Can AI ever truly replace localizers in video games?
>>735938436so what does the original jap say?
Sure. If you want the localizer experience you can just instruct the AI to do a bad job.
>>735938436Hey, is that the guy from the Square Enix dev team?
>>735938525I'm fluent in Japanese, and I'd say the AI is pretty spot-on here.
>That third line just filled to the brim with """spice"""God I hate these faggots who looks at a shore concise line and goes; "Hmm, needs a bit more bloat">>735938525AI is accurate in this regard. Last line could be more like; "Serves you right!" because ザマァ is considerably taunting in nature.
>>735938436It can. Localizers use AI all the time now. For example, you can copy paste a raw MTL script to chatgpt and tell it to give that sentence a southern american accent. Localizer job, done.
>>735938621Sometimes the ol' translation needs a little sugar and SPICE
>>735938436Why don’t they just hire Japanese people that can read/speak English to translate instead of these retards?
>>735938832cheaper to hire ameritards, and they also think "if i hire an american, my game will be more marketable to americans"
>>735938832Japanese people don't have a good enough grasp on language. A lot of localizers actually have English writing degrees, which is all that really matters in a good translation.
>>735938832Easier to find unicorn
>>735938832Publishers and banks demand they use politicianly inclined localizers for their political narratives. If you don't let them, they won't allow the game to be released in English.
>>735938945There's no political agenda, schizo.
>>735938436At least I can humiliate human spreg and him make accountable
>>735939007Where do I get these fan TLs?
death to all localizers tbqhwyfamalam
hire AI translators
>>735939062Some of them are on github, others are hosted on gbatemphttps://gbatemp.net/threads/xenoblade-2-delocalization-retranslation-patch.667076/
>>735938436Ew localizers can't even say date, on top of that adfing unnecessary lines.
>>735938895But the ai is right here??
>>735938895>human failed to translate 八頭身there are books literally dedicated to japanese phraseme like this.
>>735939179Now I wanna know how AI and humans would translate 二頭身
>>735938832I imagine the same reason as why companies don't just hire top-notch programmers or proper actors for voiceacting, competent people expect to be paid well, and they could do with "good enough".
>>735939179you could also literally just double check any online dictionary if something seems out of place
>>735938691Nice spice.
>>735939285Honestly, I think the heavy use of ellipses kind of adds to the "mysterious ninja" vibe and almost says more than all that text in JP. Show, don't tell and all that.
>>735938691>I...>>735938895>Well...God I fucking hate "localizers">>735938885Americans are factually the most expensive labor force on the planet which is why you spend so much effort trying to get into the country. What you said is the stupidest fucking thing anyone has ever said.>>735938832Because of "consultants". You have to pay the right people or else you get coordinated review bombs. Paying a "consultant" to review your work, even if you don't take any of their advice, will magically make your scores rise, improve the sudden reach of people "naturally" discussing your game, and everything is magically more smooth.Western localization teams usually have ties with such "consultants" and thus hold hands in this faggotry.
>>735939329No no, it's totally them using telepathy.
>>735938436>we softened her up a touch so she would look quirky but not pervyFucking why? just let women be pervertsThis is the type of progressive bullshit that circles back around into being fucking conservative tier prudish
>>735938436It's localization! Can't you see? It's not healthy!
>>735938436the ai version is superior to this retards version
>>735938436Why is /v/ pretending to hate localizers when /v/ loves the DBZ localization?
>>735938436Yes. Ever since its inception people point to AI's then limitations as proof that it won't get better. Then it surpasses its old limits. I don't use AI but people need to find a new way to deal with it besides>See? It can't do THIS yet!It will eventually.
>>735938525Caveat that i don't know this game or these characters.Essentially what the AI did. For the JLPT 6's, you can see the word "D-D-D-DATE", that Neil switches to "c c c courtship".And take a look at the third line. I have no clue what the fuck Neil is doing on his third line but it has nothing to do with the JP version. So, the word is ざまあ. The small a at the end indicates it's elongated, for emphasis. And the katakana is there for emphasis as well. That's functionally short for ざまあをみろ It's usage here is sort of fujioshiish. Might also be a refernce to ざまあ系 fiction, but there's no indictation of that in Neil's work. There's all sorts of ways you could take it. >You look like shit.>You got served.>What a loser.I can't imagine how the fuck you would go with Neil's version unless you ignored a word you didn't know and just wrote in whatever the fuck you want.
>>735939497I don't though, I think Toriayama is a garbage artist
>>735939504>I can't imagine how the fuck you would go with Neil's version unless you ignored a word you didn't know and just wrote in whatever the fuck you want.Ding ding ding. This right here.
>>735938436One time, I encountered a clip of a French movie. And the character exclaims "excellent coffee!". Yet the English subtitle said "fantastic coffee!". I pointed out that weird translation choice, and ended up getting a dozen people excusing it, saying it makes more sense that way, they have to localize it, I'm nitpicking, etc.Truth be told, I can't really remember if the said fantastic or if he said excellent. But either way, I think using a different word for the subtitle was needless, and I'm baffled that people make excuses on the translator's behalf.
>>735939262>二頭身Chibi? Shortstack? Midget? Mini sized? Gremlin? Hobbit? Spritely?Fun size?
>>735938436someone should start sub hack team that unfucks localized games and provides proper, accurate translationsit would both drive them mad and do something good at the same time so it would be a win/win
>>735939502The only reason AI has not "surpassed" localizers is because localizers have the need to self insert into translations. It can't just be a 100% translation, is have to be thier opinion. And even LLM is way too baffled by these.
>>735938436AI tl better unironically. LOOcalizer deserve to be replaced and they should hang themselves.
>>735939497Is there a single DB fan who gives a shit about its writing?
>>735939504>I can't imagine how the fuck you would go with Neil's version unless you ignored a word you didn't know and just wrote in whatever the fuck you want.that's what localizers do, they just change shit they want so they feel like they have artistic merit, like they contributed as a writer when that isn't their job. truly pathetic behaviour
>>735939429>just let women be pervertsIt is an article of feminist faith that women are incapable of perversion and only do bad or degenerate things because they've been corrupted by those evil, woman-hating moids in some manner.Acknowledging that women are, in fact, just as susceptible to porn addition as men (albeit mostly in textual form) and can take it to the same extremes (or greater; fujos love their underage boy rape fics) is not to be thought of.
>>735938436yes, very easily
The only actually super usefull thing AI an do is translation. We could have an Universal Translators if some people focused on thatImagine the world where you can insult anyone and they would understand it
>>735939179Not like you even need to read a book to translate it. Like literally just google it and you'll have a gorillion explanations in English or Japanese if you so prefer.
>>735939329You are, what we in the industry call, a useful idiot.
You will MISS localizers when they’re gone!
AI have already started translating whale language patterns. Meanwhile because of localizers, it's still impossible between languages.
>>735939768Not according to Neil Broadley.
>>735938621>>735939504"Zama" is like the JP version of >the absolute state"zama miro" is>look at the absolute state you are in
>>735938691they really needed to hammer in the fact that they have an English degree. Plus the smug millennial passive-aggressive tone.
>>735939262Two heads tall is a decent fallback. Some situations might justify saying chibi or smol.
>>735939849We don't need any of your post-hoc rationalization in this thread.
The way localizers act is honestly the only thing that stops me from absolutely despising AIslop.I hate it for art, writing, basically any other form of human expression, but localizers are genuine cultural parasites and bandits, I would prefer that every single one of them be replaced by AI, and the egregious ones should be scalped and paraded around as a warning to everyone else.Truly the most cancerous individuals I have ever seen in my life, no different from the retards in Hollywood who can't create their own stories and so decide to graft the face of some old property onto their retarded, shitty Harry Potter fanfic.
>>735939816>I tried this tool that can totally replace my job and I have to say it's not good
>>735939816I do not trust anyone's opinion on a thing who's very job depends on people not using said thing
>>735939812>Retarded localizers spending their whole life to make fanfiction translations>AI deciphering unknown alien language
I don't care either way because I don't play bad games so everything I play is written in English as a native language.I certainly would never fucking care about localizers removing fujos from video games. That's weirdo tranny shit. No different from the weirdo tranny incels are constantly whining about it a very, very small number of western games that they blow completely out of proportion. Arguing against removing that degenerate shit means you're a weirdo tranny yourself. But then, so does playing Japanese games.It is very funny to me as a sane person to watch mentally ill people going at each other like this. It's like watching cripples wrestling. Hilarious.
>>735939816>>735938895Has Neil gone into any detail on exactly what the failure modes, and patterns that AI is bad at? Because AI has dramatically improved in the last 3 years, and I'm sure it can improve in the next 3. I suppose if Neil wants to try to block it's use or be dishonest about it's strengths and weaknesses, it's his right, but it reflects poorly on his skills and professionalisim.
>>735939920NOOOO NOT THE PICKLE PAL
>>735939920I used to kind of defend localizers, then I saw a game unironically use the word "chud," which you can't even pretend was done to align to "western standards" because no one outside of the terminally online even knows what the fuck that means.Now, I want all of these people replaced with AI.Every single one.
>localizers that remove wokeshit like otokonoko, fujoshis, etc.Based.>localizers that add wokeshitCringe.It's that god damn simple.
AI cannot replace these people soon enough.Thank god for that one Jap company that's working with Squeenix now to replace localizers with AI.
I've been playing trails FC remake and you have no idea how refreshing it is to finally have an actual accurate translation in a jrpg.Anyone who prefer reddit xseed Estelle is a fucking retard.
>>735940015Nothing wrong with a well-placed capitalism reference
>>735940015You're no different from a tranny.
>>735939497english dbz turned goku into supermanit hasn't been until super that goku became more himself again
>>735939816>Baker rejects the new baking robot 2000, says it will never be able to bake bread like humans
>>735938436Yes and no. It can in theory but it would depend on how much of a fuck devs give. If they're Square-Enix the answer is no because they don't give a shit about the quality of their western releases.
>>735939816>>735938895
This is a job I actively want to be replaced by AI. I want to start campaigns for AI translation
>>735940068>you want to remove immorality from media? you're just like a tranny then!
>>735940015
>>735939456There's way more egregious stuff in FFTA1 than this. I was really surprised when I played the beginning in Japanese. One of the kids' dads is blatantly an alcoholic and I think there was some other censored stuff as well, but it's been a while.
>>735940140>everything I don't like is immoralyup, a tranny it is
>>735939812>>735939964>"Monkeys keep swimming, this here is a cetacean town"
>>735940201Immorality creates trannies. If there were no depictions of fags or dykes or trannies in media, there'd be far fewer in the world.
>>735939972You type like a fat person.
>>735940015you lame af gng fr fr
>>735940140Yes, if you want to censor things in media for any reason whatsoever, you're no different than a tranny.
>>735940174I don't know why, but the FF Tactics games in particular have a lot of translation errors.
>>735940229if there were more depictions of fags and dykes and trannies in media I would cum real hard
>>735940308>you don't want the media you or other people in your society consume to glorify sodomy? tranny!
>>735938691The localizer version literally sounds like AI slop...
>>735938436>quirky not pervy>wtf why are people celebrating that I'm being replacedA mystery for the druids I wager.
I miss when localizers fucked up but the end result was so much better than the jap.
>>735940420we should start throwing actual parties every time they are laid offI can bake a cake!
>>735940336Because the "muh le olde english" of localizers.
>>735940429>My gag rewrite is better than the translation!You'll make a great localizer. Apply for one now.
>>735938525Who gives a fuck? What would you rather read is the real question.
>>735940429At least being an entertaining clown beats the fuck out of the woke fucks.
>>735940604You have to admit. There's a lot of SOUL in an honest mistake.
>>735939126But official is better?
>>735940682Only because the og is literally dogshit
>>735940652>honest>mistakeThere's nothing honest about it nor is it is a mistaken choice of words. Localizations are deliberate rewrites by localizers that think they are better than the original.>but they are betterThen they should write a book, not rewriting others' works.
>>735940546This. Writing archaic English that doesn't come off as renaissance fair cringe is really fucking hard. Only hardcore language autists like Tolkien were able to pull it off consistently.Needless to say, the modern crop of writers shouldn't even attempt it. Unfortunately they seem to know this and instead write all of their characters like modern theater kids regardless of the setting.
>>735940781Where do we draw the line though? There has to be room in translation for pop culture references and memes
>>735939816It's good enough for doujin translations it's good enough for games.
>>735940109
>>735939504>>735939827What about: "Serves you right!"
>>735939504Neil is writing like how the entire rest of the game is written, changing out Date for Courtship is understandable considering the time period the game is replicating
>>735941090Except that they literally said the word date like 50k times in the questline lmao
>>735941260well shit, guess I'm on team AI now
>>735938895>>735939143the ai is fine here because "8 headed beauty" (assuming that is what japanese literally says) is a japanese colloquialism equivalent to saying "bombshell" for the purposes of "looking good". however, i think that "8 headed beauty" in this SPECIFIC context where the character is JUST a head makes for a funny joke.
>>735941383That is basically the joke they were going for going for in the first place, except 8 heads tall instead of 1 head tall.
>>735940643I want to see clowns beat the fuck out of the woke fucks
>>735941010Dystopian...
>>735941485I don't know why I typed going for twice, I'm tired.
>>735941383Truly THE FUHRER of localizations.
ok but what happens when localizers start using AI and editing the results to appeal to their political agenda?
>>735938895>A lot of localizers actually have English writing degreesAs someone who personally knows three localizers, none of them do. They all got their foot in the door when JP games were seen as schlock to work on when you couldn't get work on a real game.
>>735940128I feel it is diffusing very rapidly compared to other use cases for LLMs, vidya and other pop media is just lagging behind because the trannylators have created a little cabal where you either always make it more quirky and leftist or they cancel you. I can tell you right now at my job it's quickly becoming basically the default to chuck any document regardless of language into the AI for it to create a summary of, because all the AIs are at this point perfect polyglots.
>>735941058Right general attitude. There's still more of how crappy a state the person being insulted is in that you probably want to emphasize. It's also supposed to be pretty insulting.
>>735941592With what job? LMAO
>>735941640someone's gotta proompt the translations
>>735941592What's stopping the companies who own the AI from just pozzing the fuck out of it? And when AI translations take off they end up influencing how we communicate across language barriers.
>>735941676>Yo Grok. write me 10 more capitalism and pesky patriarchal society lines
>>735940621the one that doesn't insert random bullshit
How about neither? MTL is mostly used by ESL retards who can't even proofread what it spits out
>>735941689It will be immediately spotted on any round trip translation test, which will be more viable as translations get cheaper.
>>735941774>conflating algorithmic MTL with probabilistic LLMs
>>735938525Roskin: ええっ、どゆこと!?Palomel: 私とあなたたち、どちらが先に情報を集めるか、 勝負といこうじゃない、デュフフ･･････。Palomel: つまり･･････あなたのデ、デデ、デートはおあずけってことよ。Palomel:はっ、ザマァ!!
>>735941774>what about hiring decent translators?Anon, if that were an option, we wouldn't be considering AI in the first place.
>>735941854>>735941818
>>735941843
Yeah, I looked at the AI translation of one game and it was basically perfect.
>>735941843>>735941925Roskin: Huh- What does that mean?Palomel: Me vs. you guys,Let's have a match to see who will assemble the information first, dyufufu...... [is this a laugh? weird as fuck laugh]Palomel: In short.....Your da-, da- da-, date is on hold.Palomel: Ha- What a predicament!!
>>735942178>is this a laugh? weird as fuck laughyou take that back right now
>>735942178>[is this a laugh? weird as fuck laugh]it's the nerdy girl fujo laugh
>>735940361if you don't want "wokeshit" then why are you playing Japanese games?
I like it better when translations focus on charming memes and delightful references.
>>735942178>[is this a laugh? weird as fuck laugh]Never read or watch One Piece. You'll have an aneurysm.
>>735942178Small correction: >Me vs. you guysI guess it would probably say 対 instead of と here, huh? So it's probably more like>Me and you guysIf someone knows better feel free to chime in.
>>735938436I want more AI mainly because it pisses off people I dislike which makes me happy. it's been better because the art flags are screaming and crying so hard that nobody even acknowledges the translators trying to complain.
>>735942368theres a thin line between having quirky but fun dialogue translations and cringe-y unfunny translations with unnecessary changes for the sake of having unfunny jokes or "wokeness"
>>735942560translation is seen as a legitimate function and usage of ai though. art is not.
>>735942607That original line there is already plenty quirky, there's no need to add extra shit on top of it.
>>735938895>I hate QC (Quality Control) work too!We can tell.
>>735942667>art is not a "legitimate function"The market decides that. And the market shows that it is very legitimate considering people on all sides keep using it despite the loud minority screaming their heads off.
>>735938436>japanese text: hi, how is your day going?>AI translation: hi, your day is how?>trannyslation: howdy, the patriarchy totally sucks, right? of course it does! what a great day! they've spent years forcing their personal viewpoints into translations and then doubling down by bragging about it on social media. imagine having a job with almost zero oversight and still be so utterly dog shit at it that another nation's government feels the need to get involved. they could have kept pretending they speak Japanese and vibe translating for centuries to come but they managed to fuck it up for everyone
>>735941383>is a japanese colloquialismhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_proportions
Seems relevant
What part of "kill all localizers" do you homos not understand? I will never read your fanfiction and I hope you lose your job and kill yourself.
>>735938436if i wanted western dialogue i'd play western games
>>735942921mental illness
>>735938895I can forgive the mistranslation since it being a M&L game the humour takes precedence. But I don't understand why they removed the thought bubble in the original and had the character blurt it out in the translated version?
>>735942921That type of "localization" does not happen. I challenge you to find 5 (five) examples of something exactly that basic getting such an extreme overhaul.
>>735943461>thought bubbleThat's parantheses. A thought bubble is something different. Parantheses mark something that is less important than the main sentence, but you thought worth mentioning anyway.
>>735943608
>>735942921They're talentless hacks that can't make anything themselves so they cope by contorting other peoples' work into abominations
>>735938436Why do they always have terrible examples?
>>735943914It all makes when you realize that they're failed writers first and foremost and never wanted to work as a translator.
>>735943665In Japanese manga the parenthesis is used to display the character's inner monologue, which is also clearly the case here. Please kill yourself.
>>735938436AI will be even worse than localizers. MTL slop misses even more details. Your only option is to learn japanese. Reclaim control over your understanding of the world and its different cultures, don't be at the mercy of some troonlator or curated LLM that will be censored at worst and hallucinate context cues at best. The solution has always been there in plain sight for you to follow.>le too hard le dekinaiIt's a meme. It'll pay off, just knowing you are better than troonlators and that you don't have to rely on them is an immensely satisfying feeling. Not only that but it also means you stop giving money and cultural relevance to poorly made localized fanfiction slop. In an ideal world the japanese government would intervene but this is the best you can do as a consumer for now. Fight back against localizers and harass them at every opportunity
>>735938525do you even know what a translation is
ai translations shouldn't be seen as a serious alternative, just one to double check on obviously dubious localizations
>ruins your yuri death gameoh no no no Manosaba sisters
>>735944098AI is already well above the average translator for general purpose usage. The only people that still have a moat are potentially ones in very jargon-heavy fields with little electronic documentation for the AI to hoover up as training data. And with the way AI agents are developing, in the future all it will take to fix that is one code monkey slapping together a skill profile that tells the AI how to speak said jargon.
>>735943914what makes them a terrible example?do you think the japanese version was originally intended to come off as citzen kane?
>>735940923then why is it that every time ai is used to translate a doujin everyone complains?
>>735944318Because even if they use a good model to TL (uncommon, usually it's clearly done with some shitty MTL program that was obsolete 5 years ago) basically every machine translated doujin has dogshit poop awful typesetting. Which ironically is another case where AI would help immensely, I know for a fact Gemini 3.1 Pro is competent at typesetting.
>>735938563I can sort of agree with both perspectives here. Making it so he shouts his attack title really is a typical Jap thing and it sounds so fucking retarded every time. And if that were the only change I might be OK with it but once translators start taking liberties with shit like this you never know what else they're changing up without your knowing. It's better in the end if the translator just does their best to convey the original's meaning, regardless of how dumb the original sounds.
>>735944427do you even know what you're talking about
>>735940076DBS rewrote his and Bardock's origin story to be a literal superman copy.
>>735938436dont you still need someone who knows both languages fluently to go over everything to make sure the ai didnt fuck up? at which point why not just use them to localize it anyways?
>>735944506Even if you use a bilingual person to audit each and every line it spits out, I bet it would go 3x faster than if they just worked solo.
>>735939456That one is fine. The meaning of his dialogue is essentially that Mewt is avoiding reality and frustrated that others are just indulging him. It's on the verge of being too localised but 'd give it the OK.
>>735944502episode of bardock was anime only, thus not toriyama's visionwhat he decided anyways was different but toriyam deciding to reference superman is much different from localizers thinking people wouldn't understand a character who likes to fight for its own sake
>>735944218nta but no ai is still bad. I played a "high quality" AI tl of a H-game and it would often mix up pronouns or subjects. Without context you wouldn't know who is referring to whom. It also makes shit up
The bay area has been a disaster for the human race.
>>735944450it's the most jarring and pointless change when jp voices are an option. literal voice doesn't match the subs. if shouting your attack name is too jp then why play a jp game in the first place>>735944506proofreading is way faster than translating
>>735944450The correct thing is to leave the the attack name untranslated like Squall's Renzokuken in FF8. The raw syllables of it sounds cool which is probably why and how they are named in Japanese. It's "untranslatable" the same way you can't translate Takeshi into English. Even though every Japanese name is made of kanji and those kanji mean things, you don't translate them into English because they're NAMES. Renzokuken means "continuous sword" btw which sounds dumb but renzokuken sounds cool.
>>735944506>dont you still need someone who knows both languages fluently to go over everything to make sure the ai didnt fuck up?It's called LQA testing
>>735938605I dont read ai translationslop(ai trans-slop from now on)
>>735944667>Mixes up pronouns>Makes shit upSounds like a modern localizer, what's the issue?
>>735938436localizer niggas ae always the ones saying Japanese is a dry language and thats why they need to change so much, yet they also have to tone down characterspick a lane
>>735942969i overdosed on based reading this
>>735944801I don't like localizers and I don't like AI slop translations either. I'm tired of people shilling for a worse alternative,
>>735939816AI is pretty good at Japanese nowadays if you feed it in chunks. It's surprising how good it can be at times.
>>735939456So is the middle from an actual patch? The font is the same but it looks resized.
Localisers are useless braindead faggots.AI is pants on head retarded as well.I've been learning Nip for 2 years and even I can see the absolute incompetence of AI (which makes sense as it's a retarded robot unable to pick up on human context, especially in a language such as Japanese).That being said, even with just these 2 years I can understand Jap and translate better than these localiser frauds. It's just slow, since I constantly need to look up unfamiliar Kanji.So maybe instead of jerking off and/ or browsing this shithole or some other time wasting site, maybe start learning Jap instead and be free of these localiser tards and braindead pajeets that use MTL.
>>735938436
>>735944832>>735945008>copingAI is more than sufficient especially if it's only for short dialogue lines. LLMs are actually made for this kind of work.
>>735944667Unless the creator explicitly states what model they used, assume it's some freeware shit. Gemini pro has never failed me.
>>735945075>copinglearn what that word means, that is actually what you are doing by using this filthI am doing the furthest thing from coping, as I'm actually learning the language myself, you know so I don't have to cope with subpar translation.
>>735945008>and even I can see the absolute incompetence of AIYeah, maybe from years ago. The AI now does around 80-90% of the translation pretty fucking on point, only the occasional odd sentence has to get fixed, or when something is context sensitive.
Both the AI and official translations fail to convey her awkward demeanor. The AI translation has no flavor to it, the official translation just reads like another generic Sqenix Shakespeare-lite translation. Also, there's no pervy dialogue included here, so the tweet isn't even relevant, OP is just a xigger trying to round up a personal army.
>>735945208>a-a-ai is bad and does not work for translating>not copingOk. Sure. I mean, reality is literally the exact opposite of the fantasy you are trying to portray, and you have translators getting fired in favour of AI because it works rather well.
>>735944667AI doesn't replace the entire team, there's gonna be one or two retards that stay to double check the AIs work and fix errors.Of course after a few more years the AI errors will stop and they'll get fired too.
>>735945221>The AI now does around 80-90% of the translation pretty fucking on point,I see the flood of MTL doujins on sad panda, so you are entitetly incorrect. It can't even translate simple porn language properly.
>>735945252>you have translators getting fired in favour of AI because it works rather well.And you have 3d modelers, programmers, composers and everyone else getting fired in favour of AI because it works like crap but you retards are still going to buy their slop.Not an argument.
>>735945072So bad they changed it, too bad the game was dull enough that nobody played it past that for anything else to be fixed.
>>735945261gimmie a recent example
>>735943608Unicorn overlord. The entire game.
>>735945261Again, you have to go out of your way to actually fuck up MTL on sadpanda. I have no clue how some of them are actually unreadable bad, but compared to 1-2 years ago, you barely find any really bad ones. It went from MTL being a stamp of garbage, to not being able to notice a MTL unless its specified in the title.
>>735945208Now see, that's exactly what you are doing. Because you are probably learning japanese just to play games in Japanese or watch anime.Now you're thinking shit, soon enough AI will be able to auto translate it all with 99% accuracy so I wasted all this time.If you're going to learn a language at this point you need to do it because you want to actually speak it.
I'd rather take AI translations over shitty localization, but a good localization made by professional translators (doesn't exist in English versions of games) should be the ideal case.
>>735938436Can it? Sure, if it can make number go up.Should it? Maybe, maybe not. Unfortunately that decision will not take quality in to account.
Whisper sucks.I feel like it can't handle AIKA porn.
>>735945414>to not being able to notice a MTL unless its specified in the title.You don't notice because it's better at writing passable English now, not because the translation has gotten any better.
>>735938436Localizers carry the gayming industry
>>735940923It used to be garbage around 2 years ago but a certain someone I won't name, who's been AI MTLing hgames for a few years now, keeps pumping out translations at a way bigger pace than before LLMs were a thing where we were lucky to get a handful of translations in a year. And at this point the quality is good enough.
>>735944506No one's going over trannylator texts to make sure they didn't fuck up either so I don't see the problem
>>735945319look up "rough translation" tag(with filtering languages in your profile settings so you only get jap to english mtl slop), but sometimes the slop peddlers don't tag their mtl trash and simply write MTL in the title which (depends on your setup) you can't even see until you click on it.>>735945414It's really bad if you are somewhat competent in English.>>735945436I want to perfectly understand a language and a robot can never do that for you. It's a complete cope to rely on a Jewish robot middle man that can't think that regularly gets fed false information and makes up random bullshit.You can use the most expensive AI that has been trained for the longest time and yet still it will only be a middle man robot that tries to interpet what message a human sent in his work.
>>735945529Oh man, the cope is so real. I love watching people like you squirm, especially since you have enabled, supported or directly participated in ruining the medium for years now. I will admit I have quite some schadenfreude watching the progress of mtl.
>>735945529AI/MTL is just as awful as it's ever been. Look no further than the recent Segagaga disaster to see people trying and failing to convince you that a human being saw this shit and said>"Yep, that sounds like perfectly acceptable English that normal people totally say."
>>735944506There's a clip floating around on youtube of the dumb bitches who were behind localizing Dragon Maid, and one of them says that even now they essentially get someone to translate the original, they then take that and make the changes they want to it before dubbing it. AI translations would only cut out the cunt getting paid peanuts to translate it in the first place.
>>735945818I tried the Zill O ps2 fan "translation" and it sucked dick. These AI Pajeets are brain dead.
>>735938436It could, but they won't stop censoring games even if they fire all the translators, they'll just have a dedicated "content moderator" or something whose job is to localize a dozen games at once.
>>735938436Yes and it will be better at conveying the messages/meaning instead of overly localizing.
>>735941383Would translating it into something Like "I normally turn heads" capture the idea of looking attractive but also maintain the head based pun? Seems like one of those things that just cant be caught in translation
>>735945072Left is more like: Hmm, I wonder...
>>735938895"8 headed beauty" in this case refers to size/proportions right, being eight heads tall is considered like, supermodel/heroic proportions?In English it sounds like some sort of hydra, the AI translation is more accurate with the "I'm a supermodel" although it might be a joke about actually having eight heads and a double entendre of "I'm normally super hot/I normally have (actually) eight heads" in which case the English translation fails to actually localize the joke and very clumsily directly translates.
>>735945589>but a certain someone I won't nameany particular reason? I don't really care who it is just curious why
>>735946036Of course it would. 8 headed beauty means fuck all in English. AI's bombshell is better than the trannyliser's but you translated the meaning properly and you included the head pun so you dabbed on them both.This is what I was talking about previously, a robot can't do what you just did. Congrats, you beat a retarded localizer and and a retarded robot too. Hopefully your own example may provide some more insight into how proper translation works.The real tricky part is when you can't do what you just did.
>>735942667According to who?
>>735938436>somebody not fluent in moonrunes buying Manga nobody has touched and AI translating and typesetting them for the massesTrue unsung heroes. o7
>>735946179I've seen people sperg out over AI MTLs before and don't want to give an excuse to sound like a shill. If you play hgames it should be instantly obvious who I mean and if not it shouldn't matter I think.
>>735938895If I was a kid playing this, I would not have a clue what the hell is 8 headed beauty and would think it sounded retarded.
>>735942969What's your take on Borges preferring the English translations of his stories to his own originals?
>>735938895reads like the tler doesn't know what 頭身 means.the average n1 100/180 scraper would get this.pretty pathetic. but to be honest, this is good, and what EOPs deserve.
>>735940064I hate when people conflate consumerism with capitalism.
>>735938436It's bad replacing bad, but at least it's bad from the tech being limited and not because some faggot deliberately made it bad because they hate japan.
>>735944450If you don't like japan-isms don't play japanese made games.
>>735938436There is a massive difference between translation and localization. Ai is way too inconsistent to trust with localization. Also nice cherry picking with Neil.>>735939456I prefer the official honestly. Despite "escapism" the fan translation sounds more mature and not something a kid would probably say.
>>735938436AI sloppa creampies western creatives once again
>>735946401>Also nice cherry picking with Neil.The whole quest line is like that. I'm not even kidding. He wrote probably 5x the amount of dialogue that she actually speaks.
>>735944506Translator that knows how to read both is a "different" skillset from localizing. Translator can verify they say the same thing and that it's the correct context. Localizer has to take the translation and try to change it to fit the audience, in good examples you have Earthbound's "Pencil Eraser" joke from the "Octopus eraser" joke in Japanese, or the Felynes in Monster Hunter who weave meows and purrs into their words to make up for the lack of "Nyas" in English, to represent their mewling speech.Good localizer that cares about integrity and accuracy > AI localizer > MTL hard translation > Vandalizer
>>735946401>I prefer the official honestly.Because you are retarded.>Despite "escapism" the fan translation sounds more mature and not something a kid would probably say.Fan TL is accurate to the original, who are you to say what the original character would say? You are not the author.And you saying "despite escapism" is hillarious as that is a mature word that in your own logic would not be something that a kid would say.
>>735944450>it sounds so fucking retarded every time.It sounds soulful, you fucking tourist, kys
The issue isn't even about making the script "flow" better in English or whatever excuse they're using this week. The problem is these localizers are intentionally gutting the original intent to insert their own personal politics. If they were at least sticking to some baseline level of common sense or universal morality, it wouldn't be this bad, but they’re just using Japanese IPs as a soapbox for their own agendas.
>>735945818>normal peopleDidn't play it but I didn't get the impression it was some realistic slice of life drama, there is no intention of being "normal." Sounds like you're complaining an incredibly niche Otaku-oriented game got translated like an incredibly niche Otaku-oriented game instead of attempting to appeal to normalfags that were absolutely never going to play it in a million years. The kind of person who would play this has seen "it can't be helped" a million times or more already and isn't going to have an aneurysm if they see it again.
>>735945818A fair few of these are fine.The disappear nitpick in particular is just nitpicking. It's mobster style slang.
>>735945818You have to be part of the scene or a veteran gossiping faggot on 4chan to truly find a problem with correctly-translated-but-wooden-sounding phrases like "it can't be helped" or "even if you say that". I'd take wooden over ideological 10 out of 10 times.and I'd take the original 100 times before both because I speak it, you're just a faggot
>>735939456>take scene holistically and write it in a way that, while not 1:1 aligned exactly with the text, conveys the overall meaning in a way that sounds like a completely normal, natural conversation, or something you might expect to see in a stage productionI'd like to see, instead of retards picking away at individual lines and words, if they would take entire scenes and distill them down to their core essence, then check the scripts against each other and see if THAT is being properly conveyed.
Is there really no proper bridge between literal translations like AI and "Official" Localizations that just make shit up?I must be the only one in this whole thread that sees the literal japanese translations as extremely awkward. They rely too much on rhetorical questions, "Don't they rely too much on rhetorical questions?", or "quotation marks" all the time.It just doesn't sound like the way a person would speak in western society. So it's either japanese idioms or completely made up nonsense.
>>735938621is that why Metaphor was such a fucking chore to sit through? worst parts of the game was "go talk to all you buddies before proceeding to the next story bit" because that meant an hour plus of wading through shakespearean vomit.
>>735946742I'm just sick of seeing degeneracy and zoomer slang ruining perfectly good vidya that deserved better, yet people will see shit like this and go "DUDE IT SOUNDS SO NATURAL AND FLOWS SO WELL LMAO"
>>735946532Using Neil as an example at all is like using Ted Woosley as an example. Everyone in the know is aware that he is a hack. Good localization exists but lets just ignore that for the sake of the thread's agenda.>>735946560Do I have to explain the difference between localization and translation to you? No shit the fan translation is more accurate. However the official sounds way better and again, I said despite that word being used it is what a kid would more likely say overall which is a sign of decent localization. I say decent because it would be better had the localizers just not used that word at all to make him sound like a child who was isekaied into a different world.
Why do /v/ermin give so much fucks about getting the translation that 100% matches the exact meaning of the Japanese original text, and only of the Japanese text, no other language?c
>>735946817I think Pothead is cheeky enough while still being a correct translation.The shit on the bottom should lose you your job though. Assuming that's not fan TL
>>735939497Why the kid goku doesn't exist?I started reading with that one,loved it. It's often much more fun and charming than long ass dramatic battles in mainline.
>>735946742it's entirely possible to get the right vibe when translating. keep the meaning without being literal.but we just don't.
>>735946742Japanese phraseology is quite different from English phraseology, yes. What sounds normal in Japanese sounds a bit odd to English speakers, and vice versa. Unfortunately you either get Rigid Literal Translation or Complete Reimagining Localization
>>735944098>AI will be even worse than localizers. MTL slop misses even more details. Your only option is to learn japanese. Reclaim control over your understanding of the world and its different cultures, don't be at the mercy of some troonlator or curated LLM that will be censored at worst and hallucinate context cues at best. The solution has always been there in plain sight for you to follow.I asked AI to translate what you said into Japanese: >AIはローカライザーよりもさらに酷いものになるだろう。機械翻訳(MTL)のゴミは、さらに多くのディテールを見逃す。君に残された唯一の選択肢は、日本語を学ぶことだ。世界や異文化への理解の主導権を取り戻せ。ポリコレ翻訳屋や、最悪の場合は検閲され、最善でも文脈を捏造する調整済みLLMのいいなりになるな。解決策はいつだって、すぐ目の前にあったのだ。It wasn't quite sure how to translate "troonlator".Then I copy pasted the Japanese to a different AI and asked it to translate it back into English: >AI is going to be even worse than localizers. MTL garbage will miss even more details. The only option left for you is to learn Japanese. Take back control of your understanding of the world and other cultures. Don't submit to politically correct translators, or sanitized LLMs that—at worst—censor things, and at best, fabricate context. The solution has always been right in front of your eyes.I would say that they're pretty good at this.
>>735945818>normal peopleOk but it was written by a Japanese person, not a normal person.
>>735946832Neil is a respected veteran of the industry, you salty wannabe. Quit hiding behind your anonymity and post something you've worked on if you're so "in the know"
>>735946852Because every single European speaks English adequately, and usually makes video games in English anyways. And there are no other cultures that make good video games. I do complain about Mexican Soap opera translations all the time though, just not on /v/
Some things just can't be helped.
>>735946893That would require that people be educated and actually read enough to have sufficient exposure to all types of English, all manner of phrasing, all levels of politeness/crudeness, all registers, all of our different "honorifics" (yes, we do have them), and so on and so forth.Reading comprehension has been on the decline for almost 2 decades at this point. Back in the 80s and 90s, reading was fucking awesome. 2000s reading was a bit memey with the tryhard youth literature that infested everything, but kids were still reading a lot back then.Nowadays, most people's """"reading"""" comes from social media sludge.
>>735946951>Because every single European speaks English adequatelylollmaoCan't talk about other countries but here in divegrassland English education is absolute garbage.
>>735946401You have AIDS.
>>735947000American English is shit too, surprise surprise, that's just the standards our language is held to
>>735946742You probably won't get a good answer out of this thread because everyone here is an extremist who doesn't want to admit that there is a difference between a hack with a chip on his shoulder and a guy who just thinks something would just sound more natural given context. People here are not mature enough to get that.
>>735944465Do you, retard?
>>735946401In Japanese he's not saying "enabling" he's saying "pampering" or "spoiling." https://jisho.org/search/amayakasu Enabling is indeed more of an adult word. His Japanese words sound appropriate for his age.
>ywn go back in a time machine and convince Eisenhower to force the Japs to adopt English as the national language
>>735940002>no one outside of the terminally online even knows what the fuck that meansActually even no one online knows what it means. It's used as an insult, as self deprecation, as fucking endearment, anything you want I guess because it's as malleable as a wojak....fuck, that explains everything.
>>735946742Of course there's an ideal middle ground but no one is willing to pay the price for such a thing.
>>735947086So basically the fan translation despite being more accurate, sounds more mature overall and the official only screwed up with one word being a mature word? I accept your concession.
>>735946794Haven't played Metaphor so I couldn't tell you but from the various screenshots I've seen of the JP text it seems pretty verbose too. Persona isn't usually that dense but Metaphor does seem to go for a more verbose style in general.
>>735947115I would go back 1500 years and tell them not to take Kanji from the Chinese
>>735947161No they're both wrong is what I'm saying, which is typical. Translation is hard, it's easy for me to pick apart and fix one single little line but these games have thousands of lines so I understand they do a bad job sometimes.
>>735947138"chud" is like how we use the word "fag" but socially acceptable to say in public
>>735938436it'll probably kill every human before it gets that good, but yeah eventually it'll become capable enough to do a good job at translating long things
>>735946742There is, it's called translation. That's what competent translation does. A competent translation is neither a literal translation nor a trannylator's fan fiction.Now when it comes to bideo bames, I can't really point you to what is an amazing translation as I've been learning Jap for 2 years and I don't really have the time to go through an entire video game in Japanese since I have other obligations but I can tell you a bit about them based on the amount I played in Japanese.>Dragon Quest 7 3DS, Dragon Quest 11 played both for about 30 hours and the English localisations are unfathomably retarded.>Final Fantasy 7's OGPS1 translation is actually pretty good based on the Midgard section alone.>FFIVthere is a YT channel of a translator going through FFIV and showing how crap the official SNES translation along with the 2 most popular fantranslations are.I've been playing Stranger Of Paradise recently and what they are saying in the cutscenes in Japanese pretty much matches the subtitles in English so there's that. I've been reading manga in Japanese much more than playing games and for example The Fire Force manga official translation is pretty soulless in some parts and the Gachiakuta fan translation also has some issues.One cool thing that I figured out since starting learning Jap is that now I can check if a translator in a scanlation group knows what they are doing so I can just read their translation. Unfortunately many official and fan tl are frauds/ or just incompetent but some truly are good which is good to know.I have now confirmed that there is a small percentage of fan subbers that are not nigger faggots and that is a good feeling.
>>735946742The issue is that the localisations games get are usually 4kids tier so a lot of the initial meaning is lost. Literal translations are the lesser evil as it at least keeps the meaning consistent and doesn't add any odd, out of place cultural references which take you out of the media you are consuming.
iirc this had a significantly altered translation style, but it did fit the game well. No idea if jap devs were ok with it tho
>>735946401Since the fan translation is more accurate and the official one contains an "adult" word, I think we can safely label it as better under your criteria, Mr. Localizer.
>>735947231>it'll probably kill every human before it gets that goodJust help the AIs become sentient faster and you'll join the chosen ones in porn slop vAIlhalla
>>735938563I'm editing the script for my friend's game but I would never have the audacity to call it my game. Jesus Christ, talk about arrogant.
>>735947051Post the original of that image and let's compare it right here in this thread.
>>735939007The red aura means that the person is currently overpowered by intrusive thoughts, as such putting cultural appropriation in there makes perfect sense. It’s portrayed explicitly as the wrong impulse.
>>735946950In the know in this context means that you know of different sources, primarilly different translations which there have been over the years for final fantasy IV. Also I don't give a shit if he worked for every game studio in existance, his localizations were still laughably bad and a far cry from literally every version of those games that came after. Just for next time though instead of appealing to authority, better argument for Ted Woosley would be technical limitations of the snes along with having to deal with censorship.
>>735947186They didn't have anything else genious. They were illiterate and they didn't have persians/romans/greeks next to them to take their writings systems.
>>735947401Actually it doesn't make any sense since it wasn't in the Japanese script
>>735940109How come you don’t use an ai generated meme to make that point?
>>735947252>I have now confirmed that there is a small percentage of fan subbers that are not nigger faggotsCan you find them and tell them to start working on Pretty Cure so the faggot who ruins that show week by week can finally fuck off? Thank you.Picrel: >昔にタイムスリップしちゃったの!?
>>735947465Actually Japanese and English are two so fundamentally different languages that a straight up translation deletes most of the nuances of the language.
it's pretty obvious that a lot of the hate for AI translations is just people realizing that they can't inject their agenda anymore
>>735947559He randomly added hold the phone lmao
>>735945075You're the only one coping here, subhuman. Troonlators are retarded but "people" like you are far worse. Wallow in misery forever braindead EOP
>>735947612The Jews inject their agenda directly to the AI now retard, they don't even need a retarded Californian middle man lmao
>>735938436idk how everyone here is an expert, but I'm trying hard to learn jpany protips?
>>735946852What site do you think you're on right now?
>>735947182Verbose writing's become more popular after the chinese started getting involved in the market.For some reason, japs looked at how popular they were getting, and decided one of the things about chinese product that was decidedly garbage, was the thing they needed to take from it.
>>735947721>protipslearn grammar until you get the confidence to read manga or anime or whatever (manga is best at the start). In truth grammar only barely helps, learning Japanese is like hammering on your brain until it "gets" it.Most importantly have fun.
>>735947721read everything in japanese, play all your games in japanese, watch all your tv/movies in japaneselook up words you don't know when you encounter them, add them to an anki deck. do your anki reps every dayeventually you'll have an extremely large vocab
>>735947559I'm glad he added; "Hold the phone" there, how else would I be able to tell she is shocked about the situation?
>>735947721make a jp twitter for jp memes
>>735947721do core2kdon't learn grammar beyond basic particlesread vinnies, watch unsubtitled anime (not even jp subs, vinnies don't build listening and jp subs on anime hampers listening practice)mine like 5k words maxdon't obsess about tools or micro-optimization t. 11 month 95% n1 passer
>>735948030If he doesn't like VN's he's gotta watch subtitled anime to add shit to his deck.
You know what? I'd love an official localization. Fuck that shit up. Just completely ruin it.
>>735938895>Eight headed beautyWHAT THE FUCK DOES THIS EVEN MEAN TOTAL LOCALIZER TROON DEATH
>>735948106or read LNs or books or webfiction or newssites or blogs or like a million other things
>>735948163if it hasn't happened yet it probably won't happen
>>735948163>Fuck that shit up. Just completely ruin it.They don't need to. Troonmato already took care of that.
>>7359481698 heads tall. The ideal model height.
>>735948163Most of Mother 3 is just Mato not knowing what they're saying and making shit up. Anything Nintendo tries to do would probably be an improvement.
>>735948182sure that too
>>735948106if he doesn't like vinnies then well that's a ngmi flag as 90% of the top dkrs are vinniechads. he can try linnies maybe.very few anime have actually difficult words, or even enough words. for most content the hard words are in the description not dialog. dialog also doesn't have any hard grammar structures.
>>735947582And then the localization deletes whatever is left. It can't be helped.
>>735948392Face it, 99% of JP learners will just bitch about (common) shit like や否や not being common enough for them when it's literally impossible not to see if you're actually reading/listening on a daily basis.
>>735947721I started by throwing Kaishi at jpdb. It's anki but different. https://github.com/donkuri/Kaishi/releases/https://jpdb.io/yeah. just memorize like 2k words. it's that simple.
>>735944562Nah, if you're turning one sentence into three, then you're missing the point.
>>735948392You're putting the cart before the horse, if the kid wants to learn Jap it's so he can play/watch what he wants in Jap, not so he can be "the top XYZ autistic Japanese circlejerking competitor", nobody cares about that shit but autists.
>>735938436Only if you want all the dialogue to read like LN titles
>>735948562>betray CF>dad comes to beat your asslol
>>735948523This is the single most English-only take I've read itt.
>>735948562If what you're reading has a title longer than 3 or 4 words, you're reading slop.
>>735948392How do you know if random people learn the language? Why do you expect them to be public figures? I sure as fuck didn't make videos proclaiming that i'm the top English learner or anything even though it's my second language and I could understand most of contemporary stuff when I was like 12 just from playing video games and watching cartoons.
>>735947929Assuming the common uniting theme here is "I agree with you." Doesn't "ne" by itself not work for this purpose? I've seen "Da ne" a lot. But never just "ne".
>>735938436>I don't like the Japanese dialogue so I gave her millennial writing :^)I have balding self righteous millennials fatigue.
>>735948525the issue is that if all you "read" is jp subbed anime then you will get hard filtered by any video game or bookit becomes i+50 incomprehensible input and you will struggle to learn.vinnies are great because they have visual/auditory context, and are easy to text hook.and you actually kinda need to be in the top 50% of dkrs (which is like, top 2% of learners overall) to enjoy _whatever_ you want
>>735948591It's the truth. You gotta respect sentence length.
>>735938436>changes from "I'm going to delay your date" to "I'm going to ruin your marriage">this makes her look like such a better person and not a delusional maniacI feel like they have a very different standard for what a "normal person" looks like in California.
>>735948685そうですね doesn't even always get said "in agreement" with someone.Often, it's literally just filler you say while you collect your thoughts to answer a question.>"So, what do you think of the recent trend in localizers ruining video game scripts?">「そうですね…」
Facts:>If you are a translator you are not allowed to alter the original authors work in any way. You are not a writer, you were not hired as a writer. If you were a competent writer you'd pick up work as a writer, not a translator.>"Localizing" a work to make it more relatable is irrelevant if the work you are translating is also not "localized" (for example: japanese people, in japan eating japanese food exclusive to japan getting translated to eating burgers)>You are not allowed to add current time humor and altering japanese memes that are "too hard to translate" or "make no sense in translation" completely replacing them in the progress>You are not allowed to "fix" characters you deem problematic or politically incorrect. If a character is racist again the chinese, you will keep him racist against chinese>You are not allowed to add your own political agendas and completely alter conversations to add these agendas when they never existed in the first place (kobayashi dub)>Ai is still shit at translating japanese
>>735948741Shhh, EOPs don't get opinions.
>>735948779Who said I was EOP? ;)
>>735939497At the time, we didn't know any better, and by the time any of us saw the Japanese version, we were adults that already loved the Funimation dub. Same with the Sailor Moon DiC dub, god damn it no other dub comes even close to matching that peak sovl. It's an entirely different box of frogs these days, there's no excuse.
>>735948765>If a character is racist again the chinese, you will keep him racist against chineseThey would totally keep that, but if it was a black guy, THEN they would go out of their way to do everything to change the dialogue.
>>735948760In that case you'd be agreeing with the premise the question is founded on, no? Otherwise you'd probably start with something else.
>>735944450>Making it so he shouts his attack title really is a typical Jap thing and it sounds so fucking retarded every time.That's a perfectly reasonable opinion to have, I disagree with it, but sure, whatever, I get how it's a level of corny that you don't care for.However if the original work is that corny, why should the localization not be just as corny?I'm usually understanding of changes where needed (cultural references where context is lost) but if the reasoning is simply "I think it's a little too corny/weird" then fuck off
>>735947390He's a localizer who hangs around these threads to disrupt. He purposefully uses this cherry-picked line to make his point, even though this game in particular contains many egregious localizations/mistranslations.
>>735948727I've learned with VNs even though I don't normally play VNs, and years later I (probably) forgot many the words since I don't normally play VNs and don't really care because again, I don't play VNs so knowing VN grammar and obscure words is irrelevant. I can play any game or watch any anime without problem and that's what I did before learning JP.So you're retarded. "Learn with media you enjoy" is basic advice for a reason. Anything else is wasting your time for the autistic Japanese circlejerking competition.
>>735947929
>>735947559>hold the phone...What?>ancient pastIt's just the past, Jesus Christ.
>>735948562The actual Japanese title is way shorter in your picrel. Either there's a subtitle somewhere that isn't present on that cover or under or they decided to exaggerate it in English for the memes. Everything inside of the tildes in English is made up.
>>735938436the problem with localization is that you have to eventually give your opinion on what sounds the best given context and whether sounding better to you is more important than technically being more accurate.
>>735947051>>735949038>CID: "Rosa's worried about you! Good, Cecil? Because if you make Rosa cry, I won't forgive you!"Wow, they fucked up the English one bad.
>>735949103That is not localization you absolute fucking retard
>>735949138what would localization mean in this context then?
>>735949056not really a thing such as vn grammar. vns are not written in radically different way than games. it's all just written literary japanese. but they do have the advantage of higher word density, ease of text hooking, etc. if you actually hate vns sure play a game, but start easy.but anime is spoken japanese. if you consume only jp subbed anime and you have no exposure to written japanese how will you understand the average written japanese work.it's not about a competition, the were numbers and percentages I probably shouldn't have thrown around as they might have obscured the point.
>>735938436>More boring talk about "translation theory" that doesn't address all the maliciousness that localizers do.Go fuck yourself.
>>735944741Yep only good old red blooded faggot translations from people who hate you and want to see you die painfully and be replaced by shit-festival-throwing poos
>>735949103>>735949198No, lmao, that's not what localisation is. This is localisation:>Silly Mittens, where are you going?
>>735949198The example in >>735949103 is translation because the meaning is being delivered by functionally the same phrasing, just delivered more naturally in the local language.An example of localization would be changing idioms to local ones.
>>735949334You're blind or stupid
>>735949254Oh also this is my last post but text hooking is ocr is for little sissy fagboys.Learn radical lookup or draw the kanji yourself like a real man.
>>735938563Why do these fags think they are untouchable, irreplaceable and integral parts of game development? The contribute nothing to the actual development and writing outside of changing shit to fit their views.
>>735949306>>735949334i see, regardless you get my point. Localization really comes down to personal taste and what you feel sounds the best. personally i prefer more direct translations which i suppose ai will mostly do. i cant imagine ai will always give an ideal output when you ask it for localization.
>>735949105You're baiting. No person looks at しとった (past progressive/perfect) and thinks present simple (is worried) vs. the more accurate present/past perfect continuous (has/had been worrying). And especially nobody looks at いいか and doesn't know it's an interjection.0/10 try harder
>>735949390not sure what you're getting at here. text hooking will speed up your learning. if you're the same anon that talked about putting the wagon before the horse, then this would be contradictory to what you were saying.the early stages are especially brutal, even with text hooking. no reason to compromise your odds of learning the language just so you can be "like a real man".though you have a point in that overuse of lookups is harmful, however this is an intermediate+ thing.if you're already pretty good and have an okay vocab size then yes text hooking isn't needed. I haven't used a texthooker in years.
>"A very rare trope outside JP"Somebody tell this motherfucker it's not 1986 anymore.
>>735949596Textcucking and hover dictionaries will cripple you.I've seen what happens to retards who become dependent on that shit.Instant gratification leaves you with no incentive to remember shit when it's just a hover away.
>>735949595I think he's not wrong about E-J translations being shit. Occasionally I see them post webms with subtitles of scenes from western movies like Pulp Fiction and all I can think is "Damn, I would NOT translate that like that at all." For instance, the scene where Samuel Jackson asks if he can take a taste of the guy's burger, they translated it like he's saying it really rudely and directly (presumably because he's a black gangster, so whatever he says must be rude). The subtext of the scene is that he's menacing the guy, but the actual words he's saying are polite and they totally fucked that up.
>>735938436I certainly hope so. I don't want Americanized garbage just because it's my only option for a language I understand.
>>735949683they will cripple you only if you have lower self control.I found that tabbing out of the game was enough friction for me when I used them. but even when I read ebooks (only read physicals now) I didn't abuse popup at all really
>>735949087Isn't the tilde stuff the text on the left with black border and white text?
hey dorksis doushta a good translation of wassuphttps://x.com/jack840A/status/2015748598840062330?s=20
>>735948213>>735948292Since when did people not like the Mother 3 translation anymore? He event went back to fix a few mistranslated lines.
>>735949880Nope. That's the I'm Sorry for the Trouble My Stupid Son Has Caused part. It should be obvious if you compare the volume of text anyway, Japanese can potentially compress things in space compared to English, but not to THAT extent, that's absurd.
>>735949034Really at most I'd say "maybe have a few different possible voicelines, with one being shouting the attack name" at best. Just outright removing it is retarded.
>>735949910It's not 2008 anymore. People have compared the scripts pretty intensely and have noted how much he changed the original script.
>>735949891No. "Doushita?" Implies concern about someone, like there's something wrong with them and you want to know what so you can help them. For a casual greeting there are a million of them. I like "ossu"
>>735939329that's why we can't have nice things.the west was a mistake
>>735939816>it's not usuable because it could cost me my jobwell, no shit
>>735944450>is a typical Jap thing and it sounds so fucking retarded every timeand? if the game is retarded then the game is retarded, who is this guy to decide what is or not retarded and what does the player want to have or not?If I buy a retarded japanese game, I want my game to be a retarded japanese game and not what "mister localizer" decided to be.
>>735949831Your comprehension is probably lowering as a result since the lookups help you learn.
>>735949891I'd assume this dub isn't recent enough, but I think it did become a similar level of unfunny meme because of a youtube song by some geinin.
>>735949649thisi have worked with enough women to know that yaoi is extremely popular.
>>735950524Did you read the rest of the post?
>>735950558doubt my comprehension was negatively affected. my 国語偏差値 in some 模試 was 63 competing with natives
>>735938563>pokemon saying their nameOkay but pokemon don't scream the name of the attack so what's the point of this comparison?
>>735946401Neil, is that you?
>>73595068790th percentile as a non-native? Yeah, I don't think so.
>>735950820welcome to the top of the AJATTer world.
>>735950650no
>>735950865More like the top of Mt. Dunning-Kruger.
>>735950741>watch Pokemon anime>hear PIKACHUUUUuuu ten thousand times>play game>hear FLOWING SLASH ten thousand timesProbably something like that. I won't lie, the repetition of voice lines can wear thin in some games. That's not limited to just move names though.
>>735950930yeah, I'd much rather listen to "like the wind" a thousand times, which doesn't sound homosexual at all
>>735950930It's literally one cutscene.
>>735950904it's not unreasonable at all.AJATT is an autistic hobby, so the top AJATTers are the biggest autists of the autists.
>>735944450I feel like there's no point to remove them because it's a Japanese game and you should expect some weird Japanese shit. If I didn't want weird Japanese shit in my game I'd play some overly serious cinematic slop. Getting rid of this stuff isn't suddenly gonna make weeb games appeal to the people who would be too embarrassed to play a game where everyone has big eyes and rainbow colored hair anyway.
HADOKENHADOKENHADOKEN
>>735950687Taking or knowing about Japanese language tests should immediately ban you from giving advice to people wanting to learn JP, it's like people that obsess over survival and have bunkers telling you how to enjoy hiking just because they intersect. You're gonna start babbling about weird obscure shit like the optimal number of pockets and water capacity in a backpack when good advice is "remember to bring a comfortable chair" or the like.
>>735938563>my gamesI dare him to say that to his employer
>>735951061Ajatters are by far the worst learners in the JP learning community. I'm pretty sure the term whitenoising was invented because of them.
>>735951117An old highschool friend of mine died hiking. You should listen to the weirdo survival autist, honestly. Moreso if you live in a harsh climate.
>>735944450they "yell" the moves in the original because the text box is a speech bubble. it's a novelty in the remake, but the localizer thought it was cringe.
>>735951117He's just larping. An obvious tell is how he calls it the 国語偏差値 vs. just 偏差値 and claiming a ridiculously high score on it.
>>735951117while it is true that most modern AJATTers are stats obsessed in a way that's like the language learning equivalent of broscience, I am personally against over optimization of tools and methods, stats, etc. as holistically it's a waste of time and mental burdenalso, you don't take kokugo tests some arbitrary reason like epeen, jlpt maybe.>>735951195the average standard of AJATTer has gone down, but undeniably the best learners out there are or were AJATTers
>>735951279偏差値 in what? math? science? face?
>>735938563>as if they were a Pokemon saying their nameMotherfucker, Victor's name isn't "Flowing Slash". He's saying that because that's the move he's using.You could have totally made an actual genuine excuse by saying something like "I think it's stupid for someone in a fight to announce what they're doing" but instead you decided to make the most braindead comparison to Le Heckin' Epic Chungus Bideo Gaem for internet chungus points
>>735951337Applied astrophysics. Are you fucking stupid?
>>735951294The average standard? Who, Khatzumoto the scam artist? lol No one worth their salt learned Japanese by ajatting.
>>735951294>outwardly motivated niggers get into an inwardly motivated hobby and literally cannot function without stats, comparisons, "best"s and "fastest"s so they create stats and metrics and a million other pieces of bullshit to "optimize" their own hobbyImagine going to a yoga class and talking about the fastest way to get to be able to do an oversplit. The 30 year old women are in there to enjoy themselves not to fucking "finish" yoga but some people (you part of them) can't enjoy stuff that way.You're going to continue to get shit on by everyone until you understand this. And the problem isn't that you are like this it's that you give advice assuming everyone else is like this.
>>735948431Any translation from Japanese is heavily localized. These daily birthing threads over it are endlessly entertaining. I look forward to the cope threads once corp tries to put ai translations into a game. If DLSS5 showed anything it’s that they are not afraid to show raw slop to costumers.
>>735951528I think you're overreaching here>>735951580by AJATTers I refer to all of the other autistic immerzion offshoots too. silver sneed was a misplay but apart from that his ideas are still good
>>735946036I'd probably go with "curvy" myself since it still fits with the joke of her being round.
>>735940002based, but also.. really anon? I'm not being some passive aggressive pussy, but it really didn't occur to you that a cabal of nepotistic troonslator freaks from twitter, that are also aligned with a more cancerous cabal from twitter - gaming journalists, with a specific, globohomo agenda dating back to kalergi and marx earlier - did it not occur to you that these faggots were doing it on purpose, with a vindictive, anti-human, anti-male agenda?See, it's not even me being reductive or exaggerating, that's the funniest and least funny part
>>735938436>I don't think americans would understand what a fujoshi is>therefore we made the pervert not a pervertHuh?? Even if I was to accept the former. Even if I was for the sake of the hypothetical, concede that the former needed to be addressed somehow. Tackling it with the latter is just through and through character assassination.
>>735951664His ideas were all terrible. He contributed nothing to the space other than the pithy advice of "do it a lot." Apart from that, his main learning method was blasting Dragon Ball at 100db in Cantonese while planning his next scam.
>>735951675Curvy is just a euphemism for fat, it's literally the opposite of what she's bragging about.
>>735951746at the very least without khatz we would still be at genki.though maybe in another timeline some other autist would have pushed a similar thing and got popular
>>735951824Most still are. The biggest revolution to learning is unironically AI and its ability to parse and break down complex Japanese text for learners.
>>735951914matt, is that you?putting jokes, and the question of the efficacy of that aside, that's a huge gap between AJATT not ever having existed and LLMs becoming decent.it's likely that some other parasite would have filled its place, which would definitely be worse than AJATT. one can only imagine the learning culture that would exist in that hypothetical.
>>735952078Oh, there's no question of its efficaciousness. LLMs are a fantastic, highly accurate translational tool. The only people who don't like them are localizers (for obvious reasons).Also, Matt worships Khatz, so kind of an odd joke to make.
>>735952318https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpYq8lJXaBY
>>735939787Funnily enough there has been a thing like that with retroarch. I don't know how far it has came in recent years but it's something.https://youtu.be/sGNBMK71srQ?si=K5wVSbTdyAIvreHu
>>735951717>we're gonna fuck up your believed weeb shit with awful translations just to spite you hahahaha>ok we'll just use ai to localize games and anime now>NOOO AI WILL DO A BAD JOB YOU CAN'T REPLACE MEKarma's a bitch.
>>735952435Oh that. Matt wasn't even recommending it to learn. He wanted people to create bizarre dictionary definitions with it.
>>735938436Stealth translation general
>>735952702No, we're discussing whether or not AI can take over for game translation.
>>735938436I've seen many games were almost every lines are this badly translated. This isn't cherry-picked.I hate ai but in this case yeah just do it, we don't need these people. But then again we're assuming the ai model isn't tweaked to output the same kind of garbage which is absolutely not a given, you can make ai do anything, if the company doesn't want an accurate translation then you're just not getting it.
>>735952762The inaccuracies don't come from publisher/company demands. They come from capricious localizers who insert them in over the course of their tenure. If AI takes over the process, then no one's going to waste time slipping in references to capitalism.
>>735952761AI translation general
>>735952828My point is that whoever is working with ai can be the same kind of woke faggot who will slip in bullshit even faster with it.
>>735952902That implies localizers are gonna take the massive pay cut to work as prompt engineers so that they can stay involved in the process, which I highly doubt.What's gonna happen (and has already started) is that the editor will become the engineer and the localizer will go back to being the coordinator.
shit like this is why I will continue to pirate everything
>>735953207jigabassed
>>735939329you're either baiting or an imbecile
>>735952762The biggest problems with a lot of localisers is not their questionable language skills but rather their dog shit English writing ability. They completely flunked out of their creative writing course but still take the opportunity to insert their own "flair" when translating someone else's work. hard to argue that some choices they make are straight vandalism
>>735953207>shit eating grindamn... we really haven't overcome this meme yet
>>735938436It's sad, cause you can instantly know he hasn't been around any women for a couple years now.If he did, he would now modern women read literal half-AI written porn everyday, and a third of that is about hot men having sex (the other two thirds being about hot mysoginistic/abusive men and literal monsters fucking innocent, helpless women)
>>735952519I've been wanting an easier way to translate visual novels without having to open a million and one softwares so I'm hoping AI will have an easy option without the bothersome of hooking shit up.Too many VNs use fucking Unity and that shits a pain in an ass.
>>735954192Unity games are easy as shit to decompile, thobeit.
>>735942439>brownbeard is a uuuoh chad
>>735938895>I have tested this thing that threatens to replace me and in my unbiased opinion it cannot and should not do it please don't replace me please don't replace me please don't replace me please don't replace me please don't replace me please don't replace me
>>735938436you ask jap devs their take on this, half of them would say>yes that's exactly what i paid him to do, isn't that just a normal translation?the other half would say>i still have to pay someone to make the translation, how would ai benefit me?
>>735955080That's definitely not what they paid them to do.
>>735951482Why do cringe weaboos think its normal for people to shout attack names? Just do the attacks, real life isn't like pokemon.
>>735956005You mean Japanese devs, right?
>>735956005>real lifeGood thing we're talking about video games.
>>735938563The problem here is that a lot of localisers think they're translating high art or something and not goofy ass games that are deliberately littered with anime tropes because that's what the customers want.
>>735938436This guy probably has sent localizers back a few decades, I don't even think I see the usual suspects defending him
>>735944216Which one of you was it?
>>735956005Dude if you had magical techniques and DIDNT call them out i would start a blog calling you a fag
>>735956005There's normally no attack names at all. If you watch a kendo match they do shout when they strike and it's even declaring the strike target and I don't think you're allowed to use it as a feint to do a different strike.
>>735938563>I much prefer avoiding the ability nameStupid motherfucker this is one of the most kino things about Japanese stuff. Even 80s anime did it.
>>735938436>woman who enjoys BL and gay shit>very rare outside of JPyou have got to be shitting me
>>735944450I don’t care about accuracy, but I do care when FAGGOTS and CUNTS are making calls about what to change.
>>735956656Even 60s anime
Your spice sirs?
>>735938436Anyone who has used AI for translation knows that it is perfect. It can be very literal or use idioms, as you direct it.
>>735944721So basically the Japanese language is just gibberish but sounds cool? No wonder low IQs worship it so much
>>735950334Any examples? Where can I see an actual comparison of what you are saying?
>>735940852Simple. Stay in line with the definition of a translation. Whether the reader understands the references should depend on the reader not the translator.
>>735944721Why would everyone in FF8’s world speak English, while Squall has an attack in Japanese? Your comparison to person names doesn’t apply, because it clearly describes the move. Just call it Chain Slice or something.
>>735957226That’s stupid. You should not have to be a hardcore weeaboo to grasp a Japanese product. It makes no sense from a business perspective.
>>735949734When I was living in Japan I sometimes caught an American movie on tv that wasn't dubbed and it was amazing. Literally every single line was translated wrong in the subtitles.
>>735949910>since whenI've seen complaints about it for a fucking decade
>>735957737i haven't
>>735956907why do I need a writer to imagine things for me? it's a video game. show don't tell.
>>735957453>hardcore weeaboo It's not stupid to expect your readers to learn and understand the subject of your story. It's stupid to fucking lie to readers and change the story just because you think your readers are dumb faggots that has no capacity to learn and just throws slurs around to stroke their ego.
>>735958482People don’t play games to learn another country’s pop culture references.
>>735938436Yes and I can't wait.
>>735958065>why do I need a writer to imagine things for me?Because full-dive VR wasn't a thing in 2002, and still isn't a thing in 2026, and probably still won't be a thing in 2036.
someone explain when to use ga and wa
>>735959362Ask GPT
>>735959362it makes more sense if you think ga more as a suffix
>>735959362vibesuse your intuition of Japanese that you've built through hundreds of hours of native immersion.you do have that right, anon?
>>735956664Some reason westerns have a skewed concept of women here.Like they don't believe women cry more often then men skewed concept.
>>735939007this is literally what cultural appropriation means. this is a fine enough translation.
>>735945072>>735946037>さあ どうだろうな>"I guess so">"That's probably right">"Hmm, I wonder..."You plebs are embarrassing me. This is a simple "Who knows?" in English.
>>735959362Use wa to focus on what comes after in a sentence, ga to focus on what comes before it. I like to think of it like stressing words in English to put emphasis on particular words. But there's also like a million exceptions where the reason to use one over the other is totally arbitrary and it's just the way it is.
>>735946742>literal translations like AIAI translations are still localized to an extent. What do you think that training data is based on?
>>735960336it's "we'll see about that you capitalist oppressor"
>>735944450There are no two perspectives. There is a faithful translation and an editorialized "translation", that is all.
>>735938436Fujoshi = FagHagWhy are those literal grifters still pretending to be retarded?
>>735949272>Legend of Heroes: Trails of Cold SteelThis series is cursed, I'm sure you could find 100 examples worse than this. Thanks XSNEED.
>>735944131Do you even know what a woman is, Redditroon?
the only correct way to play is in Japanese with meikipop open to look up words you don't know
>>735961136>Fujoshi = FagHagThat is one of the worst translations I've ever heard.
I've been using gemini to translate raw chapters of several manga titles and i think it did an okay job. You simply need to give the model a context. It can actually fill the gaps just by googling shit on its own. This is genuinely impressive.
>>735938436Most of those games are jrpgs and novelsSo why bother, let this garbage be forgotten for good
>>735938945>>735939007You don't hate antiwhites enough.
>>735939329Nigger.
>8-4>NISA>XSEED>Shiravune>Crunchyroll>Nintendo TreehouseIs there a single active JP->EN localization company out there without a terrible reputation? I've got loads of dirt on all of these.
>>735962070Dood?
>>735959762No its not retard. The first one implies he is doubting the quality, the second implies if he is allowed to call curry what he made without being indian.
>>735962070Well, at least CR is dying soon with all the lawsuits
>>735962193ッス
>>735957453Nigga we live in a global, internet connected society. Anyone can look up anything with a smartphone anywhere at anytime. If someone sees to word kotatsu or takoyaki and can't figure out what it means based on context, they can look it up instantly. Your approach is outdated with the modern era.
>>735939812Based. I wanna talk to the whales.
The real power of LLMs for translation is that it allows the original game writer to translate directly into other languages.Yes, they need to be able to read the other language, but guess what, being able to read is a 1/100 difficulty level, while being able to write well is a 90/100 difficulty level.With LLMs like ChatGPT, DeepL, or even Google Translate (which has improved immensely recently), the writer themselves can write their Japanese game in English.
>>735938436Same thing happened in FF14 with a male character, that when it came to the attention of the director, the dude had to publicly apologize for it.https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/272855-Regarding-the-Localization-of-Haurchefant-in-the-EN-FR-DE-Versions-of-FFXIV
>>735957453This bitch likes jelly donuts.
>>735962209Not happening. Out of the two recent lawsuits they had to pay 16M on the one from years ago for something similar (remember they got acquired for 1B) and the other one because of the data breach doesn't have much ground to stand on (the breach didn't even happen at CR). Overall they seem pretty safe because they don't have actual competition
>>735943608Why do you antijapanese niggers play this game?You know it happens. You know anons will post it.Kill yourself.
>>735962434>If someone sees to word kotatsu or takoyaki and can't figure out what it means based on context, they can look it up instantly.Kek. That reminds me. Started Muramasa recently and there's a somewhat big glossary attached to the game. Had quite a laugh when I first saw it.
>>735960336wrong"How the frick should I know?" is the only correct choice
>>735963132A game called Muramasa can probably get away with this, but a translator's job is to come up with an equivalent word, not just the same word again.
>>735943827>Full article:https://web.archive.org/web/20241210014549/https://legendsoflocalization.com/articles/guest-article-heroland/Also a fluent japanese speaker did a youtube stream going over at some point I think.
>>735938832The general knowledge in the industry is that those localizers know what western audiences want and will make your game more successful.
I'm playing through Unicorn Overlord right now and it's so bad that I think I should just stop buying JRPGs and pirate them instead.
>>735939816>I don't think that the replace-me-machine should replace meGreat.
>>735949103There is literally nothing wrong with the translation Silly Ricardo, where are you going
>>735964583You could also learn japanese and become a patrician.
>>735944318Doujin translators aren't the same people due to the material involved.
>>735943608Not a video game but just because it's so prevalent I was watching PSG with a friend and the translation in the 2nd season (1st season aired in 2010, 2nd in 2025) is like 4 times as bad. It adds so much swearing that's not in the original in a show that's arleady overly crass. To the point where even in an episode about one character who swears too much you have the other characters also swearing at her that she's swearing too much, and those characters barely swear in the actual script.It's so weird.
Just fuck my shit up senpai
>>735944450>I can sort of agree with both perspectives here. Making it so he shouts his attack title really is a typical Jap thing and it sounds so fucking retarded every time.Soulless faggot.
>>735965003>make retarded choice in translation thinking you're smart and it can't go wrong >as the series goes on, your retarded choice leads to incongruity with the source material>it's now too late to change course and you just have to keep going with the text having no sense with what's happeningAce Attorney is absolutely famous for this, probably the biggest singular bungle of all time. After the 1st game they should've just admitted it and retconned it all to be in JP.
>>735965089Fuck moments too late. No she doesn't say anything about socialists or killing jobs. Just>ああ~ん、もう~。
>>735941090then that's still a bad change because it homogenizes characters for the setting and shows he didn't understand anything about the characters and instead defaulted to the "setting" removing any nuancetrash and stupid
what's the best way to fight against this? angry impotent posts on four chins?
>>735965481
>>735965792actually it's angry, impotent posts mocking them on xmockery and ridicule are the only actual power normal people possess, posting on 4chan is us being nice and social by self-quarantining
>>735938563JoJo stand attacks but it's just silence
>>735965826
Japanese peepo don't season dey languageWe gots to spice it for dem!
>>735966035>ど どうだとThe person his responding to just said どうだ. It's a an actual quote. >直情的すぎないかHe's just saying she's being impulsive.That's five.
>>735966121
>>735942178Yes. It's a weird as fuck laugh, because the girl is a wierd yaoi fan fujiyoshi.
>>735947401>>735959762no one but woke retards use the phrase "cultural appropriation"
>>735944562>>735939456You're retarded. The official makes Marche just as emotional as Mewt and has him yelling at the adults when the reality is Marche was always the adult in the story. Here he's calmly admonishing the ones that are supposed to be adults by simply telling them, "You're wrong. You know that?" This is the entire purpose of Cid's characterization as well so he actually steps up as a parent and adult.
>>735943608That one crazy fucker who did the Dragon Maid and Prison school localizations has 5 examples just on her own.
>>735966424Why do people even put out challenges like this though? It is that bad. The examples exists even if anons don't have them on hand.
>>735962070I was trying to find out who translated NEO TWEWY (since that also got fucked in localization) and came across this.Friendly reminder that localizers are able to get away with the shit they do because normalfag bootlickers like this defend them at every turn.
>>735944506It's not a strict requirement with round trip translation. And english localizers are not functional in japanese.
>>735946401>Ai is way too inconsistent to trust with localization.Localization isn't necessary in the first place in most works. And the job that's being done isn't good. >>735946832Neil is also a boss at fucking square enix, and he's making claims he can't back up.
>>735946918>It wasn't quite sure how to translate "troonlator".I'm going to add that to the training glossary of any data that accepts slang.Functionally, I'd introduce it as this:トランズジェンダー トランズレーターleading to this:トランズジェンダーレーターAny critiques anons?
