Was Luke really the powerful force demigod that the Star Wars fandom made him out to be?
>>736488653now that you mention it, he doesn't really have any feats does he
Only in the old expanded universe, and only to a point. He couldn't solo the spooky lovecraftian force god for example and had to get a whole bunch of others to help him.
Yeah he's able to perform some 'sick shit' as I would say, not to mention he was able to create a new order and fill it with members who were actually competent before he died. Not to mention his lineage was badass. What's more important than his power is that he was just a good dude.
He's no Kyle Katarn but he's alright
>>736488934Kyle's just a guy with a lightsaber
>>736488653He beat Vader so badly the guy was cowering in fear on the ground and then killed himself. He must at least be good in a swordfight. Part of the "Luke is super strong" meme is that it would suck to think everyone sucked at using The Force, and it wasn't very hard to fight Vader.
>>736488653Depends on the writer
he's so strong that disney made into him a failed NEET so the new characters would look better
>>736488653George said that Luke and Leia had the same potential that Anakin did before he got lava'd so I figure the sky is the limit. If you were to compare them to other great Jedi in history and try to power scale it I would say he is the greatest Jedi in the history of the order.
>>736488653It took some time to reach that level, but If he truly believed something needs to die, he could curb stomp pretty much anything once he was a master.The reason he didn’t was because he almost never reached that point.
>>736488653No. Luke was a whiner who had like a year of training off-screen and had his arc of nearly falling to the dark side cut, just leaving him looking like a weakling who lost to Vader and then Vader killed Palpatine too.Luke was always an overhyped weaking that the extended lore treated like Jesus and Neo combined despite the movies and books making him look like a complete tool.
luke>omg strongest evarrrr literally megirl luke>wtf cringe mary sueexplain this phenomenon
>>736489317Luke earned his place through decades of writing.
>>736489317Men think its cool when men do cringe things and think its cringe when women do cringe things. Same but in reverse for women. Not a lot of rocket science behind it, you just hear more men whine because you're a man who talks to other men.
>>736488730He tonguetwisted his sister
>>736489317OT Luke spent years before he could beat a father who didn’t want to fight him and barely survive Palpatine.EU Luke took 20 years of training and mistakes.Rey took less than a year to go from not even knowing about the force to overpowering Palpatine in brute strength
>>736488653the EU went really wild with wanking how powerful Luke was in the Del Rey era
>>736488653I mean, he was the last jedi left, so he would seem so in comparison.
>>736488653It's funny how Disney threw out the EU and then immediately made an infinitely worse version of it less than a year after they started making Star Wars
>>736489317Luke almost got killed when he faced Darth Vader in Empire, and Vader was fighting with only one arm most of the time.Meanwhile, Rey picks up a lightsaber once and she's seriously challenging Kylo Ren in a duel... he should've just force pushed her lightsaber away and maimed her if the sequels wanted to have any drama or tension or threat.
>>736489317>explain this phenomenonExplaining everything the sequels did wrong would take hours. The short answer is Luke fails at things and asks for help/ teaching, while Rey always succeeds at everything no problem.
>>736489317Except Luke's culmination in ROTJ is about relinquishing power, it's only when he disarms himself that he actually defeats Palps because it proves to Vader that he can still be redeemed.
>>736488653His only actual strength was the ability to use the force. That's it.
>>736489662To be fair, he only started Jedi training when he was like 20 years older than every other Jedi that received the same training. In that context, Luke is impressive... most impressive.
>>736489737Maybe if you put it that way.But in the story he was only cool because he could use the force in the world where the majority of force users were killed.During the times of the Old Republic he would've been a weakling.
>>736488859even then it was only in the later stages of the expanded universe after the controversial yuzan vong shit happened and wrecked everything.Most of what Luke got done was both by being competent and connected to competent people/droids.He nearly became a sith a number of times and lost a few students to the dark side, but had plenty of students who didn't fall, the movie crew, lando calrissian popping up as Hassan the Camel salesmen, his sexy wife and few almost-wives before her...A lot of the expanded universe was rather careful to keep him from being too powerful.He instead would be one of several pivotal characters making a major difference.
>>736489017and a few questions
>>736489317The phenomenon I’m most intrigued by is the fact that ST apologists can literally never say what the actually like about it, with the sole exceptions of a few shipping legbeards.Every single time one of them tries to talk about it, there’s always a caveat, they always have to drag the OT or even PT down with them in order to try getting a leg up.You’ll never hear>rey was a good characterYou’ll hear>WELL ANAKIN AND LUKE WERE MARY SUES TOO, HOW COME IT WASN’T BAD THEN?!?!You don’t hear about how the plots are good, you hear about which EU plot was actually worse, as if having a warning about prior failure and ignoring it was a good thing even if it was true.Compare and contrast with PT fanboys. I personally don’t particularly like the PT, but those who do can and will talk about parts they like without having to shit all over the OT in order to do so.
>>736488653He banged a red head, so that has to count for something.Chewie is still higher than Luke on the feat tier since it took a fucking moon to kill him.
>>736489056part of that was supposed to be him drawing a bit on the darkside combined with vaders own reluctance (and its made a bit obvious with the fight choreography) but yeah.Luke is supposed to be very talented with the lightsaber, even more than his father was.The idea is that he had little remaining of the jedi order to rely on, and built up a lot of stuff himself.He grabbed some of the traditional forms to take in for offensive, defensive, and manuvering, and then from there was just winging it and figuring out some personalized shit that worked best for himself.
>>736489886>I personally don’t particularly like the PT, but those who do can and will talk about parts they like without having to shit all over the OT in order to do so.I think it has something to do with the way the OT and PT feed into each other; the whole poetry shit is funny, but I think it's a very real thing, so if you like the PT, you're going to appreciate the OT. By retroactively making the saga about Anakin, you will be invested in IV-VI, so there's a level of interplay that doesn't exist with the ST and the rest. Disney couldn't resist the call for more money, but I think a good steward of the franchise would have realized this and not made any more episodic SW films and just done spin-offs. Even if the call for such a thing would have been almost impossible to say no to.
>>736489886The Prequels were trying to be their own thing and, no matter how shit they were, even the biggest hater had to say "well, it's George's vision... just gotta let him go and do what he wants" because they trusted that even if his plan sucked it was still a plan.The Sequels, however, deliberately tried to copy the OT and blatantly had no plan or overarching plot. Each movie was written as the production officially began, it wasn't like the prequels where Lucas wrote his scripts and then, after getting everyone to read it, started to plan out every bit of it and design all the characters and ships etc.People may be stupid sometimes but they are actually pretty good at detecting when someone is winging it and has no idea what they are doing... and the Sequels set off every alarm bell.
>>736489317Just reverse the roles (beloved empowered foid replaced by straight white man) and you’d understand.
>>736489826at first, sure, but he was quickly getting pretty advanced.He was without a doubt on the level of a late-republic jedi master by the end of the original trilogy due to the trials he had overcome.Hell yoda was putting him through some of the basic trials to become a knight on dagobah.So he was strong, but uneducated.lacking a bunch of the knowledge of various force techniques and applications the jedi had built up over the millennia.Over time in Legends he works his way up, but its mostly background stuff. A lot more focus in the relevant books is on what he and his students might be doing when shit is going down.But you are right about why he was cool in the original trilogy.
>>736488730>featsKys
>>736489662nah bro he had a support network of badasses with their own plot armor, and cultivated an academy that produced some of the ballsiest jedi in the entire franchise.My boy Dorsk 81 bitch slapped an entire imperial fleet out of the yavin system, giving the ultimate force finger to Admiral Daala (a magnificently competent bitch)
>>736488730He clearly picked up gear head, duelling and critical strike at a minimum
The biggest joke of Disney owning Star Wars is that they still haven't done the one thing that everyone was positive about when the sale happened: releasing the original trilogy on blu-ray in their unaltered theatrical versions with the original effects intact.Apparently they are going to run the original 1977 Star Wars in theaters for the 50th anniversary, but no news on any physical release or the other two films.
>>736489317Bitch lifted 20 heavy rocks after one day of training. Luke couldn't lift one ship after days of training
>>736488653In the extended universe he once folded space in order to effectively travel faster than the speed of light.
>>736490853Luke struggling with the training and doubting himself (and Yoda) before Yoda effortlessly lifts the X-wing is genuinely my favorite Star Wars moment.>I don't believe it...>That is why you fail.
The entire world is facing imminent collapse and you're in here discussing Onions Star Slop
>>736491109The entire world is always facing imminent collapse.
>>736489317luke needed training and even then, he wasn't the one defeating the big bad, but his father.meanwhile, that bitch from the new trilogy could do things perfectly even though she never had any training whatsoever
>>736491109The entire world has been facing collapse for far longer than you think.
Sometimes even a small hope is enough to defeat the Dark Side
>>736488730he used the force to destroy a black hole in the EU
>>736490679we don't...we don't talk about the Jedi Academy trilogy
>>736491341JAT is kino and I'm tired of others not folding to my beliefs.
>>736489317Luke gets his ass kicked very hard multiple times in the original trilogy
>>736491341Since when and why not?I really liked the trilogy.Admiral Daala is one of the best antagonists in the Expanded universe.They had set up the imperial remants as infighting greedy moffs who couldnt get their shit together to threaten anything, and running into admiral Daala was a great opportunity to shake things up.
>>736488884It BAFFLES me why Disney didn't go for a Jedi Academy movie.Instead they just wanted to retread the old movies.
>>736489317the force is female chud
>>736491458Daala is a fucking retard, and Kevin J. Anderson tried to make her Thrawn 2, but because he is also a retard, she just ends up being a retard.
>>736491109Lol, when has it not?The fact that literally nothing ever happens should tell you to calm your tits
>>736491478Disney wanted to milk Star Wars for money without realizing WHY people wished to buy Star Wars stuff for decades. They thought more content and constant new characters would translate cleanly into ticket and merchandise sales, but they've made Star Wars so lame that nobody wants to buy all the figures and shit anymore.They somehow killed a collector market that thrived for over a decade with no new official content being made.
>>736491520what are these numbers
>>736491341your loss really
>>736491530>Kevin J. Anderson tried to make her Thrawn 2No he most certainly did not.Daala never once acts like thrawn.She got shit in order by gathering the warlords for a meeting and assassinating them.She conquered her way into power.She didn't try to invent anything new like Thrawn; she simply tried to get shit back together and make the best use of what ships she had gathered.There was nothing super genius about her.She was simply competent and driven.
>>736491658it's what the scouter says about their power level
>>736491458>it’s a Daala says fuck it, gasses the entire room and hands everything over to Chadmiral Pellaeon episode
>>736491478I'd be easier to go with Dark Forces>1 as a introduction to Kyle>2 as jedi/sith/force introduction >3 aka JKO as finaleI guess the problem would be with 1 since , irrc it would clash with who actually stole Death Star plans
The Imperial Remnant shouldn't have become part of the New Republic, Bastion should have been gassed. Prove me wrong.
>>736491520
>>736491692its over 40,000???
>>736489317Luke was low tear in the first flick. He only leveled up in the second flick and was OP in the third flick.Ray just started out as a goddess and by the time she did some training on-screen, the audience was already over her. Plus, Ray’s movies were only about her while Luke was always helping people like a true hero.
>>736491594Something is legit happening this time retard. See you in three months when the food supply runs out and you're in here talking about Glup Shitto from Star Slop Power Battles
>>736491594>>736491871>STOP TALKING ABOUT THINGS ON 4CHANlol
>>736491520Who's the bottom right. I don't watch Star Wars movies.
>>736491871Lol sure sure, of course.
>>736491781I could see Pentastar joining, or at least, being their own thing for a little longer
>>736491923Glup Shitto (Turned)
>>736491923Lei and Han Solo's son Ben Solo (forma Sith Larper)
>>736491109The entire world is facing imminent collapse and you got hit by a newfag filter
>>736491871I've noticed that many modern people into politics will either imply or outright state that people cannot focus on two things at once...>how can you complain about A when B is happening!?>why do you care so much about Y when X???Fuck off, I can have fun in my spare time while contemplating politics and social engineering even if (You) struggle.
>>736491923angry white male
>>736491953>>736492053>>736492194Oh, okay.
>>736489317What does she even do.
>>736489317Men are just scared of us being better than them (which we are btw)
>>736492368fumble into being the only jedi left, also the most powerful by just doing nothing and also stole the name skywalker.Palpatine WON.
>>736488653He was a one-eyed man in a galaxy of blind men. He'd have been quickly outshined had he been born a generation earlier.
>>736491871Two more weeks till the vaxx die offs!
>>736492368>>736492492Rey makes sense if you think of her as an Isekai protagonist from a particularly incompetent writer.
>>736492368The famous example is the villain has a red lightsaber and is shown to be insanely good at The Force, and she has probably never heard of it, but she beats him in a fight. She also successfully Jedi Mind Tricks people. She can telekinesis lift stuff. She kills the Emperor who is retconned into being a jillion years old and in control of all Sith activity that entire time.
>>736491625Hell, they nearly did the same with Marvel too. Even then, that’s only really being propped up by video games and tabletop games made by people who love all the legacy characters. The movies and television shows are a financial black hole, and DC pretty much has what’s left of western comic sales captured at the moment.
>>736492590I Died and Went from Real Life to a Universe of Incompetent Morons
>>736492621Why didn't Palpatine just stop shooting lightning out? Is he stupid?
>>736492253Any other literature worth checking out from the Legends timeline?
>>736492806Does Palpatine's revival make more or less since than the explanation in Dark Empire?
>>736489317Easy examples, there are scenes in the first two films where Luke fails at tasks, people are disappointed with him, or loses fights. The only scene where Rei struggles with something is she doesn't succeed at the mind trick the first time she tries after five seconds of learning it exists, but she does the second time. Other than that, she's better than everyone else at everything and everyone immediately loves her.
>>736492902darth bane trilogy, darth plageuis and the kotor comics
>>736488653Luke has no real feats of not other than beating Vader in a duel>but my EU wankery..NOT CANON. If George didnt make it then it isn't canon. No amount of pissing and moaning will change this. Only the OT and prequels are Star wars canon.
>>736492903it's basically the same explanation (Palpatine figured out how to possess clones of himself)
>>736493018And the 3D Clone Wars.
>Lucas bootlicker is here
>>736492902I'm reading the EU chronologically and it's pretty great. I'd recommend The Lost Tribe of the Sith - The Collected Stories. It's pretty self-contained and doesn't require any knowledge about the wider galaxy during that time period. For something closer to the time period of the films I'd say Outbound Flight is great too.
>>736491109Good.
>>736492806It's like trying to stop peeing mid stream
>>736488653Out of all boards in this website do you really think this is the best one to ask this question?
>>736493209off topic threads are always better for some reason
>>736491520man kylo ren fucking sucks as a villain, he seems like one of the goons you'd send after a jedi than someone with any degree of authority
>>736493179So... rather easy? It takes some force (ba dum tiss) but you can stop the flow early. It also strengthens your lower pelvic muscles so you can climax better
>>736492903less.dark empire was made before palpatine's backstory was established, allowing them to wrote him in as a dark side revenant rather than as an actual person.The Big Guy trilogy used an adapted version of this power for the finale.
>>736492806why did he aim both hands at the lightsabers and not aim at her feet?
>>736492806Why did they bring him back
>>736491520The sequels are such a disaster. Kylo should've been Jacen Solo, Rey should've been a gender swapped Ben Skywalker. Do the story where Jacen/Kylo kills Mara, Rey is mind wiped for her protection and hidden to find clues to Luke. They both team up, reunite and an ACTUAL skywalker lives once the films ends.
>>736491045I hate Starslop, but that is a genuinely kino moment.
Why do autists keep bringing up their EU fan fiction like it has any bearing on the question?
someone is desperate to bait lmao ^^^^^
>>736492368SHE IS ALL OF THE JEDI
>>736493395I used to get bored and do this as a kid and all it would up accomplishing is getting pee everywhere
>>736492368Getting deepthroated by Luke for her "training". You know the video.
>>736493018>Luke has no real featsExcept blowing up the Death Star and lifting his X-Wing and going on a killing spree in Episode 6...
>>736488653Everything felt extremely forced with the old trilogy. The characters, the story. Boomers invented an imaginary lore inside their heads where shitons of things happened in those movies.Most fans are not ready to admit that the prequels era improved everything and made everything cooler despite some cringe stuff.
>>736494390Why won't genx and soillennials just apologize to George already?
EU bait didn't work so he's shifting tack lel
>>736494204>lifting his X-Winganon...
>>736494204>lifting his X-WingThat was Yoda you dumbcunt
>>736494486I should make picture like this but for Star Wars. I don't know what to put in it but boomers and x generations fanboys often imagine SW is like Indiana Jones but in space with Luke being in a wild jungle visiting old alien temple and fighting big monsters inside it, it has never happened but for some reason they pretend old trilogy was full of adventures like that where literally like 60% of it happened in close spaces and empty backgrounds.They are convinced of it because simpsons, south park and family guy pretend those movies were awesome.
>>736494204>Helps saves the Princess>Blows up the Death Star>Blows up an AT-AT>Makes the mission to kill one of the outer rims notorious gangsters, Jabba>Fights and defeats Vader
>>736494847>Things that never happened: "I must save that village from monsters"That's literally the Red Ribbon Army arc. Whoever made that picture has no fucking idea.
>>736494390>inventedGeorge gave a lot of supplemental shit through toys games and the EU being official.
>>736494549>tacktact *
>>736495394no, it's tack. Like in sailing. Tact is not short for tactics.
>>736493651Rey genuinely is better as some nobody that grew up in the middle of nowhere. The Jedi found kids like her all the time after all.
>>736495554that's where they found Anakin, after all
>>736488730>destroyed Death Star
>>736490696Based
>>736495456damn
>>736495617I don't mind the idea of her subconsciously using the Force to make people like/ignore her as a defense mechanism for surviving alone.I have a lot of ideas about what a sequel trilogy could be like without retreading too much of the EU.
>>736495394tact means a diplomatic manner, not a shortening of tactical.tack is a sailing term.
>>736488730He beat darth vader
>>736489220Any examples that made him reach that point or was he a maximum moralfag that wouldn't even do it to the devil?
>>736495857In theory it could be done, since prodigies exist and ultimately somebody had to have figured shit out on their own to even start one of the orders so it must have happened before.The key problem with Rey isn't her abilities, but how the script treats her as a whole. Her myriad unlikely powers and skills aren't treated as anything more than just something to be expected of her. Sure, people jerk her off constantly in the movies, but there's never a sense that she's anything special outside the fact that she's Rey.For me the best example of this in action is her swimming in TLJ. It's an incredibly minor thing, but the mere fact they never bother to explain how the fuck someone raised in a desert knows how to do it is telling; it's just assumed she would know how, because she's Rey. Of course she knows.Oddly enough Rian was the only one who tried to throw in some lines about people being surprised by her bullshit, but he made it ten times worse by having absolutely no explanation for it. It's like he thought raising the subject was enough to make people think there was some reason, but all he did was highlight that, no, the only explanation is that she's Rey.
>>736496421the fake big boss of the Yuuzhan Vong and Abeloth
>>736488653>>736489317The prequels are superior.
he's at it again
>>736496426Once I'm home I'll vomit my autism
>>736492590I do want ASOIAF games about Isekai Viserys III during or before Robert rebellion
>>736496741>It's a Luke drives Mara insane by being so unthreatened by her that he goes to sleep instantly in a forest full of monsters specifically hunting him episode
>>736489317This bitch accidentally shot lightning out of her hands and killed Chewbacca. But actually he was on another ship. But Rey thought she killed him.
>>736497031The worst bit about that was that it was implied that she only shot force lightning because she was of Palpatine descent.
>>736495187no it's not
>>736494847Early Krillin would never warn Goku like that, he would fling the poop at his eyes in an attempt to blind him and sucker punch him.
>>736489317just watch the movies retard
>>736489017>>736489846Ruby Bliels?
Star Wars thread? Nice.
>>736497283He's better off not watching the Disney movies.
>>736497153Yes it is.And the whole thing starts with Goku following Bulma on her adventure to search for the dragon balls. Reducing kid Goku Dragon Ball to train and fight is fucking retarded.
>>736497332its not that kind of thread its going to be a shit flinging contest
>>736489317if rey was braless the entire time her movies would have been better
>>736497386a normal star wars thread then
>>736489317>OT Luke: struggles for days or weeks to lift a single rock, repeatedly failing, all with the help of the greatest jedi teacher that has 900+ years of getting younglings to not suck ass at the force>Rey: instantly suspends multiple boulders worth of stones in the air with no effort while talking, with zero real training whatsoeverYeah, totally the same.
>>736497332>Filonishit
>>736497386>>736497453nah, there is a guy trying to bait us into it, but it aint going well for them lmao
>>736489886The prequels for all their problems still told a coherent story with sincerity and impressive worldbuilding and supplemental material. They also and this is a big one…did not insult their audience. To be honest I dont even think the sequel movies have fans. Yidsney Wars is the biggest colossal media failure I can think of and historians will look at it years from now and wonder how.
>>736497818You know what, you're right, fuck that guy. What's your favorite SW vehicle. For me it's the basic bitch TIE fighter
>>736497979>To be honest I dont even think the sequel movies have fansonly children and reylo shippers. That's the only people I ever see praising them
>>736498008TIE Defender, my beloved...
>>736498008it's basically cheating, but my beloved ever since I saw her in 1999
Nah, he was kind of a tranny.
>>736489197>George said that Luke and Leia had the same potential that Anakin did before he got lava'dThat doesn't sound from what we see in the movies.
>>736488653The power creep in Star Wars is simply not appropriate
>>736498307Its more of that ‘power isnt what it seems’ thing
>>736491871What the fuck do you expect any of us to do about that you retard?
>>736498076To me this is just a rare special OT ship thanks to Rogue Squadron coming out before TPM.
>>736489314He literally beat vader, are you retarded?
>>736491871The Iran thing? Im not smart enough to be worried help me out here
>>736498049TIE fighter was my first time with a flight sim Vidya. I was hyped as fuck to use this.
>>736498307He clearly wants Force power to get passed down like DNA, considering he wrote in a Good At The Force blood test. Potential in this case is how much Force power that could be used if it was trained to the fullest.
>>736498586He beat Vader by doing only the exact same shit Mark Hamill did in that scene, to Vader who was only doing the exact stiff shit Prowse did in that suit. ‘Oh there’s magic around it’ fucking not really! I mean i get it, i understand the scene, but no Luke just threw a bunch of Haymakers because he got mad. It unfortunately doesnt ring as a feat of strength
>>736498796>He dindu nuffin>He beat Vader>UHHHHHHH (Brings real life faggotry into it)Nigger
>>736499012Im a different poster. You have to reckon with that this scene looks like your basic Hamlet overpower Claudius scene or whatever. Call me a gay zoomer but he did like one performative flip
>>736492621She also uses Force Heal, which was previously never shown in the movies and considered too video-gamey by Lucas, and something no other famous Jedi from Lucas's material ever did.
Luke jumped kind of high one time in the swamp.
>>736498796>He wants more magic Force bullshit>The shit that eroded the franchise
>>736493837>Not spamming Force StormDo they even Knight?
>>736493625JJ Abrams introduced Snoke as a new villain in the first movie, but left zero plans for what his deal was. So Rian Johnson just fucking killed him and set up Kylo Ren or Rey to become the new villain. Disney was never going to allow Rey to be a villain, so they backpedaled that hard and then Abrams decided to go with a weirdly undeveloped romance plot for Kylo Ren for reasons unknown, and they had no villain any more. So they just said, "Fuck it, bring the emperor back." They decided to "tease" this by having the emperor's mysterious broadcast to the galaxy be played in Fortnite. Even though Fortnite was super popular already, almost no one knew about this before seeing the movie. Not joking.
>>736498638global economic crash basically, mass starvation, etc
Luke and the og trilogy characters in general are hampered by the fact their movies were old and the level of action just doesn't compare to what you see in later films. I like the lightsaber duels in empire and Rotj a lot but the prequel duels really are a massive step up in quality by virtue of the actors and stunt doubles just being better and putting more into it Better special effects also helps the newer characters look more impressiveThere should be a term for later prequels making the past seem more advanced or better compared to the original run as this happens quite a bit.For vidya examples think about how much more advanced adam jensen is depicted as compared to jc Denton just because Adams games came out later and this could do way more; that's what I mean
>>736499417Obi-wan is just a padawan and Qui-gon, while a cool dude, is objectively a subpar force wielder.
KOTOR has utterly ruined any SW discussion on /v/.
>>736499669>NudeusexEwww
>>736499669Prequel duels look like sterile dance battles where two ballerinas compete to lightly tap their poles against each other as fast as possible. It looks like a highly choreographed dance routine, not two swordsmen trying to kill each other the prequels special effects are fucking dogshit and aged like milk. And no, it wasn't the limits of technology at the time, it was that George was an absentee director who's always hated the labor of directing motion pictures so he just shot the entirety of Clones and Sith on sound stages in front of blue screens so he could let the computer make the movie in post for him.
KOTOR and The Last Jedi are very similar products, in the sense that both were made for people who don't actually like Star Wars
>>736499679If they aren't flurrying either then they're just kinda being silly.
>>736499931People who hate the Last Jedi don't like Star Wars as real artistic expression about the human condition, they like Star Wars as a brand that lets them performatively display their fandom by purchasing merchandise and consuming ancillary material that allows them to debate inane trivia factoids about the expanded universe online, i.e. soulless bugmen consoomers
Prequels were solely carried by Republic vs CIS /k/ino
>>736499931KOTOR is just a classic Star Wars story that’s near a 1:1 copy akin to TFA. TLJ is the complete opposite
>>736499509Basically. I think it's worth noting that Kylo Ren is also portrayed as weak and dumb to the point he'd make for a bad main villain considering the plot is about a terrorist group that takes out the government and establishes itself as the new leadership. They were put in a place where they had to come up with some bad guy to cap off the trilogy. Just using the Emperor again is stupid, but it's not like Snoke could've been the villain of Episode 9.
KoTOR 2 is the best star wars game
>>736491109If it were assured that we'd all be dying in a nuclear holocaust tomorrow, I would STILL be on here calling anyone who watched The Clone Wars a faggot casual.
>>736499931This but KOTOR2. Written by a hack with delusions of competence who hated the very concept of SW.
>>736499928I disagree. The saber battles in the prequels are good. Jedi aren't just swordsmen; they are able to see the future. So it makes sense that their fights look that way when at peak ability and training. The Disney sequel fights are what actual bad choreography look like.
>>736500247>loading ramp
>>736499931>>736500149>>736500285My apologies, I indeed meant KOTOR 2, sorry for the misunderstanding
>>736488653Both Vader and Palpatine thought he was strong in the force and they're expert enough witnesses for me.
>>736499669Prequels also had the benefit of hindsight. the OT was flying by the seat of their pants doing whatever they could to get the effects going. No CGI to fallback on 100% practical work. ANH's sabers were fluorescent bulbs that couldn't take a hit so they had to cut the Obi-wan/Vader fight like that.
>>736500285Yeah, adults tend to dislike cheap, dualistic morality and shitty plot """twists"""
>>736488653He's the son of the chosen one
>>736499669The prequel characters waving glowsticks in the air is definitely flashier than the lightsaber fight in A New Hope. I think that gets filed away with the part where Jar Jar Binks steps on poop as something the prequels shouldn't have done, rather than intentionally portraying the duelists as way better than Luke.
>>736500116The day they stopped making these encyclopedias was they day the world ended
>>736500173>Kylo Ren is also portrayed as weak and dumb to the point he'd make for a bad main villainYeah, I walked out of TLJ hoping Rey would become the villain and Ben Solo or Finn would become the hero and redeem her in the end. Her super-strong abilities and lack of training were the perfect setup for her to go dark side. But then none of that happened and what we got was so much worse.
>>736500375Potential does not equal actual success. Im sure your teachers said you had potential but here you are posting about SW on /v/ as a grown ass manchild.
>>736500285This bizarro narrative that Chris hated Star Wars has no basis in fact. You cannot point to a single interview to back that up and it in fact originates from an EA shilling campaign in the lead up to TORtanic
>>736499931Yeah, Avellone hated Star Wars so much he read every EU book he could get his hands on.
>>736496426>>736496830Okay autism vomiting time:Luke sends his nephew out to track down someone strong in the Force that he had just sensed, which is Rey. Ben's been struggling with his insecurities so Luke feels that sending him on a mission that's doable but still important could help build up his self-esteem. Things go south when the Imperial remnant that Finn is part of also arrive on the planet for their own ends, led by Phasma who instead of being a nobody in fancy armor is second-in-command for the First Order (who are NOT as powerful as the sequels shown but have at this point brought in a couple other remnants into the fold). Finn's first taste of combat terrifies him and he goes AWOL, shunning violence. He, Rey, and Ben all run into each other as shit goes sideways with Ben, lured by his own emotions, joins the First Order which is a huge propaganda win for them. Meanwhile the New Republic officially isn't treating them like a serious threat better to nip things in the bud so a totally rogue group of NR officers and other military stage a strike on the world as well which brings Rey and Finn in contact with Poe who'll take them both back to Luke and builds up a rapport with Finn to show that some people fight because it's the right thing to do, though Finn still rejects violence (he's not to be castigated for picking up pacifism, it's to be shown that pacifism but still resisting can be admirable too). At this point Finn can't wield the Force, but when he meets with Luke we'll be told that anyone that puts in the effort on the path can do so, it just takes more time than those born with the capability like him.Notably, in order to sell toys (because merchandise is still a big thing for Star Wars) we need new ships for them to use rather than rehashing X-Wings and TIE Fighters. Hell, make Uglies official and sell magnetized bits so kids can make their own Ugly abominations.
>>736489886The biggest flaws you can really throw at the OT are often all to do with the time period it was made, and the expectation from hollywood that the first film would flop.The biggest problem with the PT is that the writing and pacing is god awful, people have said the novel versions of AOTC and ROTS a better than the movies as well as most cartoons and books set between the two are considered the absolute peak of the time period. Which if anything means it was just a case of good idea, poor execution.The biggest problem with the sequels is that it was written and headed by post-2010 Disney. Disney has just been living off it's older IPs and brand name for the last two decades at this point. The only thing Disney knows how to do is throw 'member berries at the audience and distract them with over the top action scenes and hope that they don't notice the writing and plot makes no sense.
>>736500173They should have committed to following up on Kylo Ren's arc from the Last Jedi, where he finally stopped being a wishy-washy punk and committed to being evil not out of obligation to his grandfather's legacy and to get back at his parents but because it is who HE chooses to be. However, Star Wars fanboys are retarded manchildren whose minds are governed by cliches, so when Snoke turned out to just be some retard who died instead of Darty Icky like in their fan theories, they started pissing and shitting themselves and demanded another Dark Lord in a Robe to be the final boss. Disney was spooked by The Last Jedi not making as much money as the Force Awakens (which was less reflective of any perceived decline in quality and more that Force Awakens was lightning in a bottle and it was impossible to recreate that level of hype) that they let r*ddit and 4chan crybabies write the last movie, and JJ brought back Sheev so he could just do RotJ again, even though TLJ's setup for the third movie was trying to make doing that impossible. Alas.
>>736500247Games have to have endings to be considered great in my opinion.
>>736500383>ANH's sabers were fluorescent bulbs that couldn't take a hitAmazingly, they're using light bulbs in recent work like The Acolyte, and it's clear the actors are scared they might break it.
>>736500521>he read every EU book he could get his hands onNo wonder his authorial stand in preached the death of the force
>>736500605Guess you hate Planescape Torment then, because they literally have the same ending.
You know what bugs me? How come Disney and Filoni decanonized the EU and hate it but copy it for their stories anyways? That would be like some asshole student in school telling you that you aren’t smart but copying your test scores and homework anyways. And the worst part is they dont even copy the good stuff. They make discount Jacen Solo or Dark Empire 2.0 or steal the Katarn arc for Rogue One or turn Thrawn into some moronic Saturday cartoon villain.
>>736496426>For me the best example of this in action is her swimming in TLJ. It's an incredibly minor thing, but the mere fact they never bother to explain how the fuck someone raised in a desert knows how to do it is telling; it's just assumed she would know how, because she's Rey.She paddles 10 feet you fucking retard, treading water is not hard and most people can instinctively do it.
>>736500517>>736500521You can also love something while pointing out its flaws. KOTOR2 couldn't exist as it was if the people that worked on it didn't love Star Wars. Kreia's whole thing is that she's notably wrong almost the entire time. She even directly says that every single student she had fell to the Dark Side. That's not some compelling anti-Star Wars soapboax self-insert wagging her finger about how the whole thing is wrong, it's a bitter old woman that can't accept that she might be the one who is wrong.
Avellone is a hack who created one good story and has shit the bed every time since.
>>736500656you beat kreia in a fight and then your friends in the ebon hawk fall into a canyon and it zooms out to the galaxy and the credits roll in planescape torment?
>>736500494They definitely could have written a story where Rey is the villain and Kylo Ren is heroic for fighting her. She's such a Boy Scout Luke copy that it's hard to imagine her as the villain, especially after two movies that were just the original trilogy again.
>>736500665I like the idea that it's so they can steal concepts and characters but not pay the authors and creators royalties.
>>736500712The narrative never presents Kreia as being in the wrong many, many times
>>736500712Exactly, well said.
>>736500752You leave your party behind to go off alone and fight a metaphysical battle stretching back to eternity.
>>736500669She dives into an underwater cave, dipshit.
>>736489317Disingenuous retard
Force rly should only be the this mystical precognition stuff that also helped with your reflexes + Obi's mind fuckery, maybe. Pushing, pulling, crushing/choking, super speed or lightning are just too much
>>736500665>Katarn arc for Rogue OneArc? In Dark Forces he steals the plans for the Death Star in the opening level which is like, ten minutes tops.>>736500816The fact that she's a Sith Lord who is using the Exile to get back at everyone that wronged her doesn't exactly paint her as being correct.
>>736500634Yeah I clocked that from the odd lighting the sabers had in that. I guess to save budget but it looked bad.
>>736500712Kreia is literally just manipulating you to create a less corrupt Jedi order and turn you into a weapon against the true sith.
I think TFA was a fine movie and I'm tired of pretending otherwise
>>736500665Different people made those decisions. JJ Abrams wanted to ignore EU shit in writing his movies, but Filoni was in love with it and wants to reference it as much as possible. This leads to a weird half-assed situation where Thrawn is onscreen but it's not Thrawn from the books, it's Thrawn from a cartoon.
Force has a will and is a female (canon btw, be it EU or not). Which means Kreia is in the right about it
Kreia was right and im tired of pretending she wasn't.
>>736500857I don't remember any time travel in the kreia encounter but I always felt I may have done something wrong, I replayed it once with the same choices to make sure I saw what I saw and was then disgusted. These were the same niggers who ended NWN2 with basically rocks fall, everyone dies so I was already sick of their shit.
>>736500816What exactly should the game have done to show she's wrong, have the force materialize itself and say "nah it ain't like that bitch" to her face?
>>736489317Holes are lame. Just look at that picture you posted, the culmination of that trilogy. She has the exact same dumb look on her face as your little sister did when she was trying to lie to your parents about you.
Malachor
>>736488730He swung over a pit on a cord thing.And then this other time, he jumped off a plank and did this sick turn-around rebound into a front flip. That was pretty dope bruv
>>736500816>>736501031You can gain influence with Kreia while still disagreeing with her. She doesn't ask for blind obedience, she just wants you to make decisions based on your own genuine convictions rather than adherence to dogma.Anyone who gets angry about Kreia has never held any actual beliefs in their entire life and their worldview is entirely shaped by others, which is why they get angry when their beliefs are held under a microscope and they are asked to explain why they believe what they do - they are NPCs who are not capable of introspection.
>>736501203Nice word salad Chris.
>>736500864She let gravity handle most of it and then paddled 10 feet. Is it really that fucking unbelievable to you?
>>736491229not even top 10 best luke skywalker moments desu
>>736501203My genuine convictions are I try to help everyone in video games except for FTL where I have to be a cunt to survive.
>>736501273Yes, it's unbelievable that someone who has literally never swam in their life would jump off a cliff and hope for the best knowing full well they can't swim.That's fucking retarded, and so are you for whtie knighting it.
>>736489017>Kyle's just THE guy with a lightsaberftfy
>>736489317Luke gets his ass kicked over and over and over again until ROTJ and even then his plan to sway his father on Endor fails and he nearly loses and gives into the dark side on the deathstar. He would have died to the emperor if it wasn't for vader. Hell he almost died like three times in ESB alone.
>>736501470>Using white knight unironicallyYikes, sorry that I've had sex and don't cry about women in movies and video games online as revenge against the femoids that spurned me
Today I will remind people to read the best book series star wars has to offer (The New Jedi Order) because it is pure unadulterated kino (if you can get past the first book's weird ass prose).>extremely interesting and new villain unlike anything else in star wars>body horror>exestential horror>constant debating of the role of the jedi and the force itself>legacy characters are respected and not just kneecapped to make way for new ones>new characters are EXTREMELY well written and have some of the best arcs known to star wars
>>736501553good run, but you overplayed your hand.should have just pointed out the typo
>>736499669the prequel fights look like dogshit
>>736489465A lot of the EU reads like retarded shonen slop and capeshit with what it makes jedi capable of
>>736489317Lei skipped steps 5 to 8
>>736501556The Yuuzhan Vong were fucking garbage. A Hail Mary attempt to bring something new when they kept regurgitating the same handful of characters over and over again rather than try to write stories about people that weren't connected to the Skywalkers.
>>736501556NJO is god tier but for me? It's the KOTOR comics which are peak Star Wars. In this thread Zayne Carrick is a damn hero, end of story!
>>736501789These comics sucked. Stop shitting up these threads with them.
>>736501707>The Yuuzhan Vong were fucking garbageHow are they even remotely garbage when tehy are the most sophisticated and detailed race/culture in all of star wars? An entire pantheon/religion, culture, language, detailed back story, interesting motives and characters. I am legitimately convinced you are just fucking retarded anon.
>>736501856I know, these comics are the best, it's crazy how Disney can't reach a tenth of their greatness.
>>736501882Just because they were somewhat unique to Star Wars doesn't make them good.
>>736500897It saves money on CG I guess. They clearly wanted it to be an actual light source in the scene that would change the color of things around it. That's not worth filming a sword fight where the participants have to be gentle with the sword, though.
>>736501882They're ugly, edgy, and contradict the absolute core tenet of Star Wars, that all living things are connected to the Force
>>736501967You clearly have not read them if you think any of that is applicable to the series.
>>736501789Look I don't know who you are, but you look like a top bloke, and this may seem weird but I feel this strange bond between us
>>736501967>contradict the absolute core tenet of Star Wars, that all living things are connected to the Forceask me how i know you didnt actually read the series. they are connected to the force, just not in any way the jedi know how to sense or deal with because the vong had their ability to use the force completely cut away from them as punishment by their whole planet. Some of the vong literally regain the ability to use the force through practice and experimentation, and multiple characters in lore eventually learn to use the force in new ways to sense them
>>736501556shit was so cashHe stood alone at gjallerbru... And that answer is enough
>>736502123Self replying now. Just like old times. Time for you to go tremble in a hole for another decade, old pal.
>>736502132To go further into detail, Kreia is quite clearly just plagarized from a character in the NJO (Vergere), and the concept of a "wound in the force" is also just stolen from the NJO.
>>736501856What's the matter, Filoni Boy? Afraid of a little good writing?
>>736502253bodies them so hard the shamed ones start to worship him as part of the jedaai heresy... so fucking kino...
>>736502307None to be found in those shabby comics.
>>736500962filoni pilfers characters and ideas from the eu because he's jealous of themevery single think he took from the eu is objectively worse than the source material, what he did to thrawn is a total jokeit's clear he just takes shit for the purpose of his oc's beating them to show how mucher greater and better they are
>>736502390dont fucking remind me of his failed abortion attempt at thrawnNot just his appearance, his entire personality and depiction is so fucking awful compared to his EU counterpart that I can never ever support anything Filoni does ever again.
>>736502358That's right, sis. Rebels and Resistance mogs it hard!
>>736488653>Was Luke really the powerful force demigod that the Star Wars fandom made him out to be?In old lore? Yes.>"Seen through the Force he was a maelstrom of luminous energy, a Force storm against which there was no shelter. And yet all his energy poured from a calm center; an eye."
>>736502490what? you didn't like how he was defeated by some plucky rebels half a dozen times and outsmarted by deus ex space whales?
>>736491109The collapse is taking too long, the world needs to crash faster.
>>736502564Give it three months at present conditions. Let's be honest, the judeosatanic USA deserves it.
>>736502254The term is samefagging here, fren.And you generally don't use it unless it's blatant since you look like a dumbass
>>736493837If those robots are so powerful, why don't we see them constantly? Do they need to stay on that spaceship to work, like they rely on the power grid or something? Are they made with really scarce materials? The normal 'battle droids' seem useless by comparison.
>>736502614>the judeosatanic USA deserves it.Maybe but all my stuff is here so gonna have to hard pass on that one.
>>736501707>Hey umm guys I think were lost shouldn’t we be fighting Space Marines?
>>736502490Wait Thrawn was just blue data?
make a game about her.put in a dark side/light side honour system like RDR did.print billions.
>>736502801worse, he's blue elon musk
>>736502768Not really up to you buddy. Maybe half the country shouldn't have voted for the most raped zogslave, including myself
>>736502830we've already had a game about an ugly hag, we don't need another thanks
>>736488653I'd be asking that about Vader. Force-wise, he lost a lot of his body and the movies were too old to really showcase him.
>>736489368Or, or, and hear me out.We saw Luke train.This girl just ... knew how to do everything effortlessly, like some kind of mary sue.
>>736502914>uglyjust say you're a retard it's okay
>>736502490They really didn't seem to grasp that Thrawn accepting setbacks in the books wasn't because it was all part of his keikaku, but because he usually had secondary goals that could be accomplished in failure as a safeguard. There are times when he actually does get screwed out of a goal without planning for it, and he never acts smug about it. In fact, the few times he gets genuinely pissed off are when someone fucks him over out of ineptitude and forces him to come up with a new plan on the fly.NuWars Thrawn just gets repeatedly gaped until his asshole can't take it anymore, whereupon it turns out his ultimate plan was a bit shit and not worth the repeated rapings.
>>736502132The problem is they tonally and visually do not fit SW. Its the equivalent of Cthullu manifesting into Lord of the Rings after the end of the war against Sauron or The Flood randomly appearing in Star Trek.
>>736491520>it's the numbers taken from the ass episode
>>736502909>Get raped by Jews>Get raped by JeetsIt was an AVP situation
My skills are yours to command.
>>736503109>tonallyThe movies sure, but theres literally ZERO reason that the books have to follow the general tone of the movies. Are you literally fucking retarded? Even IN the movies we see weird aliens all the time. If you dont like the tone because you just want everything to be morally black and white space wizards with very little aliens basically no sci fi thats fine but theres no reason star wars ALWAYS has to be that.
>>736504442Weird aliens is one thing but when it's weird aliens that are an edgy teen's idea of cool is another.
>>736504545>edgy teen's idea of coolYou could just admit that you are retarded and have no idea what the Vong are actually about anon.
>>736504598>no no they have a complex culture and religion!The Vong are Dark Eldar-lite.
>>736504685>t. actual retard
>>736504685You are genuinely retarded.
>>736489831>Most of what Luke got done was both by being competent and connected to competent people/droids.Luke's greatest power of all is that he can make friends.
>>736504598People were complaining that they just reused light side vs. dark side stuff from the movies down to just having a clone of the Emperor and a bunch of new gigantic weapons. They responded by making villains who are neither light side or dark side.
>>736504442>a series of books and comics based on movies shouldn’t be comparable in tone to movies because ummm random schizobabble
>>736505003I guess that would be considered a superpower for most posters here.
>>736488653In Legends yes, he got cucked by Disney
I would rather have a teenager's idea of an edgelord alien race doing cool and cruel shit in Star Wars than whatever safe and toothless slop Filoni's waterlogged brain will allow.
>>736505430is your IQ literally 20 that you cant imagine any part of a media franchise varying in tone from others?
>>736490072I don't know if there's proof that Luke is better than Vader, but not only was Vader never the best duelist (Dooku was actually better) he was severely nerfed from losing 3 of his limbs, being stuck in a suit that's literally killing him, and also like 60 by the time they fought.
>>736505810You could have neither too you know.
>>736506136Jinpachi beat his son, grandson and grandnephew and strapped them to a rocket going into space, and he was like a million years old
>>736505902Even KOTOR2 the boogieman of /v/ SW fans feels like SW. Hell something terrible like Rise of Skywalker still sadly feels like SW. The Vong and all media surrounding them do not emulate that at all, they're just miseryporn from start to finish with bad writing even by the standards of the EU itself. I get it kid, its shitposting jeet contrarian hours and you latched onto this topic because you had nothing better going on. But the Yuuzhan Vong suck and much like the Disney Canon, nobody in their right state of mind has the braincells or compulsion to defend them.
>>736506283And?
>>736497153>goku and bulma enter a town plagued by a shapeshifting monster (oolong) and goku proceeds to beat his ass>goku and bulma enter a town controlled by a rabbit mafioso and goku proceeds to beat his ass>goku enters a village where the RR army set up a gigantic tower and taken the village chief hostage, goku proceeds to spend multiple episodes beating everyone's ass
>>736505478Uh, you don’t get to bring friends
>>736500962>JJ Abrams wanted to ignore EU shit in writing his moviesExcept 7/8/9 are just Operation Shadow Hand with the serial number filed off.
>Is the only good nuSW protagonist/story post-Rogue OneHow does he do it?
>>736505430If there was only 1 book, it should be pretty similar in tone to the movie it's based on. There are so many Star Wars spin-offs that they're fine to get darker sometimes.
>>736500665>How come Disney and Filoni decanonized the EU and hate it but copy it for their stories anyways?Because according to the EU the death star plans were stolen on no less than 20 different occasions
>>736506862It wasn't 20 times. It was 2 times.
>>736500665The EU was a bloated mess with too much garbage. Disney's intention was never to ignore it (they wouldn't have classified it as Legends otherwise), but rather to pick and choose what to add into their own canon. Which is fine on paper, but the way they handled it was dumb since they ended up ripping off stupid parts of the EU and poorly anyways (Dark Empire lol).
>>736506637"Ignore EU shit" as in ignore trying to make the movies fit into the canon of every Star Wars book, comic and video game. They copied heavily from the EU even in having Ben, grandson of Anakin, and the resurrected Emperor. Their story is essentially a replacement for that story such that it's impossible for both to happen.
>>736506491I know you've never read the NJO. If you think it's tonally too different for SW or it's just misery porn, you're going off what other anons have said (when they too have not read it), so your post reeks of a poor attempt to fit in by being incessantly negative on a topic you have no experience with, which is ironically far more jeetlike than anything posted ITT so far. SW in general leading up to the NJO and past it had experimented with multiple different tones by the way, not like you would know since you have no experience with the subject. It's always so obvious that someone has never experienced any of the EU. You people get so hyperbolic and can never actually explain yourselves. Its been over a decade since the Disney buyout and no one is going to ever believe the complaints of the EU being bloated or shit or whatever is true, let alone any complaints about the Vong but other people who have never interacted with the EU itself.
>>736503108>old Thrawn was a smart character written by smart people >nu Thrawn is an allegedly smart character written by retards
>>736506491you cant even name 4 NJO books without googling, you never read them, stop lying. You read some cursory fucking vague articles and wiki pages and made an opinion on them based on what you think was going on because you are an insecure autistic faggot who seethes copes and dilates about things that arent literally the same as what you expect them to be.
>>736507196Maybe they should have tried to make their story not shit
>>736506736by not being overpowered there's an argument to be made about the writing quality of the jedi games, but as a whole cal feels like a shitter barely at knight prowess in survivor which makes sense for the character him not being annoying or a douche also helps
>>736506736>Is the only good nuSW protagonist/story post-Rogue One
>>736488653according to rian johnson, no, he was a scared slob
>>736507863Mr potato head’s opinions on the subject are less than worthless
>>736507863rian johnson? the guy with a vendetta against star wars because he broke his millennium falcon toy as a child because he thought it would fly when he threw it?that rian johnson?
It's almost like it's time for you manchildren to GROW UP and move on from Star Wars to actual serious SF like Foundation and Dune. Put the fucking toys away.
>>736507213This post reeks of projection. Its a story where trillions of people die or get placed in torture machines, where sentient planets house the torturers of the galaxy and internal bureaucracy nearly fails to safeguard the galaxy. They aren't obscure novels they just suck.
>>736508047No, child, it is you who are the child.Enjoy prison.
>>736508136>internal bureaucracy nearly fails to safeguard the galaxyYou mean just like the prequels?
>>736495916By the time he did, Vader was already a severely crippled middle aged man who probably wasn't giving his rage induced A game because he was conflicted over fighting his own son.
>>736507863Luke's final act in the Last Jedi is the embodiment of everything Yoda ever taught him, the problem is that the EU and video games made you think that being a Jedi is about being REALLY good at killing people with a lightsaber
>>736488653He lost to Exar Kun
>>736508398congrats anon I thought I had already read the most retarded post on 4chan.
>>736488859Abeloth was when Luke was like 80 to be fair and that was the last EU thing Luke did before full Disney control.
>>736494847lmao that picture was made by someone who only ever watched GT onwards and knows OG Dragon Ball only from Roshi memes
>>736500665Disney wanted everything to be theirs, Filoni was on the receiving end of that and Clone Wars season 6 was unfinished, the final season Disney eventually crawled back to is only two plotlines out of six or so that were in rough development. Shadow Lord is heavily borrowing from the cancelled Maul game, you know the one that was in early development and where George made the toy of Talon and Maul hug and say "they're friends!"? That's where the inspiration is coming from.
>>736508398I'm gonna play Devil's advocate and say you're half right, but Johnson makingLuke die like a chump because a galactic Discord/Zoom convo was too tiring for him was a disgrace. Every legacy character died like chumps, and even years after, I'm still bitter that not even Johnson or Jew Jew thought of a single fucking scene wher Luke, Han and Leia meet again after a long time.
>>736502390>>736502490You know they got Zahn back to rewrite new Thrawn books and oversee the character in Rebels and the show, right? Thrawn is just a shit character that kinda of worked in one particular instance, but go read about how Zahn feels about him and you will never look at the blueskin again>actually yeah if Thawn was on the Death Star the Empire wouldve won because um.... THEY JUST WOULDVE CHUD
>>736508880the cancelled Maul game was originally conceived to take place pre-Episode I with Maul doing Sith Assassin stuff for Sheev. Maul hadn't been resurrected yet in the cartoon when it was in pre-production, which is why they had to shift the concept to being about a Maul doppleganger rather than Maul himself when George shoved Talon into it.
>>736508929>I'm still bitter that not even Johnson or Jew Jew thought of a single fucking scene wher Luke, Han and Leia meet again after a long time.It's not bad writing because it hurt your feelings.
>>736508929Not only did they die like chumps, they lived like chumps. Han is still a loser smuggler, Leia is still a resistance leader, Luke is a coward. The entire sequel trilogy went out of its way to shit on the main characters of the originals as much as possible before killing them off
TLJ is the least-worst sequel film. If anything, Rian should've done VII, the Jurassic World guy doing VIII and JJ doing IX.
>>736509051It's really funny how people bent over backwards to not try and fuck up the EU timeline even though George didn't care. We could have gotten Maul and Talon as friends if they decided 'fuck it why not?' instead.
>>736500665That's what Lucas was doing when he was in charge, dumbass
>>736509165That's a brownoids way of thinking.
>>736508993>oversee the character in Rebels and the show, right?That was a lie.>As far as input into the show is concerned? Nothing.>They have not... They've shown me some things in advance and with season 3 of Rebels since I was doing the backstory in the book 'Thrawn' they were feeding me scripts, so I saw what they were doing. But I have not had any real consultation. They've not asked for any input.>And they (Filoni) are very busy with other things, but they'd know where to find me if they want me. But yeah, no, I haven't had any input into the series. I'd love to have some.>I generally put it this way: from our house to LucasFilm, The Presidio, is about a 10 hour drive. I will make it in 8 if they call.-Zahn in a 2024 interview
>>736509261Ah yes, because the EU was sacrosanct even when it gave us stuff like the Black Fleet Crisis and the Jedi Prince series.
>>736509150Nah that's TFA. Derivative as it is, TFA maintains a steady quality throughout, which is how it was able to trick bitter Gem X'ers into thinking Star Wars might be good again. TLJ is bogged down by extremely shitty B plots like the gambling planet or Laura Dern being the worst leader of all time
>>736508398>>736508929The problem with the EU is that it went way too far with powerscaling since the writers idolized the original cast too much like Gods. So you had shit like Luke closing black holes and getting into epic lightsaber duels with bigger baddies than Vader and even Sidious.Unironically Filoni's portrayal of Luke is much more in line with what he should have been - a wise Jedi Master who gives sage advice to the next generation and only steps into the fight when necessary.
>>736508993>hey got Zahn back to rewriteYou mean 30 years later disney forced the origonal writer to write the same character but worse under their direct orders and gave him literally no control? If it was the same character he would have acted the same in the new thrawn trilogy. He doesnt even act like the same fucking person.
>>736509290And no one ever mentions the nucanon thrawn book for a good reason.
>>736509368>Luke closing black holesluke closed a single micro black hole, it took literally all of his willpower to do so, it nearly killed him in the process, and he spent the rest of the series trying to recover from the ordeal. You did NOT read the series lol.
>>736509103Whether or not it's bad writing is irrelevant. Luke, Leia and Han were in TFA specifically because that should make fans happy. Having one of them fucking die and Luke have no interaction with the other two obviously won't make fans happy.
>>736497979>wonder howanon, all the actions of yidsney (aka disney) and every other hollywood entity make complete sense once you realize and accept the fact that the jews who weaseled their way into controlling them are not interested in profit. not in the monetary sense. i mean... theyre jews so they ARE but thats not the objective of the company. the objective is the destruction of white western society. the hollywood entities that jews control are used to undermine, sabotage, destroy, and desecrate the shared cultural history of white western society. erasing our heroes, replacing them with niggers or foids, making those older heroes look like incompetent blithering fools, constantly pushing 'diversity' and 'inclusion' and so forth; all of it is intended to barrage with you this shit until you'll accept the tide of browns they want to flood the country with (and their peers in politics, especially the democrat traitor party do that part) so as to demographically replace you and genocide your entire race theywantyoudeadandgone they want this so that they can reap far MORE control, power, and wealth for themselves than theyd ever get by making competent or decent movies. not to mention that theyre literally commanded to do so by their holy books. the problem is jews.its literally always jews.
>>736509518I bet you cry about TFA being too safe and similar to the original film while simultaneously whining every time the sequels took risks
>>736509362TFA is a glib facsimile, there is basically no quality at all unless you clap for memberberries which TFA is all about. It's the exact same shit as ROS but people pretend it has some merit because it's rehashing ANH beat for beat but 40x worse in every way possible.
>>736509290Good to know Filoni is an actual liar. What a fucking hack.
>>736509468It's just an epidemic, Dovin Bassals being anywhere near a black hole are ridiculous, they're closer to interdictors if anything. It's lowgrade shitposting at this point.
>>736508398In that he uses The Force so hard he dies? Sure, except Yoda would have taught him to get in the fucking spaceship Rey brought and go help.
>>736509621the problem isnt that the last jedi took risks, its that the things it did were just retarded. Taking risks isnt automatically a good or bad thing you low iq subhuman who only thinks in black and white. New is good when its done well. When its interesting, internally consistent but re contextualizes without creating plot holes
>>736498307>anakin>12-14ish years of formal training by masters deeply learned in the force and lightsabers and all that>a monastic type life of full dedication to this one craft of being a jedi and using the force from an early age>personal attention from the strongest and best jedis to exist, regularly >luke>lived as a dirt poor moisture farmer until 18>got maybe a few weeks of formal training from old obi-wan and a few months from yoda at most>thats it >leia>didnt even get what luke got its not surprising that luke and leia, while having the *potential* of anakin, never displayed anakin's full capabilities
>>736509621There's taking risks and being innovative in an interesting way, and there's being "subversive" as a means to middle finger your audience, EsB is the former and TLJ is clearly in the latter.
>>736509621Wrong, I generally like TFA, even though there's plenty to complain about, like the gigantic planet-destroying laser. It was fine for that movie to be safe. Risks that don't pay off aren't fine.
>>736502348Not even just the Shamed Ones, there's a part in a later book where a Warrior Caste guy hears another character talking shit about Ganner and he threatens to rip the dude's face off. This is a commonly held position with them in normal Yuuzhan Vong society.
>>736509627I agree, and ANH beat for beat but 40x worse is still better than the other two
>>736509747>internally consistentSee, when fans do this they are engaging with a made up version of Star Wars where retcons never existed, everything was always perfectly aligned and they pick and choose wookieepedia articles of what is canon to the perfect version of Star Wars that only existed in their head.
>>736489317Luke fails constantly throughout his trilogy, and only after becomes a jedi on par, if not greater than with Yoda (And still has regular failings past that point)Except in Disney canon, where he doesn't even get a chance to be a good Jedi and just dies a pitiful old man.
>>736499669did it ever occur to you that the fight scenes in the OT look the way they do because all the true masters of lightsaber combat are either dead or old (obiwan) or old AND stuck in a stiff restricting life support suit (vader)?
>>736509821I just don't see "a bloo bloo Luke Han and Leia never all had a nostalgic scene together" as a real criticism. It was an impossibility when Harrison Ford refused to do more than one movie, and I value Han Solo in TFA more than whatever imagined fanservice scenario exists in fanboys' heads.
>>736508993>>736509369The new Disney book version of Thrawn is by far the most interesting version of the character that's been made. The Ahsoka show and Rebels basically raped him though he's nothing like depicted there.
>>736509845there is nothing in the prequels that completely ruins the origonal trilogy in the same way that the holdo meneuver does. Literally nothing in star wars makes sense, NOTHING, if such a thing is possible. There is no reason any battle would take place as they do, everyone would just use manless drones to hyperspace ram eachother.
>>736509821Except the traits that everyone hates about new movies were already established, Han being a deadbeat loser, Luke being a runaway failure were plot beats that were setup in the first movie, amazingly continuity wise the Disney trilogy is somehow more consistent than the OT, because that one was smart enough to throw away idiotic plot beats that weren't working between movies.
>ST fans are posting on this siteI'm old.
>>736509993This is like saying Lord of the Rings sucks because the Eagles could have just flown the Company of the Ring to Mordor
>>736510015Its not fans its just shitposters. This is what happens when you give undeveloped nations phones and the means of accessing the internet.
>>736510015>TLJ is 10 years old next year
>>736510097i cant even give you a 1/10
>>736509993>there is nothing in the prequels that completely ruins the origonal trilogy You say this because you watched the prequels as a toddler and don't remember the beforetime when the OT was the ONLY star wars Space Jesus Vader is the worst creative decision of the entire franchise that limits the entire universe to exist in the shadow of one man and his immediate social circle.
>>736510152>Its not fans its just shitpostersNever doubt the ability for someone to have taste abysmal enough to like pure garbage.
>>736510015sequel hate is mostly from zoomers who are primarily fans of the prequels and clone wars fyi.
>>736509993Except people bitched about midichlorians back when PM was released, there's plenty of stuff that didn't jive with established old canon that's been forgotten because the canon has changed so much since then that it's not longer jarring (clone wars lore etc.)
>>736491520I dunno what's worse, this or Boruto.
>>736508398Except the framing makes it an absolutely moronic sacrifice.Firstly, literally nobody except the first order witnesses it. The fact people do somehow find out about this would be pants on head retarded even if it wasn't in a setting that had already managed to forget about the existence of the Jedi AGAIN. Secondly, the movie has Snoke teleport Kylo and Rey together with literally no effort at all. The idea Luke would die of a force heart attack while Snoke suffers no side effects is absolutely moronic.Thirdly, Luke dying makes his display meaningless to Kylo. All he did was prove that he had nothing to fear, since even the greatest master just went out like a bitch. If he had lived it would be a whole new story, but he didn't because disney despises Luke.Finally, Jedi have lightsabers for a reason. Obi-Wan, the quintessential Jedi, was perfectly willing to hack someone's arm off when he made it clear violence was inevitable. Yoda himself said to use the force for defence. Jedi were guardians first and foremost, not spiritual advisors.This nuwars idea that Jedi are supposed to be pacifists is a complete revisonism based on a flimsy misunderstanding of the PT era Jedi's mistake.
>>736510204>Space Jesus Vader is the worst creative decisionthe chosen one prophecy is literally not what you think it is anon, it was created by the sith to ruin the jedi.
>>736509468Luke nor any Jedi has no business being anywhere near, much less closing, black holes. Fuck off Michael.
>>736510097
>>736510317Is this Disney lore or something George himself had said
>>736510317If the prophecy turns out to be true and does destroy the sith isn't it weird that it was made up by the sith.
>>736509993>why didn't everyone use the objectively best metaYou're looking at childrens films from a no-life gamer point of view. WHy didn't the empire construct 20 death stars instead of only one? Why wasn't the exhaust port defended by a tie squadron 24/7? Why didn't the Emperor sense Vader was going to betray him after knowing him and manipulating his every move for basically his whole life???>>736510263Midichlorians are only mentioned twice in the entire PT and most people don't even catch the second time because they're interwoven into the dialogue with much higher quality than in Ep1.
>>736510413It's called 'irony', you might want to look it up on tvtropes and educate yourself
>>736510413The prophecy wasn't really set up to destroy the sith though. It worked perfectly as a corrupting force since naturally the Jedi would try to find and raise a strong warrior only for Palpatine to easily corrupt them like he did with Anakin. And from there the rule of two bullshit continues.
>>736498008As much as I hate Disney canon, I really do like their Resurgent-class Star DestroyerReally sad thst it wasn't an old canon thing so i'd be featured in more SW mods
>>736510404funnily enough its neither, that anon just pulled it out of his ass REALITY: the chosen one prophecy was originally dreamed up by the jedi, who in their classic hubris, immediately made the wrong assumptions about it and it got them beaned.
>>736509993I don't think anyone will argue with you that the ST is complete garbage with nothing redeemable about it.
>>736510321Good thing it wasn't a black hole anon. If you're this incapable of reading you should just kill yourself at this point it's pathetic.
>>736510460>Midichlorians are only mentioned twice in the entire PT and most people don't even catch the second time because they're interwoven into the dialogue with much higher quality than in Ep1.It's still a quantitative, biological measure of Force power that limits the Force to those genetically predisposed to it and makes Anakin Skywalker the most important person to ever live, when most people understood the Force prior to the prequels as being something spiritual that existed beyond the physical plane>luminous beings are we, not this crude matter
>>736510460>Midichlorians are only mentioned twice in the entire PTYeah and everyone loathed it back in the day, but people moved on.
>>736510460>why didn't the empire construct 20 death starsbecause it was the size of a small fucking moon and they didnt have the resources for more than 2>why wasnt the exhaust port defended by a tie squadronbecause military guys didnt go poring over engineering blueprints and overlooked the weakness>why didnt the emperor sense vader was going to betray himhe did, he was arrogant enough to believe he could control vader anyway and often slapped down plots by vader that vader thought were secret when they werent; this is made very, very fucking clear in the EU there ARE answers anon. youre just too retarded to find or learn them
>>736510643That was just Yoda saying mind over matter in his esoteric way of speech because Luke was saying the X-wing was impossible to move.
>>736509939>It was an impossibility when Harrison Ford refused to do more than one movieThen write a scene like that for that one movie?>and I value Han Solo in TFA more than whatever imagined fanservice scenario exists in fanboys' heads.I sure don't value that he's in the same place doing the same shit 30 years later, like he didn't learn anything from the three OT films, and he's established as pissing off his wife and son so much they don't want anything to do with him. 90 minutes of the three of them having a tea party would be horrible, yes. But imagining it would suck that hard is the same thing as imagining it would be perfect, just more pessimistic. Ultimately, it could be "good writing" to just not have those 3 at all. They settled for a weird half step where people are supposed to be happy to see Han Solo in the Millennium Falcon again, but the same movie also has his son stab him to death.
>>736510696thank god you watched the OT as an uncritical toddler so you never had to take a cynical, plothole-surfing lens to it like you did the sequels>muh EUOh okay, that's what we're dealing with here
>>736510260I'm pretty sure it's from the sequel hate is from anyone with eyes.
>>736510641>um acshually the vong's dovin basal is not a real natural black hole it's just an artificial mini black hole!What a silly hill to die on.
>everyone always memed on "she has lost the will to live" since 2005>Carrie Fischer's mom dies less than a week after she does>purely natural causes despite her being in arguably better health than her daughter>have never seen that like joked about sinceThe force works in mysterious ways
>>736510898the difference is that Debbie Reynolds was a 90 year old woman who had a stress-induced stroke and Padme was a 25 year old woman who is explicitly said to have noting physically wrong with her, she just died because her feelings were hurt that her sociopath husband didn't love her anymore, abandoning her newborn children in the process.
>>736510460>Why didn't the Emperor sense Vader was going to betray him after knowing him and manipulating his every move for basically his whole life???Hubris.The entire point of the throne room scene was Luke dismantling the Emperor's hubris. The Emperor repeats time and time again that Luke's efforts are folly because he has foreseen the outcome and knows it will failThe fact the Emperor drops his smug act when Luke throws his lightsaber away was supposed to make this clear enough that even the children the movies were aimed at could grasp this.Why couldn't you?
>>736510875>anon is literally just looking at wookiepedia articlesi hope you never stop posting, i love lolcows so much.
>>736510898Heartbreak aka a heart attack/stroke caused by severe stress is a real thing but I always preferred the theory that palpatine siphoned the life away from Padme to keep Vader alive
>retards ITT acting like Disney Wars has any value to itThis board has reached peak contrarianism.
736511049>I'll double down and start projecting. That's a neat trick!Like I said, if you want to die on this hill that's your prerogative.
>>736511056honestly a better theory than most, but it has a critical flaw in that to do that, palpatine would have had to have surpassed his old master plagueis, who he definitely did not, and plagueis didnt even ever figure out how to manipulate life as an abstract with the force
Interesting how the nuwars fag provides a perfect demonstration of what>>736489886said.They can never defend the ST on its own merits. They always have to run away and undermine something else in the hope of lowering the bar
>>736511103everyone in here defending disney is shill or a bot, don't be silly anonwe're all just screaming into the faceless unfeeling machine void to try and make ourselves feel better
>>736509468>>736510641Hey retard, you seem to think the point of criticism is the specific degree of powerscaling, when the problem most people have with the EU is that it cares more about EPIC feats of martial power than actually interesting character work or moral dilemmas. If EU writers wrote the conclusion to Return of the Jedi Luke would have just kicked Vader's ass and then deflected Sheev's lightning back at him with his lightsaber making him explode and then created a vortex in space to destroy the Imperial fleet.
>>736511216>everyone in here defending disney is shill or a bot, don't be silly anonThis is projection btw, you're the one treating it like it's sports teams. I hate more Disney content than I enjoy at this point.
>>736511293>moral dilemmas.The moral dilemmas in the EU are literally 10x better and 10x more frequent than anything else lol. You are just too fucking funny dude. What moral dilema is there in the origonal star wars trilogy? Luke doesnt even stop to consider the millions and millions of lives hes ending when he blows up the death star. Oh no, thats literally something that ONLY the EU dealt with, because in it he actually has grief and trauma for the lives he has ended.
>>736509748So you're basically saying that Anakin was a privileged and ungrateful chud.
>>736511151Could’ve been Vader unintentionally siphoning off Padme instead
>>736511519Anakin as depicted by the prequels is pretty much an unrepentant sociopath who was a bad apple almost from the start that did not deserve the redemption he's given in Return of the Jedi
>a bunch of fuckers itt fawning over the Thrawn trilogy>the only character I have ever seen in the wild that actually fits the description of a fucking Sue>even in his own stupid books there's Gilad Pellaeon who thinks everything he says and does is fucking bullshitI hate you all
>>736511002It's likely that her getting choked nearly to death by her husband made it extra hard to live through childbirth. Maybe that's bad writing, but her dying from being too sad is worse.
>>736511703he literally jobs to his own ego in all of his own books, how is he even remotely a mary sue? do you even know what that term means?
>>736511792The robot EXPLICITLY says there is nothing medically wrong with her. Padme dying from her injuries would have made sense, but I just don't think George wanted Anakin to be directly responsible for his pregnant wife's death because we're still supposed to think he's the hero, after all god i hate the prequels so much
The coolest fucking thing I've ever seen Luke do was at the end of Courtship of Princess Leia where he uses the Force to take complete control of the Falcon and goes absolutely nuts, while everyone else can only sit back and watch
>>736511703>the only character I have ever seen in the wild that actually fits the description of a fucking SueThrawn? It's annoying when he's like we're meeting for the first time but your ear is 1.4 inches high so you must want this painting. He fails constantly throughout even the first book, though, so he isn't a Mary Sue.
>>736511519Anakin, for all of his skills, and his power never mastered his emotions, and Palpatine used it to his advantage. Yoda was right that he was too old to be trained but the arrogance of the Jedi of his era won out. Ultimately his choices were his own though, and he could have chosen not to side with Palpatine, but his obsessiveness over Padmé won out.
>>736511920>we're still supposed to think he's the herono one has said thisno one thinks this anakin stops being the hero the second he bows down to sidious, the movie makes this explicitly clear a few minutes later when all the jedi get murdered and anakin is leading the clones to the temple
>>736511703Man I keep noticing no one knows what the term Mary Sue or Gary Stu means anymore. If a character has noticeable glaring flaws and is constantly struggling with their own internal issues or ones they encounter they cannot be a Mary Sue. Even Rey isn't because she sucks and really has no ambition or idea of what shes doing. The closest on hand example I can think of a Mary Sue is either Word Girl or Kim Possible, and even the latter struggles with teenage bullshit on occasion.
>>736512078Except le chosen one xD prophecy dictates that everything Vader did was justified because it led to him balancing the Force or whatever.
>>736511519correct
>>736512015anakin's biggest problem was that he had a teacher that was too determined to adhere to the council's word to the letter if qui gon had survived maul and managed to take anakin as his formal apprentice, i highly doubt palpatine would've been able to sink his claws in to anakin at allhe needed a father figure, qui gon was willing to accept that role initially, but after his death palplatine took it because he saw an opportunity obi wan wanted nothing to do with it, but was willing to take a brotherly stance with anakin, which is not what he needed
>>736512124Kim Possible is also primarily a comedy show, so a character not having many flaws is fine since it's not a serious work that wants us to engage with it intellectually.
>>736512078It's about still seeing him as a human being deserving of sympathy that should be redeemed, in this case RotS has to reconcile Anakin's shift to Vader while also ensuring the shift back into Anakin in RotJ feels plausible and sympathetic, stuff like the temple massacre can be argued and put on the feet of Palpatine, but if Anakin choked out his own wife we'd start to see him beyond redemption.
>>736512204if quigon had lived he would have left the Jedi order to teach Anakin himself, which would have removed him from Sheev's reach and the psychotic decrees of the council. He would have turned out relatively normal
>>736512161Yeah he kills Palpatine and dies ending the Sith lineage he was a part of but that doesn't retroactively make anything he did from Order 66 on okay.
>>736512161the only 'chosen one' think he does in the ot is kill palpatine bringing balance isn't some ying yang shit, it's the eradication of the sith cancer and restoring the force to it's natural statei'm not saying jedi are the be all end all force masters either, their arrogance directly lead to their downfallif it wasn't at anakin's hand it would've been someone elses down the line
>>736512161Anon, why do you think that some random rumor in universe for star wars is meant to be a literal thing that is supposed to take place? Theres a reason a lot of the jedi dont think its real. It was LITERALLY started by the sith to psy op the jedi.
>>736488653It varies. In the Dark Empire comics he takes down an ATAT with just the force. In The Last Command novel he uses the force to enhance the range of a pair of binoculars.
>>736512294George has said time and again that the prophecy was meant to be taken at face value and Anakin IS a divinely ordained messiah.
>>736512349feel free to show any evidence of this
>>736488653In the movies? Nah, he is a borderline fraudIn the comics? He is the most busted jedi to ever exist
>>736512396https://www.youtube.com/shorts/zR0YtjlP7SYretard
>>736512015>Yoda was right that he was too old to be trained but the arrogance of the Jedi of his era won out.Yoda was a fucking retard. An untrained Anakin would've been snatched up by the dark side far sooner. And without knowing strong love, he would've been the true successor to Palpatine, an irredeemable psychopath through and through.
>>736512469Where does he use the term literal. the fact that he does end up doing the thing someone was rumored to do one day is what we call dramatic irony anon.
>>736512483it's honestly pretty remarkable that the prequels took Yoda, one of the wisest, kindest, most beloved characters of the OT and turned him into a sociopathic mass murderer without an ounce of empathy
>>736489317I gotta say fellas, I really fucking hate the shitquels.
>>736512596>yoda>sociopathic mass murderer without empathywhere are you even getting this shit
>>736512316Yeah for every feat Luke has like closing a micro black hole he also jobs or does something stupid like falling to the dark side somehow.
>>736512210Kim Possible is action comedy, the genre of a piece of media doesn't mean you shouldn't look at it with insincerity. The fuck is wrong with the troglodytes on /v/ today? They really aren't sending their best...
>>736491109Nigga it's fuckin been this way since foreverIt only got more retarded and more accelerated when social media stirred in more dipshits
>>736511480>What moral dilema is there in the origonal star wars trilogy?Aside from just "should I stay home and let this happen or should I put myself in danger trying to stop it?" Luke wants to join the government, but meets a girl actively fighting against the government and has to pick sides. Han has a similar decision about whether he should just fuck off smuggling or go help the people he's made friends with. In Empire, Luke has to decide between continuing his work with the rebels, or going off on a more personal journey. Jedi has an abundantly clear dilemma of whether Luke should embrace the darkness in his him or do something more morally virtuous, exemplified when he's half a second away from cutting Vader to bits and decides to spare him.
>>736512624>shitquelsneat, it works for sequels and prequels
>>736488653I feel like the Expanded Universe somewhat severely overblew just how powerful Force Users could be. In reality, Force Users just had mild or vague clairvoyance, telekinesis and super reflexes. Palpatine, ostensibly the most powerful Sith Lord ever, just shot lightning out of his hands. None of the movies ever really portrayed Jedi as godlike in any capacity, and the most powerful Jedi and Sith, Yoda, Anakin, Luke and Palpatine, never showed anything near as impressive in the movies as they did in the EU.
>>736512483Anakin was well on his way to acting like an irredeemable psychopath by the end of RotS, the Dark Side is a hell of a drug.
>>736512930None of those are moral dilemas anon, those are character dilemas. You do not know the difference.
>>736512940>In reality>star warseu haters really arent sending their best
>>736512124I'd call Rey a Mary Sue in the first one since she not only never fails at anything or has trouble, she's put right next to Han Solo and is better than him at repairing the fucking Millennium Falcon, and she confronts a trained knight with insane Force powers and beats him in a fight. Later films at least have her struggle with some things.
>>736512761Where the fuck did I mention insincerity you disingenuous twat? Most comedies don't require serious intellectual engagement. And you call me a fucking troglodyte? Get some fucking reading comprehension.
>>736512596imo the prequels are fine with how yoda is treated he goes from an overconfident jedi master who is watching the order and republic fall into the hands of the sith, into a much wiser jedi after losing it all and spending decades in exile to meditate and understand what happenedyoda learned from his mistakes and passed down his newfound knowledge to luke, with most of the old dogma removed
>>736509131>Leia is still a resistance leaderA resistance leader that toppled the old regime, but the new regime doesn't want to listen to her when she says something is up!
>>736492902Pic related is better than 90% of SW media.
>>736511703>the only character I have ever seen in the wild that actually fits the description of a fucking SueNobody mentioned Ahsoka though?
>>736492902Cloak of Deception is gr8
>>736513313he wrote another book in the NJO and its easily my favorite star wars book. Its not really enjoyable stand alone though, you kind of need the context of everything before it in its series to really appreciate it.
>>736512940palpatine was most certainly not the most powerful sith lord everthat was vitiate, and you better be thankful that the hero of tython stopped him
>>736513080Violently murdering someone who has done awful things or not having the weight of killing your dad on your shoulders is a moral dilemma. The morals are pragmatism and righteousness.
>>736512662The biggest selling point of Attack of the Clones was "hey kids, look, Yoda has a sword now!" and in Revenge of the Sith he brutally dismembers a bunch of stormtroopers after earlier in the movie telling Anakin "don't miss your loved ones" which is absolutely insane advice
>>736513550Anon.. I dont think you are old enough to be posting on 4chan and you should probably avoid doing so in the future if you dont wanna be permabanned for being underage.
>>736513559ill take 'shit that didn't happen for 200', alexyoure just making things up at this point
>>736513559I think you're being disingenuous. Yoda defended himself against clones that were trying to kill him, that's not psychopathic. Also, Yoda's advice can be summed up as "accept the things you cannot change". No Jedi could stop death, and Anakin's obsession over attempting to stop Padmé from dying and not accepting that death happens and we should move on from it rather than let grief consume us is what led him to becoming Vader.
>>736513485palpatine was likely the most powerful rule of two style sith, simply due to the nature of itthere are probably other sith lords from the old republic era and earlier that outclass him though
>>736512940Yeah people tend to forget in ANH Jedi were basically just space wizards with some precog. The most impressive feat was Vader force choking someone and it was implied only powerful force users like him (and later Luke) could do it.
>>736513485>vitiateSWTOR is Infinities tier I disregard it and the books surrounding it.
>>736513559both cases were either in self defence or to protect othersi.e. situations where it's totally ok for jedi to fight
>>736513794the rule of 2 doesn't always mean that subsequent sith are always stronger than their masters. On paper they are supposed to be, thats the whole idea after all, but being able to kill your master doesn't automatically make you stronger than him. Palpatine himself literally kills his master in his sleep, in a very deceptive way as sith often do , instead of a 1 on 1 battle. There were probably lots of other sith who killed their masters in devious ways.
>>736501203Nah, I dislike Kriea cause that bitch keeps yapping despite me leaving her on my ship.That, and there's usually no dialog to properly refute her
>>736513901That's Plagueis's fault for sleeping.
>>736513791>Yoda defended himself against clones that were trying to kill him, that's not psychopathicYoda dismembering people was a deliberate creative choice to show off his skill at committing violence >Also, Yoda's advice can be summed up as "accept the things you cannot change". That's fine, except that's not what Yoda tells him. He says don't mourn or miss the dead, which invalidates his very human emotions.
>>736513837iirc the only active force powers we see in anh are telekinesis (choke falls into this category), and the mind trickeverything else is just passiveprecognition wasn't a thing until esb
>>736501556Also features Vergre, the Kriea with actually good writing (ignore her retconned sith identity)
>>736514081Nah Vergere was a fucking deceptive bird in NJO I'm not surprised her teachings led to Jacen's fall.
>>736513205>Most comedies don't require serious intellectual engagement.Your exact words. Wrong ones at that. Fuck man I'm so tired of phoneposters, SEA, underage and their adjacents.
>>736513901the idea is the apprentice only kills the master once he learns everything from him killing plagueis in his sleep was underhanded, and may reflect poorly on sidious' actual prowess, but is still acceptable under the rule since the apprentice did manage to outsmart and best the master
>Greatest duelist in the lore>Reduced to a tutorial fight
>>736514050I thought precog was what helped Luke hit swamp rats / targeted the death star reactors and you need some level of it to use lightsabers without cutting your arm off.
>>736513840you shouldn'tits kino as fuck, minus like, one or two cringe parts
>>736514081>gnore her retconned sith identity)I actually like this, and dont consider it a retcon. She was lying and manipulating Jacen to not only reach his potential but to also eventually turn to the sith. It makes a lot more sense too, given that she tries to convince Luke and the jedi that the dark side didnt exist when it clearly does. She does this of course, because it makes them more susceptible to the dark side
>>736512124Rey is a sue, because her "flaws" are token gestures that don't mean anything and never meaningfully impact her. One of the classic examples of mary sue faux flaws are being too good for this sinful earth, which is Rey down to a T.Thrawn is not one, because his flaws literally get him killed and they're foreshadowed in book 1.
>>736513685Go ahead and claim there are no morals endorsing killing someone who has and wants to do horrible things, and no morals that killing your dad is bad.
>>736488653He was, the debates were annoying. I'd take them in a heartbeat with how cucked canon Luke is.>>736491229Dovin basals aren't real black holes
>>736514201iirc actual passive precognition wasn't fully established until tpm, before that the closest thing in the ot was having visions about events
>>736492902Shatterpoint for Mace Windu in space Vietnam kino.
This galaxy sucks I'm going to smoke some deathsticks and fuck purple women.
>>736489418Jokes on him, I already bondburgered her last night
>>736488730He defeated the rancor
>>736514423The helmet was supposed to demonstrate the force guiding someone's actions. It wasn't outright called precognition but it was functionally the same.
>>736506491>Hell something terrible like Rise of Skywalker still sadly feels like SW.this is how anyone knows you're lying btw
>>736514201Part of it is just that The Force can do whatever the fuck it wants but some people actively fight against it to the point it can't or doesn't want to intervene. Han has a hard time moving a lightsaber at all, but it looks like he's trying to pick up a very heavy object. Maybe Luke is using telekinesis to move it where he wants.
>>736514565the cave was fucky, i don't know if i would count it as jedi powers alone, yoda even says that the cave has a strong dark side presence
>>736510263Midichlorians at least have the excuse of potentially being correlation eith high force potential, rather than causation.>B-but the film saysUnreliable Narrator. Science showed that Midichlorians appeared in Jedi blood, so Jedi accepted the theory that they're what speaks to the will of the force, instead of being force-sensitive bacterium.
>>736514565>trust in the force>let it guide your hands>deflect fucking blaster bolts and shit with it, cool>just let go and let the force take the wheel and you turn into a master, awe-worthy swordsman with a laser sword>one day, like an absolute dickhead, the force just decides to drop your ass and help the other guy instead of you>die like a bitch from itnever understood why they would suggest doing this
>>736513485Vitiate was a Jobber who relied too much on the force to be a good sith.Palpatine took the Galaxy with a mostly mundane series of events.
The Force is like a river of life, Jedi go with the flow and use the currents to take them as nature intended. Sith fuck with the river, they pollute it, build dams, let it stagnate anything so long as they can exude better control over it. In this sense, you can think of the Sith as an order of metaphorical beavers
>>736515017>caring about petty 'rulership' as an end goalyour ignorance as as profound as your pathetic obsession with status, sheev
>>736515493Vitilate spitting hypocracy as usual these days.
>>736515614>sheev is unable to understand rulership and empire as a means to an end rather than an end itselfsheev exposing just how very lesser he is as usual these days
>>736514252Vegere did not teach that the Dark Side did not exist, Vegere taught that the Dark Side as a spectre of Corrupting Force did not exist, and that instead each person had a Dark Side to them.
>>736488730He literally blew up the Death Star, and later defeated probably the strongest combatant in the galaxy.
Visually the original trilogy don't translate the power of force users because of the limitations at the time, especially in Episode 4 where the only lightsaber fight involved old ass Obi Wan. You can really tell that Lucas always wanted jedi fights to involve a lot of acrobatics as early as Empire. The endgame is probably wuxia style Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon choreography
