>buying games on steam? you're just renting!>physical though? that's permanen-
>>737922365I know this is a shitpost but I never understood calling buying a game on Steam (or any digital service) renting?
>>737922365Degradation of the label layer doesn't mean the data layer is compromised.This is especially true of CDs, where the data layer is in the middle of the disc. DVDs have the data layer towards the outside of the disc.
>>737922365>finally a pristine copy of my favorite game!>i have the perfect spot on my shelf for this...>NO KITTY PUT IT DOWN AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHH
>>737922559I think it refers to those services selling licenses for games, licenses that they could revoke for whatever reason leaving you without games
>>737922365I don’t collect optical disk snoyslop so I’m not worried
>>737922559It's because you don't own the games you buy. You're just buying access to an account that has the game. If you try to buy, sell, or trade games between steam users, you're violating steam EULA and they can ban your account. Not that they facilitate trading or selling in the slightest. Like why would they, you down own anything to begin with.
>yes goy! sell all your childhood stuff!! It's gonna rot anyway!
>>737922365>buy car>piece of shit breaks down after 15 years>erm you didn't akshually buy the car, you just rented it!
>>737922759>>737922803That's hardly renting but okay
Disc rot only exists from manufacturing errors, it functionally is not real
>Sony makes a statement confirming the 30day check is a one time thing>PCniggs have to resort to their old bag of tricks like disc rot in an effort to prove steam isnt THAT shitim nooticing
>>737922365>buy physical game>it doesn't run without a day 1 patch>servers go down>it only works on consoles that already have the patch downloadedPhysical media is just as impermanent as digital media in the modern age.
>>737922759>>737922803its because retards don't realize steam doesn't care if you break their DRM and just choose to OWN your own copy independent of their system
>>737922365>Bazz
>digital copies isn't owning>physical copies isn't owningthen what is?
>>737923061Depends on who you ask
>>737923061making a mental copy
>>737923013spoken like someone who hasnt seen a console irl for 20yearscare to list examples that arent live service or multiplayr only slop ?
>>737923061pirating a game with 2 backupsI buy games to give money to devs, and for the convenience. When I really really care about a game I buy it, then I save at least 2 backups that don't need any activation to run. Also preferably I'll buy it from GOG and make those two backups.
>>737923023No it's not that. DRM doesn't determine ownership. DRM is just a copyright protection.
>>737923061>digital copies isn't owningSure it can. See GoG in the EU>physical copies isn't owningSure are.Gabe just doesn't want you to own your games, so you can't.
>they don't have DRM-free GOG installers on M-DISCs stored in salt minesNGMI
>>737923270I gave up on consoles after the 360 because of mandatory installs, incomplete data on disc, and day 1 patches. I don't care that it's not every game, the fact that it happens at all means I will not financially support those platforms.
>>737923061Nothing Game ownership was killed by the internet's existenceThe only way you ever owned any game was with physical on pc that had zero drmThat concept died when the internet effectively turned that into legal shareware
>>737923398So why doesn't gog allow reselling?Why don't console corpos allow digital reselling?
9 times out of 10 people who complain about cartridge rot or swelling batteries or dead batteries are just people who don't respect their possessions. Actually turn your GBA SP off instead of leaving it in sleep mode 24/7, Don't leave your carts under the sun, have a tuperware box or something to put all your games instead of throwing them all over the floor. Even my old GB and N64 games still work fine because I'm not a fucking savage who throws their own things around like a hooting monkey.
>>737922661It does mean the owner is a literal child who treats his physical property like garbage though since I have discs from the 1990s with the label still looking like new
>>737923762You basically can't own digital games because an easily and infinitely duplicatable resource doesn't work in capitalism.
>>737923430do they even make these anymore?
>>737923061>lives on a mortal plane >believes in permanence>believes in ownership Were you born yesterday?
>>737923061Ownership doesn't exist
>>737922559If you buy from gog you have the actual files for the game. If you buy from steam, you have a ticket to use to play the game until they decide you no longer are allowed.
>>737923948Exactly, ownership of games is literally irrelevant, there's nothing to be gained from it and piracy is always an option You buy games on steam because it supports the developer and you get integration with the best platform to play games on on the market
>>737924097Do you think installers are voodoo? You Goldberg a steam game and zip it up and you have the exact same thing as on gog
>>737923061>then what is?teabagging some scub you merc'd during a killing frenzy
>>737923982Apparently they do
>>737922365I have yet to have any of my disks do this. I have stuff from early-mid 90's
>>737922690Just put it ina new case? What a retarded thing to cry about>>737922867Not buying either :)
>>737924136>Exactly, ownership of games is literally irrelevantNo it's pro consumer.
>>737922906Link yo statement? Why would you need a 1 time check?
>>737924485If you need to sacrifice other things to get it then it's not
>>737924568Actually it remains true, even with sacrifices like lockdowns, because I can still just pirate on PC anyway.
>>737924647>You need to stop being a legitimate consumer because something you claim is pro consumer is not letting you use your rights as a consumer
>>737924782No need to rush your argument out as a strawman meme quote I never said. Take your time and form a coherant thought.
>>737923061Buying the company that makes the game
>>737923361yeah, and steams works by requiring the use of steam for the game to function, dumbass.so you can copy the files all you want, it just goes back through steam.except you can break that.
>>737924940You said it remains true How is having less rights as a consumer more pro consumer if the sole advantage is getting a right that turns you into a non consumer when you exercise it?
>>737925026I have more rights as a consumer when I can own a game, not the other way around. Did you mean less rights as a pirate? Pirates aren't consumers. And if I wanted to crack mod steal dupe and do all sorts of piraty things I have my PC.
>>737922365>Living in a humid bog
>>737925157Selling games explicitly turns you into a non consumerYour right to get a partial refund comes at a cost of the right to enjoy the product It's irrelevant to the actual consumers
>>737925401>Selling games explicitly turns you into a non consumerI didn't say I was selling my games.>It's irrelevant to the actual consumersAs a consumer I disagree.
>>737923361DRM wouldn't be legal if we weren't only entitled to a "license". Copyright and license agreements go hand in hand. The entire reason we're only sold "licenses" is precisely because of legal mumbo-jumbo. When you buy a music CD, you're buying a license. If they actually sold you the music itself, then you would have absolute legal freedom to copy and redistribute the music in that CD as you please. A CD is merely a physical license, it doesn't actually entitle you to ownership of the music in that CD. There is no future in which a company will ever sell you anything other than a license, even if it's in a physical medium. People who get upset about "licenses" are just those who don't understand why licenses exist in the first place. If licenses didn't exist, then piracy wouldn't be illegal.
>>737925545>When you buy a music CD, you're buying a license.And the media which is music on a CD. Do you know what media is? It's a different thing from intellectual property. You can own the music via CD while not owing the intellectual property. These are two different things. Can you please learn this so you stop making the same mistake every day?
>>737925759Then your problem isn't with licenses. Your problem is with digital media.
>>737922690my jerk cat clawed that super tiny Wii remote sensor bar codeso ended up doing the candle trick, and it worked until i stopped playing the wii, but my tv had wax built up over the bottom of the bezel
>>737925852>so ended up doing the candle trick??? what in the goddang
>>737925852cord*
>>737925014Plenty of Steam games work without Steam at all. Plenty more just need a Steam emulator. Honestly, the latter can hardly even be classified as DRM, since you can keep all the actual game files intact and still play them however you want.Steam has real DRM, which makes it so an emulator doesn't work and requires cracking the executable, but not every game that requires Steam has it. It's still pretty easy to break, but requiring cracking clearly makes it DRM.
>>737925852the candle trick has some crazy tech priest vibes, what unbridled kino.
>>737922559No one reads the terms and only now are things getting strange enough with all these multi-player only games that they're acting on them and turning off games legally and people are getting a wake up call that they never fully owned anything
>>737926143zoomie fren, back in the long ago we used to summon the wii remote signal by lighting two tapered candles set several inches apart above our televisions and turning off the lights.When the wicks went out, we were forced to stop playing until the next day when the dollar tree reopened.
does the new 30 day snoy shit apply to physical copies too
>>737923762GoG doesn't sell you games, it sells you a license to download it from their servers and to have it show up on an account.The files of the games themselves are DRM free, so you're already entitled to do whatever you want with them.
>>737923061Having 3 copies of the source code, one acive copy on your hard drive, a second copy backed up locally, and a third copy backed up offsite like in the cloud.If you have that you own the game.
>>737926238>>737926285>>737925852i'm more confused now, what the fuck?? i've heard of baking your 360 but what is this candle shit
>>737926751Sensor bar was basically a 2 point heat register to triangulate where the remote was and how it's moving. 2 Candles could replicate the heat points
>>737926751The Wii sensor bar is basically just two infrared lights, one at each tip of the bar (the bar was only plugged into the Wii for power, it didn't transmit any data to the console). Hot things also produce infrared light, so you could use two flames instead
No really, why won’t Gabe just let you own games like GOG does? What possible reason could there be for that? If steam made it a policy that all sales are owning the game and not just buying a license, the entire industry would be forced to accept the terms because of how powerful Steam is. I unironically can’t explain why they do that outside of being greedy or evil
>>737926751The wiimote had a camera inside the controller that picked up the infrared signals from the sensor bar, if you placed two flames 7 inches apart it would work just like a sensor bar.Really the "sensor bar" was just a light bar.
>>737926925Literally what I did a few years ago. Wanted to play RE4, dug my Wii out of the closet but the sensor bar was broken so I used two little candles
>>737923843No, I think it's just cheaply made CDs. I had a bunch of magazine CDs from the 90s which were very badly deteriorated by the 2000s, and they were just sitting in CD cases the whole time.
>>737926947Because you still don't own the games. All storefronts, whether digital or physical, only sell licenses. What GOG doesn't have is any form of DRM, so you're free to do whatever the fuck you want with the files. Even if what you're doing with them is explicitly illegal, they can't catch you or stop you. You can copy that shit and redistribute it and GOG has absolutely no way of stopping you. That's the real difference.This, incidentally, is also why there are way less games on GOG as well.
>>737927136So why wouldn’t Valve just… mandate that you can’t sell games with DRM? What the fuck are these companies going to do? Go to Epic Games? Gaben has total market dominance and Epic proved that even platform exclusivity isn’t enough to make people leave Steam. They should just do it if they actually gave a fuck about the consumer like everyone pretends they do
>>737922661How do you replace the label layer, then?
>>737923430The M-Disks post Verbatim buyout are just regular BD-R's with degradable organic matter.
>>737922365CDs, DVDs and blurays are basically indestructible. Only one I've ever had go bad was one I left outside for years on purpose to distract birds.>>737922690>OH NO the plastic case that costs 50 cents and is trivial to replace broke :(
>>737922690What a retard you are. Every crack on a case and scratch on a disc is SOVL. It all has a story to it.
>>737922365I spend more on housing in one month than I've spent on steam games in 10 years. If my rental goes away I'll survive
Which physical game format theoretically has the long lifespan?
>>737927481Boche ball with rocks
>>737922860you bought the car though
>>737923061Nothing. Everything is temporary besides your soul. Take care of it.
I remember when I was a little kid Tarzan game cd literally shattered in the cd drive, I was crushed. Dad bought me a Hugo game as a replacement but it was much worse
>>737923061>wait... you're telling me nothing in this universe is fucking permanent??? and everything will eventually rot under time's gnawing tooth?? what a fucking ripoff!!look at this dude who thinks it's possible to "own" anything lmao
>>737922365>had my steam account for 18 years >still have all my gameswhen are they taking them away? can any doomposter let me know?
>>737923270>care to list examples that aren't all these examples?truly we are in awe of your vast intelligence
>>737922559it's a digital store's cop out from granting you the rights you have as a buyer of goods. i think it's mostly to disallow you to resell your digital games. (which i kinda agree on because it's piss easy to copy digital games compared to physical ones)
>>737922803Trading or reselling games was never considered really "legal" in corpo eyes and they put malware-tier copy protection on physical games that could even prevent you from installing a game too many times. Guess you never owned your physical games after all.
>>737923398Gaben always wanted you to own your games more than his competition, though.
>>737922365death is eternal and you can't take it anywhere when you die.
>>737929473That fat fuck does not give a single fuck about you. He loves his consumer given monopoly and hasn't done a single thing for the benefit of gamers.With GOG I don't need the launcher to play my games, fuck I could put them on a portable HD and take them wherever I want and play them, with Steam I have to log in to my account and download its, Steam just nothing more but pretty DRM and actively contributed to the death of physical.
>>737926947Feel free to explain how you don't "own" games on steam.>trading and selling gamesCorpos never considered that to be something legal and either put "don't share your game with anyone" in the licence or added measures trying to prevent people from "sharing" their game with anyone . Also I will never understand why your #1 argument for owning your games is... no longer owning your games.>b-but le physicalYou can download a game from steam after like 2 decades and it will still be in pristine condition, the same can't be said about a old CD game you used frequently.
>>737929559>He loves his consumer given monopoly and hasn't done a single thing for the benefit of gamers.Oh look, another console nigger trying to pretend he knows anything about PC gaming.If Valve never existed PC gaming today would be a eternal joke and all the action would be on consoles. That is what the industry wanted.
Also>Steam actively contributed to the death of physical.If you actually were there back then you'd know the industry was hard at work trying to kill off pc physical games along with PC gaming itself with increasingly predatory malware-tier DRM and shitty licences. I also never understand this obsession with le physical when digital improved my gaming experience like 10 times. I barely even bought any physical games back then anyway when you could just download games from the internet.
>>737929647if you own a good, you can do anything to it, even sell it. that's like the basic stuff.
>>737923061What do you want from the word? For some people who talk on this issue, their defining angle is that they want to be able to legally sell the copyFor me it just means that I know I will be able to play the game whenever I want for the rest of my life. I can achieve that with locally-stored data and practicing good backup habits.
>>737927243Bro steam is full of games with no DRM, and they can still only sell you licenses (and access to the data needed to play them) for those, this is not something within Gabe's power to decide, it's how software works
