Is Rattata the shitmon posterboy of all shitmons?
no that would be any early route birdmon
wouldn't it be magikarp?
That would be Luvdisc, or maybe Spinda
>>737943714Lifehack for anyone playing the Gen 1 games: The bonus catch rate for low health caps out at 25% remaining HP so instead of chipping awa until it's a red slither you can just Super Fang twice and then start chucking Great Balls (Ultra Balls are glitched)
>>737943841Rattata is iconic though, Spinda and Luvdisc are not
Raticate really isn't all that bad with Hyper Fang. It can even learn stuff like Thunderbolt and Ice Beam if you want to play around.
>>737944037Ratatta isn't a shitmon. It's available as early as possible and performs passably in the main game. Shitmons like luvdisc appear far too late to work into a party and are pure garbage even if you wanted to try anyway.
>>737943714>>/vp/
>>737943813Magikarp turns into gyarados, so it's saved by having an actually useful evolution. You just have to suffer through 20 levels of objective shit.
>>737944273That's why I said "posterboy". Everyone knows you'd never use a Luvdisc, but there are a lot of pokemon you might use, assuming they're good. Tropius is a shitmon.
>>737944486So what is it a posterboy of since it isn't a shitmon? Why would a mon "everyone knows" is shit not be it instead? Stop being a retard.
>>737943714Gen4 has lots of shitmons
THE TOP ONETOP ONE PERCENT
>>737944651Gen 4 was the first time a regional bird was actually viable for the entire game. What were its other shitmons? Luxio and Floatzel were both great.
>>737944724Swellow with Guts Facade puts in work and Fearow gets Drill Peck early. Staraptor is unhinged but saying it's the first actually viable bird is doing the past birds dirty
>>737944724>luxray>goodHmm yes I love my 120 base physical attackers best move being a 65 power thunder fang
>>737944724Kricketune is pretty shit, Wormadam too. Most of the rest of the dex is from older gens so they don't count.
>>737944960almost every kid thought it was good. not my fault that is really wasn't. intimidate is always a great ability though. but just get gyarados
>>737944960>>737945067I think Luxray slinks by with a passing grade because you always want a thunderbolt user in these games for the Gyarados and countless birds and fish and Luxray's only competition is Pachirisu (lol)
>>737944960This isn't smogon singles sperglord nothing with an attack stat over 100 is a shitmon
>>737945223It’s also slow as fuck and frail. It offers nothing
>>737943714the bugs
>>737945282So is most everything else you fight. Base 70s are mediocre at worst, you're a baby spoiled by nugen power creep. If intimidate and base 95 thunderbolts are nothing to you then 90% of the entire series are shitmons.
raticate was alright in gen 1
>>737945425>they will literally never remove all of the bugs out of pokemon literally
>>737943714hoenn had some real shitmons. almost everything you can get earlygame is a shitmon. rattata is way better than zigzagoon, or poochyena, or lotad or surskit for example. they have shit stats and you can't even take advantage of typing because their moves are shit too.
>>737943714It has to be Bidoof, right?Rattata is a shitmon, sure, but I think Joey's TOP PERCENTAGE kind of memed him into being more than that, if it makes sense.
>>737943785Staraptor says fuck you
>>737945448Why not just run electabuzz, magneton, or even electrode at that point
>>737943714Rattata mogs Sentret, Poochyana and Patrat.
>>737945425specs weedle is broken though
>>737945657this is what i came to post, its 100% bidoof
>>737945425Is butterfree really that shit, I always thought it was sort of ok
>>737945186He's also fucking cool
>>737943714No that's the Pidgey
>>737944273>>737944204>>737943714This kind of shit is why Nu-Pokemon sucks.A pokemon like Rattata/Raticate exists as an early game power boost. You catch one early, and it evolves early having higher stats than most of the pokemon you'll fight then. However, Raticate begins to fall off and is intended to be replaces by another pokemon. That is good game design.Having shit like Rattata + Weedle/Caterpee in your game is meaningless with free global XP share + general easy difficulty where you don't need to consider power spikes and XP rates.
>>737945637I think they had a different philosophy there. Ludiocolo and Nuzleaf were better than any shitmon final evolutions from gen 1 and 2, but they were also shit because you couldn't evolve them until the end of the game. You couldn't just buy evo stones like you could in RBY.
>>737945425>be picrel>harden>harden>harden>ran away
>>737945657>>737945736bidoof was banned because of his Moody ability
What do you even qualify as a shitmon? Something that's unviable in playthroughs or something that's unviable in pvp? Because you can pretty much use anything for the former with little issues.
>>737945657Even outside of HM slavery, Bidoof can be useful up through the midgame of sinnoh. Bibarel's water typing can be useful if you didn't choose Piplup and Moody can be a lot of fun.
>>737945901Yeah, and level 1 Agron or w/e was an actual threat in the game too because of endeavor and berry juice memes.
>>737945924For me it's something that you can catch early game but you replace later. Butterfree is kind of a shitmon because it is easily outclassed when you can get Kadabra.
>>737945683Intimidate? Physical attacking? Being available five minutes in? Other options existing doesn't make something a shitmon.
Do I use Mr. Mime or Jynx for my leaf green playthrough
>>737943714Yeah https://catbox.moe/c/hucy66
>>737945924I just count something that sucks and you wouldn't bother really catching or using unless forced to. I think, generally, the route 1 normal types fit into this but they do make useful HM slaves and some of them have decent abilities (Such as Zigazagoon).
>>737944486Tropius is a HM slave>Fly>Cut>Strength>Rock Smash
>>737946178they're both good but I'd say Jynx
>>737945785As a kid I would always get it, specially if starting with charmander for Brock. But stats wise and not having STAB makes it pretty shitty. You can still put Psychic on it and keep the whole game, but kadabra would be miles better
>>737946178Both. Throw in Drowzee, Haunter, and Lickitung for the creepy team.
>>737946178Jynx. Fairy types didn't exist in gen 3 and the combination of psychic and ice type moves absolutely obliterates most of the Kanto pokedex.
>>737943714Delcatty exists
>>737946386jynx wouldnt be weak to fairy anyway
>>737946516I was referring to how Mr.Mime is part fairy from gen 6 onward.
>>737945896As a kid I would catch Metapods because I thought everyone hated them because they were useless, and that made me sad.
>>737946827yeah but that anon was talking about FrLg
>>737947172you can fuck these games up to get fake pokemon by the way
>>737945785it's pretty good in FR/LG because of Compound Eyes + Sleep Powder + Dream Eaterin gen 1 it's ass though
>>737948385can't venomoth do that same thing
HOW ABOUT YOU SHUT YOUR WHORE MOUTH WHEN RATTATA IS FUCKING TALKING?
>>737943714The powergamer fears the rat power.
>>737943714>lust-provoking image
>>737943714As terrible as raticate is. i'd say beedrill is even worse.
>>737948628Venomoth doesn't have compount eyes
>>737943714You still remember rattata. What about all the other first route shitters your brain didn't bother to remember?
>>737945508Because they're genuinely designed to teach new players about evolution
>>737943714>80 power stab move early game>shitmonat least it has a move
Given enough time I could probably write down all the names for the first 150 and maybe like 5 after that.
>>737948931gen 1 buff.Basically every gen 1 pokemon except for the most shittiest of shitters is iconic at this point.
>>737948931sentret, zigzagoon, bidoof, patrat, uhhh squovet?
>>737943714No, pikachu is. Can't even beat the first gym in his own game
THE GIANT RAT THAT MAKES ALL OF THE RULES
>>737948931I remember bidoof more
>>>/vp/
Nbbles...
>>737945834It’s not an early game power boost because your starter is stronger both at the point you get it and for the whole game after. Like if it was actually strong early game you’d have people saying in the new games>yeah just use Raticate until your other mons level high
>>737949540>charmeleon 64 attack 65 special 80 speed>raticate 81 attack 97 speed 80 power moveit is an early game power boost>>yeah just use Raticate until your other mons level higha game for toddlers isn't hard enough to force you to min max your team for each stage of the game. no one cares what you use in the game
>>737948748^thisratto sexo
>>737950150>charmeleon 64 attack 65 special 80 speed>raticate 81 attack 97 speed 80 power moveYeah great now what level was Ratata when you caught it and what level was Charmeleon at the same time? How much time did it take before Ratata was useful? Could you have gotten farther faster using Charmeleon?
>>737950389All pokemon games are the easiest with only two pokemon monopolizing all the exp
>>737950389if we are considering which mon to hoard all the exp to decide which mon to use then you'd be using nidoking over both of them
>>737950578Sure but that doesn’t change the core point that it’s not good game design lol
>>737950389How is that Misty battle going?
>>737950637did I say gamefreak was good at game design?
>>737950389You can get a ratatta two minutes into the game. Is a 1-3 level difference really that severe to you?
>>737950746>>737945834Is suggesting Raticate is good game design and intended as a Jeigan mon, im asserting that due to the games design it doesn’t work.
>>737950353oldfags pretend this was better than what we have now btw
>>737950910Jeigan mon?
>>737943714Ratata is the best pokemon. You better agree or else..
>>737950959u mad
>>737950910>it doesn't workexcept it works, you get a rattata, you mash a, you win early game
>>737950991It’s a character archetype in Fire Emblem that starts off strong but falls off because exp investment provides very little benefit compared to other characters
>>737949362Because you're a zoomer
>>737950991Jeigan is a Fire Emblem term, referring to the character of the same name, to describe party members that start off strong but drop off heavily later into the game due to a combination of poor growth and being replaced by better units of the same type.
>>737951136Rattata doesn't drop heavily, you can solo the game with it
>>737951232Yeah and you can solo the first Fire Emblem with Jeigan, that doesn't change how the games are going to hash out for casual players.
>>737951232It also doesn't start any stronger than the starter, it's evolving into raticate earlier than the starter hits second evo that's the power boost. Jeigan is just a dumb comparison overall, no pokemon fits that role.
>>737951398>that doesn't change how the games are going to hash out for casual players.how?
he cute
>>737943714If my rattatas and geodudes are not in the game, I won't play, simple as.
>>737945425>soloes lance's dragonite at level 3heh, nice try dragonman
>>737951398Casual players just pick whatever they want to and if they happen to want to use a rattata they just get to enjoy a nice power spike at level 20
>>737945508Fuck you. Bugs are cool.
>>737943714Depends on what you mean. Rattata has memes. Top 1%, F.E.A.R, Raticate abusing Guts, that sort of thing. I'm of the opinion that if it's ever had a use it's not a shitmon. Parasect is awful, but it does have Spore. Onix dies to Bubble, but Sturdy let's it throw down a hazard or sand before it bites it.Magcargo doesn't have anything.
>>737951039I know nothing about pokemon. But isn't the whole gameplay loop just maining one pokemon and grinding it to higher levels? That way you beat the game using only one mon?
>>737952264magcargo makes your eggs hatch faster
>>737952264Slugma balls
>>737951602I wanna suck his cute little conedick
>>737950389Rattata has higher attack than Charmander (the starter with the highest Attack stat) in gen 1, and also gets the 1.5 STAB when using Normal moves. You can find one at level 4 very easily in the first route, and it's easy enough to train up to match your starter's level. Once they match levels, Rattata ALWAYS outperforms in raw damage.The starters have the main benefit of using Special Attack moves, like Vine Whip, Ember, or Bubble/Water Gun. You are going to need one of those for Brock, whose entire purpose is to test the player's ability to use Special Attacks when appropriate instead of spamming Tackle. When you get to Misty though (and for most other trainers) Rattata is entirely more effective because Misty's Starmie has a high Special stat (which is both attack and defense in gen 1) and therefore takes way less damage from the starter's special moves, which includes Bulbasaur/Ivysaur. Meanwhile, a freshly evolved Raticate at level 20 (one level lower than Starmie) gets a guaranteed one-hit KO with Hyper Fang.Rattata/Raticate remains strong because of its Attack stat, STAB, and crit rate (due to its high speed in gen 1) for quite a while and can easily be useful in an endgame team if the player doesn't want to replace it with a Snorlax or Tauros in the same niche.
>>737952214Everyone's favorite bug chaser
>>737950389>Could you have gotten farther faster using Charmeleon?Charmeleon would get hard stuck against Misty, so
>>737952269In gen 1 all the way up through 4, a single high-level mon is pretty optimal. You need to catch others for HM usage, but you can solo the game with a starter or other early-caught mon pretty easily. Gen 4 had a little of it, but gen 5 is really where the late game becomes too high level and the mons too diverse to really rely on just one higher-level pokemon.With the introduction of the exp share in gen 6, it becomes better to have a whole team with no real cost. Trying to solo the games with this design is also MUCH more difficult because the trainer levels near the end get close enough to 100 that it becomes more difficult to overcome type disadvantages with a raw level gap. That said, it's still not hard, and you can just have your starter and 5 random shitmons that passively take in experience that you never use unless necessary.
>>737945785iirc Butterfree learns confusion in gen 1 and psychic moves are too strong in there
>>737953076Thanks for the write up bro>hmWhat's that?
>>737951108gen 4 was in 2007 anon
>>737950389>How much time did it take before Ratata was useful?>normal stabEnough time to walk to a poke center to heal it I guess
>>737944486Tropius needs a new form or evolution in WiWa since they don't use HMs anymore. Dunsparse got something. It's never too late!
>make a gen 2 powerlevel mon and put it in gen 9Tragic.
>>737952710Based truth. Raticate was always one of my favorites
>>737953725It's a shame. Spidops actually has a really good movepool.
>>737953331Wait, are you asking what "HM"s are? You know, like Cut, Strength, Surf, etc. They're required in every game up through gen 6.
>
>>737950389Pokemon games are about friendship. Perhaps you've forgotten that, smelly leet gamer.
>>737952269Is it meta? Yes. Is it counter to the spirit of the game and Pokemon universe? Also yes.
>>737953940Like i said earlier. I literally know jack shit about pokemon. What is HM?>>737954249Fair
>>737943714no, all the gen1 poison types are, they are the goombas you stomp
>>737953471literally too big for another evolution
>>737953725Minun has a higher base stat total than this thing.
>>737954086why is this piece of shit the face of all early bird shitters when spearow mogs it so hard
>>737955273because>early bird shitters
>>737943785corviknight replaced skarmory so hard they had to give it a mega that just kills shit
>>737946178Mime till you get jynx.
>>737946940Mega based.
>>737954420
>>737944672What if the opponent also has a priority move?
>>737943714I can't not love the rat
>>737956554Most newer players don't, along with the various other tools that shut down F.E.A.R. completely. It was mostly a clever way to troll brainless ubers players who just run a whole team of setup sweepers and expect to win
>>737943714
>>737943714Depends. Rattata sucks even in Gen 1, but he is undeniably iconic, a meme, got a regional variant, and will forever be a part of Pokemon as long as it is an IP.So he could literally be the posterboy in that he sucks and would be put on a poster, but to me "shitmon" really also means some fucking stinker no one gives a fuck about and is also useless. People at least LIKE Rattata and find him cute.For me it is gonna be this guy: Fugly design, terrible moves, terrible ability, terrible stats. Shitmon through and through.
>>737956554It is also beatable by anything that sets damaging weather or has rough skin or a bunch of other stuff. It is a hilarious gimmick though, and there are even infinite strategies using it with like Sturdy + Recycle + Berry Juice.
>>737943714I mean Gary had one in his team until the player killed it, anyway
>>737956554you've still reduced him to 1hp
>>737959384the goal of fear is a self sufficient ko, which that wouldn't be
>>737957845watchog can learn hypnosis though
>>737954420>HMHM stands for "Hidden Machine". You can get items in the games that are called "Technical Machines" (TMs) that are one-time-use in most games and teach a pokemon a move it can use in battle. HMs were special because they could be reused infinitely and taught moves that are used to clear or pass obstacles in the overworld in addition to being useful in battle.In gen 1-6, HMs are required to beat the game, so people often caught shitmons and taught them nothing but HMs to progress through the overworld puzzles while they just used their starter pokemon to battle everything. Gen 7 got rid of HMs in favor of just giving the player items that do the same things, and each game since then has done that.
>>737959606No it can't
>>737959930It doesn't even have to be a Watchog yet, Patrat learns it.
>>737945425luv me masquerain
>>737950637>it’s not good gameZoomers are retarded.
>>737960093can i just say, that's stupid
>>737960416You can say it, but it doesn't make it so. A lot of things can learn Hypnosis just fine, like Ponyta.
>>737952214why does it looks so smug?
>>737960000
That anime episode with rattatta and sandrew in "training harnesses" [bondage harnesses] did things to me
>>737945425>twineedle is practically the only actually super effective (emphasis on effective) move against psychic types in gen 1>exclusive to a pokemon that's not only slow and frail, but half poison toon-nice...
>>737962235bird superiority
I'm literally wearing shorts right now because they're so comfy and easy to wear in warm weather.
>>737964104what's your team?
>>737952529same
>>737952529based and same
>>737943714At least Raticate is kinda cool. Bidoof is peak shitmon for me
>catch a rattata>it's cheesed to meet me
>>737943714>shitmonthat's not a shitmon. THIS is a shitmon
>>737965124Mimi is so lucky....
>>737943714>Rattata>shitmononly to genwun only fags and even that is barelyHyper Fang and Quick Attack carried to mid game
>>737962772
>>737950959Because it was better.Then>witty reactive pun that takes some thought from both the poster and readerNow>rote accusations and strawman images
>>737965580leather club's two blocks down
nibbles did nothing wrong
>>737966045statistically speaking, nibs did less than wings
Behold
>>737966486AHHHHHHHHH
>>737945657bidoof is great
>>737952337This lol, hes my go-to for egg hatching
>>737945657Bibarel is viable in lower tiers of Gen 4-5. With the ability Simple, Swords Dance will grant +4 attack to Bibarel in one turn. Then you can sweep, with Aqua Jet giving you priority.
>>737952387I love shiny slugma because its got that quicksilver aesthetic going on for it
>>737967967>Metal Slime if he Pokemon
>>737943714>Gen 1 raticate being a crit demon>FEARRattata is one of the better mon, if you want to shit on gen 1 mons that are absolute dogshit that never evolve into anything of value caterpie and weevil are right there.
>>737943714Just grind levels and oneshot everything lmao.
>>737943714screw you OP I like my rat
>>737967967>evolves into magcargo>looks terrible
>>737968615Wasn't butterfree the classic grind out Brock mon for charmander kids though?
>>737968615And wigglytuff
>>737969405Blame gen 3
>>737943714Sir, Rattata learns Hyper Fang at lv13 in FRLG.That's an 80 base power move with STAB so 120. Also has a small chance to cause flinch.There's also FEAR Rattata. I think I made my point.
