Holy Judaism Batman!

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>>59106618
>10$ for a starter pack

>subscription
woof

>>59106618
What about clothing options?

>>59106656
Only the default ones are shown in the video this info comes from:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s17ze2S7AHk

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Here's a better offer for you
>No starter pack
>No membership
>No premium battle pass
Everything is already unlocked for free.
And as a neat little bonus, you don't have to sit through walls of texts and cheap animations, you can just focus on the battle

>>59106717
Does Showdown have any animations?

>>59106721
No, and that's a good thing

>>59106717
>fanfic meta
lmao

>>59106730
So your issue isn't that the animations are shit, it's that they exist at all?
Kinda lame opinion.

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Let me be a Groundfag for a moment:
Confirmed:
>Steelix, Torterra, Garchomp, Hippowdon, Rhyperior, Gliscor, Excadrill, Krookodile, Stunfisk, Golurk, Diggersby, Mudsdale, Sandaconda, Runerigus, Ursaluna,
Unconfirmed:
>Sandslash, Nidoking, Nidoqueen, Dugtrio, A-Dugtrio, Golem, Marowak, Quagsire, Donphan, Pupitar, Swampert, Camerupt, Flygon, Whiscash, Claydol, Groudon, Wormadam-Sandy, Gastrodon, Mamoswine, Seismitoad, Landorus, Zygarde, Palossand, Ursaluna Bloodmoon, Toedscruel, Clodsire, Great Tusk, Sandy Shocks, Iron Treads, Ting-Lu.
Kind of concerning at the present moment for a monotype team. No Water immunities, no Ice resist, I think Runerigus is the only decent supportmon (no Claydol, no Toedscruel).
Surely though Mamoswine, Gastrodon, and Swampert are shoe-ins though, right?

>>59106730
>lazy slop and PNGmons are a good thing
The absolute state of smoggies

>>59106744
I was under the impression that every Mega would be available at launch, though now that I think about it, there are still several new and old we haven’t seen yet.

So, will Mega Froslass be enough to take care of common dragons like Dragonite, Salamence, and Garchomp?

>>59106768
It speed-ties with Mega Salamence and Dragapult could also be a potential threat as it easily outspeeds it but if either one doesn’t kill MFroslass they’re getting clapped-back. But with possibly every non-legend mega being in does make me wonder what the new Top 5 will look like. I’m willing to bet Mega Mawile makes a comeback if it keeps Sucker Punch as that, Iron Head and Play Rough is enough to hurt a lot of the good Megas.

>>59106618
>$7 for premium battle pass
>$50 for 12 month membership
So are these two separate things or does it mean you can pay $50 up front to get the battle pass for 12 months?

>>59106618
It's amazing how much interest in the game can sour for many the moment they reveal a battle pass.
They just had to release it on mobile as well?

>>59106810
>They just had to release it on mobile as well?
Did they? I thought it was only releasing on the Switch

>>59106816
Switch version coming first, mobile comes later.

>>59106802
OP got it wrong. Battle pass is 10 per season, membership is 7 a month or 50 a year.

>>59106842
So 90 dollars per year, plus actually grinding out the battle pass
Grim...

>>59106768
I can't see it being good because mega steels are too common. Maybe with Vivillon support?

>>59106618
These hairstyles are kinda.....ass

Why would I buy any of those things? What do they get me?

100% there's gonna be trainer cosmetics behind the battlepass, right?

>>59106741
*Schlopschlopschlop* daddy GF take all my monies!!!! *Schlopschlopschlop*

>>59106973
It’s not that I don’t have issues with Champions, anon, but
>why have the shiny, nice-looking, high quality thing for money? You have this shoddy, ugly, taped-together thrift store alternative for free!
Is kind of a retarded question. Of course a quality product is more expensive to produce and maintain. If it wasn’t, Showdown would look as good as official battles do. It’s not stupid to be willing to spend money to have something of higher quality.

I think Champions F2P model is aggressively predatory though, and I don’t intend to buy any of that battle pass shit.

>>59106969
Buddy that's the least of your worries, there's gonna be mega stones behind the battle pass

>>59106987
Do we know anything about item acquisition in this game, by the way? It seems like it’s just “spend VP to get an item” but do we have any confirmation that there are items unavailable for VP purchase without unlocking them first?

>>59106998
Not yet
Honestly I expect that they'll make some mega stones "exclusive" to the battle pass but then offer it for an extraordinary amount of VP later.
They'd probably do that for big ticket items, like when they add NFE pokemon they're not gonna make Eviolite easy to get, they know people will work for that

>>59107017
I do not think they will do that, locking important gameplay items behind a membership would be reputation suicide

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Will the pokeballs of the pokemon i transfer to champions remain the same?

It's not even that jewish considering the vast majority of megas are unviable to begin with. You're realistically only buying the BP for e-penis cosmetics.
The 80 slots being locked behind starter pack sucks though...

It occurs to me, the first month of this game is going to be completely unplayable because degenerate VP farming strategies are going to dominate the meta, and I'm not sure the devs will react in time to save it from 90% player base loss.

The complete lack of single player content is a real problem for this game because there's no reliable way to accrue VP (past the tutorial phase) outside of PvP gameplay. And the one thing they can't do is make it so you can ONLY get VP by winning games, because anyone whose first mon rolls suck ass or who wastes their starting VP making silly choices because they're new to the game is doomed to lose forever against a ladder full of people importing from Home. I imagine they understand this, so they need to make sure "the VP faucet is always flowing" in some way.

But when you think through every other avenue for VP acquisition, besides winning games, what it looks like is "players not trying to win games".

>participation VP just for being in battles
aggressive turn 1 forfeits. I can enter and quit matches way faster than I can win them
>VP for battle pass challenges we've seen like "use a super effective move"
match starts, use SE move, instant forfeit. Again, I can do this way faster than I can finish matches
>participation VP but only if you complete the battle, you don't get it if you FF
Weigh down my A button and go AFK. I will use my first moves until either I lose the match or run out of PP, and if I run out of PP the move timer will auto-select more moves. Eventually I will lose (or win) and holding A will get me back into another match.

In every case, the bottom of the ladder is going to be almost entirely people who are not trying to win at all, they're just losing on purpose while farming VP. And the bottom of the ladder is where every new player will start. Imagine getting a new game and going into matchmaking and 4 of the first 5 matches you play are turn 1 FFs that kick you back into the queue.

>>59106618
So, is there any plan to actually buff the shitters? There is no reason for anything to be a shitmon here because this app exists solely for battles so they can’t hide behind the “world building” bullshit excuse . What the point of having all starters if only the ones with megas, baratiger, and grassrilla are worth a damn. Is game freak full of regards who

>>59107055
They will absolutely put a limit of how much VP you can farm weekly. Like their other mobile games.

>>59106618
I hope we can expand the fucking inventory space with points
90 is nothing compared to the number of available pokemon

>>59107068
Preferably they'd nerf the metamons a bit first.

>>59106717
*As a neat little bonus, we ban everything we don't like from being played, teehee!

>>59106744
Mamoswine is in, check Wolfey's video

>>59107070
Still, perverse incentives. If I only get VP for the first 30 matches in a week that I lose, I'm still incentivized to start every week with 30 aggressive forfeits to acquire that VP as quickly as possible.

>gotta pay for clothes
>gotta pay to change EVs
>may even have to pay for pokemon if they feel like timegating home releases
hahah

what does a membership get you?

>>59107087
More battle music, missions, battle team slots and even more boxes

>>59107087
A conical hat with Dunsparce on it.

>>59106721
I'm not in the desperate need to see the same XY animations recycled for the billionth time

>>59107038
I hope so, I saw some of the recruit options had a great ball and I hate that one

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>>59106618
>battle pass and the membership are two different things
oh no no no no

>>59106629
>Box slots 30 --> 80
>free track from Let's Go
>50 Training Tickets
>30 Quick Tickets
Treating this as just a $10 game seems like a pretty good deal honestly. Hopefully it extends to phone users. That would have me set for a good long while. I could focus on spending VP on items.

>>59107165
>80 box slots
kind of painful, depending on how it goes. You can't transfer mons out of Champions so ultimately investing in any kind of Champions box space is a direct waste of money unless it can be expanded indefinitely to fulfill your needs. If it never gets above 80 (or much further beyond that, anyway) you're gonna have to use Home and acquire mons outside of Champions, and as long as that's the optimal strategy there's no reason to have any box space in Champions at all, really.

>>59107181
$10 to not constantly have to go thought home's loading screens

>>59107198
30 mons is fine for a "current roster" of mons/teams though. You'll experiment with new teams and change it over time but I doubt it will happen with a lot of regularity. 80 box slots is really just for deep storage, keeping mons that you won't use for months or maybe years at a time until something in the metagame changes that makes them worth using again. I mean if you look at VGC usage stats for any given series/format once you get below the top 25 mons you're down into less than 1% usage, you're not likely to be rotating through a lot of those mons, UNLESS you like to experiment with weird teams and try stuff out constantly just to poke at the seams of the meta. But if you like to do that, 80 isn't anywhere near enough, because you'll have literally hundreds of mons to choose from and no way of reliably getting the ones you want to experiment with on-demand without Home.

So like, again, why are you paying for box storage on champions? Unless you can start to systematically build a living dex IN champions, where any comp mon you may want to try is available on-demand, it's wasted investment, no? You're still gonna be stuck using home regardless.

>>59107181
There are not even 80 fully evolved/viable Pokemon in most formats

>>59107106
I unironically want this

>>59107216
>>59107224
I’m sure in future seasons they will do different rulesets that encourage you to use off-meta teams. We already know they’ll implement other gimmicks in the future after mega evos. They’ll probably have seasons where you can only use the WW dex or only the original 151 for example.

>>59106618
When will these bastards let me be fucking bald

>>59106629
The starter pack one is the actual good deal.

I hardly even understand the battle pass stuff. How much is the non-premium battle pass? Is the membership seperate from the battle pass? What are the benefits of either, and what benefits can be acquired ingame by grinding?

>do a battle pass
>its just p2w mega stone and mon unlocks
if it had emotes for your pokemon id buy it in a heartbeat. let my ursaluna hit the griddy when it kills someone

>>59107301
Pretty much the only benefit is getting mega stones faster
It's definitely only a short term thing because unless items actually are consumed you only ever will need 1 of everything

>>59107216
>UNLESS you like to experiment with weird teams and try stuff out constantly just to poke at the seams of the meta.
What meta? It's a brand new game with 40 something new megas to build around and other changes, literally everyone is experimenting for at least a few weeks. Any decent team builder should want more than 30 slots convenient.

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>>59107311
>when you predict the switch and get a free Swords Dance

>>59107325
Thats what home is for

>>59107301
Battle Pass
>seasonal
>focuses on faster gameplay resources
>some exclusive clothing
>free version still gives some rewards

Membership
>monthly
>gives permanent extras as long as you're subbed
>battle music, missions, battle team slots, more box storage, maybe more

>>59107358
>focuses on faster gameplay resources
Yeah but unless they add champions specific items you'll only have like 3 battlepasses before you have everything
There's only like 30 battle items (excluding gimmick items and berries)

Why are the retarded devs holding box spaces as hostage?
Cosmetics and Music are the only things that should be paid

>>59107370
Box space is irrelevant because there's day 1 home support and you'll never have more than 30 mons you are actively using

>>59107374
why do people whove never touched vgc in their life keep saying this

>>59106618
ugggh not feeling any of the male hair styles

>>59107297
Bring back the Union Room cue ball trainers.

>>59107380
Im not saying there are gonna be less than 30 or 80 good pokemon or whatever
But you legit will not be using 30 pokemon at any given time lol, you can spend 5 minutes to go to home and transfer what you are actually using in and out

>>59107386
>just waste 5 minutes every time you need something new
Time is money, spending 10 bucks is the sane choice

The starter pack is a permanent +50 box space right?

>>59107397
>>59107165

>>59107386
30 pokemon are only 5 fully teams

>>59107400
cool

>>59107413
Who runs 5 full teams simultaneously, and desperately needs to run them so bad they cant spend the time to swap in home pokemon

>>59107363
I hope they add champions specific items, like an item version of tinted lens for bug and grass types

>>59106925
After aurora veil it should be able to live a super effective move or 2. And since you can't fake it out it's gonna get it up.

>>59107459
With snow and aurora veil up its still 2HKO by band bullet punch scizor unless you go invest significantly into defense as well

>>59106618
Man if they want me to shell out a whole game worth of money for a single year worth of gameplay they should have made the characters less terribly ugly
Why should I even bother customizing them

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>>59107384
Fucking something, please

The most (literally me) NPC pokemon has ever had is pic related, but they keep cockblocking buzzcuts and clean shaved heads in the newer games

>>59107055
You're obviously not going to get VP by withdrawing from the battle, like in every other gacha with participation prizes
Granted you can try an explosion team but they're probably going to put a cap on how much VP you can get

>>59107472
Thats rough, it's gonna need a decent bit of support to get shit done.

>>59107311
If they introduce emotes or visual customizations for your Pokémon, that would almost certainly entice me to buy shit. Much more than trainer clothes, for sure.

>$50
>Annually
Separating PvP from the main series seemed like such a fine idea until I saw the pricing...

>>59107540
It's an optional membership, and the least impactful of all the ways to spend money

Would it really have been that difficult or expensive to put in some single player content for this game? Just some matches against the CPU, like the Stadium games. Doesn't have to be as much as the Stadium games either, just a gauntlet simulating getting 8 badges and then facing a generic elite 4 or something.

>>59107553
shut the fuck up. you're buying the new mainline games anyways. oink oink oink, paypiggy

>>59107553
Has it been confirmed there is no single-player content? Given there has been no advertising for it I'm inclined to believe it. It would be a major turnoff if so. I could otherwise play this game at work or while a passenger, where walking away from the game at a moment's notice or a brief connection interruption won't leave another player hanging.

>>59107482
They look better than the SV character models, but the clothing and hair options look so shit in Champions so far

i dont understand the gacha model for ingame pokemon "recruiting" if home transfers are a thing. are they going to put the number of transfers from home behind a paywall or paywalled timegate as well?

>>59107580
They are punishing mobile only players who dont own a switch and play mainline games
Kinda based actually

>>59107580
It's confirmed from an interview that there's no limit on Home transfers

>>59107553
It would defeat the purpose of the game
>introduce a single player mode
>normies just scout and play single player exclusively because scared of comp

5 years of membership is $250
That's like 2 family outings at a local diner these days

>>59107580
You have to think of them as two entirely seperate monetization options. HOME players will not even have to engage with the recruit gacha unless they have a mode that's limited to them (and I don't think they will because HOME transfers and gacha recruits are going to be occupying the same box spaces).

Champions really isn't impressing me so far as this big battle simulation hub for the series, might as well kept this shit in the mainline games

>>59107584
i can see the angle that goes like
>hey, you could start playing go and sub to home or
>hey, just buy the main games and a switch
but locking mobile only players to rng mons and what will certainly be never ending losses to stacked PKHeX teams seems at odds with that goal.

>>59106717
Showdown is for third worlders only now

>>59107605
pokemon showdown? more like pinoy showdown

>>59107603
I'm not sure why they're even trying to get a mobile audience.
Normalfags and competitive pokemon battling must get along like oil and water. There's zero chance there's any staying power for that

>>59107605
Always has been.

>>59107603
>stacked PKHeX teams

Neither side has a stat advantage.

>>59107605
Whatever you say bootlicker

>>59107611
I think they want players who are importing from Home able to play matches on their phones so that they can't think "I left my Switch at home, so I won't play Pokémon right now." Nearly everyone has their phone on them at all times, so this approaches 100% engagement rates.

>>59107611
thats where my mind is at. i get the drive to make comp pokemon more 'accessible' without disemboweling all the IV and breeding autism in the mainline games. i just dont see it working, at all. i guess TPCI is really banking on their matchmaking to keep normies from being fed into the PKHeX woodchipper? the matchmaking or events that ban the entire meta, maybe

>>59107624
Dog Pkhex is not relevant anymore, even normal players have perfect Pokemon. I have over 100 bottlecaps in ZA

>>59106618
>making you pay for fucking hairstyles
It's so over for this franchise

>>59107629
>forcing myself to tolerate the Z-Abortion
>or just use pkhex
feels relevant to me

>>59107640
It was obvious from when they were autistic about "you have to be in a school uniform at all times!" in SV and then sold actually decent clothing in the paid DLC

>>59106629
I was going to get it if it was $5 but $10 is way more than I'll spend on this shit.

>>59107563
I haven't played a Pokémon game since X/Y, the only reason I'm considering Champions is because it's free to play

>>59106924
>paying 90 for a actually good game is too much
>but paying 430 for plass 2 is totally worth it
campaignshitter moment

how do you guys feel about shinnies being confirmed not to be in champion?

>>59106618
what does the $50 annual membership gives?

>>59107779
>paying 430 for plass 2
Where did you get that number from?

>>59107785
They are though?

>>59107030
>TPCi
>caring about reputation
Pokemon fans are shit eaters, they can and WILL do that and nothing will happens, remember the dexcut?

>>59106717
call me when they unban baton pass

>>59107779
What good game has Pokemon produced that costs 90 dollars?

>>59107055
>They nerfed protect so you can't toxic stall with shitmons to win when you have nothing built
If champions is anything like PTCGL. Then expect the meta to always be which pokemon are good for the missions, and which pokemon are handed out for free to everyone. Until you get to the highest rank you will be facing what I mentioned before. In PTCGL you vs the free battlepass decks and whichever deck type the missions are for far more than whats actually meta

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>>59107792

Is dynamax in the game

>>59107861
Most people who bought ZA already own a Switch.
You do know there are other games outside of Pokémon?
>>59107868
Megas only for the foreseeable future.

>>59107895
>megas only
Lame

>>59107896
the mega ornament is named the "omni-ring" or something anon
its clearly going to include the other stuff like z-moves and dynamax eventually

>>59107920
I hope so, the only appeal this has for me is having all the gimmicks interacting at the same time

>>59107868
It will be in eventually, it's on the Omni-Ring.

>>59106717
you’re not going to convince people to stop acting out of spite

>>59107920
They'll probably do seasons of certain gimmicks only. Then some seasons with multiple like all of them or megas+tera or tera+dynamax etc.

>>59107030
Releasing a mediocre PS2 game on a 600 dollar console in 2026, that costs 80 dollars, that you don't even own would also be reputation suicide.

>>59107935
which game are we talking?

>>59107779
Pardon me?
It's $90 a year for a BATTLE SIMULATOR with less modes, worse effects, and more grinding, than the one from 27 years ago. There's hardly a game to it

>>59106744
Based monotypefag
No claydol would be sad

>>59107958
Not even a fucking little spec of a single player mode, this is THE Battle Simulator Fucking Kek

Is the Starter Pack a permanent upgrade? You 10 bucks for 50 more box slots and that's it, Game Freak won't delete them a year later?

>>59107986
Yes

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>>59107165
>free track from Let's Go
>$7
>free
I fucking HATE you people. HATE.

>>59108036
I said free because a music track is worthless

>>59107854
But they don’t give you “free starting meta noob team” you just draw 10 random fucking pokemon. No two players start with the same pulls. Imagine being new to the game and your starting team winds up being 4 support mons, a sweeper Pyroar you don’t have the mega stone for, and Dudunsparce. You’re not laddering with that shit after the first day.

>>59107930
If they can figure out how to get mega+tera balanced it will be the meta everyone demands over and over and over.

>>59107580
>>59107601
The monetization is also needing a 500$ console and like 5 60$ games and at least 2 30$ DLC to compete with no gacha reliance

>>59107930
>>59108120
I think once it'll get going it'll be
>You can use 1 of the form types (Mega / Tera / Dynamax)
AND
>1 Z-Move
Like gen 7

>>59108188
The sad part is that cost is still way cheaper than what most gacha games demand to keep up.

>>59108188
Are there any other game series where people feel entitled to compete at the professional level without having bought the game itself?

>>59108198
Every card game ever

>>59107592
The problem is, you aren’t making players LESS scared of comp by making building a team capable of competing require a resource that can only be obtained by competing. The FOMO pressure is huge, everyone’s afraid of wasting their VP on a team that will just lose all the time because it’s bad. Single-player gauntlets give players a safe space to grind and practice. It doesn’t have to be modeled after the RPG either, it could just be Battle Frontier, we know they have AI code that CAN perform moderately respectably in emulating VGC style opponents, just to get their toes wet.

Remember, the current most popular online PVP-only game (Fortnite, at least I think it’s still winning but honestly who the fuck knows at this point) will matchmake you against bots when you’re losing (and lie about it) so you don’t crash out from constant failure and quit.

This is one of those places where EOMM, despite everyone bitching about it, saves the day. You need players to be able to win if you want them to keep playing, and players stuck with a shitter team and no VP are basically barred from winning in the PVP space.

>>59108209
Champions probably is the best way to bring battle frontier back since it is legitimately made for the same kind of players + they can put floor leaderboards

>>59108209
>will matchmake you against bots when you’re losing
Every modern pvp game does this. Champions will likely throw a shitter bot at you if you go on a loss streak too.

>>59108192
No, Dyna has to go. There’s no reason not to Dynamax, it’s way too good. I’m fine with Dynamax formats but they need to be a separate thing. They don’t fit the rest of the meta.

Mega/Tera sharing a single use between them I think is good, though that MIGHT be biased in favor of tera a little too heavily.

>>59108223
We know Dynamax is included on the omnitrix and I doubt they'll let you use all the gimmicks at once

>>59108223
Megas are basically restricted Pokemon I can’t imagine Teras being popular outside of like steel dondozo

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>>59108233

>>59108223
Would it not be possible to just nerf Dynamaxing by reducing the HP buff and making moves fully protectable?

>>59108248
There is a lot of ways they could nerf Dynamax and it's going to NEED nerfs if they want it to compare side by side with the other 3 gimmicks.

>>59108251
Genuinely how would you ever make Dynamax and Z-moves equitable
Dynamax is literally 3 turns of generic Z-moves

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>>59108240

this is how my journey begins to become a pokemon master

>>59108264
First step is requiring held items to dynamax

>>59108264
>>59108192

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>>59107311
>gardevoir turning back and blowing a kiss after KO'ing the opponent
>honchkrow getting its fedora tipping death animation from PBR back
>raichu pulling out a surfboard when it uses surf

>>59108233
Run the numbers, you’ll be surprised I think. Consider a mon like Mega Metagross, widely considered one of the best, most centralizing megas. Between its ability and stat changes, it gets roughly 25% more total defenses, and roughly 30% more offenses (including Tough Claws boost). If it instead terastallized into a type that resists what is checking it, that advantageous typing gives it 100% defensive increase (halves incoming damage) OR more, and its offenses are similarly boosted (about 30%) for a STAB tera OR 50% for a tera that grants a new STAB. That’s more in both cases (albeit without the speed boost) PLUS it keeps its held item.

If you have Metagross against Kingambit, you’re far better served going Tera Fighting Brick Break, which gives you a 200% defense increase against its sucker punch and then a 50% increase to Brick Break, versus Mega Metagross’s 20% defensive increase against its sucker punch and then 30% increase to Brick Break. And that’s not factoring in the Life Orb you could now be holding because you aren’t holding Metagrossite.

That doesn’t mean you’d never run Mega Metagross, of course. Just that tera is a more powerful tool defensively and offensively than it appears at first. Changing defensive type matchups and STAB is an extremely powerful multiplier.

>>59108268
you must sell all your possessions and travel the world with pokemon go

>>59108282
I guess but if I was worried about Kinggambit I’d just carry a different Pokemon that hard counters the common sets instead of giving Metagross a specific Tera

>>59108233
Grass Tera Volcarona is more threatening than 90% of Megas.

>>59108291
It was just an example to demonstrate the power scaling. What would likely happen is you’d have Kangaskhan in the back as your mega and LO Metagross on the field, and see a dangerous dark type like Kingambit and realize that you could swing things majorly with a fighting tera, and that it’s worth doing that over mega evolving Kang.

>>59106717
What do you niggers think is going to happen when the boomers realize showdown is a thing. Showdown doesn't have LE SECRET DEAL, the boomers who give a fuck about the IP and making money are actual literal retards about the Internet and Showdown has managed to exist in it's niche world not drawing attention to itself with a patreon or LE SPONOSRS like meleefags have. The day of the cease and desist is coming. Yes it's open source but every single dev is a smogon tag and will fold with the letter and the meta will be stuck at it's current format while champions will update.

The end of smogon fags is at hand.

>>59108233
If there was a format where you had to choose between either megas or tera then tera would still be picked a lot. Being able to change the type of any mon on the fly without needing a held item is extremely powerful.

>>59106717
People want to play a REAL video game. Not still jpegs with no animation slapping each other. There is a reason why people are far more willing to spend hundreds on an official game like Master Duel than play any of the dozen free Yugioh simulators.

>>59108324
I also think it would help less-viable megas shine relative to the “rich get richer” megas. Because in a lot of cases, the mileage you get out of “tera + item” for powerful mons is so comparable, you’d rather just run them with the regular item and keep the flexibility to tera elsewhere without gimping them. But you’re fine keeping Beedrill with Beedrillite because there’s zero universe where it’s doing anything but mega evolving, and if it’s coming to the party at all it’s because you have a plan for a super fast glass cannon. You never blew your tera, got sent to Beedrill in the back, and went “fuck I wish this guy had a Choice Band”, you already know that wasn’t saving it.

>>59108188
Even mobile F2P shitters can still get access to any mon they need for Champions.
>download GO for free
>catch random shitmons on GO
>transfer shitmons to Home
>use tradebots to get any mon you want through Home

Champions just looks pretty meh, where are all the neat different formats like Little Cup and stuff

>>59108492
They don't want option overload on day 1. We will likely get more formats and events in the future.

How many of your move slots should be taken up by buffing moves when team building? Feels like I don't have space for any.

>>59108548
Having one format is going to get old, even faster if a lot of mons are not available from the start

>>59108548
Ive heard this too many times

>>59108188
This is the most stupid post in this thread.

>>59108580
Most mons don't want them at all unless they're also doing damage when you use them. Some bulky pokemon will run swords dance or nasty plot to be used once before attacking. The only "buffing moves" that are fairly common are ones that buff the entire team (screens, tailwind or trick room)

>>59108223
>Megas
Require specific pokemon, sacrificing an item slot. Multiple megas are inherently asynergistic, and a pokemon that doesn't pop its mega is actively worse for it. Many megas are also overly balanced, so most are pretty useless. Megas are also incredibly telegraphed. Nobody is running a Kangaskhan raw, you know what is happening
>Z-moves
Same item drawbacks as megas, combined with often putting sub-par moves on pokemon, that will never click the move raw. Near universally used to set up, or oneshot a bad match up, or wallbreak. Very predictable if items are visible, can catch off guard otherwise.
>Terra
Is set up for "free" during team construction, can reverse matchups, as well as enable sweeps like Z-moves, but only via increased offenses so somewhat limited. Nothing is lost if you choose to not terra, unless you build in specific ways that make the pokemon dependent on it. Many pokemon have predictable types to favor, buy still mostly unpredictable.
>Dynamax
Is entirely free, and requires zero setup besides choosing moves of a particular type. Combines the setup potential of Z moves as well as their matchup reversals, while often offering a higher effective BST increase than megas. Uniquely effective in doubles. Costs nothing if you don't use it, except occasionally sub-par move choices to get particular Max-moves. Gigantimax is a meme, so entirely unpredictable besides meta trends.

If these are take one, leave the rest, Dynamic is flatly better than Z-moves, better than Terra like 80% of the time, and better than every single mega bar maybe Zygarde. Dynamax fug is better than mega fug.
If these are all one each, no two on the same pokemon, it's gonna be a fucking circus of random bullshit, where the main purpose of the other three is to beat the opponents Dynamax without costing you yours, or explicitly using your Dynamax to beat theirs while preserving your other 3, like Gen 1 Ubers dancing around the Mewtwo that both players have.

>>59106721
How bout you guys just pick what you want to use and not fight about it? Life's too short. If you wanna use the Champions thing or Showdown then go ahead, do what you want.

>>59108548
Kinda hard to do with only two options

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>>59106618
>all of these negro hairstyles
>for maybe 1% of their audience

Have they STILL not confirmed 6v6 in private matches?

>>59108580
Usually no more than 1. RARE cases of two, usually on fuckmonster sledgehammer pokemon that actually can just sit there for 2 turns doing nothing, then win, like Primal Groudon's Rock Polish/Swords Dance sets.
Even on hard-core support pokemon like Whimsicott, disruption is usually better than buffing. If your opponent can't play the game, and you can, you are winning. If your pokemon is super strong, but the opponent is still playing the game, they can beat yours. Unless the buff immediately puts you into "I go first and oneshot everything", it is difficult to justify a lot of the time.
A common issue for more buff-oriented supports is "all my friends are dead" syndrome. A pokemon that sits there, not really doing anything, that the opponent is free to ignore, and beat the shit out of the other slot. The supportive pokemon does nothing to draw focus, and nothing to actually help their partner survive. Alcreamie sits there, adding +2 to its partner, which keeps dying because it is taking two attacks per turn, and Alcreamie is doing nothing productive. You WANT pokemon your opponent feels like they need to kill now, to force bad decisions.

Singles, you can get away with more than one on certain bulky setup pokemon, that run a boosting move, and recovery, and sometimes sub/sleep talk. This is vulnerable to exploitation nowadays though, because it leaves an opening to shit that can set up faster/harder and just kill it.

>>59108641
The power boost from Dynamax isn't really even the issue. I did the comparison between mega and tera; Dynamax is sort of like "all the positives of tera". It gives you the bulk of a type resist (via doubled HP), the offensive power of both a STAB tera and a non-STAB tera (kind of, because move power scales more for lower power moves, your high-powered STAB attacks get a buff comparable to the 33% increase STAB tera gives, while your weaker coverage moves get buffed more like 50-60%). So unlike megas, which have versatility at the cost of raw numbers, Dynamax has the versatility AND the raw numbers to back it up.

Of course, that is (arguably) balanced by its transience; it goes away after 3 turns, or if you can force a switch-out. And that alone could almost be enough to balance it. The real problem with Dynamax is that it makes all of your moves into stat buffs/debuffs (but really, you're running buffs) for both mons on your side of the field. 3 turns of "hitting hard through protect and double bulk" is a lot, but when you can use those three turns to not only buttfuck the other side of the field but ALSO put both of your mons at +4 speed and +1 attack, or +2 speed, +1SpAtk, and set a beneficial weather, or whatever, the "transience" goes away and you carry that buff through.

If VGC matches lasted 40 turns on average this would be fine but they last like 12-14, so you're taking 1/4th of the match to assrape and then another 1/4th-1/2 of the match to bask in the afterglow, and the only real counter becomes for the opponent to ALSO Dynamax to try and stack comparable boosts.

That's why Dynamax can't fit with the rest of the gimmicks. If you can only pick one gimmick, you have to pick Dynamax or the other team is setting up on you WHILE they're killing half of your team.

>>59108679
This is what came to mind for me too lmao

>>59108691
>>59108641
Why are you people so obsessed with the ideas of gimmicks being balanced against each other? It literally doesn’t matter multi gimmicks formats are just gonna be for the lulz

>>59107935
Which youtuber fed you that opinion?

>>59107611
They’re trying to compete with other esports and gacha games that are multiplatform and on mobile. If the Switch had the same form factor as the 3DS then I would agree with you.

>>59108722
Because mega + tera would be balanced and well-liked IMO should be the long-term format. The other ones can be silly standalone meme formats but I really think mega + tera should be what they come back to.

One thing I would like to see from Champions is regular experimental formats.
Back in Gen 7 I fondly remember formats like the Tiny Tourney (only small Pokemon allowed) and a Spooky format (only "scary" Pokemon allowed). Those were very fun.

>>59106618
I’m still mad about megas. They should’ve let people use two at a time rather than one.

>>59108785
Agreed. I’d also like a reg/format that just retired the most popular mons in the prior formats for a few months to shake the meta a bit. I know they’ll start champions with all the meta mons available to try and increase conversion, but I think
>no Gholdengo lol pick another one
Is something the game should do from time to time

>>59108820
Formats where the number of omni ring uses changes would also be cool, but keep in mind that in a bring-4 scenario two megas means half of all teams would be megas. They’ve done it with double-restricted formats before but it’s CRAZY centralizing, it just becomes “mega evolution showdown”

>>59108081
Yes it's worthless and you're paying $7 for it, but I guess in your mind that somehow makes it free. Absolutely fucking baffling.

>>59108116
You don't get all 10 randoms you pull. You pick ONE from the 10 randoms. It's a gacha 10 pull.

>>59109022
Confirmation? I thought your recruitment was limited by VP

>>59109028
Just watch literally any video up or read any article? How are you this stupid? You roll 10 Pokemon and get to keep one from the 10. You can do this for free once per day or roll more by using VP or tickets. This has been stated multiple times.

>>59109022
>>59109033
Did they really have to do the gacha system for rentals? We should just be able to pick from a list. I get that's how they monetize it, but yeah it's messed up we let them get away with it.

>>59108785
I wonder if that's feasible with how recruiting mons works
like imagine there's an event "Steel Showdown" format where only Steel types are usable, but you've only recruited 2
you'd have to fork over some cash or just not participate

>>59106621
This kike hater is correct.

>>59109028
You can permanently recruit with VP. The temp recruitments have a limit.

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>>59108820
To me the Omni-Ring design implies you'll be using one gimmick, but you can fight two different gimmicks against one another if they're available during a season. (a Tera versus Mega battle in the original trailer as well)

>>59109039
I imagine there's probably either a Battle Factory esque mode, or a featured event where you can get a charity team to participate, but these teams are gonna be ass even if only by them being common so often countered, let alone the frankly likely case of them incentivizing buying more pokemon by making you use the most hideous dogshit you have ever seen, like Heavy Metal, Heavy Slam Aggron in the all Steel tourney.

>>59109033
My understanding was you could rent pokemon from the recruit ranch for a week or whatever for free, and then pay to permanently recruit them, and you had to pay for rerolls sooner than once per 22 hours, I don’t recall being told you could only recruit one.

That’s retarded anon, you’d have to log in for 6 consecutive days of pulls before you could even have a team to play the game with. Are you SURE you’re limited to one pull from the 10? That makes no sense.

>>59109086
It is 1 per 10 for sure in normal circumstances.

There must be something at the start of the game that assures you get 6 Pokemon.

wonder how rental teams will work

>>59109094
The free rentals go away after 7 days so they 100% MUST start you off with 6 permanent mons so the game can function.

>>59109094
>>59109094
Maybe. I feel like that one single sentence in the overview trailer (“once per day”) is potentially a translation issue or oversimplification. And the reason I say that is for one thing, it’s not actually one reroll per day, but per 22 hours for whatever dumb reason, and we have that confirmed. You get a new roster ranch roster once per day-ish, but if you can only recruit one pokemon from the ranch you can’t really play the game.

Like you say, maybe at the start of the game they do something so you can get more mons. Okay, and when the week is up and you lose them all? Do you then go back to “oops can’t play, log in for 6 days in a row”?

TPCI are retards and I wouldn’t put it past them NOT to think this shit through, of course. But like, think this shit through. You need players to play the game if you want to land whales. Making it mildly annoying to do is how you incentivize spending money, not making it impossible. If freebies have to do 6 logs in a row to have a team they can use for one day before they’re dropped to 5 mons… they’ll drop the game. That can’t possibly be the business model. It’s retarded.

Will home work from day one?

>>59109149
Yes

>>59109117
They probably offer you a choice between a Venusaur, Charizard and Blastoise team.

>>59109149
The game is designed around it, so it must. HOME update will probably drop just before Champions, maybe a day or two early, rather than risk the alternative where HOME is late.

imagine not having a living dex ready

>>59107030
>reputation suicide
>TPCi
lmaoing @ you

>>59107068
Knowing Game Freak they won't.

>>59106618
>no drills
it's over

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Yae or nae?

>>59109268
>rain team
>arcanine
you killed him
you killed your own dog

>>59109209
>living dex
pffft, imagine not having a comp dex ready
enjoy wasting 1 quadrillion BP on ability swaps, move swaps and nature swaps

>>59109268
Where are the Fakemon in the second and third slots from?

>>59106618
>A few seem to actually be returning from SV.
Meh, wish they'd take more from ZA

>>59109284
I don't think I'd be sending Arcanine and Drampa out into the same battles, generally speaking.

>>59108371
My irl friend used to play comp but hasn’t touched Pokemon since the DS era despite owning a Switch. I told him to just buy FRLG and use ACE to hack in a team. Then he can transfer those mons from Gen 3 —> Home —> Champions so long as they’re legally obtainable in game and Home doesn’t reject them.

>>59109214
Also forgot to mention that they'd probably also nerf some shitmons as well.

>>59109320
Obviously.
How will the normies and PVPfags know which Pokémon to like or dislike if they don't nerf the non-shillmons?

>>59109318
We don't know if FRLG Home transfers will be available by the time Champions comes out.

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>>59107311
Ribbons should be something you can actually equip on your Pokemon, hats could easily work, too. The shillmons can get full attires like Unite.

>>59107486
I was hoping Champions would have had adult PC's like PBR had. I wasn't expecting it after the first trailer, but it would have been nice.

I assume you can add the G-max factor on pokemon in this?

>>59109268
Looks like shit. Anyway how do I make Froslass work if I want to do bulky blizzard spam in doubles?

>>59109457
Copy the articuno team

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>>59106618
Its back!

>>59109428
I'm hoping and praying they add variety in the future

>>59107935
>600 dollars
source

Is the game being locked to lvl 50 instead of 100 a good thing?
Like do crits and RNG rolls matter more at 50 or 100? Stuff like EVs scale up going to 100 right are they even as impactful at lvl 50?

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The default outfit is extremely ugly

>>59109591
By design. They want you to pay for new clothes.

>>59109514
EVs get dealt out at like a minimum of 8 points, because at level 50 you only see half the impact of all the points you build up, so they compensated for that

>>59106717
unironically what are the odds of showdown getting DMCA'd?

>>59109629
Zero. If they wanted Showdown gone it would have been taken down a decade ago.

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>>59109597
I thought they scaled up at a different rate instead of just linear 1(50):2(100)

>>59109760
I'm not great with numbers, but I specifically remember youtubers saying each increment is specifically 8 points and the level cap is 50, so it makes sense to me that they truncated everything

>>59109472
The generic isekai MC haircut

>>59109629
Didn't Nintendo grant permission for Showdown to stay up but under certain conditions?
If anything it's an advertisement for the VGC.

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>>59109830
>>59109830
Like this is what I mean

>+9 HP if you doubled it
>+5 ATK
>-4 DEF
>+5 SP.ATK
>+5 SP.DEF
>+5 SPEED
It's not a 1:2 scaling from 50 vs 100, there's some increasing curve going on

>>59109514
Being level 50 makes Pokemon slightly frailer.
lvl 100
0 SpA Abomasnow Blizzard vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Abomasnow: 127-150 (33.1 - 39.1%) -- 99.9% chance to 3HKO
lvl 50
0 SpA Abomasnow Blizzard vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Abomasnow: 67-79 (34.1 - 40.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
The big thing about every Pokemon being lvl 50 always is the fact that you can underlevel your Pokemon to underspeed your opponent.

>>59107386
>Oops, you've exceeded your three free daily transfers! Would you like to purchase 5 Transfer Gems? A first time buyer has the limited $7.99 package, that grants one free* gem!

>>59106717
>only metas people play are fanfic metas
>everyone is an insufferable timerstalling buttfaggot who wants to waste your time as much as possible rather than forfeiting when they recognize a loss
lol

>>59109868
Because a Pokemon doesn't start with 0 stats in everything at what would be "level 0"

>>59106618
WHat the fuck is this general even about? The game is not even out yet

>>59109891
Discussing what we know about the game.

>>59109891
Maybe you could read some of the 250 replies? The game has finally started getting real info and footage in the last week or so from a demo and previews

seems like a showdown refugee thread

>>59106618
>DEIrstyles
Sigh.

>>59109891
Basically everyone praying some new info gets found from the PAX demo.

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I’m only gonna play for the trainer customization. Gonna slutify Willem like I did Paxton

>>59109923
Retard

>>59109867
It's a gentleman's agreement. They don't make money, Nintendo doesn't rape them.

>>59109883
This
Offenses scale with defenses, and since it's a ratio, that doesn't really change with level, except for some extreme low fringe cases like uninvested Happiny and Chansey. Happiny and Chansey basically always invest in defense though so it's fine. I believe Pure Power pokemon end up SLIGHTLY weaker relatively at level 100, due to the way EV and IVs result in raw number changes, but not by enough of a margin to really matter.
But HP effectively scales against level in the damage formula, and virtually all pokemon have better HP growth than the damage formula, so most pokemon become more durable at level 100.
Some exceedingly low HP pokemon actually do become more frail at level 100
50
> 0 Atk Mew Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Diglett: 101-119 (118.8 - 140%) -- guaranteed OHKO
100
>0 Atk Mew Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Diglett: 197-232 (122.3 - 144%) -- guaranteed OHKO
But this breakpoint is so low that no actual competitive pokemon will ever be affected by this. Actually, I think literally only Diglett and its variants are affected by this.
This also means that the higher the HP stat of the pokemon, the more bulky it relatively becomes at level 100. Blissey benefits the most from level 100, but other HP tanks like Wailord and Guzlord also benefit from 100, more than defense tanks like Dusclops or Deoxys.
It also makes a few EV spreads marginally different, since at level 50 you need 8 EVs for +1. Among other niche things, uninvested single point speed creep becomes marginally stronger, but also more costly, because you no longer get the "extra" +4 on a 256/256 build, getting +1 directly means going a point under in your other stats.
Speedforce Regileki (so fast you beat Trick Room) is also not possible at level 50, though that's more funny trivia than actually useful tech. Probably a couple other exact number/bugs across other generations, too.

>>59109964
>Gentleman
Anon you do know that Showdown is run by trannies right?

>>59106717
I’m personally waiting for the monetization whining after showdown gets killed. Paypigs always get slaughtered.

Showdown doesn't make money or use roms of the real games. There is zero way it would ever get shut down.

>>59110020
You say that like Nintendo hasn't sued for less
You are talking about a company that sued Super Mario, a supermarket owned by a man named Mario.

>>59110020
>cite damages in the form of microtransactions they could have hypothetically sold without a free alternative using their IP
I'm sorry, anon, the legal system is bent and twisted for exactly this purpose.

>>59110025
a supermarket would be making actual profit off their IP name.

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Showdown is open source. Even if Nintendo shut down the official site there would just be a dozen new identical ones that would instantly pop up.

>>59110031
It was founded in 1973, anon
Donkey Kong only released in 81

>>59110020
Don’t be an obtuse retard, Nintendo is scummy as fuck and killing this shit is right up their alley.

>>59110033
Yes but how will you get players to pick a new one, and who will run it?

>>59110033
The bigger issue with showdown getting a CnD would be the fractured player base. Sure, anyone could mirror the battle simulator portion but every mirror would have its own power mad council of troons trying to enforce what their idea of what OU is.

>>59110066
Smogon OU has become such a meme anyway. People will be more interested in testing Champions formats than playing fanfic shit.

>>59110069
For like a week, then everyone will understand around half of Smogon's decisions, and start asking for them.
Especially recently, Smogon has been overreaching, but a lot of the foundational rules are there for a reason.
Just, don't complain about lack of sleep clause too loudly, okay?

>>59110100
I have never complained about a lack of any clause because I'm the exact kinda player that will use and abuse those strategies that make smoggies shit their pants.

>>59109959
Yea you are.

>>59110118
You got an entire hour to come up with an original comeback and you still failed
i'm really amazed

>>59110135
Maybe I'm not terminally online.

>>59110140
You clearly are otherwise you wouldn't be in this website

>>59110033
And if that happens you'll have to enter the grooming discord to find an opponent

>>59110020
Showdown won't shut down from lack of money or lawsuits or anything of the like
It will shut down from the flood of Indians that will take over the platform once the paying members move to Champions

>>59110143
So, you admit to being terminally online?

>>59110155
Everyone on 4chan is

>>59109287
Can your competitive mons be competitive in champions? I thought the trailer made it clear that they reset ev/ivs once transferred to incentives the micro transactions

>>59110143
I will only say you're a hypocrite. Replied with one word and except more.

>>59110162
>You're a hypocrite for saying the truth
Welcome to autism hell anon

>>59110159
They only *might* reset EVs and IVs are completely removed from Champions
Nature, Ability and Moves should be retained (assuming the moves aren't changed by Champions as well)
The real question is actually if Champions will convert EVs in Home to stat points as well as if they will convert Minted nature to true nature but that remains to be seen.

>>59110164
retard

>>59110178
Welcome to autism hell to you too

>>59110100
This is what every smogondrone is made to believe before they actually make an effort to play official formats. Almost everything Smogon bans are problems exclusive to 6v6 singles, and the result of desperately trying to replicate the way the game was played 15+ years ago.

In ranked 3v3:
>Baton Pass is niche and can't be a big chain
>Evasion sucks, and keeps getting nerfed (no more Moody, Clefable and Chansey lost Minimize)
>OHKO moves are rare and only used for anti-stall on 1 or 2 mons
>Sleep clause is unnecessary, I've pretty much never seen more than 1 asleep at once

>prices
DOA

>>59110195
>3vs3
loooooooooooooooooool
lmaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaoooooooooooooooooooo

>>59110245
Typical smoggie showcases his complete lack of understanding for anything that isn't his fanfic meta.

>>59107843
But Baton pass is legit garbage tho

>>59110195
>>59110245
3v3 has always been the official Singles format.
>>59110289
Then why ban it?

>>59110351
>Then why ban it?
Think anon is referring to baton pass being bad in 3v3, a format where it is not banned.

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>do my 4 nightmare prey for the week
>look at prey renown progress
>still stuck on rank 4

>>59110393
Whoops this is pokemon, not WoW.

>>59110195
>Baton Pass is niche and can't be a big chain
I'm thinking that's gonna change with the new meta. Baton passing to a mega is too tasty.

>>59106618
>a subscription
lmao

>>59107301
No such thing as a good deal with microtransactions, you'd know this if you were born before 9/11

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>>59110470
I take what I can get in this digital hellscape.

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>>59110470
Starter Pack + owning ZA & SV gets you everything you need for Champions. That is EXTREMELY GENEROUS considering the absolute hellish state that mobile games are in. Most gachaslop games demand several hundred dollars just to hit a single pity roll for 1 character. Meanwhile Champions let's you get all the mons by simply owning the mainline games.

>>59106721
>crack open pokemon champions mobile port
>write script to convert showdown replay data into champions replay data
>make modded champions read a local replay repository instead of the official servers

>>59110556
Feels like it would be easier to just inject mons into Home than do all that

>>59108492
Bro, it doesn't even have a battle recorder yet. They're really just trying really hard to get it out before gen 10 to move VGC onto it while still having some time to test the waters and expand.

>>59110553
Jesus Christ, man...

>>59110553
>Gas at Sam’s Club/Costco is $3.56
>Gas normally is $3.99
>This means gas being $3.59 is actually good!

>>59110666
NTA, but anon, if you're someone that cares about Pokemon pvp and kept up with it, you are not just a casual fan at this point. Anyone taking Champions seriously would have already owned and played the mainline Pokemon games.

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Look at him go

Surprisingly the jump back isn't new, but the animation is much improved and helped by a better camera angle

>>59110767
I really like the visuals in Champions. Like, it’s probably the best looking 3D Pokémon game, right?

>>59110794
That's a low bar but probably
At least it's better than watching an SV battle which feels like pulling teeth

>>59110767
Meh

>>59110767
There's a similar thing with one of Maushold's hurt animations. It uses the exact same animation as SV but the placement of the mice as they're knocked away is much better.

The question is, when they inevitably add restricteds, in what order/quantity do they do them? There’s no way they add all 100 at once, right?

>>59110936
I hope they add them for private lobbies, but please no restricteds in ranked ever. Nobody likes them no matter how much they pretend they do.

Have we seen if total selectable Pokemon goes above picking 3 for singles and picking 4 for doubles in private battles?

>>59110984
No one's played private battles yet

>>59106611
>>59106611
>>59106611

>>59110767
Something tells me Cinderace, Deciduey's, Zacian etc signature moves are still going to look half baked shit like they did in SV

>>59110195
>Sleep clause is unnecessary, I've pretty much never seen more than 1 asleep at once
Git Spore'd, son

>>59110973
Restricted formats are fun, they just need to do the SV thing where after the restricted reg they go BACK to base power formats after a few months, rather than accelerating all generation.

Ideally they’d have both in parallel but I doubt they’ll split the ladder