any fucking questions?
why does the axe beat the lance?
>>736584887I feel like these should be the opposite direction. No way medium (sword) beats heavy (axe) and longer range (lance) should always beat heavy (axe)
>>736585049If it was realistic the spear would just beat everything.
beats beats beats beats in my head
>>736584956OP is mistaken: axe beats tree, and tree beats lance
Wouldn't the type of armor be a much more important consideration here?Also who the fuck would use a lance if they're not mounted?
>>736584887ok, but where do bows, magic, and ninja stars fit into this
Lance outranges and outspeeds axe, kiting them. Axe outranges sword and is stronger than them, just simply raping them. Sword is faster than lance and can close in the distance and kill them before lance does.
why do you have a lance instead of nunchaku? dishonest image
>>736585235>bowsBeaten by guns.>magicBeaten by guns.>ninja starsBeats guns.
>>736584956I don't know the actual answer, but I'm going to say because of the chop force or something.
>>736585135Spears beat sword and axes without armorArmor beats them all, especially spearsGuns beat armorYou can also stick a bayonet in to turn your gun into a spearSo the meta is guns vs guns
>>736584956Because you can turn it sideways and use it as a shield to stop a lance
>>736584956>Sword has more flexible fighting style than axe, axe has to commit to each swing>Axe can hook or knock aside thrusts of spear, maybe break shaft>Spear outranges swordThat's the way I always took it
>>736585324What the fuck?
>>736585375Against armor you swap over to blunt force, a staff, which you handle in a nearly identical way. I'll take a staff over a mace, which is the closest thing you can give an axe and sword user I guess.
>>736585443what
>My weapon > weapon>Lance best weapon>Lance > all
>>736585235>bowsBows outrange everything. They can kill lances, magic and ninja stars in one shot but not sword and axe. Very long reload time.>magicShorter ranged than bows but enough burst damage to kill sword before needing to recharge mana. Moves slowly after running out of mana.>ninja starsVery fast. Kills shorter ranged units by kiting them. Faster than sword. Gets raped by bows and magic outranging them.
>>736585513>Beast beats gunAustralia loses one war against some birds and suddenly animals think they are hot shit.
>>736585513>moon cancer
>>736585417>Spear outranges swordI saw a good demo of this on /gif/ once. It was so hard for the sword guy to even get close enough to tag.
>>736585469I'd go with halfswording for greater control and try to pole in the gaps of the armor>what about mordhauno
>>736585443Fate bullshit. They're for classes with super attacks, magic resistance, luck stats, etc.
>>736585513fateshit
axe beats shield beats bow beats lance beats sword beats axe
>>736585513>sword beasts lance for some fucking reason>berserker which supposedly trades off sanity for power actually has everyone doing 2x dmg to themwhat a retarded system
>>736585513gunner? did we finally get a gunner?
>3hrt thread got nuke>no transithea poster for 3 days kek.
>>736585669when I read FSN I barely read any of the stat pages, I get the impression that it's all pointless fluff because I could tell who would win each fight based on the story alone
>>736585368ironically lances are better at killing an enemy in a single hit than axes
>>736585628The reach is too strong.In boxing and MMA people stress over 2 cm of reach, now imagine the difference a whole meter of reach makes.
>>736585689>sword beats lanceSaber class beats Lancer class. If I remember right from FSN, Saber class is high all-around stats with good magic resist. Lancer is basically a lower-stat saber with a better special attack, which is usually some kind of magic bullshit.Berserker class gets a built-in crazy stat boost in exchange for no smarts. It prolly balances out a bit.
>>736585880again wtf is the point of a stat boost if you're only dealing 1.5x damage while everyone else is dealing 2x damage to you, it's a retarded as shit system, also, great special move there with the gay bulge guaranteed kill attack that somehow never works
>>736585235In FE Fates, bows are axe equivalent and beat lances and ninja stars, magic is sword equivalent and beats axes and bows, and ninja stars are lance equivalent and beat swords and magic.There's no real logic to it besides trying to work bows and tomes into the weapon triangle.
>>736585129Kek
>>736586016This is a medieval weapons thread.
>>736585829His statements are pretty ironic from a gameplay perspective too, because the majority of the enemies in the game are way too bulky to be one-tapped without lucky crits. He's a typical high strength, low speed build, so there aren't many enemies he can attack more than once anyway, and the enemies he might be able to one-tap are the frailest ones like mages, which don't require armor to protect against in the first place.
>>736586130Bohemian Earspoon beats lesser polearms
>>736586680Reminds me of the Sword Spear from Elden Ring.
>>736586560Yeah you don't really OKHO much in FE7, however you do get some brave weapons to 2-hit-killThe most dangerous enemies in the game are the luna druids, who bypass resistance and have high critical hit rates. You want to either kill them with a brave weapon or weaken with a longbow and finish with one more hit.
>>736586820Or a winged spear, or a partisan, or a spontoon...A lot of weapons are similar in both their form and function, differing only by their origin.Convergent polearm evolution is real, I tell you.
>>736584887Yeah, when does Rhea beat my dick?
>>736585417>Sword has more flexible fighting style than axe, axe has to commit to each swingIf you fight like a retard, maybe>Axe can hook or knock aside thrusts of spear, maybe break shaftKek, good luck trying to do any of that>Spear outranges swordSure, it also outranges the axe
>scythe beats all three
>>736587808I will now play your game.
>>736587869I have a scythe in my game but it looks like this.
>>736587869download a save file if you play on psp, the 'hard mode' (aka the only difficulty on gba) is locked
>>736587913Sorry, but I only care about the fake scythes.
>>736587962Should I play on PSP? Is that the best version?
>>736585628Spear/polearms are the clear best weapon of choice in pretty much every scenario.
>>736587995I only played GBA and PSP, I don't know anything about the newer releases
>>736585513>Caster is effective against Assassin>Assassin resists CasterThis doesn't make any sense
>>736585728No, this is just a meme. Outside of the seven standard classes and the Extra Classes used for FGO, there's also a handful of other nonstandard classes. Some classes, like Savior are "extra special" classes that would normally never appear in a Holy Grail War due to being as overpowered as Grands. In fact, Saviors are practically just another flavor of Beast in a sense.Stuff like Gunners are just "normal" nonstandard classes designed to take the place of one of the standard classes. It's not really that special. The most common theory is that it's just Archer with Riding instead of Magic Resistance.
Swords are neutral, axe is better when you attack people below you, and spears are better when your enemy is above. Also shadows beat commons, commoms beat dolls, and dolls beat shadows.
>>736587964All scythes in video games are fake.
>>736588237300IQ tactics chad
>>736588274Isn't the one anon posted an actual farming tool? I've seen that one in the Souls games. Well, if I remember right the actual farming tool is shorter.
>>736586004It's purely a gameply thing. It's not meant to reflect the actual lore. In the game, Berserkers are actually one of the most practical classes because the game heavily favors offense over defense. Some of the most valued Servants are still Berserkers to this day. It's always been one of the best classes.Bear in mind, this game doesn't have PvP.
>>736587808unfathomably based
>>736588237What game is that?
>>736588303People would make improvised polearms out of scythes by attaching the head sideways like that.It's got more reach, and a sharp point on top of the regular edge.
>>736588274Don't worry guys, I speak fluent Baguette.Hmm... Uh huh. Yeah. Right. Got it.It says,>"Now where could my pipe be?"
>>736588513GARFIELD
>>736584887this isn't truelance is for better range and being defensive with poke capabilitysword is all rounder, jack of all master of noneaxe is for high strike damage but forces you into animation locks
>>736588391Kartia
>>736584956In reality an axe is kind of a shitty weapon, especially compared to a sword or a lance, and really REALLY shitty compared to a halberd
>>736588708Kinda looks like Front Mission.
>>736584887Large swords/zweihander should beat lance actually, since they're literally made to do that
>>736588708>Amano artHoly based! I need to check that out.
>>736588593Spears the all rounder. Swords for indoors/ceremony only, axes are for peasants.
>>736588827Amano did the designs for both
Swords are always worthless because they have low damage output and frequently equipped by low STR classes, and the high STR classes would rather be equipping Lances or Axes anyway because most FE games load up on Lances after midgame anyway. Only time Swords are good is the first few chapters because dumb stupid bandits all use Axes and have poor stats all around.That's why most Lords are sword locked because you wouldn't use them otherwise. Hell in some games you don't even need to use your Lord for anything but map objectives and the occasional recruitment.
>>736589184Swords are good in basically every game.
>>736589184>>736589232Swords were the best weapon type up until the end of the Kaga era
>>736589232They were good in earlier games when accuracy and weapon weight mattered more. Now accuracy is so easy to boost that it’s pointless for a weapon to be more accurate.
>>736589567They still have their uses but I agree that over the years swords have lost a lot of the things that made them good. Three Houses has it really bad, Engage did a bit better. I find them good in Fates, though I wish I had a lot of the Katanas in Conquest.
>>736584887Do you know why? Sword + Board is always OP and default way to play.
It's funny that swords are bad largely because of hot dog-sandwich semantic distinction. Obviously throwing knives are essentially throwable swords, but IS is squeamish about this idea and treats them as their own weapon when and if they appear. Thus swords are forever gimped because they lack this ESSENTIAL quality of a physical 1-2 range option. All because we can't think of "short knife" as a type of sword.
>>736585513this would be awesome if it was all completely illegiblelike remove saber/archer/lancer/gunner and you got a blue and orange morality-esque set-up
>>736589774>game that introduces throwing knives has two very good 1-2 range swords
>>736589774the weapon types are too similar nowI liked having magic swords as the ranged option
>>736589834>very goodpushing it a bit, anonand then they never brought them back anyway
>>736584887the meme that axes are "heavy weapons" isn't even true. actual axes require much more finesse
>>736589774The problem is even when they do exist, you’d rather have a lance or axe since they hit harder. We need to return to garbage FE6 hit rates without any way to boost them for swords to be good again.
>>736589871I was talking about Siegfried and the Levin Sword, I'm not willing to call the Kodachi very good either, and the Wakizashi is only 1-2. Leo's Iceblade has Silver penalties. I think that's it?
>>736589918>the Wakizashi is only 1-2The Wakizashi is only 2 range*.
>>736589918Nigra, Tellius introduced throwing knives and physical 1-2 range swords. I thought you were talking about RD. Fates didn't do anything new except make everything that already existed in FE bad and useless. Prfs and magic blades don't count.
*dodges**doubles you**crits*The scariest bosses in FE are swordmasters. Their only weakness is the lack of good ranged weapons.
>>736590002Oh yeah, RD did have 1-2 range knives, didn't it?
>>736590003What about kite and sword type?
>>736588816To be fair, Halberds are considered axes in FE.
>>736590186What are the maces then and how do they fit in? Just heavier swords?
>>736590234They're Axes in Fates.
>>736590254Huh??? That don't make sense. Considering european historicity and the way people trained; You trained with clubs to get better with swords (striking harder), you trained with weighted wands/staves (now barbells) to get better at polearms/two handers/grappling.
>>736590362Actually, Clubs are also Axes.
>>736590424Club is a generic term for maces and weapons that you bash others heads in with But yeah, that's extremely dumb.
>>736590003Berserkers can do that too while also not being a frail piece of paper.
>>736590523The weapon triangle is definitely just a gameplay contrivance.
>>736590568And it still don't make sense. Here's a smarter one.
>>736590627Some goals of the weapon triangle are to promote dynamic choices in combat and giving value to carrying multiple weapons. Since bow and magic users are generally frail, this triangle would have some consequences for that design goal, essentially sword/club units would be totally dominant in melee while spear/polearm units counter the counter to them. It's not that there's a problem with that, it's just different than what IS has tried to achieve with the weapon triangle over the series.
>>736590627Where are axes bro?
>>736590886Axes really are a shitty weapon.
In langrisser it's usuallyswordsmen (& axes) > pikemen > cavalry > swordsmen
>>736591136I like that triangle.
>>736590627AXE AND FIST
>>736590886Spears and Polearms, you cuck.
>>736584887>weapons beat weaponsSo what's armor for?
>>736591263Taking less damage.
>>736591263see the image in >>736585368
>>736584887wrong, halberd beats everything
>>736591202>FIST
>>736590560He's right. Swordmasters on thrones are often the most annoying bosses in the series.
>>736591484>6 StrGeez, stop bragging about your above average Lyn.
>>736591484The only time you will ever see Lyn ORKOing. I guess the sword was holding ehr back.
>>736591338Nah, halberds are clunky and shit.>Kite and Stick.>Blocks your halberd strike and whacks you over the head with the stick; you are dead.LOL.
>>736590560Berserker bosses are mogged by swordies in every game they exist in
Marriage with Marianne!
Decent crossbow is a weapon of mass destruction. We could have realistic weaponry if the economy would be realistic. Bg3 has powerful artifacts selling for the price of 2 pizzas and 3 pea soups.
>>736591536which swordmasters?I would have said mage bosses with siege tomes are the most annoying, e.g. ishtore
>>736584887>>736584956Axes are fuckstrong and snaps lance like a twig. Lance outranges sword. Sword swings faster/more agile than giant chunk of metal. That's how I understood it as a kid.
>>736584887Lance straight up outclasses both sword and axe, that triangle makes no fucking sense.
>>736591835NTA but Kel/Carlyle are both pretty annoying and notable swordmaster bosses
Any questions?
>>736585324What game is this, super opposite land
>>736585235bows are axes
>>736590869That's why floaters and mount units will always be the most OP and wanted if there's ranged options combined with them because they will help support the rest of the crew and overall just dominate the battlefield with aerial superiority. I'm just basing it on most common tropes in wargames and roleplaying game meta as well as medieval slasher games. The way to out do sword and club shield cunts is to surround them with the other options or fire from far. That's why you would have a stack of spear guys for one knight to counter them. Its pure logic.
>>736592008>hooks your lance and disarms youWhat now, lance bitch?
>>736592463I have a pole, my grip is stronger, if anything I hook your shitty axe away and stab you so hard that my lance goes all the way through you.
>>736592463fishing rod main, i kneel
>>736592737They should bring that weapon back.
>>736592250Fate grand order
>>736592941Now showcase the "long and short explanation" meme of the convoluted Fate series. Its seriously worse than Harry Potter level of writing sometimes.
>>736585324Imma gonna assassinate a horse
>>736593071Are you going to turn it into glue or mettwurst after?
>>736585628They were overpowered as fuck in historical war for a reason. If not for archers/artillery then defensive pike walls would have been an invincibility hack for middle ages warfare.
>>736592796I don't get itSome FE games have extra weak joke weapons, but FE11 does not. that's just a forged javelin
>>736584956it makes sense when you think about the characters/classes associated with each weapon. sword is noble lords and heroes who trump the brutish thugs and pragmatic warriors that use axes, who can outfight/suckerpunch the rigid lance users who are used to more regimented/"honorable" warfare
>>736584956According to FE6, the weapons' weight distributions is what creates the weapon triangle. I assume axes win against lances because they can effectively hook them due to being top heavy.>But muh reachAxes in FE include hammers and halberds, so they're not necessarily short weapons
>>736593612Does raise the question as to the efficacy of using a polearm with an axe head. Like, just because you can chop wood with a log splitter doesn't inherently mean you'd be good with a long polearm. In this essay I will discuss why the weapon level skill was the superior version...
>>736592139Both get cheesed by 2 range, since range swords kept getting gimped at 2 range in GBA emblem instead of being allowed to be normal weapons.
>>736593750*weapon level STAT, whoops
>>736592169I guess the logic for this is>Swords outspeed and outmaneuver both axes and bows, which are slown down by the physics necessary to use them>Tomes have a intellect beats brawn factor to them ig>Axes beat lances by hooking them to overpower them, and beat hidden weapons by overpowering them straight up>Bows beat lances and hidden weapons by outranging them>Lances beat swords by outranging them, and beat tomes by preventing them from building distance for their spellcasting>Hidden weapons beat swords by being even faster/more dexterous than them and beat tomes by striking before they can cast their spells
Give me some intresting Alear builds for my next playthrough. I don't know what to do with him other than being a carry.
>>736594127Corrin engrave killer bow sniper. He's going to be behind people for his personal anyway. You can also pass that to Lindon if you lose interest
>>736593071>>736593083KEK
>>736594127General gaming or bust
weapon triangle is too ingrained with the series to be changed, but I think it would make sense something like this: swords are low weight so they're likely to double, but have the lowest might. lances are all 1-2 range so you can get no retaliation hits in player phase, but they're heavy and unlikely to double. axes have the highest damage, but come with an inherent penalty that always makes them hit last.>>736589774there were magic swords for 1-2 range but for some reason they decided to prune all but one of them.>>736590869it's pointless though since most of the time you don't get to choose which weapons you're fighting against. if a reinforcement army of lance knights show up and your axe user is on the other side of the map you aren't going to run him over to fight them. you use what you have at hand and if it's disadvantaged you just have to power through it with stats.
>>736585129But then who was phone?
>>736585129And I beat cheeks.
Marry your full blood sibling
>>736584887Yes by what logic does axe beat spear?Spear would wipe the floor with both those weapons if all weapons were in trained hands.
>>736594709Bow would wipe the floor with anything but IS knew our superiority from the start and nerfed us
>>736584887
>>736587760No he's right, axes are better for hacking but a sword is better build for long slices, saws and stabs
Lance should beat all melee weapons.
>>736594741I can’t imagine a more painful nerf than being shackled to GBA archers.
>>736594858I can't imagine anything better
>>736584956Lances are very philosophically close to trees.
>>736594912Reminder that Awakening had the log and Fates had the pine branch as joke lance weapons
>>736584887>Pavise+What now?
>>736594127Shit eating doggo knight with Sigurd for turbo movement.
lance beats both in the real world
Pink Leif
Conquest relay?
>>736596947start it
>>736584887why are you gay
>>736596947No
>>736587808That is the gayest shit. Not touching that game.
>>736584956Because it's simply superiorThe better question is why axe doesn't also beat sword
>>736585324>Caster are mages that hide within their HQ>Assassins are specialist of infiltration>Rider are mounted warriors for open field.>Assassins > Rider > Caster > Ass.?????
>>736585546>bow>reload time
>>736585091polearms lose to everything in 1v1. you get exactly one chance to hit your opponent and then your weapon becomes useless.
>>736584887what if hes got a bunch?what if hes got a pointed stick?
>>736600340Caster's strongest domain is his/her HQ. Assassin loses because you basically gave them enough prep time.
All of these match ups are contingent on the battlefield. Discussing them in a vacuum is a joke.
>>736585091>cuts your spear in half
>>736584887IRL it's >Greatsword (specialist formation breaker)Beats>Lance/halberd (evolved professional soldier weapons)Beats>Sword (handy sidearm)(only if good quality and used with training)Beats>Axe/spear (cheap shit for mass peasant levies and barbarians)
range is everything in melee combat so of course spears and other weapons in that category destroy the fuck out of everything else, but then devs have to balance out things to make an interesting game which is why they end up not feeling as powerful most of the time, same thing for video game shotguns which often start losing effectiveness after 2ft of distance
>>736603713I love slugs but I totally get why games don't include them.
>>736594127wolf knight avoid tank bonded shield battery.a swords with one for all is basically guaranteeing a hit with a silver blade, which you won't use too often, but it's handy when you do. alternatively sword power + roy in divine dragon but use the boots on alear instead of seadall.
>>736602767>Greatsword (specialist formation breaker)Has been tried, in some scenarios with some degree of success, but ultimately it didn't work reliably and often just got the swordsmen impaled unceremoniously>Lance beats swordagree>sword beats axeI guess so. In a 1v1 swords typically have a reach advantage, and in formation, axes work poorly due to them needing more space for swinging. Swords can do thrusts. Axes are also a poor defensive weapon due to how they are balanced compared to swords. >sword beats spearNo. Spear has more reach. The fact it is a cheaper weapon doesn't make it automatically inferior, that is stupid consoomer logic. In 1v1 a spear will likely beat a sword with superior reach, and in formation the advantage of spears is even more pronounced. In the end of the day a spear is just a shorter lance. It's reach advantage is therefore a bit less strong, but in turn it is more flexible in how it can be used (quarter staff techniques). If we add shields in 1v1 the table flipps in favor of the sword. For the swordsman, the shield just adds protection, without any serious tradeoff. For the Spear guy, the shield comes with a heavy tradeoff: He can use his spear with only one hand, shortening it's effective reach substantially and making it overall harder to use well, because the leverage that his offhand provided on the shaft is gone, making it slower, less accurate, limiting its versatility (quarterstaff stuff) and making it easy to knock out of the way. The table flips yet again, if we are talking about spear + shield in formation.
>>736584887Romans conquered the world with swords, ergo sword rules, everything else drools.
>OP items ruins meticulous game balance
>>736600263>x beats y if it is not just x but x paired with ywoah
>>736606546romans conquered the world with training, discipline and superior logistics and tactics. They also didn't just use swords. They threw their pilae before engaging, weakening the enemy formation by making their shields unwieldy/useless. They also used slings to decimate foes before melee combat started. Every roman legionary had a sling in his inventory and was trained in using it. And lets not forget their huge shields. Their swords were strong in combination with all of this, not by themselfes, so saying "swords > everything" because romans is kind of dishonest. Also, it's not like swords vanished from history after the fall of rome. If they are so strong, why didn't anyone else just conquer the world again, using swords?
>>736602264https://youtu.be/uLLv8E2pWdk=103Raped and moggedSpears beat everything There's a reason every army in Earth gave a million soldiers this to go fight wars and win.
>>736608206Romans conquered swathes of land with swordsSwords became shit when armour got better, they were great before then
>>736602602>>736585324>>736600340Assassin > anyone, if their target doesn't know they are a target. If they do, but they don't know when and how, assassin can still win, but with various levels of difficulty, depending on their targets caution and perception. If their target somehow knows when the assassin strikes and is prepared, the assassin is absolutely fucked. So Caster > assassin if caster has reliable future sightOtherwise, if the caster is not a trained battle mage who also has some kind of sixth sense, it's assassin > caster
>>736588816True, but most peasants had one available to them
>>736608285>Swords became shit when armour got better, they were great before thenand spears can just phase through armor?
>>736585123Came here for this.
>>736608457No, but the cheapness value became a lot more important. There was just no reason anymore to use swords when they were as effective as a spear and used 10 times the ironI'm not anti-spear or anything, but I think people have overcorrected and are shitting on swords too hard now. Realistically pic related would mog both during the peak of ironclad knights
>>736606684wrong!
>>736584956you can throw the axe
>>736608682Spears are completely useless in close quarters (i.e grappling). Swords aren't too shabby in close quarters since you can half-sword. War hammers aren't great in close quarters either since you need space to wind up your attacks. Therefore, I believe the ideal loadout for an ironclad knight would be a long war hammer and a dagger of some kind. But if you could only pick 1 weapon I'd go for a sword.
>>736608758>pike (spear) beats billhook (axe)>zweihander (sword) beats pike (lance)wtf is the triangle the wrong way around?
>>736608342No.
>>736606484Spear wins if they have the space to leverage their reach or its formation combat. They lose in tight spaces. That's why everyone carried some sort of melee weapon to use for those instances.
>>736609974The Scottish soldiers lost, so isn't the Billhook better?
