>Tfw you lose nearly every matchup against your rivals and lose every League battle and only manage to win in Alola because the writers were phasing you out for a new character so they felt bad about making you loseIt's so funny to me that even in his own series, Ash wasn't even the best trainer despite that literally being his entire life goal
Badly written forced loses completely ruining his reputation with the masses.Badly written damage control cope plot armored wins where the only people remaining who like them and defend them are schizo self-inserters.Ash is a truly tragic character.
>>59047968I genuinely believe the writers just hated Ash
The boy who never grew up
>>59048197We know what happened from the Teraleak.It was all Yuyama's fault who was obsessed with making the Ashnime an "eternal" series like Doraemon and was set-on the thought that if Ash won the League the anime "would have to end".Reminder, the guy was so obsessed with the idea he even wanted to make Ash lose at Alola. That's when people finally grew a spine and told him to fuck off. Alas, too little and too late.
It made him kinda relatable. Most people aren't winners.
>>59048308Ash also had a bad habit of not evolving his mons so that didn't help either
>>59047820Ash has been in a coma since the first episode.
I fucking hated Ash’s Charizard as a kid and still kinda do. Disrespectful motherfucker except in the movies where it decided to act tuff.
>>59048280He's the one responsible for this bullshit? That figures.
>>59048819It doesn't make sense that his Charizard didn't obey him after a certain point, he got all of the Kanto badges and that should have made him show respect, atleast according to game logic
Say what you will about Ash, but he was a very selfless character and risked his own life several times to defend his Pokemon or his friends. We could all only hope to be so brave in the face of near imminent deathhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nF6XeEtG9no
>>59048280Genuine jap retardation at play. They probably "grew a spine" when they saw viewership plummet after the Kalos fiasco where him winning would have been perfect given that was his best team yet and they hadn't switched to lazy mode Alola animation. In fact any competent writer could have seen that him winning in Kalos would give him the perfect reason to go to Alola: he finally won and achieved his goal (or got closer to it) and so he wants to relax and go take it easy in a tropical paradise. Even more pathetic was them trying to course correct with that ridiculous tournament of champions, in which Ash's fights were the least interesting, on top of it being brought down as a whole by Leon glazing, with Leon himself being a nothingburger champion who only exists to glaze Lizardon yet again.
>>59048617Most of his Pokemon are evolved though
>>59049233The issue wasn't even him winning the Alola League, the issue was them going full retard and acting like winning some hastily cobbled-together tournament in a tourist resort meant you were automatically Cynthia-tier for some reason.Logically winning the Orange League would be considered way more impressive, with its 100+ years of history, legit challenging requirements to even qualify, and a final battle against a local champion with a reputation for being very tough.But to Ashtards, winning something named the "region-from-the-games league" and being awarded a title named "champion" is just magically superior by default.
>>59047820>>59048197>writers>>59047968>written
>>59049322Ashfags have been wanking the orange league for years anon. It only when they got the alola win.
>>59049348 Its only when they got the alola win that they stopped*
>>59047820>his entire life goalIt wasn't a goal. It was a dream...from his coma jkBut he learned that it's not about the glory, it's about the friends we made along the way, and the journey itself. That's what the show was actually about. Meeting new mons and characters. Battling just gave them the reason to
>>59049348No, not really. "It doesn't count" has been the general mantra, usually with no actual explanation for WHY it doesn't count. All the leagues he's lost were always thought of as "this would've been his first league win".
>>59049384That's such a cop-out though, They changed it just so they could keep his story "open ended" and not give him a proper ending, when from the very beginning his goal was to be a "Pokemon master" and to catch every Pokemon in the world, not BEFRIEND them all
>>59049233the point of the anime was for ash to become the best trainer in the world, and him winning and taking a vacation after all the growth he went through would've been a good capping point to show that ash has truly grown to become a great trainer. and yet HIS story was fumbled all the way to the end, when he coulda capped off as something greater
>>59047820Goku isn't the strongest fighter in the series even though he wants to become the strongest.
>>59048970Actually, it makes sense when you consider most of his Kanto gym badges were merely gifted to him after he helped the gym leaders deal with a minor inconvenience. He shouldn't have even made it as far as he did in the indigo league.
>>59049970thats because his journey hasnt been finished yet, anon.goku still got shit to do (such as beating frieza's new shiny black form and surpassing beerus for realsies) meanwhile Ash's adventure simply stopped despite him losing most of his leagues despite wanting to become the best.
>>59049974yeah, but at least people would've been fine if that was part of his character development and became better enough to get all 8 gym badges and beat a league eventually
>>59049233>They probably "grew a spine" when they saw viewership plummet after the Kalos fiasco The series actually experienced its stark decline with BW, and no wonder. Ash's departure with Brock, lack of regional transitioning and his post-DP design/personality made post-DP ashnime feel like a different continuity.
>>59049233>>59050014Viewership has been going down for literally every TV show in the world for the last 40 years, it has nothing to do with muh leagues or muh brocks and everything to do with the declining popularity of linear TV.It was nips bitching extremely loudly on social media in response to the Kalos loss that got their attention. And probably nips bitching about the Alola league feeling like a copout that made them go "fuck it let's make him world champion".
>>59048308Rocky did it better and also gave him wins after the first movie too
>>59047820Everything past XY is badly written fanfiction. The end to XY was kino. Ash lost but got the girl. SM and JN showed how empty winning and becoming champion actually is.
>>59048197Shudo did hate Ash and wanted to have alternating protags, that's not a secret.>>59048280>obsessed with making the Ashnime an "eternal" series like DoraemonReally weird That works for stuff like Spongebob or the Simpsons. Even Goku or characters like Superman or Spiderman(even superheroes occasionally pass the baton to their sidekick until there's another reboot event).Pokemon never felt like a comedy series that can do that like Doraemon or other, nor was Ash special enough like Goku or other heroes to justify him always being the main character
>>59050236To add, Rocky and Ash both losing the first time makes sense because they're both small time guys and are trying to make a name for themselvesRocky then fucking wins in other movies because there's even more at stake and has actual experience and people's honor to defend now, while Ash has more experiences and mons and adventures while still fucking sucking. No one likes learning the same lesson over and over again
>>59050257Ash sucked in KantoWins in OIHas a satisfying win against his rival in JohtoIs a mentor figure to May in HoennHas a satisfying wins in BFHas a satisfying win against his rival Paul in SinnohSucks in Unova, no defending that one. Is the coolest in Kalos.How did he suck? You guys are autistic and just obsessed with logistics.Be sucked dicks in Alola and felt like a cartoon character but gets a pass cuz he won smt nobody cared about.
>>59050245It's not weird at all. Detective Conan is doing it just fine, having a "plot" that basically inches forward every now and then but can obviously do so for another 50 years as long as the powers that be decides the series shouldn't end yet.
>>59049395>"It doesn't count" has been the general mantraBy people criticizing him, not by people in favor of him.These are two different groups of people no matter how much ashfags insist otherwise.>>59049970He wants to fight strong opponents, not be the strongest necesarilly.>>59049981>his journey hasnt been finished yetIt has though, you're just the ideal consoomerAnd even then all the things you mention take place prior to the epilogue.
>>59051001>By people criticizing him, not by people in favor of him. These are two different groups of people no matter how much ashfags insist otherwise.No, those in favor of Ash wanted to see him "win a league" for ages after the orange league was a thing. Nobody counted it, regardless of their opinions on Ash.
>>59048956The most bullshit asspull in anime history
>>59051001>He wants to fight strong opponents, not be the strongest necesarilly.It's both. He wants to surpass the strongest opponents he meets, but he doesn't want that to be the climax. We can already see how that's like in the original ending. Goku became the strongest unsurpassed character and didn't get a real challenge after Buu, which to someone like him gave him everlasting boredom and left a huge void in his life that he likely would have felt a lot sooner if not for Raditz.
>>59051001yeah but end of z was originally the end before they decided to make more stuff, so now goku story continues with him getting even stronger
>>59051094That's revisionism>>59051266>didn't get a real challenge after BuuRight when the original manga ended.>>59052423All the modern stuff takes place before the end of Z.
>>59052446yeah, and the modern stuff hasnt reached its conclusion yet, so his journet isnt finished yet
>>59052482>yeahso his journey ended, ok.
>>59052501but its not finished, which is an important distinction, having an end is different from the rest of the journey being finished
God damn I wish i was a 10 year old getting to travel with the sexiest 11 year old girls on earth, desired by numerous species of Pokemon but refusing them all anyway to fuck my electric mouse onahole and hot ex beauty model mom.What a life.It’s not fair.
>>59052510In Japan, the original source material takes precedence over everything else, so the story effectively ended with Buu. Super is supplementary material.
>>59052998ThisNo matter what happens in Super, the ending of Z after Buu is canon. If Super can fill the gap between, it can be included, if it can't it is noncannon like GT. That's just how the japanese work.
>>59049186The episode where he goes out of his way to get back the gym badges TR stole from other trainers, despite Brock telling him he has to register for the Pokemon League or risk not participating in the tournament is pure kino. Very nice kid.
>>59050094And then they bitched that him becoming world's strongest was unearned (and not only that meaningless, it devalued prior champions too because he lost to Misty immediately after) and just gave up entirely.Then they bitched about Liko being a bad protagonist, now they're bitching about Roy being brown and getting freebies.Nips literally don't know what they want from Pokemon and I wouldn't be surprised if they stopped trying to do a weekly anime outright after Horizons.
>>59047820He should have won the Sinnoh League. Writers thought him winning a championship meant his story was over, which is dumb. Have him challenge Cynthia and loss. There, he still has more room for progress. If Ash had a couple of wins under his belt, it would have felt far more legit for him to defeat all the best trainers.
>>59047820The anime doesn't make sense. It just randomly makes type disadvantage Pokemon win to subvert expectations or make cutesy mascot Pokemon win to sell toys. Ash is a shit character but I bet a tryhard optimised protagonist would struggle just as hard against this.
>>59048956It would be so based if they followed up on this mystery nigger and his two legendaries. This fanfic tier character is absurd and would make an amazing seasonal antagonist.
>>59053697You're conflating two groups of people.For the billionth time, people who hate Ash don't, by definition, like Ash; and viceversa.
>>59053821Point is, no matter what they did or what they do, they've earned too much ire to continue a weekly Pokemon anime in good faith.Ashfags got burned too bad to trust in the systems, and Anti-Ashfags got what they wanted but it was somehow even worse than Ash's tenure.
>>59053721Then you get the problem of the story not being actually over anon.>>59053832>they've earned too much ire to continue a weekly Pokemon anime in good faithYeah, just not by the same people you were refering to during the ashnime's run.>Ashfags got burned too bad to trust in the systemKek no, they still worship him.>Anti-Ashfags got what they wanted but it was somehow even worse than Ash's tenure.Thanks for proving what I just said.He's not coming back btw.
>>59053836>Thanks for proving what I just said.You can dislike Horizons without being an Ashfag. You can also dislike Ash without being a Horizonsfag.Why do you exist in this binary world where you're either an Ashfag who hates Horizons, or a Horizonsfag who hates Ash?
>>59053697No, they like Liko. and nobody cares about Roy except westfucks that only like him because he's brown.
>>59053842>You can dislike Horizons without being an AshfagYou can not like it, but if you say its worse then yeah, you're an ashfag.>Why do you exist in this binary world where you're either an Ashfag who hates Horizons, or a Horizonsfag who hates Ash?You can also be indiferent to both, there's a third option. And many Horizon fans like the ashnime.But there's no reason to hate Horizon, and definitely not one to make up flaws about it if you aren't an ashfag already.
>>59047820All would've been forgiven had he won XYZ's leagueEven the retarded artstyle change
>>59053875>Even the retarded artstyle changeNah. Even SMfags have started admitting it didn't look good now after violently defending it for years.
