dialogue in every normal RPG>Hello, I'm Joe Bob the local baker would you be interested in my wares?dialogue in Pillars of Eternity>you look upon an overweight man, he smokes his pipe while watching cats fuck when he notices you he gives you a wide smile>Greetings traveler I'm Joe Bob, from the famous Bobs who participated in War of the Oven alongside Romdon Garsay himself, we are originally from Shitholia on the continent of Whogivesafuck >asking him about what the fuck are the things he namedropped sidelines the convo as he drops even more random bullshit>after 20 minutes of his wikipedia dumping you're none the wiser
Holy fuark, I haven't seen this pasta in an eternity. In fact, this pasta doesn't even show up in the archives.
>>738242459why do CRPGs like that need to spell out everything like it's a book explaining the surroundings or internal monologue when they can just show you and you take those conclusions yourself
>>738242459This sounds weird but I avoid criticizing PoE because it really looks like they put in a lot of effort in the lore. They have art booklets, novellas, plenty of worldbuilding etc. I respect the effort
>poe pastapostingmight be the best thread all weekanyways deadfire still pisses me off but shoutout Berath, what a God.
I unironically refunded this POS after it was just dialogue dumping boredom even during combat.AMA
>>738242459So?
>>738242459sounds based actually
>>738242459Why does every RPG have to be "normal"?
dialogue with an Obsidian written character in POE>Hiya, I'm Eder, and I'm looking for my brother.dialogue with a POE Backer written character>through the haze of pipe smoke filling the tavern like the Scottish highlands on a dreary morn, you spot a fiery-headed Godlike chatting energetically with the rotund tavern-keeper as he runs a deeply stained rag over the bar. As you stare at the bartender suddenly your consciousness is overwhelmed by dizzying visions of armored knights & hapless peasant soldiers clashing in the battlefield! The commander's booming voice rallies the troops, but with a woeful turn it is rebutted by the foe's fierce forces. The battle dragged on and on until the sun set bathing crimson light upon the staggering survivors as they drug their broken bodies from the bloody carnage of war. A hoarse voice called out from the mud for his mother before exhaling a rattling death-groan. The Commander looked with grim resolve as tomorrow would bring a new battle...
>>738243813at least they clearly labeled them so you could avoid all of them, i appreciated that.
>>738242459P U R E S O V L
>>738242459Illiterate retards need to be gatekept out of cRPGs, which should be written like books
>>738242459so basically you want retard-tier simple writing instead of book-tier writing that gives you a lot of lorepillars is the best written game on par with the best fantasy books
>>738242459
>>738242459just stick to jrpgs, lilbro.
>>738244041Fallout 1 and 2 has no bullshit fluff just actual dialogue and it mogs POE
>>738242459And that's a good thing!
I 100%d the game on the hardest difficulty on launch. Read all dialogues and text except for the ones made for backers and i still didn't understand anything about anything. I had no idea what the last boss was on about. Man was i burnt out
>>738244406ah yes because every game in the genre needs to be exactly like fallout 1 and 2, gotcha.all crpgs going forward should be making stupid quips and dated references too, yep.
>awful combat>awful writingWhat was the point?
>>738244406fallout would be better with those descriptions of what the character looks like etc
>>738244736>stupid quips and dated references But enough about PoE.
>>738244797what do you have down's syndrome? You see how the character looks like anyway why do you need an additional description
>>738243976You could also murder them.
>>738244768>>awful combat>>awful writing>What was the point?I mean the environmental art was really nice at least.And I believe the point was for washed up hacks to make quick and easy money by nostalgia baiting and exploiting crowdfunding.
Obsidian used to have this really good reputation before Avowed and Outer Worlds 1&2, but if you really think about it, they always suffered from this 3deep5u syndrome, more or less.KotOR2 feels like that, parts of New Vegas felt like that. But they were very good games despite that and it other than some dialogues like Ulysses' and Atton's, not a big deal.But they really went full retard in Pillars. They tried to change it for Deadfire but it was too late.I feel bad for that Josh Sawyer dude because he seems to care about the IP.
>>738244768Both the combat and writing were good for the genre but after playing several games I finally had an epiphany >wait a minute crpgs are boring
>>738244993>And I believe the point was for washed up hacks to make quick and easy money by nostalgia baiting and exploiting crowdfunding.And it succeeded in doing that.It's weird that they made Neverwinter Nights 2 and that one is unlike everything else they did.
>dialogue in hylics
>>738242994I have no idea how that became a thing. Baldur's Gate 1&2 and Icewind Dale have little to none of that crap.The closer I would point would be the dream sequences in BG1 and they were cool because of the narration.Neverwinter Nights 1 was made by Bioware but was basic rpg quest dialogue, too.
>>738244993>nostalgia baiting and exploiting crowdfundingIt actually feels like they didn't iterate at all. It was like they just wanting to stick with the same jank older RTWP games had.>>738245063DOS2, Underrail, Pathfinder all have better combat and/or writing.
>>738244523The entire game's prose is purposefully obtuse for the entire game but at the very end everything is spelt in a clear manner and then, if you re-read everything, all the vagueposting shit becomes "clear".Most sane people are too burnt out by the end to even pay attention, let alone replay all that verbose crap.
>>738244914no I don't it's just a few pixels retard
>>738245276Pathfinder's veer into cringe territory frequently but in the end it's a fun rpg adventure to read and play.
>>738244768I love the combat. The dragon fights on potd are some of the most fun I've had with an rpg.Especially the secret endgame fight with two dragons + an archmage. Super intense and there's so many little things to manage every second. Once you really understand the systems (which I didn't until like my second playthrough) its super funMy only problem is that there's to many shitty filler fights, a lot of the midgame areas drag on way too long with enemies that pose no threat to you.
>>738242459All of Owlcat's RPGs are exactly like this too
>>738242459Planescape:>Why do you call me 'restless one'?>"Restless is a good a term as any.." Dhall draws a ragged breath. "Something keeps you here, does it not? Something that must be resolved, some passion that must be quenched before you can reach the True Death?"Rogue Trader>Strange and blasphemous things started happening during the first warp voyage with you on board. The crew are whispering that you may be the reason. Is this true?">Yrliet juts out her chin and somehow seems even taller than she actually is>"The minions of She Who Thirsts could sense my soul behind the thick walls and thin veil that separate your fragile lives from the roiling fury outside. A Child of Asuryan that dared to wander beyond the veil... within the reach of an outstretched claw... protected only by the barrier of unreliable mon-keigh technology... It is too tempting a quarry for the monsters that serve Sai'lanthresh.">ContinueBaldur's Gate 2>"Coo! I bet you want to know how to save that lass of yours?">No>"Are you saying my sources are incorrect?">Yes>"You don't even want to go after the wizard guy?">No, I don't care>"Well, let me show you my house anyway">cuts to his house>"So, you need 20k to save the lass"
>>738245886My dude why are you lying, even item descriptions in BG2 mog everything in owlkek games
>>738244797wait, wtf are you talking about?i thought you could examine things in fo1 and 2 and get a little description
>>738244523Heh, yeah. Game narration pissed me so much that I'd gladly go with deus ex apocalypse ending, if it was offered to me. Every single person in that game was annoying as fuck. Only lore person of worth was Eothas, and he was retconed into an asshone for 2nd game.
>>738242994>>738245185>I have no idea how that became a thingPlanet Escape: Tournament happened and became cult classic, soewhere along the line midwits convinced themselves that more words = good, the rest is historyPoE sold on promise of return to glory of infinity engine games yet somehow it loses to BG trilogy in literally every aspect, this is also why Deadfire sold fuck all copies, consoomers actually noticed they were tricked for once.
Honestly other than some of the exposition in the early game I find the amount of text fine. I enjoy how descriptive it is. And Durance is the best companion of any crpg so he makes up for any other flaws.Deadfire's writing was pretty bad tho, the dialogue is marvel tier.
>>738247852>planescape: tournamentUnironically the game we should have gotten
>>738247967B-but don't you wanna nut Xoti? O-or Teheku, if you're into that? I-it's a game for mature adults, l-lots of SEX!
I like how Owlcat handles lore dumps where you can hover over the highlighted words if you want to know more. Makes the dialogue feel a lot more natural.
>>738248073There isn't that much sex though? The romances are clearly an afterthought.Which is a good thing, romancefags are blight on crpgs
>>738248135Still you have to admit it’s a cop out. Ideally the story would be written in such a way where lore encyclopedia searching is unnecessary.
>>738242994>when they can just show youno, they cannotcRPGs are very light on graphics and animations since wasting time, effort and budget on meaningless stuff like this retarded. You simply have two units standing in front of each other and a dialogue box open. Which is why they are written like books and that's what makes them great
>>738244041they are different mediums. if you want to write a book, do so. if you want to make a game, let the player actually play it, because that is the purpose of them.sitting there and reading wordslop for 20 minutes while occasionally hitting a button to make more text scroll by is not playing.or at least make it a VN
>>738248387>sitting there and reading wordslop for 20 minutesActually. You read wordslop for 20 minutes then press a crapton of buttons nonstop because they added some sort of MOBA/MMO skill pool to a 5~6 Infinity Engine cRPG party.In the past you could just buff your frontliners and micro your 1~2 casters. Not anymore. Everybody has a lot of buttons that refresh between encounters and even resemble rotations in some capacity.
>>738242459excellent game, ekera
>>738247852one of the ironic things about PS:T's wanna be sequels, is that PS:T is actually a very easy read. it uses very plain language and articulates its sometimes esoteric ideas very simply. it doesn't tryhard to sound impressive. it reads like it's written for relatively clever teenagers.all the wannabe-sequels however, read like they're written for 30-40 year old manchildren who are embarrassed about still playing video games, so they need to make their hobby seem deeper than it is by making it as obtuse or "subversive" as possible in unexpected (and ultimately stupid) ways
>>738248570People forget how many jokes and quips are in BG1 and 2; if that game was released today many anons would complain that its marvel writing.
>>738248570>it uses very plain language and articulates its sometimes esoteric ideas very simply. it doesn't tryhard to sound impressive. it reads like it's written for relatively clever teenagers.I never thought about it but you're right, also explains why PS:T was peak for me when I was 16
>>738248323Nah secondaries can kill themselves for all I care. If you arent already intimately familiar with 40k or Forgotten Realms what the fuck are you doing playing RPGs
>>738248643There's a fucking "Don't call me Shirley" reference in BG1. I think it's when recruiting Quayle.And many, many others. The millenials that were 20 or 30 when making BG1&2, Fallout (and liked Buffy) are more or less the same millenials aged 40~50 now doing the same kind of jokes and quips.It's just an irrational cultural reaction because these kind of jokes and quips were overdone in recent Marvel movies and the zeitgeist hates them.They were at worst just mildly funny "did you get the reference?" thing in a pre widespread Internet world. A connection of sorts between devs and players.
>>738248643>marvel writingdo you think Arnorld Schwarzenegger action movies from 80's are have marvel writing too because they have jokes?
>>738248643Difference is, marvel writing is when there's no sense of tact, as if writing is afraid to be taken seriously, so quips and even outright slapstick comedy very often undermine otherwise serious scenesBG never does that, at least I don't remember any particular instance of that happening. Even Jan Jansen drops the clown act when shit gets real with his family.
>>738248904The player got some silly dialogue options here and there, but for the most time they were sarcastic remarks subtly pointing out RPG tropes taking place during the main story.
>>738249040Yeah, but those mainly happen during side quests or minor encounters, like when you tell the cloakwood hunters that you're siding with druids because you armor chafes and they have amazing aloe balm. Or some retarded "I'm here to kill everyone" dialogue choices in iron throne/seven suns. I don't think you can quip anywhere with Sarevok or Irenicus.
>>738248570torment was very much a product of its time, both in how it plays around with infinity engine conventions, in how it copies successful jrpgs, and in how tech got good enough to support verbose games without crippling memory issuesdepending on your interest in modern artsy games, and branching narrative adventures, torment can be easily interpreted as "another one of those crpgs" because there are still plenty of WHAT'S THE DEAL WITH [BLANK] exposition-questions and filler berks with 2 literal lines of text
A lot of people think PST is all WORDS WORDS, but if you go check the total words of popular CRPGS, BG2 has a higher word count than PST, and if you go replay it, it's quite concise.Go read Owlcat's games and see how shit CRPGs have gone in terms of writing.You can be asking a simple Yes or No question in Owlcat games, and they will never give you a straight answer.
>>738249770BG2 is a really long game and has a lot of dialogue, but also a lot of party banter and interactions that would depend on your composition and even random triggers.So my bet is the actual average word count per playthrough is way smaller than the total word count.No idea how the same average would be for PST.
>>738249770>>You can be asking a simple Yes or No question in Owlcat games, and they will never give you a straight answer.>when your game has a sex and it's "female"
>>738249770>BG2 has a higher word count than PSTJaheira and Viconia romances probably account for at least half of that lmao
>>738250280Aerie also has a wordy romance and a lot of interactions with party members of all alignments and comments during quests.That bitch liked to be the center of attention. Even her romance was all about how she feels and what she wants.
if you play as a stupid muscle TNO then I imagine the wordcount is significantly lower. Most of the UPDATED MY JOURNAL came from stat checks.
People aren't ready for the truth, but that's Disco Elysium's writing. 90% of the dialogue can be safely skipped with zero story impact.
Why does POE persist? Everyone, everywhere seems to hate it. Yet /v/ has a POE thread everyday.
>>738250396At least you get to actually breed her wingless ass which can't be said about the roastiesAlso>every romance option is a divine caster>they want to fuck you because they are subconciously drawn to the bhaal's essence stored in your bhaals
>>738250643It insists upon itself.
>>738250676I take breeding every day of the week and her annoying whining was somewhat believable for a high and mighty (former) Avariel.But the opportunity to buckbreak Viconia into submission is also pretty good.Never did Anomen or Jaheira.
>>738250643Maybe they will announce poe3 soon and this is all a marketing ploy
>>738250849After Deadfire, Avowed and Outer Worlds 2 I will be surprised if Nu-Ai-Microsoft won't shut down Obsidian for good.Or force Bethesda to kneel and force them to make New Vegas II.
>>738242459>>asking him about what the fuck are the things he namedropped sidelines the convo as he drops even more random bullshitThis is my favourite second thing from crpgs. First one is boss fight.
>>738248756So then the lore keywords are pointless in your view?
>>738242459I unironically think full voice acting should become the norm, just to force writers to learn brevity.
>>738251348I actually think full voice acting will be detrimental for Dark Heresy because the combination of long verbose writing, full voice acting, and no cinematics will lead to stretches of just staring at the screen waiting for the line to finish. Either that or just skip the voiceline as soon as you’re done reading, defeating the purpose of full VA entirely.
>>738251348i too love basic dialogue slowly read to me at less than 1/3 speed i can comfortably read
>Based TierEderDuranceSagani>Alright TierAlothZahuaDevil of Caroc>Boring TierGrieving MotherManeha>Annoying TierKana RuaHiravias>Worse than Dogshit TierPallegina
I bounced off this game with the stronghold>Hey guess what. Here's a stupid fucking thing to to break the already molasses-like pace of the game that you have to constantly go back to to babysit and manage, it's all technically optional so you don't strictly NEE-Fuck off. Uninstalled.
>not already smiling from watching the cats fuckJust say you didn’t play the game next time.
Speaking of CRPGs, I'm disgusted at how Larian just left DOS2 without fixing the narrative endings.Every journo and secondary just gave it a 10/10.
>>738251669Yep, unironically. Video games are a different medium where presentation matters. Read a book.
>>738251852go watch a movie faggot
>>738251829Sure there could have been more detail for certain paths, and I think the “canon” ending is kinda badly written, but the endings are so open ended that I think providing more details would have disappointed people…and they didn’t have the resources to do a full epilogue like in BG3. Considering how remarkable the game is in all other aspects, I would say it’s fair to give it a 10/10 (even if I wouldn’t do so).
>>738249770Owlcat need to hire editors if they want to make all their games fully voiced from now on. I played Dark heresy alpha and mostly liked it, but I can't imagine it being fully voiced with their terminal case of verbosity
Thaos was kino and I'm tired of pretending he wasn't
>>738242994The average DnD gamemaster is a failed novelist or drama actor who loves descriptive words
>>738247967Zahua >>>>>>>> Durance>>738250643Cause it's a flawed gem and we're all tsun tsun about it. The main thing I miss from PoE 1 and 2 are the gorgeous prerendered backgrounds. No other CRPG that came out since has anything on them.
>pointless characters the gameyeah that’s exactly what pillars isit’s a shame because it’s an interesting crpg that just got completely dumpstered by having a million npcs who are all a total total total waste of time interacting with
>>738242459>tries to make it sound terrible, makes it sound like kino
>>738253730He has a point that the game has a lot of unnecessary prose. It does an opposite of "show, don't tell". They did improve that aspect in Deadfire, but it suffered instead from a Marvel writing.
>>738242994How do you show facial expressions Ina top down isometric game with static portraits?
>>738242459>And then you accidentally clicked "tell me more about yourself" in an Owlcat game
>>738254929"How do you show facial expressions in a top down isometric game with static portraits?" He frowns"How do you show facial expressions in a top down isometric game with static portraits!" He shouts"How do you show facial expressions in a top down isometric game with static portraits?" He smiles"How do you show facial expressions in a top down isometric game with static portraits?" He snaps"How do you show facial expressions in a top down isometric game with static portraits?" He sings"How do you show facial expressions in a top down isometric game with static portraits?" He says, stoically"How do you show facial expressions in a top down isometric game with static portraits?" He cries
>>738254929Animate the portraits.
>>738250849Sawyer said he wants PoE3 with turn-based combat. I am sure Microsoft will take it if he pitches it as a BG3 clone.
>>738257545sayer chasing trends again huh?>dos2 becomes popular from environmental mechanics>sawyer adds exploding barrels in deadfire>disco elysium becomes popular>sawyer makes pentiment
>>738257667well yeah, but since it's turn based it will sell millions.
>>738242459Well, that's a dialogue written by someone who expended 4 years in college, OP.
>>738257545I still find it hilarious how Larian managed to shit all over Obsidian with their Original Sin games. Who would have thought relying on nostalgia doesn't make good games?
>>738259973>Relying on nostalgia doesn't make good games>LarianUhhh...the same Larian that only makes CRPGs based on franchises from the 90s?
