I'm currently playing it right now (finally) and oh my fucking God it's good. The negative reviews are greatly exaggerated. This sets a new standard for crpgs that we probably won’t ever see again from anybody besides Larian Studio. I think they found a niche here. What’s also interesting is why is BG3 more successful than Divinity? Is the lore just more interesting?
BG3 is shit and everyone that likes it is a retard.
>>3952178Along with various faggotry, following 5E setting with "subjective" good and evil and other atrocities developers had committed one of grave sins - they made all not completely evil humanoid characters bland ugly in faces while giving good looking and/or charismatic faces only to most villainous characters (3 main villains and main devil, even a fucking hug in human form has good-looking (for a granny) face), dindus demonic tieflings (but, mind you, not your party members), to drow (and again, when drow had been announced as a companion - her face was quickly uglyfied in a few steps over several patches) and some background "retarded ignorant nobles", that are conveniently placed behind colums in main hall not to attract too much attention - and through that developers push "ugly good, beauty bad" narrative. This is one of the worst things one can intentionally put in any media piece, as this is clearly had been made to made people to refute beauty everywhere.
>>3952178>What’s also interesting is why is BG3 more successful than Divinity?Better presentation for one. Divinity was low budget slop on the road to the promised RPG land of BG3.
>>3952178>This sets a new standard for crpgs that we probably won’t ever see again from anybody besides Larian Studio.You won't get it from them either, kek
>>3952178>The negative reviews are greatly exaggerated.Can you link to the negative reviews?
>>3952178Why do you care what people on this website think, have you actually read half of the shit written here? Every other person is an unironic cultural warrior who's opinions go as deep as game I'm allowed to like Stellar blade good bg3 bad It's just reddit with different media chosen
SOMEONE SAID BG3 THIS WHOLE WEBSITE SUCKS *send post*
>>3952288>Can you link to the negative reviews?you clearly have internet. Just go on steam, nigger.
Yeah. sorry you thought this place had decent discussions, but I never found a single compelling argument against bg3. Just low brow barely even makes sense culture war shit yet generic ass jrpg slop where you play in 3-5x speed gets praised to the moon.Why? Because we deemed the jrpg to be le kino, even if no one finishes it out of boredom. Theirs genuinely no other reason, stop being a newfag.
>>3952288Sure. Here you go:>>3952192>>3952237>>3952245
>>3952310Nope.Link me the reviews that prompted this thread, not posts on 4chan.Nevermind, they don't exist.
>>3952311>Nevermind, they don't exist.lmao are you a fucking idiot?What about the famous criticism that BG3 doesnt feel like a BG game because, among others, its not rtwp?
>>3952311>not posts on 4chan.Posts on 4chan are what prompted this thread though. If you're asking for industry reviews you won't find them because 1: They don't exist and 2: Nobody fucking trusts industry shills to begin with.
>>3952308>I never found a single compelling argument against bg3Uses the worst version of DnD ever, and they homebrewed it to be even worseGimmicky encounter design that relies on unique modifiers they pulled out of their ass rather than interesting compositions of monsters and classesTrash fights drag on due to indecisive enemy AILame MMORPG itemization where everything is “build N charges”Interface is terrible, somehow worse with lost functionality compared to the devs previous game on same engine. Inventory management is a nightmare for the entire gameTerrible story, heavily railroaded to ignore player choiceTerrible writing, constantly immersion breaking with cringe Marvel quipsInsultingly bad callbacks to the first games, made by and for people who didn’t like or play themDevs cut major amounts of content and then lied about it instead of acknowledging what obviously happenedThe MacGuffin is a spiky d20Game packed full of YouTubers, muh critical role VAs, trannies, sometimes tranny YouTubersPacked full of woke garbage, half the races are black now, devs repeatedly lecture you about xenophobia and muh “refugees”Non-binary feminine penisesVitiligo sliders (I think that is a first honestly, inpressive)BG3 had the potential to have been a good game, but that potential is buried under so much garbage and stupid shit. Anyone who praises it without reservation clearly either likes garbage and stupid shit, or is willing to tolerate it and put up with it. All BG3 really innovated was high production values and a big budget, and viral marketing to appeal to a non-cRPG audience. It worked, game was very successful. Zoomers eat that shit up.
>>3952178It is a flawed game but there is a lot to love in it too. I´m going through a second run myself and i am indeed enjoying it more than the first one.
>>3952308>I never found a single compelling argument against bg3Correction : You refuse to engage with people criticizing your first crpg
>>3952368adding to this anon : Reactivity is gone past act 1Roll for everything design, for funny reactions to le nat 1 animations and clips that go viralAct 3 quests are assTerrible evil path overall
>>3952457>engage with people criticiAKA give me (you)s
>>3952178>It's so fucking goodHave you been playing RPGs for only a decade or so? Because all BG3 does is imitate DIv:OS 1/2. It's basically Divinity Original Sin 3. I finished it, uninstalled it, and went back to playing Icewind Dale and Wizardry 7.BG3 is the litmus test for RPG tourism.
>>3952178It's D&D 5e so the game mechanics of the system are just so fucking awful. There's nothing the game can offer that makes up for the fact that it's D&D 5e. That right there is such an impossible hurdle.
>>3952457This, honestly.
>>3952544>Because all BG3 does is imitate DIv:OS 1/2. It's basically Divinity Original Sin 3The craziest part to me is the number of areas where the same devs working on th same engine managed to regress from features their last game had. They nerfed the generic mercenaries (out of saltiness for players disliking their donut steel OC origin characters) to fixed race class combinations, requiring a janky multiplayer workaround just to make a custom party. They fucked up the in-world tooltips and made them useless, just giving an objects name and no other information (dos2 tooltips could show the value and weight, to sift through the six gorillion clutters). And they made the inventory a nightmare to sort and wade through, gone were dos2’s tabs, just dumping everything into one stupid pile. They attempted to reduce the pain with a search bar, which is a nice idea if it worked, but when I played the game at launch it was bugged and broken.
>>3952178>I'm currently playing it right now (finally) and oh my fucking God it's good. The negative reviews are greatly exaggeratedYou're playing a popular game, which won game of the year and got critical acclaim, the problem is that you identify as a contrarian faggot so deeply that you have to frame this as some type of rebellion despite just agreeing with the status quo.
>>3952465>terrible evil pathwhat game has an evil path you consider to be good? i'm not baiting i would like to know so i can play it lol>>3952593idk i really enjoyed bg3 and finished it twice. i've finished act 1 of dos2 3 seperate times and always lose interest in reaper's coast.
>>3952178D&D is for women and homosexuals. By extension, so is BG3.
>>3952237>when drow had been announced as a companion - her face was quickly uglyfied in a few steps over several patchesMy wife Minthara is beautiful
>>3952886I can't take her seriously since they reused the VA from the frumpy middle aged magister on the tutorial boat in DOS2
>>3952311>open Steam>filter to see negative reviewsWow, so difficult.
>>3952631>what game has an evil path you consider to be good?WOTR
It's pretty decent. I played through it two or three times with different builds. It's not nearly as memorable and comfy as 1 and 2 though. It's not even really nostalgia, 1 and 2 just have more soul.
>>3952631>what game has an evil path you consider to be good? Tactics Ogre
modern fantasy is very gay, also they shoved so many obnoxious homos in this game who are going out of their way to tell you about their homosexuality it unironically felt like 30% of fearun are faggots, i wonder if it was Larian or wotc mandated californian faggot writers.
>>3953449Only two really stand out in my mind. Astarion obviously, but also the tranny at the circus. I guess the strong lesbo couple was kind of stupid, though.
>>3953416>Tactics Ogre"Evil" path in that game is objectively completely justified I don't think that's a great example anon
>>3952178Huh?
>>3953544companions are player sexual they arent actually gay, they have faggy mannerism but thats just how modern city leftoid (women?) writers who grew up on modern netflix schlock write dialogue and characters. Im talking about actual lesbian love letters you find all over the world, like 4 or 6 out 10 gnomes you rescue in underdark announce to you they are gay, random cook tells you about his husband etc, Its honestly ridiculous and i see no reason for such behavior besides virtue signaling from writers.
>>3953392
>>3952178>D&D rules >forgotten realms setting>rolling for skillcheck in a single player game (lmao)>dogshit companions>asinine story about muh gods of the outeruniverse eldritch endtimes >cut scene animations are mocap>evil path is half-baked with it clearly being stitched onto the good path>maps are basically a boring theme park of various asinine encounters>no unique cultural and visual elements between races, it hardly matters what race you are>in fact, there are only 3 races - white, black and asian, all of which are complaying various fantasy races
>>3953723This needs to be hammered into the head of /v/.. and everyone else
>>3953723>>3953781It’s bullshit because it doesn’t reflect the reality of the late ’90s and early 2000s video game industry, which shifted from a relatively niche space driven largely by passionate developers into a heavily commercialized, corporate market shaped by venture capital and boardroom decisions aimed at the lowest common denominator.
>>3953784Here comes the cope
>>3953785If it's just cope from him, why does Harada here agree?
>>3953785>zoomer starts spewing buzzwords the second his uninformed viewpoint is challengedEvery time.
>>3953790https://x.com/Harada_TEKKEN/status/1761762564344791383source
>>3953793Harada can speak English? wtf
>>3953790>>3953791Let's wait and see how many more will come up and die on this hill
>>3953794Yeah he can speak it pretty well. His Twitter account is great for getting random insights and behind-the-scenes stories.
>>3953785its true for almost every media, only brain damaged zoomer or marketer would claim modern hollywood movies, music etc are better than 25 years ago.
>>3953798Naruhodo...
Couldn’t help but notice that none of the “I’ve never seen any reasonable criticisms of BG3 posted here” fanboys even bothered to respond to, much less attempt to refute, the multiple examples posted in this thread. Always falls back to “you must be wrong because the game is popular and sold well / muh critics liked it (N years after gamergate) / lol the first games were worse because they’re old”
>>3953784What anon saidBG 1 and 2 have a great painted art style that just looks nice even today, the characters don't feel forced, and the story is just more interesting/complete. They are also the reason 3 even exists in the first place. 3's story is meh, the twist with the illithid parasites is fucking stupid, the characters are modern tropes, and obviously the game was inspired to do everything 1 and 2 did, "but better". On the other hand, 3 has a shit ton of content and the gameplay is actually entertaining. I was a huge hater of the game at first, so when I finally broke down and played it, I killed most of the companions and just told everyone in the game to fuck off. I was surprised that it was actually fun while doing this, but the ending was dogshit and had nothing to do with how I played my character. Granted 1 and 2 was a pretty simple good/evil choice too, but everything in the game supported those two choices - 3 gives you the option to do things in many interesting ways, but the result is still a binary good/evil choice, which feels halfassed... not even considering how much I did not give a shit about anything that was going on at the end of the game, too.In the end, I have zero interest in playing 3 anymore. I did it maybe 3 times I guess, or 2 1/2, but I've done everything I want to do. A lot of the quests feel like a chore to do once you already know how it turns out. The only time I feel that way in the first two is Irenicus' dungeon.
>>3952178>What’s also interesting is why is BG3 more successful than Divinity? Is the lore just more interesting?Did you play divinity? It's almost like sandbox rpg, story is dogshit, you are farced to play two characters, its like 90% gameplay 10% story and rpg elements, items are almost random, there's alot of issues with it. BG3 is a really good game, but the moment you get to ACT3 the city the name is called after, it falls of the cliff, it's to big and meandering, you fuck around there and it feels like at every turn you are missing something more.
>>3953851>Did you play divinity?>you are farced to play two charactersIt's always astounding to me the number of zoomers who think that Larian sprang into existence with D:OS>t. thought they sucked since Divine Divinity
>>3953859Releasing a game with a name as terrible as 'Divine Divinity' should have consigned them to ignominy, in a just world.
>>3953863Yes. I could never take them seriously because of it. I completely forgot about them until D:OS2 came out and then I was like “oh fuck. These guys are still around somehow?”
>>3953839>I did it maybe 3 times I guessplaying and finishing this massive rpg even 2 times is a massive thumbs up for it lolI cant recall a game so long that I played twice lol>>3953863>>3953864That title was forced on them by their publisher at the time though lol
>>3954077I've done it twice for sure. Like I said, first game I killed most of the companions and played sort of neutral evil, and I didn't like the ending choices. Despite that, the game was still fun to play and there was a lot of things I could do differently, so my next game was the typical goodie two-shoes character I usually play in RPG's. I tried to play through it a third time, tried various builds, maybe it adds up to another half finished game. At any rate, I have zero desire to play it anymore, so it is what it is.
>>3952178>The negative reviews??? it literally had no negative reviews
>>3952192Unfortunately so. Could've been great though.
>>3952925I think she was also the main villain from OS1. Sounds the same, at least. So she has a good rapport with the studio.
>>3953723This isn't always true. I just played F.E.A.R. for the first time in my life, and the whole time I was playing it, I was thinking to myself "Why does this game look, feel, and play better than any FPS released in the 2020s?"Sometimes people are blinded by nostalgia, but other times the old thing actually is superior to the new thing.
>>3952178The CRPG equivalent of Harry Potter. Popular, but if you gush over it to someone who has any real familiarity with the medium they'll politely chuckle and never talk to you about the subject ever again
>>3952178Main plot is utter trash, the combat sucks. Everything feels Marvel. The "villains" are a joke. They managed to make something with an epic presentation feel completely devoid of epicness. At no time did I have a sense of adventure, like in BG1+2. It feels very small while it pretends to be big, but not good small either, like the early game in actually good RPGs.Disappointment of the decade after all the hype. RPGs are a lost art.
>>3953723wow, what a genuinely lefty meme, making a bad and lazy point without any trace of wit, originality or pithiness. Textbook example really.
>>3952178>why is BG3 more successful than Divinitydivinity is ugly looking. The elves and lizard people in particular.
>>3959860Only thing that bothered me about the villains is they're basically power rangers, or the planeteers with their gems. They even have a catchphrase (Hate, Fear, Murder or whatever), just like the kids say in Captain Planet. Its pretty dumb.
>>3952192fpbp/thread
>the Teifling barbarian is an atheist I'm gonna assume the wall of the faithless was decanonized?
I want to play this at some time in the future. Probably will have mixed feelings about it then.
>>3952178They released an unfinished game that had to be patched for a few months later. How is that any different from the slop that was released by other companies in the past decade or so? That it has more shinies for the consoomers to get distracted by?
>>3960458>divinity is ugly looking. The elves and lizard people in particular.TrueHowever, they weren't content with just that, and, in their majestic equality, decided to hit the Forgotten Realms with the ugly stick as well
>>3952178>turdhued syntax
>>3961065Not really. I guess she's just stubborn and stupid about it. I mean, there are people in faerun who literally sign away their souls to an eternity of torment in exchange for a few decades (at best) of power. They're not a very foresightful lot.
>Baldur's Gate 3 (BG3) has a total script of approximately 2.5 million words (specifically 2,503,837), including about 2.12 million words of character dialogueThe reactivity of BG3 is insane, pic related. Combine that with the top tier voice acting and music.Only contrarians say it's bad.Yes, I hate the diversity token shit they did too, but that doesn't make the game bad.
>the reactivity...is INSANE>go to baldurs gate as a drow/duergar>no one gives a fuck
>>3961541It's full of black humans so they probably just think you're a black elf/dwarf.
>>3961527Tokenism isn't just whenever a minority appears.
>>3961599>1 cross dresser>1 trans character>1 black party memberit's tokenism, like jacob in mass effect, and so on>>3961541>le cherrypicking
>>3961614So you want to see more cross dressers, more transgender people and more black people in order to prevent tokenism. Seems reasonable. If you were being sincere. But you and I and everyone reading this knows that's not how you mean it. You actually want there to be none, and you're deceitful in that intent, hiding it behind that pathetic claim of concern about tokenism to provide your bigotry a pitiful shield. It isn't working. You're too stupid to be convincing.
>>3961631Where did I indicate concern over tokenism? I think it's an effective ploy devs can use to keep the unfortunate rabble infected with the leftism mind virus happily rocking in their cradles. That's all. Can we really expect a western euro dev to produce an all-white vidya game cast in 2023? They'd be cancelled, as the kids say
>>3961527all that effort for mediocre netlix tier soap opera dialogue and teenage drama, sad
>>3961656you're describing veilguard, not bg3. the dialogue is fine
>>3961659>you're describing veilguard, not bg3. the dialogue is fineNTA, I've played computer games since the early 90s. I cannot think of a game that I have played that has worse dialogue and writing than BG3. The dialogue in BG3 is so incredibly immersion-breakingly cringe that it's immediately off-putting and hampers the player's suspension of disbelief, such that it is absolutely inconceivable to me that any sentient human being would give it even the most mild praise, such as "fine". It is not fine. C'est la merde.
>>3961664nta but I thought Neverwinter Nights 2 was pretty shit. Bunch of terrible characters.
>>3961664you're delusional. give examples. the tone of the writing is boilerplate, same as nwn2 or da:o and so forth
>>3961527>the more werds the gooder the gameit's so over
>>3961614>>le cherrypickingan entire act and 2 races is cherrypickingYou should've gone with the "wotc wanted less racism, hence the discrepancy between a1 and a3"
>>3961678the more words the more reactivity, yes. good cope tho>>3961820name a game w more reactivity that is voice acted or keep cherrypicking to cope
>>3961948>name a game w more reactivity that is voice actedAnon accidentally argues against full VA without realizing it, lmao
>>3961948>name a game w more reactivity that is voice actedAlpha Protocol.
>>3961820>wotc wanted less racism, hence the discrepancy between a1 and a3They done goofed. BG3 made me even more racist.
>>3961948>that is voice acted moving the goalpost...again...
>>3961948>good cope thoIronic, since you're coping for the obviously atrocious writing in this game by setting up "reactivity" as some kind of virute in itself. Please tell me how it makes the generic Macguffin hunt any better if this or that forgettable character says a line about me being a githyanki.
>>3961669>you're delusional. give examples. the tone of the writing is boilerplateI remember the precise moment when I realized that something had gone horribly wrong during BG3's development (after trying the early access right when it came out and enjoying it) when I played the full launch version of the game, and my character started making """witty""" quips in the tutorial nautiloid.>I've got a lot on my mind... or, in it, I suppose.The game is full of shit like that. I found it extremely jarring and immersion-breaking. Many writers for games and shows are now a specific strain of irony-poisoned leftist millennials who grew up watching too much Joss Whedon bullshit as children/teenagers, and too many Marvel movies in their 20s and 30s, and their bullshit just sticks out like a sore thumb and rubs me the wrong way.Or for another example, this charming gem https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=viE-RcTtKdE>This squirrel might be the single most adorable creature you can recall in all your stunted memory.>It would be ever so ~*twee*~ if it were climbing a tree!I have played NWN2 and DA:O, admittedly years ago when they came out, so they are not fresh in my memory. But I did not at all have the same visceral reaction to them as I did to BG3. I've never had a game so actively shatter my suspension of disbelief left and right.
>>3962406>BG3 haters cant deal with some funny moments in a whimsical fantasy adventureYawn
>>3962406I remember in BG2 that the evil party members kept complaining about the party reputation being too high. I mean, evil characters should be happy to exploit this chance instead of caring about their evil image.
>>3952192tsmt
>>3962750>good paladin wants to decline the reward>evil warrior wants to get paid
>>3959860if you felt no sense of adventure going into the underdark or mountain pass for the first time, I don't know what to tell you.
>>3963090Underdark felt just like an extended cave. No drow/illithid/beholder settlements like in bg2, only the heckin shroom people. Forge was cool, visually, but over quick and the fight and story development was trivial compared to how you're led to believe you're doing something very important.
>>3952178Playing it again for the first time since release, and doing an evil Durge run is way more fun than I expected. I feel like a hurricane drifting from place to place, just causing chaos and making everyone's lives worse.Coming off the back of Rogue Trader, it feels like it's impossible to make the BG3 companions dislike you without actively trying to sabotage your relationships with them. Wyll and Karlach obviously object to me raiding the Grove, but the dips in their reputation caused by evil deeds is more than offset by being generally competent at doing stuff in general. Feels weird to be almost comically evil, and yet Astarion/Shart/Lae'zel all like and trust me.
Sorry to hear that. Have you played any other RPG before?
>>3967122>it feels like it's impossible to make the BG3 companions dislike you without actively trying to sabotage your relationships with them. Wyll and Karlach obviously object to me raiding the Grove, but the dips in their reputation caused by evil deeds is more than offset by being generally competent at doing stuff in general. Feels weird to be almost comically evil, and yet Astarion/Shart/Lae'zel all like and trust me.In the EA (when all the available original chars were edgy evil cunts except maybe Gale) Larian initially claimed that they were forced to frontload all the evil companions in order to get players to playtest them, but that later on in the game there would be a full roster of good companions. In actuality, we already saw the full roster except Karlach, and behind the scenes, they rewrote all the characters to be bland, agreeable, playersexual, and focus group approved. Wyll in particular had his backstory almost completely changed.
>>3952240BG3 romance has nothing on DOS2 smut, also music is unironically much better
>>3967328Dos2 has an wonky, awkward and whimsical style. Some weird soft porn horror comedy. It works. Bg3 has a lousy tone.
>>3952178d&d system is a millstone around this games' neck
the game takes a nosedive during Act 3, like every Larian game. It crumbles under its own weight. I think most if not all crpgs suffer from this. They draw up huge fantasies with all the dialogue and always fail to deliver in the end.
>>3967604>during Act 3Past ea part, you mean. When I got into act 2, I realized pretty fast that they ruined the game. Act 2 feels like a new game altogether.
>>3967604>They draw up huge fantasies with all the dialogueBg should've been the hub late act 1.>promising baths full of lavenderWhat we got was a 4 some with sex workers. Pretty sure drow wouldn't work as sex slaves on the surface, but whatever.
>>3952368I unironically disagree with everything here and think BG3 is the greatest game ever created full stop no joke.
>>3952457>>3952588NTA but BG3 was my third crpg after bg 1 and 2 and I still think 3 is omega level GOATED tier surpassing all vidya with ease.
>>3967328bg3 romance is lit the best in all of gaming. The only thing on the same level is W3
>>3967182>In the EA (when all the available original chars were edgy evil cunts except maybe Gale) Larian initially claimed that they were forced to frontload all the evil companions in order to get players to playtest themIt wasn't Larian, it was a "leaker" in here that spammed this shit day in and day out, until people believed him.I know it because I was him and I was bored at work.
can you stop bumping your thread nigger its going down to p10 for a reason
>>3967977>It wasn't Larian, it was a "leaker" in here that spammed this shit day in and day out, until people believed him.>I know it because I was him and I was bored at work.We are now at the point where 4chins posters LARP about LARPing. This is extremely grim.https://www.ign.com/articles/baldurs-gate-3-early-access-changes-player-data-feedback-larianNovember 10, 2020>“There's been a group of people complaining about the fact that the companions are snarky and they have to have an opinion,” Vincke reveals. “But we’ve only put the ‘evil’ and the ‘neutral’ ones out there. We haven't put any of the ‘good’ characters in yet, so I think that will balance that.>“I didn't expect people to be that sensitive to how the companions thought of them, and the fact that we didn't put the ‘good’ characters in there,” he admits. “I didn't see that one coming. In hindsight, it's cool because it means [players] care.”-Swen "Larian" Vincke
>>3967998>grimNothing to add.
>>3967977actual full blown schizo
>>3952178>Why is BG3 more successful than DivinityThere's a lot of answers to this question but mostly it boils down to brand recognition around normies with Baldur's Gate being huuge and well known, on top of the DnD bubble inflation thanks to Stranger Things and Critical Role. If you want a deep dive, normies fucking HATE anything they need to pay attention to so any game that comes as a sequel or has a (2) in it like Divinity OS2 is going to have less sales from being in a series unless it's a clear and total reboot ala BG3. Larian has also banked a lot of good will and gamer cred with their last two games being rather good crpgs and being supported for free post-release for two years at least. Is it a lore question? Not really, DnD lore fucking blows and only certain facets of the setting are interesting. Everyone hates FR for being a boring cookie cutter setting and as much as people love lore fellating to debate most DMs opt for their own setting. Even something renowned as being a great setting like Planescape or Black Sun is liked for vibes more than lore. It's just good vibes and less investment required, even if BG3 has quite a lot of flaws and clearly suffered from way too many rewrites and ways to appeal to more consumers. It's not terrible, even with 5E's terrible downgrade in terms of usable gameplay.
>>3967977No, Larian actually stated they frontloaded the evil dudes and a lot of the datamining revealed we had at least 4+ more planned "good" aligned party members. None of which were Halsin or Minthy, but for some reason those two were so popular that the devs compromised on vision just to get those two into the game as party members.>>3967998The funny thing is that players actually liked Shart for being a mean Step-On-Me girl or they thought she was built for domination loss or something. The people who weren't that well liked were Astarion (genuine cunt but this somehow didn't get changed, he just became slightly more charismatic), Wyll (boring), and Gale (boring AND comes on to you strong). Gale wasn't made any more interesting because he just became a DMPC knowitall, Astarion somehow stands out because he's actually snarky and selfish for once and kind of funny, Lae'Zel is less mean I believe but she's a bit irrelevant. We missed out hard with an earlier Minsc and the weird Bard Halfling chick that got cancelled, in exchange for Bear Sex and Minthara's lack of pregnancy.
>>39680354? I only know of the halfling werewolf.
>>3968035>WyllOg Wyll was a fraud and that would've been fun.
>>3968050Jaehira was meant to come earlier, Karlach a different character, iirc we had a different Paladin, earlier Minsc, and the Halfling. There was one more who I was forgetting, I believe a druid or a sorcerer? The datamining was a long time ago so sorry if some information is wrong
>>3953723Things in the past were objectively better than they are today. Arguably many things related to art and culture were far better in general. And if you go back in time before you were born it was probably better then too.
>>3968100I wonder what monetary change happened in the U.S. in 1971… hmm… the ultimate conquest of 1913 fulfilled
>>3968116It happened long before 1971. The conquest was already completed by 1933. 1971 was just phase two of the occupation.
>>3968126I was told that the cartel of central bankers seized control of our money supply for our own benefit (and here’s why that’s a good thing)
>>3968126Some game theory professor claims that Trump is a 4d genius to get Venezuela and then attack Iran. Essentially it enslave Africa, Arabia and europoor to buy resources from the US and Russia I'm exchange for high tech, crippling their innovation, due to loss of production capacity. Big stretch.>>3968139Natural development.>>3968072A paladin? I thought jaheira and minsc aren't actual companions, but sidelings, like the drow. Pretty sure larian lies and they never had plans for more companions, besides the werewolf. I like the original nightsong concept better. The current one doesn't make any sense, nor is she strongShe's rather weak.
>>3968204Minsc was always intended as a full on companion or origin character, he had a tadpole after all. Jaheira I don't know about but I don't remember the leaks having her on the companion list. And yeah the werewolf chick would have been cool and some other characters too but it is what it is, unfortunately.
>>3968308>he had a tadpole after allI’m still mad about how they handled this. My first playthrough I wanted to spare Minsc when you are forced to fight him. using the in-game “non-lethal blows” mechanic, which works fine for sparing Minthara in act 1 (the game recognizes that she’s not dead and you can recruit her on the good path by doing this for example). However, when you knock him unconscious, he immediately springs back up into combat and continues attacking you, and then if you knock himunconscious a second time, he just dies. Boo gives you a disapproving glare, and the Emperor says that he can’t save everybody, although this is a lie because if you recruit him, he does, in fact, extend his stolen protection to Minsc and protects him just fine. It’s completely arbitrary, immersion-breakingly stupid, and just one more example of how the games lauded reactivity is a surface deep illusion that crumbles when you don’t do exactly what the devs want. The game doesn’t respect player choice, or even its own mechanics.
>>3952178World is too small. Even BG1 is bigger than BG3. Its story is very paint-by-numbers. Predictable. It's also very woke (Tranny circus manager, paladins lose their class benefits and "Fall" if they don't give the rich man's house to the homeless immirants, etc etc) The game is also easy as piss because as hard as raphael is, you can kill him in one round with a fighter/monk who can get 11 attacks doing 30 a hit.Only people who like it are CRPG posers who weren't playing CRPGs in the 80s and don't know what the genre is suppose to be.
>>3968395Your complaints about BG3 may all be valid. But "supposed to be" is not a valid argument.The genre is not "supposed to be" anything. You don't have to like that the term is being used to describe experiences which are somehow not like the ones the term was originally used to describe. But you can't gatekeep like that, no matter how you try.Instead, you might try developing a new label that makes a distinction somehow. But genre labels are not a matter of "should". There is no objective standard of what is or isn't this or that genre.
>>3968395>paladins lose their class benefits and "Fall" if they don't give the rich man's house to the homeless immirantsit's called lawful stupid for reasons, anon.
>>3968422how is letting some illegal squatters occupy other person house lawful
>>3968402>But "supposed to be" is not a valid argument.>The genre is not "supposed to be" anything.Stopped reading here
>>3968461you're just not getting this alignment thingie, are you?
>>3952178>oh my fucking God it's goodoh my fucking God your taste is so shit
>>3968422>it's called lawful stupid for reasons, anon.It’s called the developers not understanding the source material and projecting their modern political garbage, anon. There is nothing lawful stupid about siding with a gang of violent squatters, doing so is a chaotic act. The lawful good thing to do would be to insist they leave the man’s home (who has done nothing to them, they just want to steal his shit because they’re greedy rapefugees), and to perhaps help pay for lodging for them out of the paladin’s own pocket in an act of charity.The game handles paladins very poorly in numerous instances, and will cause a paladin to fall in situations where no reasonable DM would do so (another area where human judgement is sorely needed and not a scripted game, except in obvious cases)For example, if you decide you’re going to kick in the door of Moonrise Towers and storm the cultist lair in a frontal assault, after clearing the first floor, my paladin made it to the second floor, and was accosted by the guards for “trespassing” and made to fall for “resisting arrest” in the middle of battle against the evil cult, because the area was flagged as a town. Fucking stupid.
>>3968318Act 3 is rather underbaked yeah, not much to say. It's a shame since clearly they had intended more but the game is solid enough from act 1. Larian has a particular style of RPG unfortunately that just means situations like these might be a miss.
>>3968492might be excessive and a reasonable DM wouldn't do it, but in other games, paladins tend to get away with way too much bullshit.The flagged as town thing sounds like a bug anyway.Also, D&D has always been full of modern, political garbage as you call it. Despite it often being called medieval Europe inspired fantasy, it has like nothing in common with medieval Europe. The alignment system is part of it and always was a problem, that's why many players don't like it.Protect the helpless, however, is a concept much older than D&D.
>>3968521There's no reason to play act 3. After hitting level 12, I kill the brain. First playthrough I started some quests, but markers broke and I never cared for it. Act 3 is pretty shit.
>>3968558boss fights are by far the best in act3
>>3968528>Protect the helpless, however, is a concept much older than D&D.Have you played the game? They aren't helpless, they're aggressive and violent squatters. They're about ready to knife the guy to steal his house. The developers are expecting you to go "Yeah! Eat the rich! Kill all landlords!" and think that helping them to steal some guy's house is the just and moral thing to do.
>>3968560Bg3 has boss fights? They hardly take longer than average fights. Everything melts in 2-3 rounds, rocket tag sucks.
>>3968642if u are at that point because you know the system install difficulty mods and have house rules to not abuse exploits.
>>3952178Is it still just sex porn and romance?
>>3968644I always play random builds. Is there a bg3 randomizer?>house rulesI usually have a bunch of self imposed limits. Had a team of 3 winter casters, water and ice only, admittedly utility spells were allowed.
>>3968558Can we take just a moment to talk about how fucking stupid it is that level 12 PCs can possibly challenge an Elder Brain? A being like that is more powerful than most demigods in the setting. And the one in this game's story is approaching full transcendence into true divinity. It's just fucking stupid.
>>3968680It is very dumb that they didn’t scale the game to reach 20 by the end. Presumably that was to leave open room for a sequel or expansions that didn’t materialize.
>>3968680Standard Elder Brain has a CR of 14
>>3968680>Can we take just a moment to talk about how fucking stupid it is that level 12 PCs can possibly challenge an Elder Brain?No? Level 12 is actually rather high.>A being like that is more powerful than most demigods in the settingAbsolutely not true by the way.
>>3968680>Elder Brain?netherbrain >> elder brain.
>>3968753Cr was always off-putting. How come some dragon can resist an elder or netherbrain? Way I see it you can conquer faerun with it. Secondly, where is the army of mindflayers during the boss fight? The ones that spawn like 10 minutes after the fight?
>>3968753A standard elder brain has only 21 int which is one point above a smart halfling or half elf. A standard elder brain is immobile and has at least 5-6 ultharid guarding it. The netherbrain should be at least twice as strong as a regular elder brain as it can fulfill the grand design. Spin it as you like, the plot isn't thought through.
>>3967946Mass Effect trilogy/Dragon Age origins romance are better.
>>3968774Bg3 doesn't have romances. It's horny superheroes humping anything that moves, literally zoomers 'sexuality'. Barely above the level of bugsex.
>>3968680>>3968698High level DnD is just not challenging without bloating the combat encounters or scenarios with either Etrun the farmer (Level 20) or Nethersax destroyer of worlds hidden Archdemon. The problem is that epic level campaigns demand you to use part of the cosmology but wizards is very against anyone but them writing in lore changes or part of that. Mask of the Betrayer for instance was a high level campaign but it didn't let you make any real changes to the setting
Does he still have the pass or did he lose it?
>>3969837He got Pat Tillman’d in the battle in front of the Druid grove.
>>3969902>He got Pat Tillman’d in the battle in front of the Druid grove.How do you even get that to happen? I killed the gobbos at their camp.
>>3970190>he didn't guarantee wyll was friendly fired to death
>>3970190>How do you even get that to happen?Anon, a question like that could be really unlucky for someone's health. I'm concerned. Just looking out for you, buddy. I don't want anything bad to happen to you, you know? In the heat of battle, you never know...
Chickened out of my evil durge run in Act 2 by not immediately killing Isobel in the Last Light Inn.This place is just too fucking spoopy man, I need at least one location that isn't a terrifying shithole.
I hope Divinity has unique loot more like BG3 but still keeps the random loot of 1 and 2
>>3971044BG3's unique loot was very nearly as shitty and stupid as the random loot of DOS2. I can barely remember DOS1's loot, just the crafting system.
i dont like how legendaries are basically all backloaded to Act 3.you can get 1 intended, 1 via preorder bonus and 2 by cheesing Voss/Raphael., a single one in act 2 and 19 in act 3
>>3971054still way better than turbo tedium of DOS2 "oh I leveled up, time to replace ALL ITEMS on every party member and spend 100k shopping and checking every merchant"
>>3970343>>3970403I meant "how do you even get the gobbos to the grove"
>>3971612There’s a battle there the very first time you approach the grove, it’s how Wyll is introduced.
>>3971614Oh that battle. Nevermind, I thought there was some sort of way to have a big ol battle or raid or whatever with the Goblin Camp attacking the Grove.
Was the Orin fight supposed to be a meme fight? I just used Vow of Enmity on my character and Minthara, used Calm Emotions on Karlac, and then the three of us just beat the shit out of her until she died. My main did 100 damage on a smite crit. So far the hardest fight has been Myrkul. And even that was a meme fight since you can just stand below him and throw grenades
>>3968680That isn't the worst part for me. The worst part are the plotholes1. Ketheric and Balthazar imprisoned Dame Moonlesbian in the Shadowfell so Kethric could be immortal. Then Shar followers spent 100 years stabbing her to become Justiciers. But the temple is a blasted ruin hinting at abandonment for centuries. So when exactly was it destroyed? 2. After imprisoning Moonlesbian in the Shadowfell, both Ketheric and Balthazar forgot she was in there? And then they had to go looking for her? What the fuck? 3. Ketheric pledged to Shar in exchange for power, then betrayed Shar and made up his own cult because lmao why not. Yet Shar doesn't harm him for this, but she DOES harm Shadowheart for so much as looking at flowers or having a naughty thought? 4. The Elder Brain with the Netherese Crown threatens all of existence, including the gods. You're told this multiple times. But then the gods are like "Nah, you deal with it :) " ???5. How come Selune did absolutely nothing to save her own daughter from a century of torment, but the other gods will fuck you up over minor slights and betrayals?
>>3968521>Act 3 is rather underbaked yeah,Literally every major quest has quest markers in a two block radius and you change the fate of the world just walking around in that area, it's ridiculous. You go down into the sewers just to explore, and you're immediately tagged with the Bhaal plot, Voss, the Guild, and I'm just like bro, how many of you fuckers are just hanging out in these pipes like the Ninja Turtles waiting to spring quests on passersby
Im wishy washy on bg3Some aspects of it definitely makes it feel gameplay wise a new standard for crpgs like how easy elevation works like I can cast high jump jump on the banister in act 2 and drop a cloud on all targets or slow falling down from the giant tower in act 1 under darkBut man some parts of its main quest and a few side quests are so lame
>>3971724>definitely makes it feel gameplay wise a new standard for crpgsimo it makes gameplay worse and too easy to exploit and impossible to balance, DOS2 didnt have shove, real-time swap turn based on demand with a hotkey and it made abusing it a lot harder cause it limited a lot of bullshit possible in bg3.
>>3971730I guess dude but Thorn whipping some guy off a ledge is literally the coolest thing i seen in a crpg in 20 yearsThe rest of them might as well just take place on a 2d painting And the ultima 7 being able to throw crates around to block doors or create a elevation is cool but dos had that.
>>3971714>The worst part are the plotholesBetween the initial early access and release there were at least three waves of writers redoing shit and undoing what had been done previously, until the game and characters were rewritten into focus group approved nonsensical mush
>>3971736Also the sound design of bg3 is pretty cool like throwing a fire ball and hearing the sound effect of multiple portraits from the top falling off is chiefs kiss.It's not the most balanced game but it's features and general look/sound design is pretty solid.The issue with bg3 really does come down to how restrictive 5e is, and some story bits.I prefer freeform character creating systems that rigid class systems but that's controversial here
>>3971093Modern games suck even more at pacing then older games. Kinda curious.>>3971616You can slaughter the grove. It's clearly discouraged and robs you of content, but you can do it.
Lae'zel is pretty much essential at the beginning of the game. But by the time you get to level 7ish, she's really pointless and outclassed by Paladins and basically anyone with magic. Kind of sad. Fighters suck.
>>3971827did we play the same game? My Lae'zel could have solo'd the game by act 3, but Gale sucked for the most part
>>3971827>Lae'zel is pretty much essential at the beginning of the gameIf you kill her on the beach, her corpse magically teleports to the monastery, presumably due to lazy scripting for a cutscene with her that was supposed to trigger if you hadn't recruiter her
>>3971827>outclassedGiths have overpowered exclusive weapons and Lae'zel's default class is genuinely OP
I like the gameplay but I hate everything else about it.
>>3971616There is, just tell Minthy the location.
>going full durge in act 2>slaughtered pretty much everyone by the end of the act>tp'd to the last light inn after killing the nightsong to find jaheira solo'ing about 20 dead harpers and some giant plants>help her kill everything>she just sits back down at the table like nothing happened>at the end of the act, she finds me in moonrise towers, calls me a hero, asks to join my partyOkay? I guess? To be honest, I thought she was going to be angrier at me
>>3971960Did you not murder Isobel?
>>3971979Not personally - she died immediately after I killed the Nightsong, since that causes the Inn to lose its shield and shadows to invade it. Everyone turns into an undead except Jaheira.
>>3971991>Not personally - she died immediately after I killed the NightsongThat explains it, I guess that Larian assumed that people wouldn't skip quests.
>>3972002>I guess that Larian assumed that people wouldn't skip questsRAISING THE BAR FOR CRPGS
>>3972005>going full durge>Skipping IsobelPlease explain why.
>>3972007Because I could.
>>3972009That makes no sense though, it is one of the pivotal Durge moments.
>>3972026>it is one of the pivotal Durge momentsDurge is meant to be played as a lawful good paladin who resists the urge. Congratualtions, you failed.
>>3972026It makes complete sense because I do what I want.
>>3972029Then why did you kill the Nightsong? She's an annoying dyke but you're playing a lawful good Paladin.
>>3972032You're responding to at least two different anons. I only killed the wicked and evil.
>>3972033Based, I enjoyed my evil Durge run so much.
>>3971886She's the weakest gith. They all magically block attacks.
>>3972002Played a gith in my first run, jaheira threatened me and I killed everyone in inn before talking to isobel. Act 3 was barely functional in that playthrough.
>>3971742>focus groupFound the culprit. It's data driven management.
>>3952178>why is BG3 more successful than Divinity?BG3 is easier to play and it's cities are more digestible. You're also always doing something leading up to combat or directly in combat.Divinity Original: Sin 1 and 2 have more than a little downtime in every populated area you visit. Fort Joy. Despite the fact that BG3 has regressed in multiple ways in comparison to D:OS2, I can't deny that I like it's combat encounters (aesthetically) more.
>>3967328VIDEOGAMES
>>3972002>That explains it, I guess that Larian assumed that people wouldn't skip quests.I have no idea what quest I skipped, but my goblin butler told me to kill Isobel, so that's what I did.
>>3972386Jaheira should have turned hostile as soon as you attacked Isobel.
>>3972387I didn't attack Isobel. I killed the Nightsong, and Isobel died as a result. Dunno what Jaheira thought happened, but she acted like nothing happened afterwards.
>>3972389>but my goblin butler told me to kill Isobel, so that's what I did.
>>3972390Yeah? He appeared at the next long rest to congratulate me and gave me my slayer powers.
>>3972389>Dunno what Jaheira thought happened>>damn, you just can't find a good place to get a drink around here anymore
>>3953723I sure like how detractors of [current thing] are always nostalgia blinded retards whilst anyone that likes [current thing] is actually an impartial and fair judge of value.
>>3967328if an elf drinks your cum in divinity do they get to see your memories
>>3961678This would be a valid argument if CRPG """enthusiasts"""' of the RPGcodex vein had not spent 20 years bloviating about the wordcount in Planescape: Torment as proof of hack fraud Avellone's supposed genius.
>>3972904It's both about wordscount and wordsquality anon. Planescape was also helped by being an exploration of a genuinely good setting, whereas all these other games have basically done nothing similar.>FaerunSucks major balls, FR is a terrible setting outside of BG itself because of WotC hating anything to do with the greater setting, even then the setting isn't really that good.
>>3968609>>3968528>>3968492>>3968422>>3968395The owner of the house was literally aiding terrorists putting bombs inside stuffed animals for children, sorry chud, it's Lawful Good to side against such a retard.
>>3972937Faerun is very good at what it is meant to be, which is the archetype of a generic fantasy setting. It's also enjoyable in what it is, it's just important to keep its purpose in mind, like a well worn slop adventure or romance novel.Interestingly, Pathfinders setting feels more unique due to just how strange and bizarre some of the places in it are, while everything on and around Faerun is exactly what you would expect.
>>3972944>while everything on and around Faerun is exactly what you would expect50% of Tethyrians are now from Chultblack dwarvesblack halflingsblack gnomesblack surface elvesThanks, Larian and WotC, for this stunning diversity
>>3972944That's completely fair, it is good slop but when you're trying to make something that's quality it doesn't really compare or pair well, which sort of sucks that it's the default setting of any and all DnD products when there's tons of good options like Dark Sun. As for Pathfinder, I guess it helps that Golarion doesn't even try to make sense. It's a kitchen sink setting where everything happens (at the same time roughly) and everyone knows it's happening so no one is surprised at all when demons are coming in from the north or something. It's interesting yeah, meanwhile Faerun outside of the more space-esque stuff that's really just (and this is the main crime of FR) a cannibalization of planescape or spelljammer or dragonlance. It's mostly just sad it keeps eating all the unique parts of the setting and turning it into slop
>>3972956What's slop with faerun? Is there a quality setting according to you?
>>3972944>Faerun is exactly what you would expect.I expect white people and I am not getting enough of that
Are games like this about actual roleplaying (not every decision is optimal) or just trying to max your stats out to rape everything?
>>3973254>Are games like this about actual roleplaying (not every decision is optimal) or just trying to max your stats out to rape everything?For the fans of a game like BG3, approximately 1% are role players and 99% are min maxers
>>3973259Fans of BG3 are most casuals and normies who play for the romances, they're not minmaxing anything.
>>3973489>Fans of BG3 are most casuals and normies who play for the romancesCorrect.>they're not minmaxing anythingThey’re not roleplaying, which was my point. I’m sure the majority are following busted build guides from online with some abomination with a half dozen dips and cheesing the most broken things in the game, not that they’re developing their own optimized builds on their own.
>>3973138>what's slop>DMPCs up the ass>Nothing can ever or will every happen of significant consequences>Completely normal fantasy but doesn't incorporate cool gimmicks or interesting politics behind it like Dragonlance>At best three cities are ever explored or of interest>keeps eating every settingDark Sun is quality, it knows what it wants to be and plays to it extremely well. Planescape was formerly quality, Dragonlance is quality. Eberron is significantly more quality. It's more a problem that FR has been pushed more and more to just be an uninteresting default rather than anything innately wrong with Faerun and FR on principle (at first).
Durge in Act 3 feels kinda disappointing. I want to impress the tribunal by killing everybody on the list, but there's no good options to do it sneakily. I would have thought there'd have been some persuasion/deception checks to get each victim some place isolated, but as far as I can tell, you just have to quaff a potion of invisibility and kill them in a crowded place like a retard.
>>3973254>Are games like this about actual roleplaying (not every decision is optimal) or just trying to max your statsRPGs usually attempt cater to both crowds. It's up to you.
>>3974098>Stealthy cool kills in DnDWere you expecting something like Oblivion from two different groups that have the subtlety of screaming fire in a movie theater?
>>3974261I just expected a dialogue option to be able to lure them away from somewhere that isn't a busy tavern - especially the chef with his rat problem in the basement. "Hey, come look at what I found [DC 15]" or something like that.
>>3973254Depends on the player. This particular game is objectively on the upper end in terms of player freedom and expression for the genre.
>>3974404>This particular game is objectively on the upper end in terms of player freedom and expression for the genreIt's absolutely not. Go try to kill the Emperor when you meet him. Or try to ignore Shadowheart without recruiting her. Or kill the red dragon in act 1. Or go storm the Absolute's army encampment in act 2. I could go on. BG3 had more immersion-breaking moments of railroading where the game presents you a false choice of autonomy then prevents you from choosing the "wrong" option the devs didn't want to let you do, than almost any cRPG I can think of.
>>3974414Weird and dishonest when 99% of crpgs are heavily reliant on scripting for literally everything but combat encounters.
>>3974416>Weird and dishonestIt's weird and dishonest to pretend to give the player a choice, and then to ignore the result of the offered choice if it conflicts with the desired railroading, you illiterate dipshit. It's why "but thou must!" is a meme.
>>3974418The game is not intended to be a sandbox game and therefore would cease to function unless there were some instances of railroading, as must occur in all narrative games to varying extents. However, this does not change the fact that the game offers an unusually high degree of player freedom in gameplay and problem solving by the standards of the genre.
>>3974421I've seen these arguments dozens of times, and in response to criticism, the BG3 fanboy always resorts to a strawman such as:>The game is not intended to be a sandbox game and therefore would cease to function unless there were some instances of railroadingI listed four examples of incredibly stupid false choices where the game pretends to allow you freedom to do something and then forces you because you chose wrong.>kill the EmperorWhoops, DM gives you a game over.>ignore ShadowheartDM teleports her to you in a ridiculous cutscene. Sven even admitted they fucked up here and wrote themselves into a corner, and this was a failsafe to force the MacGuffin into the party.>storm the Absolute's army campDM teleports you away and forces you to say "I should have known better!">kill the dragonFlies away with DM plot armor. In DOS2, several similar situations (a creative player winning an unwinnable battle) were acknowledged and the player was rewarded with some interesting unique items. Here, nothing.If something must happen in a cutscene for the plot to function, so be it, but don't pretend to give the player a false choice and then ignore the player's choice. THAT'S the problem, that's what's stupid and immersion-breaking. Not some retarded strawman of "uhhhhhhh so you're saying you want to literally do anything and go anywhere? Well that would just be silly">the game offers an unusually high degree of player freedom in gameplay and problem solving by the standards of the genreIt absolutely does not. The only thing that BG3 excelled at was having great production values and a big budget for a cRPG and a very successful viral marketing campaign. The whole game is on rails and breaks easily if you start fucking around. These clowns advertised "17,000 ending permutations" and delivered a game with like three choices at the very end of the game, a la Deus Ex, and didn't even have fucking ending slides at launch. The reactivity is an illusion.
>>3952178i found the game to be mechanically extremely fun and it's the first game since Dark Souls where I felt compelled to do various self imposed challenge runs like solo honor modethe writing however felt really lame and the saving grace there was allowing me to murder everyone who was annoying for the most part
>>3974643>like solo honor modeWhat class did you do this on? I've failed three honour mode runs so far (with an actual party), and I think I'll only try it once more before I admit to myself that I'm not good enough at the game for HM.
Are we stilll thinking a role-playing game isn't reactive if it lets you do things 200 ways differently in-game with deliberately different responsive outcomes but has>muh 3 endings
>>3974670pure bladesinger, shadow blade is hilariously broken
>>3972541That's kinda based, unironically would want that in the setting.
>>3974671"But thou must!">Yes.>Okay, okay, alright already.>[PALADIN] By my oath, yes!>[BALDURIAN] Certainly, my lady.>[ELF] Me go do dat>[Dwarf] Aye, lass.Larian *claps* Raised *claps* The *claps* Bar!
