>>737997661
bit of a boomer game
everybody i know that rates it higher than the other snes fantasies are people who played it as kids on hardware. which i can respect but to put it above 5 or 6? pfft

Because it's the first entry that's almost entirely on rails. No variety or exploration, no builds or variety in party members (it is all 100% scripted). Nothing that people liked about 1, 2, or to a lesser extent 3.
It's basically FF13 if it were made 20 years earlier.

>>737997661
It's plenty popular, for what it is. But at it's an early title in the franchise's infancy. It's not 6, 7, or 10.

>>737997661
From the discussion Ive seen here it feels like the vast majority of people haven’t played 1-6

>>737997661
It was their first attempt at a lot of ideas that would be done better in later entries. Still noteworthy though.

>>737997661
First of all, it's FF4.
Only good FFs deserve to be referenced via roman numerals.

>>737997661
Because it sucks. Its easily the worst of the SNES games. The gameplay is incredibly barebones compared to 5 and 6. The plot is literally just a string of different characters being mind controlled.

>>737997661
After Years only exists because it was popular
Same with the DS remakes.
IV/V/and/VI are also the most played pixel remasters

>>737997895
This is you:
https://voca.ro/164VHQkzAnUd

>>737997895
lowkey banger burn

>>737997816
I've only played 1-6 and I don't intend to play any more beacuse I don't think these games are very good

>>737997661
>it should be in conversation with the very best of the FF's but it simply isn't
It is though? It's usually in the top FFs mentioned when people list their favorite Final Fantasy games. Excluding After Years. Fuck off with that one.

>>737997661
The 2D version of this game is like actually mind numbing.
There's like 0 strategy for 99% of the fights, you just hit enemies with your strongest attacks.
There's never a reason not to just Berserk Cecil, Kain and Edge because none of them do anything well other than Attack.
There's never a reason to use any of Rydia's skills besides her strongest available spell or summon and Osmose once you run out of MP.
Rosa is the only character who actually has some interesting decision making from time to time and even then Pray's kind of a catch-all filler action that ensures everyone's HP is always at a manageable level.
Gear is a non-factor, dungeons give you basically everything for free and you'll rarely, if ever, run into a scenario where your Gil is low enough that you need to consider what to buy for whom - choosing whether or not to use the Avenger is basically the only interesting gearing decision you'll run into, but it gets outclassed by other endgame weapons anyway.
I know Final Fantasy games aren't the most mechanically demanding RPGs out there, but all the other entries in the series have at least a little more going on than this.

>>737998218
PSP version is fine since it’s the original JP difficulty

>>737998218
If you're not playing on ATB, FF4 is easier than the PSP version of 1
If you're on the snes version of 4, it's easy no matter what.

>>737997661
It is very popular but the other 2 SNES FF games have really fucking loud fanbases so FF4 can feel lie not as out there.
Personally I liked it a lot. The Dark Knightt o Holy Knight twist and setup in gameplay was done really well. It's a bit weird because it is build like a NES game with characters taking only 1 tile instead of 1+1/2 tiles like FF5 and FF6 did but far from unplayable.
I also enjoyed that dungeons were still those resource draining marathons. Makes for fun resourcemanagement where you calculate that 1 MP potion gives you so and so HP for x price via magic while a HP potions gives that and that HP healing for Y price.
I remember being so relieved when seeing the camp site a the end of a dungeon right before the boss.

>>737998315
I AM talking about the PSP version and other versions that perserve the JP difficulty and mechanics.
In fact I'd actually argue US FF4 ends up being harder in some areas because Pray is just THAT good and it's not available in that version.

>>737997661
>Why isn't FFIV more popular?
It's the most released and re-released Final Fantasy game outside of FFI.

>IMO it should be in conversation with the very best of the FF's but it simply isn't
It always is.

It's on par with VI but the after years fucking sucked

>>737997661
anyone that played it always ranks it high, it's one of the few FF games I think are actually good

>>737997760
this. it's s proto movie game. if anything it deserves more hate.

>>737997661
No idea, way better game than VI.

I think it's the best story in FF, as well as the best soundtrack. The characters are relatable.

>>737998218
For many fights I'd have Rydia cast Stop while the rest of the party attacks.
In FF4 I do no-death, and trying to minimize damage to allies, the game is easy enough for a hard reset on game over.

>>737997661
Isn't it pretty popular?

It's the one I argue most people should start with. Though, with that said, I do think 5 and 6 are better. Still a classic though.

>>737997661
because retards complain about it being too much of a cut and paste hero saves the princess kind of game even though we havent had a game like that in over 30 years. long story short people have shit opinions. it's a really good game.

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>>737997661
FFIV is an important game in the franchise developmentally, ATB is essential to the franchises identity, I just don't think its aged very well. Final Fantasy has always ping-ponged between giving you really rigid characters/classes and just letting you go wild and FFIV is really heavy on the locked down side of things, it decides who is in your party for most of the game and those characters have very specific roles in combat, it makes replays of FFIV very boring as you can't mix things up by swapping in different characters or playing different jobs, its always Dark Knight, Dragoon, Summoner for this part, and Paladin, Monk, Sage, Engineer for that part.

So I prefer FFIII or FFV just because those games will let me change around the Jobs, or FFVI or FFVII which will let me change around the party.

>>737997661
Final Fantasy 6 and 7 have pretty unique settings
Meanwhile Final Fantasy 4 is a rather mid redemption story where half the character heroically sacrifice themselves for overcontrived reason, it was fine for it's time but now it just feels kinda quaint

>>737997661
IV is way more popular than II, III and V (in this side of the world, at least).
And, to be fair, most FF fans nowadays started playing the series with either VII, X or XIV.

>>738002370
Job systems are gay. Either give me pre determined characters or let me do everything.

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>>738002675
>t.

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>>737997661
When someone says 'Final Fantasy' I think of something that looks like Final Fantasy IV

Its the most quintessential Final Fantasy for me. More so than Final Fantasy I even, because Final Fantasy IV introduced so much stuff that become mainstays of the franchise where as FFI~III was still trying to find an identity FFIV is what solidified what makes something 'Final Fantasy'.

>>737997760
and yet somehow 9 is considered the best when in reality it's one of the worst

>>738002994
NTA but yeah I don't get the hype for 9, it's pretty "OK" and unmemorable. 8 is way better for all of its disc 2 crap.

>>737997760
>It's basically FF13 if it were made 20 years earlier.
Holy retarded

>>738002994
>yet somehow 9 is considered the best
Its not, there was just that one graffiti and people just kept repeating it as a meme.

>>737997760
>It's basically FF13 if it were made 20 years earlier.
This might be the dumbest Final Fantasy opinion I've ever read.

Is FF13 really that bad? I haven't played it since release. All I remember disliking are Lightning, Hope, how empty and claustrophobic the stages are, the unreasonably long encounters and even longer superbosses, the nonsense story, and Sazh and Fang being my favorites.

Actually wait nvm kinds dreading replaying it now sounds awful still.

Its shit.

>>738003317
It's pretty bad. You don't even get to actually play the game until like halfway (~20 hours) through.

>>738003317
>>738003449
I liked it.

>>738003497
What did you like?
>>738003449
Yeah sounds about right, even going through it now in mind, the only positives I can think of are:
>Sazh is cool, nice story
>Fang is hot, cool warrior lady
>Music is really good
That's about it. Also those summons were fucking ugly. Shiva twins motorcycle is neat tho, but still ugly.

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>>737997661
Ff4 is one of the worst ffs. 1 2 3 5 6 7 13 14 are all better than 4. Hell even 9 and tactics are better than 4.

>>738003664
This tier list is garbage

>>738003702
Honestly you're correct, just haven't redone it since 2024. Dawntrail should be much lower.

>>738003664
FF: Mystic Quest would like a fucking word with you as the worst FF title

>>738003568
Play in JP dub.
I like the dynamics between the cast, first time where almost everyone in the cast has beef with each other. Really good music. Plot isn't that confusing and it's neat to see the parallels to post 9/11 America. Amazing art design and setpieces (Oerba was top 3 FF moments for sure). Lots of moments like Hope about to kill Snow or Sazh contemplating suicide. I played XIII in order after a marathon and it's funny as fuck after hours of everyone's a goody goody to each other (generally, Wakka and Rikku relationship was hilarious). Lightning just punches Snow in the face multiple times for being an idealistic moron. (Lightning is a bit of a bitch though but that's the fun part). There's quite a few nuance to the cast which was pretty nice. Snow is an idealistic retard because he has a hero complex but this pisses of Lightning because he's constantly getting his sister in trouble. Snow is doing his best to help everyone but because Hope's mom dies and he keeps blathering on about "I'll save everyone", it pisses off Hope and Lightning just tells Hope to kill Snow since he's an annoying shit is great.

I say this a lot but the only bad thing the games had were the shipping.

The real question is why no one talks about the ds version, basically a Hard Mode patch that also lets you multiclass

>>738003664
This is one of the worst tier lists I've ever seen, and I think it might have been constructed solely in an attempt to make XIV players look bad.

>>738003857
Honestly I should've played it instead of PSP. The story in FF4 was light as hell but DS looks like they added a lot of depth.
>>738003664
>XIEVE covering most of S and A tier
>Including EW with that dogshit poorly paced MSQ and post patch
brother what the fuck are you doing

>>738003836
Anon if I take your word and replay FF13 and end up disliking it again, that's a 100 hours of my life you can't refund me. When was the last time you played it? Because I don't see how the empty hallways and soul-draining long fights aren't still an issue.

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Dragon Quest IV did the "predefined party members with personality" innovation better. FFIV's greatest contribution was introducing ATB.

>>738003906
>brother what the fuck are you doing
It's so bad that I'm pretty sure it's a false flag. The only one that belongs in S or A is Shadowbringers, and Dawntrail should be at the absolute bottom.

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>>738003857
>>738003906
3D is the best version of IV.

>>738003882
But the majority of XIV players ARE objectively bad. They're mediocre players game-wide, they're horrifically socially inept, and they're fuckin fanatics across every scale imaginable.

Am I say XIV is a bad game overall? No. Im saying the players are.

>>738004074
Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the tier list, I'm so confused.

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1=2<13<15<16<3<12<4<10<8<11=14<8<9<7<5<6

>>737997661
>it should be in conversation with the very best of the FF's but it simply isn't
It's the worst pre 7 FF besides 2 and you are a retard

>>738003857
I'll always love IV DS because putting Darkness on Paladin Cecil is the coolest shit ever. I still stand by Cecil being a proper mix of Paladin/Dark Knight rather than just one or the other.
There's a romhack that adds a job system to SNES IV (US FFII) and I found that a pretty good time, I'd recommend it if you wanted to change up a playthrough.

>>738003664
>XIV split by expac when XI isn't
You can just leave games you didn't play off retard

>>738004420
I'm gonna be honest, I don't think he's played most of those games, and I don't even think he's played XIV. It's the worst list I've ever seen in my life.

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ROAST MY FUCKING ASS!!!!
Some controversial thoughts before you blast me:
>Why is XIII so high
>>738003836
>XIV?
I thought ARR -> SB was pretty similiar and a natural evolution of the MMO. I don't even hate SB that much since the post patch + actual content of the game was great. ShB is HEAVILY only carried by the MSQ and I still have problems with it.
>XVI
Yeah I liked it. I like the story FFs what can I say?
>Why is EW so low then?
Legit got me to drop the game. WoW refugees came in waves, statics got worse, dev team got peak retard, post patch was a fucking mess, MSQ was messy as well too especially after replays.
>Why is 1/2/3/4 grouped together
I don't have much of an opinion of those games. They're good but they're basic. I liked 3 for roleplaying. I liked 2 surprisingly quite a bit for the gameplay. 1 and 4 are just rpgmaker jrpgs but nothing bad with that. 1 has some neat variety that's not really utilized. (Surprised a romhack hasn't been popularized for this). 4 has some fun story beats but not enough fluff to make it stick unlike 5.
>WHY IS VII R THAT LOW
Not a big fan of the changes, it's bloated, almost everything I like about VII got replaced. VII feels like lightning in a bottle. VII R feels like Netflix Presents Final Fantasy VII.

>>737997760
This. FF4 is OK for one run but you start to feel the staleness when you don't even have any control over what party members you want to use. It's all scripted from beginning to end.

>>737997760
Actually I'd argue FF13 is even less limiting than FF4 because at least the Crystarium allows you to customize your characters' growth to some extent especially in some of the later stages.

>>738003317
13's only legitimate criticism is the cast sucks complete ass, and while Sazh is the closest thing to a relatable character in the main party, this criticism mostly goes for everyone else in the world. Villains? literal whos. Supporting cast? doesnt deserve screentime, Lightning is angry again!
This problem kinda plagues 15 as well, but they at least tried with a few of the side characters.

>>738005108
>Actually I'd argue FF13 is even less limiting than FF4 because at least the Crystarium allows you to customize your characters' growth to some extent
XIII allows zero customization, it's just a matter how how much of the Chrystarium you have unlocked. Either way, 3DIV has more customization than XIII.

>>738005793
Bro you just made me stop and think for a second. Who the fuck wete the villains? I remember that Orphan thing, the final boss, but that's IT. Matter of fact, what the fuck was the story about even? What the fuck is a Fal'cie? L'cie? What the hell was that shit about?

I am an old man with kids I was NOT that young when XIII came out, I must have been 18 at the least, I would have easily committed at least some of it to memory, but I distinctly remember barely retaining any of the events as I played, it all just washed over me.

>>738005954
If you're only talking about max level with everything unlocked yes, but after a while the Crystarium becomes too big for you to max out and at that point it's up to you to figure out what you want to focus on with each character, especially when you unlock their secondary Paradigms.

>>738007145
>If you're only talking about max level with everything unlocked yes
I'm talking about all of it. There's no customization. There's just "haven't unlocked it yet"

>>738007336
You're the one who chooses what to focus on.
If you want to spend your points on making Fang a Medic instead of progressing further up her primary Paradigms that's customization.

>>737997760
>implying tardos played these games in order
nigger more people started with 4 than all of the others combined
toss this assumption out, it's trash

>>738006274
I remember the general mythology of XIII because I did find it genuinely interesting but I don't remember the characters.
It was that gods existed on the planet (Gran Pulse) and would contract people against their will to do their bidding. Fail to do so and you get turned into a zombie, succeed in doing so and you get turned to crystal to "join them" or whatever. A lose/lose, essentially. So people built a new world above Gran Pulse, named Cocoon, so they didn't have to put up with it. I think the villain was some old guy that wanted to crash Cocoon? I know all the characters are contractors (I do not remember whether that's l'cie or fal'cie, they really should have just used 'Gods' and 'Contractors' because that's what they are) and they turn into zombies because they suck at doing their jobs but get better somehow.
Seriously, there's some interesting stuff there that you could explore but holy fuck is it lost in terminology.

>>738007484
No. There is no customization in XIII. None whatsoever. And either way, there is objectively more customization in the 3D version of IV than XIII, even if you falsely believe there is customization in XIII.

>>737997661
Its very popular what are you on about

As for me, I don't think it holds up well. It was groundbreaking when it first came out for its storytelling

>>738006274
ngl sounds like you're just looking for a way to hate xiii lol

>>738007596
But... there literally is?
Saying there's no customization in XIII is like saying there's no customization in V because you will eventually master all the jobs and unlock all their abilities.
Sure, it's true that a 100% save file for two different players will usually look the exact same, but the process of getting there is what makes it customisable.
Same thing applies to the Sphere Grid in X.

>>738007764
>Saying there's no customization in XIII is like saying there's no customization in V
Nope.

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FFIII is my favourite because it's fun and I really like the job system.
FFV is my second favourite because it's fun and I really like the job system but black mages aren't good and black mages are my favourite thing in the entire series so I like it a little less than III.

>>738005793
13’s cast was great, the problem was that other characters outside of them were lacking. I really like Serah though

>>738007831
Lol okay I can tell you've clearly never thought about this at all and just have a bias against XIII

>>738007764
This retard just compared XIII to V

>>738008030
I'm just telling you there isn't customization in it. The comparison to V's jobs is also peak retard, as if you have never played either game.

>>738008124
Then explain what's different about the way both games handle customization.

>>738003317
Its one of the few games I literally fall asleep playing. The other big name is Mass Effect, but at least I can pin that down to the soundtrack. FFXIII is just boring, it's all flash and no bang.

>>738008354
Lmao
Nah bro
I like you better as a retard that goes around trying to say XIII is like V

>>738003664
I can smell the hormone injections from here

>>738008354
>Then explain what's different about the way both games handle customization.
XIII doesn't have customization. Each character has a static tree that you level up, and that's it. Each character's tree is slightly different, but nothing ever changes.

V you can make any character be any job and level them up accordingly and choose passives to have for them and make "custom" classes that way.

If you had played either game, you wouldn't need this explained to you.

>>738008424
NTA but your only argument being “no” isn’t very convincing when the other guy at least bothered to explain his opinion.

>>738008560
I'm not engaged in an argument with you retard I'm insulting you

>>738003073
>>738003232
Any arguments?

>>738008552
But every character is allowed to level every job in V, just like how XIII allows you to level every Paradigm.
And in both games there are jobs/paradigms that you will neglect on certain characters because it's too much of a grind to level everything, however it is theoretically possible to max out everything.
Either they both have customization or they both have static skill trees (whatever that means considering skill trees are literally customization)

>>738008684
You never insulted me because that was my first reply in that chain. I just pointed out that one anon bothered to explain himself while you just went no no no over and over. As least the post above mine elaborated on a position.

>>738008894
>But every character is allowed to level every job in V, just like how XIII allows you to level every Paradigm.
You're actually retarded, aren't you?

>>738008993
Have you not played these games? That's literally correct.
You can't lock yourself out of a job in V by leveling a different job.

>>738008920
>you never blah blah blah
Shut up fag

>>738009042
Why are XIII schizos like this?

Are you a tranny? Are you tranny brained and that's why you're being stupid?

>>738009230
Is it really this funny to act like a retard or are you being genuine?

>>738009292
>no u
Oh my god, it just keeps happening. You really are a tranny.

>>737997661
They put everything into the "story" and "presentation" so the "game" part of this "video game" is very lacking

>>738009057
Just saying don’t be surprised when people disagree with you when this is how you decide to respond.

>>737997661
It's been remade and remasted more than any of them, I don't think it needs even MORE

>>738009370
You are literally acting retarded so that's what I'll call you yeah, but I get that you haven't even played XIII and the only info you have is based on scrolling the wiki and youtube videos from 2012 so it makes sense that you wouldn't be able to maintain a conversation about the game's mechanics going beyond the surface level.

>>738009395
Nigga this is 4chan I dont care if people agree with me

>>738009506
>no u all the way down
You're such a weird tranny. I played XIII when it came out, and I've played IV every time it gets re-released, including FFII on the SNES. And FFV multiple times as well, though it didn't get released in NA until way after it first came out.

All that is to say, XIII has no customization at all, while V does. You clearly haven't played either game. And 3DIV, again, has more customization than XIII regardless of whatever other tranny nonsense you're trying to spew.