https://www.rockman-corner.com/2025/04/keiji-inafune-blamed-arrogance-for-mega.html
>>12183225>2025/04
>>12183225He's objectively correct.Legends did cost a lot of money and sold terribly, even though it's a good game, at least outside of the controls. It's important to keep in mind who are you making the game for.You can see how a similar-ish game from Square, Brave Fencer Musashi, released next year and actually did well.MML team learned from that experience and used it to rake a shitton of money from Battle Network.
>>12183225It failed because it's a shit game with awful map design.
>>12183273>We underestimated their intelligenceJust straight up admitting the game is for retarded children, which it is. At least he's honest about that.
>>12183283I guess he also underestimated the intelligence of random users on 4chan that would years later read the excerpt of his book.
>>12183273Why do Japanese devs always say the most depressing shit and learn the wrong lessons. . Basically saying "don't try"Look at what the mega man and mighty number 9series became with this new knowledge. The more I learn about Japanese development the more it seems like the 80s and 90s output was a fluke. Like they were accidentally creative and they swiftly rectified that for the new century.
>>12183321well they did try, bn was something new and it worked out unless you mean don't try 3d. and considering mega man x7, yeah don't try 3d is the correct mindset to have. sometimes being cynical makes everyone happier in the long run. imagine a world where they made a shitty 3d mega man tps series for the 7th gen instead of trying something original at the time by going back to their roots.
>>12183273Wow, I didn't know Japanese people had Linkedin writing too, thought that was US exclusive
>>12183283It's extra funny because every American review for Megaman Legends was how much the game was an easy baby game for Tiny Saturday Morning Cartoon Watching Babies, unlike REAL Megaman.
>>12183321Megaman Battle Network is fucking incredible though, there was tons and tons of love and effort poured into the first three games (as well as the last one). It was an enormous hit for a reason. It tried something new for the series and RPGs in general but appealed to the original audience just as much as it did new players.
>>12183321No, he quite literally said that you need to be aware of who are you making a game for and not just trying to grab new audiences while expecting to keep the old one.Mega Man did great with BN and Mighty No. 9 is a trainwreck on a lot of levels, but at least one of them was him trusting his buddies from Inti Creates to actually be able to learn Unreal Engine and make a good game, but they fucked him over.
>>12183225POST THE REVIEW
>>12183225>We introduced 3D graphics, added RPG mechanics, and tried to bring in a broader audience: older fans, teens, even self-proclaimed "otaku" who had outgrown the series.That was me, and I fucking loved it.Fuck the children.
>>12183265It isn't a shit game, but it isn't a Mega Man game.
Having openly rejected Megaman Legends as a real Megaman game in my youth, and only having played it to completion for the first time as an adult, I have to say it does deserve to be part of the franchise. When you take everything into consideration, all the MM games that came before and how challenging they were, how Capcom was writing lore to tie all of them together, how they experimented with 3D on 5th gen consoles, and how chill the game is in general, MML is just... fun. It's not cynical. When every Megaman game is challenging, the one game that isn't as challenging just becomes enjoyable for that very reason.
>>12184000I love MEGA MAN 64!!I love KIRBY 64!!games dont need to be hard to be fun!!! The only mistake inafune san made was no Mega Man 64 2!!!Don't be sad Inafune san!!!Ganbatte!!!!!Thank you for all your hard work!!!Thank you for MEGA MAN 64!!!
>>12184021>games dont need to be hard to be funYes, that is correct. Most taxpayers agree.
>>12184000nice zero trips but honestly i've never found most mega man games hard, 1 and 3 have some pretty annoying parts but the hardest mega man games came later i'd say. also i haven't played legends yet but doesn't it take place on a flooded earth? how is that not cynical just because the mood is cheerier than in x or zero? like shit's fucked in the mega man universe in general except for battle network where dr cain presumably doesn't exist to open up pandora's box.
Target audience doesn't matter, if your game is fun it will sell. Legends wasn't fun so it didn't sell. They could have just made the games actually fun and spared us 25 years of stale discussion
>>12184118trillion dollar jewish asset managers bought controlling stake in every publicly traded japanese video game developer and started mandating DEI hiring and content practices from the top down?>>12184127this is a shitpost and doesn't warrant serious response.
>>12184156>trillion dollar jewish asset managers bought controlling stake in every publicly traded japanese video game developer and started mandating DEI hiring and content practices from the top down?tbf yeahEthics departments led decisions all started popping up pretty noticeably.
>>12183273>We failed because MM was for a series for elementary school children and Legends was aimed at teenagers!>So we learnt from our lessons and made Battle Network! A series that teenagers liked....
>>12184156>trillion dollar jewish asset managers bought controlling stake in every publicly traded japanese video game developer and started mandating DEI hiring and content practices from the top down?No. It's because the market very heavily disincentivizes creativity and it always has. If you're not willing to spend $40 on a flawed but creative game then you are the reason the games industry is the way it is. Mega publishers and asset managers have nothing to do with it. The publisher's job is just to say, "We are going to force you to make the rational move here economically". Every indie developer with business sense operates the same way.The only logical move in the games industry is to try and release a smash hit. That's the only logical move, which is why everyone is doing this now and spending 5-10+ years on a single game (both on a small scale like Deltarune, and on a large scale like GTA VI). Aiming to release a game that's "moderately successful" is financially absurd, because at best you make your budget back and at worst the studio is forever ruined. Just look at how studios like Treasure and Cave struggled along awkwardly for years, until they finally folded after exhausting all their opportunities. This is why there's no creativity in the industry. You guys don't want creative games, you won't buy them.>>12184168The logic is that if you're going to invest millions of dollars into a single project, and if this single project can also be destroyed in one fell swoop by a massive PR fuckup, and if running afoul of woke ideology is the quickest way to a massive PR fuckup, then you're going to hire a consultant whose whole job is built around helping you avoid that so you can focus on actually making a game.
>>12184127It is one of my favorite 5th Gen games Japs just have shit taste and there wasn't enough marketing for it in the west
>>12184206>you have to spend $80 on flawed games or the market will die!such a market deserves to die. stop making "flawed" aka bad games.
>>12184230What a broke ass faggot take
>>12184234"you're probably poor" is the corporate shill's version of arguing with holes. it's a meaningless defense mechanism you resort to when you know you're wrong and seething about it.
>>12184243Broke and schizoid
>>12184230>such a market deserves to die. stop making "flawed" aka bad games.You know you're talking about the 90's game market, right? The golden age of gaming was built on people shelling out $60 for shitty games. All the 90's masterpieces that you adore today only exist because they had the economic freedom to fuck up, because even flawed games would make a return.
>>12184293this 1990s "golden age" of gaming was based on a pre-H1B economy where the middle class still existed. sorry, but corporations don't get to dictate the market. good luck selling your $80 trash today :)
>>12184108>ake place on a flooded earth? how is that not cynicalDespite the Maverick Wars ruining the world, what's left of humanity (and Carbons, which are Reploids) chose not to kill each other over the scraps.
>>12183406>>12183273What's funny is that a few years later Inafune would be at the forefront of the "Japanese games are dead, we need to pander to the west to get that sweet CoD audience" sentiment that almost killed Capcom, so he literally learned nothing.
>>12184745He was ultimately correct though. They failed a few times, before producing westernized games like Monster Hunter World, RE7 and DMC5 to a great acclaim. The real problem was overreliance on non-Japanese game studios.
>>12184763>He was ultimately correctNo he wasn'tJapanese studios are leaving the West right now for obvious reasons
>>12184301These were game prices in the 90's, before your "H1B economy" or whatever you're blathering about.Do you think families were buying hordes of games at these prices? No, they were buying FEWER than they do now, and a ton of people were renting. People are absolutely buying more games per-person now than they did back in the 90's, because games are so cheap. They're just all buying the same popular ones.
>>12184763Those games were big successes for a variety of reasons, and being western-oriented was probably not the crux of that. There's no one else offering what either of these three games did at their timeframes at the quality they put out. If there is demand, you make it and you've got attention, gamers and casuals both will come.Mega Man, then and now, even as a long-standing mascot? He doesn't really fit demand nor does he get much attention. Especially in the deluge of indie platformers that eat his lunch.
>>12184775Their leaving the West, because they are more successful making "Western" games without the West direct involvement.You can see it by looking at Souls games or, for a earlier series, at Metal Gear.>>12184840I don't doubt that those games would still be successful if they were more weeb, but I feel like them being western-friendly is what ultimately locked down their franchises growth, especially Monster Hunter.
The big problem with it is it's just a really poorly controlling game.I think a lot of the Western fanbase also wanted more cool shit like Megaman X, and they got a game that felt like it was for kids, instead. Yes, I know it's all for kids, but perceptions. Megaman X was heavy metal and cool, while Legends is a game where you go into town and cutesy music plays.They may have made a mistake in not making a more conventional Megaman in 3D first, and then making Legends.
>>12183273I know Inafune has a reputation for being a retard, but I really feel like he learnt all the wrong lessons from this. As someone who likes the Legends games more than any of the mainline entries, this whole thing completely rubs me the wrong way. What is the lesson here? Don't aim for something greater and just keep making retarded shit? The Legends games have an enormous amount of soul and passion that the endless 2D sequels lacked, so why would you regret that endproduct and blame it on arrogance? I hate this.
>>12185025The lession is that a game for everyone is a game for no one and that the quality of a game doesn't matter if it isn't immediately appealing to the audience.They made a great game, but no one cared about it. It was arrogant to assume that everyone who liked Classic and X would instantly go buy Legends just because it says Mega Man on the title.
>>12183383Well, to be fair, the only thing "hard" about MML were the controls, and forcing yourself to give a fuck about the boring plot and obnoxious characters enough to keep playing.
>>12184108>but doesn't it take place on a flooded earth? how is that not cynicalWhy do you automatically assume it must be cynical? Your brain is cooked, man.>>12184978>They may have made a mistake in not making a more conventional Megaman in 3D first, and then making Legends.This would have helped the game immensely, in the west at least. Smartest thing I've heard said about this game in years.
>>12183406>No, he quite literally said that you need to be aware of who are you making a game for and not just trying to grab new audiences while expecting to keep the old one.Wonder why he kept his mouth shut around his peers a few years later. Still butthurt they replaced him as the artist for the series?
>>12185119I don't think he was in a position for a direct involvement as an artist at the time either way.
>>12183273So the game that alienated old fans and introduced RPG mechanics failed despite good reviews. The other game that alienated old fans and introduced RPG mechanics succeeded and also got good reviews. I don't see how there's any lesson to be learned there, feels more like they got lucky.
>>12185162Yes the whole thing is bullshit. Legends isn't any more or less mature than Battle Network, they're about on the same level. In fact on a gameplay stand point BN feels like it targets an older audiance with its fast paced gameplay.BN also makes zero attempt at targeting the old MM fans, the entire thing was new and if anything was targetting the Pokémon crowd.The whole interview to me reads like Inafune is in full cope mode and trying to convince the suits at Capcom that "(he) learnt from his mistakes so it's okay if I that previous game didn't as well" PS: Legends did well enough to get a sequel AND a spin off AND another cancelled sequel.This whole thing is bonkers.
>>12185162Targeting kids with shitton of toys, anime, manga and coverage in kid magazines is the key part.
>>12185179He's not talking about old fans, he's talking about demographic."Oh, yeah, kids would buy whatever slop we slap Mega Man label on" is an obviously arrogant position.>PS: Legends did well enough to get a sequel AND a spin off Asset reuse to recoup initial costs.>AND another cancelled sequel.Crowdsourced, because that was the only way to push for Legends 3 inside of the company.
>>12185190>he's talking about demographic.I don't see how Legends is supposed to be aimed at an older demographic compared to BN. It's not like 8 years old were playing BN.
>>12185258>It's not like 8 years old were playing BN.i was, on vba with save states...
>>12185258How do I say it? It's the degree of what Japanese call "coolness", I guess.Legends is a game for nerds (otaku) that are into kiddy stuff, rather than a game for kids.
>>12184684well that's good at least, took a few centuries to stop with the retarded fighting but better late than never. all's well that ends well y'know, well that really doesn't apply but seems safe to assume the future wouldn't go to shit if they ever made a game after that.>>12185083because you explicitly said it's not cynical in the post, and i was wondering how that's the case because i haven't played it yet heard things about it that seem to imply otherwise, keep up dude.
>>12185368>i haven't played ityou'll know what anon meant if you do
>>12184684By the time of ZX humans and reploids practically became the same race anyway.
>>12185368It's all about adventure and exploring ruins from when the world did go to shit. But everything is fine now. Mostly. The evil pirates you fight are basically Team Rocket.>>12185378I love this bit of worldbuilding where as the series goes forward in time you start seeing so much mixing between machine and biological life that even random forests have robot trees and cyborg insects. By the time Legends happens it's impossible to tell how much anything is biological or mechanical.
>>12185378How does that even happen? So dumbmm history is full of stuff that happens just because we need a game to happen
>>12184809>>12184293>BUBUBUBUBBUBUBUB GAIS, INFLATION! >IF YOU TWINK ABOOUTY IT, GAMES ARE CHEAPER NOW>SO PAY 80 BUCKS FOR YOUR SWITCH 2 GAME!Again with the Can00kbait, motherfuckers, 50$ were 50$ back then! and we had more money! we werent broke, houses were still affordable, and we werent drown in taxes!Also,rentals, anyone?
>>12185492>How does that even happen?Cybernetic implants for human(oid)s, biological part (that is essentially a death clock) for reploids.Basically equalization for a mixed society after the shit that happened in Zero.
>>12185492>why is fiction so fictional?at least try to imagine the apple dude
>>12185492That is the part that bothers you? Not the cyber-elves?
>>12185258>It's not like 8 years old were playing BN.I got BN at 10 years old and knew several friends that played them. It seems more appealing to kids to me looking back. It's pretty much a digimon clone and had self inserts for 10 year olds.
>be Capcom>give us cliffhanger>sit on it for 10 years while using the characters in side media like MvC and making the Servbots your company mascot>announce sequel>cancel it and blame the fans>ffw to 2025>25 year cliffhanger
>>12186801Yeah bro I'm still waiting for them to resolve the cliffhanger from the Mario movie. They'll do it one day.
>>12186801>>announce sequel>cancel it and blame the fansLegends 3 was never officially announced, the whole Devroom thing was Inafune and company attempting to put a pitch together to CONVINCE Capcom to approve it for development, and that failed.Nothing was ever approved and therefore nothing was actually cancelled.
>>12186801>>12186847>CliffhangerI'm not sure the ending of MML2 really counts as a cliffhanger. The plot was resolved, there was no antagonist left, there was no looming threat or anything, the only thing left was Volnutt was stuck on Elysium, and that alone doesn't feel like enough to build the plot of a game around.The MML3 Demo also felt like it was sidestepping that to focus on a bunch of nobodies, and considering the director was the same guy who directed X7, that didn't inspire confidence.
>>12183225He might be right, but I think some success was not enough success to Capcom. There was a huge campaign to push forth the 3rd entry by some Capcom staff and a fan bulletin board, but it was still shot down. So maybe fate worked against it like most games I like. On the other hand, I don't really agree with a lot of the statements he made to the press throughout the years, as he seemed to just say what the press and general audience want to hear than expressing the truth from my perspective.
>>12187462Do you have the 4inch-nel? I almost missed out that one.
>>12183263>at least outside of the controlsThe bad camera controls are where most of game's difficulty comes from though. It wouldn't be the same if they were 'fixed' unless you redesigned both the enemies and the combat system as a whole.
>>12184763Game of the Year is going to be won by a turn-based jarpig that Jap companies like Squenix spent two decades claiming was a dead genre.
>>12186853>>12187462Inafune actually had power at Capcom to keep it going while he was there and they even produced a playable demo for 3DS, but there was no one to keep it going after he left.In all honesty, 3DS was a bunch of potential for little games at Capcom that they haven't used. Like, you can bet that the likes of Mega Man Powered Up, Maverick Hunter X, Bionic Commando Rearmed 1-2 and Ultimate Ghost n' Goblins would sell great there if ported, but they were stuck on platforms less suitable for that style of games.
>>12187498I think that there is a room for camera improvement that would require just minor rebalance.>>12187505But then you got Sega with Yakuza and Persona, Falcom with Trails, Nintendo with Mario RPGs (ironically relegating Pokemon combat system to a mobile game) and SE itself with Saga, DQ, Octopath, etc.It is more complicated than that and Expedition 33 is Western as fuck where it counts.Hell, JRPG is just a spin on an old school 80s western RPGs.
>>12187485I had no idea, but likely couldn't afford them anyway. Perhaps that may be an issue, as word around the community doesn't spread. As it does feel like the MML community is shrinking.>>12187506The PSP did seem to have a lot more capabilities for shading and polygon pushing than the 3DS, not to mention its aspect ratio. There would likely have to be a lot of concessions to be made for ports and maybe the negative press of inferior ports may further damage the reputation of those games. I remember MML3 was supposed to be tailored specifically for the DS, so it would've had a much cleaner slate to push.
>>12187505It still is. First of all, the style of JRPG Final Fantasy used to be was a dungeon crawler lite with random encounters. Nowadays if you don't have slow moving visible enemies you can avoid while you leisurely explore dungeons with no danger, if there are even dungeons, people will call your game "outdated". Second, Final Fantasy used to be the king of RPGs as far as mainstream recognition goes, which makes Squenix think it still deserves that top spot, and the only thing holding it back is it's outdated gameplay. Because you can look at E33 sales numbers and think it's all great for an RPG, but Squenix is chasing Cyberpunk or Skyrim numbers, those are the RPGs they're competing against (or at least think they are) and they can't do it with turn based.
>>12187558They were like $60 for a 4" tall figure. And if you wanted her without her hat, that was a seperate $60 release exclusive to amiami.
>>12183265This has always been my problem with MML: aside from the character models the game looks really flat and unexiting. The world is all empty hallways that fall into nothing
>>12187676Not a problem for marble fag, he has lots of money despite his moaning about being poor
>>12187641It is not a "dead genre", you tard. Plenty of people, including Square, are making successful jrpgs for the core audience.
