For the whored

Both

>>733718239
Vanilla had an alliance bias when the game was built and released.
Their zones were better made, more polished, and their cities were more detailed. They had advantages in BGs (faster run to stables, more defendable towers, better choke points) even though horde had Will of the Forsaken. Paladins were better than shamans too if you disregard the raiding situation.

Horde was absolutely rushed at the end and shat out where far more time was given to Alliance and their zones. There is nothing for the horde approaching the detail of Dun Morough > Loch Modan path. Look at the effort for the deep run tram. Horde had nothing comparable, even if zeppelins are more convenient.

The path from Elwyn to Westfall then on to Duskwood is the best designed leveling path in vanilla, horde has nothing comparable. Alliance had Stockades, VC/DM, and Gnomer. Horde had RFC (useless), SFK, WC, and SM.
Only SM is an obstacle to reach for alliance. Southshore is close enough to SFK, and ratchet is close to enough to WC/RFK/RFD. Horde has no reasonable means to reach Gnomer, VC, or Stockades.


Horde ended up being the favorite by fans and devs but that's because horde had buckets of soul where alliance at times felt like Disney fantasy.
>FOR THE HORDE!
vs
>For the Aaaaalliance!
One works and one doesn't. Saying "for the alliance" has always been half as interesting and everyone knows it.

>>733722217
>Horde has no reasonable means to reach Gnomer
What about that goblin in Bootybay that teleports you directly into gnomer? Was that added later? Because that's how horde gets into Gnomer easily.

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>>733718239
Alliance had more time put in because they were made first, but Horde had everything easier, better, and stronger. Objectively so. There's a reason "optimal" stuff always favors Horde (with the sole exception being Hardcore stuff just because of Light of Elune).
>objectively way stronger races
>shaman is much stronger than paladin (this one we know is because of literal favoritism, or at least anti-favoritism from Afrasiabi and Kaplan hating Paladins)
>much more convenient travel options, better locations for capitals and hub towns
>Barrens is the most convenient leveling zone in the game
>more world buffs
>leveling zones are all much easier
You might say some of the ease on the Horde was because Blizzard was rushing a bit to make them, though. Likewise, Alliance having more time and effort put into their stuff often lead to things being inconvenient in exchange for the better "story" and "polish" (i.e. humans having to run all over and spend an eternity traveling in their early zones because it makes sense in the story and things are spread out logically, rather than it being nicely condensed like for the Horde). Likewise, even though Horde clearly didn't get as much time given, because they were made second the devs had a better understanding of how to make things.

>>733722217
Your logic on the dungeons is fucking dumb. RFC is a MUCH better dungeon than Stocks, for one, so if you're calling RFC useless and not Stocks you're just biased. SFK and WC are just as annoying to reach at their level for Alliance as Deadmines is for Horde (if not more so). And Horde gets a free teleport to Gnomeregan. Horde has much more convenient dungeon placement throughout the entire game.

>>733722217
what's VC?

>>733718239
for PvP:
>Vanilla: Horde OP
>TBC: Horde OP
>WotLK: Alliance OP

>>733718239
during SoD I was forced to play ally and god damn what a marathon. No time for quests, you're just walking across whole zones all the time.

>>733718239
blizzard has always had a horde bias and it was never even subtle

>>733723257
Vice City

>>733718239
They had an alliance balance.

And the GMs absolutely were intolerant of any wokeness. No homosexuals, no poc. We got a phone call from a GM once because my friend, playing at my house, was being “too gay”…because he is gay.


But yeah they made shit really fucking difficult for horse back then. Just look at raiding capitals.

>>733718239
horde bias for sure
>easier starting zones with mostly beasts (no humanoids with social aggro)
>better low level dungeons with better loot (good luck getting to sfk as alliance)
>broken racials
>orcs are good guys

I really have nothing to add because I feel like >>733723159 and >>733722217 summarized it well, but as someone who had historically played Horde until Classic Anniversary (where I was trying to catch up to my friends who were playing Alliance), I was shocked by how inferior the Alliance experience was. While I liked the Alliance starting areas and Duskwood, I found that the heavily vaunted Alliance "questlines" mostly involved delivering letters back-and-forth.

The Horde leveling experience is just so much more simple, to its benefit. It also helps that there's more variety in terms of the aesthetic of Horde settlements, whereas the overwhelming majority of Alliance settlements have human architecture, and Dwarf architecture isn't that much more interesting. There aren't really many long, involved questlines, but that's perfectly fine as WoW quests aren't anything special.

Also Stockades is such an insanely soulless dungeon it's unreal. I legitimately felt bad for the Alliance when running that shit, what a joke.

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>>733718239
Very obvious Alliance bias

>>733718239
>macro instant cast
>chill around and get it within three spawns while the retards try manually attacking it

>>733723830
People mock paladins as being shit to level and stuck as healsluts in raids, but they were always a class that was bursting with utility and damage potential. Shaman lacked ease of utility and defense of paladins and it was a glaring difference if you played a shaman against a paladin at any point besides healing done raid logs.
Then they took the "impossible to kill" class and by wrath they were hitting harder than arms warriors.

Totems gave a LOT of utility but they were finicky as all hell, especially before the totem bar was added.

>>733718239
>ctrl+f "shoes"
>no results
this sub fell off

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>>733718239
>oh boy that epic onyxia questline was so cool! I can't wait to play the horde version!
...oh wait

>>733724624
nah bro, Shamans are great, just think of all the value you get from Sentry totem! nobody else can copy that!

>love horde races
>alliance has way better setting & content
I wish I could somehow be a tauren in goldshire

Alliance to start, Horde till BFA, Alliance since.

>>733725039
>I wish I could somehow be a tauren in goldshire
Okay Baine

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>>733725135

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Tirisfal Glades > Duskwood

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>>733727450
Not so fast

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>>733724786
Shame we didnt have a major questline like this but for horde involving AQ. Now that I think about it, I wonder why we never got a 5man dungeon in silithus.

Neither

>>733729868
they didnt feel the need or want to get everyone doing the latest raid, which also resulted in almost nobody clearing naxxramas
there was some catch up gear outside of raids when new ones released but they were insane time sinks especially then

>>733718239
Eastern Kingdom zones were designed first. They have a lot more detail and soul compared to Kalimdor, but that they can be a bit nebulous (not a bad thing). Majority of Ally zones are EK so the faction feels more soulful. So during vanilla people viewed it as the favored side.
Kalimdor zones were a last minute rush job, hence why so many zones feel barren. But the low level zones are extremely dense and efficient, because the devs didn't have time to put in all the soulful, longer content. There's no cool plot lines or stories, but you will level quickly. This is far more palatable to modern players, so the Horde is viewed as the favourite. Additionally, the modern version of the game (+HC) puts way more emphasis on world buffs, and having an extra one, Warchief's blessing, means a lot, even if Ally guilds have no problem acquiring it. Honestly kind of bullshit that the Horde got Ony when they have nothing to do with that story line.

>>733730902
>they didnt feel the need or want to get everyone doing the latest raid, which also resulted in almost nobody clearing naxxramas
In hindsight this was a good thing, because it meant raiders were stuck on the loot treadmill and weren't' complaining about having no content.

blizzard had horde bias, but the playerbase favored alliance
that is why they made blood elves and allowed horde racials to be insanely OP forever

>>733731520
remember hordebros, "bias" is when all your favorite characters get turned into idiots and then killed off. "Horde bias" means "Horde will always be the loser in any storyline".

>>733731302
Nothing to do with it? Nefarian?

>>733731520
Night elfs and dwarfs exist. Human racial is better in pvp too. What OP horde racials are you referring to?

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Crossroads 4 life

>>733722217
I tried a dwarf and a human before going horde and something about durotar->barrens->thousand needles just felt right. Mulgore is amazing to me.

I will admit after doing an alliance alt later that Stormwind felt like disneyland and the alliance Onyxia questline is much better

>>733734478
>Stormwind felt like disneyland
In a good way or a bad way?

>>733723257
VC = VanCleef = Deadmines because DM is dire maul

>>733718239
Horde biased, they had better passives, easier travel between cities/zones, they get a dungeon sooner, quests frequently dab all over alliance leaders and show them as idiots who are greedy and corrupted, etc. They literally burnt and turnt the most historical places on the planet and the alliances only response was "we can't dismantle the horde... because we can't..."

vanilla map is heavily horde biased for pvp servers

>>733718239
class design favors horde
windfury totem and bloodlust are the literal coolest things ever, wotf deletes alliance warlocks and priests from the game
quest design favors alliance, horde is rushed and phoned in
zone design is mixed, both have some great zones and both have some stinkers like durotar and westfall (yes westfall)

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>>733718239
There's no bias, but the game is just unfinished and they worked on Alliance first. Alliance have better quests and shit but to make up for Horde being rushed they gave them OP racials and more convenience.

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>>733727450
Take me back

>>733735693
>there's no bias
>they just put more care and effort into the alliance content, and use the horde as a rotating villain of the week factory

>>733735674
>quest design favors alliance, horde is rushed and phoned in
Horde is nice and compact. Alliance forces you to visit every fucking zone every fucking time. Also horde has easier to relevant instances

>>733727450
Spent too many lonely nights walking this road

>>733736035
They put care and effort into it because they had time. Then they ran out of time.

>>733718239
Allience bias, then later on a human bias because they gave them op racials and moved the "main" capital to stormwind which felt so artificial. I really liked the idea of the Dwarves/Ironforge being the main faction/hub but at some point the suits behind the dev probably said.

>"Why is the main capital not the human city?"
>"Humans play this game, what are you stupid?"

>>733736047
Efficiency is not relevant, rushing to max level is for r*tail players

>>733736463
Sorry but running between the 4 corners of the world for 200xp was remotely fun only the first time

>>733736223
anon if you have two kids and you spend more time taking care of one then rush through the motions for the other, that's called having a bias.

>>733718239
>Bias
There was 0 bias in vanilla because bias requires an active desire to fuck over someone. Blizzard admitted that Horde didn't get as much effort because they started running out of funding and time to get WoW finished.

The real shame is that they never went back to fix what Horde was missing.

>>733737689
>The real shame is that they never went back to fix what Horde was missing.
they tried that once in Cata, Alliance players through an absolute shitfit about horde favoritism.

>>733737485
NTA but no. Bias is an intentional prejudice against something. Blizzard didn't mean to give Horde less content they just ran out of time and money due to inexperience.

>>733737796
>Blizzard didn't mean to give Horde less content
>just when forced to make a choice they chose Alliance without a second through
you really have no idea what "bias" means do you?

>>733737763
Cata didn't just add content for horde, it dramatically changed the whole game top to bottom in ways. Its like asking for a cheese burger and then getting served a cheese burger but they added shit in it as well.

>>733737883
They started with Alliance because human models were simpler and the baseline for all other races, that isn't a bias. Ironically your bias against Blizzard and a chip on your shoulder is not allowing you to recognize the difference between intentional bias and unintended consequences.

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>blizzard doesn't have horde bias

>>733723159
Don't forget that horde also had better melee weapon progression, the 20-40 range for alliance basically had nothing, while horde gets showered in useful quest rewards.

>>733722217
You are a retarded gorilla nigger and are wrong about literally everything.

>>733737963
bias doesn't have to be conscious and intentional, bias just indicates favoring one thing over another. Blizzard has always had an unconscious alliance bias, since as you admit, they design literally everything for humans first and go from there. They can't even bother to make shoes work on the horde.
If alliance content was as unfinished as horde content, they wouldn't just release the game, they'd delay it to finish the alliance content.

>>733738231
>>733738160
>Confusing bias with inexperience
Blizzard at the time said they had no fucking clue what they were doing, and basically throwing shit at the wall hoping it stuck. Its a miracle WoW even launched because none of them could agree on anything. Really explains the next decade of updates and the inability to recapture the launch.

>>733737883
Bias is when you give one race a faster movement speed when dead, while another gets a free BWL caster trinket.

>>733738304
Again you're just confusing bias with inexperience. Take down that chip on your shoulder and grow up, vanilla never had a bias.
>They can't even bother to make shoes work on the horde.
You can't even get this right, this is a design choice, not a 'problem'. Retail has added shoes for horde that works on all races specifically because people like you kept crying about this being unfair even though this was the whole point of horde races not wanting to wear shoes.

>>733737883
>Im a victim
Typical horde mentality

>>733738374
yeah good point, faster movement speed while dead has got to be the best racial in the game when you think of how much time it saves you over the lifetime of a wow player. we're talking actual days of gameplay you won't get with other races. Wouldn't it be nuts if they also combined it with a racial that let you stealth anywhere so you could more safely go AFK in peace?

>>733738548
>>733738374
>le racial bias! they wanted x/y faction to be stronger!
>both sides are simply a clusterfuck of imbalance and incompetence
Which because of fags like you both on both sides crying about it got turned into neither side having any racials that matter anymore.

>>733738548
That racial is not useful if you don't die. And shadowmeld is dogshit because it is a lower level stealth, so anyone can easily notice you. Trolling used to mean something back in the day.

>>733738616
All horde racials are superior with the exception of two situational ones by alliance: stoneform on dwarf and sword specialization on human. And nether side should have racials and all classes should be free for everyone.

there are actually people here claiming horde was stronger than alliance in vanilla
lmaooooooooo
salvation and fear ward was so massively more important back in vanilla than anything shamans or horde racials could offset

>>733738863
Kill yourself, shitskin.

>>733738710
>Trolling used to mean something back in the day.
yeah, it mean like 5 hp regenerated per second, pretty useless to be honest.

>>733738927
brown hands typed this btw

>>733738863
>lil alliance sissy doesn't know about tremor totem
>He doesn't know about windfury doubling the dps of any melee
>he doesn't know about the chain heal

>>733722217
The human areas specifically were the first they worked on and therefore had the most dev time, and it shows.

>>733739134
>>733738863
>Fags getting upset that some races/classes/factions have it easier in some areas and harder in others
Oh boy I sure love eating nothing but brown foods! Thanks cry babies now everything is generic, homogeneous and nothing can stand out!

>>733739134
see this is what I mean, you just outed yourself as a classic andy, you probably weren't alive back when vanilla actually happened
basically nobody understood how tremor worked
no tank could pull proper threat and so you were threat capped like crazy, hence salvation being by far the biggest DPS increase in a raid
chain heal was a non factor

>>733738710
>And nether side should have racials and all classes should be free for everyone.
Boy, I sure do hate you.

>>733738710
>That racial is not useful if you don't die.
ah yes, all those wow players who never died once really must've hated that racial.

>>733739134
and yet all the top guilds like method were ally ... kys greenigger

>>733718239
not so much of a bias except alliance zones were made before the horde ones and it really showed
though i finally understood the whole 'barrens chat' thing horde players were talking about, the zone is so shit that you start going completely mental

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>>733718239
quest wise it was super biased to alliance since they got all the kino questlines like messenger, though in map layouts, flight paths and racials horde were simply more comfortable to play

>>733731302
Even looking at Kalimdor, NE got pleasant locations, meanwhile horde is all about brown poop mountains. They at least pulled undeads into wacky gory shitheads with best city.

I was in a worldwide top tier raid guild back in vanilla and the fact that these "accomplishments" were 20 years ago hits me way too fucking hard

I did alliance during the first classic. Traveling anywhere was such a fucking hassle compared to the horde. I'll never do it again.

kek

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>>733718239
They have always favored the horde why else do you think they got blood elves?

>>733738160
>posts a cataclysm map

Alliance is best once to experience kino quests

Horde is best for repeated replays due to closer zones and easier quests

>>733736763
yes, after you have seen everything you can quit the game, not demand the game be ruined by streamlined quests so you can speedrun it forever

>>733745314
ironic considering nillers zoomercleaved and aoe ground their way to 60 just so they wouldn't have to do the boring ass quests agai

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>>733722217
Vanilla had a horde bias when the game was built and released.
Their zones were better made, more polished, and their cities were more detailed. They had advantages in BGs (closer start to Vann) even though alliance had Every Man for Himself. Shaman were better than paladins too if you regard the raiding situation.

Alliance was absolutely rushed at the end and shat out where far more time was given to Horde and their zones. There is nothing for the alliance approaching the detail of Barrens > Stonetalon > Ashenvale path. Look at the effort for the zeppelin towers. Alliance had nothing comparable, even if boats are less convenient.

The path from Durotar to Barrens then on to Thousand Needles is the best designed leveling path in vanilla, alliance has nothing comparable. Alliance had Stockades, Deadmines (only homosexuals say VC), and Gnomer. Horde had RFC (kino), SFK, WC, and SM.
Only Stockades is an obstacle to reach for horde. Grom'gol is close enough to Deadmines, and Booty Bay is able to teleport to Gnomer. Horde has no reasonable means to reach Stockades, Stockades, or Stockades.


Alliance ended up being the favorite by fans and devs but that's because alliance had buckets of soul where horde at times felt like Disney fantasy.
>FOR THE ALLIANCE!
vs
>For the Hoooordeee!
One works and one doesn't. Saying "for the horde" has always been half as interesting and everyone knows it.

>>733734478
As a person that played horde far more than alliance, the Barrens fucking suck. I cannot stand the barrens. I have fond memories and a lot of nostalgia for the barrens, but leveling there sucks. Barrens chat was fun but it wasn't any more special than the general internet culture you got everywhere else. There were just a LOT of people in barrens at all times so general was busy.

Alliance were spoiled with choice after leaving their starting zones with leveling paths for humans, dwarves/gnomes, and nelfs. Horde gets barrens. Yes, silverpine exists but most undead players went to barrens anyways because it was a more reliable location for groups.
Nowhere else in the game do you get stuck in the same zone for 20 fucking levels. 20 levels in a single zone. An ugly brown zone. I got so sick of looking at not-africa.
Alliance
>redridge
>westfall
>loch modan
>duskwood
>wetlands
>darkshore
Shared
>hillsbrad
>ashenvale
Horde
>barrens
>Silverpine

If you didn't get sick of barrens that means you didn't level very many horde characters.

>>733744860
So alliance didn't have two elf races?
So horde could draw some legolas fags away from alliance?
I can't believe twenty years have passed and ally faggots are still crying about belfs on horde.
That really fucked you disney-fantasy girls up, huh? Didn't get your pretty blonde elves to go with your humans and dwarves? Lmao

>>733746013
>but leveling there sucks
At least you are leveling not running around like a headless chicken because doing 1 alliance zone without bouncing will fuck you up and leave you underleveled or overleveled for other zones. I'm sick of the early ally zones just as much desu

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733745717
Imitation is the highest form of flattery

>>733746214
Funny. Alliance has more zones that are better designed but the quests are splattered about in a frustrating way.
Horde has basically one goddamn zone but the process of leveling through it is easier.

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>>733746013
>stuck in the same zone for 20 fucking levels. 20 levels in a single zone.

>roll into Barrens at 12
>start Stonetalon at 16-17
>start Ashenvale at 19-20
>start Thousand Needles at 25
You're point would stand a lot stronger if you weren't so hyperbolic. Barrens is involed in a huge 15 level stretch, sure. But let's not pretend there were 3 other zones to dip in and out of as you level to break it up.
If anything it's cool to have Barrens being the glue you return to in 2 levels to wrap up a questline or push a little lower from Camp Taurajo.

This is the problem with the Alliance vs Horde favoritism debate. People will make shit up and overly exaggerate problems while conveniently leaving out all of these wonderful charms only they have.
Almost like anyone actually invested in the question acts like a perpetual victim.

>>733746557
>>start Stonetalon at 16-17
What kind of madman does this\
>Ashenvale
Never setting foot there again if I can help it

Man, i miss it. I don’t have time to level 1-60 again and it wouldn’t be the same any way because everyone goes straight to raids and then quit after finishing them in 3 weeks

>>733746557
Nobody does stonetalon shut up.

>>733746601
>>>start Stonetalon at 16-17
>What kind of madman does this\
Those first few quests have you killing level 16-18 Tauren and their leader.
Sun Rock has a questline to go into the ravine with level 17 kobolds.
It's viable to dip in and polish off a level and start getting some work done in Windshear Crag as well.

>>733746675
>I HATE BARRENS WHY SHOULD I STAY HERE FOR 20 LEVELS
>go 2 feet down the road and do those quests instead
>NO I WANT TO STAY IN BARRENS AND COPLAIN AND ENGAGE IN POLITICAL DEBATES IN GENERAL CHAT YOU CAN'T MAKE ME LEAVE SHUT UP

Okay.

>>733722217
Wow what made ups shit. Horde had far better racials as well the fact that you disregard SM as just mention is amazing. You could make 10 levels in there and avoid th3 entire STV zone from it, which I did every character. Even as I got ganged by level 60s constantly. Also shamans were far more powerful than paladins in pvp.

>>733746715
>Windshear Crag
Personally I start it at lvl 20ish but fuck that niggerfaggot goblin quest that has the entire cave collapse on your ass while he's digging. I've done elite quests that were easier

>>733718239
>paying $15 a month to wait in line for 30 minutes to complete one quest
the green boys had the right idea, at least fighting over it creates a bit of excitement as the you wait

>>733747116
dont forget sitting in queue just to get to character creation
layering didnt go far enough

I haven't played wow since like 2006, but frost shock + windfury was total bullshit and way better than anything paladin got

>>733746918
>Also shamans were far more powerful than paladins in pvp.
Lmao yeah if they had a solid 2h getting windfury procs. They lacked any meaningful cc until hex was added, no defensive shield or bubble.
>inb4 totems
Yeah with 5 health and 5 yard range and they are dropped one at a time.
>REMEMBER THAT SHAMAN ONE SHOTTING PEOPLE IN THE YOUTIBE VIDEOS
Yeah with bis and the goddamn hand of ragnaros

>>733718239
the only actual bias was tigole and furor being extremely autistic and hating paladins because they were afraid of getting tank spots taken by paladins in EQ. everything else is the result of the game being rushed, the paladin thing doesn't even really matter because pallies ended up being better than shamans

>>733747321
>I haven't played wow since like 2006, but
Your opinion is irrelevant, people have had 20 years dissect the game and solve it. For pve blessings are better than totems, for pvp paladins are better, only balanced out by horde racials being better than alliance racials.

>>733746918
>I dont wanna level in stv
>better to farm sm instead
Did anyone ever inform you guys that unless you had a dedicated group, dungeon farming was not more efficient than questing?

>>733747457
Uh? Shamans get windwall totem. Does alliance get that? Didn't think so.
Shamans get stoneclaw totem. Does alliance get that?
Shamans get sentry totem. Does alliance get that?
Shamans get magma totem. Does alliance get that?
Didn't think so.

>>733747381
Paladins got continuously fixed and improved, to the point that they ended up being super busted by wotlk. Shamans were seemingly neglected, and they railroaded them into dw when in vanilla people wanted 2h.

>>733718239
So much dust settling nowadays, how about you just sweep and clean your fucking room OP? I sat down on your bed before fucking your mom and wouldn't you know it, a storm of dandruff and skin flakes blasted out from under your blankets. How about adding a sheet to your bare mattress you lazy fuck?

Now that the dust has settled, shut the fuck up idiot????

>>733747457
you can claim whatever you want 20 years after the fact, but I was there and shamans were the most bullshit class in pvp.

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>>733746791
If you were there for the original barrens chat you'd know like 70% of the chat was just dumb Chuck Norris "facts".

>CHUCK NORRIS DOESN'T DO PUSH UPS, HE JUST PUSHES THE PLANET UP AND DOWN

That's the authentic barrens experience just hearing shit like that spammed in chat.

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Leveling zone tier list:

S tier:
>Duskwood
>Darkshore
>Teldrassil
>Redridge


A tier:
>STVietnam
>Dun Morogh
>Westfall
>Elwynn
>Durotar

B tier:
>Silverpine
>Tirisfal
>Hillsbrad (horde)
>Ashenvale (alliance)
>Searing Gorge
>Felwood

C tier:
>Arathi
>Loch Modan
>Barrens
>Wetlands
>Tanaris
>Un'goro
>Feralas
>Hinterlands

D tier:
>Desolace
>Thousand needles
>Ashenvale (horde)
>Hillsbrad (alliance)
>Stonetalon
>WPL
>Winterspring

SHIT tier:
>Silithus
>EPL
>Burning steppes
>Badlands
>Blasted lands
>Swamp of Sorrows
>Azshara
>Alterac

>back in college
>a shy butterface girl (4/10 face, 7.5/10 body) comes to my place for team assignment
>I finish my part earlier
>launch World of Warcraft while she finishes her part
>she finishes and comes to see me play
>that looks fun, anon, can I make a character?
>sure—I let her use my account to make a character
>she makes a female human mage
>almost an hour later she is in Goldshire, killing kobolds
>she spots another player and ask him if he wants to team up
>stfu, suck my dick bitch—he responded
>she stays motionless, staring at the screen for what it felt like a full minute
>suddenly she turns around, pushes me to my bed and goes to her knees
>proceeds to give me to sloppiest but sexiest blowjob I ever had
>fuck her furiously afterwards
and that's the story of how I had a sex slave for 2 months, eventually I dumped her, apparently she wanted me be her formal bf, I didn't want it (she was too childish). A couple of years later she married some kind of meditation-yoga-new-age-guy. I miss her sometimes, she did absolutely everything I told her to do, having such a control over someone else fucked with my mind, it never felt the same after her. WoW will always have an special place in my heart because of this.

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>Undead and Night Elves were the races that were placed in a continent where the other races of their faction have no presence
>Undead can take a Zeppelin straight from Tirisfal Glades into Orgrimmar (and STV) if a low level Undead wants to go level in the Barrens with his friends, or just in general wants to go back from his home in Undercity to the main Horde city Orgrimmar
>That Zeppelin also lands the entire Horde 20 seconds run away from the best leveling dungeon in the game for the hardest leveling levels in the game (Scarlet Monastery)
>Night Elves get a boat to Wetlands and corpserun for hours to get to Ironforge
No Horde bias there at all...

Horde had way better PvP racials.

>>733748990
>people could not possibly get better at a game after playing it for 20 years, there's no way
damn you're right nevermind

>>733749068
reddit/10

>>733749131
>for the hardest leveling levels in the game
That's not lvl 40-55

>>733749131
If you think about it, a new orc/undead player could get to Stormwind faster than a NE could

>>733749212
>man people in the 18th century were so stupid lining up and shooting each other with muskets. why didn't they realize that fpv drones were the meta?

>>733749182
>PvP
>in WoW
>in vanilla
Lol?

>>733749330
we're talking about a video game

>horde
I will never understand wanting to play as savages

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>>733749131
All this proves to me is having the Nelves be apart of the Alliance at any point in history was a mistake.

>>733748990
https://youtu.be/no6ppA6LKxU
I miss anni already bros...

>>733749234
Prove me wrong

>>733749315
Actually true wtf
Why did they make MH the alliance boat hub when Stormwind has perfectly functional docks? It's like making the Grom'Gol zeppelin connect with Kalimdor via the Shimmering Flats or something equally retarded

The leveling zones and quests dont even matter at all since everyone just downloaded an addon to avoid reading the text and just rush to the objectives or chose to do dungeon boosts to rush to level cap for the raids.

>>733750279
You mean retail players did this. I read every quest. I even left the slow text on.

>>733749068
>darkshore
>s tier

Were you dropped on your head as a baby?

>>733750279
They wouldn't need to do this if there were enough quests and/or they gave enough xp upon completion
>>733750348
Retail players would be the ones reading the quests after hearing how great they were for 15 years which was a fucking lie 99% of the time. The most prominent Vanilla figureheads spellcleaved all the way up to 60

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>>733749131
>>733749934
>getting to the other continent requires alliance to take a flight path and then get a boat that doesn't even go anywhere near a capital city
>horde can just take a zepplin that's right outside both of their relevant capital cities
Kinda unfair.

>>733750368
>Best atmosphere
>Most quests
>Most efficient quests
>Best race

Nope

>>733750478
>Retail players would be the ones reading the quests after hearing how great they were for 15 years
Retail players literally have questie built into the game, they don't know how to read quest text and had to install it for Classic because their brains don't work

>>733746013
>le barrens chat amirite
Newfag spotted

>>733750478
>The most prominent Vanilla figureheads
only zoomers care about streamer retards. i didn't spellcleave despite already having quested 1-60 on vanilla servers several times because the leveling adventure is kino.

>>733750665
you sound like an incel. the quests are shit and so is the story. WoW has always been about endgame raiding and nobody wants to waste time doing boring lvl 20 dungeons againf or the 10000th time when they could be getting meaningful gear and pumping at 60.

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>>733750575
>>Most quests
It has 91 quests that are supposed to last you from level 10 til lvl 20
westfall and redridge cover the same bracket and have 54 quests each totaling 108

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>>733750716
>WoW has always been about endgame raiding
This is zoomer revisionism. Most people didn't get past molten core back in the day. The focus on raiding came later, even in tbc most people that hit max level just did t4 stuff.

>>733745419
classic players aren't true 'nilla players

>>733750716
>you sound like an incel. the quests are shit and so is the story.
Says the person paying a sub to skip the actual content of the game while he afks in org looking at tranny porn in discord

>>733750805
If you want to be anal about it most people playing wow didn't even get to lvl 11

>>733750798
>2 zones

>>733750805
this, for the average player the game was grinding out an unstoppable force and then bashing heads in bgs and maybe running some 5 or 10 mans until tbc came out

>>733750980
2 zones 1 bracket

>>733749131
>Hours
Refuse to believe you shitters are that bad at the game.

>>733751012
2 zones. Inefficient.

>>733751005
The average player dropped that turd game around lvl 40

>>733751072
The average player didn't touch anything past TBC, especially not current retail

>>733751034
>muh efficiency
the math has been done and a combination of redridge/westfall/loch modan is more efficient

>>733751137
"No"

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>>733751185
>t.

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>>733751248
>t.

>>733746918
You are 100% without a doubt a latino with an IQ below 87.

>>733751723
He plays a paladin so thats a given

>>733749068
Don't worry, anon. I agree that Darkshore is based. The Alliance Kalimdor leveling path is pretty much objectively the hardest leveling path (including Darkshore and Teldrassil), with a ton of hard quests and dangerous areas (and PvP risk), but they're all great zones with nice aesthetics. And night elves are cool, despite Blizzard's attempts to sabotage them.

>people hating on Barrens when Blizzard just threw it all together the last minute and accidentally made one of the most efficient leveling zones ever designed with the ability to fill your quest log with Complete quests as you get showered with exp, as well as putting three dungeons there with good loot and WC alone giving you plenty of quests to feed you levels, you basically get to level 25 for free
Plus I just like how Savannahs look.

>>733750368
darkshore is excellent
it's sad reddit adopted it 20 years later because apparently it was efficient so they could speedrun raidlogging faster
the atmosphere and lore are great and there's all kinds of little things like the druid with WC3 voice lines, also some moderately challenging quests for vanilla like the naga cave.

>>733751779
>Alliance Kalimdor leveling path
>6 consecutive zones of nelf shit, bear asses and murlocs
Grim.

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>>733751913
>nelf shit, bear asses, murlocs
Let me guess: you need more?

>>733738297
>no arguments
Uh oh! Looks like you're wrong lil bro!

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>>733722217
>FOR THE HORDE!
Simple. Concise. Masculine.
>For the Aaaaalliance!
Too long. Doesn't roll off the tongue. Effeminate.

What actually led to the downfall of WoW? For personal reference, my favorite content was the tier 4 raids of TBC and I just recently cleared them all on the new TBC servers and afterwards deleted my character and unsubscribed.

Fresh when

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>>733753496
>Grab your sword and fight the Horde!
>Uncle Lothar wants you.
>FOR LORDAEROOOON!
Powerful. Inspiring. Makes Orcs quiver in fear at the thought of being put back into the pig pens they belong.

>>733718239
Alliance got the most kino questlines. Horde doesn't have a single questline comparable to Legend of Stalvan or the Embalmer. The Marshal Windsor rescue and confrontation of Onyxia was also incredibly kino.

>>733722217
Horde can get into gnomer from Booty Bay though

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>>733754000
tldr: GREED and change
>massive unforeseen success
>"100,000 concurrent players would be a dream come true"
>millions of players joined
>try to capitalize on it
>pull devs from the Diablo 3 alpha and use the OST to pad the soundtrack for TBC
>stop testing raids in-house after Ahn'Qiraj to save time
>massive revenue, but not profitable enough for the investors
>tens of millions of dollars in yearly server costs
>$200 million in total costs from 2004 to 2008
>WotLK brings in even more players
>Vivendi merges with Activision to get funding to support 5 million users
>Bobby Kotick takes over Blizzard as a result
>sells level boosts / micro-transactions / smaller expansions
>the metric for success shifts from number of player subs to average time played
>"the longer people engage with the game the more likely they are to spend on it"
>the effects are felt immediately and received poorly
but that was just the start of the trouble. The online landscape changed massively in 2008 with Facebook and the Iphone,
and Blizzard has been very slow to adjust.
Nowadays the real killers are gold farming bots, automated moderation, competition, and the same profit chasing microtransactions.

>>733755794
its wild to realize the picture on the right is 11 years old.

>>733745717
Doesn't really work

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>>733756042
It's been a problem for quite some time, and updating it would be equally disheartening.
I don't even have to put red hoops around it, they colored the purchase buttons red for me.

>>733718239
just look at the world, when you level 1-60 horde have flight paths in basically every zone and have questing hubs in central locations pretty much every time meanwhile the alliance towns are always on the outskirts

>>733757903
it says adventure but all you do is M+ and navigate menus.

>>733718239
The Horde is basically no more at this point, they only use the faction to be villains in the faction war storylines and have killed every interesting character.

Alliance Warcriminals like the Explorers League, continually get treated as good guys, whilst Horde characters are demonized and killed no matter how inconsistent it is with their previous characterization.

>>733736139
cuz it's only you and you walk alone?

what led to the rise of incels and trannies in WoW?

lol

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>>733718239

>>733722217
>Paladins were better than shamans too if you disregard the raiding situation
Shaman are better on a meta level purely because Warriors are realistically the only DPS that matters at end game but back in the day when tanks weren't DPS and you had balanced compositions Paladin was vastly superior because they allowed your DPS to deal something around 43% more damage before pulling threat and when you've got a sword and board tank without Thunderfury then Blessing of Salvation made a world of a difference. Blizzard changed the drakes in BWL because Horde guilds were having so much trouble managing threat while for Alliance it was trivial.

>>733718239
I mean, alliance were obviously the good guys in vanilla, but ever since then they have written horde-centric stuff.

>>733754765
>FOR LORDAEROOOON!
really proving his point. The alliance is cucked and shit without Lordaeron to lead them. Stormwind fucking sucks.

>>733763293
>I mean, alliance were obviously the good guys in vanilla
>and TBC
>and Wrath
>and Cata
>and Mists
>and WoD
>and Legion
>and BfA
>b-b-b-but since then they have written horde centric stuff
>what's that? the horde doesn't even exist anymore?

>red ridge is a low level alliance only area where full nax horde can just stroll in and murder people all day
>the barrens is a low level horde only non contested area
What do you think?
Not to mention horde having access to ships and blimps to every part of the world or having a teleporter directly to Gnomeregan. At some point it was even funny how blatant it was.

>Feralas FPs
>Horde is near the zone center and DM
>Ally's are in the fuckshit edge of the zone
FP on the Feralas/TN border is absolutely useless and make no sense

>>733764361
Stop being entitled :)

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>>733722217
No one really gave a shit about those dungeons anyways. Wailing Caverns was cool as shit while Deadmines exposes how corrupt and evil the alliance is.

I mean imagine the complete difference in questing where one faction is given a low level questline begining a major plot point around saving the World from the Emerald Nightmare and helping Druids cleanse the land.

The other faction has you kill a bunch of Stone Masons turned terrorists because they werent paid for rebuilding your capital city.

I think regardless of whatever advantages Alliance had nothing really compares to the cool factor of the Horde, theres no real equivalent to the Barrens or Barrens chat as the zone is so massive encompassing so many player levels that it became its own meme chat room.

The Forsaken/Undead zones are just cool as shit and have top tier voice acting and atmosphere which is completely unique compared to the sort of mystic Fern Gully easthetic of the Night Elves. Not to mention the Undercity gave Horde access to Western and Eastern plaguelands which is a major end game leveling area, 2 instances and the final raid of the game.

Then on top of that Horde has fucking Zepplins while Alliance has to travel around on lame ships. We get to fucking fly.

Alliance has no major leaders beyond Tyrande who doesnt do anything really and isnt really liked. Meanwhile Horde has fucking Thrall, Cairne and Sylvanas +Varimathras as our leaders and then in the fucking expansion we get Blood Elves.

Horde is extremely unique in that we have zepplins to fly us around, Orgrimmar as the main capital is just cool as fuck while the other capitals while less used are just cool as fuck and unique with 2 of them having different elevator systems to access them and Undercity has the same architecture as Naxxramas which is just over all cool. Music was cool while I did not like the Alliance cities too much with Stormwind being the best of them.

Horde wins by being cooler than Alliance.

We need to remove the "War" in "warcraft" :)

>>733739749
ARUGAL WOULD NEVER SAY THAT

>>733718239
>wow thread
>gayest most boring question imaginable

>>733755794
I dont think Blizzard was going to be left alone by the system anyways. You cant make a game with 6 million people playing it and not have the glowies get interested.

>>733749131
>not knowing about the mountain shortcut
L
M
A
O
typical alliance shitter

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>>733718239
Night Elves are based

The only time Blizzard had Horde bias was in MoP.
Back in Vanilla they couldn’t even be fucked with completing a Horde narrative. Hell, just look at Alliance Onyxia questline versus the Horde one. Now in the modern game Horde’s barely allowed to exist. I don’t think I’ve seen a dev team openly hate half their player base this consistently.

>>733766640
>horde bias is when your faction is aborted and all of your characters join the alliance
ok retard

Goibon Uden Lo

I don't get it, how is this even a question?
Blizzard has loved the Horde since the development of WC3 TFT at the VERY earliest, you know the expansion where the Belves and Forsaken got their epic backstories, which involved BTFOing the dumb racist humans (who got absolutely shat on and didn't get their own campaign btw)? Not to mention the Founding of Durotar (more Horde glory and Human buckbreaking). By the way, this is the reason WoW Alliance content was developed first, WC3 and WoW were developed at the same time, with Kalimdor and Northern EK being unknowns that had to be fleshed out later. Not because of "Alliance bias" lmao
Did you forget that the devs formed a band during TFT (Level 10 Tauren Chieftain) dedicated to how awesome the Horde is, that played at every Blizzcon, the event Blizzard has been known to humiliate their Alliance fanbase?
That the Paladin class was intentionally shafted and its playerbase constantly shat on/trolled on the forums by CMs and maybe even by an actual dev (Ellia)?
Warcraft has always been a Horde wankfest. The statue outside Blizz HQ is an orc warrior. Hanging inside is the devs' own favorite piece of Warcraft art, a giant poster of Grom Hellscream slaughtering Nelves. The mascot and main character of the whole franchise is Metzen's self-insert Thrall. I mean it's all pretty fucking obvious.

Obviously alliance

1-30 alliance is kino esp with deadlines/stockades etc
Horse has it easier while lvling and esp flight points in felwood and stv, less travelling too due to the barrens. I'd say besides the whole pala/shammy thing it's pretty balanced, factions seem like a thing in the past in modern MMOs sadly(no good ones yet lmao)

>>733770848
Lol

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>>733754765
Effeminate

>>733722217
>One works and one doesn't. Saying "for the alliance" has always been half as interesting and everyone knows it.
Saying "For the Alliance" is like saying "for the UN!" Don't be a sperg and just recite the country you're from, we're a coalition, not a nation. Making the Alliance like the Horde was a mistake.

>>733738160
Cataclysm was a mistake

>>733718239
Horde bias, not really up for debate.

>>733723830
>>733724624
Weren't paladins able to solo certain bosses at one point? They're hard to master, but when you do you're a walking truck.

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>>733754000

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>>733749068
>>733751779
Darkshore is my favourite zone in the game,I love Auberdine.

I just loved the Blood Elf starting area, like it was so relaxing/comfy. It's why every character I made was a Blood Elf and why I autistic would try and spend as much time as possible in Silvermoon. If I was more of an RP'er I would have just roleplayed in that area and never left, but that would be get boring after a bit.

>>733718239
Equal.

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>>733774520
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FU_yNE2MMOU

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>>733774730
Home. I don't know how you couldn't find it relaxing. The entire Pandarian starting zone was pretty comfy as well, had those Chinese kung-fu vibes, but I guess that's what they were going for.

>>733722217
Horde has objectively better flight path and zep paths in literally every zone
SM is the most important leveling dungeon hub in the game and the hardest dungeon to reach for a faction
The Durotar / Mulgore into Barrens (which is the biggest leveling hub in the game) is as good as the human starting zones.
Lot of incorrect hordie whining in this post

>>733723257
Venture capital

>>733775461
He also ignored the 10 people reminding him that Horde can literally teleport into Gnomeregan.

>>733775560
I think you mean Venture Company

>>733749131
>NE are offered a chance to experience true soulkino
>horde are robbed of this
>somehow this is horde favored
Only speedrunning trannies complain about this.

>>733718239
I don't think either