Hidetaka Miyazaki ruined an entire generation of games.
its people who need to get their head out of their ass when it comes to video games, its not a true skill that matters to defeat a boss so why do you care so much to struggle so much
>>737854070The problem is that other devs have tried to emulate what Fromdoft does. I wish "soulslike" didn't become a genre. It should just be left to Fromsoft because clearly no one can beat them at their own game. Not everyone likes souls games, and souls mechanics infecting a wide swathe of games post 2011 is unfortunate.
>>737854203>be me>browse internet>see online randos struggle with game and complaining>see superior smug randos who mastered game making fun of strugglers and acting smug>i never played game but want to be the superior smuggo>play game until i can join the smuggo groupThis is literally how souls markets itself
>>737854203It's boring if it's too easyBut frustrating if it's too hardThe dick needs to be just rightGoldielocks cock
>>737854070It wasn't like this before ER. Should've just stuck to the DaS formula.
>>737854249Lies of P did beat fromsoft
>>737854387It absolutely did not
>>737854203The difficulty isn't really the main issue, it's just a samey easy way to do difficulty without clever design. It's also why their bosses completely fall apart when they have to deal with more than 1 enemy.
>>737854373This style started during DS2 and fully fermented during DS3, elden ring is just this design pushed to its logical conclusion.
>>737854516>expedition 33 boss fight
Every time a boss animation falls at a slower rate, hovers in the air without the ability to fly, or does some other shit that basically violates the laws of physics I want to give the developer a wedgie. Anime brain rotted fucks.
>>737854554It was nowhere near as bad in those games.
>>737854387Lmfao
>>737854554Playing through Shadow of the Erdtree then fighting vanilla bosses is fucking hilarious, you can genuinely feel the design changes. Like the old bosses are moving in slow motion by comparison.
>>737854070Miyazaki is a hack who doesn't even know what made Dark Souls good. He got fooled by the wannabe tryhard normies that praised it for its difficulty, but that was only one of the many factors that made the game good. For some reason, Fromsoftdick focused solely on this aspect--probably because it was the easiest to market--and that's why everyone is so divided on Elden Ring. Only wannabe tryhards enjoy Eldenshit, not because the game is actually good, but because they falsely believe that partaking in this torturous odyssey makes them part of some sort of masochistic community, while the true fans are left to scoff at the overly difficult game design that borders on absurdity.
>>737854249This except the opposite.
>>737854070why did shazam lose and get raped?
>>737855597Matthewmatosis won.
>>737855864Won what? Elden is one of the most successful, influential, and popular games of all time. Even its roguelike spinoff, Nightreign, was very successful and continues to mog bigger, more recent releases like Marathon if we're going by daily player count alone. mattjewmatosis got exposed by gred glintstone and firelink conspiracy for being a fraud.
>>737856242>if we're going by daily player count alone.>Measuring the quality of a game by the number of people playingAvatar must be your favorite movieIt MOGS as you dickless trendchasing faggots say
>>737856242>Won what?He made the best review of Elden Ring out of anyone, and he did it years before the game released.>mattjewmatosis got exposed by gred glintstone and firelink conspiracy for being a fraudthe fact that he's lived rent free in the minds of soulschizos for years just because he dared to say he didn't like some of the Souls games is proof that their minds are leasing out permanent real estate to him. They can seethe for all eternity that some people don't like everything attached to the brand of Fromsoft, that's fine.
>>737855864I can't imagine watching people like this unironically. Do you ever think for yourself?
>>737854516Maybe don't stand there t-posing?
>>737854516this webm has a higher artistic value than every soulslike combined
>>737855864Shut the fuck up, Matt, and get back to work on your pixelshit "game".
The open world aspect adds nothing of value to the genre. Ohh, you did the things in this area first? Congrats, you're over leveled for this other area now so it'll be unexciting and lame to play through. The difficulty never feels 'correct'. The game's combat challenges and open world exploration compete against each other and make both worse.
>>737854387True. LoP's gameplay is far more refined and engaging than Elden Ring's, and its DLC was superior, too.As a day-1 Demon's Souls player, I'm glad I didn't become a blind From-Drone incapable of recognizing this.
>>737856463>He made the best review of Elden Ring out of anyone, and he did it years before the game released.lol ok. and today he's known as a shitter and a fraud that is bad at souls games and deliberately lied about what miyazaki quotes. >he dared to say he didn't like some of the Souls games is proof that their minds are leasing out permanent real estate to him.no. matthew tried to convince retards that difficulty wasnt the point of souls games and that elden became too hard while also misquoting miyazaki to support this argument.
>>737857213>today he's known as a shitter and a fraud that is bad at souls games That doesn't make any of his opinions incorrect though. Identifying hypocrisy isn't actually an argument, you still have to refute the opinion.
>>737857213>today he's known as a shitter and a fraud that is bad at souls gamesElden Ring is one of the easiest games ever made if you don't kneecap yourself by deliberately not using the best weapons and summons. Even DSP could beat it without too much trouble.>matthew tried to convince retards that difficulty wasnt the point of souls gamesAnd he was correct. Everyone understands that modern Souls could never do a pacifist boss like Astraea or a boss who becomes weaker in a second phase like Sif (Miquella was the perfect opportunity for this and they blew it to make the spammiest, rolliest, particle shittiest boss to date). Modern Souls has ironed out stuff that made early Souls so memorable. Everything he said about delayed attacks being a crutch in DS3 became so comically, blatantly obvious to people with IQs of 90 by the time ER came around that we now have memes like >>737854516 posted in every other Souls thread. The more Miyazaki has focused on technical difficulty, the worse his games have become.
>>737857595>That doesn't make any of his opinions incorrect thoughIt does when half of his points are a result of user error or deliberately misconstruing the intentions of the author.Now fuck off and get to work on your next pixelshit game that nobody will buy, Matt.
Elden Ring is a ridiculous corruption of souls combat. Some of the DLC bosses are pure nonsense and I have no idea how they thought the dancing lion was a good idea when the camera can fucking keep up with the thing.Anyone who says the game wasn't made with spirit summons in mind is delusional
>>737854387>>737857096This. Lies of P felt made with passion, and recaptured the magic of DeS for me. No obscure loreshit, no muh bigger and badder bosses, muh open world slop
>>737858610Crotch Rot Rossilin (?the centipede rotten bug lady) was the worst boss. She spends the entire fight running/rolling/flying away from you.
>>737857894>It does when half of his points are a result of user error or deliberately misconstruing the intentions of the author.So the other fifty percent of his opinions are correct?
>>737854387Lies of p fags really believe this.Lies of kiss is one of the most boring games I've ever played. I 1 shot every boss. Got fucken bored in the dlc and dropped it. Kill yourself
>>737854070Trend chasing faggots did, dont blame the original for the lesser.
>>737859403i fart at you and it smell:)
>>737856242>mattjewmatosis got exposed by gred glintstone and firelink conspiracy for being a fraud.fucking who?
>>737859403> I 1 shot every boss.cool story bro, unfortunately you are lying, but I do know a game like that, it starts with elden and ends with ring
Im content with games that use combat as context for an adventure and progression systems while not being too difficultLooking forward to witcher 4
>>737856579positioning doesn't matter in ER, the attacks track 360 degrees
>>737854736now try dark souls 1 lmaoholy it it's crazy how they can gradually make the bosses faster and faster and your brain just adjusts
>>737854070Normies unironically took the git gud memes seriously. You guys wanted to shitpost for keks and now you have created an entire generation of try hards that see completing these games as gaming accomplishments to be proud of. They can now all be cool together because they helped each other out to complete a difficult game. You guys chose this future so deal with it.
>>737856874>Ohh, you did the things in this area first? Congrats, you're over leveled for this other area nowthey did this in DS1 without having a bloated empty world
>>737855597That's a crazy fucking image. Do people really have the time?
>>737859657This mentality is why Crash 4 was so hard. They saw people saying it was the Dark Souls of platformers and assumed that's what people wanted. They directly listened to le hardcore speedtrannies when designing it
>boss goes apeshit for 10 seconds flailing wildly>at the end leaves about a .5 second opening>take a swing>so fucking bored and just want to get the fighter over with, take another swing>punished for half my hplmaoso i go UGS and try to stagger the faggot? "YOU DIDN'T BEAT THE GAME". go spells and snipe the nigger from a safe distance? "YOU DIDN'T BEAT THE GAME". use a summon? "YOU DIDN'T BEAT THE GAME"
soulsfudds will defend this
>>737859578NTA, is Lies worth getting? Im on the fence about it because half the people bitching say you need to perfect parry to kill guys and the other half say you can just ungabunga and its too easy. I like doing multiple playthroughs and making unorthodox builds so I dont want to be pigeon holed into playing a sekiro clone or conan simulator. Is it more like sekiro or more like darksouls?
>>737854070WOW, when am I supposed to attack here?
>>737859657The souldborne series have never been hard, though. They're unique (or used to be) so it took getting used too but once you figure out the 'trick' its ezpz and always has been. People thinking they're special for beating games made for a casual audiance is so pathetic.
What's with the uptick in Elden Ring bitching threads recently?
>>737854070this is from leddit or twitter, isn't it
Leda is a megane at heart!
>>737859812Well its why these Souls-likes have been so influential in the gaming industry. Even extending outside of the industry such as influencing Shows like Stranger Things. I knew all those years ago when I saw how much reddit and 4chan kept memeing the first Dark Souls that Fromsoftware definitely had a surprise hit on their hands that was getting grassroots support. This eventually led to them becoming the modern well known company we know today. Basically all of these memes worked. Their games just kept selling better and better until now with Elden Ring they are selling Skyrim tier numbers. We will see in a few years how much total sales the game achieves but my guess is it will get into 40+ million units sold.
>>737859957Dodging and spacing attacks in that game is perfectly viable, you don't need to parry everything, not sure about th eunga bunga I guess there's a cheese combo of stats and a weapon but I felt the damage was okay, I don't look up guides, people say the game is too linear but after Elden Ring's dogshit open world it was a breath of fresh air to have a simple mapGreat fucking story too, very good game for a first attempt, really looking forward to the sequel
>>7378600384 sec on there's an opening. Just like every other boss, try climb inside his asshole
>>737860171>influencing Shows like Stranger Thingsthe fuck are you on
>>737854249They can't even beat themselves at their own game considering they've yet to top Dark Souls
>>737860189This is all sounding really good. I heard the story ws wild but I didnt want to spoil too much of it just incase I bought it.Thanks man, ill try it out! I've had a soulslike itch that needs scratching but ive played all of them to death. Hopefully this does it.
>>737859957>multiple playthroughsyeah no
>>737854070Elden Ring is a good game. It's the best game in the "fast combat" arc of soulslike games, and frankly proved the system viable. But the DLC took it too far. In retrospect BB/DS3 seem to be in this awkward in-between phase. And unironically DS2 is the closest we ever came to a perfect soulslike.
>>737860636>DS2 is the closest we ever came to a perfect soulslike.You have to make your bait less obvious
>>737859403>soulslikes are measured by their boss difficulty and nothing elseyou're a brain rotted faggot and the reason the genre is such shit.
>>737860343Why no multi-playthroughs? Do you find all the weapons and stuff your first go around or is there little build variety?
>>737860683He's right, though. It has the best lore, the best locations, the best build diversity and the coolest armors (the most important thing)
>>737854387>my forced parryslop beat Fromsoft!Lol. Lmao even.
>>737854070It's funny because you can see his games become parody of themselves. DS2 is his last good game and people keep saying it's too easy.
>>737861187And the shittest gameplay, which is kind of important in a video game
>>737860636>It's the best game in the "fast combat" arc of soulslike gamesHonestly I think what I enjoyed most about Elden Ring was that even though it was hyper-aggressive a lot of the time you didn't have to play that way in return. Beyond the usual magicfagging you could do stuff like guard counters (years of shield+spear finally paid off), break poise, apply status even more grossly than before, etc. I'm sure you could even do a consumable build even with the stupid crafting.
>>737860269https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EZpUXKVtNk
>>737861187>best loregood individual storylines don't make up for how much of a rearranged cobbled together mess it is, even by souls standards. just look at people arguing if it's in what was lordran or not to this day
>>737855439I agree with what you're putting down but I think the core aspects of what made early souls games good are still ~60% intact in elden ring and as such I enjoyed it. But you're correct that they started flanderizing themselves to appeal to xbox retards who actually thought Dark Souls was hardcore
>>737860269
Sorry but i dont take 4chan posters opinions on From games seriously, you motherfuckers get shat on by every baby filter every time a new From game releases so i just assume all this bitching is from casuals.It was Gasoigne and BloodstarvedIt was every enemy in das3It was the giant in sekiroIt was margit in ERIt was the fucking tutorial helicopter in AC6I just cant with you niggers.
>>737861664this board can't even do a z-input, are you surprised?
>>737854338Lol glad I 'tried' the game instead of buying cause it's boring
>>737861664>muh baby filters>muh casualsImagine being so fucking casual you think these games are hardcore. People out there doing no damage runs with their fucking tongue. Fucking Super Star Wars is harder than this shit
>>737860038>spam dodging away from the boss like a panicky pussyEvery fucking time. It's funny because the giant light pillars that follow every attack which specifically appear behind where the player is standing is the developers literally screaming at you "STOP FUCKING ROLLING AWAY YOU COWARD" and yet people still can't help themselves.
>>737861664More than one person uses this website, dumb-dumb.
>>737854070rollslopware an its consequences have been a disaster for gayming
>>737854569>Make a boss that kills itself after 100 dodges/parries>Won't die to any other strategy when you first see it>Literal meme fightI'm sure they thought this was hilarious.
>>737861854Good point, people complaining that these games are too hard are actually even more pathetic than I previously thought
>>737854203Overcoming hurdles is fun, don't know what to tell you. Not like being good at soccer, playing guitar, chess, etc are relevant outside their fields either, I mean people competitively stack cups even.
>>737854387Man I get hating a company but you’re praising people who made shovelware using 1:1 mechanics for something nobody even remembered or talks about.
>>737861754Not for a long time but i swear there used to be a time your average /v/irgin was actually good at vidya, better than me who was always subpar at least, but somewhere during the mid 2010's this place just got plagued with casuals, must be all the phoneposters and election tourists.>>737861854Thats my point nigger, im not good at vidya and always play sub optimally in my first playthrough of all souls game (level up all stats equally to test everything) and i STILL dont bitch at 99% of the content the games have while there is constant crying about unfairness from here, its frankly embarrassing and im impressed someone didnt make a collage of "first week of new souls game" to grudgepost later showing /v/ whine about tutorial level stuff.
>>737861991What's crazy is that you can place any complaint about the game and someone will twist your words to make it seem like you got filtered>the combat is less fun because bosses rely more on memorizing moves now than previous games, and while I did not struggle I enjoyed the previous style of boss design more>OHHH BABY GOT FILTERED BY BOSSES? LEARNING WHEN TO DODGE TOO HARD? >a lot of open world encounters just ended up being annoying rather than challenging because they had no meaningful level design to work with, so they resorted to shit like making 20 enemies that shoot slow tracking projectiles and just peppering them across liurnia lake, or just copypasting the same shrimp 20 times spread out evenly>OHHH BABY GOT FILTERED BY WRAITH CALLING BELLS? SHRIMPS TOO HARD? >exploring in ER is shit because most of the little pickups you see lie around the world are random shit like arteria leaf>OHHH BABY GOT FILTERED BY EXPLORATION? TOO BAD TO LOOK THROUGH THE RUINS INSTEAD? Like you can literally make any argument but someone will just ignore it entirely and then claim your issue was struggling with difficulty. t. felt ER was very easy but badly designed in many aspects
>>737862125phoneposting has been detrimental for motor skills, people can't even navigate a directory or print screen nowadays
>>737862241>I AM SILLY
>>737861878It's almost like spacing is a natural way of avoiding danger or something. Being in the mindset of "is my hitbox on during the attack?" is purely gamist and goes against your sense of self-preservation.
>>737862417There's spacing and there's panic rolling 4 times in a row, stop mashing. Even in Nightreign there's a surprising amount of stuff you can avoid by just walking.
>>737862241It's because it's glaringly obvious that your core issue with the game is that you got frustrated by it's difficulty but you don't want to admit that so you call it bad game design instead.It's one thing to say that the open world detracts from the game and that there are too many reused bosses, that is legitimate criticism. Saying that the bosses are unfair or that certain attacks are undodgeable or whatever is not criticism, it's cope.
>>737861991>this game is easyI'm glad we agree. The difference between you and I is I'm actually not a shitter so I gain no sense of superiority for beating it (an accomplishment shared by millions of people including the blind, retards and people with no hands)
>>737862609>the game is easy>actually it's super difficult and you're a shitter if you can't git gudMake up your mind you stupid faggots holy shit
>>737862320Meanwhile look, there is one such retard right here >>737862609It doesn't matter what you say, these faggots will just read the words as what they want instead. They'll just strawman you as someone who struggled with the difficulty.
I find it how funny how the majority of the fanbase has the "real way to play" mindset instilled in their minds for no actual reason. In a game with hundreds of ranged spells, dozens of summon types and millions of vulnerabilities to exploit, you decide to just roll+R1 for 200 hours while not even enjoying it?
>>737862609>there are too many reused bossesLet me guess you got your ass beat by the powered up divine beast and now you totally hate it because it's reused, not because you're too shit to deal with the curse status, right?
>>737862503He's rolling 4 times in a row because Radahn keeps attacking. This has been the problem with modern Souls games. Enemies are hyper aggressive and flashy, and the Demon's Souls combat system just doesn't really facilitate it well.
>>737862417Rolling away over and over again without any sort of timing or logic to it simply because you're scared of the boss and you don't know when exactly to dodge so you just spam dodge is not spacing. It's panicking, and the game rightfully punishes you for it.>>737862674The game is difficult if you actively fight against it's systems and refuse to use the tools the game gives you because you've been tricked by the internet into believing that's how hard the game is intended to be. The game is not difficult if you play it like an RPG, it is difficult if you play it like Sekiro.
>>737854070if you actually understand boss mechanics then you can get in attacks far more frequently, usually every 2-3 seconds at leastanyone dodging a boss for 10 seconds just plainly does not understand the mechanics, this was most evident with Malenia
Why can't Souls babies handle Bayo or Ninja Gaiden?
>>737862768>the game is easy if you play as intendedThanks tips >the game is difficult if you deliberately hamstring yourself because you think you're hardcore for some idiot reasonThankfully I'm not an idiot like most of these cunts
>>737862609>Saying that the bosses are unfair or that certain attacks are undodgeable or whatever is not criticism, it's cope.What's interesting is I said none of that. I said I find it less fun to memorize boss moves and previous souls games didn't make me do it. That's all. I didn't struggle with memorizing them, I beat all bosses in ER without struggling too much after figuring out how to dodge the pertinent moves via memorization. It's just that I preferred the old style of souls bosses that didn't make you memorize much if anything, since the runbacks were long and the stakes were high. I found that gameplay more compelling because it's the dungeon crawling that's great about souls games in the first place, in my view, and not the boss fights. They were always mediocre and only good for the thematics, and even with all the spectacle they're still not that good in ERLike you are literally exactly what I was talking about. You aren't even reading my post, you just wanted to dismiss my points with "git gud"
>>737854070I like the souls games.I dont like when so many games try to be souls games.I like when people make games in their own style so that not everything is the same despite being seperate ips.
>>737854350thats why you have difficulty settingseasynormalhardetc
>>737862827Good question. It's because they don't like dull button mashers with non-existent level design, boring drab visuals and generic art styles.
>>737862827I like both.
>>737862273Phoneposting is such a plague in general>>737862241You can have tons of criticism for the game, i have 100 nipicks with it, but the 2 first things you mentioned just come off as difficulty bitching a bit. The 3rd personally i dont agree with it, all minor dungeons, ruins or camps always have at least one unique item within them while legacy dungeons tend to have the bulk of worthy items, which is what makes sense to me. What i do bitch about is that despite basegame having 200+ weapons way too many use standardlized movesets instead of the unique r1s, r2s or jump attacks that tend to be locked with 1 weapon or way too little diversity in the stat orientation of the weapons, 5 katanas and not a single faith one, plenty of hammers but no int one, etc...
>>737862862Who the fuck told you that memorizing boss movesets is necessary, or even intended, for you to beat bosses in Elden Ring? This is exactly the problem with discourse around this game. You fundamentally do not understand how these games work because your brain has been poisoned by internet discourse which has led you to believe that the only valid way to play this game is to press R1 and circle and literally no other button.
>>737862969>Bayonetta >Generic art styleSouls niggers are retarded
FROMsloppers you ok?
>>737863030>Who the fuck told you that memorizing boss movesets is necessary, or even intended, for you to beat bosses in Elden Ring?Incredibly dishonest. Nobody beats Malenia without learning how to dodge waterfowl dance, which you can only learn by seeing the whole move a few times. Same goes for messmer, rellana (the DLC one, if that's how it's spelled), gaius, radahn, just to name a few. All of them have moves that you must memorize in order to beat them.
>>737862609I know its jeet hours but is it really that hard of a concept for people to understand something can be difficult and completely nonsensical or pointless?
>>737862969Soul babies average IQ
>>737859564*parrys you fart and then riposte*
>>737854070There are bad bosses like miquella's consort but I don't know what the fuck you're talking about if you think this is most bosses in ER, in the DLC alone I used a light greatsword against Messmer and was able to do a FULL CHAIN of light attacks on his ass if I spaced and made correct reads on his moves, especially if I started with the jumping R1/R2s. Don't even get me started on Malenia, she fucking staggers with a sneeze, I still remember being baffled at how I could just hold L2 with the spinning arcane greatsword weapon on her after every crit and just take half of her health bar away at like level 110
>>737863049As far as other braindead button mashers-but with a special difficulty mode that requires perfect knowledge of the game-games go, yes, generic as shit. B1 looks like any other game of its era, DMC 4, Resonance of Fate, piss filter and all, B2 look-DIDDY BLUD EPSTEIN?
>>737863140>Nobody beats Malenia without learning how to dodge waterfowl danceAre you just not aware that shields are in the game?You're proving my point, you and most other people who critique the combat of this game, believe that the proper response to every single instance of damage in the entire game is to use roll iframes to dodge it and any other way of avoiding or mitigating damage simply doesn't count.
>>737863192Really? Name 5 other games that look like Bayonetta souls tranny
I just want a DkS remake. Why did they kill bluepoint… the DeS remake is kino. cope, seethe and dilate
>>737863252Ah yes the block malenia strat and let her heal to full, incredibly viable how could I forget
I didn't like the open world design of Elden Ring so I stopped playing it. I like Dark Souls 3 and Lies of P way better.
>>737863252>Are you just not aware that shields are in the game?She absorbs health even if you block, making her effectively unkillable because she heals more than you dish out in the fight.
>>737863192Souls niggers calling anything else brain dead
>>737863285That look like the horribly overdesigned character Bayonetta? Idk bro, maybe the first Nier has designs just as awful but I doubt you're gonna count it.
>>737863287>>737863310Once again, this is an RPG. If you built your character properly then you should be able to do more than enough damage to make her healing completely irrelevant, even if you block every single attack she throws at you.Do not fucking tell me that something is impossible when I've literally done it myself, and it was piss easy too.
>>737863140I beat her ass with my mimic tear without dodging shit. wad that up and smoke it kiddo
yepthat's souls kino
>>737863252Another dishonest post. You need to position certain ways or have a fully blockmaxxed build to be able to block the waterfowl dance without dying to it. How would you know these things without having seen it first? Even your approach requires memorization. Just take the L at this point.
>>737854070players need access to movement, dash and air dash, wall run, double jump without torrent, etc... cause i mean look at this, LOOK AT THIS.
I like both DMC/Bayonetta and Souls games. The worst is actually when a dev tries to use heavy inspirations from both. Fuck Stellar Blade
>filters all Souls niggers
>>737863359>This is an RPG, so if you built your character any other way than my specific block setup you're having a skill issueThese posts just get dumber and dumber. You literally cannot criticize any aspect of this game without these actual nigger retards coming out of the woodwork
>>737863398That looked coolLot of opportunities to parry though, those guys swordswings are parrybait
>>737863375You people are pathetic and you prove over and over again that when you say the game is "poorly designed" it's just cope for you being shit at it.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D42nVH8lcFI>>737863428Notice how you didn't actually provide a counter argument. Here I'll sum it up incase you got lost:>You said waterfowl cannot be dealt with without memorization>I said you can just block it>you said if you block it she heals to much and will never die>I said thats not true because I have fought her this way before and as long as your build isn't retarded her healing wont outpace your damageYou then had no counter argument to this and lashed out with insults. You lost.
>>737854070Picrel has never been true for any boss.
>>737863252>>737863359I'm neither of the people you are currently replying to but I just wanted to chime in and say that you're a fucking idiot.
>ERM REVISIONISM, SOULS DIDN'T USED TO BE DIFFICULTIt always was about overcoming challenge and the old games were much more brutal if you went in blind.>THEY TOOK ELDEN RING IN THE WRONG DIRECTIONIt iterates on the exact same principles.
>>737863580So no counter arguments to what I said? Just insults. Yeah, you lost too.
>>737863534>You people are pathetic and you prove over and over again that when you say the game is "poorly designed" it's just cope for you being shit at it.You're like a broken record. You don't understand that nobody is complaining that waterfowl dance is hard to deal with. Yes, I also found out I can interrupt it. Yes, I also found out I can just avoid it. The point is that it required seeing the move first. It required seeing it and having my attempts ended by it a couple times until I got it. You can post an endless amount of your retarded little "how to deal with X if you already know what X is!" videos and it doesn't change that. You just don't comprehend my words.Literally there is no point talking to you because you literally don't have persistent memory and after each post you forget that I never once said it's hard to deal with or anything like that. Just that the issue is that you have had to see it first. Retarded nigger.
>>737854070>HOT TAKE:Elden Ring is a standalone "Dark Souls 2". It has a lot of dark souls 2 DNA in it, by that I mean it has a lot of nonsense and fucking awful htiboxes and wonky shit, but people are too proud to admit it. It's straight up jank and gimmicks all the way and no amount of highly choreographed videos of some guy beating a boss with his bare naked asshole after practicing the fight for 150 hours is gonna change that. The DLC is some of the most jank-ass fucking trash fromsoft has ever done. Bosses are mostly just "Monster Hunter, but the monsters spam AoE bullshit as they fly away to the other side of the arena after you hit them once". It is fucking BAD, dude. Worst boss design of all the souls games by far. In fact, Malenia is the big bad name of all bosses and it's only and exclusively because she has a homing combo move that 1-shots you and you have to figure out how to avoid it somehow because other than that she isn't particularly noteworthy. Remember when people thought the DLC leaks were fake because DLC Radhan looked so fucking janky and shitty but it turned out to be 100% real and it really was that fucking shitty? Yeah, fromsoft aren't untouchable. They can produce absolute stinkers just like everyone else. Elden Ring is a 7/10 at the very best and I'm basing that score on the overall feel I had from my first and second playthrough. It's just modded dark souls 3 but slightly less boring. Bloodborne, Dark Souls 1 and Sekiro are still their best games to this day. Armored Core 6 is good but that's a whole other genre and demon's souls is a classic by default and it has the best atmosphere.
>>737863601Open world slop ruined it
>>737863534>>You said waterfowl cannot be dealt with without memorization>>I said you can just block itYou can't unless you walk a specific way and avoid most of it btw, or use barricade right before she does it. Both of these things require memorization. You don't have an argument.
>>737863617Lost? Counter argument? What's your counter argument to being a fucking idiot? Are you implying that any of that shit you said made any sense?
>>737854070I still don't know what elden ring, dark souls, fromsoft, or soulslike even is, despite reading those words basically every day for I don't know how long.t. Medieval 2 enjoyer
>>737863601The older games didn't have open world principles. That completely changes the methodology for exploration and how everything is structured. They took it in the wrong direction.
>>737856456Steamchartsisters… our response?
>>737855864Yep, video still holds strong and likely always will. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Np5PdpsfINA
>>737863534These kinds of people tend to approach things with an eternal beginner mindset. To them, a game's fairness isn't about what is involved in the process of handling something, but instead about how they feel upon trying to do it the first few times and pretending that getting better at games doesn't involve learning a game by default, and that knowing/not knowing something depends on many factors.
>>737862241I find it hilarious that this post sparked a chain of posts where one anon is doing EXACTLY, 1:1, PRECISELY the thing described within. Zero selfawareness
>>737863713>>737863723This is exactly why people just say "git gud" and dismiss you retards. There is no reasoning with you. No matter what I say, even if it's supported by objective facts about the game, you'll just go "nah doesn't count game sucks I win bye bye"So fine, I give up. I'm joining them. You are shit at the game. You need to git gud. End of story.
>>737855597I'm confused, do these retards think threads of /v/ are going to make a game more or less successful?
>>737854516Would have been more accurate if it was facing the wrong way to start
>>737863359You grinded didnt ya?
>>737863892Didn't need to because I'm not retarded.
>>737863808Anon there is plenty of learning involved in these games. I just don't enjoy memorizing movesets. It was never a part of the older souls games but ER made it a feature and I don't like it. No amount of screeching about skill issue makes sense to retort this, given that I don't think ER was a hard game to begin with. I beat every boss within a couple attempts at most and I didn't feel outskilled, and I didn't even use spirit ashes. Any attempt at dismissing my problem with the game here with "skill issue" is just total non sequitur. I'd have to have failed at learning the game properly to have a skill issue. Not every learning process is fun for everyone though, memorization isn't for me. I'll leave you two indians alone now to completely misconstrue what I posted for a fourth time and instead INSIST I was having a skill issue when I found the game pretty easy and fairly balanced.
I never understood the souls genre.Just use magic. It's not hard.That giant wolf with a sword? Shoot it.The giant snake man? Shoot it.The flesh abomination? Shoot it.Works ever time.Only retards try to get next to a circle saw and try to slip a toothpick between the grooves.
>>737863637>if it takes multiple attempts to beat a boss it's poorly designed
>>737863654Time to admit DS2 was the best DS then, since Elden Ring is the most successful Souls game of all time.
>>737863828You weren't doing anything else from the get-go retard. You didn't read what was said, started sperging about skill issue instead, and still can't refute that the bosses require memorization. Nobody said the game sucks or is unfair. That's all in your head, and you're just repeating your mantra over and over because you can't actually comprehend that someone could have an issue with game design that doesn't stem from difficulty or fairness.
>>737863914>I beat every boss within a couple attempts>I just don't enjoy memorizing movesetsThis doesn't make any sense to me. Ignoring the fact that most people can't learn a boss' entire moveset in only a couple of attempts, why would you fight every boss if every single one of them required doing something you don't enjoy doing?
>>737863951A very high brow attempt at reductionism, but no, that's not what I said. I enjoy when the game requires me to learn and understand new things to succeed, and I don't mind the game punishing failure to do so. What I don't like is trial and error gameplay, which isn't the same thing as that.
>>737856598
>>737863914That was my first post in the thread. Regardless, I understand that not every kind of boss design is for everyone, but the problem is that it's rarely ever explained the way you do. Rather than seeing it as not being for you, or a game designed at odds with what you value these for, it's instead about being unfair (a term that's bent whenever it's used), irredeemably bad, or whatever else. However, I respect you for not doing so, and it was rude of me to assume that everyone arguing from that perspective seeks to berate those who do like the design.
>>737864043>trial and error gameplayMeaningless buzzword. Almost every single video game in existence involves trial and error in order to beat it.
>>737864037I never said I'm memorizing whole movesets. >why would you fight every boss if every single one of them required doing something you don't enjoy doing?Because the rest of the game is 10/10. Not enjoying the boss fights as much as earlier games wasn't a dealbreaker for me. I didn't mind that much. The whole thing about "game sux" was just strawmanned onto that criticism. People are incapable of nuance nowadays.
>>737860291>They can't even beat themselves at their own game considering they've yet to top Dark SoulsI agree with this. My thoughts after playing DS 2 and 3 is that they and most of the people hyped about "soulslike" think that the "hard boss" aspect is what made DS such a hit when that never was the case. It was about exploring the world and being able to build a character that could get through it without constantly scaling up to get through challenges. All of the sequels were ass because the worlds became linear "go to next boss" which made it boring. I remember how awesome DS was with discovering short cuts and secrets that you missed the first time. Made it rewarding to replay where as the latter games you had none of that.
>>737864106I beat many DS1 bosses and areas without deaths and still found them appropriately challenging. You're incorrect, trial and error isn't required to build challenge. It can also suffice to make players play defensively and pay attention to their surroundings. These games are dungeon crawlers at their core and that's what I enjoy them for the most.
>>737863994I gave multiple solid arguments for why the bosses do not require memorization and all I got in response was insults. So I'm done arguing. You are shit at the game, git gud.
>>737864175You did no such thing. You posted a video explaining how to avoid dying to it, all the methods explained within required already having seen the move a couple times to either have memorized the move itself, or memorized the startup of the move in order to cheese it (which in itself is a trial and error thing, you don't know waterfowl dance is something you would wanna interrupt because it's hard to dodge if you didn't try dodging it a couple times first)
>>737854070Retards who forrm their entire personality around rollslop would've just found something else if there was no rollslop to do so with. Insufferable people will be insufferable regardless.
>Demon's souls+dark souls 1Bosses have a handful of moves, most do tons of damage so paying close attention and taking advantage of the many openings the boss has is crucial.>Bosses do huge damage but the attacks are all clear and well telegraphed. If a boss looks like they're swinging, they are, and if you get hit it's entirely your own fault.>Elden ring>You're not allowed to beat the boss solo until you memorize each and every one of its 100 different but similar looking moves, mix-ups, delays, punishes, tricks and counters.>All of its moves do huge damage but it's impossible to tell when you're supposed to defend or how.>Game includes jumping but most sweeps aren't jumpable and you will be punished for trying.>But you can jump attacks that don't look jumpable at allBravo, FROM.
>>737863916No, I like to hit things with swords.
>>737854070I wonder who could be behind this post...
>>737854516>removing the part where the boss turns in circles while moonwalking
i wish dork sauce and stamina combat did not spread it's grabby black tentacles into every single action-adjacent genreestus and any sort of per-checkpoint resource management is a genuinely great design paradigm for this post "limited lives" era, but when every single dash is treated as an i-framing dodge roll and every attack has a longass startup i think it's time to pack your bags
Cope faggot, seethe even...
>>737864428Hideo Kojima?
>>737854070>"FromSoftware games are fair!">[FromSoftware games continue to let enemies attack through objects like walls and pillars when you can't]
>>737854516Zanzibart tier humor
>>737854070I FUCKING KNEEL to Miyazaki-sama, Bluepoint tranny studio obliterator.
>>737864487Wow hes just like me.Except I dont publish my games I keep them as exclusive things for me only.
>>737864564Kojima fucking despises Miyazaki... Well, the feeling seem to be mutual desu
>>737864574Entirely truthful but outrage-inducing for some inane reason? Want to talk about the stupid ass enemy behaviour logic that makes human-type enemies roll off cliffs instead?
>>737862105>shovelwareretarded fucking zoomers don't know what shovelware meansit's not a catchall term for games you don't like you fucking stupid child
Day 0 demons souls player here. All went to shit exactly right here.>le you are going to dieAs soon as i read these words i knew these game was fucked forever. As always, developer misses what made the game good.
>>737854249Depends what you like from soulsborne games. Games like Lords Of The Fallen (the second one) or Bleak Faith have long since beaten FromSoft at exploration.
>>737861434I didnt think it was, I just assumed it was somewhere other than the exact same spot as ds1 & 3.
>>737854070It wasn't Miyazaki that ruined it, it was sweats demanding the games be harder.
>>737864651I agree, they focused too much on the meme difficulty, and put aside things like mystery and interesting level design
>>737862241I think the horse really ruined it also. Every enemy is really fast and has a way to catch you. It cheapens the joys of mounted combat
>Duskbloods is the highest budget, longest dev time game fromsoft has ever made with Miyazaki personally heading the project>permanently exclusive to switch 2>makes snoys seethe>makes pc vegans seetheKino is coming
>>737863363How annoying. I hate the dog like enenys in these games. They've never been fun, just an annoyance
FromSoft should port Deracine or make an actual Echo Night sequel, I'm tired of rollslop
>>737864854Its just a tarkov clone, AC6 was in dev time for just as long.Im curious on how quick the game will die, i underestimated NR but im pretty sure Duskbloods doesnt last a trimester.
>>737863637Its shocking to think a majority of people are like that guy. They drive around, they vote.. its more spoopy than the lovecraftian horrors in Bloodborne
>>737864854It will be shit like all tendie slop
>>737864162>I beat many DS1 bosses and areas without deaths and still found them appropriately challengingIf you beat anything 1st try its not challenging at all.
>>737865023>>737865032>the cope beginskek, 10 million copies in 2 months minimum
>>737862934No, that's why you want difficulty settings.>how much HP do you want to meatsack whack atThat's why you actually have those settings.
How do ER fans ignore that every boss has a checkpoint outside its door to excuse how terrible the combat is
>>737854070It always annoys me that Fromsoft fell for their own hype when the "prepare to die" marketing wasn't even something they made DeS and DS1 in mind with. They used to be about exploring a harsh world and the difficulty was just a means of creating an obstacle to be overcome for exploration but with DS3 the games are just about difficulty and exploration isn't important anymore.
>>737865101I very much doubt it, i think ER did 30mil in that time, you think 1/3rd of all From fanbase has a switch2 or that nintendo fans will just buy Duskbloods for no reason?
>>737865176Duskbloods selling anything less than 10-15 million in 2 months will not happen. Yes.
>>737854387At least it has no Zanzibarts.
>>737865176Elden Ring sold 16 million copies in 3 months retard bro. 30 million is lifetime.
>>737865272Sorry, it has been a while so my number game is weak, but that makes the whole thing worse doesnt it? It would take the whole 2/3rds to make the numbers the guy is thinking. >>737865218Im not petty enough to screencap stupid shit to post later but feel free to do with my posts if you want to boast later then, nothing sweeter to show off how right you were in your predictions.
>>737862752That was a lull, just running away would've done more.
>>737865397Already did screencap, Duskbloods with either A. Sell Elden ring numbers or B. Outsell Elden ring numbers. 10-15 mil minimum in 2 months, it will also become a system seller.
>>737862827Bayonetta is pretty easy on normal mode, honestly
>>737865494>nightreign, a non exclusive, didn't even get close to 10mil salesLOL, DB will be exactly like bloodborne, a mediocre selling fromsoft game stuck on a console.
>>737854070this is one of the reasons why i think kingdom hearts and ff7 remake has better combat in souls you are always the loser faggot looking stupid while the bosses do all the amazing acrobatics and combos and effects. In kingdom hearts and ff its both of you the player and the boss acting like fucking gods.
>>737865159trial and error was fundamental to the design of demon's souls and it still is in elden ring. I don't understand where this idea came from, but it's wrong.
>>737863363>base dogs with havel skinfucking howit's the intro boss
>>737859403You didn't even play it, tranny
>>737865494Well good luck, May cant go by quick enough so we can get the june direct and with it a new trailer and the release date.>>737865584Give up, the man is either trolling or delusional, neither worth taking too seriously or good for mockery
I feel like a lot of game devs gave up on actually trying with action combat since fromsoft games became popular. It isn't that we don't get action combat games not in the souls format anymore but it seems like a lot less, not much coming up either.
>>737854387This. So did Stellar Blade, unironically. I feel embarrassed to have sunken 200+ hours in elden slop after playing those two vastly superior games.
>>737865143there are plenty of games with difficulty settings that actually alter enemies and their behavior but not numbers like that at all
>>737863749Open world isn't what people mean with difficulty
>>737863914>I'll leave you two indians alone nowself-hating indian detected
>>737865494>>737865584>>737865660NTA but I think Duskbloods will sell well. Probably not Elden Ring numbers since it's exclusive but if from pulls off this concept they are going for it could be big.
>>737865625What?Did you even play this game??
>>737865781I dont know man i just dont see the market for it. Think of it like this, ER, their biggest game, a 30mil seller, is now at 30-40k players on steam right now, lets be generous and double the numbers thanks to consoles, thats 60-80k active players, but there is zero guarantee even half of these people are interacting with the pvp WILLINGLY, be it invading, arena duels or co-op with the intention of pvp and this is a game targeted for this audience, its a pvp focused souls-flavored tarkov clone (but not a shooter, the most popular genre for MP-pvp focused games, but a 3d action game). Like, maybe if its REALLY good it might do well and become a system staple like the ps4 became the BB machine but its just so incredibly niche in its appeal i dont see it happening even in the best conditions.
>>737865621What a monumentally stupid fucking thing to say. You're not even disagreeing with me. Notice how I said difficulty and not trial and error gameplay? Dumb fuck.
>>737865984imo we simply do not know enough about DuskBloods to make any conclusions on it, we need another showcase trailer + release date
>>737854070Anybody that sincerely believes the OP pic is just bad at building a character. If you can't trade hits with a boss because of your defense or stunlock a boss with your poise damage, you're intentionally choosing a light build that relies on being a glass cannon that also only does light, high damage but low impact attacks. And at that point it's your fault for playing a character like that and getting mad that you're playing at the boss's tempo. You can easily make a build where you control the pace and direction of the fight because of how many options you have to tank boss attacks or stunlock them (which is what the game is built around).My first playthrough of the game was just using a greataxe with Wild Strikes on it so I stood in front of bosses holding L2 until they got stunned (the only boss this didn't work on was Malenia). With heavy armor, high investment in Vigor, and defensive talismans you can out-trade any boss. And this is just the easiest method I could find to do that strategy without any outside input. You don't even need heavy weapons for that, as straightswords and katanas tend to have insanely high poise damage for their speed (especially if you use Square Off or Unsheathe).There are videos of people beating the game without ever pressing dodge or block and niggas will still claim that armor is useless because they think it's Dark Souls 3. Literally just don't equip the soreseals, level Vigor (the best stat in the game), and eat hits.
>>737866303They are already said it is a pvpve game with focus on pvp and its the tarkov (and darker than dark) inspired game Miyazaki was mentioning in interviews a couple of years ago, what exactly are you not sure about that description?The only question is how much pve content (or content in general really) there will be, we know there are at least 2 bosses (frogtits and Blaidd-Axe Edition) and some regular mooks (all the white hooded guys in the trailer and promo pics) but how much else will there be is the question. NR got to recycle all of ER's content so it felt fine-ish outside of having ONE MAP, but Duskbloods doesnt have the luxury of being a spin-off and siphon its content from their biggest pve filled content game so im curious how much will it have.
>>737859763It's been happening forever. The faggots used to organize over IRC and set "targets" for which games they would make impossible to discuss on a board, and which games they would push.
>>737854070Haven't played elden ring is it just DS3 again where shields are useless?
I wonder what would happen if these games didn't have boss health bars.
>>737856874>The open world aspect adds nothing of value to the genreit does you just have to do it like gothic 1
>>737866446You are a moron Fights are supposed to be these beautiful dance where you go toe to toe with a boss instead of fighting them 30 times to memories number of moves in the combat, delayed attacks, which attacks are 360 which ones aren't and when he's going to some aoe bullshit with little to no tell
>>737866631It would be more frustrating to fight embut if game was balanced around not having health bars then it would be a lot more interesting >>737856874Open world and feeling of real exploration and adventure is the best part of the game you are just a combat faggot
>>737854070It's shit like this that has ruined later soulsborns for me.I hate the end game and dlc boss fights in this and dark souls 3 because everything becomes hyper aggressive rollslop, I literally hate this shit for all the reasons people praise them to high heaven.I unironically like dark souls 2 more than this shit.
zulli the witch
I really liked Morgott and the female knight boss fight they actually felt fair and right Instead retarded Aoe shit that breaks your combo
>>737854070I just beat the shit out of the boss while my Mimic Bro holds aggro because I'm not autistic enough to place dozens of artificial restrictions on how I play a video game.
>>737854070I got like 1k hours in elden ring, i never really felt like this in elden ring, but it did feel like this in dark souls 3. what no poise does to a game, good lord.
>>737854387>Incels of Vlol. kys
>>737854070I hate parryslop and I hate rollslop.They're literally just hidden QTEs. And now we're getting encounters based around them. And as much as I hate parry bullshit for being a QTE, the i-frames roll bullshit, because it depends on you knowing what is essentially the exploit that your character very briefly becomes invulnerable when in certain parts of the roll animation. And there are boss fights built around you knowing that.What's worse, the mechanics that were actually interesting in Dark Souls 1, like the need to be judicious with how you spend your stamina are completely gone in the sequels and copycat games. You had to cheese several items in Dark Souls 1 to get stamina regeneration that is baseline in the sequels and copycat games. Out with the resource management mechanics, double down on parryslop and rollslop.
>>737854516That webm is what everybody is thinking but doesn't have the competence to animate. It doesn't test your skill, it tests your patience and when your playing time is limited, your patience runs out quickly.
>>737867925>QTEsdefined by how an interactive element is shoved into a relatively non-interactive aspect (cutscene, reload animation) but combat is anything butyou could argue that risk/reward is way too skewed, or how parries tend to be the saddling point of optimal play, or even just claim that focus on plain positioning with no deflects nor iframes is a better way to design a gamebut you didn't and now you sound like a retard that can be easily dismissed with a>HURDUR I HAVE TO PRESS A BUTTON TO EXECUTE AN ACTION DURING COMBAT FUCKING QTES MANget a grip anonymous
>>737868394More so stubbornness to learn every cheap shot and trick game can pull off and all the permutations and combinations of the moves Owl from sekiro also does that but it fits the character and he's the only one who is doing that and sekiro fights are much quicker so you can learn most of it in 10-15 minutes
>>737854070he invented the inverse of Devil May Cry, where the bosses are styling and SSS comboing your dumbass while you wait your turn to get two light attacks in. lol
shadows of the turdtree flopped in japan btw
>>737866446>out-trade bossesyeah right dude, elden ring is the worst game for tanking, they haven't recovered from everyone posting the one havel vs artorias webmhold on let me set up to trade with a boss>get to near end game to get malenia's rune>get specific weapons and arts(armor optional)>cast spell, cast art, eat consumable, throw perfume>can trade with the boss ONCE before needing to back off and regain health
Ooh so hard https://youtube.com/watch?v=Ifw64EoIO1w
>>737867586mohg, morgott, godskin duo and radagon are fun to fight, same with some others but i don't really care for the direction fromsoft is going and that's fine
>>737867623Based
>>737869126>didn't use some of his hardest abilitiesthe boss can just decide to throw?
>>737854070And yet these souls "pros" lose to a khezu and then ragequit and cry.
>>737869296When presented with the optimal gameplay of rolling to the left, yes
Reminder that Miyazaki never once said "difficult was never the point" and he also repeatedly praises trial and error mechanics in video games. You're all mindlessly parroting a bunch of youtube essayists, who in turn are mindlessly parroting Matthewmatosis, and Matthewmatosis was flat out wrong. Or he just lied, which is even worse.
>>737869436Idk what they saying but trial and error is assbeans
>>737869296That is every boss fromsoft has ever made. For example, Malenia is easy if she just decides to never use that shit where she does 20 attacks midair with perfect tracking
you can literally CR2 malenia with a greatsword completely safely on her finishers
>>737869505What's the issue? I don't want to just walk into a boss room and be able to intuit every single thing they're going to do and auto win. that's fucking boring.
>>737869436Weird how he managed to predict exactly the way in which Souls would degrade. I guess maybe seething some more will make people like retarded attack animations that completely break immersion just to make the attack harder to predict.
>>737854516>>737864447
>>737868921>to learn every cheap shot and trick game can pull offYeah it's the equivalent of those super mario clone games that kill you regularly in ways you can't predict until you die to them
>>737855439Funnily enough the reason DS1 was considered difficult was just that it didn't casualize itself in an era when everyone was doing that.
>>737870351This is pretty much why I never got Elden Ring, it was already headed in a bad direction with DaS3
>>737867297
>>737854249This
elden board
>>737857674You say that while the Ancestor Spirit exists, you have to murderize animals and natives to be able to get to him and he doesn't attack unless you do, you can leave the arena and not fight him at all. He's the easiest boss because he's clearly not a fighter. You are slaughtering a majestic creature just because you can and want to, not because you needed to.
I'm so glad you guys don't work in game development holy shit
>>737859657Cool, now let's see how they do against Glock Saint Isshin. I'm betting he's the least beaten boss in all souls games. I love Iudex Gundyr because they had the balls to actually gatekeep you from the entire game if you couldn't beat him. 0 chance they would do that in the current age. Then again I know people that dropped Sekiro at the chained ogre.
>>737862969>dull button mashers>Jump+r2>ad infinitum
>>737863534>zero souls in over 95% of the video
>>737854070If they knew they were likely to take a hit in that situation then they did get greedy though.
>>737865023There is no universe where fromsoft makes a tarkov clone. Unless you mean an extraction game with typical fromsoft gameplay, then yeah, probably.
>>737864625>Kojima hates Miyazaki and vice versaHuh that makes sense actually. Kojima is "skip gameplay watch my movie". Miyazaki is "there is no movie, here's an item description, go figure out the story".
>>737854387Maybe Dark Souls 2. Lies of P is below Dark Souls 3 (one of the worst Souls games) tier. Hell, I'd put it below nu-LotF.
>>737862503>there's panic rolling 4 times in a row, stop mashingif he didn't keep rolling he would have been hit even soonerYou can't expect the average player to perform hitbox/tracking manipulation against such a fast paced, overwhelming, unstaggerable and high damaging entity
>>737856242''Soon enough all we'll be left with is a generic blob of a game. Enjoyed by everyone, and loved by no one.''
>>737862768>you don't know when exactly to dodgeso every player will have to go through some stage in which THEY DON'T KNOW when to dodge correctly, and according to your definition that equals to PANICKING, and should thus be PUNISHED?You are unfathomably retarded
>>737861434it wasn't Lordran
>>737854070Imagine being this filtered by a From Software game. Do you think there are movie watchers who get angry that the Godfather is considered the best movie ever? If so that's you.
Why do people care so much? Personally I just don't play games I don't like. There's no gun to your head making you play souls likes. I don't play first person shooters or 4x.
>>737862609>Saying that the bosses are unfair or that certain attacks are undodgeable or whatever is not criticismit isyour autismo/challenge runner/nolifer experience doesn't reflect the averageand the average player who DID NOT abuse cheesy tactics (like summons) found enemy attack patterns to be too overwhelming to be enjoyable on their 1st playthroughIt doesn't matter that every single fight in ER can be learned to be done hitless OR can be cheesed, too many players were unable to have fun. That issue stems from its design and pisspoor balancing, no matter how rowdy you folks get about this
>>737865689nah
>>737874464>u have to le learn le bideo jame?
>>737863359>If you built your character properlythe game is nowher near tightly designed nor finely balanced for you to have such expectation on the playerbaseIt's the worst argument you can make to defend ER
>>737874608The average player used summons.
>>737854387Lies of Pi is shit
>>737874608>too many players were unable to have funThis is not my problem. Games should cater to their audience instead of trying to please everyone.
>>737854070Based truth sayer, fromcultists will defend that>delayed attacks>roll the whole game to find illusory floors, rollslop ultra>rats will stop your ultra heavy weapon windups with mid game armor, making fast weapons superior due to same dps but more opportunities/less anim cancels
>>737874608>too many players were unable to have fun.The game received massive widespread praise, your opinion is not the majority
>cheesy tacticsBro you have brain rot. No one's complaining about grenades in an FPS or using Earthquake in Pokemon. How the fuck does this genre attract this level of mental gymnastics where people refuse to use all the tools the games give you but then pretend the game is unfair?
>>737864106>Almost every single video game in existence involves trial and error in order to beat it.funny that the DeS to BB run didn't fall into this paradigm, outside of a few gotcha moments (like hellkite)One almost has to wonder why they became so popular and influtential...
>>737874608>your autismo/challenge runner/nolifer experience doesn't reflect the averageIf you want to nuke this argument, just remind them that difficulty is a relational property and epiphenomenon. You and the usual webm poster have different nervous systems, brains and experiences, if a boss is bullshit to you, they're bullshit, because being bullshit isn't an objective heuristic, it's again, relational.In fact, if they tell you that the boss isn't cheap, they're projecting, on top of actually lying.
>>737867623Why even play the game if you're just gonna let an npc play it for you? I just don't understand you people.
>>737874775It's because there are retards on the internet who will insult you for using basic game mechanics that they arbitrarily decided are verboten and some people out there are autistic enough to take the word of retards on the internet seriously and actually follow their arbitrary rules when they play their own single player game that they bought with their own money.
>>737866446it's nice that ER allows you to play a tankthe issue is that the balancing is way too much weighted towards a handful of specific optionsand that a tanking/hit trading playstyle only becomes viable in the mid to late gameand that certain bosses can easily invalidate it unelss you're turbo minmaxed and using summoms to draw aggro
>>737874905Have you never played a singleplayer game with NPC allies before?
>>737874757and a large swathe of the original souls audience were people who liked the methodical dungeon crawling were patience and preparation were rewarded more than slamming your face against a brick wa over and overIt seems that ER catered to people who enjoy the latter more
>>737874701If the game design is good, it should be feasible for a skilled but totally unfamiliar player to complete deathless. If the design is good, after every death the player should be able to say ofc i died i did x. If the design is shite it has mandatory learning experiences that you can't predict.
>>737872128I only beat Isshin once in my life, and it was by sprinting around him and chipping his health after combos. Insane fight but feels more fair than any of the bullshit in Elden Ring
>>737874774because the first 20-40 hours are amazing and most of the game's flaws aren't readily apparent yet
>>737862503The problem with Fromsoft games is that you either end up like that because you treat it like a realistic fight where his swords hit everything in their path and then there is the way of autistically memorizing the hit detector jank and either stand right before the boss where the swing goes through you, jump over a strike that should hit your legs/feet and so on.
>>737875000>If the game design is good, it should be feasible for a skilled but totally unfamiliar player to complete deathlessDo you really think it's a reasonable expectation for a person to be able to beat a video game without ever seeing a "you died" or "game over" screen? I can't think of a single game that's like this, can you?
>>737874701good game design teaches you things, gradually, and then expects you to use those teachings you've learned to overcome obstacles, without necessarily failingSome failure is to be expected, but that expectation should not be ingrained in the design of the challenges themselvesIf you do, you get with rage games like Cat Mario: unpredictable bullshit that exists in a vacuum, your prior experiences do not help you prevent itThat's what ER challenge is skewed towards
>>737854070Dark souls 1 was fine, dark souls 2 is literal perfection and its why frombabs hate it so much (they cant spamroll entire fights, they cant instantly spamfill their hp)Every boss in dark souls 2 is also pretty fair in terms of difficulty.It says a lot when most of the dark souls 3 players get filtered and stop playing at smelter demon. They are dogshit at the game without spamming rolls
>>737874906That's insane, I can't think of any other game where this occurs unless we're talking actual bugs or cheats
>>737874775nigger, I'm not disparaging their use. I recognize they're cheesy, but they're a valid way to clear challenges. rarely satisfying, but also not frustrating at least
>>737868394It doesn't test your patience. It abuses your intuition. The monkey brain knows things don't move like they do in nu souls garbage. That's it. That's the trick.
>>737875138>Some failure is to be expected, but that expectation should not be ingrained in the design of the challenges themselvesWhat the fuck does this even mean?
>>737875081it's not about it being reasonable, it's about the mindset the designers/artists/animators etc... have when they begin crafting these challenges>>737875138
>>737874992It's the people slamming their face against the wall who are whining in this thread. ER rewards actual patient and prepared players with so many tools to counter anything the game throws at you.
>>737866303It doesn't even matter because there's only been like 15mish Switch 2 total sales, it's not going to be a system seller when Nightreign is superior and not on a shit console, and not every tendie is going to buy this game, probably less than half as none of these fags buy anything but tendie games to begin.
>>737875180What makes them cheesy? Name any other game where using a feature with a tutorial is somehow cheesy? People not using summons are either good enough that summons mess with aggro a la cats in monster hunter or they're on their own special little challenge run, why the fuck did this view catch on?
>>737874983Not one that plays for me, no. I'd prefer playing myself, otherwise I'm just watching a movie or whatever.
>>737874992It's your own fault for slamming your head against the wall over and over because you mistakenly believe that the developers are expecting you to just learn to time your dodges better as literally the only viable strategy for a boss.
>>737863861These people are freaks who need constant affirmation or they kill themselvesOne of the ways they do this is to try to convince others that their views are correct and yours are wrong, this rntirely falls apart however when objective facts are in play (like that elden ring is a good game)
>put on tower shield>use guard counters>use summons>use crafted items >beat the entire game and dlc>have fun
>>737875204>I expect some players will fail this fight the first few times, but I taught them how to use this mechanic in the level prior. if they've mastered it, they will eventually succeedgood game design>You know this animation for Gaius charge looks fine, but it's too easy to dodge since we gave the players spammable rolls with a gorillion iframes plus a horse. I NEED them to die a bunch of times to this move, because this way the gamer street cred mentality will be used to shield our product from criticism.. That won't happen if the game isn't "hardcore"!! Suzuki-san, prease make the tracking and duration of this charge super obnoxious, will you?Bad game design
>>737862768>literally every single character of note in the entire game has some kind of magic, ranged projectile, or AoE ability to deal with a variety of situations>thousands of niggers of 4chan screaming and pissing and shitting because their gattsu cosplay (no crossbow just the sword) had a rough time with malenia
>>737875348No anon, you can't use mechanics that exploit the fact that you're playing at the bosses pace. That's cheating and you did not beat the game
>>737854373DaS3 DLCs are just that.Base game is surprisingly tame. The most outlandish move is the final boss doing DMC air combo on you.
>>737875348>have funAre you tho?
>>737875472>Base game is surprisingly tameOcerios, motherfucker
>>737875374I don't know what I'm supposed to take away from this post except that you really had trouble with Gaius' charge attack. Did you try blocking it? Or using quickstep? Or using bloodhound step? Or raptor of the mists? Or vow of the indomitable? Or just being tanky enough that it barely does any damage?
>>737875501legionary cosplay with tower shield and short spear w/ broadsword swap was actually pretty kino
>>737854070>game sells dozens of millions of copies >and also generate endless seethe from casuals at the same time From truly saved the video games industry during its darkest hour.
>>737854070This approach was great in Dark Souls games. Elden Ring is like a parody of it. It's entirely unfun. That's why I won't buy the next game.
>>737875394>thousands of niggers of 4chan screaming and pissing and shitting because their gattsu cosplay (no crossbow just the sword) had a rough time with maleniaI agree, although there is something to be said about the fact that the game does not scale proportionally with the player's arsenal.Either the game's way too hard, or pitifully easy, 1000+ hours in it alongside tons of replays and I've never been able to strike a run that really felt great to play.
>>737875501Yeah I had a blast even though everyone was telling me I didn't. Trying to memorize 10 swing combos and rolling 5 times per attack just doesn't sound as fun to me.
>>737875223No, ER rewards patience and preparation in the sense that it forces you to do a whole bunch of tries against each and every boss (what you learned previously doesn't carry over btw) until you get it right, either through sheer memorization or by crafting a temp build that can deal with that boss specificallyThe other route is just looking up OP and cheesy builds/strats and sticking with them, oneshotting everything throighout your entire playthrough
>>737875612I'm sure holding block and R2 after negating every hit is fun. I believe you.
>>737854338and in that process nobody realized they're a fucking retard for boasting about being a good gamer like a 12 year old, holy kek
>>737875562Souls games are easy fag
>>737863140No anon you must be foolish he clearly beat every single boss on his first attempt lvl 1 with a broken sword, you just need to git gud. It's genuinely fucking hilarious how much that moron is just proving your point that "git gud" is a lazy deflection of all criticism.
>>737875652Are you saying that when you died to a boss you would just do another attempt again and again without switching things up or changing to a different strategy? You just went back through the fog with the same plan that got you killed the last time?
>>737857674>Modern Souls has ironed out stuff that made early Souls so memorable.When I imported demons souls and loved it I could've never imagined what it'd evolve into.
>>737875673I'm sure losing to radahn 200 times is fun and you don't just get off on finally being free from your mind prison and pretending you're cool on 4chan for wasting your time.
>>737875710Then why is everyone ITT whining about having to slam your head against a boss over and over again for hours because the game is unfair bullshit trial and error with undodgeable one-shot AOE spam attacks?
>>737875303>are expecting you to just learn to time your dodges better as literally the only viable strategythey aren't expecting that, but they've made bosses bullshit enough so that if you aren't planning to hit trade/max block/go ranged/use summons you will have a miserable experienceAnd if you do any of the above with enough knowledge of the game mechanics you will just steamroll most fights with no satisfactionThe issue is that there's no middle ground
>>737875516I didn't have much trouble with Gaius at all. But if you can't see why the attack is obnoxious and poorly designed then I'm afraid you have a terminal case of fromdronismyou're just deflecting.
>>737875725you're implying as if there's any way to formulate a "plan" or "strategy" when you fight a boss the first few times, considering the amount of incomprehensible animations and patterns and hitboxes they throw at youYou can only go in to try and make sense of the thing, one pace at a timeUnless you steamroll them with summons and OP ashes of war, that is
>>737855864is that the retard who got filtered by the congregation in ds2
>>737873103Yeath thats what it is, an extraction souls-like but with the focus on the pvp instead of pve.It is a very funny game when you think about it.
Everyday the memes shitting on souls get further and further from what actually happens in the games.
>>737874438Considering how many "ER is trash" videos there are, he seems to be wrong about the latter, and with plenty of "I love ER" as well, he is also wrong about the former.Double wrong, as he usually is.
>>737856703He actually finished it and it was shite anon
>>737874438A large amount of people consider Elden ring the best game ever made with seething browns hating it
>>737876238>you're implying as if there's any way to formulate a "plan" or "strategy" when you fight a boss the first few times, considering the amount of incomprehensible animations and patterns and hitboxes they throw at youI managed to do it just fine
>>737855864>lie about "difficulty was never the point">a decade+ later people are still regurgitating it
>>737874905>y-you have to play the game my way!!!fromcucks are hilarious
>>737856242>Elden is one of the most successful, influential, and popular games of all time.
>>737875348for me it's powerstancing bandit curved swords.
Playing DS1 for the first time. I like the level design in general but hate the following things:>fires too far away from bosses, have to go through the whole level again every time >every secret room or hidden hallway just has a miniboss that wrecks your shit harder than the actual boss of the level>damage is too punishing, you are expected to "learn" attack patterns but you can't survive 3 hits when the boss may have 5 or 6 patterns, for example, so you HAVE to play the same level over and over again (see point 1)I really wanted to play ER but if you're telling me it's even worse then I might not bother.
>>737881690man dark souls was so soulfulER is just an open world boss rush
idk I think fromsoft games are fun
>>737875048I remember distinctly being disgusted after playing the games the first time I saw someone spamming forward rolls into attacks and thought it was so lame and didn't feel intentional, he gave up no space by having to move out of the way, it didn't simulate getting out of the way in any way like a sideroll would even if part of the model would have clipped the feet, there was no cool parry animation or anything that would make sense, just a pure exploit...then that became the intended way to play basically from that time on.It felt like a betrayal for my scrawny ass on shaky legs holding l1 for dear life in a grounded dungeoncrawler and had turned into devil may cry.
>>737854387I am a big fan of Lies of P and think it is a fantastic game but get your head out of your ass. It's not even remotely close. A great game but it is no dark souls. For instance, most of the levels are literal hallways.
>>737875516So you do know it's a bullshit move you can't properly dodge.I like ER and the even more the DLC, but you'll find the occasional unfair move every now and then.
i like the way the maiden in black says "touch the demon inside me"
>>737875612Did you actually chooss those tactics yourself or did you just look up the easiest build on the internet?
>>737882819I've finally came to emulating the original DeS and it's so interesting seeing how the roll was originally meant as a repositioning toolEnemies don't have magical gapcloses in their attacks that makes them hit you even if you roll back away from them, but their hitboxes linger long enough a lot of time that if you try to use the iframes to roll into them you'll end up getting hit regardless
>>737884039If by "dodge properly" you mean rolling to the side with midrolls then I've done than many many times. I only offered that advice because he seemed like he was struggling to do it that way.
>>737884135She's talking about her uterus
>>737864574Truthnuke that makes fromtrannies -ACK? Yeah I'd say so
>>737854070Oh god the 15 hit combo>Walks around abusing spacing and hits his ballWhen will it be my turn?!!>Jumps over swing and delivers stance braking jump attackThis isn't faiiiir>Shoots a gorillion space laser beams while standing in safe spacePlease no more>Throws a pot of status jizz causing the boss to stagger with aidsAIEEEE slop slop>hit the boss with a full charged attack while he distractedly flails at ashI hate ROLLING AHHHHHHH>Parries boss putting him into a stagger as I hit him 15 times
>>737885173Sorry anon you're not allowed to use basic game mechanics, they contradict my narrative.
>>737884686Doesn't mean it's not a bullshit move with a much tighter window than normal. There's a reason everyone struggles with this particular move, so much so that everyone knows when you mention it, and you need to bother to give alternative advice that isn't just "time it properly". Don't be disingenuous.
>>737884670Yup. It's very hard to capture how it felt playing it as your first souls game and that setting the expectations going forward. It had a very specific design that worked in certain scenarios. The boss design that with a few exceptions (flamewalker etc) felt designed to have you have conquered the level slowly, and then be shitting your pants as you had finally reached the fog with a ton of souls to lose and having to start from the beginning of the level if you fail, the challenge being to compose yourself and try and not panic roll and to instead figure out the puzzle aspect of it, despite how terrifying it is. So in a white room scenario the boss is easy as shit, but as a first time experience learning the systems and not knowing the boss, it was tuned for that. Once you learn all systems and level up your rolling game and figure out i-frames and learn that you can just run through levels to get back to a boss it kind of falls apart, but for the first half of the game playing blind it had something really magical there. While I love all souls games I wish they'd make a soft reboot of sorts that took a different path after demon's souls and tried to keep it about the dungeoneering and staing clever and calm rather than an action fiesta. A game that would prevent diebacks and embrace those aspects and keep fear of losing souls etc instead by changing incentives and mechanics to fascilitate that.
>>737881690The more of these games you play, the more you adapt to its particular brand of bullshit. You also do get better at these the more you play. However, going into Elden Ring, a lot of people think they took things too far if you intend to play them like you did from Demon's Souls to Dark Souls 3. Elden Ring can be relatively easy comparatively if you abuse a lot of the extra mechanics and systems the game gives you. In fact, a lot of people didn't complain much about the game because there was a literal guide and interactive map that showed where everything was upon the game's release. However, if you're like me and you go in blind, the game is an absolute pain in the ass to play. You miss a lot of critically useful items, miss out on a lot of content, and are generally lost most of the game. I don't know why people defend Elden Ring so much. The game is an incoherent mess with its content spread out thin for the sake of being "open world." I platinum'd the game, too.Just keep in mind that you get acclimated to the series' bullshit the more you play, so it doesn't feel all that bad.
>>737885173>>Walks around abusing spacing and hits his ballYeah faggot retardedmost bosses can turn 180 in 0 seconds>>Jumps over swing and delivers stance braking jump attackUnless you dedicate entire build to unga bunga that's not happening
>>737854070name 1 boss
>>737854249soulslike was never a genre Its an obtuse way for the brainless mutants that love these games to describe them because they havent the first clue what an action rpg even is Its so pathetic that its become a catch all for games that have a death/respawn mechanic present in the game at all
>>737867925stamina management in practice was just early game "god I hate running out of it on bosses" *put every level in endurance until you get enough to roll x times and swing your giant sword once so not be bothered by it* only difference is you didn't sprint. If they actually made it so that sword n board or just blocking anything is something anyone but beginner's would still do and actually made stamina mangement an incentive, then sure, but it's basically irrelevant to anyone but beginners during a few hours of des/ds1.
>>737886094Ivan PopeHe was a nice boss but ended up laying off almost everyoneBut what can you really do in this economy
>>737870351sekiro not having these for the most part made that game so insanely enjoyable, I felt like from was so fucking back and had found another way to make the game challenging, then ER happened.
>>737854070The reason Elden ring is so frustrating for most people is because the game enforces mandatory time-to-hit (TTH) with little other options for challenge aside from time-to-hit. It's like Miyazaki decided every enemy should have the exact same amount of room for player's to attack in advance, and just filled the blanks in with random shit.basically every option worth using in Elden Ring for a "skill-based" playstyle.>Roll R1 during the slow parts of an enemy's flailing>partially charged R2 during humanoid hyper armor>R1 once because the enemy is delaying their attack>R1 twice because the enemy is delaying their attack>R1 three times then roll because the enemy is delaying their attack>endlessly mash R1 without locking on because the enemy was designed for horses>Jumping R2 once, wherever you can>wait two seconds because the enemy is flailing (Roll R1)>wait three seconds because the enemy is flailing (Roll R1)>hold the run button for four seconds because the enemy is flailing (ash of war once)>spam roll for twelve seconds because the enemy is flailing (R1 three times)>spam roll for twelve seconds because the enemy is flailing, DLC version (ash of war once)Waiting is hard for people with a high time preference. They'd rather wait the same amount in a movie game like uncharted with actual stimulus like dialogue and cutscenes, than wait for artificial shit like an elevator, respawn times, crossing an empty map, etc. This is why Resident Evil and The Last of Us are gaining traction. Elden Ring isn't artificially difficult, it's artificially slow, same for all souls-likes.
>>737854338>I act like thisAnd i am in fact superior to you
>>737885818People like "learning the trick that makes the game easy". it's an entire genre now. Games where you learn the piece of trivia or random wikipedia article or gimmick, and you just stomp the same way over and over. These threads always have some smug guy self-reporting like "derp i used the braindead thing and didn't engage with the game at all". Metroidbrania or whatever.>just ignore the combat! Just spam [thing]! Just go here, and grab [thing]! You didn't grab [thing]! I picked it up! I'm good at games!
>>737875612hitting a boss in the back from complete safety as your minion takes all the hits doesn't sounds like a very engaging action game
>>737886681Sekiro lets you get really aggressive and chop down the health bar if you actualy dodge and move
>>737886709They added guard counters and stance breaking to the game and even told you to use them in the tutorial but everyone pretends like they just don't exist and that this is still DS3.
>>737855597What a fucking pathetic life, to spend you free time on discord gayband and doing ''coordinated'' trolling on /v/
>>737875612>>737875673>>737886995If only there was some kind of middle ground or something.
>>737887068There's zero reason to use guard counter unless the enemy is already slow enough to spam ash of war. It's high commital in a game where enemies like to randomly cancel and reset their animations as they see fit. You waste stamina, and many enemies will just hyper armor through it.
>>737887068>stance breakingWorks for sekiro because you can see it and only use one weapon it's very inconsistent in ER
>>737885173not to mention it's totally possible to be a complete shitbrick either with a greatshield or a poised up colossal weapon build trading charged r2s. the community psy-op'd itself into thinking roll and r1 is the only way you should play these games, got frustrated by dark souls 3's roll catching and got more frustrated by elden ring doubling down on it. everything else is cope.
>>737886995>hitting a boss in the back from complete safety as your minion takes all the hitsThis is for sure the intended way to play as is revealed by the rewards. All the legendary boss weapons are just the boss's long ass animations ported to the weapon leaving you completely vulnerable. If you play solo you have dodge 10 attacks to counterattack for one second and repeat-gameplay. Unless you really work at finding openings to use them, they're mostly useless. If you have summons, all the boss rewards are suddenly viable. This is what Miyazaki wanted. He wanted you to do anime ultra attacks in the back of a dragon.
>>737886709Those are quite the amount of attack options though, especially when you substitute your R1s with R2s, Charged R2s, or Ashes of War, depending on how many R1s you could fit in.
>>737887228If you have enough time for an R1 you have enough time for a guard counter.Also where did this meme come from that enemies in ER can cancel attacks? I have an insane amount of hours in this game and I've never seen it happen once.
>>737854070Remember, this is fine and you just gotta git gud but when DS2 puts more than 3 enemies in a level and you cant iframe through fogwalls this retard fanbase throws a hissy and it's "artificial difficulty"
>>737887240In my opinion the fact that you can't see the stance bar in Elden Ring makes it a lot more satisfying when you trigger one.
>>737887690>2tranny whiningdon't see that often
>>737855864who
>>737887690In DS2 everything looks like it's ice skating while constipated and has super stiff combos so it just looks naturally glitchier.
>>737854070>challenging gameplay focused games instead of hollywood movieslop>fun multiplayer without greedy live service or microtransaction bullshit>ruined gaming Is it opposite day?
>>737887494It's only like 3 hits there. "Skilled-play" Is mostly discovering the TTH and putting in as many R1s as possible. Soem enemies like to flail the second they lose too much posture, so you just make that hit the heavy one.>>737887536idk what to call this rubberbanding gimmick throughout the game.>Attack 1: believable animation speed, believable recovery time.>Attack 1, 2: same animation, much faster, same recovery time.>Attack 1, 3: same animation, much slower, much faster recovery time.>Attack 1, 4: same animation, same speed as Attack 1, same recovery as Attack 1,3.It feels like bad netcode, i thought it was my GPU doing it, it's just enemy behavior.
>>737888048you don't understand, everyone else in the industry making poor souls clones or ramming souls mechanics in their games is fromsoft's fault, not the leeches.
>>737887159There isn't, as these gameplay aspects aren't designed to be situational so you naturally vary up your gameplay. Once you have those setups the easiest way to win is to just spam it. You have to actively fool yourself and pretend like you can't justt use your best shit. It's bad design. You have to create that middle ground by not upgrading your summon so it dies halfway through and not roll with any of the op weapons or ashes. My solution was to play with no summons, rollslop, not upgrading health or weapon too much by switching them around a lot, then focusing on staggering.
>>737887494>how I sleep knowing he literally wakes up and starts walking around. shit meme
>>737888048>challenging gameplay focused gamesartificial cheese product
>>737888456>There is no middle ground, all you can do is (describes exactly how to find a middle ground)
>Invaded by-
>>737886978If you're ever going to claim someone didn't beat the game, it shouldn't be because they used ashes/shields/consumables/broken weapons/whatever, it's because of this.If you found stuff on your own, used it, and steamrolled, you beat the game. If you leveled up too much by finding a good source of souls or a lot of exploration, you beat the game. If you threw all the summons, spells, and consumables you could at the boss, you beat the game.If you looked up online the best weapon, strongest ash, cheesiest spell, whatever happened to deal most damage to a boss, then you didn't beat the game.
>>737887690DS2 is my favorite game solely because I like Dynasty Warriors.But let's be real, that game does have a lot of flaw, starting with half the game looks like GMOD full bright map with zero lighting
>>737854387Why does Lies of P mentions trigger Fromtards so hard?
>>737888682
>>737887056With some exceptions where you can abuse it like lady butterfly, you could really try your hardest to get to angles where you break through the block and hit them directly in between parrying them and try your hardest to win including uses dodges and it was still a decent challenge on a first run so, that was great.
>>737854070>Hidetaka Miyazaki ruined an entire generation of games.No, tastelets who kept playing his mediocre garbage acting like it was a reddit badge of honour to get some gamer e-cred did.
>>737854070Are you a character action troon?
>>737888905Only bonfire and torch fire cast actual shadow in DS2. You will be seeing flat lighting most of the time.
>>737889101>Only bonfire and torch fire cast actual shadowYou're saying a fantasy game doesn't have LED street lamps everywhere? woah
>>737888961body type a/b
>>737888590point is if you have to ignore the majority of mechanics to reach that middle ground yourself then it's not balanced design. It's like how dishonored is a stealth game incentivizing non-lethal gameplay but 90% of your tools go completely unused for that playstyle.
>>737889352Why does Dishonored incentivize non lethal gameplay?
>>737888629Damn that performance hit is totally worth it for EAC, right guys?
>>737860081Shazam has been getting raped for the last 4 years and they haven't really gotten over it.
>>737889435the story for one, if you haven't played it i won't bother with the analogy
>>737861854Why did /v/ get raped by a helicopter?
>>737887442god elden ring sucks
>>737854070excluding bloodborne DS2 was the last interesting game they've made in terms of new mechanics and systems (even if some are bad), since then it's all just about bosses and rushing through the game as fast as possible to get to them
>>737888905Now post the Shaded Woods.
>>737889697If you mean Dishonored 2 then sure, the level design really fucked with morality there.For Dishonored 1 you only really get punished if you try to clear a level of all enemies, you can just go through the levels killing guards in your way and still get the low chaos ending
>>737886709that sounds like too many variations to memorize for anyone but the 0.1% 200 iq players, but perhaps you are implying that people feel these timings subconsciously and through muscle memory alone, even if they can't articulate it, so it FEELS static and reptitive.
>>737889697That's not an actual reason
This is pretty funny>git gudders are shitters who couldnt deal with more than one enemy and infinite iframes for everything>b-but the lighting and animations are badWhile there is truth to that, the fact that you couldnt counter the actual point raised means he was right
>>737875513If he was in Monster Hunter he'd be a starter hunt.
All of these retards glazing Lies of P like it isn’t the most boring boss-rush parryslop “soulslike” of them all. That fucking game doesn’t even deserve to be called a soulslike, because it completely sacrifices any and all level design for “muh hard combat!!!” Like at most that fucking game is a Dark Souls 3 like.
>>737862241Why did /v/ get raped by the tutorial boss in AC6?
>>737890428But you dont need to parry shit in P, you can, but you can also dodge and if timing is too hard then just block and then R1 your health back
>>737854070There was nothing stopping you from not going all in on rolling. You chose to play the game like that.
>>737863096Why. Did. Shazam. Lose.
>>737874438Nothing about Elden Ring is generic.If anything it doubled down on all the obscurantist aspects of Souls design more than any other title in the series.And it is considered the best game ever made by a large portion.of the player base.What makes that Mick mad is that the game isn't full of retarded gimmicks because Matthewmatosis cares more about banal "novelty" than actually good mechanic. Unless it is by Kamiya, in which case he loves it when the games do the same stuff forever.
>>737859578>> I 1 shot every boss.>cool story bro, unfortunately you are lyingNot him. But blocking is super fucking overpowered in Lies of P. I genuinely did 1-shot most of the bosses in the game. But I never played the DLC. I heard it's more difficult. Maybe blocking is no longer enough. I'm guessing Lies of P is a much more fun and engaging game if you actually play it more like Sekiro and engage with more of its mechanics. But there was little to incentivize you to ever take any unnecessary risks when blocking was so easy to execute and you could just recover the damage you took while punishing the enemy.
Because of staggering and jumping Elden ring had quite a lot more variety in attacks and made you actually vary r2s, jumps when you could ,and awarded risky super aggressive play to try and squeeze every attack out that you could to keep the stagger going.Kind of lost the feel of the more defensive style typical of earlier souls though.
>>737864854>pc vegans
>>737890578>didn't rollyou didn't beat the game
Elden Ring is the tranny's oneitis.
>>737857674The first phase of Rennala's fight is the Maiden moment, where you bust into a room and beat on children and a mentally ill mother for no reason other than greed. If you're too illiterate to understand that without some Irish guy telling you it, you don't get to have opinions.Beyond that, Messmer's fight gets easier in the second phase. And the Fire Giant becomes crippled as the fight goes on.
>>737890585Matthew. Matosis. Won.
>>737890740>I genuinely did 1-shotNot that guy either but that doesnt mean what you think it means.I do agree that blocking is really strong in Lies of P, but nobody brought that up, its always parryslop or just "game bad" with no substance, which means they didnt actually play the game
>>737860125Adorable little killer.
>>737890553There are absolutelt bosses in the game that force you to parry. Besides, the fucking game was built around parrying, you have to really go out of your way not to during each boss. And that shit isn’t even fucking “parrying” to begin with. Its that fuck ass Sekiro perfect block, you don’t even get the satisfaction of an actual parry’s staggering! What the fuck!
>>737889963it's not entirely dishonored's fault, it's also just an expectation built up in the stealth genre that if you have the option to non-lethally take someone out it's always better to do so, so when presented with that option in d1 you feel like you should do it. Just taking out completely like in SC:conviction (something that game doesn't get praised enough for) would have been an option, and completely in line with Corvo's revenge quest, or you make it a lot harder or have guards wake up very fast to disincentivize it. Iirc part of what made people play non-lethal in d1 was the extra objectives that could come up to do it non-lethally so you felt like you should play in line with that for that MGS-style "good ending" . Once you got the inkling that killing people changes the story (even if the threshold for that was a lot higher than one thought as you pointed out) people were more inclined to go non-lethal.tldr; stealth games glorify non-lethal so players tend towards it, eliminate it entirely like in sc:conviction so players just feel free to go ham.
>>737862827Why would they play a worse type of game?Why are DMC fags so bad at Final Fight?
>>737857674>look us spam memes, that means something!no, it doesn't. I don't even need to creep the archive to figure out it's been reposted a hundred times by the same person. none of these hate threads are organic. it's you and your ilk thinking you can consensus crack while being bad at it.
>>737891314>Besides, the fucking game was built around parryingSure it was, sure it was.Anyway thanks for proving my point, Lies of P was built around blocking, but you wouldt know since you didnt play the game
>>737854070I wish people would shit more on bloodborne for giving us the shit we have in souls like games today, elden ring isn't a cause, it's just a symptom
>>737891314the main utility and fun of parrying is to be able to block a fast sequence of blows with timing instead of jut avoiding an entire flurry completely by rolling away with one button. A really boring boss like Margit becomes so much more engaging with the parry flask for this reason. The ultimate would be to award blocking entire small sequences with mini staggers. The regular parry once>long ass 25% hp drain is just boring and limited as hell.
>>737862503okay, open the game and record it for the thread, give is some good lessons
>>737891386There's a secret conspiracy to make it seem like not everyone in the world loves my favorite video game.
>>737854070everything after dark souls 1 is genuinely the worst garbage i have ever played besides dark souls 3its energy harvesting satanic crapdark souls was a slow paced super mario/castlevania/zelda type game where you didnt need insane reflexes or cheesng to winall of the other souls games are just straight up artificial difficulty snoozefestsit unironically did as much damage to gaming as fort nitethe worst is blood borne and dark souls 2desu elden ring might also be okbut the faggot propaganda is a turn off for me lolbloodborne is like legit top 5 worst games ive ever played
>>737854249>I wish "soulslike" didn't become a genre.It still isn't. Never was.
>>737854249the previous era of gaming did kinda suck because everything was too casualized and easybut this era is even worseeverything is either for retarded normalfaggotsor complete annoyinglike i want to have fun not torture myselfthe limit on game difficulty being fun is jak 2also noticed alot of "games" that are just loosh harvests like rust battle royal gamesanything where you can lose progress and its not your faultim so tired of what the child raping nigger jesus the non omnipotent "god" of rapedid to gamingits just a casino for retarded zoomersand theyre all soulelss vax zombies so they dont carei feel bad for souled zoomers lolmust suck having corrupted dna.
>>737891552>hurr muh spam roll bad game>cites margiteverysingletime
>>737854070Souls games barely have enough content to last more than 6 hours, but bloat out your playtime by making every boss take multiple hours to kill because of cheap shit.
>>737854387Lies of P has also delivered an absolutely stellar DLC with a final boss that actually feels like a culmination of all the themes rather than a shitpost made into a boss fight.And it's so ironic the final DLC boss has his own waterfowl but you have an instrument designed to deal exactly with this type of attacks instead of coping with AI manipulation.
>>737854387kys
>>737891314nigga trumpdonald nigga
>>737863096Is this supposed to make the game look bad? It just makes the Rev look like a retard.
>>737890796What, the shameless Nintendo dicksucking didn't tip you off already?
what would you like to see in the next armored core game?
>>737891587>dark souls was a slow paced super mario/castlevania/zelda type game where you didnt need insane reflexes or cheesng to winRight, which is why DS2 is the best because it's exactly that while balancing out the retarded DS1 cheese
>>737892983Debra Wilson?
>>737854070
>>737854070How? What games were ruined?
>>737874608The fun part is exploring unknown territory, getting cool.new weapons and armor, getting your ass handed to you several times by mobs, getting brutally raped by bosses , gitting gud, bullying the boss that raped you and feel the dopamine hit. Move to a new area, rinse and repeat. Tbf Ever since Artorias and Manus we have been silently conditioned to git even better with each game. If you took a Demon's Souls player on a time machine after he defeated King Allant give him a controller and put Consort Radahn in front of him there's no chance he will defeat it in a couple of tries. Meanwhile the same player that kept playing the souls games will just look at him and Nah, I'd win and actually win in a few attempts or at least the same day. The one game that put shitters on evidence is Sekiro because there's no grinding your way out of a fight, there's no summons, no way to cheese. Nothing. Just Wolf, Kusabimaru, Fushigiri and your skill. It's fucking great when it clicks. And Sekiro has Demon's Souls gimmick bosses , Dark Souls 3 bosses AND Sekiro bosses. A genuine masterpiece. Genichiro is probably the most fair, balanced and well designed boss in the entire catalog.
>>737863883We're discussing ER, not DS2
Is lies of pee worth getting, if I really hate the delay attacks and upped boss damage in this? Liked Dark Souls 3 and especially Sekiro, but in Elden Ring every moveset feel tedious to learn
They fucked it by making the world too big in Elden Ring and over re-using duplicate enemies
>>737868801The parry button isn't interactive. The ONLY thing it does is parry if you hit it in the correct QTE window. Otherwise, it does fucking nothing. It's a fucking QTE. Handle it.>>737886487Stamina management wasn't a big deal if you weren't an ADHD retard. It served to make all your actions feel meaningful, like an investment, because you couldn't get it back immediately.
>>737893513Blocking makes you take orange damage like BBIf you get hit you lose hpIf block you lose hp but ALL the damage you took through your block can be recovered by hitting the enemy.So you if any enemy is annoying to deal with you can always equip a fast handle, block then attack to get your hp back, repeat until you win. Attacking also refills one estus if your empty. All in all its "easy" since the blocking is extremely safe, but since you can take the "blade" of a mace/greatsword and slap it on a dagger handle combined with arms for special attacks means a lot of shit to experiment with.
>>737888339>r1sBad player, this is L2ring, with R2 (jumping optional) stance break as the 2nd best option, R1 are only good if you pair it with bleedI dont blame you though, both bb, sekiro and das3 are r1 games so you are conditioned.
>>737854338Is it though? I feel like that's how the fans market it. With SotE I got the sense the devs were trying to beat it over your head to just stop being a maso-retard already, with the showering you with summon materials, locking ludokino behind npc summons, and the final two bosses being cock and ball torture ONLY if you insist on it
>>737867925>You had to cheese several items in Dark Souls 1 to get stamina regenerationyou had to cheese the ring and the shield? how, exacly?
I beat the giant then dropped this out of boredom and I don't remember a single boss actually doing this.Most had fairly short combos and the exceptions did not have AoE during their combos. Are there bosses I missed the pic is actually true for or is it just making shit up?I killed almost every boss just blocking them too.
>>737854070Cheekily dodging all of Malenia's AoE spam attacks and then punishing her with a whip!
