I don't understand how the Playstation's stick placement is even considered TOLERABLE. Why the fuck would you EVER place the main control stick, which moves your character and you are constantly using, off to the side in a position your thumb doesn't naturally rest in by default??? AND WHY DOES NO ONE THINK THIS IS A BIG DEAL
>>738806360right? xbox controllers are so fucking weird. it makes no sense, why is it asymmetrical?it's like they didn't even test the design before shipping.
>>738806360It's good actually because when I wanna turn right and look left my thumbs hit into eachother and it's like they're kissing
>AND WHY DOES NO ONE THINK THIS IS A BIG DEALbecause it doesn't matter
>>738806428your hands are not symmetrical, ergonomics 101
>>738806360Anyone who bemoans stick position when you'll need to claw grip with a trad controller regardless is a small brained retard.
>>738806428>why is it asymmetrical?Because the movement stick and the face buttons are the most important and high-priority, so they go in the place your thumbs rest naturally. Get a fucking brain man
>>738806494I've played many years with multiple controllers from multiple consoles and never used the claw grip
>>738806360Wii U solved this 14 years ago
>>738806360The PS style stick position is the OPTIMAL controller design. It also has the best D-Pad, which zoomer Gaylo-homos obviously have never even used.
>>738806494The optimal hand positioning
>>738806619how is it optimal?
>>738806608It is certainly less egregious but your right thumb should not rest on the camera stick by default, it's not as important as the face buttons
>>738806608If any of the main buttons are underneath the control sticks then it’s a shit design
>>738806587>Because the [left] stick and the face buttons are the most important and high-prioritycitation needed
>>738806360excuse me, based coming through
>>738806706camera stick is way more important than the face buttons, retard. unless you play 2d platformers or racing games where you don't move camera at all
>>738806706yeah your left thumb should rest on the shitty playstation dpad instead
>>738806360sticks are for your palm, not your thumbyou're arguing about being the self perceived king of the sub-standard
>>738806689It's symmetrical, your thumbs rest on the sticks, while the D-Pad and face buttons are found in identical positions as well.
>>738806587You're often controlling the camera just as much as moving. In fact, you'll probably have your finger on the right stick most of the time and just press the buttons when you need to.
>>738806360I find both layouts easy to adjust to, and am suspicious of anyone claiming one is uncomfortable to use. I also disagree with your premise. If I'm using the left analog stick, I'm probably using the right analog stick more than the face buttons. I also use the d-pad as much or more than the left analog.
>>738806913>press your thumb forward>you strafe rightthanks sony
The stick should always be at the bottom, symmetrical placement just like our hands and every organism on the planet. Watch someone play elden ring on an asymmetrical controller and laugh at them struggle to move the camera or select an item from the quick menu in the heat of a boss fight/ pvp encounter. You’re literally playing with a handicap.
>>738806360Who cares, I'm on PC I have both controllers I can pick whichever one I feel like at the time.
>>738806360honestly having both PS4 and XOne cumtroller that I switch between regularly it really makes no differenceI was also originally more on the Ekex bockex side but having experienced both it literally doesnt make a difference nor affect gameplay
>>738807009Skill issue.
>>738806360the function of the face buttons have been replaced by bumpers and triggers so the PS layout makes more sense. xbox design is a relict of the past
>>738806360Symmetric is better to aim and shoot
>>738806360I can't play 2D games for shit on the xbox layout, D-pad is exclusively used for item and menu screens.
>>738806428Xbox controllers are the symmetrical ones. It's the PS ones that you have to hold in a weird way when playing 3D games.
>>738806360I use a Dualsense, 360, and Switch 2 Pro controllers. The stick placement doesn't matter at all, what DOES matter are the fucking Nintendo and Xbox button layouts being reverse, that shit can suck a dick.
>>738806589>never used the claw gripdo you even play video games?
>>738806589Maybe you should stop playing gacha games and should pick up real ones like Monster Hunter and Devil May Cry.You need to claw grip in those. Hell even babby game FF14 needs a claw grip. You're at a severe disadvantage playing on symmetrical sticks unless you have back paddles/buttons on your controller
>>738806587>movement stickIt's a left stick, retard. What it does depends on game and settings. Only a retarded masochist uses a controller to play FPS games.
>>738807380assymmetrical sticks*
>>738806360I don't understand how the Xbox's stick placement is even considered TOLERABLE.Why the fuck would you EVER place the secondary control stick, which moves the camera and you are constantly using, off to the side in a position your thumb doesn't naturally rest in by default???
>>738806428it’s asymmetrical because the left thumbstick is always used unless you’re the 1% of people who bitch about dpads. moving it up takes tension off the muscles that move the thumb. the right stick isn’t so bad because you are typically in equal time between the face buttons and the stick or less, so your thumb is not in a static position of tension constantly, whereas it typically is when the left thumbstick is symmetrical. symmetrical controllers are objectively inferior and will cause musculoskeletal issues eventually. sorry I had to btfo past, present, and future in these retarded threads but facts are facts. you can act like a tough guy and say it isn’t bothering you but the damage is being done
>>738806589You have tiny baby hands.
double claw is way too annoying with an xbox controller, and that's the only way you should play.
>>738806360What kind of baby hands do you have where the playstation's stick is "off to the side"?This has been an ongoing argument for years. My hands rest comfortably on both so I genuinely have no fucking idea what either of you faggots are whining about.>WHY DOES NO ONE THINK THIS IS A BIG DEALThis is "which side does the toilet paper go on" level of a deal. At this point I'm convinced you have no real conversation skills and just want to argue about nothing for the sake of arguing.
>>738806798And here I thought saying that /v/ doesn't play games was only a meme.
>>738806360>AND WHY DOES NO ONE THINK THIS IS A BIG DEALbecause it's notif you can't go from one layout to the other with zero effort, the problem is 100% you
>>738806469No your hands have mirror symetry
>>738806360It doesn't matter, now the fact that ABXY have like 3 different placing standards, that's 100x more fucked.Kiwami was the first and last i played Yakuza on a nintendie system because of that bullcrap.
I use to care about this.Then I realized after 20 seconds on either you get use to it
>>738806494>TradTard.
>>738806589For Dark souls and elden ring I claw gripped It works really well
>>738806360Do a shoryuken
>>738806360Please sir, you need to understand, Sony is a small company ran by two blokes with a passion inside a garage, give them some slack!
>>738807048This. If you're playing a dpad game then just pick up the ps controller, stick then use the xbox controller. No game requires you to use both the left stick and dpad primarily unless theres some claw grip shit going on like dmc style switching. Idorts always win.
>>738808051>download the kiwami 3 demo on the switch 2 to see how it runs>try Karaoke>uninstall it 1 minute laternope fuck that
>>738808051It's actually the fucking worst, anyone that uses a Xbox controller on PC and then also games on Nintendo hardware often is a fucking lunatic.
>>738808324Pretty much, though I actually prefer the DualSense for Pragmata, I like the haptic triggers gimmick. And Sony ports like Uncharted 4 just make more sense with PlayStation glyphs, though I understand that's just mental association more than anything else.
>>738808329qrd?
>>738807284What the fuck are you talking about
>>738807498Obesity issue
>>738808450>Braid dead retard can't remember multiple button layoutsDo you need to look at your controller when a game asks you to press X? lmao
I have never had a problem with either.
>>738806360>I don't understand how the Playstation's stick placement is even considered TOLERABLEbecause it's correct, you fucking idiot!
>>738808553Years of muscle memory, having the buttons already memorized in a very specific position, then playing a minigame where you have to press said buttons very quickly on a system where they are in a completely different position.Try doing that shit.
>>738807009this is not a thing.if you experience this then you are the problem, not the controller.
>>738807009You have to be mentally disabled for this to be even remotely an issue. You ought to be able to orient your thumb in relation to your body as intuitively as you would in relation to its joint. No neurotypical, able-bodied person has ever tried to point their thumb forward i.e. the direction they are facing and then found their thumb pointing east because they pointed it "forward" relative to their hand.We have billions of years of evolution behind us providing us with binocular vision and highly articulate opposable thumbs, allowing for extremely dexterous positional control by instinct alone. That is the natural state of a homo sapiens and something has gone wrong with your birth if that is in any way difficult for you.
What the fuck is wrong with the average gamer's hands? I can go from symmetrical to asymmetrical without issue. I own several controllers of each configuration. Is this an issue of fat hands? small hands? I seriously don't understand the autism around this.
For me it would be a modernized version of this. Joysticks have legit potential, maybe not the best option for everyone, but i like them.
>>73807009This is my issue but for the switch pressing the face buttons and accidentally moving the camera as well, whoever thought that the right stick should be directly bellow ABXY needs to be shot.
What were they thinking?
>>738808724nobody sane plays nintendo after wii sports resort, anon.
claw grip is retarded they should have buttons on the back of the controller
>>738806360>its okay when Valve does it
>>738806446It does in fact matter. My hands are not fragile and I only ever get hand pain gaming on playstation style controllers. I can play hours of Armored core with zero hand pain on xbox but just like 30 minutes on playstation is guaranteed hand pain.
>>738806360Relax, you get used to it soon enough.
>>738809790>the new irish curseyou got stubby thumbs, don't ya?
>>738806360xbox layout is retarded
>>738810071No? It's just basic ergonomics.
>>738807363don't care about the thread just came in to say arisu owes me sex
>>738806360Also, the Dualshock is made for WEAKLINGS with SMALL HANDS, while the Xbox controller is made for REAL MEN with MEATY CLAWS
>>738810504But the dualsense is larger and heavier than the xbox controller
>>738807380>Monster Hunter and Devil May CryBoth never required the claw grip.Devil May Cry didn't even have style switching until the 4th game, so the dpad was barely used.
>>738810731
>>738806360you must be new to console gaming.retard.know your history in gaming.retard
>>738811164Ayo I don't play all that boomer ahh shit like Crimson Desert, unc.
>>738809790Your hands absolutely are fragile if using a controller for 30 minutes causes pain. That's not normal, no matter what controller you're using.
>>738810213Who the fuck holds a controller like this, a fucking chimpanzee?
>>738810986>t. never played DMC3 Virgil
>>738810986>Both never required the claw grip.Zoomer, just go back, you're embarassing yourself.You've never played DMC3 nor any of the Monster Hunter games outside of the zoomer ones.
>>738806360>AND WHY DOES NO ONE THINK THIS IS A BIG DEALBecause nobody's ever used it
>>738806360>AND WHY DOES NO ONE THINK THIS IS A BIG DEALBecause it isn't. I own a ps5 and xsx and I have no trouble at all adjusting to the stick placements on either respective controller.
>>738809790Enjoy your crippling arthritis, anon.
>>738812463Haha, negro, you probably were not even born yet when I played those games. I even still have my saves from PC version.
do goyim really "claw grip" their controllers?
>>738812667Then I guess you're just DSP-dented and played on journo mode, there's no other way to explain it.How about you boot up that game and actually play it?
>>738812705Claw grip is for when you need to use the D-pad while not letting go of the analog sticks. It's rare but several games required it to play at a high level back in the good days.Nowadays you can just use back buttons/paddles as they're all starting to get common.
>>738806360Playstation's layout makes more sense because it allows you to claw grip the D-Pad with your index finger. This is often needed in fast paced actions games.
>>738812783Haha, negro, so what do you use dpad for in DMC3? Roleplaying as Kail while listening to Kamelot?You can achieve SSS rank without even switching weapons. In fact, it's often optimal since that's exactly what speedrunners do to maximize their damage. And even if you need to switch weapons 2-3 times per fight to be more flashy, you don't need the claw grip for that.
>>738806587camera control is more important than face buttons though
>>738806360Indoctrination. This is how everyone grew up playing games that didn't live in japan or USA.
>>738806619I agree PS positions are better but PS d-pad sucks, compared to xbox it's better but it sucks ass compared to SEGA d-pad
>>738813224>speedrunnersyou truly are a zoomer, saving those 2007 savefiles is just larping.You see, back in the day we had fun playing video games. We didn't watch youtubers play games for us.And yes, fighting stylishly is what DMC3 is all about, getting those high combos and trading strats with your friends.
>claw gripping in the era of back paddles>symmetrical in the era of gyro
>>738806360Are these the controllers you play Mixtape with?
I like the symmetry of dual shock. I guess whether thumb placement is symmetrical or not depends on the game, but I can't really think of a game where I spend most of my time using face buttons + left analog, or dpad + right analog. Like off the top of my head>Fighting gamesdpad+face button most used>Souls gamesleft+right analog most used>turn-based RPGdpad+face button most used>side scrolling action or platformerdpad+face button most used>FPSleft+right analog most used but also>FPS on a controllerAs for games where you are mixing left analog+face button most of the time, there's uh... DMC?
>>738813156>This is often needed in [dogshit games]
>>738813351Haha, negro, I asked you a simple question. What the fuck did you use dpad for in DMC3? Dante please, because Virgil wasn't even playable in the original release. Is it really that hard to answer a simple question?Also, back when there was no cloud and shit everyone was making backup of their saves.
>>738813156What's preventing you from claw gripping the stick? Easier to hit the dpad with thumb than a twisted finger.
>>738813545>I only play turn-slopNobody cares, Ranjeet.
>>738813823>if it's not souls slop it's tranime>le jeetjeetjeetjeetYup your opinions are dogshit. Stick with snoy controllers, faggot.
>>738806360>>738806445I'm so confused. I've literally never had the problem of my thumbs kissing on a controller. How the fuck are people managing this?
>>738808919>be oldfag>got used to the Xbox layout all in my life on PC/Xbox>get a Switch 2 because I'm not getting any younger>get a PS5 because I'm not getting any younger>also get into emulation of all the older systems>any kind of QTEs come up
>>738806360>off to the side in a position your thumb doesn't naturally rest in by defaultGenuinely is this a small person thing or what, I keep hearing it for years and then I pick up my dualshock and my thumb very easily rests on the sticks. But I also have big hands because I'm tall. Asymmetrical is fine as well, but I only hear people bitching about symmetrical, so there must be some major malfunction other people have.
>pic related is people who prefer top sticksFucking subhuman mutantsBottom sticks are ergonomically superior for properly opposed thumbsI bet you fucks can't even hold a cup with one hand
Playstation controllers feel more natural and always have. I had an og xbox and xbox 360 but I've always preferred playstation controllers and even use a ps5 controller for pc games even though I don't own a ps5. Ultimately it doesn't even matter and you're a faggot
>>738814143No I have relatively smaller hands and when just holding my controller in a "natural resting position" my thumbs want to naturally stay lower towards bottoms sticks
>>738806360How come Sony didn't patent this shape of the controller and for a while everyone was making controllers that looked like it?
>>738814158Tbf, the PS5 controller is a pretty nice controller. Battery life isn't great, but in terms of feel it's really good. If I could have the feel of a PS5 controller but the feature set of steam deck controller, I'd be pretty happy.
>>738814204Make your hand fully neutral, like it's dead. Then move it on your controller. The thumb needs to bend extra to reach the bottom stick, no?
>>738806360why would either of them put the right stick, which you use just as much to control the camera, off to the side in a position your thumb (supposedly) doesn't naturally rest in by default?also xbox can't into claw gripping the dpad
>>738806812Or any action gameSo that only leaves fps, with a controller LMAO
>>738806360Steam controller fixed Sony layout by raising the sticks higher.Hopefully PS6 controller copies it by lowering the touchpad and putting the sticks on top like some kinda cyclops steam controller.
>>738806360Zoomer post
>>738814425>Make your hand fully neutral, like it's dead. Then move it on your controller. The thumb needs to bend extra to reach the bottom stick, no?Not really anon. When you hold an xbox controller, your wrists are at different rotations (from the radial ulnar joint). You turn your hand over slightly so it's closer to facing down. Both hands remain in a neutral position.The twist makes a lot of sense for fps games because it also brings your finger naturally up onto the trigger more.tl;dr it's not about hand movement it's about wrist movementps controllers = closer to both palms upxbox controller = right hand closer to palm down
i wish i could end the life of everyone in this thread
>>738806608No these were stupid.
>>738806836>PlayStation Dpad>ShittyNo one thinks this except tendies
>>738809706This, watch the discourse change in the next few years over this now that daddy gabe has done it
>>738806360
>>738814765Complete bullshit. I've owned all three for years. Sony controllers always felt wrong. Especially PS3 and older, they literally didn't even fit your hands. I seriously don't know how anyone is okay with sony cotnrollers.
>>738806360>Why the fuck would you EVER place the main control stick, which moves your character and you are constantly using, off to the side in a position your thumb doesn't naturally rest in by default???The directional pad is the main, the stick is optional little zoomie.
This whole argument is basically a miscommunication between boomers who think the d-pad is an important part of the controller and zoomers who almost never use it.
>>738806360It's crazy how 12 year old me could play Left 4 Dead 2 but then switch to God of War 3 with no issues. I have never once thought about how the stick layout matters because it fucking doesn't. You could just fuck off 4Chan until you see something interesting or think of something interesting to talk about. Instead you post this dumb shit.
>>738815420I was born in 1988 and the left stick is the most important input on a controller.
>>738815420>the d-pad is an important part of the controllerBut it is. The stick is absolutely useless since it's used with 100% force anyway.
>>738815178>they literally didn't even fit your handsThey fit in my hands, but I'll agree the sixaxis/dual shock aren't preferable. The PS4 controller was chinesium garbage. The dual sense is a good feeling controller. As said asymmetrical stick placement is largely beneficial to fps games because of how it places your fingers more on the triggers.
>your thumbs natural position is up near the d-pad/face buttonsOk, so make it symmetrical at the top instead of the bottom like the Steam controller. Symmetrical is still objectively superior with this argument, just a matter of placement. Asymcels stay losing.
>>738815507False.
>>738815569No.
>>738815507I think the last game where I really had to use the d-pad a lot was Catherine. Most of the time I just use it to navigate menus in an RPG or cycle weapons. Stick is basically universal movement for games made after 2012 latest.
>>738815732Nigger, 2D games are still very common to this day
>>738815880only if you're an indieslop slurper.
>analog stickshow about no
>>738815916Oh, so you're just a AAAslop eater.
>>738815880If it's indieslop I'll just play it on mouse and keyboard as intended. If it's Touhou I'll play it on a leverless fight stick for precision.
>>738806360Never been an issue for me, plus it's more comfortable for the d-pad
>>738815957what's the difference between auto and turbo
>>738806428FPBP
>>738816654I think turbo was only if you held down the button and auto was press once and it'll keep going till you press it again? That or rate of speed.
>>738806360>>738806428>>7388167381997the day controllers were perfected
Regardless if you prefer sticks on top or sticks on bottom, there is NO good argument for them being asymmetrically placed, especially when the the very console that popularized it was the same console that popularized console FPS where both thumbs stay on both sticks the majority of the time.
>>738806360This is why the new Steam Controller is the best controller. It puts nearly everything near the top of the controller, so all traditional controls are in a natural position. The only thing you have to bend down for are the trackpads, Bending your thumb into a more straight down stylus position which is appropriate anyways.
>>738806953exactly, wii u pro controller will never be beat
>>738817224>the console that popularized console FPSThe N64?
>>738806360I barely use the stick, the dpad gets more use
>>738807079fortinajti or babaji?
>>738817193Worst controller ever made
>>738806360>use the right stick in the lower position constantly for camera control>this is in use at almost all times in any first-person or over-the-shoulder game>suddenly it's uncomfortable and unusable when the left stick is in that position
>>738808958>>738808993all i'm trying to say is Wii U Pro sticks > 360 sticks > Sony stickswhile the fine motor control demanded by sticks is more or less equivalently delivered with either stick orientation, putting them on top aligns the thumbs' physical motions (and the sticks' haptic feedback from displacement) with the associated cardinal-direction input sent to the gameand as an added bonus it avoids the edge case of thumb collisionalso, having buttons at the bottom takes better advantage of the thumb's oppositional/grip musculature
>>738806360Lotta fps controller faggots outing themselves in here.
>>738816738>comparing some literally who to sloth, the ultimate lifeform
>>738806360>>738810213>>738813156This is one of those things you learn to pick up on and intuit if someone is a retarded nigger or a mutt shitskin adjacent that only ever plays cod or fifaSymmetry with thumbs located lower relaxed able to quickly snap up onto arrows is best but either way is usable at least. You never need to claw hand a controller, and I've taken the time to hundred percent armored core and dmc games.And regarldess, inability to at least use the other style youre not used to at someone else's house is straight up troglodyte behavior.Skill issue, you fucking aspie faggots with autistic hand claw habits, you'd probably enjoy those single handed disability controllers instead
>>738814941>bifurcated dpad buttons>goodit doesn't even matter if they're protrusions from a unified plate because the ergonomics of rolling your thumb over the narrow gap between four triangles is horrible
>>738818915>at someone else's housewhy the fuck would i play vidya at someone else's house
>>738806360I use the Dpad more. Cope.
I swap between my Playstation and Xbox controllers constantly and I don't have a nervous breakdown. What the fuck is wrong with this board?
>>738806587Not since the PS1 has the face buttonmap been more important than the analog.
>>738819065it's not a question of being able to cope with inferior controller design, it's a question of why one platform in particular forces its players to cope
>>738806360It was a different time. When the Dual Shock/symmetrical stick placement was made, D-pad was the norm.Games like Ape Escape that required twin sticks weren't the norm for the PSX, even when the "Dual Shock version" came out, mostly because the OG Playstation didn't have them so developers had to make stuff for the D-pad and ABXY/symbol controller instead of the Dual Shock.I don't know why with the PS3, Sony didn't change it unless MicroSlop has some patent for the Asymetrical stick placements.
I only claw with my left hand.I think it stems from playing on the gamecube when I was a wee lad
>>738806360I've always said the symetrical sticks was worse for any 3rd or 1st person game.
>>738806360Why is the Xbox considered the correct one and not pic related when on a lot of games you use the right joystick camera button way more than the face buttons?
>>738817224>there is NO good argument for them being asymmetricallyYes there is. There is literally no argument for them to be symmetrical.
>>738806360i agree both sticks should be at the top. it's amazing how there isnt a proper controller
>>738819627What about the Wii U Pro controller?
>>738819904no gyro and (far less importantly) no analog triggers
>>738811413I can play 12 hours of souls games on any controller. I brought up ac specifically because it has much much higher apm than most games.
>>738806360if you were actually good at any games youd understand playstation is better cause it gives you more range of motion up and down. that's why the xbox controller the aiming stick is also on the bottom. playstation just decided to be symmetrical. xbox is good for xbox era platformers. all the new platformers and shit all the buttons are on the triggers and lb rb instead of the face buttons so playstation is the best for new games.
>>738820505>playstation is better cause it gives you more range of motion up and down.That's 100% false btw.
Dualshock 2 is the greatest controller ever made.
>>738820557you must have tiny girl hands then
>>738820505>xbox era platformersname one
>>738820623Or you lied and are incapable of backing your claim.
>>738806494Claw grip is for people with minimal dexterity and range of digit motion. Literally cripples.
>>738820737blinx
>>738820786Claw grip was necessary but now we have back paddles and claw grip is vestigial.
>>738817193The perfect controller came out long before that.
>PS4 is the perfect controller design!*PS5 controller copies a bunch of things from Xbox*>damn PS5 is the best designed controller everwhy are snoys like this?
>>738806360I'd use a symmetrical controller if anyone makes a good one that isn't full of planned obsolescence features.
>>738806360The only benefit lower symmetry ever had was clawing (not needed anymore) and it's better for 2D games (just fucking buy a 2D controller). That's it. It's literally nothing.
>>738806494Has anyone tried using the trackpad for games? What's your experience like? Do you give up and just use the sticks?
>>738820759it's literally just mathematics you tiny handed woman (man). back my claim? go ask whoever invented trigonometry
>>738818678If anything it'd be more taxing for the right thumb using this logic since you're doing more precise motions for aiming
>>738821112If it's just simple mathmetics then why can't you back your claim?
>>738806608Yup. Retards still don't get it. I hate that the Switch Pro didn't do a top right stick.
A lot of people have a compulsion to make things symmetrical so they'd rather have a DualSense
>>738821112why do you think your image disproves my ability to use top sticks
perfection.
>>738822163>ruins RE4 forever
>>738822163I always loved how relaxed you can get with the Wii mote. The joycons dont feel the same cause they're so dinky
>>738822163>MR TELEVISION, GET DOWN!!
>>738823176epic chimpout
