Now that the dust has settled, what does /vr/ think of it?
I played a friend's and it's alright, I already had an HD modded 64 so I didn't feel a need to buy a new one.
i already own a real n64, i don't need a clone
just emulate
>>12429708It's great. It's $300 to play like 10 games, but it's great. Analogue has been following through with monthly firmware updates. We're still waiting on promised features, but they seem to be mirroring the Pocket launch in that people who buy one a year from now will have a better first impression than folks like me who got one at launch.
it seems like they made the "best possible" digital N64 but unless you have a group of people to consistently play multiplayer games with, the value proposition just isnt there
>>12429708Waste of money, Nintendies will really dip into their kids college fund just because they are too lazy learn to solder a basic RGB mod. If only they were PS Chads who had changed more lasers than women.
>>12429742>This post has been brought to you by an Analooguie shill
>>12429708I already have a Mister.
>>12429708pointless
>>12429742>monthly firmware updates>still waiting for promised featurestruly embarrassing
>>12429708>Now that the dust has settled, what does /vr/ think of it?It's good that people are trying to make things like this.It's bad that it takes them so long to make it and it costs so much to buy it though.Conclusion: good hustle but keep at it.
>>12429708waste of money, especially if you already own an original N64 and a flash cart.
>>12429742Oh yeah, I loved getting monthly firmware updates on my N64 back in 1997.
>>12429708Is FPGA actually any better than emulation or just a meme?The technology still confuses me, but as far as I understand it people still have to develop "emulators" for FPGA consoles, it's just that they're in a hardware description language. The FPGA replication is only as close to the original console as your implementation is, which was probably just based on an existing software emulator anyway?And surely an FPGA is all digital logic, it can't actually replicate analog sound chips, analog video output any better than a software emulator could?
>>12429763Calm down tinhat I seriously doubt anyone from analogue is here to try and persuade the 15 actual users who aren’t rage baiters or bots to buy one. Either way mine is still in box because as soon as I got it they announced a gold one, so I’m looking to just trade it plus whatever extra I need for the purchase from one of the eBay price gougers. This is the only system I’d do this for. I’m sure some people would do the same if analogue did a Saturn release. N64 is my favorite system and 200 for an hdmi/fps increase for games to see them run a lot better is very lucrative to me. Just waiting for the controllers to come out from mod retro.
>>12430480>Calm down tinhat I seriously doubt anyone from analogue is here to try and persuade the 15 actual users who aren’t rage baiters or bots to buy one.kek, you'd be surprised.
>>12429708Can someone explain to me in a legitimate sense without getting vitriolic or emotional or using meme linguistic mannerisms what the allure of FGPAs are?
>>12430598just something else to fuck with
>>12430598buying product and getting excited for new product, but unironically.
>>12430484I’d be more surprised if this board had more than 30 actual real life users now. Would be a giant waste of time and resources I would think to try and get one or two more sales from /vr. I could be wrong though for sure. I just love all the n64, well, love that the system has been getting recently w not one but two console clones, and possibly new (good) controllers via modretro.
>>12430771>without using meme linguistic mannerisms.You tried
>>12430598>what the allure of FGPAs are?less latency and digital video output modes. the downside is fpga based shit is always released in an half finished state where the end user is the beta tester for lifetime of product. paying several hundred dollars for a product that may or many not be finished is quite retarded when you could buy one of the many millions of original n64 consoles from various places.
>>12430774I know for sure that a certain flash cart producer personally shilled his stuff on /vr/. yes, it does sound unlikely, but it happens. when it does, it's usually because these guys have been anons all along, so they're here anyhow and it's as easy as namedropping their product in a convo once in a while.
>>12430802Thanks for the elucidation anon
>>12430803Aight, I mean it would be a good place to advertise at least it was a year or two ago but recently it has felt like we’ve lost a lot of posters and most of it is Ragebait samefagging. I just wish the board was as healthy as it was even a year ago, but I submit that it would be harmless if they already were anons to shill here for sure.
>>12430812>has felt like we’ve lost a lot of posters many since 2020. was always a low traffic board but threads are lasting a lot longer on front page>I just wish the board was as healthy as it was even a year agoit's healthier now that jannies and mods aren't deleting everything that hurts their feelings and are apparently ignoring reports filed by the decade long spamming nintendo schizo having his feelings hurt
>>12430456>people still have to develop "emulators" for FPGA consoles, it's just that they're in a hardware description languageYes>The FPGA replication is only as close to the original console as your implementation is, which was probably just based on an existing software emulator anyway?Yes>And surely an FPGA is all digital logic, it can't actually replicate analog sound chips, analog video output any better than a software emulator could?Sort ofThe main advantage of FPGA is that software emulation has an overhead CPU cost which is always going to add input delay, FPGA simulation does not have this disadvantage, so you get a no input lag experience without having to fuck around with run-ahead and other bullshit.The other advantage is that for some reason a lot of FPGAs ARE just more accurate than their software emulation counterpart. I couldn't tell you why if its just bad development on the software emulator's part, really big example is for MAME its almost never accurate with its slow-downs but the MiSTer port of these arcade games usually will be which is a huge deal for SHMUP players in particular. N64 is another big one where the software emulation scene still is just dogshit which is a huge reason why the Analogue 3D exists and there's been so much effort to make native PC decomps of N64 games specifically. But it brings into question whether this thing is worth paying $300 when you could just buy an original N64 + an everdrive for a very similar price point. Or you could buy a MiSTer for a little bit more (or a clone for even less), and you can play every relevant N64 game on it except for Conker's as well as have access to all the other consoles it has. So if you had to ask me if the Analogue 3D specifically is worth it I'd say no.
>>12429742Lmao is this a joke?
>>124307744stats says this place has 3 posts per minute so it has to be a lot more than that. Most 4chan users only lurk and don't post, and while there have to be some autists posting here all day surely there can't be that many since the board is slow. But there's definitely still several hundred people who browse this place at the very least.
>>12430891>huge reason why the Analogue 3D existsThe analogue is no more accurate than ares and relies on hacks to get most of its games running.
>>12430919Well that’s good to know, I wish we had more genuine posters tho. I once had a guy straight up admit he was samefagging as he raged against himself in a thread citing it’s the only way he could get engagement.
>>12430456the thing nobody tells you about fpga emulation is that as nice as it sounds on paper it still requires a software implementation that's just as bug-prone as any program
>barely 10 games worth to play>shitendo
>>12431042>101) Mario 3D2) Mario Racing3) Zelda 3D4) Zelda 3D expansion pack5) Goldeneye even though it was never good6) That jetski game the guy posted above I guess7) Uh... there was a Pokemon game I think8) ...What am I missing?
>>12431087>What am I missing?long term memory and object permanence
>>12429708They tried to trademark "fpga"fuck these people
>>12431025>the hack caused the good janny to leave,You're out of your mind, everybody hated the way it was moderated before. Though, the only real solution left to be implemented now would be to finally make the /V2K/ board, which, obviously, will never happen.
>>12431472you can count the nuisances here on the fingers of one hand and they're all spammers who should be deal with proactively. if you do that the board won't need any further tinkering.
Can you connect that controller to an actual N64?
>>12431472>everybodychronic faggot flamebaiters like (You) aren't everybody>/V2K/ boardmost of the worst spams threads are 90s console wars edition no. 10,000 so that'd solve nothing. it's impressive how braindead you are.
>>12429742Bro that so fire, thanks for post bro
>>12429742>picking the fat guy in wave race
>>12431087>>124310421. Mario 642. Paper Mario3. Mario Kart 644. Pokémon Stadium 5. Pokémon Stadium 26. Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time7. Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask8. Mario Party9. Mario Party 210. Mario Party 311. Banjo-Kazooie12. Banjo-Tooie13. Conker's Bad Fur Day14. Ogre Battle 64: Person of Lordly Caliber 15. Daddy Kong Racing16. Donkey Kong 6417. F-Zero X18. Perfect Dark 19. Mischief Makers20. Wave Race 6421. Kirby 64 The Crystal Shards22. Yoshi's Story23. Star Fox 6424. Perfect Dark25. Star Wars: Rogue Squadron26. Star Wars: Battle for Naboo (an improved Rogue Squadron) 27. Star Wars: Episode 1 - Pod Racer28. Since & PunishmentI think there's a few more (I find the controls for RE2 novel, couch matches for StarCraft is fun in a crippled 110% screen-cheating sort of way, and I find Quest64 cute in a basic trash sense but I wouldn't recommend it, etc, etc - I also left out GoldenEye because I think it's shit), but there's a bigger library than people give it credit for. However, the majority of genres overlap. Hope you like collectathons, party games, and platformers. Do you like RPGs or tactics games? Well, we've got Ogre Battle. Good thing it's a great game, because there's LITERALLY nothing the fuck else. The problem is that even if there's a few good games it doesn't matter when stuff good enough to make this list wouldn't even be notable on a console with a catalogue like the PS1. Sure, I like Mischief Makers, but it would've fallen through the cracks on the PS1 because it's just F I N E. Pod Racer is F I N E. There's probably 50-ish noteworthy games total on the system (not all great games, just mediocre and better, or at least novel in some way). I find that interesting about it in retrospect.
>>12430891>The main advantage of FPGA is that software emulation has an overhead CPU cost which is always going to add input delay, FPGA simulation does not have this disadvantage, so you get a no input lag experience without having to fuck around with run-ahead and other bullshit.I disagree with this, I think this is another "FPGAs are magic boxes" kind of thinking point, since original consoles processed input with a CPU running.... software.At 60hz "zero lag" just means within 16ms you can read input, process the game logic and render a frame.Even if you had a magic box that could read controller input and instantaneously render a frame it would have the exact same percievable latency as a software emulator that took 15.99ms to do the same thing - they have both processed your input by the time the next frame renders. That's what "no latency" means, it doesn't matter if it takes 0ms or 15ms, it just has to be done by the time the next frame is displayed.Surely a 5Ghz desktop CPU can emulate everything that a 4Mhz SNES cpu did input-wise within the same time frame?I would probably guess emulator lag actually comes down to modern operating systems and all the random accumulated latencies they will have such as delay reading from USB input, v-sync and frame buffering etc. The FPGA vs software argument is really just "bare metal" vs "bloated software and hardware stack" as far as I can tell. I see no reason why a board with a CPU running a software emulator connected directly as possible to controller input and display output like an original console wouldn't also have 0 lag.
>>12429742>It's great. It's $300 to play like 10 gamesGo fuck yourself
Instead of this, you can get a used N64 with a 1080p HDMI dongle for half the price. A Summercart 64 is just another 50 bucks and you're still saving money while getting a more authentic experience. If you really want the upscaling and stupid scanline filters then you're better off getting a chink clone Mister FPGA from Aliexpress for way cheaper.
>>12431834parallel vs sequential vs human perception>>12431967>>12429761lol
>>12431987Not disagreeing with any of that but it's a nightmare to get clean output from a N64. Every variant supports composite and s-video out but IIRC only very specific N64s can even be modded for RGB. Some HDMI mods were capable of extracting and using the raw video signal but that was one hell of a mod as far as difficulty goes, I'll stick with my blurry composhit thanks.
>>12431539
>>12431834>Even if you had a magic box that could read controller input and instantaneously render a frame it would have the exact same percievable latency as a software emulator that took 15.99ms to do the same thing - they have both processed your input by the time the next frame renders. That's what "no latency" means, it doesn't matter if it takes 0ms or 15ms, it just has to be done by the time the next frame is displayed.When I said zero lag I meant zero latency added over the original console, not literally 0 response time. >I would probably guess emulator lag actually comes down to modern operating systems and all the random accumulated latencies they will have such as delay reading from USB input, v-sync and frame buffering etc. The FPGA vs software argument is really just "bare metal" vs "bloated software and hardware stack" as far as I can tell. I see no reason why a board with a CPU running a software emulator connected directly as possible to controller input and display output like an original console wouldn't also have 0 lag.No, not at all. All FPGA gaming devices also have a CPU in them running a lightweight Linux since they still need to support USB drivers, external devices, display drivers, UI etc. You can test your theory yourself by running emulators on the lightest weight version of Linux possible, I guarantee the input delay will match. It has nothing to do with software bloat, it's in the emulator itself and the devs document this. If you want a direct example compare bsnes with snes9x, the prior is more accurate but has more latency than the latter. You run it on an FPGA you get the best of both worlds there. >Surely a 5Ghz desktop CPU can emulate everything that a 4Mhz SNES cpu did input-wise within the same time frame?You bring up SNES specifically but this is actually the most egregious example, that is just not how software emulation works.
>>12432068All models of N64 can be RGB modded. The difference is that only some NtSC/NTSC-J models can do the "simple" mod. The later models, and all PAL models, require a much more elaborate model for RGB.>>12431987Depends where you're from. If you're in PAL regions then this advice doesn't stand (I question what dongle you're suggesting that wouldn't be trash, but I digress) because then you're stuck with 50hz titles, and just doing a "region free" tray mod doesn't fix things because NTSC titles (unless you're running a PIF mod which are insanely expensive) will have inverted colors (unless you've got an HDMI or RGB mod) and still play at the 50hz. The inverse is also true, but there's barely any PAL exclusives, and they're all considered absolute dogshit, so it's a moot point.
>>12432486man, being a PAL gamer was so absurd and depressing. just the option for games to output in 60hz would've been a godsend, since the frequency was actually widely supported in 90s PAL TVs, and yet it took until the next gens for any devs to implement this obvious fucking QOL improvement.
>>12432486To clarify, the PIF mods allow the systems to swap between 50hz and 60hz. The RBG/HDMI mods fix the inverted colors. Getting just an RGB/HDMI and tray mod will allow you to play another region's games at the incorrect hz rate, but only from flash carts. The PIF mods are required to use original cartridges. >>12432493Yeah, it's genuinely inconceivable how bad things were for us. Even when the games were made in PAL regions they didn't give a fuck. Even now, if you're a hardware guy the genuine beat advice is to just import an NTSC console because the games run better, and it'll ultimately be cheaper than fucking around with mods and other dumb shit.
>>12432542>Even now, if you're a hardware guy the genuine beat advice is to just import an NTSC console because the games run bettermaybe there are other exceptions, but I've heard that it's preferable to mod a PAL Neo Geo since the difference in resolution is noticable and the games aren't region locked.
>>12432567I don't know much about the Neo Geo, but I'm curious as to what makes it the exception.Honestly, there was nothing stopping devs from making a great PAL version of a game for most retro consoles, most just didn't bother. For example on the Wii if you choose 576i at 50hz (instead of 480i/480p, there was not 576p option) most games would just letterbox the video to 480i, despite the lower frame rate giving them the headroom to utilise the increased resolution.
>>12429708It's an awful middle ground. Some games run closer to original hardware compared to software emulation but to call it accurate by any means is laughable.Not much of a point then compared to real hardware with an HDMI adapter or just regular old software emulation.>>12432486NTSC games on a PAL N64 run at 60hz, it's up to the individual game to determine that. The color encoding in PAL60 is indeed fucked but that's a known issue which affects some scalers and a lot of TVs, and strangely enough the GameCube suffers from the exact fault which is a much much bigger problem there as GCN has some 60hz only PAL titles. Your best bet is to hope you get lucky and your display device just supports it, the original RetroTink 2x 3.1 doesn't but the Koryuu does.I have no experience with a PIF mod but a Blaze/SuperUFO adapter works great for import gaming, as do chinese Everdrive clones. However, if you play a lot of NTSC N64 games, you're just way way better off getting an NTSC N64 instead as it's probably cheaper and definitely more reliable than anything you can do a PAL N64.
>$300+ for an emulatorLOL
>>12429708I like mine. The CRT filter looks really good with AA disabled. Funny how all those ultra HDMI n64s on ebay plummeted in price once these came out.
>>12432542>Even now, if you're a hardware guy the genuine beat advice is to just import an NTSC console because the games run better, and it'll ultimately be cheaper than fucking around with mods and other dumb shit.The Saturn is the only console past the 16-bit era which needs any sort of hardware mod to output 60Hz, and fortunately that has no games. The PS1, N64 and everything after that can do 60Hz out of the box. It was just never implemented by developers before the Dreamcast.
>>12429742That's such a sleek setup.
>>12430336Yeah, imagine putting out a fucking finished machine. You silly fucking faggot.
>>12429708>nintendo: releases one platform and makes minor revisions during its production run, just works>anal log slop: releases fpga clone, not quite 100%, expects everyone to download updates, it works but system is in a perpetual incomplete state>>12430336chad post>>12436079>imagine putting out a fucking finished machine.has anal log done that yet? let us know when we can buy a system that's a fpga clone, complete and never requires any homosexual updates because:>oopsie whoopsie! we found a buggy wuggy because nobody really put in that much effort to test everything! cringe.
>>12429708My friend Kaze says it is fucking terrible and not a real N64 copy and I trust him so no.https://youtu.be/wrbyP7y5z80?si=Aek5-Ewa9YMtLTgf
>>12429708Overpriced. I just kept my original N64 and bought an HDMI converter for it.
