>>738118545
If you didn't portray left as a drooling idiot maybe there'd be an interesting discussion here

>>738118545
Left wins game of the year award, while right has to shill his game on /v/

>>738118750
not really considering the strawman here is the left is a bunch of unconnected buzzwords and things that have been done before.
also the right has "players kill enemies quickly but also can get easily killed"... but that's gameplay first. premise first would be something like "the demons of this world can cut through armor, so the player dies fast, but an angel has blessed his sword, so the demons die quick too."

this image is bad, a wojak would befit it more than stick figures.

>>738118996
>also the right has "players kill enemies quickly but also can get easily killed"... but that's gameplay first.
It's not, it's a decision made to make you feel like a knight, not something that was made to "improve gameplay"

>>738119185
it's so much of a "gameplay" thing that it has its own fancy term: TTK (time to kill)

So basically Eurogame vs Ameritrash?

>>738118545
Name 2 games (left and right)

>Nebulous nonsense thought up by someone who hasn't ever made a game
Surely they know what they're talking about.

>>738119259
In this specific instance the TTK is decided by the premise of wanting the player to feel like a knight, as opposed by gameplay alone which might have you stabbing an enemy 200 times because it's more "fun"

>>738118545
Ehhhh, i think this kinda character assassinates gameplay first, and glazes premise first. I mean ffs mordhau is a perfect example of gameplay first design, of having deeply well designed sword fighting gameplay.

Likewise someone can make an absolute ass premise, like godai on ps2.

>>738119409
I mean... a full suit of armor = dying quickly? I know you can get unlucky, slip, and break your spine, or get stabbed through the gaps in the armor, dying instantly, but it's not what immediately comes to mind when I see a full suit of armor.
Not really making me feel like a knight. Makes me feel like a guy with no protection.

>>738118545
Their both gameplay first its just left is copy pasting entire chunks from other places and right is actually thinking about how to put them together properly. Left is a retard and right isn't that's all

>>738119641
>>738119409
Knights in full plate were not easy to kill at all, to the point where blunt weapons existed so you could turn the guy inside into mince meat without having to stab through all that plating with your own sword (which often was not going to happen). Swords were very efficient against poorly armored peasant levies and the like, though.

>>738119641
That's just on your lack of imagination, you could make the combat about thrusting into weak spots where a skilled player can do "headshots" i.e. strike inside visors and kill every enemy in one hit, whereas an unskilled player could wail against an enemy for 10 minutes and not make any progress because they're hitting armor

TTK still remains low because the unskilled player isn't actually killing the enemy and decreasing their HP, they're "missing" their shots

>>738120060
You're literally saying "just suspend disbelief and use your imagination to justify why the gameplay doesn't match the premise of being a knight". Fucking idiot.

>>738121198
No I'm saying why are you interpreting that point in the most boring bad faith way possible when you could've imagined a myriad of options that actually fit the description

>>738118545
Sands of Time was designed Gameplay first.

They came up with an awesome rewind mechanic and puzzles to take advantage of it then got a writer in to make a story to build it around.

>>738123237
Exception that proves the rule

>>738123972
Warcraft 2, Fallout 1 and 2, Diablo and Starcraft

>>738118545
If this is something you actually believe and not a troll image you're a dumb motherfucker

File: maxresdefault (8).jpg (180 KB, 1280x720)

180 KB JPG

>>738123972
Hotline Miami, Blood Wizard, Kenshi, Cruelty Squad, and many more. Gameplay is king.

>>738124203
Fallout was designed premise-first and that's the reason the gameplay is so bad

>>738124203
Warcraft 2 is kinda ass outside the art and the music, Warcraft 3 was premise first and is much better for it, both Fallouts were premise first

>>738124306
All unironic dogshit for posers

>>738124369
>Warcraft 3 was premise first
It wasn't, all Blizzard games are designed gameplay first

>>738124416
Nope, Warcraft 3 was designed to lead into WoW and set up its world and races in the necessary places

>>738124472
WoW wasn't even on the table when Blizzard started work on Warcraft 3
All Blizzard games are designed from the ground up, they have a rigid set of mechanics and nothing every operates outside of them, it's one of the strongest examples of "gameplay first" you can come up with

>>738124508
Just because they started work without WoW doesn't mean they didn't pivot hard into it during development