With Mega Evolution confirmed to be returning in Pokemon Champions, I thought it'd be interesting to make a thread where we theorycraft and discuss how certain Megas will fare in a post Gen 7 environment. Many Pokemon have gained new tools thanks to moveset additions. On the contrary, many Pokemon have had defining moves stripped away from them. Those who have gained:>Mega BlastoiseGets access to Shell Smash>Mega SceptileGets access to Shed Tail, with both higher defensive and speed stats than Cyclizar>Mega AdbomasnowSnow Warning now sets up snow, rather than hail. Also, gets access to Aurora Veil.Those who have lost:>Mega AltariaLoses Return and Heal Bell, will most likely rely on Double-Edge for fairy STAB>Mega TyranitarLost access to PursuitThe questionable...?>Mega GalladeAssuming the base form got access to Sharpness in Gen 9, Inner Focus may end up being switched out for Sharpness as well. Otherwise, as it stands, base form outdamages the mega.
>>58212239>Otherwise, as it stands, base form outdamages the mega. i hope they do that because it would be so fucking funny
>>58212239I have a sneaking suspicion that they're going to buff megas in some flat way, like giving a default 1.1x to all stats, or maybe distributing more stats to each individual mega, or updating abilities, or giving them like a second, bonus ability or something. So many were pretty bad even at launch, so many were just a bad sidegrade of the original (like, why would you ever mega ttar?), and so many more will just be plain weak at this point that it would be embarrassing. There's got to be a shakeup somewhere or all of the megas will fall into either the "stupid busted new ability" or the "stupidly bad" camp with no inbetween.
>>58212239Megazard Y is going to be amazing. It was already good but being able to power up paradox mons and chi yu will take it even higher.
>>58212239>Mega AerodactylGets Dual Wingbeat, now has reliable flying type coverage>Mega BanetteGets Poltergeist, a considerable upgrade over Shadow Claw>Mega KangaskhanPower-Up Punch was REMOVED in Gen 9, meaning Kangaskhan loses access to this move. This would be a huge blow if the move remains removed in Champions as well.>Mega PinsirSimilar to Altaria, loses access to Return, meaning it may rely on Body Slam for flying STAB>Mega ScizorGains Dual Wingbeat and Close Combat, but loses RoostAlso, Slowbro lost access to Teleport in Gen 9. Not notable to the Mega since it doesn't have Regenerator, but this could've been another instance where the Mega form ends up becoming WORSE, as regular Slowbro's ability makes it more valuable for it's defensive pivoting.
>>58212283I'm sad it lost roost in gen 9, but it'll still probably be a staple of sun teams. On the plus side it gets scorching sands and breaking swipe which are neat tools.
>>58212292huh this is where I first learned about poltergeist, neat move idea.
Mega Metagross is a very interesting case. As of Gen 9, it now has Heavy Slam, a SUBSTANTIAL upgrade over Meteor Mash. It also gets access to Psychic Fangs, Steel Roller, Expanding Force, Body Press.. Probably one of the biggest winners when it comes to moves it's lost vs what it's gained.
>>58212239I feel like champions will have all the moves
Mega Aggron now gets Body Press with 230 defense
>>58212239>Lost access to PursuitBut Knock Off tho>>58212292>Dual WingbeatGood lordWould Banded Head Smash + Brave Bird + Rock Head be more threatening than if they gave MegAero a Rock STAB to go with Wingbeat?
>>58212471Christ, there's only 4 contact Rock moves, and Aerodactyl can't use any of emStone AxeHead SmashAccelrockMighty CleaveHead Smash would be phenomenalAccelrock may be a bit redundant with 130 - 150 speed
>>58212471I completely forgot Tyranitar didn't always have Knock Off until very recently, hah>Head SmashThis would be scary on both for different reasons.
Mega Charizard Y will have gained tremendously if the paradox pokemon are in at the same time. Suddenly it becomes the ultimate sun team, pair with Whimsicott to run tailwind/sunnyday for extra weather control.GF needs to make a mega that has Electric Surge as its ability. Too few mons get that.
>>58212458That sounds good in theory and then you start running the calcs and realize that, like Mega Steelix, the only way for body press to be a huge boon would be to have STAB.Zamazenta's body press can actually pick up KO's while even with massive investment, Steelix and Aggron struggle to pick up 2hko's on massive threats.
>LatiosGot Aura Sphere, Mystical Fire, and buffed Luster Purge >Lopunny Scrappy is now immune to Intimidate and got Close Combat, Triple Axel, and U-Turn. Sadly Return got gutted so has to settle with Mega Kick and Strength >SwampertGot Bulk Up which is better than Curse on a Swift Swimmer >>58212292Banette got priority Swords Dance too which is insane, also helps that opposing Megas are always vulnerable to Poltergeist
>pursuit removed>gained nasty plot and ENCOREInsane. Shadow Tag is one thing but being able to give its teammates free setup is retardedly good
>>58213080>use status move or something as megagar comes in>if you can't outspeed it you literally just get perish trapped and dieHorrifying
>>58213080Every fucking Wolfe fan is going to try to make the Mega Gengar perish trap work. Hell they'll probably use Gothitelle at the same time.Fucking obnoxious.
>>58213047>opposing Megas are always vulnerable to PoltergeistYou sure about that?
>>58213139Mega Fug is going to be carrying an item guaranteed and even then Poltergeist isn't do anything if the mon gets wiped out by a Life Orbed Dragon Ascent first.
Taking pursuit from Tyranitar was the greatest mistake Gamefreak has ever done, at this point it was just iconically strong, now look at it, pathetic.
>>58212283Honestly Charizard is gonna be really fucking wacky when we start having multiple gimmicks active at once. You see it and it could be:>Mega Zard X>Mega Zard Y>Z-Grass>Tera GroundGranted the megas are objectively better than Z or Tera Zard but it could still absolutely catch someone off guard.
>>58212239I hope they remove that +20 attack from Gardevoir, it's giving me hives from anger
>>58213156smogshit ruined competitive pokemon discourse
>>58212278>(like, why would you ever mega ttar?)Look at these stats anon. That's why.
>>58212283Y is the Goat.X is a Fraud.
>>58212239I doubt Shed Tail Mega Sceptile would do much as it lacks Regenerator like Cyclizar
>>58212256Inner Focus is such a nothing ability. Sharpness even makes more sense for a mega gallade to have because it literally sharpens and enlarges its arm blades.
>>58213174It was good for countering M Kanga's fake out.Anyway, it's a niche use, I seem to remember. I hope they change these things and also give Audino a better ability.
>>58213171a mega having just inflated stats generally means it’s shit and not worth using
>>58213174Maybe if you're a singles shitter.The inner focus buff made Dragonite's dreams real. Immune to intimidate and fake out, now it could tera normal extreme speed to pick up priority KO's on frail mons.
>>58212239Mega Altaria wants Facade to punish burns, for doubles it wants hyper voice since intimidate is everywhere.
>>58212292>Power-Up Punch was REMOVED in Gen 9I'm pretty sure some moves removed in Galar were back in Arceus, plus there's Champions. No way Kangaskhan won't be able to use Power Up Punch again
>>58212933The only chance for it to happen is Mega Eelektross (or Mega Zerora if it's really included in future DLC)
>>58212278They should just make megas not need a hold item, but, while mega'd, the item is ignored. This buffs mega-able Pokemon by letting them not be dead weight when not mega'd, without making the megas themselves broken. As an added bonus it would nerf Mega Fug.
>>58212292Z-A is bringing Power-Up Punch back so maybe Champions will follow suit and bring back the move
>>58213047>also helps that opposing Megas are always vulnerable to PoltergeistThis interaction is technically not official, it only works that way in Showdown because the code suggests that it would interact like that. Completely possible for Champions to change the way this move works.
>>58213696I really hope that it becomes a consistent thing in Champions to bring back old moves. I’d love to see how much damage Pursuit could do to the new meta
>>58213156I think it’s only really relevant in singles. Did VGC ever use it?
>>58213907>I think it’s only really relevant in singlesEven that's giving it too much credit. It's only relevant in fanficshit. Smogon ruined competitive Pokemon discourse.
>>58213907Switches obviously happen in doubles, but you have so many defensive and mitigating/redirection tools in doubles that don't work in singles. This means that even if Tyranitar switched in on mons that didn't want it around, you have options other than hard switching.Singles really does feel like playing the game with half the movepools/support options being useless.
i wish all pursuitards just shutted the fuck up
>>58213948this but for people seething about smogonit’s been over 15 years guys calm down
>>58213951>stop seething that discussion about the game gets infested and polluted by a fanfic format that doesn't resemble the game that encourages campaignshitters who never touch PvP to parrot retarded takes
>>58213960yesit’s been 15 years bro calm down.
>>58213171>assault vest ttar has higher spdef>cb/cs ttar has higher atk/spe>leftovers ttar has better longevity>etcmega ttar is a waste of a slot, it just does what normal ttar does but with slightly higher stats and no item to benefit it. I think they should have given it sand force as its mega ability instead of sandstream, that would have been a natural choice to easily boost damage and maybe make it worth it. Instead they gave sand force to steelix for some reason lol
>>58214268I think they made TTar and Garchomp underwhelming on purpose to balance them out but in ORAS just stopped caring about even attempting to balance mega pseudos and just went full retard.
>>58214277Yeah, Salamence and Metagross are broken.
>>58212239>AltariaWHo the fuck runs Physical altaria? 252 HP240 Def16 Sp>Fire spin>Roost>Perish song>Hyper Voice
>>58214418It pairs nice with dragon dance sets
>>58213960do you screech this hard about nuzlockes too?
>>58214277probably but at that point why bother? They should just give them new abilities, like the previously mentioned sand force ttar, and speed boost garchomp
>>58214743nuzlockefags are at least intelligent enough that they don’t think it’s the normal way to play the game and that game freak needs to design around them
>>58214743yes
>>58212239>Gets access to Shed Tail, with both higher defensive and speed stats than Cyclizarcyclizar has regenerator and is thus superior to sceptile in terms of shed tail. cy gets at least 4 with boots and no other moves, serp gets at most 2.
>>58214754smogonites just want op mons banned they don't expect gf to cater to them lmao, they have like a hundred different formats to toy around with>>58214761then you're supremely gay
>>58212239>blastoiseshell smash and terrain pulse. will be a pain in the ass. >alakazam, banette, gengarpursuit was removed from the game.
>>58213080im going to start running mental herb hawlucha.
>>58214795Blastoise will be the shining example of why Shell Smash was originally only given to shitmon
>>58214817Take that back, fag. Cloyster isn't a shitmon.
>>58214268mega ttar has higer usage than regular in gen 7 and nat dex.
>>58214826>mega ttar has higher usage if you ban all the megas that are better than mega ttarholy shit......
>>58214824shitmon in terms of viability dude, that's always what it's meant. Cloyster fell off hard after gen 3 where it was already very niche. Shell Smash made it viable.
>>58214826unexpected but I accept it
>>58214824It was kind of forgotten after Gen 2. I don’t think it’s bad in gen 3 though, but it definitely wasn’t good in 4
>>58214832only 8 are banned. there 6 with better usage that ttar. the rest are below or unranked. regular ttar isn't used at all in nat dex ou.
>>58214832>>58214857that doesn't even make sense based on what he said, he could have only been comparing it to base ttar, not other megas. Lmao.
>>58212239One thing i'd like to see them do is give old megas new abilities. >TyranitarSolid Rock:Base T-Tar already has sandstorm, plus Solid Rock pairs well with the 50% special defense boosts he get's from sandstorm.>GalladeSharpness:Because there would be no reason to use the mega form over base. >AbomasnowGrassy surge:Like with T-tar, it's redundant to have Snow warning again. Also like with T-tar it would pair well with the 50% defense boots plus the health he would recover at the end of the turn.>AudinoAroma veil:She needs it, there's no reason to use her over Clefable or Blissey.>Mewtwo XNeuroforce:He needs it, he's the worst of the two forms. >Mewtwo YPsychic Surge:She needs it, she's been powercrept.>AmpharosNo Guard:Unless they give him Draco Meteor. Zap Cannon, Focus Blast, and Meteor Beam are the only moves he can use to take advantage of that massive 165 special attack.These were just off the top of my head. If you guy's have any better ideas i'm all ears.
>>58214418and that one screecher thinks is smogon users that shit up convos...
>>58214834it was a giant staple in gen 2 though, and i think relatively relevant in gen 1
>>58215699that's why I said it fell off after gen 3, if it was last truly relevant about a decade ago (saying this from when it got shell smash) then it definitely was powercrept out of relevance.
>>58215720my bad, i misread your comment as "that's always what it's been"
I think M-Garchomp getting scale shot will be a huge boon for it, seeing as speed was always it's biggest issue
>>58215653>Audino>Aroma Veilfor the love of god just give her regenerator like she always should have had
>>58216493That works too.
>>58213174If abilities are going to change they better give my nigga Magnet Pull instead of Meme Force
>>58217177would be kino, not sure why they opted out of it anyway, that visually at least looked like the plan
>>58213127giving perish song to trappers was a giant mistake.
