>if you need more than 1000 demons per level you're not making interesting encounters, you're just flooding>if a level strips the player of their ability to jump you've done a poor job designing the level>having a non-animated skybox in 2026 is lazy>closing a door, raising gates or removing an elevator which prevents the player from retreating backwards is unfair because the player is not familiar with the arena you've locked him in>every level should be built as if the player only had their pistol
the WAD has to be fun to play
>>736903475>if a level strips the player of their ability to jump>in the doom 2
>closing a door, raising gates or removing an elevator which prevents the player from retreating backwards is unfair because the player is not familiar with the arena you've locked him inEat my ass hit isn't a tactical shooter where you have the luxury of slowly clearing every room, you're in HELL
>>736903475i've got one:>provide ample and varied ammunition, if a player has solved an encounter using guns you as the mapper did not expect that shouldn't be grounds to punish the playerstop dumping rockets everywhere ffs
>if a level strips the player of their ability to jump you've done a poor job designing the levelZ-poser. might as well play brutal doom and 3 tap a cyber at this point.
>>736903596>he never rocket skipped
>>736903849This mooves you horizontally. That's not jumping
>>736903475>this scrub listkek so which wad filtered you op?
>>736903475>closing a door, raising gates or removing an elevator which prevents the player from retreating backwards is unfair because the player is not familiar with the arena you've locked him inShitter.
>>736903582Now THIS is controversial. Bet you only play fun video games faggot.
So which .WAD gaped you, OP?
>>736903648>isn't a tactical shooterSome wads are thoNot every wad is a slaughter
>>736903475>every level should be built as if the player only their fists
>>736903475Make more interesting WADs like MyHouse.
>>736910339Unironically this. MyHouse was, while not for everyone, a clear attempt to make something beyond a blind shooter in the engine. The fact that this blew up, took the world by storm, and nothing came of it is insane. Everyone just went straight back to making levels full of the same demons being shot by the same guns.
Kind of crazy how a lot of these "First few of the kind" are still fun to play
>>736910697myhouse only works in tranny UZDOOM, most popular doomers avoid it and play dsda
>pistol now has perfect accuracy
>>736910697>why do fans of a shooter game like making and playing shooter mods for that game
>>736910339To attract more secondaries? No thanks.
>>736903475those are highly limiting and subjective. it sounds like you might have ASD op.
>>736910339>>736910697you see the influence of myhouse all the timea ton of maps do the "endless corridor" shit nowa lot of them also do dynamic area loading like myhouse does
How about if we instead address the player?>you didn't beat the WAD if you oversaved>you didn't beat the WAD if you used a weapon pack>you didn't beat the WAD if you didn't pick the hardest difficulty pistol start
>>736903596Yeah but unironically. If your level design is broken by the default source port jump height design it better. Add a railing to ledge.
>>736916301define "oversaving"
>>736916301You beat the game if you got to the end. No exceptions>but muh exploitsIf they are possible to do, it's the devs fault>butNo.
It's interesting that Doom 2 has about 20 monsters, and yet there are still vanilla megawads that offer unique content.The fuckers who keep making open-world games need to learn from this, because their games don't even last 5 hours before you start feeling the severe repetition, while Doom has been mixing the same pieces for 30 years and there's still room for the feeling that you’re experiencing something new.Moral of the story: an open world with just 20 monsters could have 500+ hours of gameplay and still feel like every encounter is unique, but no one can pull that off.
>>736916830Saving should only be used when you are planning to stop playing the game.
>>736916914It's kinda wild. I personally think it's out of a deep understanding of how the demons work, and what demons complement each other nicely. It doesn't matter if it's the same demons every time if the demons are in varying groups with varying sizes in new positions in new maps. It's the same reason chess is still fun 5000 years later, despite the pieces being the same it's where you put them that makes it interesting.
>>736916914>open world>20 archviles
>>736916914and to top it all off it looks like complete shitegray and brown sprites and textures from the fucking 80s with like 2 frames of animationand it's STILL fun
>>736916903>You beat the game if you got to the end. No exceptions*THUMP**THUMP**THUMP**CRASH*HEARD YE WUZ TALKIN' SHIT LADDIIIIIIIIEEEEEEE
>>736903475>if you need more than 1000 demons per level you're not making interesting encounters, you're just floodingThis is the "sentences that will make people mad" thread. I don't want to argue about this, but I want to make it clear there are good and bad ways to put a shitload of enemies in a level. They don't all have to be nuts.wad where the fun is only in killing so many demons. Projectile enemies, like the Imps, not the Chaingunners, target their attacks directly at you. That means moving sideways a bit makes it harmlessly pass by. There are weapons that are specifically good at killing a big group of enemies, like the rocket launcher. Like any Doom level, the player should have enough ammo and power ups to win a fight, but not so many strong options that the game becomes a joke. I could talk forever on this, but I'll just keep it to one more point: walls act as both stage boundaries and cover, so the terrain needs to be interesting without stopping the player from having a fun fight. In short, Doom can be fun with a ridiculous number of enemies, the level just has to be built for it.
>>736903475>>if you need more than 1000 demons per level you're not making interesting encounters, you're just floodingSkill issue>>if a level strips the player of their ability to jump you've done a poor job designing the levelSource port faggot zoomers get the rope>>having a non-animated skybox in 2026 is lazySource port faggot zoomers get the rope>>closing a door, raising gates or removing an elevator which prevents the player from retreating backwards is unfair because the player is not familiar with the arena you've locked him inSkill issue>>every level should be built as if the player only had their pistolOk2/10Do better
>>736903901>going from one platform to another with a gap in between is not jumpingbrainlet
>>736921069>Walking off a ledge fast is jumpingRetard
>>736903475>slaughter maps have a right to exist>so do maps that are faithful to dooms original control scheme>graphicsfags in classic doom>waah i dont like maps that dont let me turtle>only decent criticism, depends largely on the wad as a stylistic choice, imozoomie speedrunner brained/10, op is a faggot like usual but at least hes awareheres one of mine but might not be controversial:>maps also feature a shitty weapon replacer thats barely or not even different than stock, does more to cause mod incompatibility than to be interesting
>>736903475>if a level strips the player of their ability to jump you've done a poor job designing the level
Can i get some lesser known decent WAD recs my niggers ive played all the popular wads made by people like Skillsaw and Ribbiks now im really struggling to figure out what to play. I'm an analysis paralysis fag.
>>736903475Sure, i'll contribute:>Having a hidden archvile constantly reviving hitscanners on inaccessible ledges doesn't make for fun level design. It's just frustrating for the sake of being frustrating. >Putting an archvile on every other encounter is tiresome. >making you fight a cyberdemon on a room with barely any space to avoid spash damage is awful>if I have to shotgun a baron even once i'm dropping the whole fucking wad>don't put essential weapons for clearing the level like the SS or BFG in obscure secrets, I shouldn't need to look a guide for all the secrets to beat your levels. >stop putting over 5 secrets per level. Secret hunting fucking sucks. Secrets should reward exploration so just make them relatively easy to spot if you go out of the main path. Maybe one harder to spot secret per level, not all of them.
>>736924380MAYhem 2018 Orange and Purple versions
>>736917031>1 hour level with 5000 enemies>cyberdemons and/or archviles trap in the final roomSuck my ass. I'm saving after every major fight.
>>736924885In the Doghouse had some excellent slaughtermaps. Has one with literally 5000 demons.That's not even the biggest one.
>>736916457No. I hate GZniggers.
>>736917864>complete shiteSpeak for yourself, I prefer it over most modern games
