>>58996837
Btw there's an almost identical thread on /v/
>>>/v/734098837

>>58996837
>kanto pandering
>generational gimmicks
>party-wide exp. share
>underwhelming postgame
it's weird because XY are bad for different reasons than the later gens but they're still undoubtedly the tipping point where the series started to decline. it's telling that nostalgic kalosfags are nonexistent compared to unova- and even alolafags.

Can yawnchad juggle two kalos defense force threads at once?

>>58996861
>pokemon exist in the pokemon game
>it has new mechanics
>it gives you a reason to use more than 1 pokemon
>it puts content before the credits instead of after the credits
Where's the bad part?

>>58996861
yea all this, in short it's the when the games stopped focusing as much on being self contained adventures that placed emphasis on new pokemon and shifted more at just being "the latest expansion" to the Pokemon series as a whole

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>>58996882
>here's your emphasis on new pokemon sir

>>58996880
>>58996889
hi yawnfag

>>58996837
Yay yawnie thread

>>58996842
He's shitting this one up too

>>58996889
What about the other cave mons?

>>58996870
plenty of people on both sides do it for /vp/ + /vr/ when west kanto is in question

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>>58996837
>Why are these two rated as the downfall of the series?
Because borts can't stand the fact everyone else says BW began the downfall of the series

>>58997309
Weird. It wasn't borts who hated Gen 6

>>58997309
'Everyone else'
Doesn't post any examples

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>>58997326
kk gotchu

>>58996837
It's really obvious they rushed these games out, and were intending to polish them with a third version, since Zygarde was blatantly setup to be a third version legendary, and it was confirmed in the leaks they scarped Z version after working on ORAS to focus on the 20th anniversary titles (SM)

They are this weird transitional point in the series, but you can tell they didn't put their all into this, hoping being the first 3D mainline titles would be enough to carry them

>>58997587
>It's really obvious they rushed these games out,
Not really. It has more content than gen 5. It would be obvious it was rushed if they cut berry farming and fishing for no reason instead of bringing them back and polishing them, didn’t include customization, didn’t include amie or super training, made the whole campaihn a boss rush with not a single non-gym town, and made all the pokemon have barebones animations.

>>58997648
yeah, or if they released the game without all mons' access to their hidden abilities

>>58997648
>Not really. It has more content than gen 5
No PWT?

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>>58997318
because nobody hated gen 6 except underaged borts who couldn't cry about it online yet

>>58997689
No, it has challenge instead of soulless nostalgia pandering instead.

>>58997718
>Challenge
>XY
lmao

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>>58997727
which gen offers more?

>>58996861
Kanto pandering and the postgame were the only real mistakes. It still has the best map design and regional dex in the series

>>58997741
The one where there's bosses that are remotely interesting and a Battle Tower clone that isn't completely broken. Like, it's impressive how little challenge XY provides, there's not a single interesting or remarkable boss fight in the campaign, no interesting or difficult optional normal content in the post-game, and the Battle Maison can be made mash A easy in every format with only two teams. At least PWT makes you make monotype teams.

>>58997781
>The one where there's bosses that are remotely interesting and a Battle Tower clone that isn't completely broken
So XY. Glad we agree

>>58997773
I dunno man, the map design has a few too many Sinnoh time wasters, three parallel lines, and near zero map design maps for my taste. Like it's not on average Alola bad on the micro, but when you have less going on than Kanto Route 7 or Scorched Slab on any map that's just a waste.

>>58997741
>which gen offers more?
Gen 5 because I actually lost a battle during my playthrough of white 2 (to iris) and I genuienly did not lose a single battle through the entirety of pokemon Y

>>58997741
XY. I lost to Grant but didn’t lose a single time in gen 5

X and Y are just "complete" games and every game since has basically been that "completed" games
Outside of asset reuse like oras, ultra, and later dlc, these games hit a point where the devs say they're done and ship it out, they don't put in the extra passion and now instead sell you a half baked "post game" that revolve around one gimmick

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>>58997781
>The one where there's bosses that are remotely interesting
so definitely not gen v right?

>>58997817
>lost to a dude with 2 pokemon
>in xy
...How

>>58997788
Battle Subway doubles work fine, there's no way to exploit the AI to shut it down.
Battle Maison Singles are ruined by True Ant, just like B2W2's, but with more regular access to the culprit. This extends to Rotations to a much lesser extent.
Battle Maison Triples are ruined by FEAR Aron, a strategy that can trivially get you to quadruple digit runs if you can put up with the constant lag. This is similarly effective in Doubles and Multis with another player, only slightly less effective in Multis with AI.
Explain to me what's difficult about that, campaginshitter?

>>58997812
>lost to a girl with 6 shitmons
>in bw2
…how

>>58997830
so just don't use those strats?

>>58997822
do you ever get tired of this
like you've saved all these pictures and post on this board all day every day
doesn't it ever feel kinda boring or a waste of time

>>58997840
no; these are legitimately the only interesting archetypal threads on this board and the only reason to ever post here now
if anything I missed them
>all day every day
I've been gone for months

>>58997822
Yeah, definitely Gen 5. Elesa and Clay are reasonable for the campaign in both games for using remotely good Pokemon, Ghetsis in BW is a solid final boss, the E4 run when you can actually become champion is pretty good and having a rematch with a different team is above average for a first version, and post-game Cynthia is very good as a bonus boss, which isn't even getting into B2W2. XY has a Furfrou that might catch you off guard if you're doing a Nuzlocke, that's about it. Maybe Grant for Tyrunt but Amaura is such a free setup Pokemon that I wouldn't even assume that.

>>58997835
>It's good if I play like a retard!
Okay campaignshitter

>>58997830
>battle subway doubles
eviolite trick room dusclops, gg

>>58997840
The best part of the thread is when he runs out of arguments so he just starts copying your posts word for word but switching Kalos and Unova around

>>58997861
>Google the meta comp to remove all the challenge
>There's no challenge!
Okay retard, like you're organically coming up with those strategies

>>58997867
https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/black-white-battle-subway-records.102593/
>CTRL+F Dusclops
>2 results that barely broke 200
Politoed has better representation, and that's just because Gen 5 players are weatherbrained

>>58997885
>Look up meta comp on Gen 3/4/7 Battle Tower/Tree
>Good team that can always lose based on how you play the matchups and how the RNG goes
>Look up meta comp for US Crystal level 10 Battle Tower/Battle Subway Singles/Battle Maison
>Team with near 100% winrate that is trival to pilot and only loses to carelessness and the worst RNG
campaignshitter moment

>>58997891
>>58997901
Why would world record streaks be relevant? That's a tiny fraction of the already tiny fraction of people who actually play the battle facility. I don't get this. That's not really a factor in comparing the battle subway and the battle maison for me. Who cares? I'd prefer to make a team that has pokemon I like while still being decently strong.
The only actual relevant differences between subway and maison is that subway doesn't have triples and rotations while maison has lag.

>>58996837
fairy type was a mistake

XY saved the franchise, Gen 5 almost killed it

>>58997918
>world record
Some of the streaks posted wouldn't even get a Starf Berry, it's just smogonfags posting how good they did. On the other hand the ones with particularly braindead strats have some unusually high streaks, even if the number one isn't necessarily it. It could come down to power creep, that's especially true in Gen 7's high streaks, but it's still a notable pattern.

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>>58997939
this

>>58997876
>so he just starts copying your posts word for word but switching Kalos and Unova around
and the sad part is that they’re equally if not more valid

>>58996837
They're objectively bad games.

>>58996837
They’re objectively good games.

>>58997960
So according to you SV is the best game in the series?

>>58996837
It less that Gen 6 was a catalyst specifically, and more that it is emblematic of an overall decline in passion from the development team.

The sales for BW sent a message (whether it was the right message or not) to GF that it didn't matter if you put a lot of effort into fleshing out a new region and developing a story that attempts to be engaging. So XY has a story that barely exists.

BW receives harsh critical reception due to restricting you to only Unova mons in the main story. They backtrack in B2W2, and the message they take away is that old fans demand endless inclusion of old Pokemon.

Xy is birthed in the era of the slop children's mobile game. GF decides that Pokemon games need to be quick and content lite to compete.

And then every issue that comes with 3D, it changes how you design Pokemon, it took time for GF to learn to make a 3D game (which they're still struggling with to this day), Pokemon has never been boundary pushing and that's easier to obfuscate in 2D, etc.

XY is a game that, under different development circumstances, could've been great. But a simple confluence of factors changed the core, and it ultimately did well enough to reinforce GF going down that path.

>>58998165
>It less that Gen 6 was a catalyst specifically, and more that it is emblematic of an overall decline in passion from the development team.
True. I really felt a decline in the passion when they brought back all the features gen 5 cut, added more depth to them, took their time to give every single pokemon multiple animations in and out of battle, added subtle mechanics that didn’t even need to exist like natural objects, and added long requested features like trainer customization.

>>58998165
>And then every issue that comes with 3D, it changes how you design Pokemon
Why do retards act like “3D” is a genre
every DS game was already using 3D graphics

>>58997567
Wow Reddit, how unreliable. You know they ban anyone who likes Gen 5 right?

>>58998177
Hi yawnfag
>Brought back all the features that gen 5 cut and added depth
Oh my bad, like Pokemon Contests! Oh wait no... oh you must be referring to in game mystery gift events! No wait, Gen 5 had those and they were cut by Gen 6. Got it, you're referring to the safari zone... no, they created the friend safari that sucked dick. Oh got it you're referring to the Battle Frontier! Oh wait, no, they only really had the Battle Maison and it was barely fleshed out. Cope harder or name examples.

>Give every single Pokemon multiple animations in and out of battle.
This is an aesthetics thing. And even then they fucked up tons of Pokemon with horrid dog shit animations that they were stuck with for years.

>Added subtle mechanics that didn't need to exist
Every fucking Pokemon game does stuff like this. This isn't some unique element to XY.

>Long requested features like trainer customization
Again, aesthetics. And trainer customization was extremely half baked, and already behind what other games at the time could accomplish on much lower budgets.

Care to take another stab at it?

>>58997710
What's this from?

>>58997718
Oh? Where's the challenge? Also XY has way more nostalgia pandering

>>58998180
I love a classic Twitter tier nto reading my post moment. The issue isn't 3D inherently, the issue is GF completely fucking botched the transition. It was already a generation behind even by the standards of the 3DS

>>58997741
Pretty much all?
Just because there's a bug in Challenge Mode doesn't mean it's easier than XY.

>>58997788
Name one boss that's not mashing A

>>58998195
It didn’t really matter whether or not I read your post because your post is just more zero substance 3D screeching without a single explanation of how the implementation of 3D was actually bad.

>>58997812
He's gonna call you a retard

>>58998194
>Oh? Where's the challenge?
The streaks that you need to restart if you lose.

>Also XY has way more nostalgia pandering
That’s weird, I don’t remember all the gym leaders and champions being nonsensically shoved into XY.

>>58997817
How? How could anyone lose to Grant?>>58997822

>>58997812
How? How could anyone lose to Iris?
>>58997741

>>58997822
The number of Pokémon doesn't matter. It's the quality.

>>58997834
She has strong Pokémon. Her Haxorus in particular has swept me multiple times.

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>>58998205
Picrel is a couple examples when it comes to individual Pokemon models and animations, but I could honestly just show most of the over world chibi models to prove the same point. And for some Pokemon models, it has a lot to do with animations as well. GF clearly needed a little longer to let XY cook. It could have looked 10000x better.

>>58997835
Even without those strats it's brainlessly easy. I've seen the AI use Thunderbolt on a Hippowdon that had been out for multiple turns by that point.

Where can I get gems in XY?

>>58997855
There's a Furfrou that's dangerous in XY?

>>58998222
>all the models look better
>and have more animations that make more sense
>and don’t turned into a distorted tweened mess the second they move
Wow, you sure proved the transition to 3D was bad.

>>58997867
I can assure you that's not as broken as you think. It's definitely one of the better mons to use, but not nearly as good as you're making it seem.

>>58997827
He has strong Pokemon. His Tyrunt swept me a couple of times.

>>58997939
>almost killed it
It would have been a better fate than the actual trash we got since XY

>>58998238
Who the fuck is defending the tweened animations in BW specifically? Yes, some of them fucking sucked, but that doesn't negate my point.

And even if we wanna argue that XY had better looking models, its animations are dog shit. Skarmory just floating, most Pokemon just standing still with no expression, Elektross looking the way it does at all, etc. etc.

This also ignores the fact that GF couldn't optimize their models worth a damn, which caused performance issues on the 3DS. These issues are all connected.

>>58998261
>Yes, some of them fucking sucked, but that doesn't negate my point.
What point? That the models look better?

>the animations are dogshit because…the flying pokemon flies and the standing pokemon stand except for when you actually play the game and they aren’t doing those things
Wow, you sure proved the transition to 3D was bad.

> This also ignores the fact that GF couldn't optimize their models worth a damn
They actually optimized them perfectly. The vast majority of 3DS games have extremely shitty looking models. Making the Pokemon look better in a POKEMON game in exchange for SOMETIMES losing frames in a TURN BASED GAME was the correct choice. If “optimization” just meant “make the game run at maximum fps” then every Pokemon game would just be text based, retard.

>>58998210
>The streaks that you need to restart if you lose.
I prefer PWT because it's already hard instead of going all the way to 20wins before thought is required

>That’s weird, I don’t remember all the gym leaders and champions being nonsensically shoved into XY.
They weren't into BW2 either. Their inclusion actually makes sense. It's the Pokémon WORLD Tournament. Why wouldn't Gym Leaders and Champions from other regions show up? Meanwhile XY had Kanto mons everywhere, free Kanto starter, free Lapras, roaming Kanto bird, Mewtwo, only mons with two megas being Charizard and Mewtwo. That's just the stuff that's shoved in your face, or hard to miss. There's tons of dialogue and musical references too. Oh yeah SANTALUNE FOREST IS LITERALLY JUST VIRIDIAN FOREST.

>it’s another “3D models are bad because I like to stare at showdown gifs” episode
it’s all so tiresome

>>58998214
I did. Multiple times>>58998238
Tell me how

>>58998238
Tell me how Typhlosion and Hitmontop look better and more accurate?
Hitmontop is supposed to spin in battle and Typhlosion's flames are always out in battle. I understand them looking like that outside of battle, but not the static model in battle

>>58998244
Not possible

>>58998280
'Sometimes losing frames' the game was mostly fine in the overworld but in battle the lag was obvious

>>58998282
>I prefer PWT because it's already hard
It isn’t though
The nostalgia pandering means the teams are incredibly predictable and the lack of streaks means that high risk high reward strategies are way more viable compared to actual facilities where one miss on a 85% accurate move can fuck up your entire run.

>Their inclusion actually makes sense.
Every important person in an entirely separate country stopped what they were doing all to go a tournament in bumbfuck middle of nowhere that was literally just established? And they all look exactly the same as when you last saw them? And one of them is a fucking boss of a notorious criminal organization who’s supposed to be on the run? Yeah, sure retard. Defend that pandering just because it caters to your childhood games but go screech over a Snorlax and Pidgey showing up in a Pokemon game.

>>58998293
>Tell me how the pokemon based on eruptions erupting when it attacks and the pokemon literally named capoeira doing capoeira movements instead of nonsensically being upside down 24/7 look better and more accurate?

>Hitmontop is supposed to spin in battle
Which it still does. Maybe you would know this if you actually played the games instead of being a mouthbreathing Showdown starer.

>Typhlosion's flames are always [FANFIC]

>>58997817
How the fuck do you even lose to Grant?
The Mawile you get on glittering cave sweeps that fight.

>>58997721
kalos is unfinished and i hate gen5 but naming walking as a feature for gen6 is so sad

Yawnfag will keep posting and arguing until the end of time because he'll never get over the fact that unova has aura and kalos just doesn't.