Sooo... your assumptions? Will it be a gold rush, or just another source of enless money for the nullblocks? Will global visibility of the site in the end be removed after a month, or noone will care enough in the first place?

the only carrier "buffs" we need are dread nerfs

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Meanwhile in Eve Echoes.

>>2059014
It's just a nerf to pochven and wormhole mining and a minor buff to nullsec. No dofference to HS because nobody is turning the new ore into pyro or trit anyway.

>>2059014
My original assumptions based on the test server: The new ore is absolutely worthless, needs too much effort to mine, doesn't refine into enough ISK/hr to chase over spawning asteroid anomalies in your back yard where you can easily exploit them. Assuming all mineral types have an equal chance to appear from a refine, the price of the ore will settle somewhere around Arkonor, and most of the reactions don't even turn ISK positive after the reagent costs.

If those numbers are just placeholders though and the ore turns out to be worth even more than Pochven ore, it'll probably become a major part of the mineral supply. I think people will probably still mine real easy to get anomaly spawns for something to do, but prismatic ore will inject so many minerals into the economy that most other forms of mineral mining will be worthless. Like you won't need to use those asteroid spawner upgrades in null and high sec asteroid and moon prices will drop significantly. I don't think LS and WH mining can get any more dead than it is though.

>>2059123
Oh, and the site mechanics:
>Site spawns as a cosmic signature, must be scanned down
>Warping to the site starts the fissure, which move a bubble looking thing (Not as in warp bubble, but looks like one) in a straight line from point A to point B over the course of a few days
>As the bubble goes over parts of the fissure, those prism rocks spawn in
>To mine the prism rocks, you deploy a mobile depot like object that requires ships to link to it. It takes either three porpoises, two orcas, or one Rorqual to link the device, which then causes the prismatite to become minable.
>Prism rock has 26-56m m3 in it, supporting a decent sized fleet

>As the bubble moves, eventually the prism rocks drift out of it and despawn
>The fissure also spawns abyssal ores and other +15% ores behind it as it moves which don't need linking to mine, but are lower in volume

>Once the site has been spawned for 20 hours, it becomes visible on the in game map and a beacon is added in system that allows warping directly to it
>Site is not deadspaced, so cynos still work on grid

I'm expecting the sites will get ran deep in nullsec beyond easy blops range but likely will be worthless in regions that have hostiles nearby. Lowsec sites will be completely wasted. If the sites have any value whatsoever, someone will permanently post a scout in the system to drop cynos as soon as a fleet forms and the Rorq lands.

>>2059123
>Assuming all mineral types have an equal chance to appear from a refine
You CHOOSE what it refines into.

I don't get hypernodes raffles. I don't mean how they work nor why retards would potentially buy them, but why people create them?

You pay an up-front cost to create a raffle that is blatantly a scam, which will be burrowed amongst a thousand other similar scams, and that will need to sell all it's ticket in 3 days? And in addition, most raffles that I see have the creator buy half of the tickets in the first place? Why? Do these raffles actually ever succeed? Are there enough gambling addict morons to fuel them?

yes people are stupid

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>>2059194
Once again, /eog/ spouts retarded bullshit without any experience whatsoever. Why do you do this shit? You can't even read patch notes correctly, much less have any hands on knowledge.

You can choose what the ore refines in with a reaction, which going by the test server's values won't even be ISK positive to do so except for Isogen. You can also just outright reprocess the ore which randomly gives one of the seven mineral types per batch, which has no reagent cost like reacting it, but might give you Tritanium or something else that's low value.

This was literally how it worked on the test server in addition to being written in the patch notes.

>>2059245
So in other words, you choose what type of ore it refines into.

>>2059232
Mega rich players gamble with hypernets a lot, it seems to be a fun way to use their money for bragging points. Some of my corpmates are filthy rich and hypernet things like titans or AT shipswhile giving rebates to their mates to make sure they fill all the ticket slots. Then one of them will win, they'll have a laugh together and put it back up on the hypernets.
As for why they buy half the tickets in the first place, it's to get the ball rolling (people are more likely to buy a ticket that's closer to being completed) and because it gives them a 50% chance to be able to put it back up after they win their item back while still turning a profit from other gamblers. They've done the maths.

Do not hypernet if you're not rich enough for isk to be meaningless, seriously.

>>2059014
desu only nullsec will care about this
>hisec guy goes to mine in losec: gets ganked in every hole
>losec guy doesn't care about mining
>nullsec guy can bring 20 of his friends to back him up

>>2059797
Well, wormhole gang have a new potential prey to stalk. If there is still some independent groups there, because large ones too busy farming.

>>2059797
For anyone without a fleet of at least 15 people, it's simply not worth doing. Assuming a group is using the triple Porpoises to activate it, that's three characters alone that have to be wasted not mining to even get the site to work. The non-prism ore that spawns doesn't have big enough rocks to be worth mining beyond a few ships and spawns very slowly. Unless CCP really ups the amount of Pochven ores that appear from it, you're better off mining anywhere else in lowsec.

this guy is really 1 tick fighting in an npc station

>pointless mining "improvements" that do nothing except clutter the UI
>pointless new mining ships to clutter the ship tree even more
>pointless 1B exploration BC (lmao) with some likely marginal unintended niche use cases making WH space worse
>pointless carrier changes
>pointless UI stuff
>pointless new map that still probably gets mogged on by Dotlan

*yawns*

>>2059015
This but also removing marauders from the game

>>2059232
People gamble IRL, too, with full knowledge it's a scam.

>>2061494
>but nothing was ruined at least on paper
In this neighborhood we call it "a good update"

I think CCP's pushing carriers in an interesting direction with this new patch. They're probably not there yet but they're starting to look like a fun fleet support ship

Carriers still need 10% dps buff and reduced NPC fighter aggro tho. Ideally they should be viable alternative to thunder packs isk/h wise. But there is still no content for them outside of ratting and crabs. All L5 should allow carriers. Bring new DEDs.

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>muh pve

>caps
>pvp

>chinese botting simulator
>pvp

botting is illegal

never stopped me

you don't even know how to bot and parse local

Carriers should just be full support ships. Massive Ship Maintenance Arrays, limited clone bays when deployed, the ability to dock in someone's carrier like it was a citadel, that sort of thing. Make them into Upwell structures that fly and must be docked at a POS like structure when logging off, otherwise they stay in space.

>support ship
just fly Astrahus or Fortizar

When are people gonna realize EO game mechanics are hopelessly obsolete and almost all big gameplay and ecosystem issues will never get solved before the whole thing is built anew from ground up? It's insane how there hasn't been a real overhaul since the game was released more than two decades ago (partial reworks of various tools etc don't count). If CCP was actually committed to EO development this would have been done already.

>EO
You forgot to shill Shithole.

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>EO

>EO
>EF
>EV
not hard

Are there any big high sec war groups like SRS was still? I know Bully Brigade will attack people, but the worst they send is maybe a couple of guys in marauders. Is there something between them and Black Flag for war decs?

>>2059797
>nullsec guy can bring 20 of his friends to back him up
No its more like
>nullsec guy has an intel channel feeding into a 3rd party app that plays a loud alarm plus a push notification to his phone warning him of anyone that comes within 10 jumps

>>2058581
Very cool how ccp has a tendency to nerf the economy into the fucking ground when goons are under attack then decides to buff mining into the stratosphere as soon as they're prime to capitalize.

>>2062380
Goons are glownigger central, they probably have dirt on CCP devs

There any actually active groups here these days? Last time I was playing it was like a dozen mostly afk people in allout and not a whole lot else.

>>2062388
idk why so many feds play this game. every large alliance i've been in had some fed that was pretty vocal about it. maybe it's across all games and a statistic likelihood

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Apparently, some alliances unintentionally recreated the Russo-Ukrainian war in Eve Echoes.
>an alliance from Cloud Ring decide to destroy a newly formed mega alliance in Providence for lol and it was a massive success.
>alliance in Period Basin saw this and decide to copy them and declared war on their neighbor in Delve.
>initially it was a success. They manage to secure a gain from Delve.
>alliance in PB decide to do it again.
>leader of PB alliance said the campaign would be swift and will be over within 2 weeks.
>But alliance from Delve have enough of their shit and strike back.
>alliance in Delve destroyed all POS held by PB in Stain.
>Alliance in PB also lost several Capital ships to alliance in Delve.
>now everyone in Eve Echoes are laughing at alliance in Period Basin for failing to drive out alliance Delve despite being bigger and more numerous than Delve.
Btw, Period Basin is mixed bag with Chinese, Russian and US. While Delve are EU with German as their main leader.

>Eve Echoes

>>2062399
If you're asking for 4chan corps specifically, nah shit's dead.

>>2062399
>Last time I was playing it was like a dozen mostly afk people in allout and not a whole lot else.
today there are 2 dozen entirely afk people in all-out

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>4chan

How do you fix game where people roam with fucking Super Carrier?

I keep making isk, more and more but the Hel keeps getting even more expensive each month.

>>2063384
The fuck are you talking about? Supers are crashing in price.

I have no interest in anything bigger than a battlecruiser.

I have no interest in undocking.

>>2063322
CCP are niggers and hire trannies. this is important to talk about. I will rape hilmar in the putrid asshole.

Is there a 4chan corp or discord?

Anyone who'd be up to do a few stupid roams? I have this ship I really like the look of, and I'd like to try without immediately losing.

Safety in numbers and all.

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>Is there a 4chan corp or discord?

>>2063707
Im sorry for being a noob despite being worth 22bil

I just play a week now and then and hoard

You have been doing this
>amarr
shit for a decade

Wormhole UN is going on. Apparently there's three CCP guys in there fielding questions specifically about wormhole space. Any questions /eog/ has?

wormhole space is aids

>>2063837
when are they banning all alts so seeding wormholes becomes impossible

>>2064020
Multiboxing was brought up, but it was a touchy subject. Some people really like multiboxing for the gameplay. Almost everyone in the wormhole UN multiboxes either by choice or being near forced to for mechanics, save for a few like the E-Uni guys that have enough actual people to form fleets.

Seed alts likely aren't going anywhere anytime soon. Logoff traps in C6 space are considered one of the only real threats players face out there, so those will likely remain unless w-space fundamentally changes.

>>2063773
>>2063688
>be me
>take my shitfit out
>go near a station, see a BS i could maybe take
>go the station, he warps to me and docks
>out comes a dreadnaught and a bifrost
>get booshed out to 100km

I mean they had no tackle and the bifrost would melt probablybefore the dread got to me but something weird happened and the bifrost went away, took damage from guns maybe, and so I just warped off.

Are proving grounds still a thing? Because that's just about the only way you can have a controlled fight.

>>2064242
If you want some kind of gay arranged duels go play another game. Eve is about hunting intelligent (lol) prey in asymmetric environment.

>>2063837
>When will they start developing the game again?
>What is their secret in securing funding for idiotic doomed-to-fail side projects time and time again?

>>2064080
Eve is so boring and low APM that multiboxing is the only way to make it interesting.

>>2062380
They have 3 goons plus like 2-3 more goons-by-association on the fucking CSM, how are you surprised?

>>2063688
No, there have been many attempts but it never works because of the anonymous nature of 4chan.
Also the 3 posters in this general already have their own alliances/corps, so at best any characters they use to join will just be spy alts that will hang until they get access to a corp hangar, then clear it out of anything worth taking.

>>2063837
>WH UN
So you mean Hawks are talking to themselves in a mirror, or...?

>>2064404
No if the game is boring and has no micro then it means you're doing very boring tedious low input activities for carebears, like mining.

>>2064506
UN's made up of about 30-40 different wormhole groups, two reps from each. But yeah, Hawks/Voidlings/HK do have a large presence in them.

>>2064401
>intelligent
Hardly.

Just say it, Eve is about cheesing the shit out of every mechanic and then hiding when you cant.

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>>2064600
Watch ibeast™ in english autodub bro if you want to learn how to solo pvp without all this coping about cheesing.

>>2064925
>Ibeast
>no cheesing

>>2064506
I almost exclusively hunt/evict in WH and NS, not mine lol. Another case of some clueless noob talking about shit he doesn't understand.

>>2064600
NTA but I suppose it wouldn't make sense to anyone that hasn't flown in a highly coordinated small gang but when you get 2-10 people in varying ship sizes and actually utilize the majority of tools you're given (implants, drugs, links) and have a fleet of people that understands the majority of mechanics like ranges/manual piloting you can push their pvp capacity far beyond expectation. There's no real cheese just raw skill/fleet prep (and money) superiority to make the fight against random null blobs you can poke more even. Hunting bigger game with fewer pilots then having the ability to maneuver around the pitfalls and counters isn't cheesing it requires hunting intelligence.

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multiboxing niggers getting their advanced buffing gnosis that allows them to huff all gas each connect with their 6-12 alts and doubles as an eviction tool for faggots

What is the counter to the gnosis holy shit its like fighting Andrew Tate 1v1

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>dying to gnosissies
Just kite it

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>kiting

>not kiting

I got muted in the EVE discord for a week by one of the devs for saying someone else was a certified Real NiggaTM for getting banned from the EVE API. I fucking hate these leftist devs and the trans/gay players supporting them.

I wish someone would make an Eve-like, I enjoy the spreadsheet-y shit, the ship designs, cold empty space aesthetic but the player ecosystem is poopy butthole.

>>2065652
they're nearly always blaster fit and thing has no tank or speed, just kite it to death.

>>2065960
Eve is amazing when you start treating the other random players like NPCs.

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souvlless

>>2066516
wtf why

>>2066684
because people keep calling interacting with the game 'needless clicks'

>>2065952
Not their fault that you can't self moderate and hide your power level in a community that you know will castrate you for the wrong opinions.

>>2065113
*drops a dreadnaught on your ass*

OUTSKILLED

>>2066834
*decloaks a cenotaph*
heh, nice try kid

>ceno
>after its been kneecapped

nothing personell kiddo but ur not cut out for this anymore.

>>2066834
*ganks cyno and mooonwalks out*

>>2066863
*blaps you*

nothing personal

Do I really need to hear dramatic music and get a popup every time I warp into an asteroid belt/anomaly?

Is skill training bugged too now? I went to add a skill and the timeline at the bottom just flickers and the queue cannot be unpaused.

>>2067529
More than likely the server that handles skill training is busted. A lot of different EVE functions run on different servers, it's why you can see things like autopilot stop working but the game plays fine.

Typically, you'll see "support" servers like that go down first during times of high use to save resources for other processes.

nvm, fixed it :-)

This update is massively disappointing. For something that had a huge focus on mining, absolutely nothing of import has changed except everyone got about 5-10% more mining yield across the board.

I'll be able to mine salt from miners when I gank their abyssal fit hulk tho so there's that for a positive.

How many pointless nothinburger "expansions" will they get away with before even the most retarded boomers unsub?

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What can I do with this guy to make some money while I wait for more drone skills? Or should I just mine. I haven’t been playing long. I have no long term goals other than better/cooler drone ships.

>>2067776
My personal recommendation, if I had all the knowledge I did now when I first started:

Skill stuff
>Take a referral link. Do it with an alt of yours if you're stingy, otherwise find some group you vaguely like and take one of their referral links. This will get you 1m SP.
>Do AIR career daily. Completing two of the objectives, one of which is make three stargate jumps, gets you 10k SP. Doing this 12 times in a month gets you 120k SP from daily rewards and a monthly reward of 75k/225k SP if you're alpha/omega. Can be done once a month.
>Do the AIR career program, cheese the fuck out of it to rapidly finish it if can. Throw corvettes at NPCs to lose a bunch of ships, go to Thera via Signal Cartel's bookmarks and jump all over the universe, whatever it takes. Gets you like 1.5m SP on completion, can be done in under a few hours if you know how to finish things fast.

Solo stuff
>Buy a Punisher/Coercer, run T0 abyss. You need virtually no skills to do so, just small energy turret and the ship skill.
>Upgrade to a Retribution if you like the Punisher (Plays the same but is better, does higher tier abyss) or move to a cruiser like an Arbitrator or Vexor. Cruisers are slower but solo frigate tops out pretty low, so cruiser is your best long term option at the cost of being slower to get started. Go cruiser if you really enjoy the abyss.
>Do high sec exploration. Very safe, but pays like a slot machine. You can run a single site and make 150m ISK from a good drop from a boss or run for hours and get nothing. You only need a destroyer or cruiser for most sites in HS, teaches you how to do stuff outside of HS too.
>Mission running sucks unless you do it in a very specific way (IE, burners or mission banking).

>>2067949
Group stuff
>Find some guys to run Homefront sites with. Sites designed for 3-5 players with low skills, cheap ships, and take about 10-15 minutes to complete. Sites pay out 15m ISK per character that completes them up to 5 people. There's homefront communities, but most are underdeveloped. Used to pay really well, now pays about 60-80m ISK/hr for an average fleet.
>Train to use large energy/hybrid turrets and fly a Praxis for incursions. Incursions take 10 or 40 players per site, take about 6-8 minutes per site, and pay out about 10m ISK+some loyalty points each site. Usually makes about 100m ISK/hr unless everyone is a newbie.
>Wormhole sites can pay well but most people don't do them publicly as a group, the only one I know that still runs openly is EVE Rookies on Fridays, which needs a Coercer Navy or Confessor trained to join. Pays about 100m ISK/hr unless you get jumped early and the fleet has to leave.

Mining
>Mining sucks unless you have fleet boosts, making this a fleet/multiboxer activity only (Except for gas which pays well anyway)
>Train to fly a Retriever, Mackinaw, or Endurance and go to ice belts in high sec. You'll usually get a fleet invite from someone and make reliable ISK solo (About 90m ISK/hr in a Hulk).
>Gas sites have to be scanned down and are usually found in lowsec, rarely in high sec. Finding one can pay well even without boosts though, Ventures with T1 scoops can make between 60-100m ISK/hr mining them.
>Wormhole gas is more common but has much lower pay.
>Ore is virtually worthless to mine outside of nullsec and mineral prices are dropping after the new expansion, don't bother.

None of this really says how to specifically do anything so you'll have to ask specifics for what interests you.

Honestly if you like drone ships, abyss is a great place to use them as the Ishtar (T2 Gallente droneboat, much bigger version of the Tristan) and Gila (Pirate drone boat) are the most meta choices for it.

>>2067949
Yo thanks for the advice i really appreciate it man.

Everywhere I look for abyss stuff gives me a long list of caldari missile boats to follow ... can i get by with drones? I'm never sure how vids from even a year ago stack up to today.

Is it better to go get skills to do abyss stuff in a punisher over the tristan? I was going to go tristan in to vexor, but then I trained for a corax but i think that advice might be dated.

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>>2068200
I do abyss with a Gila which is heavily reliant on drones with only weak missiles to help supplement damage. The real strength of the Gila is the fact that its medium drones are extremely tough (For drones), very high DPS (Its two medium drones do the damage of 7.5 heavy drones), and the medium drones track well enough to hit frigates. That's what makes it king of the abyss, in addition to being a very easy ship to get into.

Other drone ships can work fine, and indeed drones are very strong in the abyss. And training drone skills is never a bad idea since drones help a lot of things in many areas of the game. Since a Gila is fairly expensive for a new player and you're likely to lose ships, look at a fitting like this for the Arbitrator or Vexor. A fitting like this for either ship (Obviously replace missiles with long range guns on the Vexor) should work and cost under 40m ISK. The ship pretty much flies like a Gila, so once you get some practice and extra ISK, you can move up to that ship instead.

A Tristan is kind of hard to start with as a brand new player because drones need a lot of skills to get going, Drones level V to fly all five drones and ranks in Drone Interfacing to make them actual threats. Then other drone skills to back up their application. You can make it work for T0 abyss, but I don't really like it since it has trouble killing the Skybreaker rat early on. If you fly the Tristan anyway, put some blasters in the high slots and get a web so you can add to your drones' DPS against tougher enemies. I just recommend the Punisher because a) the Punisher has four guns instead of three like every other frigate, out DPSing every other turret frigate even when you're brand new and b) it's a really tough ship with high base stats, but making use of your Gallenete skills is fine. Though you might want to use an Incursus while you wait on Drones V.

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>>2068258
Here's an absolutely dirt cheap Incursus fit for T0 Firestorm abyss. 1.5m ISK and does well against everything except the Skybreaker rat. Use it until you finish Drones V, then go to the Tristan with a similar fitting.

>>2067776
Get into an algos.

Oh god what the fuck. Why do I have so many Dreads? HOW do I have so many Dreads?
>2 nags
>2 nag fleets
>Moros Navy
>Rev
>2 PNI's
>Phoenix
>Zirn

What the fuck. How the fuck.

>>2068711
No wait I have fucking FOUR Nag Fleets what the fuck.

bad at eve

7 days omega? im subbed for 3 more years on 2 accounts

But now you're subbed for 3 years and 7 days on 2 accounts!

>>2068739
it's your fault eve sucks

>>2068831
i promise you eve does not suck because i use an alt to stash my gila into it when 5 or 8 gankers camp my abyssal trace

30 more hours until my odyussy finishes building

What should I do first

>>2069824
Train into a ship that's actually useful.

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>>2069844
I already have every subcap trained, I blew a small portion my 40m banked skill points on training the 3 new skills to 5.

I'm going to go huff gas with it in high sec just to have a disgusting display of wealth. I built five of them, one for each account.

another expansion another 30 minutes spent relogging all 110 alpha accounts

>>2069922
Are you the tranny with alts in every wormhole system

>>2069933
no, they're alpha skill farms

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>mining crits
>null/low get new ore that can be converted into any mineral you want
>highsec now gets mining escalations and gets kernite/omber back
The game needs a new ore sink

>>2070124
That or they finally realized that scarcity was fucking retarded, Rorq nerfs were enough, and the real problem with nulsec stagnancy is Asset Safety enabling immortal titan caches and skill injectors enabling extreme levels of botting

the real problem with nullsec is that it exists

retard

>>2070124
The thing about ore is that it will balance itself out. The more the prices drop, the less people will go out and mine it. But the problem is the equilibrium point is whatever the bot armies in null can get it at, so this latest patch is just going to fuck mining everywhere else in the game as prices crash.

CCP doesn't really care though, the way they see it, bots are very stable in the amount of minerals they're injecting into the economy and make prices reliable. They let CCP advertise EVE as an economic sim without having to deal with the consequences of demand outstripping supply and prices skyrocketing which stops people from playing.

The new Kernite/Omber in highsec is worthless, prices on minerals are dropping so much the only resource still worth mining in HS is ice. Even moon ore prices are going down.

scarcity when

>>2070293
Not happening again. Regular minerals will never be split in different security bands again, from now on it will be somewhat like the old days. Null is now getting virtually infinite amounts of medium value ores and high sec is getting back most mineral types.

Very little discussion on wormhole space about ore, though when Voidlings and others were asking about it in the wormhole UN, it was stated by CCP that originally the devs were being very careful about ore spawning in wormhole space due to how easy it was to block off wormholes. They've revised their opinion some based on the fact wormholes aren't really generating an ungodly amount of resources as they expected, but it's going to be some time before there's a pass on j-space ore sites and potentially unique j-space moons.

The best people can hope for is that lowsec and j-space get unique resources (Or more uses for T3 resources in wormholes' cases) to drive demand for things in those parts of space.

>wormhole UN
gay

>>2070297
They realized scarcity was the wrong way to fix the game, but they're also to scared to actually fix the major issue caused by citadels, which is Asset Safety.

it was the right way to fix the game. they should've doubled down

They should have removed Rorq-tainted minerals from the gaem.

>>2070661
Scarcity would be fine if players were willing to accept that ships have value and you can't just throw them away without cost. A lot of people play EVE just to do that though, and if they can't, they stop undocking and then stop playing.

There's always a zero-sum game between players interested in EVE's economic aspect and players who just want to brawl. If you make things cheap, industrialists and miners start dropping out, and kills and losses lose their meaning. If you make things expensive, everyone plays overly safe and you get one fight a weak. There's no way to get around this.

The only good thing CCP could do is make minerals available everywhere and put unique resources in each security band: T2 components in nullsec, T3 in wormholes, and faction ships/mods in empire space. This way at least those items would have their values determined by how easy they are to acquire.

>>2070942
Then people just don't undock, everyone gets poorer because no one is buying new ships to replaced ships that have blown up and you didn't fix jack or shit about the game.

The economy isn't broken because there was too much production, the game was fucked behind there wasn't enough destruction

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Eat Antimatter L

>A lot of people play EVE just to do that though, and if they can't, they stop undocking and then stop playing.
nice theory
>If you make things expensive, everyone plays overly safe and you get one fight a weak. There's no way to get around this.
they could fix the game mechanics to stop disincentivising combat

a phoon costing over 400M during the worst times disincetivised it more than any game mechanic

>>2071070
>they could fix the game mechanics to stop disincentivising combat
Yeah, asset safety is the biggest one, the winning move of losing a war is to just go do FW instead and wait for your shit to come out of asset safety.

not interested in your reddit war. I'm talking day to day small scale. it is a bad idea for you to defend yourself from even 1 guy showing up in your area compared to just being a bitch

Nobody uses phoons to PvP, retard.

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>Nobody uses phoons to PvP, retard.

When are they gonna remove citadel/rig bonuses on industry? Currently you are actively getting cucked if you are not in some shitty nullblob with perfect structures.

>>2067949
>>2067953
>>2068258
>>2068262

you got any advice for an idiot who wants to rp as minmatar and use junkers for abyss?

>>2071522
I've been trying to push "refine is 100% effective but is instead time gated" for a long time. People who build occasionally or just for personal use won't notice a different, people who build at mass scales will need additional/more expensive structures to keep up throughput. Also helps reduce pay disparity between miners operating in different areas.

caldari joans is a stupid nigger. I fucking hate this faggot so much. I've gotten several accounts banned in his circlejerk chat channel doing as much as possible to give false information and generally shit up the quality of messages. I've been doing this for over a year.

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>>2071551
Yeah, I did some abyss with various factions' ships because everyone has their own preference on what they want to fly. While I 100% agree that the Gila is the top meta pick for the abyss, the Ishtar has some benefits and drawbacks to it, and the missile based Muninn and Sacrilege aren't bad choices either for high level abyss. Even the Cerberus works fairly well in some ways.

If you want a Minmatar path, decide if you want to go with missiles or projectiles. Missiles get used a lot, but a Vagabond isn't a terrible choice of ship for higher tier abyss even if it's not as great as some others. The Cynabal is also fun but made of paper.

If you want to go turrets, start with a Rifter fit like this in T0. Either beeline your skill training to fly cruisers and enjoy the Rifter or Thrasher as long as you can stand it, or move to a Firetail and then a Wolf or a Dramiel if you're alpha and want to stay in frigates and just run T1 abyss.

For cruisers, the Stabber will be a faster ship over the Rupture and better suited to artillery, using an afterburner and shield fit and relying on drones to kill frigates. The Rupture will be armor fit with autocannons and a web, usually with a MWD to get in brawl range. You'll eventually move to the Stabber Fleet Issue which can be arty or auto fit, usually as an armor ship, and then finally an autocannon Vagabond.

If you're doing missiles, the Breacher is what you'll use which is more tanky than a Kestrel but lower DPS. There's not a lot of great missile options beyond that for frigates, so you'll probably go to the Bellicose (Which isn't super great due to low DPS for cruiser), then a Scythe FI, and then finally an armor Muninn which is a really great ship. Get webs to help with application on everything but the Bellicose.

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>>2071220
>>2071229
>Nobody uses phoons to PvP, retard.
ngmi

>For cruisers, the Stabber will be a faster ship over the Rupture and better suited to artillery
>better suited to artillery
fuck off retard

>>2071628
/eog/ providing shitty advice again.
>>2071825

Do you feel more slippery and agile after the armor rigs change and new armor layering?

they turn you into a suicide retard brick but in a slightly different way. avoid at all costs just like before the changes

don't use arty on anything but destroyers and few frigates you sick fuck
don't fly Rupture

>>2072117
Arty Stabber Fleet issue actually works somewhat well. Arty Broadswords are actually legitimately good.

they practically printed 'autocannons' all over the ship in big letters and you still went with artillery

>>2071551
>>2071650
Just go missile breacher in to talwar?

RoF benefits arty more than AC, plus arty being 50/50 optimal and falloff is still nice.

no it doesn't retard

>>2072123
Yes, because that's how you win fights in Eve. Everyone expects an AC Stabber Fleet Issue, so they make decisions that play into that. Which, by consequence, give me the advantage because I am intentionally skewing in a different direction.

If you just fly ships the obvious way the only people who will ever fight you are the people who know they're going to beat you. By flipping the script in unexpected ways you get engaged by people who don't realize they're taking a losing fight.

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>RoF benefits arty more than AC
your optimal and falloff don't matter because you need to be in scram web range to hit anything but afk miner even with tracking bonus in 2025. Before resistance buff hurricane fleet, the classic arty platform, didn't have enough alpha to penetrate non-tanked crab Ishtar

why are you relying on other people choosing to fight you
>By flipping the script in unexpected ways you get engaged by people who don't realize they're taking a losing fight
with eve's retarded balance, it's pretty rare to see a ship fitted how it's intended. twat fits are not unexpected

>expects
What do you mean, bruv? After buff 80% of SFI are passive fit stabber style except x3 gyros, TE and 425mm. Where is the surprise? Arty fit without DPS and alpha? "Kiting" without point at 40 instead of 20? Hold on you can't even use 720 on SFI wtf.

The game is so powercrept arguing about pointless T1 cruisers is silly.

>he doesn't arty panther

drones should be altogether removed from the game btw

>powercrept
i can 1vs1 ur vaga or vedmak in stab fleet fag mate

>>2072336
>stab fleet
"The game is not powercrept, my faction ship is good".

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Looks like the Glassing of Dronelands is going to cost over 22 trillion isk. The hellcamp killed 5-6 trillion isk. We have bo idea how many trillions has just gone to asset safety.

This is a huge fucking opportunity, how are we capitalizing on this gaping hole in the economy???

nobody cares

>>2072799
my production margins have risen considerably

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>>2072136
>>2071551

Talwar is fantastic for running T0 or even T1 with missiles but if you want to progress beyond that you're going to want to train in to caldari ships. If roleplay is really important to you, think of it as affording stolen caldari ships or some shit i dunno.

>>2071650

Honestly ........ running a rifter in T0 is probably good flying practice for a newbro. Even if i think its a dead end compared to missiles and drones.

> pic unrelated

>>2071825
You dont know about the 100km 100mn Arty Stabber fit?

>>2073290
Yeah, I don't really like frigates in the abyss because I feel like they're dead ends unless you're multiboxing three of them. And that goes double for off meta ships like projectile or hybrid frigates. For T0 and T1 though, this isn't as big of deal.

The main thing people are trying to get from T0 and T1 abyss is experience. The ISK/hr is mostly there to ensure you never run out of cheap ships to throw at the abyss, not so much to make money in and of itself. Abyss is a good way to teach players things like tracking, EWAR, etc. for the PvE side of things because the only other place that forces you to think about those things in PvE are Trig invasion sites and diamond rats.

At least the Vagabond isn't terrible in the abyss and could conceivably carry you through T5 reliably. Barrage can basically hit anything in the pocket with the falloff bonus and the tracking is high enough you don't need a lot of help to swat frigates with your guns. Even if the shield tank isn't as great as other ships, its ability to kill shit quickly makes this less of a problem. The ship does great against things like Kiki waves.

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>>2073374
I like trying new shit ... you better not be trolling me in to losing a vag

>>2073382
It's not my go-to off meta ship, but I've done about 20-30 T4 runs with it and a half dozen or so T5. Autocannons are really flexible with the huge falloff and good tracking, and that makes it where you'll never have a dead zone for application. You could drop the web or tracking computer and beef up the tank, but I feel like it's better to play to its strengths.

I think it flies better than the Phantasm, which is a nice abyss ship that works for alphas, but is really cap hungry and has problems tracking up close or poor DPS at long range with scorch.

>You dont know about the [my garbage shitfit]?
no

Is it worth resubbing if I haven't played in 9 years or something?

>>2073391
Vaga isn't off meta at all. It's one of the most commonly used ships in high tier Gamma. Off meta would be Broadsword.

>>2072908
Very nice

>>2074095
No. Current eve is dog and you'd just gonna be disappointed.

>>2074095
i can think of few things more depressing than last playing in 2015 and returning to the game to find that things are somehow even worse than predicted
fuck ccp

>>2074095
>>2074363
>>2074432
To add to this, I have almost no isk and ships. What happened to make you anons disappointed in the devs?

mostly they don't address the game's big problems in any meaningful way

>>2074491
CCP first buffed Rorqs, introduced skill injectors leading to infinately scaling resource faucets breaking the economy to quickly inflate the game's value before selling it to chingchongs and then mostly just ignored the game

>>2073374
Blitzing Frigate T1s is extremely easy and fun 50-70mil/hr you can do anywhere in a ship that costs 30mil though. Love that shit.

>>2074095
>>2074095
Just play for free for a few weeks/months until you decide if you wanna sub or not.

>>2075151
It takes a little more training for a newbie to do, but yeah that's about accurate. I was blitzing T1s in a Retribution for about 4-5m ISK per site, and I could do about 10 per hour.

The sad thing is there's not a good step between there and higher level abyss. T2 abyss in a cruiser pays about the same per run but it usually takes longer. T4 is about the point where your earning per hour in a cruiser overtake T1 frigate abyss.

>>2074095
I did that 1 month ago, it's "alright", I guess, but I'm mostly just revisiting memories of the good old days of Nork. and shit. From what I see, the shit I used to do to make dough isn't viable anymore (highsec manufacturing & trading)

stop with the faggy highsec instance pve, play the game

>>2075540
I miss doing level 3 missions in a drake...

>>2075266
Yeah i never bothered with higher tier abyssals cuz the fit/implant costs aren't worth it.

>>2076484
I do T5 because it can be done in a ~550m ISK Gila and doesn't take long to pay for itself. Even though T6 is probably a net profit over it, I really just don't like the idea that I can make optimal plays and still lose my ship in the abyss just because three battleships spawned in a row. I haven't died in T5 in around 400 runs now.

>>2076514
Gila has enough DPS to do t6 in any weather with no guaranteed time outs. There's some autismo who does t6 Firestorms in a Gila and doesn't time out. It's a 1200 DPS fit that costs like 12b.

Abysshit is one of the things that should have never been implemented.

>>2076514
Out of curiosity what does the fit look like and does it require crystals/nirvs?

>>2076638
It's literally just the Povertila with max skills. No implants either, but T5 only.

People actually go omega just to mine in hisec for 12mil/hr?

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>is 1.5bil in your path

>>2076796
>Be CCP
>Introduce ship for a niche that literally doesn't exist
>it's massively outside of the price range of anyone who would even remotely consider engaging in that form of content

1.5b isn't even a lot, nullbears have just been duped into thinking their poverty is normal.

think about how long it takes to pay for itself nigger, not how much money you have

Incredibly nullbrained post

arsehole

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>>2076784
soul-sec
make it less

>>2076784
Are they doing it while working?

How to best move a bunch of small ships (say, 10-20 t1 destroyers + fit) from highsec to lowsec?

keep them packaged, use dst

yeah, dive into lowsec in a dst

what's the problem

you guys all have scouts right

don't need a scout, I have a brain instead

Hisec is gay and boring. Lowsec is either gigahomo FW faggotry or dead excluding some resident russian giga autist camping the same constellation for 2 decades. Null sec is pointless gigabloc F1 monkey faggotry and also dead. WHs are gay and dead and will additionally burn you out like IRL work. Poochven is gay RMT paradise. There's really no point in playing this abandoned game. I bet it only survives because there's a certain core group of boomers whose only social interaction is through pretending to play an interactive chat program.

stop complaining

>>2078072
and yet, here you are

>>2079023
My main use for the Internet is to get mad and reading about eve is the perfect tool for that.

>>2078072
Let's be honest those descriptions are exactly why you play.

my gameplay is going afk in krab systems for hours

one of my alliances mining corps is freaking out because oisio went lowsec.

>>2075151
>>2075266
Can missile ships do this?

>>2079914
Kestrel -> Hookbill -> Hawk does fine.

>>2079786
Tell those linknet fuckers in the mining fleet they actually need to learn to fight back. 80+ accounts in a mining fleet and no one will retaliate against gankers despite knowing where their wormhole station is. They just beg the handful of guys out in nullsec to do something.

>>2067949
Forgot to add to this, but pirate (or even empire) FW can reliably make you about 120m ISK/hr solo and be done in something as cheap a sub 1m ISK Tristan. Move a few dozen fitted ships out to the border of lowsec, sign up with Guristas/Angels, then just sit in small-1 plexes. No one will bother you and every plex that completes gets you 27,500 LP, which cashes out to be about 40m ISK on the conservative side.

>>2080841
>sub 1m ISK Tristan
Shit DPS will be fine for scout FW plexes, but small FW and small incursion plexes will be almost too tanky for a low skill cheap frigate. You can do it, but it slows you down a lot. For them, a destroyer is a much better pick (and barely more expensive)
>No one will bother you
Idk where you're doing that, but in the amarr vs minmatar vs angel cartel area, I sometime get run out of 4 or 5 plex in a row, and I've been told pirates can be very prone to awoxing

>>2080861
I admittedly don't do insurgencies every week, but I periodically send two or three characters out to an insurgency to AFK farm small-1 plexes. Very rarely does anyone drop any of the characters. The only thing I'll say is don't do insurgency when it's in early stages, if there's only 5-6 systems to farm in you'll get dropped or awoxed. When there's 10-15, everyone's spread out and nobody is really hunting.

I started with a Tristan because it was cheap but eventually moved to an Algos because of the higher DPS. I hardly lose any ships and would start using Worms but the damage gain is minimal and it's 80m ISK vs 2m ISK. If you're not fighting other players, you just fit for damage since the plex rats deal next to none. If you want a chance to fight off another solo player though, you've got to invest in a ship and probably skill up to fly it, farming doesn't really require anything though.

I highly recommend everyone keep an alpha character in ZZ to farm on a slow day, it'll likely print money compared to most other things for people who singlebox.

>>2080959
And this is characters split between multiple small sites. I don't bunch them up in one, although I will send a spare to back another up if there is people contesting them. Two algos together is a good amount of DPS and hard to control for one other ship.

>>2080338
Doesn't the kestrel only fit rockets and not light missiles? I haven't played in years.

>>2081046
No

>>2081113
Thanks, I guess I'll look for a fit later. I haven't played in over 5 years i think

>>2081046
It does lights, but you should probably go to rockets when you have over 11km range with them.

>>2081155
What's the difference? I don't even have rockets skilled up apparently.

>>2081193
Light missiles have longer range and take more power grid to fit, rockets have better application against fast/small targets and do more damage. If you plan to fight in web range, so long as your rockets can reach far enough, go for those to save on fitting. Only problem is that missiles are very affected by skills for their range, so you need to have near max alpha skills to get enough range from rockets.

Light missiles are considerably easier to use though because with good skills they can reach up to your maximum lock range. You can also hit things that fly out of web range, though fast moving targets will cause you more problems (Namely abyssal drones).

>>2079914
I do it in a Hawk with a 30mil Tech 2 fit.
An Alpha can do it in a Worm which is a 100mil Tech 2 fit.
Most of the best Abyss ships are missile ships, with a few exceptions like Retribution, Vagabond and a couple of other turret ships that can do it.

>>2080338
Seconding this. I started with Hookbill but if you're new go with Kestrel.
Like other anon said, once your rockets go over 15km range then switch to those.
in T1s the only rooms you even have to pay attention are
>Tessera Battlecruiser
just orbit more than 15km away from it
>Angels
manage your cap and kill whatever's neuting you ASAP. pop a blue pill booster if you start taking more dmg than you'd like and kite the fuck away.

Everything else is basically semi-afk orbit the Biocache at 5km, especially the Worm.

>>2062301
Thanks to this post, I remember now why I drop EVE every time after a month or two os cosmic madness. Thanks, anon, you saved me this year

Eve's intel system is completely stupid. The amount of instant, perfect and uninteractable intel the game feeds you is bonkers and has many harmful effects on the game.

ok wormhole nigger

>>2081280
>>2081381
>>2081382
Interesting... I found a video talking about using a corax for it, I might try that too. I'll try my first abyssal this or next week.

>>2082467
yeah honestly you can run low tier Abyssals in basically anything.
https://abysstracker.com
look up some ships/fits on here.
I've been wanting to try a Wolf and Jackdaw at some stage but lazy.

>>2082615
Thanks, I'll look at it when I'm free. I appreciate you guys!

>>2082467
I think if you're brand new and want to ensure you won't time out in T0, a destroyer is fine, but it does cut your pay down by a third. Still, it's easy to meet the DPS requirement on anything in T0 with it, even the Skybreaker rat. Once you hit about 130-150 DPS on a frigate though, go with that.

>>2083032
Why's it cut the pay in third?

>>2083201
Typically the number of filaments used determines your pay. A cruiser needs one filament for abyss, a destroyer two, and a frigate three. The destroyer earns twice as much as a cruiser and the frigate three times as much. It's because destroyer abyss is designed to be ran with two destroyers and frigates are designed to be ran with three.

These numbers aren't really exact, but it's a good way to look at things. So using a destroyer instead of a frigate means less loot drops, but you're also using less filaments.

>>2083201
the original design was that you run an abyss with one cruiser, two destroyers, or three frigates with friends
each person entering needs a filament and each person gets their filament worth of drops
but you can just solo in a frigate instead to get three runs done at once compared to a cruiser, and a cruiser is not gonna clear three times as fast

>>2083317
Solo frigates are a dead end though, you might be able to do T2 but T3 is far too unreliable to be worth it. Triple boxing frigates in T4/T5 is better ISK/hr than a cruiser though and three frigate fits combined are cheaper than a cruiser, but personally I'd rather stick with a cruiser for that level of abyss just to avoid things like wrecking shot roulette.

>>2083323
Can you still solo that with a cruiser?

>>2083327
Yeah, in fact you have to. All abyss fits a max of one cruiser.

>>2083205
I don't really understand this. So, does it drop more loot the more filaments used or?

>>2084164
Yes. Supposedly, running in a cruiser is still the optimal way because they can solo higher levels and afford the time to get the optional caches, but if you want to risk as little as possible, it's very possible T1 in a solo frigate is the way to go.

>>2084357
Thank you! I've been flying around T0 with a Corax it's pretty quick so far.

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>Corax

Corax is good for owning overconfident solo dictors but that's about it.

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>rlml t2
>drone interfacing, durability, sharpshooting, drone navigation level iv
>afterburner level v
>evasive manuevering v
>caldari and gallente cruiser level iv
>buy a povertila
>use 'augmented' drones for giga dps
>stagger your reps by 1 second
>use hardshell dose ii
you will now never die in t4 eletrical cruiser abyss
level v everything listed above and use high grade crystals to run t5 effortlessly

>Using Augmented drones in abyss
Split damage types make them weaker than even the navy drones, stick with navies or T2 if you need extra DPS. Even in 50% resist penalty weather your navy drones are doing 25% more DPS than augmented, and augmented aren't as durable as navy drones and they have less tracking and higher speed, hurting their application.

slamjam did nothing wrong fuck all-out

Only pve niggers left playing.

big brutor cock for my intaki character

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Another short daytrip into WH to shoot people and did not encounter one other ship

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>>2081382
I tried T1 for the first time (Dark) in a Hookbill and in two pockets the ships were humping the boundry so I couldn't orbit them.

>>2086569
I've started doing my wormhole exploration in a nomen with no cloak just to try and get fights. I'm convinced at this point j-space is either completely dead or I am the most threatening entity to grace C1-C3 space.

>>2086594
Don't be afraid to go out of bounds a little, you take damage based on how distant you are from the boundary so being like 3-5km away isn't a killer. Just don't MWD yourself straight out.

You can use the fact that rats won't willingly cross the boundary to do things like screw up drone battlecruiser/kikimoras too, they'll usually just get stuck dragging across the edge and never get close enough to hurt you if you're careful about it. Easier to tank the abyssal depths than a half dozen kikis.

>I'm convinced at this point j-space is either completely dead or I am the most threatening entity to grace C1-C3 space
if you ever "find" anyone, they'll be cloaked anyway, or disappearing to their citadel within seconds of you being in system. wormhole space is something we'd all be better off without

>>2086608
>I'm convinced at this point j-space is either completely dead or I am the most threatening entity to grace C1-C3 space.
Low class is dead as fuck aside from indy holes.
c5's are a handful of active corps and a million farms from randoms that never undock, and a bunch of rented holes.
c6 is krab central but you'll get yeeted if you try to roll 6's because nobody wants you fucking with their isk printer.

It astonishes me how people yap about high class being a blue donut when there's literally hundreds of c5's inhabited purely by small groups of russians who never undock, who have absolutely no backing. You can literally evict them with a handful of friends and start printing your own isk. It wouldn't even be hard.

>It wouldn't even be hard
aren't wormhole evictions inherently extremely autistic and unfun

>>2088651
Yes. What anon means is that some C5 corporations are set up in a wormhole but can't actually defend it, resulting in them getting pushed out by an actual corp that would want the space.

There's several problems with this though. The first is you have no idea where diplomacy falls and if you evict someone that had relations to the C6 cartel, you'll just keep getting evicted back. For example, every C5 with a system effect is a rental system, so securing one of those will draw attention. The other problem is the defenders have a slight homefield advantage of having their defense prepared ahead of time.

The biggest problem though is if a group is big enough to secure a C5 system for themselves, they're too big to gain anything from a single hole. You need a C5 with a C5 static which are virtually all claimed, and if you can't take that you're better off taking a C4 or C2 with a C5 static. Single holes don't support anything other than a small corp, so having statics is more important than having a high class home base.

>>2088675
Is is extremely rare that anyone gets pushed out of a c5 because someone wants to actually live there these days. Maybe back when wormholes were 3-10x more populated by actual pvp groups compared to now but these days the vast majority of lived in c5/c6 are farmholes owned and/or rented by the wh cfc. There are basically no groups trying to break into c5 space evicting people for a desirable hole. The same can be said of functionally every wormhole with a c6 static, hawks will evict you/tell you to leave. Honestly these days I feel like the most desirable systems have C4 statics since they can be farmed for only a bit worse than C5 but they're still pretty dead. Honestly at this point I feel like the best holes are either C4 with a C4/something useful that isn't C5 or C6 static or a C2 with a C4/HS static.

>>2088651
Only against someone who actually has meaningful defensive capacity which almost nobody does anymore because 9/10 times it's wh cfc doing the evicting so basically all groups live minimally knowing there's no reason to defend a hole when they could just logoff freighter everything when hawks/one of the wh cfc eviction groups come knocking with more firepower than the rest of jspace can field combined.

>>2089158
Having fought against hawks/voidlings/hk a few times in j-space, it's just fucking miserable. We've managed to fight them back a few times, and every time they call in nullsec to push their numbers up, telling their renters it's a requirement to retain their stations. These same people then say in the same breath that anyone can take C5/C6 space just to save face to CCP. Even when we managed to regain hole control and push them out for a bit, they just show up with an extra 50 to 100 people next time and lock down the system even harder.

The problem is value, even C5 isn't that great anymore. No one wants to expend an effort claiming space when the threats are disproportionate to the rewards. Even if there was a corp with 500 people in it ready to secure their own system, no one system can support that many people. If C6 space was split in half and the two groups fought against each other all the time, it'd be worthless too, which is what's hurting C5 space--even if one system is safe, the sites just pushed to other ones and eventually stop spawning as they collect in one place. C6 only works because all systems are safe and sites cycle through each other fast enough.

>>2086594
Oh yeah they'll do that once in a blue moon

>>2088675
>For example, every C5 with a system effect is a rental system
No it isn't. There's like 30-50 c5's rented by Hawks, which is literally run by one dude and the corp as a whole told him that they're his problem to defend, and there's supposedly some HK rentals, but I don't even know what corp they're under because I've never seen one.

>>2089357
They're mostly under the corps themselves. When you rent a system, you live out of a HK/void/hawks structure, or whatever their holding corp is. They'll still shoot you if they catch you ratting, but they won't blow up the structure itself because it's theirs.

>>2086608
Thanks anon! I haven't had to yet but so far I'm liking the Hookbill.
>>2089341
I saw another ship do it but luckily I'm using light missiles instead of rockets this time so I just orbited the loot container.

>>2089402
It's not that uncommon, the Drifter is worst for it. In higher tiers, the Drifter AI instead tries to orbit a sleeper, so it's better to nuke the Drifter first in those cases so you don't have to chase him down.

Drekavacs can be bad about it too since they orbit at about 35km.

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grey is systems with no players in the past 30 mins
didn't realize how dead sov nullsec is, thanks 2d map lol

I haven’t played in years, is All-Out still a good option for new (trans) players?

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>>2084986
damn brother, u right, i swapped out the augmented and ran some t5 with navy infiltrators, and that made it even easier. got lucky as hell too, made 550m est. in 1 hour

if wormhole space isn't cancer, how come it got ruined by one group of players not playing how you want them to

>>2089900
Current wormhole space is running exactly the way CCP intended it to. The fundamental mechanics of high class space actively encourage mutual NAP, because there is a static number of sites that exist, and the only way to get better site respawn is to let other people farm safely.
Whether you like it or not, Wormhole space is being played exactly the way CCP designed it to be played.

>blue donut is good if we do it

>CCP intended permanent habitation in wormhole space
implying

>CCP didn't want people to live in this place which is why they made it possible to anchor structures there

https://www.eveonline.com/news/view/into-the-known-unknowns

nigger

>>2089977
It's another example on how CCP fundamentally doesn't understand how their game works. Eve having any success was a complete fluke in general.

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Do all the other missile frigates play similarly to the Hookbill in abyssals? I swapped from my poorly trained rockets to light missiles and seem to be running T1 more smoothly. The odd thing is I swear the fitting tool said I have more dps with rockets.

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>>2091348
Rockets and missiles can be deceptive because of server ticks. Rockets get hit the hardest by this.

For example, if the tooltip says you have 15km range with rockets, but the actual stats are a 3.75 second travel time and 4000 m/s speed, then your rockets have a 1/4s chance to travel 12km and a 3/4s chance to travel 16km. So effectively between 12-16km, your DPS is only 75% of what is actually is. Add this in to enemy rats moving as well, and your effective range is much shorter than what the tooltip says.

Missiles usually don't care unless you're on the edge of their range or fighting high speed kiters, the tooltip saying 47.5km range when it's actually 40-50km range isn't a big deal when your target is always within 20km and/or approaching you. For that reason, you shouldn't use rockets unless your skills are very high or you're a newbie willing to fight in blaster ranges with a web.

Garmurs get this the worst due to their flight time reduction bonus. There's a huge range where they have a 50-50% chance to do damage at certain skill levels.

>>2091395
This is really interesting! Do gunships and drone ships get hit by this as well?

>>2091348
>>2091395
Beat me to it I was actively typing up a similar response. Rockets are excellent vs light missiles if you're well within their range but do not play nice when chasing stuff or shooting at the edge of range. Light missiles rarely have these issues just due to the sheer range increase. It's an old obtuse mechanic many are unfamiliar with that CCP has refused to fix likely due to ancient legacy infrastructure. Doesn't mean rockets are inherently bad you just have to understand the weird quirks to make them work.

>>2091405
Far as I'm aware it's just a quirk specific to missiles though I've never tested it on other stuff like fighter vollies. To my knowledge all drones have their own tracking formula similar to regular turreted weapons with turret tracking and optimal range/falloff.

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>>2091405
Sort of, but it's more reliable. Turrets have a falloff range, where they do proportionally less damage to targets between the optimal range and falloff range. For some guns like lasers, they have huge optimal ranges and very short falloff ranges, meaning they usually do full damage or very little damage. Autocannons have the opposite, tiny optimal ranges and huge falloff ranges, meaning they usually do some damage to a target even if they're pretty far away, relative for a short range gun.

The formula is roughly:
Within Optimal: 100% damage on average
Optimal+50% falloff: About 85% damage
Optimal+100% falloff: ~55-60% damage
Optimal+200% falloff: ~10% damage

Turrets also roll on a damage chart every shot, so they may do anywhere between half to three times their listed damage. This will average out to be the listed damage over time, but especially against NPCs opening up with a wrecking shot (300% damage), it can make a huge difference particularly in frigate abyssals. Wrecking shots happen roughly 1% of the time. Note that for players, each turret rolls individually, so if you have 4 turrets, you have about a 0.000001% chance for all four to land a wrecking shot at once. NPCs effectively have only one turret though, so it happens more frequently for them.

This graph shows the discrete attacks done by a Coercer against a target and what each attack could potentially roll.

None of this accounts for turret tracking or missile application (Missile Explosion Velocity/Radius), just what happens when those things aren't taken into account. Missile users in the abyss need to be aware a lot of things move very fast in there and missiles will have problems against them unless you can slow them down with a web (Namely rogue drones vs crusier missiles).

>>2091405
Drones are very hard to calculate because it's not just a matter of a drone's application and the enemy's movement, but also the drone's AI.

Drones have an optimal range, a falloff range, and a tracking speed like all turrets do. A lot of these are equal to a ship one size smaller or better: Heavy drones track better than short range cruiser guns, almost twice as well; medium drones track like frigates and destroyers; small drones have such high tracking they practically never miss assuming they're in range. Their optimal and falloff ranges are pretty short, but their AI forces them to orbit up close, and usually pretty fast too.

And therein lies the problem. In theory, a heavy drone should be able to hit a cruiser pretty easily and even apply against a frigate somewhat well. In practice, not only is the target ship moving (Resulting in them going in and out of range or just making the transversal velocity much higher), the drone is also orbiting around the target pretty quickly and at very short ranges. Unlike player turrets and missiles where you only have to worry about slowing your target down so you can hit them, you'd have to web all of your own drones to get them to slow down enough to stop overshooting their tracking speeds and have them apply which isn't really feasible.

Drones have two "modes", orbit and chase. They start in chase mode against targets out of range, using a MWD to speed up to them rapidly, then slow down and enter orbit mode when in range. Drones apply best when the enemy's velocity and the drone's orbit velocity closely match, resulting in a very low transversal, but it's hard to game this to match. They do ok when the target is very slow and the drones can stay in orbit mode the entire time, and they do very poorly when the target is faster than their orbit speed, constantly switching to chase mode to get back in range (Unless chase speed and the target is similar, at which case their fine).

>>2091481
For the practica of drones, most drone ships like the Ishtar, Vexor, or Stratios, who actually do use heavy drones to apply damage, need to have a web or potentially two to get heavy drones to apply to targets. They need to be able to drop enemy velocity below a heavy drone's orbit speed, which is about 350m/s. They can forgo use of heavy drones and drop to mediums against frigates and destroyers or particularly fast cruisers, allowing them to get by without a web or application bonuses, but this also decreases their DPS.

This is why the Gila shines so much in abyss and most other activities. A Gila's paper DPS by drones is no better than a Stratios: Two medium drones by a Gila deal the same damage as four heavy drones by a Stratios. But those medium drones need almost no support to track and apply to targets, so a Gila doesn't need things like webs or to be in web range, nor does it need tracking computers or target painters. Send your navy vespas against frigates and they'll kill them just fine. Other drone boats have to drop to 5 medium drones which lowers their DPS by a little less than half of the Gila, slowing them down.

>>2091418
Maybe I'll drop trying rockets for now, or at least until I have max skills. Light missiles feel more comfortable right now anyway. I definitely do want to try drone ships at some point, I'm unsure if I want to try gun ships.
>>2091443
What program is that? I assume it's reading logs? I'll have to read more about turreted ships soon, lasers look like they'd be fun to watch firing. Wrecking shots sound hilarious, are they possible against players too?
I did notice on my Hookbill that I was doing less damage when I (and the enemy) would enter the cloud that speeds up velocity.
>>2091481
>using a MWD to speed up to them rapidly
Kino! I did notice in abyssals that enemies seem to randomly speed up, I assume it's MWD or afterburners. I never knew about different sized drones tracking different, cool!
>>2091501
I see everyone mention the Gila for abyssals but is training up for regular Gallente ships a good idea too? There's so many ships that look really cool aesthetically, it makes deciding what to train a bit overwhelming.

>>2091533
EVE Log Analyzer, it's web based. You plug in your combat log and it parses it for you. Good for analyzing data and getting some good rules of thumb, but EVE combat is usually a little messy so you can't always follow the ideal things to a T. It's why autocannons are so good in PvP.

You can progress through the Gallente ship line, Incursus -> Tristan/Algos (When you have Drones V) -> Vexor -> Vexor NI -> Gila/Ishtar works fine. Just mind that other ships than the Gila will have less durable drones, so you'll have to pay attention and recall them when they're being shot. You'll train Gallente ships anyway if you want to fly a Gila so you can't really make a wrong decision. Just move to a Vexor ASAP since the frigate/destroyer drone boats aren't that great beyond the Worm.

>>2091561
>It's why autocannons are so good in PvP.
>Autocannons have the opposite, tiny optimal ranges and huge falloff ranges, meaning they usually do some damage to a target even if they're pretty far away, relative for a short range gun.
Is that due to >>2091443 mentioning this?
>Gallente ship line
Got it, thanks! I'll have to look up some fits before I delve too deep into all of this. I'm not sure what to go for after the Hookbill.

>>2091617
It's more that you can't really fully avoid autocannons due to their good tracking and huge falloffs (They can fight you point blank for high damage or kite you on the edge of your range) and consume no capacitor to fire. The tradeoff is they usually do less overall damage than other weapons even at point blank range.

Pulse Lasers can get some pretty great range with scorch ammo (Long range ammo for short range guns) for a short range weapon but they have trouble fighting very close up due to poor tracking and as soon as you go out of your optimal you stop doing damage. So if you can reach up to 20km with your lasers but an autocannon can hit you at 25km even for low damage, they'll just stay around that distance and win if they can keep you tackled and outrun you. Minmatar ships, which use projectile weapons like autocannons, are also pretty fast and agile so they're better at dictating range than Amarr ships, where lasers are usually found. Even if lasers can reach a target anywhere, a faster enemy can just pull range and leave.

Capacitor is another huge issue because if you run out of cap, you can't fire your lasers (or hybrids). Stronger lasers use more cap, so they take away from other modules like micro warp drives and armor repairers, so you have to be careful of burning too much cap or being hit with energy neutralizers. Autocannons and artillery (and missiles) don't have to think about that. All of these combined is why projectile turrets and missiles see a lot of use in PvP followed by blasters and then finally energy turrets.

>>2091721
I'll have to learn pvp at some point, it sounds interesting but very chaotic. Maybe after I'm sitting on a good amount of ISK. For right now I Just want to learn the best way to make money.

Convince me to come back to this game.
Last thing I tried was attempting solo pirating in low sec and null sec only to never catch anymore and only get into fights against people that choose to fight and who obviously knew they had an advantage.

I already hate the combat from doing highsec PVE missions where you just Orbit > F1 F2 F3 in a Drake and Raven.

>>2091348
>Do all the other missile frigates play similarly to the Hookbill in abyssals?
Basically. Hawk is basically a straight upgrade to it.
Worm is basically Hookbill with 2 strong drones.

>It's why autocannons are so good in PvP.

>>2091774
I tried solo pvp for a while.

>>2091985
Awesome, thanks anon! I guess I'll work towards the Hawk unless the Worm is better for some reason?

I was watching a video on abyssals and I didn't realize how much of a big deal overheating was when he said it was critical until I got to a room with 3 sansha and a room with 3 angels. I almost died but I forgot which room it was. I think the only reason I survived was overheating my launchers, afterburner, and shield booster. I ended up completing it with hardly any armor left.

>>2092034
Worm works on Alpha, is a 100mil fit and more chill/afkness.
Rocket Hawk is more fun and more DPS but you cant start applying your dmg until you're in range and its only a 30mil fit, but its Omega only.

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>Minmatar

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>>2094177
I don't think I should fly either of those ships yet. I just lost my Hookbill. I accidentally overheated my shield booster and afterburner to 100% in the first room against 3 Sansha. So I think I'll leave my Hawk that I was going to use Thursday, in the hangar for now. I probably need to get some more skill levels up.

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The collection expands.

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EVE Uni is ran by a tranny now

>Now

>>2094201
Big tip. Modules deal heat damage to surrounding modules, so if you have two overheated modules next to each other, they will damage themselves, and damage each other, which significantly reduces the amount of time you can overheat.
Try to put as many passive modules between modules you expect to overheat as possible. They will act as heat sinks and take damage from overheated modules but not cause any further damage.

>>2094825
Today the website UI changed for the worse. Not only are the colors fucked but, the layout is too. I won't be filing a complaint though, wiki maintainers are usually incredibly insane.
>>2094835
Thank you, anon! I also realized another problem after losing a second ship to overheating in the abyssal area. I was trying out a drone ship for the first time and apparently some of the keybinds to control drones are near keys to overheat a rack or module. I'm pretty sure I hit the wrong buttons several times. I'll try out the passive modules thing next time, thanks a lot!

>now

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112/113 ain't bad

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zogpilled????

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You should be flying the one and best ship.
And don't bother checking up that guy, it isn't me.

>>2096251
That guy looks like he'd be the villain from a movie set in Chinatown, based. Is the Abaddon good? I don't have my battleships anymore but I used to have a poorly skilled Raven.

>>2094835
>Try to put as many passive modules between modules you expect to overheat as possible. They will act as heat sinks and take damage from overheated modules but not cause any further damage.
In the fitting window or on my actual HUD in space?

>>2096512
After the Apoc DPS buff Abaddon is completely pointless.

>>2096554
Fitting window. You can move them around wherever you like on the HUD

>>2096598
Oh good, thanks! I was worried it was the other way around.

>>2096600
>>2094201
different anon, but thing with the hookbill is it has almost the lowest DPS you can run T1s with. A lot of Abyssals get easier when you just do more DPS.
Worm does 300, Hawk like 350 and Retribution upwards of 450 dps with Conflag, so often your best tank is either pulling range or just blapping stuff down so quick that it cant really hurt you.

Either way, keep practicing with the Hookbill for now. You'll lose ships doing Abyss, especially when learning a new tier. Its just how it goes.

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>>2096755
For the Hookbill, 151.4 dps with "Scourge Fury Light Missile", 134.6 dps with other types. I have 199 dps with a scourge fury light missile Hawk but I only have assault frigates to 2 so I haven't tried it in a T1 yet. I assume I want it at at least 4?
>Either way, keep practicing with the Hookbill for now. You'll lose ships doing Abyss, especially when learning a new tier. Its just how it goes.
Thanks for the encouragement! I'll buy a new Hookbill in a moment. It's such a goofy looking ship, I love it. I thought maybe I wasn't ready for T1s with my skills but then I tried a dragoon and lost that as well to my own stupidity with hotkeys >>2094863
I don't remember these damage effects from the last time I tried playing but they're pretty cool. Maybe this new Hookbill will last longer, hopefully I don't get a hard set of rooms right away.

>>2096563
The abbadon is kinda mediocre with lasers but strangely it makes a more competent than expected arty platform. With 8 howitzer and 2 gyros it has about 10k alpha and can easily have upwards of 200k ehp under links in a basic fleet. Now the fact that it's unironically best used as an arty platform is incredibly sad but that said even with lasers you can easily put out 1k dps on a boat with 300k ehp slaved with links though you'll guzzle cap charges and it probably shouldn't ever be used outside of lowsec pvp. The apoc does have more of a niche in fleet or as a longer range sniper/mid range pulse brawler but the abbadon is kinda godly for baiting slaved even without links. Pound for pound I believe an abbadon will probably eat an apoc in most scenarios if they're brawling and the apoc is really only going to be more useful at range. If they gave it a bit more powergrid and stopped perma cucking laser ships with retarded cap usage amounts it would be a monster of a ship.

>slaved with links
fuck off retard

>>2096862
>every ship should be good for pve or with zero support/prep
Are you fucking retarded or catastrophically poor? There are dozens of ships in the game that are bad but become excellent when you're willing to pimp the fit a bit. A sentinel goes from being meh with t2 neuts to probably the most disgusting frig in the game with deadspace neuts, a garmur goes from mediocre to unkillable god with snakes and a deadspace prop/faction point. If you're unwilling to discuss ships with tools that make them viable you're a subhuman.

who are you quoting

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thanks ccp

>1v1 laser battleship duels
This never happens.

>>2096792
yeah get assfrig to lv4 and then when you have the isk, try a rocket hawk. the popular fit can run T2's technically, but they're almost not worth it as you can just speedrun T1s faster for the same-ish isk.

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I feel like with the training and effort it takes to land a bomb, it isn't unreasonable to expect it to kill at least light drones.

anyone up for a laser battleship 1v1

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Stationary ships don't react well to 1400s.

>>2096563
Easily reaching 90% on any resistance is far from pointless.

>stopped perma cucking laser ships with cap
funny joke

>>2098072
I'll work on it soon, thanks! Although I'm seriously tempted to try it with light missiles when I get assault frigates IV
>>2097820
>>2098188
Post a webm if you do

The Anal Apocalypse
The Bum Breacher
The Cum Catalyst
The Dick Drake
The Ejaculating Eris
The Fuck Fiend
The Gay Garmur
The Hedonism Hurricane
The Insertion Inquisitor
The Jockstrap Jaguar
The Kinky Kikimora
The Ligma Leviathan
The Minge Monitor
The Niggerhogger
The Orifice Oracle
The Penis Punisher
The Rape Raptor
The Sex sentinel
The Tranny Thanny
The Urinal Utu
The Vaginal Vagabond
The Writhing Worm
The Zesty Zealot

Honorable mentions: QWX

I wish Vanguard and Frontier were shut down already so that CCPnigger needs to dev eve for a bit again (before launching another DOA FPS project).

>some vaguely exotic good / activity is kinda hard / annoying to find and/or extract en masse, providing an opportunity to autists/noobs to make some ISK by specializing into running the content
>CCP "buffs" the thing by making it more available / more easily extractable
>increased supply makes prices of said good plummet
>said activity is now only viable by gigamultiboxing / turbofarming it (typically in the perfect security provided by nullblobs)

Many such cases, the most egregious being exploration salvage sites in 0.0, an activity that earlier was the perfect way for noobs to both make good money and learn how to play independent of dullsec snoozefest.

>>2099629
>Many such cases, the most egregious being
Isogen. By a very large margin.
Recently anyway, I don't doubt that there were more example years back that I don't know of.

yeah nullsec is terrible, almost as bad as everywhere else

>>2099640
CCP's vision clearly is everybody running their 10 man fleets in 0.0 and having some server crushing fight every 5 years so that Hilmar can pose in some shitty gayming website making basedfaces and telling everybody how cool the fight was (a lie)

>>2099649
0.0 is mechanically the second best after WHs (which suck due to scanning for connections eventually burns out even the most dedicated giga autist) but the dominance of the unthinking zerg blob and the ongoing effort by CCP to kill any sort of small-medium entity viability ruins the whole thing.

>>2099679
Nah the problem with null is sov mechanics are how utterly trivial it is for big blobs to spam structures that take for-fucking-ever to remove. My corp is taking some sov from horde and even undefended, it's taken us WEEKS. WEEEEEEEKS of structure timers. It's fucking aids. And then there's the entosis horseshit etc.
Sov mechanics just suck in general. They're basically just meaningless busywork, just a hoop to jump through so your alliance icon appears on stargates.

wormholes are the worst space by a large margin

>>2099732
>My corp is taking some sov from horde
No. You are given sov by goons.

>>2099679
>>2099732
I initially liked exploration because at least it was a relatively solo friendly activity. But god dam the two mini-games it consists of are just repetitive boredom. Scan for signatures, over and over, then just the same shitty node clicker over and over for both salvage and data, 0 variety or variation. You would think "game" designers could at least move past the slot machine. Abyss is almost the same, you just run level 4 because the jump to level 5+ increases the risk exponentially for a solo cruiser - but a multiboxing frigate fag can do the same for a tenth the cost and minimal risk.

Its just sad they have always been chasing the next best thing instead of you know, putting their engineering and design skills to work gradually improving the content they already added to game.

there should be the possibility of people killing you during these activities so they're less boring

>>2099883
That's a common criticism of CCP and one I share. There's tons of content in the game that they could work on instead of adding new shit that nobody asked for and nobody uses.

Nullseccers don't like it when they make their content and space more accessible.