What happened to game translations? In the 90's a "bad translation" was when sequels translated by different people didn't share names/terminology. Now, "translations" are just made in bad faith. Localisation =/= projection.
>>736897661>In the 90's a "bad translation" was when sequels translated by different people didn't share names/terminology.lol lmao
Yeah, I care a lot about localization translations
>>736897742working designs was based.
>>736897661Both are wrong. Fragile male has nothing to do with a tsundere attitude, and using tsundere as-is doesn't mean anything if you aren't a weeb and might as well b alienspeak.
>>736897831>if you aren't a weebNext you will tell me that only weebs know what a ninja is
>>736897853False equivalence.
>>736897831Bro who is playing a VN if not weeaboos?
How is a normal english speaker supposed to know what "tsundere" means? Ask your coworker or grocery clerk what she thinks of the line "I'm here, you tsundere bastard." Guess what - they wouldn't know. It's a terrible translation.
>>736897831I agree that just keeping "tsundere" would be bad since 99% of English speakers haven't got a clue what that even is unless weeb but it's also hard to translate because there is no direct English equivalent. How do you think it should be translated?
>>736897831I wouldn't use "tsundere" in a typical translation either, but it's commonly used in English enough that the reader probably knows it like they know "sushi" and "karaoke."
>>736898037Nah no way.
Speaking of AI: this thread, for the 295th time, with an MD5 hash changedo NOT reply to me unless you've got a recipe for muffins attached
>>736897742You mean this isn't faithful?
>>736897937>>736897989>Engage with foreign media>Encounter foreign conceptsWOW HOW SHOULD I KNOW?!-Internet age
>>736898054very constructive
>>736898104It's a translation. That means it's in English, not Japanese. "All according to keikaku" is hack shit.
>>736898146make a one word english translation for tsundere as a personality type
>>736898069I actually like their Popful Mail translation. It's such a light hearted unserious game that I don't care about the pop culture references. Making Mail a huge cunt was funny tooTheir Lunar translations are awful though
>>736898210Or write it in a way that makes sense to an English speaker.
>>736898104bro has never read a translated book before
>>736898069AI could never create a translation this soulful
>>736897831thundere is literally a word with prefix and postfix connotations that registers in Japanese even if you haven't exactly heard "tsun-dere" before. It doesn't work in English unless you already have a frame of reference for what the hell a "tsundere" means.
>>736898054A grandmother probably won't know what tsundere means. She's not likely to play The House in Fata Morgana, etiher.
>>736898326Most people wouldn't unless they are a weeb. They will know sushi and karaoke but fuck no will they know tsundere.
>>736897989tsundere and if you disagree you are part of the the problem>>736898234bro has never read a serious translation beforewtf do you think the glossary is for numbnuts?oh yeah, you are an illiterate subhuman
>>736898326I also don't know what "la c'est la vie" means but that doesn't stop it being stuffed into everything.
>>736897661i will fucking END you
I'd translate it as "disingenuous bastard".
>>736898405Your way of absolute literal translation results in boring robotic slop in English. For it to be enjoyable it needs to read naturally in English.
>>736897989>"There's just no way to translate "tsundere"."Hard to get, slow to warm up to, gruff exterior with a soft interior(male), hiding your true feelings. There's so many fucking ways to say the same idea in English. Only retarded weebs think that it's hard to translate. Learn English, instead of jerking off over half-translations.
>>736898416It literally means "that's life". You fucking moron.
I've been on 4chan daily since 2007 and I have no idea what tsundere means even though I've seen it hundreds of times. That being said, that fragile male ego line is stupid and far worse
>>736898472So write the line and make it not sound shit.
>>736897853Someone reading a visual novel with European-named characters doesn’t need to know what “tsundere” means. It might make sense in the Japanese version, because those English characters are all speaking Japanese there, but imagine you’re in England in 1603 and someone calls you a tsundere bastard.
There are plenty of words that don't have neat and tidy english equivalence, and we're acting like the Internet doesn't exist. If a piece of media says 'Schadenfreude', I can easily just google it and expand my vocabulary. People reading these VNs aren't children.
>>736898512I got the correct translation.>Why, hello there.>How's your fragile male ego holding up?
>>736898512I don't know the context of what else was said before after, and who is being spoken to, who is speaking, or the events that have taken place.I'd need to know all that to choose one of the dozens of ways to say it.
>>736898518Who the fuck cares? It's not your story to change into something unfitting "fragile male ego".
>>736897742Fuck off zoomer. Working Designs was absolute peak.
>>736897831So.. what the other guy said. If you saw the word and didn't know what it meant you can take a moment to look it up and learn something.
Anyone playing this game should expect weeb terms. It's not like some normie is cracking open a bear and playing this
>>736898518If the word tsundere was actually there, than than it's a 4th wall break for the sake of conveniently quickly describing a character. If the OG writer didn't give a fuck about authenticity in this moment, the localizer sure doesn't have to.
>>736898416Are you like five years old? "c'est la vie" is so common in English that it's practically a loan phrase at this point.
>>736898618Or they could actually make a good translation and the megaweebs who want Japanese can go play the Jap version.
>>736898671
>>736898468it can't be read naturally in english, it's not an english work. it's not created by, or meant to appeal to the sensibilities of a foreigner.a translation is always a translation and it can't be anything else.deal with it you anti-intellectual faggot.
>>736898656>the localizer sure doesn't have to.The writer is the writer, it's their work. The localizer doesn't have any rights to n it like that, their job is to just translate as accurately as possible, not make shit up on the fly
>>736898226I like it too. Mainly because it's filled with joy instead of being jam-packed with hate for their target audience, source material and original culture.
>>736898610Man I remember looking up English words in the dictionary growing up and it's very much my native language. Do people just not look things up anymore.
>>736898728Oh it can. In another life I was part of various manga scanlation groups and making the dialogue not sound like boring shit in English was half my job.
>>736898747A lot of adults nowadays lose their inner children and turn into ignorant midwits who get extremely defensive and mad when they find something they don't know. “If I don't know, then it was not that important and you're wrong.” They literally refuse to yearn for knowledge. It's sad.
>>736898675'Fragile male ego' isn't a good translation. That's the issue. Hell, call tsundere a 'sour-sweet attitude'. It gives a better understanding of the meaning. But localizers just do shit like this and adding meaning where there was none in the first place.
>>736898146>"All according to keikaku" is hack shit.sure it sounds retarded when used for simple things, but words with specific contextual implications cannot be translated if it just doesn't exist in the target language.Japanese has fucktons of english loanwords for this exact reason, it can and should work the other way around too.
>>736897907How so? They're both Japanese terms that have broken the language barrier after decades of cultural exports.>ok but some people still don't know what a tsundere isDo said people play visual novels?
>>736898810True that could probably have been better but that doesn't make keeping obscure Japanese terms without so much as an explanation the correct choice either. I thought about "two-faced" which is close but still not quite the right connotation. Would need the context of the sentence to do better though.
>>736897937Anon you fail to realize games should be for MY pleasure.The moment they tried to appeal to a wider and wider audience was the moment the industry became shit.
>>736897661https://x.com/Johann_CK/status/1945124399851692301https://www.frontlinejp.net/2025/12/07/behind-the-english-script-of-lover-kiss-translator-discusses-process-and-practice/>>Replacing "onii-chan" with "big bro" mangles any meaning and nuance and reads plain ridiculous in English.
>>736897831>using tsundere as-is doesn't mean anything if you aren't a weebThen why are you consuming weeb media? You do realise translator's notes were always a thing? Open up the fucking kamarazov brothers, that has them. The lack of cultural education on your end is your fucking problem.
>>736898876Visual novels are not that niche anymore anon. The bubble has burst.
>>736898234I've read KJV and they didn't translate manna as mystic sustenance lol.
>>736898852If you are going to borrow the word you need to define it somewhere so people understand it, not just drop it in.
>>736897661>takes weeks to write a single line of dialogueCan't whine about being replaced with that work ethic.
The real redpill here is that both options suck. Morgana and Jacopo wouldn't know what tsundere is and thus wouldn't say it, but she also wouldn't use fragile male ego because that is a term also not of their era.
>>736897661>literal trannylator makes up idpol bullshit instead of what the translated text actually said
>>736898952The game was written by a Japanese person and first released in Japanese, so they would know it, because Japanese is the only language the world speaks in that universe.
>>736898593>>736898810>'Fragile male ego' isn't a good translation. That's the issue.Why is it bad?
>>736898598>Working Designs was absolute peak.Fuck off
>>736897989>>736898472Depending on context(I don't know a thing about this game or its characters,) you can also say shit like "hardboiled"(if they're a tough fucker with a softy side that comes out as the dere,) etc, sarcasm like "grumpy ol fuck" for a guy who's usually a pain in the ass but really nice to certain kinds of people, etc.It's true that "tsundere" doesn't translate as a catch-everything word, but there's usually an english equivelent or close-enough for specific archetypes. Same is probably true of most languages.There's almost never a situation where you're going to be able to justify just making shit up that isn't equivelent like the whinelator in OP did. If you can't find the word, it's because you're shit at both your language and creative thinking, and shouldn't be doing the work to start with.
>>736898905You think visual novels are less niche in the west than the word "tsundere"?
>>736899078They're trolling dude. Don't worry about it.
>>736897661Why can't these "localizers" just put a TL note next to tsundere to explain it?
>hurrrr why is the translator leaving things untranslated that isn't how translations work!
>>736899059Tsundere isn't a term that describes males. It's a character type. Even saying 'fragile ego' would have been better, but it'd still miss the mark that the tsundere character type is both harsh and loving in a two-sided fashion.
>>736899194What's that beside "1" at the bottom?
>>736899180Because TL notes coming up all the time would look goofy as fuck.
>>736899361I've read English fiction that is LOADED with annotations, and with good reason.
>>736899396It breaks the flow of the conversation.
>>736899361The most popular book in the world has notations. That's the bible by the way.
>>736897661>playing VN shitcouldn't be me
>>736899426Imagine a film where there was some narrator who kept butting in to explain some random shit about the scene while the characters were talking. It would fucking suck.
>>736899465It's a book. You read it. Books aren't supposed to 1:1 translate to movies.
>>736899412Still a net positive.
>>736897661Is this from the prequel?
>>736899525It's a scene like a film. A dialogue between two characters. The narrator butting in to explain what "doki doki uguuu" means while the characters are facing off with the boss or whatever would be absolute immersion breaking bullshit.
>>736899280So why not leave tsundere and add a TL note instead of doing a blatantly incorrect "translation" injected with faggot progressive mindrot?Every day you subhumans whine about AI taking your jobs I am filled with righteous catharsis. I hope you starve and die.
>>736899661see>>736899583It breaks the 4th wall.
>>736899583You're describing a book. Books do that. Have you never read a book before? Do you just skip the paragraphs of descriptions/exposition to just the quotes?
>>736898921sure,I think loanwords and notes/pointers to it's meaning are the ideal solution but you won't see those because it's much easier to just morph it into something that's vaguely similar if you squint at it whilst drunk.I don't think there should be emphasis on the audience understanding the loanword, but moreso grasping the context it's used it and the implications it carries.
>>736899686You know what doesn't break the fourth wall?>I'm here, you capricious bastard.Yet these retards spent weeks on this one line and landed on American culture war nonsense, LMAO.
>>736899720see>>736899686Do you know what breaking the 4th wall is? That's when the writer suddenly butts in and goes "Hi I'm the writer and I'm here to remind you this is a fictional story I'm writing". You don't do it because it breaks immersion and so spoils your enjoyment of the story. You are making entertainment not writing a dissertation.
>>736899583If you see a word you don't understand, either look it up or try to guess from context.
>>736899773Is The Karamazov Brothers a dissertation? Fuck off, retard.
>>736899813It's translated at the bottom of the page retard.
>>736899761Still misses that the character is putting up a front. "Moody lover" would make more sense
>>736899773>They brought Jesus to the place called Golgotha (which means “the place of the skull”)>Mark 15:22
>>736899809The player should not having to be looking up obscure Japanese words to enjoy your game.
>>736899826It's a TL note. you fucking creting. You know. like one of those you're bitching about "breaking the 4th wall".
>>736899904In that particular instance the character himself has intentionally used French and even then it has a translation at the bottom. You can get away with that in a book due to the format because it doesn't break the flow. You can't in a film or game.
>>736899956Visual novels are books
>>736897661We have a fucking word in English for Tsundere. Its fucking "coy" you would translate this as "I'm here, you coy bastard."
>>736899956VNs are not games.
>>736899970Nope, different format. Just like this isn't a book even though you're reading it.
>>736899972Legit the perfect translation.
>>736899979Yes they are. Just as much as a text adventure is a game.
>>736899851Also Sweet tart. Sour patch. The fact is, tsundere was a made up word that caught on in JP because it was immediately understandable to what it was describing. EN just needs to do that. Call the guy a sugar cube covered in salt. All it needs to do is to describe tsundere's 2 traits. Because that's what it literally is. Tsun and Dere.
>>736900027Some games are books, like how some games (Sony's) are movies.
>>736899991You are a debil11 - "Debil" generally means weak, feeble, or frail (derived from Latin debilis), but in Polish and Russian, it is used as a noun meaning an idiot, moron, or fool.
>>736897661I mean "tsundere" doesn't really fit fata's ambience I think, would be slightly immersion breaking.
>>736900050This is going to blow your mind, but even some actual paper books are games.
>>736899870As if you wouldn't just use a wiki anyway. Do you know how many obscure terms are used in video games just in mechanical jargon and lore? Like really?
Pure rewriting of history, translations largely sucked complete ass and had tons of stuff made up wholesale in the 90s even up to major releases like FF7 that got borderline incomprehensible at times. You just didn't have Twitter screencaps and culture wars to get mad about yet.
>>736900112As I said elsewhere you are making entertainment not assigning homework. Your game should be enjoyable to play for its intended audience (English speakers in this case) and its immersion is central to that.
>>736897661>twitter screencap with a tranny flagFuck off
>>736897831>The japanese author is wrong for being a japanese!Troonlizers in a nutshell people. Hang them all.
>>736900180If you want a movie, just watch a movie.
>>736900262Non sequitur. A game is meant to be entertainment. You are not going to come back after school, finish your actual homework, switch on the game and want to have it go "in scene 3 turn to page 54 of the textbook".
>>736900136Uhhh, why would you post a correctly translated image to make this point?
>>736900307If you don't find Japanese culture entertaining, don't play Japanese games.
>>736900180>>736900180>>736900307So you're the type of person who skips the tutorial directions and complains when they get stuck. Gotcha.
>>736900325If you want Japanese there is a Japanese version.
>>736900327No I'm the kind of person who makes robotic literal translations not suck to read.
>>736900347>just learn another language if you don't want to read bad faith fanfiction
>>736898894>>>Replacing "onii-chan" with "big bro" mangles any meaning and nuance and reads plain ridiculous in English.I don't think there's a reaction image that can convey how I feel right now.
>>736900395Yeah if you want Japanese go get it. The English speakers will get English instead.
>>736900371>I'm better than the translationNo you're not. it's not the 1990s anymore, old man. People know you're enshitifying games now by comparing info on the internet. You're not needed. Kys.
>>736900410I'd prefer an accurate translation, personally.
>>736900371It's a word. Once you learn it, you know it. It is not homework. I can say mitochondria and you'd know it's the powerhouse of the cell because you heard it and now know it. And you can proceed to never look it up again. You don't have an excuse unless you're a goldfish.
>>736900467Yeah I am because the translator isn't as good at English as I am and it is an English translation. This is not to say that you shouldn't try to preserve the character's meanings and intents, but a 1 to 1 literal translation sounds shit in English and is not very entertaining.
>>736900515You're talking to a gun and ball gamer who doesn't get any joy out of learning things, even passively. It's like they don't even have the ability to passively acquire information.
>>736900472This is actually hilarious
>>736900515Sorry faggot, we don't want games assigning us homework and if you try to you are a shit translator.
>>736900472Why do I as an Australian need to be subjected to American culture war bullshit when I play video games?
>>736899972NINTENDO HIRE THIS MAN unironically
>>736897661>In the 90's a "bad translation" was whenRetarded culture war obsessed zoomerIn 90s, localization teams literally changed character color to black, to make it more western friendly
>>736897661>Don't be so fickleThere you go, done. Just translated tsundere for you, why is that hard?
>>736900570Schadenfreude
>>736897661>tranny flagYup.
>>736900618Gesundheit.
>>736900535>Muh english is better>I'm better>Me>MENo. Stop begging.
>>736900593Because no English speaker should have to be subjected to this sexism Japan keeps spewing. Translations have to be made safe for the entire world.
>>736900316That's not correctly translated. First of all that ’ひと is what he's saying explicitly. The kanji 女性 is what he means. The meaning in english is reversed with him saying woman but meaning person. Secondly the 「 」 act as quotation marks. So in English, person needs to be emphasized in some way. Either with punctuation or something else. It's clearly emphasized so it likely matters for something. Lastly "most important" is downplaying it. とって一番大切 needs something a bit more exaggerated.
>>736900672Because I speak it natively and they don't.
>>736900649How dare you force me to look up this word and learn.
>>736900407retard
>>736900676This is so fucking cringe, holy shit.
>>736900472Wow what the fuck. Why is the AI assigning me homework? This isn't how entertainment should be...
>>736897742HOLY CHEESEBALLS! WORKING DESIGNS TRANSLATIONS!? I HAVEN'T SEEN MANGLING LIKE THAT SINCE OJ SIMPSON!
AHHHH NO I DON'T WANT TO LEARN NEW SHIT AND REMOVE ANY CULTURAL SHIT FROM ANOTHER PLACE FROM MAH VIDEOGAMES JUST GIVE ME JELLY DONUTS AND MAH POGGERSTEIN REFERENCES DEAD ASS FR FR NO CAP ON A STACK
>>736900697It means "bless you". You say it to somebody when they sneeze. 'Twas a joke.
>>736897812WD made games worse by cranking up their difficulty and adding questionable humor to their translations. People are fond of them only because JRPGs were an underserved niche. Much like animu fans can feel about Harmony Gold or 4Kids.
>>736897831The actual correct translation to keep the meaning would be using bipolar in place of tsundere but you can't do that now because that'd be discriminating against manic depressives (also it's called manic depression, bipolar is incorrect and a slur).
>>736897661Why not just say "hot-and-cold" or something like that?Katy Perry literally has a song about it and it was very popular. A tranny should definitely know that. It shouldn't take weeks of agonizing brainstorming to copy paste a Katy Perry lyric into a game that it doesn't belong in but that would nevertheless have been better than what they chose to go with as politically biased trannies who cannot resist the urge to insert their propaganda into places it doesn't belong.
NOOOOOOOOOO YOU ADD EXPLANATIONS FOR OBSCURE CULTURAL REFERENCES THAT RUINS THE FLOW
>>736897989Prickly
>>736897661Just say capricious. It's not 1:1 the same meaning as tsundere but it's close enough if you're desperate not to use the Japanese word.
>>736900689>>736900251
>>736900676Ace Attorney used to be the king of good localization.What the fuck happened
>>736900901If the Japs don't like it they can translate their own games.
>>736900943Good to know you agree to being a cancer in the industry.
Why do I never see examples of good localization on /v/? Do anons not know what that looks like?
>>736900676These "people" deserve to be eviscerated and hung up from lampposts by their own entrails.
>>736900968It would suck if they did though because they don't know English well enough.
>>736900681>First of all that ’ひと is what he's saying explicitly. The kanji 女性 is what he means. The meaning in english is reversed with him saying woman but meaning person.Parenthetical expressions can also be used to dictate how something should be read (though many style guides might prefer the word "read" before it). That's not an error in translation, just style, but I'll admit it feels confusing, so I concede.>Secondly the 「 」 act as quotation marks. So in English, person needs to be emphasized in some way.This is also a matter of style. There's no necessity in English to keep the quotation marks, nor to emphasize the speech with non-standard punctuation, if they are not literal.>Lastly "most important" is downplaying it. とって一番大切 needs something a bit more exaggerated.It's not downplaying it at all, what? The translator did a textbook translation of the phrase. In fact "to me, most important" is frankly the only way it SHOULD be translated.
>>736901006People post examples of what they "think" is good localization. It's just that said examples are generally not actually good.
>>736900927It's always been a bit on the censored side.
>>736901027>>736900672
>>736901126Try making a point retard.
>>736900681>literal hairsplitting pilpul to make the point that this>>736900316>is as bad as this>>736900676Why are "progressive" subhumans so dishonest? Are they just ontologically evil?
>>736901145Stop looping and I'll stop quoting.
>>736901175Ok faggot no argument confirmed.
>>736901169They're just trying to confuse the issue. They want textbook translations to be demonized.
>>736901169I didn't make any claim about it being bad relatively to other translation. Just that it wasn't correct, and translation is all about details, So being extremely picky is how you're supposed to be. The years of low quality doesn't change that.
>>736901195>out argued>resorts to shit talkingkek.
>>736901295Still no argument. Thus you forfeit.
>>736901285Your pickiness isn't even correct, though.
>>736898894The pozzed lolcowlizers group that woman in must hate that Johann guy so much. I bet they blocked his potential clients behind his back.
>I'm here, you Helga from Hey Arnold™ bastardfixed you dumb complainy niggers
>>736897661Just use bittersweet jfc
>>736901468kek, she's always the first one I think of when I see tsundere
>>736901512>I heard that this is a nudist beachWould be better.
>>736901604That would be much less accurate and also lose the part about it being hearsay about the humans.
>>736901604I don't think you can do that because you're putting in the concept of a nudists beach into the setting. And you don't know if it's actually a nudists beach. There could be no actual rules or there could be rules and people break them.
>>736901723Why? "This area" is a beach and nudists sunbathe naked.
>>736901764the nudist part is a rumour
>>736901790"I heard". The implication being he's hoping she strips off.
>>736901723I feel like with Metaphor because people have actually gone through the game, you don't even need AI to show how fucked that game is.
>>736901764Because they are literal gnomes that observe the behaviors of humans? Your changing the sentiment and cutting out words for no particular reason.>>736901803But I personally find it hilarious just how easily AI can do their job.
>several weeks of brainstorming sessions>this is the shit they came up withI just want you to remember this any time a translation tranny bitches about being replaced by AI.
Miss me yet?
>>736901910Nooo, stop! Think of the localizer :(
>>736901898What does that have to do with it being a nudist beach or not? That is literally what he is describing. If you think he wouldn't know the word "nudist" then "I hear that humans often sunbathe naked here".
Why are modern audiences so allergic to them?
>>736901984It's not about what I think the character would know, it's just about what he said. He said he hears rumors about humans sunbathing in places like this, because he is a miniature creature that speculates on the practices of humanity. Now, he just thinks this beach is for nudists.
>>736902260That's Japanese vagueness that doesn't translate well. Rather than "maybe somewhere over like this place or something" in English it should just be "here".
>>736897661"i'm here you cross bastard"this implies they're both a positive and negative influence/presence. why are trannies so dumb, and subversive? this isn't even subtle with their "translation" lmfao trannies are "trans"lators haha "translators".
>>736902308I have no idea why you're bringing up "japanese vagueness" when the issue is that nudists beach translation just removes things that he said for no reason. It's always needless cutting down of the line.
>>736902308That's not Japanese vagueness, what? "Places like this" is both direct and natural English phrasing. I feel like you're just changing it to change it because you don't personally like the sentiment.
>>736902418Because the line is left vague as it would be in Japanese because that's how they talk but in English we don't just circle around the point of the sentence and leave you to work out the rest and if you try to do it it just comes out sounding weird and unnatural.
>>736902068Because
>>736897937>How is a normal english speaker supposed to know what "tsundere" means?Why would a "normal english speaker" be playing a niche genre like visual novels instead of GTA online or sports slop?
>>736902480It's not natural. He sounds like some kind of sperg saying that.
>>73689798999% percent of the target audience for a game using tsundere understands it.
>>73690257099% of statistics are made up on the spot.
>>736897831>tsundere as-is doesn't mean anything if you aren't a weebGod forbid someone learn commonly used lingo; and who the fuck is playing this game if not weebs? that's the target demographicnext youre going to say we should translate yokai names or onigiri as jelly donuts because the average american doesn't know what they are
>>736902551>>736898894>Attempts to "translate" honourifics almost always fail to convey nuance. Yes, -san to a grown man in a posh or business context COULD mean "mister". A high schooler adressing another with -san using "miss" however?>Using -san with the surname when addressing a female peer is polite yet still casual, and thus very common even in a school context. It is absolutely not the same as the fringe case of addressing a female peer with "miss" in English.>Another decision made regarding the translation, one which I'm sure would invite misguided ridicule, is leaving terms like "onii-chan" and "senpai" intact as well.>These terms carry layered, situational nuances that, like honourifics, simply do not translate to English. Replacing "onii-chan" with "big bro" mangles any meaning and nuance and reads plain ridiculous in English.>And yet when some people see these words in English they react in a toxic manner, calling them "cringe" or "weebish" or even saying the translation that left them in is amateur. But this is not a logical or informed reaction. In fact it's largely the inverse.>Consider how English fiction itself, in general, typically handles such terms in other cultural contexts. When a character like, say Kamala Khan says "ammi" or "abba", these are left intact because they carry cultural weight, nuance, and emotional specificity.>This is not a fringe case but a standard. Characters from non-western cultures in English media very often retain such culturally-specific terms, expressing their identities without whitewashing. Audiences are expected to pick up the meaning via context or just looking them up.>So why, then, is this standard not extended to Japanese? Why are Japanese terms singled out for mockery and whitewashing while similar cultural markers in any other context are not just accepted but celebrated?
>>736902553I think you need to read more English if you're actually calling that unnatural.
>>736900593All games should have an international english version that is faithful to the original work, then they can have an amerimutt translation for the fat tards and gamers who don't buy or play games.
>>736902650I was born into it. No native speaker would talk like that.
>>736902632>and who the fuck is playing this game if not weebs? that's the target demographicFata Morgana was more successful in the West than in Japan, so it’s accurate to say that it’s not for weebs at all.
>>736902663I was also born into it, and you're flat-out wrong.
>woman is being a bitch>retarded weebs call it some japonese bullshit word to add mystiquewow ohh sorry she's 'tsundere' it's so interesting actually
>>736902695Is he talking about that beach or all beaches? If he's talking about all beaches then why the fuck did this sperg decide this would be the time to bring it up?
>>736902658Don't blame us, man. We hate this shit as much as you do.
>>736899465>He doesn't like SETSUMEISHIOUYou're gay and retarded.
>>736902739He's talking about spots "like this." He didn't refer to it as a beach, because, as a literal gnome, he might not see it as a "beach."
>>736897661Your pic answers your question and you know it. Back then it was done by semi-professionals with the goal of at least translating the story, sometimes poorly. Now it's done by "professionals" who are at best weebs and completely ideologically captured by far-left ideology and HAVE to insert their memes, or ideology, or outright hate japanese games and have their jobs through nepotism and are everything i've also already mentioned.
>>736902739He might not even be talking about beaches. こういう場所. It's possible he doesn't even know it's a beach, just what humans do when they get there.
>>736902834So is this character a sperg who goes around saying to people "I hear that humans get naked sometimes"?
>>736900784>Much like animu fans can feel about Harmony GoldFuck Harmony GoldAll /m/y niggas hate Harmony Gold
>>736897661>OMGG my precious "tsundere" NOOOOThe difference between teineigo, sonkeigo, kenjougo, both in terms of distinct grammar forms and separate vocabulary all getting flushed down the shitter? Never heard of these, so it's not a problem.Non-existence of ageru, kudaru and morau in other languages to indicate doing favor, and these getting further getting complicated with shit like the above-mentioned polite forms? Who cares?All commonly used imperative forms collapsing into "do it" and "please do it"? Lol, lmao even.Even personal pronouns all collapsing into "I" and "you" somehow doesn't seem to raise any objections even though casuals typically know the whole deal with ore/boku/watashi/atashi and so on, and that characters in Japanese media do sometimes play around with and comment their usage in the stories.Sentence-final particles poofing out of existence? Your average retard likely only knows "ne" and "yo" anyway, and the former is often covered with ", right?", so problem solved I guess.I could go on but the point is that somehow none of these things and more getting lost in translation due to innate differences between Japanese and other languages ever raise the alarm among the stalwart defenders of Nipponese's exotic linguistic quirks folded 9001 times. The retards posturing about authenticity only care about the theme park illusion of it, that is to say, the names getting sprinkled with "-san", "-sama", -"kun" and "-chan", because that's all it takes to make the average weaboo faggot with Dunning-Kruger believe he has grasped ze TAMASHII offu NIHONGO.
>>736902906He's telling his friend a slightly titillating rumor about humans. It's supposed to be a little humorous to the player, since we are undercover humans.
>>736903006If he's talking about where they are then it would make sense to bring it up and for it to be some interesting behaviour they are there to observe. If he's just decided to bring up humans getting naked basically out of the blue then he sounds retarded.
>>736902853getting sick of seeing people post pics like this as if its any indication of any sort of industry movements. this is an obviously very liberally minded unversity professor who explicitly specializes in the intersection of queer themes and video games (lame), who has also NEVER WORKED ON A GAME IN HER LIFEGetting mad at a panel done by someone with no real involvement in the industry is such a waste of time and breath. Let it gohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Ruberg
bring kino designs back we have had enough gay nigger translations
>>736903035Sounds like you got a problem with the writing in the game, not the translation.
>>736903042
>>736903061Them being there to observe a nudist beach does not change the writing.
>>736903039>stop talking about itNah.
>>736903082We don't know that they're there to observe it, just that it's something he heard happens here. And yes, you literally changed the writing.
>>736903129It is implied.
>>736903157It's definitely not.
>>736903187It is. That's the joke. It's a nudist beach.
>>736899015But if he didn't he wouldn't get to go to his friends and talk about how he man-bashed today and get pats on the back.
>>736898234lmao
>>736903187>>736903205How about you two just get nude and go to the beach together
>>736903205That's not the joke. It's just something he heard humans do in places like this, not that this beach in particular is a nudist one, nor that they're here to witness it.
>>736903258Back to sounding like a sperg again. He is saying it to make you think you have unknowingly wandered onto a nudist beach.
>>736898468perhaps if you find it unenjoyable you should just stop reading and leave the people who appreciate it for what it is alone
>>736903309Go away retard.
>>736900927is this bait?
>>736899583It's not. Translators are barely above monkeys with a typewriter. Their job is to transcribe the words from the original language to english. Their opinions and ideas are worthless, or they'd be making their own game that would be getting translated to japanese. All their attempts like the OP does nothing but diminish the work they touch and further solidify that they lack all talent or ability to be anything other than a scribemonkey made to translate better mens words.
>>736897661>In the 90's a "bad translation" was when sequels translated by different people didn't share names/terminology.I think you mean the 80s. "Translations" were deliberately shit in the 90s for sure.
Whats wrong with just using the word tsundere?If a potential reader is confused (doubtful), they can just look it up.Are we supposed to get rid of obscure or difficult words on the off chance the lowest common denominator person will be confused? Of course not. This whole argument is ridiculous.
>>736903378Their job is to make the game enjoyable to an English reader. Robotic literal translation is not enjoyable to read.
>>736903291That may be the point of why the line was written, but that's not what he said nor how he conveyed it.
>>736903407but I am an english reader, and I find AI translations to be 10x more enjoyable than modern localizer translations.so it seems like they are bad at their jobs. should they not be fired, then?
>>736903416So how I said it should be is in fact fine then.
>>736903454You disliking particular translators is besides the point. We are taking about translation in general.
>>736901169>Why are "progressive" subhumans so dishonest? Are they just ontologically evil?Their entire lives and worldviews are a series of lies they force themselves to believe. Like being able to change your gender. To be so spiritually broken results in what you're arguing with. Truth means nothing anymore to them.
>>736903476you said their job is to make the game enjoyable to an English reader. 9 times out of 10, they only hurt my enjoyment. why should they keep their jobs then? this isn't a personal vendetta, I barely know videogame writers by name, let alone translators. the point is, I am the target audience, and I am not pleased.
>>736903456No, you dropped the part about humans being the ones who do it, implied they're familiar with the concept of a beach, and changed the rumor to this place in particular being one such nudist beach.
>>736903531Them being bad at their jobs does not change what their job is.
Just learn Japanese. Even an AI translation is going to translate things like localizers do now because it will be told to do so.
>>736903407>Their job is to make the game enjoyable to an English reader.No its to translate it to be readable to an english reader. People are not paying them for their words, they are paying them for the artists words, the creator of the game. The translators words, their beliefs, their thoughts and opinions, they're all worthless. Or they'd be making a game themselves, which they're not. Because noone cares what they think or what they have to say. Their little insertions like in the OP does nothing but diminish and worsen the work of men who are better than them, which is why their customers are often mad. Like a retarded waiter deciding to cook your dish for an extra 5 minutes and add some ketchup on it. That's not your job. You're not the cook for a reason.
>>736903549You are trying to convey literal words, I am trying to convey meaning.
>>736903567as anon proved in another thread even when intentionally telling the AI to take creative liberties and make the text sound californian, it STILL did a better job at translating than modern localizers
>>736903568see>>736903559
>>736897661If you haven't learned Japanese or killed all Localizers, you deserve to lose your hobby.
>>736903591You literally changed the meaning.
>>736899194In this case the untranslated line is the character speaking a quote from a third language that is neither the language being translated from nor the language being translated to.That said, it is also true that you do often find JP->EN translators attempting to translate and terribly mangling chinese quotes spoken by japanese characters.
>>736903614you can deflect as much as you want. Just remember your job scribemonkey. Noone cares what you think, or what you can do. You're there to translate better mens works. Don't diminish it with your stupidity.
>>736903628You yourself said the point of the line being there at all was to suggest that you were on a nudist beach. The literal translation with all the vagueness does not convey that. Making clear that they are talking about this beach in particular does.
>>736903663Ok opinions dismissed faggot.
>>736903676I think saying explicitly that people sunbathe naked in places like this conveys the concept just fine, anon.
>>736903750Not really. If he was talking about it in general then you would have no reason to think this beach was a nudist beach. You only would if it was clear that this was the place he was referring to in particular.
>>736903676>You yourself said the point of the line being there at all was to suggest that you were on a nudist beachCan you not read japanese? Because that's very wrong. And you should know that by reading japanese.
>>736903774So what does it say?
>>736903771But again this place in particular might not be that kind of place. He's just saying that humans are said to do that kind of thing in places like this.
>>736903794So you actually can't read it? You've been piecing together an argument based on the translations and what other anons of said about the Japanese. Baffling.
>>736903839Then why mention it at all? Goes back to being some sperg talking nonsense rather than them being there to watch something interesting
>>736903863Translate it or fuck off retard.
>>736897661May they all be replaced by AI. And may it be soon.They truly deserve it.
>>736898747People learn words by hearing them now, not reading them. It's why you run into misspelling more than mispronunciations.
>>736903873Because it's something he heard that humans do? It doesn't exactly take a genius to understand what he's implying or rather saying quite explicitly.
>>736903972At that beach, so now they are there to investigate this curious human behavoir.
>>736903996Not necessarily. They could very well just be in the area, which causes him to bring up the anecdote.
>>736904042But yes necessarily. Did they just turn up a beach hoping to see naked humans? Most beaches are not like that, but there's something strange about this one in particular.
>>736904072They're gnomes, so they could very well be doing gnomish things when the one tells the other about what he heard.
>>736904089Like this strange place where humans sunbathe naked.
>>736904098It's just a rumor he's heard about places LIKE the one they're at. He doesn't necessarily believe this is one such place.
You’re both retarded, but the one saying “nude beach” is more so, because the gnome doesn’t know the concept of a “nude beach”, so he is saying “a place where humans sunbathe naked” for a reason he doesn’t know, because he’s not fucking human and doesn’t know what that means. Accept that you’re wrong here.
>>736904128This goes back to conveying meaning though. This line was put in to make you think you were on a nudist beach. You are making it sound like he's just some idiot who has turned up to just any beach and expects everybody to be naked.
>>736898269I'll take soulless truths rather than soulful lies. And have the writers being accountable for their mistakes instead of having to find out on my own that the stuff i consumed had a complete different meaning and some tard thought better.
>>736899280That is the footnote for the french in the middle with the roman numeral 1 at the end of it.
>>736903108Sweet Baby is an entirely different problem than what I'm talking about. Quit being a retard
>>736904193No, the line makes it sound like he's a pint-sized gnome who is unfamiliar with the ways of humanity and telling his friend about what he's heard. Nothing more, nothing less.
>>736904247Then it's just a meaningless throwaway line rather than something that affects the player in any way. "hahaha silly gnome" rather than "wait, what?".
>>736904291Yeah, it's called NPC dialogue. It still deserves a proper translation, regardless.
>>736904348That doesn't mean that what they say shouldn't be impactful.
>>736904291you can work as a troonslator now, you literally just killed the gnome personality for no reasonthat's why retards say japanese dialogue is "dogshit"
>>736904389Explain how.
>>736897661
>>736904378So long as the meaning's preserved, that's the most important part.
>>736902658Jedgment tried to do this but the usual social media suspects autistically screeched at it.
>>736904409if he knew what a nude beach means, he wouldn’t specifically bring up humans, because a nude beach implies that he could also bathe there and that he understands what it is. stop being retarded.
>>736904461The concept they are trying to convey is preserved. If you are walking around talking to NPCs it is better that what they say makes an impact and is memorable. Throwaway lines aren't memorable. Things that make you stop and thing for a moment are. They don't need to have a lot of dialogue, but what they do say should be memorable.
>>736897661Does Egnlish translation changing all instances of metric to imperial count as teh same kind of faggot "the audience must NEVER see a foreign concept or they'll die horribly" bullshit to you or not?I think it's retarded, even when it would make sense in context (like when the story is taking place in America).
>>736904538The concept was not preserved. You changed both the words, feel, and intent of the line. I don't care about how "impactful" you feel your change was. It wasn't what he said.
>>736904559I started learning Japanese five years ago, and you know what the breaking point for me was? Seeing shitty American units in the translation that only their shithole uses. That was the breaking point for me.
>>736904519Well he knows what being naked is and "places like this" would be a beach so he knows what a beach is therefore he knows that people get naked on beaches thus while he might not know the word "nudist" he knows what a nudist beach is or has at least heard of one.
>>736901898Tin-foiled hat moment, but i'm so convinced the dialogue in your pic was changed because whatever subhuman they had to "translate" was one of those insufferable tards that hates the japanese word for running away because it vaguely sound like nigger.
I remember when we used to make fun of 4kids sanitizing everything to make it more palatable for kids in the US. Nowadays people actually defend it.
>>736904583So what was the feel and intent of the line then?
>>736904610And where is the nuance that gnomes have never done it? Did he bring up “humans” for no reason at all?
>>736897661End your life tranny. Learn JapaneseYou are worse than troonlators and EOPs by virtue of shilling for AI. KYS
>>736904637>a pint-sized gnome who is unfamiliar with the ways of humanity and telling his friend about what he's heard
>>736904661AI slaps. It translates better than most humans.
>>736898598kill yourselfend your life braindead trannyyou don't care about translations or japanesefucking subhuman lmao. so millenial marvel writing is better than censored woke slop now? KYSlearn japanese.kys kys kys kys
>>736904671Telling his friend that he's heard rumours of a strange custom on this beach?
>>736904718On PLACES LIKE the one they're at.
>>736904696The irony of the original statement being applicable to the whole process and being completely erased for a terrible line is not lost on me.
>>736902692your conclusion makes no sense. Neptunia is more successful in the west so I guess weebs aren't the target audience
>>736904754We're just going to go in a circle at this point with you demanding a literal word for word translation of the Japanese even if the meaning gets lost in translation and sounds dull while I say to preserve the meaning and impact for this character and situation to be interesting and entertaining.
Why haven't you started learning Japanese yet?
>>736904617>Tin-foiled hat momentMore like a retard moment. The Japanese still stays the same and you would still hear it with JP voices on.
>>736897661>japanese text: hey, how's it going?>translator: ayo famalam, the patriarchy can get fucked in its geriatric ass! how are you by the by?translations were actually never all that good but they got too cocky and started bragging about how bad they were doing on their socials. all they had to do was stay quiet and the gravy train would have kept rolling but I guess they can't help themselves.
you had time to learn japanese by now
>>736897661Why hasn't /v/ organized its own fan-translation group yet? We clearly have enough people who know japanese and localization issues are a big problem for us, what prevents us from developing our own solution?
>>736905016Sure, let me buy the Japanese-only versions of those games off Steam or somewhere else. Oh wait, I'm still paying for shitty trannylations no matter what I do.
>>736904808kek, pottery
>>736901419there's also that poltfan who is fluent in japanese and keeps dabbing on them.
>>736905871>unable to overcome the extremely minor hurdle of using a JP site or worse case setting up a JP card>somehow thinks he would've stuck with the 1000x harder process of learning Japanese kek
>>736906492So... Can I buy a version of Fire Emblem Engage that only has Japanese text?
>>736898728If your translation makes a game less fun for the audience than the original audience was having, then your translation can be considered a failure.
>>736904845My translation is perfectly accurate and extremely entertaining. Words flying off the page with extreme respect to the source material. Yours just sounds like you're bad at English.
>>736906821>extremely entertainingNot even you believe that though given how dismissive of "just an NPC" you were earlier.>>736904348>>then it's just a meaningless throwaway line rather than something that affects the player in any way>>Yeah, it's called NPC dialogue
>>736897661>Tranny flagThat's all I need to know
>>736906913No, the way the AI worded it was extremely impactful and entertaining, even if it was just a throwaway line by an NPC. You don't know Japanese, localizer. And you didn't do a very good job on this game, btw.
>>736897661>pedoflag*toilet flush sound plays*
>>736907076As we have already gone through if you make it like he is just talking about beaches in general then you have no reason to think there is anything strange about this beach. It has no impact because it just slides off. It doesn't make you think twice or really catch your attention. Just the idle wittering of some idiot.
>>736907171>It has no impact because it just slides offlmao you're just mad because the AI writes more accurate and more impactful lines in its sleep than you write for however many pennies you were paid on that shitty ass translation job.Learn Japanese before you attempt to ruin any other games in the future.
>>736907421Explain its impact then.
>>736907435No lol
>>736907463OK then if you won't explain yourself then it can simply be dismissed.
>>736907492It's more like you can't keep the line's meaning intact because you don't know Japanese. Man, that sucks.
>>736907556You said the line is impactful. Explain its impact. How does it "hit" you and make you sit up and take notice?
>>736897831Translate schadenfreude.
>>736907598You claimed your line was accurate. Explain how it's accurate. Oh wait, we established it's not.
>>736907630Because it preserves the interest of the NPC's dialogue that is otherwise lost in translation.
>>736907598I'm impacted by the accuracy of the line.I'm impacted that it doesn't add a joke that wasn't there.I'm impacted by its honesty.I'm impacted by how it's better than humans.
>>736907684So nothing about what he actually said then.
>>736907671the "interest" of the NPC's dialogue is subjective. Its meaning is not, therefore your translation is poor.
>>736907764What is interesting about it otherwise?
>>736907782We're talking about accuracy, hun.
>>736907812>the "interest" of the NPC's dialogue is subjectiveSo what do you find interesting about it?
>>736907782Why does it matter if it's "interesting"? If the original line was plain, then the translation should reflect that.The only thing you are doing tranny, is bumping the thread until limit.
>>736907874If your answer is "nothing" it would seem it's not very subjective after all.
>>736897661Could have just said "big softie" if they want the connatation of someone who is caring on the inside, but externally rough/mean. Or say "I'm here you fat retard" if you wanted to show they were friends.
>>736907837No, no. Don't change the topic. Your kind can't translate accurately, so let's start there. Is your translation accurate? No. Your translation fails because of it.
>>736907921Rekt btw.
>>736907936Thanks. I've studied and translated Japanese works for a long time, so I'm pretty experienced with this kind of "translator."
>>736907985Literally demonstrated you were incorrect and that you yourself don't find anything of interest in it either meaning your earlier claims of it having more impact are therefore false.
>>736908041No one cares about your obsession with "interesting". Accuracy matters more.
>>736908093That's just nonsense. I would say that basically everyone would prefer to play an interesting game than one with robot literal translations that don't carry meaning over into English.
>>736897661back in the day bad translations were by hacks who were just fooling around or making shit upnowadays they're agenda driven activists who delight in injecting their venom into the works they are hired to translate. worst of all, the company censors the original as well to stop the firthy gaijin from drawing comparisons
>>736897661>6 years seething over thisYou could've learned to read JP in this time.The EN translation overall is one of the best I've read. I've read both versions. That one line with the male ego is shitty and unnecessary, it feels out of character and almost anachronistic. Fata Morgana is a masterpiece regardless.
>>736908140The problem is your defintion of "interesting" 99% of the time is either of 3 things>reddit incarnate>nigger babble ebonics>terminally online tranny speakNone of those are interesting. They're just shit.Don't agree then tell me why the "most praised" story in modern gaming Gay Cowboys Eating Pudding 2 doesn't sound like a lolcowlizer wrote it.
>>736908264Now you are just attacking a strawman. The only thing I have claimed to be interesting is the possibility that you have stumped onto a nudist beach (doesn't need to literally have any naked people on it, but just something to make you think for a second).
>>736908041Here, let's go over your translation's accuracy against the original, shall we?>I heard that this is a nudist beachOnly the "I heard that" part is correct. Every other part was not said. You dropped the words>人間達 (humans)>よく (often)>こういう (this kind of)>場所 (place)>で (in)>裸で (naked)>ひなたぼっこする (sunbathe)You got one part. Literally one part of the sentence correct. This is the sentence you wish he said>ここがヌーディストビーチなんだって
>>736908223>almost anachronisticLike a late 10th century girl using the word tsundere?
>>736908532Do you not understand the concept of something being lost in translation? You can translate something with total word for word accuracy but have it still come out as garbled nonsense because the deeper meaning gets lost.
>>736908627Yup, and everything got lost in your translation. The AI preserved all of it in its rendering.
>>736908693What was lost?
>>736908703These>人間達 (humans)>よく (often)>こういう (this kind of)>場所 (place)>で (in)>裸で (naked)>ひなたぼっこする (sunbathe)
>>736908725My translation >>736901984"I hear that humans often sunbathe naked here".
>>736902748ameriburgers are by far the biggest consumer baseas an aggregate you buy these products and you keep these companies in businessyou are in fact the problem
>>736902735>'sup bitch?Probably a better localization
>>736908789>hereAlmost, but こういう is used to say places like here, not definitively here.
>>736908918Then we are back to the impact of the dialogue. Someone commenting that he hears that humans sunbathe naked on beaches doesn't make the player believe that this one might be such a beach. It's not an interesting rumour to overhear.
>>736908818burgers are the issue with the whole world ever since they got weapons and stock marketthey are literally the "what if apes got weapons and used them" idea
>>736908568Kek I guess you have a point. Come to think of it, I think that scene was one of those extra scenario dialogues that you access from the main menu, not even in the main game. So it's a moot point in the first place. I could be wrong though, it's been many years.But I do believe the male ego line is at least opportunistic, when the translator could've just found a direct equivalent to "tsundere" without adding any more meaning to it.
>>736909009No, we're still talking about meaning. You're trying to drop the predeterminer, which alters the meaning of the sentence. Sorry that these beginner grammar concepts are too high level for you.
>>736908818That's just a byproduct of America's wealth. I assure you most people would prefer an accurate translation, if given the choice.
>>736897831>>736897661People are understanding the character isn't really a Tsundere, he's an abusive, delusional bastard(retard) with an easily bruised ego. The AI translation isn't conveying the nuance, and people literally think he's an actual fucking tsundere
>>736909101I'm talking about making an interesting game. I don't think that everybody sounding like a robot because you are just taking the Japanese word and swapping it with the English one with no consideration for whether this actually sounds good or interesting in English is how you go about that.
>>736905016because I fucking hate the language>したかしなかったかのうちに>かと思ったら>した途端>するなり>するや否やall have to do with "as soon as X happened, Y". good luck learning the differences (unexpected? compatible with volitional expressions? describes the actions of 3rd parties or can it include the speaker? etc.)>にしたがって>とともに>につれて>にともなってall have to do with "as X happened, so did Y" with different nuances (together, gradually as each other changed, one deriving from the other) and differing degrees of overlap
>mfw lived long enough to see faggots start defending lolcowlizers
>>736897661Fragile ego, there done. Same gender neutral term.
>>736899972>coy being anything like tsundereretard
>>736909198This isn't even a hard concept to understand semantically. It's legitimately baby-level grammar. You must have trouble following dialogue in shows.
>>736909395I disagree with your premise, sorry.
>>736909416You disagree with objective meaning if you think "this is the place where people do X" and "this is the kind of place where people do X" mean the same thing.
>>736909172That isn’t the translator’s problem
>>736909476I disagree with your premise that the only valid translation is robotic word for word that does not end up reading well in English. The goal is a product for an English speaking audience, so it must therefor be enjoyable to read in English even if that means taking some liberties.
>>736909172If that's what she called him, that's what she called him, anon. It's not the translator's job to change the meaning.
>>736897661In the 90s they knew the translations were bad and the localization teams would admit they made shit up Today localizers think the localizations they do are original literature they created, the original work no longer exists and they act as if they made and wrote the game itself.
>>736897661>there were a number of factors that led to the decision: target audience
>>736909551No, the goal of translation is to convey the words and sentiment to the reader while obeying the conventions of English writing and grammar. Your translation alters the meaning, thus failing as a translation.
>>736909479>>736909570The actual author admitted that tsundere was kinda not the best choice of words here, but had to settle on something he thought readers might kinda understand. He actually praised the localization, but of course, that goes against the narrative.
>>736909629The goal is to make a fun game.
>>736909651The goal of translation is to convey the thoughts and intent of a character accurately and succinctly.
If translations are so bad, why don't (you) use your superior 日本語能力 to fill in the gap in the market? Or create/join a fansubbing team? Bitching on an image board ain't fixing shit.
>>736909698If that does not result in something entertaining then it will be modified into something that is.
>>736908215that a flamboyant male character gets recommended for erasure because "westerners don't know onee characters" and "see it as perpetuating le ~harmful stereotype~ that gay men are girly" when they could keep it and just develop the character's individuality, which is a thing in the real world, like onees exist, is insanelike, they actually acknowledge that there's no problem and only do it because of the threat of EU/US white left cultural colonialism.I read lots of gay shit and there's so many manga I read with onee characters that are cool and loved just for it and it's funny how corpo left "diversity" actually erases them because it's not their idea of what a gay guy should be like.
>>736909571Worse, they believe the original scripts are always, with not exception, inherently wrong to some degree, and they are doing the world a favor by relaying their infinite wisdom in their revised translations. They genuinely smell their own farts that much.
>>736909726Then that's what we call a dishonest translation.
>>736909551What's "robotic" about it? The fact that the xharacter talks like an actual human being as opposed to a brainrotten zoomer?
>>736909702It's raising awareness, which is what is needed since trannyslators really wants to silence all forms of objection to their work, they want you to be compliant to their garbage.
>>736909650The author doesn't speak English, so their assessment of the English translation doesn't count for much.
>>736909751Certainly you can go too far with it but so can you with trying to be literal. What matters is the quality of the final product and that is measured by how much people enjoy it. Most people don't enjoy reading janky robotic absolute literal translation.
>>736897661Well as you can see a troon was involved so he had to insult men to distance himself from what he is
>>736909821Meaning is objective and separate from the relative enjoyment of the player. Thankfully the AI provided a translation which was literal but not robotic.
>>736909651That's the job of the people making the game. You are not an author. Nobody is Interested in reading your dogshit fanfic.
>>736909792You talking about the AI translation?
>>736901169These people legitimately believe that they can make the world a better place (see: conform to their objectively correct moral framework) if they just "teach" the idiot masses about how they're dumb and ignorant, and that the best way to do that is not only in the classroom, but in every aspect of life that exists.
>>736909650Authors always praise localisations because they want their product to sell and see the oversea audience like giant wads of dosh, so if some pig tells them that their way of translating will guarantee more money, of course they'll be sycophants to it. It's circular logic.
>>736909883The ones translating it into other languages are also involved in making the game.
>>736897937Remember when Kim Jong Un called Donald Trump a "dotard," and google search rates of the word "dotard" skyrocketed?This is what I think of every time someone uses the "english speakers don't know japanese terminology" argument. If we stopped using terms the average American doesn't know, then we'd be stuck writing everything at a middle school level
What’s wrong with people from Quebec?
>>736909650Not the author, the EN publisher twitter
the anti-honorific retards are fucking deranged, imagine someone acting like that in the real world>Alright let's start the meeting. This is Suzuki-san from Iwasaki's strategic acquisitions department, who'll be spearheading the->LMFAO ARE YOU SERIOUSLY CALLING HIM SUZUKI-RAMASAMA YOU FUCKING WEEB NOBODY TALKS LIKE THAT IN ENGLISH WHY DONT YOU JUST START NARUTO RUNNING JUST CALL HIM MISTER YOU FLAMING FAGGOT
>>736909880It doesn't sound natural. It's grammatically correct maybe, but not natural.
>>736910081It sounds 100% more natural than your average meme injected soapbox localisation. Go speak to some actual real human beings.
>>736910081It sounds very natural. I could imagine just about anyone from an English-speaking nation phrasing a sentence just like that, actually.
>>736910123Irrelevant. We were talking about that line in particular.
>>736909738>japan is cucked, erases its cultural heritage to appease western devilsand the sky is blue
>>736898512>>736897831A better question is how would they have translated it if it was a female tsundere (which is much more common)? because we all know they wouldn't have translated it as:---Why hello there.How's your fragile female ego holding up?---
>>736910138Not this English speaking nation.
>>736910196Yes, this English-speaking nation. You should read more books, anon. You'd learn more about how humans talk.
>>736909810>>736909936>The copelike clockwork>Not the authorNOVECT is the developer, not the publisher.
>>736910237Humans generally don't go around claiming that they hear people get naked on beaches.
>>736909806You're only preaching to the choir here, just complaining may feel good but it accomplishes zero. Much in the way bad actors moved in and shat up the business, good actors need to actually step up and start offering better alternatives themselves. Nothing will change otherwise.
>>736910295Well, in this case, a human isn't the one speaking. I can understand the confusion lol
>>736901362Ain't no way this is real
>>736910373So your point about "how humans talk" is null then.
>>736909629>No, the goal of translation is to convey the words and sentiment to the reader while obeying the conventions of English writing and grammarif the resulting product is an unenjoyable pile of shit that's awkward to read, it won't sell because it reads like a toddler's scribbles and makes you question the writer's ability (god how can someone write like this, it's barely readable english)therein lies a paradox:>be faithful and you turn a sizable chunk of people off, but cultivate a cult following that will accept the original and eventually expand>adapt it and attract a larger audience, but you desecrate the original and condition the masses to expect butchered translationsthe only way out is to educate the goycattle so they'll to recognize and demand faithful translations, but that is not an option in the first place
Can't wait for mutt global hegemony to collapse. Unit 731 should be reinstated for all americans. Total muttistani death can't come soon enough.
>>736910404Well, *what* he's talking about isn't necessarily what a human would say, but *how* he worded it would be. You seem a little slow here.
>>736910403100% real. Milana says it when you're recruiting Maureus.
>>736897661I get the logical train of thought. Tsundere implies the player is cagey with his true feelings, he's a male, so I guess you could say he has a fragile male ego. But I don't know why wouldn't just say cagey with feelings or too guarded or whatever.Actually I do know, it's because the faggot troon in the OP pic has been politics poisoned by overexposure to xitter
>>736899263I'm honestly trying to think of a male tsundere and the only one I can come up with is Vegeta who is gives off a harsh exterior but clearly loves his family and cares for his friends. Now I'm trying to think if I wanted to insult Vegeta for that attitude the only thing I can think of is that he is being a try hard bitch which is honestly also the same as dude with a fragile ego. So what's your solution?
>>736910838>AIsloppost discarded
>>736910754Nah a person wouldn't just bring this up at random, it's a weird thing to come out with then it doesn't really apply to anything specific, and it also lacks integration with the actual human player, no implications implied for a human to pick up on.
>>736910976They like to insert a little political humor into their translations.>>736911039You're free to prove it wrong. Should be easy, right? ;)
>>736910457>awkward to readI don't get this crap. Not everything is like poetry, where there's a certain rhythm and sound to the words that the author deliberately chose. It's only natural that a foreign language would sound different.A translation doesn’t need to make something sound like a native text, it just needs to preserve the meaning. If the prose feels a bit weird, it’s because it was written by another people, another civilization, another time. There’s nothing wrong with that, and it amazes me that some people can’t handle it... it just shows that most people read to keep up appearances, not because they want to grasp the meaning of something.I don't give a shit if a book written by a Russian in the 19th century doesn't sound "natural". That's exactly what I expect, in fact, if I wanted to see something that sounds natural, I'd be watching some shitty soap opera set in the same kind of society as mine.
>>736911069>AI slopPostDiscarded
>>736911049That would probably be on account of the fact that you're listening in on conversation in progress. Not that any of what you just said factor into a translation.
>>736911086>there's a certain rhythm and sound to the words that the author deliberately choseNot when they're in another language entirely.
>>736911108>he can't prove the AI wrongOh, my. How embarrassing.
>>736910838>AIgempost approved
>>736911086>I don't get this crap.if you read shit like people in contemporary times suddenly calling their parents "Lei" in Italian, you're gonna feel like punching the retard who wrote that. no amount of "b-but she said otou-sama in jap" is going to justify that shit. it's unthinkablethat's the kind of shit that turns people off
>>736911125Them being there because they heard a rumour about the strange human cultural practice of naked sunbathers gives them grounding. A reason to be there, and something they are there to see rather than being there just because.
>>736911236Ah, but it unfortunately changes the meaning of the line, so that can't work. You should consider making your own game, anon!
>>736911282The translators were hired to translate the game and their work was released as the official game in that language. They made the English script for the game and the devs signed off on it..
All this back and forth throughout the entire thread isn't even relevant. AI is here. Companies made it explicitly clear they fully intent to replace human workers with AI. Lolcowlisator trannies are fucking done and no amount of shitty bad faith arguments to justify their existence will change that. It's like arguing the merits of the continued existence of pandas as a species in the context if an asteroid the size of eurasia hurling straight for earth with a 100% change of collision.
>>736911381The devs don't speak English, so they entrust their translators to be faithful to the words they wrote. Unfortunately, they couldn't even do that lel
>>736897661without knowing context I submit the following translation: "I'm here you son of a bitch"
>>736911205as an addendum: the only way such a translation could be excused would be with a preface explaining that "the translator employs some conventions in order to reflect certain critical features of the japanese language, such as honirifics and makes no attempt to hide that the resulting work is a translation. as a result, it may read unnaturally at times"no translation agency is going to put that kind of disclaimer in any game. they'll hang you for that
>>736909738>le ~harmful stereotype~ that gay men are girly"but the whole damn stereotype is that those are big buff manly men who can snap you like a twig using over the top effeminate language and also it's not a stereotype if they ACTUALLY DO IT they parade that shit at gay pride parades and bars
>>736911446That's too bad. They still hired who they hired and their work was what was then put up for sale. If the devs didn't like what they did then they should have said so during development, hired somebody else or done it themselves.
>>736911514you're overthinking it. the sjw's rationale is always>does this show [group] in a bad light? can it>does this make [group] look good despite being completely unrealistic tripe no one wants to read? ship itthat's it
>>736911530The devs don't speak English, so their ability to assess the quality of a translation is almost impossible without a second set of translators to check their work.
>>736911069I think the english translation is funny though, because he looks like a goofy/wacky knick-knack vendor in the middle of nowherethe other examples you've given, I prefer the AI translationwhat about the Reboobican or Demoflat translation from Disgaea or Soul Nomad?
>>736911656When then if they are that anal about the English translation then they fucking should fucking learn it rather than second guess the translation in a language they don't even speak.
>>736911685It may be funny, but it's inaccurate. Most of Soul Nomad is fanfiction.>>736911708Or maybe the translators should be more honest? Just a thought.
>>736897661>we agonized for WEEKS to come up with the some misandrist slopline that you could already read a billion times on tumblr>>736897831Tsundere means "nothing" exactly once. Then you looked it up and know what it means.You're the same kind of retard who'd shove a novel into an AI and tell it to rewrite it in AAVE because else the nogs might encounter a new word they have to learn.
>>736911781The translators do what they were hired to do and that is make the game understandable and enjoyable to an English speaking audience. If the devs think that a better job could be done then they are quite welcome to do it them fucking selves.
>>736911852Translators should quit fucking lying on their translations and then maybe they'll earn their paycheck.
>>736898416it's also irrelevant to know what it means right away, because after reading it a couple times, you'll have figured out the meaning from the context.unless you're a woman and read POV, then it's game over no matter how much context you get, kek
>>736911708they don’t care. JRPGs that aren’t final fantasy or other popular shit like persoyna don’t sell well in the west, and the few people who do buy them don’t care enough about shit translations, so it’s a waste of time to worry about translation quality.
>>736897831Maybe that's how western women act tsundere?Still an awful rewrite.
>>736911902>they don't careok cool so this entire argument about muh devs is moot.
>>736898234I read a lot of Russian novels and they had plenty of terms I had to look up because they were taken 1:1
>>736900808Yeah, bipolar would be the best middle ground but the bipolar bitches working for the company would have a hissyfit if you use that.
>>736902643Honorifics are piss easy too, because you can just keep them as is and it would not cause any issues really. Everyone immediately sees what the purpose it.I'd let the argument count if someone was translating from German to English and rewriting sentences because it's difficult do convey Du vs Sie and stuff like that otherwise, but with honorifics, that's a complete non-issue.
>>736911934I mean, would you care if a random French guy said that your game’s translation is dogshit in French when 90% of your sales are in English? Remember, you’re running a company, not an indie studio.
>>736912128Depends. If it's just one guy then that's just his opinion. If a lot of French people hate the translation then it might be something to look into assuming this isn't some unaffiliated group who decided to translate it on their own.
>>736911971>his language doesn't have a native equivalent to snokhachestvo
>>736902748kek, that shit reminds me of whenever the radio here plays a quote from some burger politician and overlays it with a translation.technically, if you only pay attention to the content, the translation might not be wrong, but they always very intentionally change the tone to such a degree that the message is a completely different one.
lol why even translate
>>736912479kek what the fuck
>>736899059Cause it literally means a different thing. Tusndere is a person who acts all pissy and cold and plays hard to get but in reality they're very warm and soft on the inside and they open up as their relationship advances.It has nothing to do with gender roles and it doesn't mean a male has a "fragile ego" (in fact, a male character with a fragile ego would never open up to someone or display "female" character traits like love and affection)
>>736897661It always amazes me how these same DEI trannies love to write brown characters using naitve words even when they can speak perfect English, like "hello PENDEJO what's up let's go to my ABUELITA for some CALIENTE food" but of course we can't use japanese words 'cause I guess they're racist or something.
>>736912572sometimes doing your job is too hard
>>736905016
>>736911656Falcom's Kondo was enraged when he found out that Xseed rewrote Trails and did all that crap with Estelle without ever consulting them.https://www.frontlinejp.net/2021/03/19/falcom-ceo-kondo-talks-ports-and-localisations-zero-no-kiseki-coming-to-the-us/https://egmnow.com/toshihiro-kondo-talks-nihon-falcom-trails-of-cold-steel-iii/>The area that I would take issue with, which was very similar to what you mentioned with Nausicaä—I mean, I don’t know what particularly was changed for Nausicaä, but I completely understand that feeling—is that if they’re going to start changing the actual content, they’d better be contacting us first to get our approval and talk through it.That's why he fired them and stopped letting them release Falcom games.
>>736912687Working Designs translations were unironically better than these modern localizers, at least WD attempted to be funny when they ruined games.
>>736897831Tsundere meana tsundere.
>>736900410That would be AI translation, all you english speakers get is californian tranny reimagining.
>>736912697Yeah, I compared a bit of the Remake's translation and it seems like they actually did their job and translated. I was pretty surprised.>>736912834There wasn't any malice in their translations, so it's forgivable.
>>736912894Without a human double checking it AI often outputs nonsense as I'm sure you have noticed while talking to it.
>>736912961Not when translating. AI is 100% honest in its output.
>>736913003AI will state bullshit with confidence.
>>736912961> often outputs nonsensesame as the troonslator, but at least the AI nonsense isn't malicious
>>736913041Humans might, but AI won't.
>>736913041NTA but AI itself is just a Large Language Model, translation is one of the things it ACTUALLY excels at. AI is general is just a glorified chat bot but dictionary definitions are static, there's no moving parts it can be wrong about other than new slang terms emerging.
>>736897742localization was so much better back in the days...
>>736913097>>736912941These ones aren't too bad. They do take liberties but at least it's not outright fanfiction
>>736903039Holding a talk at GDC is something I would consider "real involvement in the industry".
>>736913092That's besides the point. Whatever you are doing with AI if there's not a human checking its work you will run into problems.
>>736913097https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMP8_jD-y0sLeast delusional AIbro
>>736898069I played this recently and honestly really liked it. It works for me probably because of what >>736898745 saidI only saw the cutscenes as Mail though, was neat the lines change depending on who you are playing.
>>736913139First one is fanfction and the second one is outright wrong at the end.
>>736909961Is North Korea just tsundere?
>>736913171You're free to post some Japanese you think it can't translate. I'll wait.
>>736913249So does she ever actually pay you back?
>>736913249Yeah true, the second one is just wrong. The first one though is ultimately a guy getting butterflies in his stomach over a girl and wanting to make her feel special, and I think it still gets that across even if the Japanese version is better.
>>736913150it's not besides the point. any upgrade just has to be better than what we currently have.and almost everything is better than idpol fuckers who intentionally rewrite the material they are supposed to translate and then gloat about ruining it out of spite
>>736913314Uh...
>>736913437Ah. Guess not. Just asking because they might have done it so you're not coming back later all like "hey bitch where's my money" and she's denying all knowledge.
>>736913147>Holding a talk at GDC is something I would consider "real involvement in the industry".lmao
>>736902853And yet if I say I don't like their politics I get a bunch of disonest leftists seething at me and calling me a culture warrior
>>736897661>TRANSlation>Is infected with tranniesBravo Kojima
>>736913303Uh oh what happened to AI doesn't lie? Why are you mysteriously dropping that point after it got proven wrong? Cmon bring those goalposts back
>>736914128>Not when translating. AI is 100% honest in its output.
>>736913759Is there not an entire room of professionals there listening to her advice? Sure she may not make any games herself but being there at GDC does give her legitimacy and there WILL be game devs who take her advice.You also mentioned she is a university professor for game devs, do you not think she influenced any of the people who studied under her?
>>736914206>AI has been shown to make shit up constantly>this magically doesn't happen in translation because... IT JUST DOESN'T OKAYYeah sure thing retardbro. Nobody's ever gonna pay for your slop "translation" btw
>>736911530You can be hired to do something and still do a shitty job. Just because nobody checked it and you got away with it doesn't mean the job wasn't shitty.But yeah, I do place part of the blame on the people who hired those hacks in the first place. They should be more careful, and expunge the industry of those shitters.
>>736914480>>this magically doesn't happen in translation because... IT JUST DOESN'T OKAYCorrect. AI has been perfected. Soon translators will go the way of the dodo.
>>736914480Yeah, post that Japanese sentence where it lies. Should be easy given how prone it is to hallucination.
>>736914543>two more weeks broYou've been saying this for years at this point kek
>>736914651Post that sentence, bro. Come on. Prove AI can't translate.
>>736914574>>736914741Anything where the subject or gender isn't explicitly stated lol It will just confidently (and wrongly) assert it's first person and/or male >inb4 noooooooo doesn't count
>>736914989Just ran it through Gemini and got>Still drawing away as usual, I see..................)Damn, even with an unknown subject, it worded it in a natural way.
>>736914989>don't give it the context and expect it to get it rightlol you are fucking retarded, of course the AI wont translate it correctly
>>736914989wait, so the AI is perfect if you just include the subject or gender.That's amazing, didn't know it was that advanced already
>>736915242>>736915245He's bullshitting. Gemini 3 will correctly identify the subject as being unknown and use either "they" or word it in a way that doesn't say the gender.
>>736915245>bro you just gotta modify the sentence and then it won't fuck up and lie lol>>736915223KEK about that >>736915242>what's 1+2 >11>wooooooooooow how was I supposed to know you weren't talking in binary you shoulda given me context $1000000000000000000000000000000 wasted on this shit kek
>>736915482My god, quit lying.
>>736915482>bro you just gotta modify the sentence and then it won't fuck up and lie>lol?oh you're a retard, byeAI looking pretty neat tho
Anti-AI autists are so pathetic that they have to pretend like the AI can't already handle their stupid trick questions.
I remember using babelfish to translate Japanese Final Fantasy XI blogs back in the early 2000's because there were no great English resources for cutting edge end game content and the nonsense it spit back to you was near incomprehensible. It was like it gave you a cypher you had to crack to figure out what the fuck it even meant, a close approximation would be the Chinese WoW boss explanation memes(pic related) but even those are easier to understand than what Babelfish would give you.Translation tools now are so incredible, people don't realize how good they have it.
>>736915681it is even funnier because the AI got it correct as the sentence could have several meanings depending on the context and the autist is mad that the AI couldn't read his mind
