https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/tinto-maps-30-south-america-feedback.1856804/Hello, and welcome to another Tinto Maps Feedback post! Today, we will be reviewing the region of South America.For this one, we took our time reworking what we considered the single most important issue reported in the post feedback - the Mata Atlântica. It was very straightforward and clear feedback, as you wanted to have a redesign and addition of the locations of this area of Brazil, to portray its colonization process better. For that, we have added almost 200 new locations, redrawn a bunch of old ones, reworked the provinces, etc. We used a lot of the feedback provided to us in the thread, and we're glad about it. We really hope that this better adjust to the expectations that you, the players, and especially the Brazilian community, have for the game.Areas:
Countries: Renamed the following: Zipa to Muyquyta Zaque to Chunsua
SoPs: Not many changes here. But take into account one thing: We have scheduled a consistency review pass on the American SoPs after the feedback received in the Tinto Maps & Feedback for the three American regions. So any post or summary made in this thread indicating to us which feedback you consider the best might be of great value for us.
Locations: The deep rework of the Mata Atlântica Added the following:185 locations Renamed the following: Kaingang to Guarapuava Laklano to Mafra Xeta to Umuarama Paracatu to Pará-katu Chunsa to Chunsua
>>2129356brazilbros were so back
Provinces:Added 36
Climate:Topography:Vegetation:
Dangers:
Development: Harbors:
Cultures: Added the following: puri_culture
Languages: The first is Language Families, the second is Languages.
Religions: Renamed the following: Chiminigagua to Bozic Ie
Raw Materials:
Markets: And that's all for today! See you on Wednesday with another Tinto Talks about the Treaty of Tordesillas and the Great Pestilence, and Friday, with the Tinto Flavour for Portugal. Cheers!
>>2129356That faggot who claimed that the Mata Atlantica should be terra nullius because something something it was never settled until the 19th century, somehow, lost
This will not satiate the apezillians.
>>2129366chilebros our med climate blob has fallen...
Way better than what I expected.
have they said anything about the columbian exchange yet(apart from total native death)? Do natives get economic nerfs for not having draft animals like oxen and horses? Them not having cav is a given
>>2129343>janeiroWhy are they fine with using the made up straight lines states as areas in NA but here they use river basins even though most brazilian state borders are organic?
>>2129400I'm going to the forums to give them a piece of my mind. This isn't fucking over.
>>2129374how long till they add a dlc that lets you upgrade natural harbours?
>>2129454You already can improve the suitability of a harbor with buildings even if it has a poor natural suitability.
>>2129393Brazilians are one of the primary target audiences of the game, it was fairly obvious they will add stuff there to please them regardless if it makes sense or not
>>2129465>Brazilians are one of the primary target audiencesProof? Behind America I'm pretty sure their other focus is Europe and maybe courting the Chinese.
>>2129374What is the point of a gorillion 100 pop savage tribes
>>2129529lag
>>2129529So every player can experience their new genocide mechanics
>>2129396I'm an ape from Brazil and I can say without a doubt that I'm satiated. - Sent from my Coconut book pro
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrma0fa0COE>you can take 95% of portugal in the first waruhh
>>2129507euros dont send death threats when paradox gets history "wrong"
>>2129560Realistic if you run them downI always hated in Paradox games where you full occupy a country but only take a couple provinces from them.
>>2129562balkanoids:
>>2129569Got their jobs as violent thugs stolen by nafris
>>2129343The release trailer was disapointing and soulesshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nP59vpuEJx8I prefer EU4 trailerhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWAP0RNFOmcFeel like it captures the game
>>2129571>The release trailer was disapointing and souless>links a video that's not the release trailerWhat did he mean by this?
>>2129529To experience the catharsis of melting them into a mestizo mob that works in your gold mines.
>>2129560man the hegemony mechanic sounds fucking retarded, they better rework it
>>2129594They should just remove it, it has no place in a pre-victorian game. Johan is a fucking retard.
>>2129560This guy pauses every 5 seconds like his brain shut off, I bet you could edit this down to 10 minutes of actual speech
EU5 is gonna filter the fuck out of all the newfags who started with EU4.
>>2129616I started with 2 and I’m fucking hyped for 5. I have no strategy games to play besides Imperator.
>>2129560Antagonism really needs to be reworked, right now it's basically useless. Anyway, does he say how much control he was actually able to get in the Portuguese land and his other conquests? This guy blobs like crazy but he doesn't seem to interact with the internal mechanics that much so I wouldn't be surprised most of his land still had shit control.
>>2129732Bailiffs give 40 control regardless of proximity which makes the whole control mechanic kind of stupid. I hate magic buildings that add control when you build them, they just shouldn't exist. It was the same in MEIOU with regional capitals but at least those were a % buff and super expensive. Meanwhile Bailiffs just teleport a flat amount of control. If they must exist, it should be a local multiplier to control-increasing effects, not a flat bonus
>>2129732Ultimately the control on someone like Castille is meaningless at that stage, his own lands won't have max control at the edges so it doesn't really matter how high the control is in the conquered areas, they will eventually tick down as you get more upgrades done. You are more than strong enough with just castille starting lands already with few basic clicks at the start of the game to boost your own position. It's not like low control means that it's actively damaging you, it just means it's lower benefit than the maximum, add a few things that give control that you can slap down in few seconds and the land is at least semi productive very quickly.
it's going to suck, and that's a good thing.
>>2129743>It's not like low control means that it's actively damaging you, it just means it's lower benefit than the maximum, add a few things that give control that you can slap down in few seconds and the land is at least semi productive very quickly.I'm aware, it's just that he would be better off spending his money on improving his already existing lands than simply blobbing. I mainly wish that point was more prominent in the game design. Either through costlier wars or non-core low control provinces gaining independence in certain circumstances.>>2129739Damn, that sounds bad. I like your solution, though I would still be fine with a small flat bonus if it was mainly amplifying already existing effects.
>>2129759Yeah, something like +10 and +50% control factor or whatever you want to call it, that would be good. That way it scales based on how much other stuff you invested in. Rather than being a source of 40% control by itself. So if a local road would normally add 5% it now adds 7.5%, if you get 10% from proximity it's 15%, etc. This also means it's stronger in territories that already have decent control but not perfect. Like in a territory that already has 60% control it might still take you to 100%. You just can't build 40% control colonies on the moon anymore.
With the new population system, how bad will playing natives be?Surely losing most of your population to disease will be absolutely disastrous.
>>2129773Sounds pretty terrible to play natives but nex dev diary goes more into the pestilence that killed most of them so we have to wait a few days to know more
>>2129773Vic3 is more rudimentary than what has been shown so far and even in that game your nation would collapse if you lost a lot of people as pops are important to every system. I assume it will be even worse in EU5. I kind of wonder if natives having a hard time will also have a chance that they will lose people who simply leave and form their own tribes to get away from the bad stuff.
>>2129773why would you play as natives?
>>2129830We have a weird fetishistic obsession with our natives, please understand.
>>2129831>>2129830I don't get why you anons are fucking offended at someone wanting to play a particular type of nation in a video game.
>>2129830It's an interesting challenge, I like playing an underdog. They are also interesting societies in their own right, separated from the rest of the world and left to develop on their own they manage to have a certain mystique to them. The real question is why anyone wants to play in any part of subsaharan africa besides ethiopia?
>>2129842>offendedno? It's just that they've always been sort of there so that the player can interact with them while playing the relevant nations.
>>2129844I like Ghana / Akan in terms of style but there really isn't anything interesting to do in Africa.DESU its the same in the Americas.The issue is that Paradox wants to gie a focus to these nations, but they can't ever show European contact as something possibly benefitial if things change for both side.You can't play some Native American nation that converts to Christianity and gets papal support to holy war against the pagans. Despite that being something that would make sense historically if Spain had fumbled the arrival in the Americas.You can't continue the trade with the Portuguese to get guns from Europe, you have to Wakanda yourself into having all the tech instead of slowly building something different.
>>2129830I always play dwarves in other games and the Inca are:ManletsLike goldLive in the mountainsHave those mountains invaded by hordes of enemies who want to steal their gold So it feels like home to me.
>>2129850>but they can't ever show European contact as something possibly benefitial if things change for both side.Weren't most of the natives doomed to die the second they came in contact with a european or asian/african for that matter?
>>2129842I say what I do because I share the same affliction. I'll probably try them out at some point too. We all have red fever.
I'll play the ERE and Sicily. That's about it.
>>2129863The willing and the raped
I wonder if any groups will not wear clothes in EU5. Like maybe some tribes in the Americas and Sub-Saharan Africa.
>giant parana???
>>2129884Fucking coomers are coming for EU5
>>2129892Maybe it is because I am a pervert but it would be amusing to see how advanced and large of a country you can get while still having people who wear nothing or loincloths.
>>2129889Parana river anon
every random fucking town is in there but mineshan't be playing
>>2129903>my town got a location all to itself
>>2129382Tell me, what happens here?
>>2129616>a bunch of EU4fags blobbing to NEO ROMA sizes only to get shut down by regular poland-sized poland or britain-only england because they're a no-control paper tigerI doubt it'll actually happen, but I'd love to see it all the same.
>>2129906"peacekeeping"
>>2129616>EU5 is gonna filter the fuck out of all the newfags who started with EU4.Its mostly newer EU4fans desu, older ones have been wanting a game like EU5 for forever that did away with mana, development and focus trees. The biggest gripe ive seen EU4fags is the whole mission tree thing, they can't conceive of a country having content without one. Its not like its gone either, Paradox made it clear that modders can just make EU4 style mission trees if they want since the framework is there but that Paradox themselves won't be doing that.
>>2129915>that did away with developmentby development I mean as a replacement to population, not in general getting rid of development.
>>2129915>the framework is there but that Paradox themselves won't be doing thatI suppose this is what they'll do for HOI5 too to pacify its modders.
>>2129915>but that Paradox themselves won't be doing that.They will be doing that, it'll just be DLC. There's a reason Johan has repeatedly used language like "initially" or "for now" with referring to missions as tutorials. Pic related is how players actually feel about mission trees. The forums are an echo chamber of a tiny minority.
>>2129915Missions are great, it's the tree format that fucks them over. It was originally designed for HoI4 to play back historical events in a certain order in a very constrained time period. Whereas EU is more sandbox and takes place over a long period.Missions could be a convenient ingame way of viewing dynamic historical events and how to trigger them. Or a guide that teaches you about a nation's history and how to go down that path. Instead they're full of shit like "build more guys" "build a building" "get free stuff" because that's what HoI focus trees are (were?)
>>2129927There are a lot of possibilities for missions to act as enhanced event chains that can appear under certain circumstances. Imagine fulfilling certain conditions as Japan for instance with an ambitious ruler and unlocking missions for the Imjin War. Basically things that can help guide even players less knowledgeable about history in ways that happen historically (and realistically result from the conditions that unlock them). They can also be used to help guide interesting alternative scenarios such as giving a stabilized Muslim Iberia incentive to explore the World.
>>2129933Yep, missions can be great if they stop being a fucking treeI think vic3 has "journal entries" which are almost like this, but like the rest of that game it's half-baked
Having attachable missions helps DLC.Now they can sell alt history DLC paths multiple times per nation.Like, France had a tree and then a tree rework.Now they can sell "ally with Scotland missions" as a pack, then later more stuff for other scenarios like fully conquering Italy, having certain new world locations theh didn't get IRL, some revolution bullshit. Etc etc etc.
>>2129956It'll be more subtle, like being packaged in with a regional DLC to get people to buy DLC who otherwise wouldn't. Like for example, the Portuguese mission tree would exist in its base form in a dedicated Iberia DLC that only gives Iberian and token American mission content. If you want Angola, Goa, Macao or east Timor then each those will get mission trees bundled into their respective regions as minor content as a "bonus" if you buy the regional DLC.
I pre-ordered the premium edition. Someone berate me for the idiot that I am.
>>2129962Dont worry anon, you will be berating yourself soon enough
I wonder how easy it will be for them to add locations in future updates
>Happy Monday everyone! Whether you tuned into Gamescom or got the news from a friendly raven, we're beyond excited to finally get a release date out there for you. November 4th, 2025.>But what to do until then? Well that's where hopefully our video content can help sate your appetite for EU5.>Today we wanted to share what exactly our plans are for upcoming video content. Prior to game release, we have mainly have 3 pieces of content consisting of:>Story Videos>>A short and stylized video that takes a look at a cast of ambitious characters>Feature Videos>>A video recap of the mechanics that make EU5 shine! Starting off with our first topic, population.>Developer Diaries>>We'll give an overview of the same topics covered in our feature videos. Just with text and images rather than game footage. If you've been around for every single Tinto Talk you shouldn't expect anything groundbreaking here, but refreshers are always nice.>You might notice all this content is broader and more general audience compared to Tinto Talks, and that's because Tinto Talks is and will continue to be about your feedback first. Where as this is more us building awareness around the game, our vision and what it has to offer. Especially to those who might not have been as tuned in. We hope you still have some interesting bits and bobs regardless of where you're coming from though!>Our current release schedule up until Mid September can be found below:>Fear not, these posts do not affect nor slow down Development or Tinto Talks (Which will continue as scheduled).>We'll be sharing more in the weeks to come. Later down the road, we'll also be picking back up some of our in house videos like the community team made History of Europa (Situation showcase) series. Feel free to let us know what sort of content YOU would most like to see after release too!>Until Next time o7>- PDX Ryagi
>>2129986Magellan being in the game is great
HE PLAYED EU5https://youtu.be/T9gZKJpXxNw?si=A-yfzvfkBJCbJFeP
>>2130033>colonization is not worth itBased. Properly simulating how colonialism was a wealth extraction from European heartlands to the rest of the world.
>>2130035bringing in tonnes of gold and silver in europe was wealth extraction how??
>>2130150Worked out pretty shit for Spain in the end.
>>2130151It didn't work because Charles I and Philip II squandered it all in central european wars.
>>2129986https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KwoVtIaY80
>>2130168didn't really work out for france or the UK either.
>>2130188If I had to be born somewhere before the 1700s, I think East Asia would be the best place.
>>2130201>*spawns you in 1640s China*
>>2130190It worked out until it didn't.
>>2130206There are some periods that are worse than others in each place. Sengoku Japan for instance is quite hellish no matter who you are as samurai murdered everyone and each other.
>>2130033>he actually did edit it down and remove the pauses>it's less than half the lengthbased
I find it suspicious that the upcoming CK3 Asia DLC is also coming alongside a lot of other changes that seem to come straight from EU5. They were even doing diaries about the same places at the same time at one point. Hopefully they will do the same thing to Vic3 at some point.
>>2130249There was probably a technology update for Clauzewitz that they're all now making use of is why. Like CK3's landless characters and EU4s BBCs and ABCs are almost certainly the same thing architecture-wise for example.
>>2130249Personally I hope they port some China stuff from CK3 to EU5. It looks like the first time paradox actually researched China and set shit up properly, EU5 could really use some of that stuff to portray the Ming
>>2130255It does look interesting to try to ascend the ranks in China.
>>2130033Blobbing is no longer really punished because you don't lose admin if you do. Unlike previously where starting all this blobbing would have delayed Castille from exploration it doesn't anymore so the logical move is to always blob
Do you think my Ryzen 7 3700X will be able to at least get me 20 frames a second?
>>2129382Oh EU5 is going to have language mechanics? how will that work
>>2129915Mana was never the fucking problem mana is good, tying mana to tech progress was the retarded part
>>2130282This is the main problem. It was so stupid how doing stuff like stabilizing your country or blasting canons would make you unable to tech up. It made no sense that new technology could proliferate everywhere in your continent except your country simply because your ruler was less skilled.
>>2130280https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/developer-diary/tinto-talks-36-6th-of-november.1713610/
>>2129892That's what the character portraits are for Anon, they're trying to appeal to the anime girl/furry/scale/porn mod crowd from CK.
Ludi doesn't have access anymore to the early access lmao
>>2130325I've seen enough gossip in my life that I don't take people filling the holes seriously. Something being possible is not evidence for it happening.
>>2130325Just take early access away from all ccs and give it to me instead
>Cuyo on the Pacific CoastPDX will never understand how the Andes works as a frontier, aren't they?
>>2130363It is strange when there are ones nearby that aren't split like that. Why does that one area stretch across the mountains?
>>2130325>pic200% the gypsy is the one who posted this to stir drama
>>2130325Are there people who actually care about the content creators?
>>2130379just take a look at the comments there, shits wild, they are unironically saying he is a nazi
>>2130190It's pretty clear the French and British elite hate their fellow citizens.Why aren't they already hanging from their neck. Beats me.
>>2130380Buy an ad
>>2130393French "protest" and practice "liberty" so they feel like they are "making change". Britain is an island of normalfags who do nothing even if they want to.
>>2130379Yes.
>>2130411Hag sex.
>>2130380I wish people were only half as based as reddit makes them out to be
>>2130380for calling burgher loans jew loans, like how is this nazi?its just a ck2 meme
>>2130419its antisemitic, it wasn't fun already in ck2, grow up
>>2130422Calling that antisemitic is like saying it is antisemitic to say there are a lot of Jewish comedians. It is a job they've been known to work and is part of their heritage. For centuries in Europe they were one of the few groups that were not opposed to doing the job.
>>2130363Anon, literally who cares about the Andes, sudacas aside?
>>2130422I think everyone saying that a little antisemitism makes you a nazi should read up on what the Thule Society believed. It's both going to make a sane person less of a nazi and realize that a quip about jews lending money isn't on the same planet as nazi shit.
>>2130411Buy an ad, faggot
>>2130436They had the strongest, biggest and most interesting empire in all of the Americas. In the 17th century Peru was the most profitable province of the Americas.It also has a lot of pre and post colonial history
TheStudent made a new Greenland videohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLTIPt3fbNs
>>2130455So the new mission system is going to be similar to the early EU4 one, sounds very promising desu.
>>2130455Can this nigga stop talking about Greenland and focus on the important nations
>>2130465That's actually really great if it's a fusion between that and later mission trees. The problem with the older trees was that they were extremely generic.
>>2129907the tagline is "be ambitious" and youtubers say the ai blobs more in recent builds, lol if you paradox is going to do anything that upsets blobbabbies
>>2130210they made a lot of cash from the sugar islands but the uk's mainland colonies revolted the second the french threat was gone and france bankrupted itself ensuring that happened
>>2129884There's characters in CKIII that don't wear clothes. I think it's some Indian culture
>>2130522In Vic3 too. The Amazonian native and Nubian lower classes don't wear anything. They have golden fig leaves in it.
weren't mission trees supposed to be gone? Why don't they just go back to the EU3 method so you have some historical randomization?
>>2130588they seem to function like early eu4 missions/current diet agendas
When are we getting footage of this game?I'm tired of bald nerds explaining shit on a static images and writting numbers on it with paint.
>/vt/umor is retardedmany such cases
>>2130600We had it months agoNow they are only allowed to do after action shit for whatever reason
>>2130602I know, but it was only up to beggining of the XV century and I have already see most of it. I want more.>>2130601vtuber website
>>2129907It doesn't matter, people just want to form Rome, Germany, the US and be done with it. The moment they achieve that, the moment they stop playing the game. Do you really think they will play to the very end to the year 1837?
>>2130522There are also the Adamites.
>>2130440>greatest impact on world history is being conquered by the spanish>and then making the spanish a lot of moneyOh, and potatoes I suppose
>>2130470Hey man, if the guy likes to play as Greenland, let the man play as Greenland.
>>2130588I thought they're just being used for the tutorial now
>>2130647I'm pretty sure this is the case
>>2130470Greenland is a good edge case for testing the extremes of the mechanics. If you can manage to blob out of control as fucking greenland you can do it with literally anyone.
>>2129598F-Fuck you!
I hope there is something that guarantees that AI Greenland dies most games.
>>2130455>TheStudentThe student of what?
>>2130700All his videos approach EU4 (and subsequently EU5) very educationally. They are actually pretty good not only to find ludicrous things you can do in the game but also to learn more about the game in general as all of the techniques are based off of mechanics he explains.
>>2130700The student of the english language
>>2130681IRL they got genocide by a peaceful native American Inuit tribe. According to the map of north america on the fourms, they aren't considered even SOPs, so greenland will never have any threat in game. AI will be too dumb to cut off trade but that will only kill a percentage
It's going to be good, I don't care what doomers say.Swedes would have to be profoundly mentally damaged and/or suicidal to release a flagship game in a messy and broken state after spending this much time, effort and resources.
At worst mods will fix it
I want to see an observer timelapse and see how bad its going to be
>>2130795>Swedes would have to be profoundly mentally damaged They are.>to release a flagship game in a messy and broken state after spending this much time, effort and resources.Look at the past half dozen paradox releases.
>>2130808A lot of those failed releases are testing grounds for EU5 and they couldn't be making it more obvious. I like what I see, but I'm not surprised if it's a broken mess on release.
>>2130797The reason I'm so confident in EU5 is that the complaints are like 90% balance. That's going to be totally irrelevant for MEIOU 4.0
huge drama on the eu5 reddit
>>2130825Is it content creator shit?That shit is already pointless and we live in a time where people feel the need to make moral justification for not liking people.
>>2130829>Is it content creator shit?yes
The second I can play EU5 myself all those content creators will end up on my blocklist
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/developer-diary/tinto-talks-78-27th-of-august-2025.1857065/Hello, and welcome to another Tinto Talks, the happy Wednesdays where we talk about Europa Universalis V!Today, we will talk about two Situations that may happen in the Mid Game, related to the discovery of America by foreign powers: the Treaty of Tordesillas, and the Great Pestilence!Treaty of TordesillasThe Treaty of Tordesillas may be triggered after the Age of Discovery starts (so, later than 1437), when at least two Catholic countries with their capital in Europe hold any location or at least one subject each in America. We’re going to use as an example Castile having a colony in Hispaniola, and Portugal having a colony in Brazil. This is the event that will trigger the situation itself: The country that gets the event will have the option to decide where to have the meeting to discuss about the Treaty. The locations available are the capitals of the two countries, a bordering location, and an American one. The Treaty will take the name of the selected location:
This way, the Situation will start: A location will be set as a fixed point to divide the world, and from that onwards, each of the countries will have a ‘sphere of influence’ in which it will be able to Claim Areas. The area in which the initial colonies will be granted to each country, and from there on, they will be able to Claim Areas that are adjacent to those initial claims. If two colonies were present in the same area, then the ‘Claim a Conflicting Area’ would be available to both countries. You can also try to Revoke a Claim from the other country, but that requires to request it to the Pope. The Claims ban colonization by other Catholic countries, but you will still have to colonize those areas using the regular game mechanics.
Besides that, there are three more actions related to the Treaty Line. You can Shift the Line to a different location, or Exchange the Sides. When the Progress to Ratification of the Treaty is 100%, a new phase will start; you can use the ‘Push to Settle Treaty’ to speed it up.
When the new phase starts, the world will be divided between the two signatory powers, including both the already claimed areas, and their respective half of the world. New actions will also be available: In this phase of the Situation, other Catholic countries that have discovered America now will be able to participate in the situation, and will have some of these actions available to them, while others will be restricted to the two Signatory Countries: The Relevance of the Treaty decreases monthly, and then additionally by each time that it is violated. The Situation will end when its relevance goes down to 0%; at that moment, the ban on colonization and the claims will disappear, and all Catholic countries will be free to colonize wherever they want again.
>>2130912>The Claims ban colonization by other Catholic countriesprotty bois keep winning
Great PestilenceThe Great Pestilence is the Situation that portrays the numerous diseases brought by the European colonizers to America after 1492. As such, it will trigger after the first European colonies have been established in the New World:It will have two different set of actions, for Colonizing and Native countries:
>>2130912>The Claims ban colonization by other Catholic countrieSpain really is going to be stupidly OP in this game.
The disease will spread throughout the Native population, pretty much as you saw with the Black Death, but in a much faster and deadlier way - up to 90% of the native population, potentially:
Random events will also pop up, both for colonizing and native countries:And that’s all for today! We will come back on Friday, as we will talk in Tinto Flavour about Portugal! And next week in Tinto Talks, we’ll take a look at another Mid and Late Game Situations: the Columbian Exchange, and the Colonial Revolution.And also remember, you can Pre-Purchase Europa Universalis V now! Cheers!
>>2130924>Injun kill count Oh yeah
>>2130912>The Claims ban colonization by other Catholic countriesbullshit
>start as castile>let portugal colonize to start the treaty>pu and annex them and get claims to the entire world for yourselfyep its gaming time
>>2130959Wait a minute...
All this shit is worthless because the AI is braindead
>>2130989That's the beautiful part. You can just play as Greenland and build your economy if you don't like it.
>>2130989From my playtesting it is actually pretty good
>>2130998Is it possible to lose? If not - it's shit
>>2131007I've heard that exact line from chronically wrong video game company execs in the 80s. You're 2 steps away from declaring that video games need lives and that a game you can't complete is pointless.
>>2131007Yes it is very hard to win
It is over Forumfags have already ruined professional armies
>>2131031screenshot it
>>2131031In what way?
>>2130912>The Claims ban colonization by other Catholic countries,oh no no no no>>2130918>The Relevance of the Treaty decreases monthly, and then additionally by each time that it is violated. The Situation will end when its relevance goes down to 0%; at that moment, the ban on colonization and the claims will disappear, and all Catholic countries will be free to colonize wherever they want again.Oh never mind I guess that's alright.
>>2131062I dont think it stops all colonisation anyway. For example on the map, all colonisable land is hashed blue or yellow, but Hispaniola is even more yellow. So I think the claim in this case might only apply to Hispaniola, and France is maybe still free to colonise Canada
>>2130912>The Claims ban colonization by other Catholic countriesSpaniards ROCKED Frenchers SHOCKED
>>2131032>>2131052They bitched about it being OP and Johan said it has already been tweaked. To what extent is currently unknown but a lot of them were suggesting that they should be just as strong as unprofessional armies. Hopefully professional armies still have an edge.
>Genocide and Slavery simulator 2025>rated 12 for bad languageIs the new scornful insult popup going to come with a sound effect of Johan telling you to go fuck yourself? What bad language would that be?
>>2131126I think it's genuinely might be the scornful insults lmao
>>2131126There's slave pops in this game?
>>2131126>a sound effect of Johan telling you to go fuck yourselfthat's my humiliation kink
>>2131143Yes I'm pretty sure you can also expel minorities
>>2131143https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/developer-diary/tinto-talks-34-23rd-of-october-2024.1711421/>The second category of buildings are the plantations. These are buildings that you can unlock from Age of Discovery advances. There are three types of plantations, for sugar, tobacco and cotton. These are far more productive than the RGO for the same goods, but require slaves to function.Slaves are both pops and a trade good
>>2131171Wonder if we'll be able to play as a bbc fueled by bbc
>>2130455>in my first game as Greenland, it took me like 80 to 90 months to discover the Canadian coast>that takes 10 gold per month to finance, so around 900 or 800 ducats to discover Canada as Greenland>right now in the current version, it would have taken me 300 months to discover the closest Canadian coastline>30,000 gold of investment for discovering the new world.They should give Greenland a bonus to discovering the new world, they're so close and have already been there before. The only limiters should be their population and the Little Ice age situation wiping you out
I wonder if they have a mechanic for (very) low ppopulation states to simply disband (at least AI-Controlled ones)A greenland which has had its pop drop to like, 5 people, shouldn't count as a country anymore and should disband.
>>2131200I don't know if they do, but they should, even if that's a complete edge case
>>2131205I don't think its too unrealistic for isolated, small states to doom-spiral. After all the historical Greenland "country" (whatever precise form of government they actually had) disappeared into nothingness.
>>2131205Not really. I can see it happening in the New World as it's depopulated by European diseases.
>>2130924>up to 90% of the native populationTawantinsuyu-bros, it is over.
>>2131196I saw someone suggest migration which seems like a good option too. A decision that allows you to move your entire country to the Americas would be nice. Maybe you'd even lose maps of Europe if that is mechanically possible.
>>2131200It should be 150, according to the Dunbar's Number. Anything below that would be just a big family at best, a dysfunctional mess at worst.
>>2131143Yes, the triangle trade is apparently very important if you want to actually make money as a colonial nation too
>>2129382Mapudungan/Mapuche wasn't spoken outside of Chile until 1600s-1700s because all the actual natives there died of smallpox/got absorbed into the Mapuche tribes, nice error there
>>2131206>After all the historical Greenland "country" (whatever precise form of government they actually had) disappeared into nothingnessYou mean Viking Greenland, right? Injun Greenland still remains alive to this day.
>>2130212Name one other time in Japan you go from carrying a dude's shoes to total ruler of the country
>>2131248100 000 BC
>>2131244Weren't the vikings already dead by the time inuits dropped by? So there's zero continuity, even by conquest.
>>2131299
>>2131305The official narrative is that there was no civilization back then. But we all know they are lying.
>>2131305the earth is only 7000 years oldtry harder
>>2131315You don't have to be civilized to slap some leather or plants around your feet. Fits right into hunter gatherer way of life as well.
>>2131339People started wearing clothes to begin with because they got tired of branches repeatedly slapping them in the crotch while running through forests.
>>2131304No, the Thule (Skrælings) actually BTFO the Vikings out of the island. All of this is well documented by the Greenland Sagas and archeological records.
>>2131354Everyone hypes up Vikings reaching the New World. But what about Inuits reaching the Old World?
>>2131373Greenland is part of North America though.
>>2131396I never said it wasn't
>>2131196I know iceland had one of their idea-equivalents give a slight bonus to early game exploration, to much seethe in the forums.No clue which dev diary it was mentioned in though.
they've really dialed in the map it looks great, now all they need to do is fix the mobile game tier UI
>>2131489UI is fine.
>>2131489It looks like some graphic from an educational show in motion. Up close it may be a bit cartoony but from far out it looks super realistic.
>>2131495It's weird how from far away it looks awesome and super detailed but you zoom all the way in and Civ 5 looks better. Something about the terrain textures or the map props, I can't tell
>>2131499The buildings over the color mask are absolutely revolting to my eye. I think it would be beautiful without those.
The Great Pestilence sounds horrible :(
>>2130924Gonna be interested in seeing how you can survive this and still be relevant. I'll try Inca because of mountain forts.
>>2131506We need to go back in time and edge the natives into immunity!
>>2131494Compare the UI with eu4 or ck2 and tell me it's fine
>high end cpu required >32 gb ram >3060tiWhat the FUCK
>>2131543>I7>16 gb>Iris XEI'm still going to play it on day one
>>2131543don't question it, just consume
>>2129773You'll get maintenance free event armies that ignore pop requirements. Or high pop growth. or something.>>2129850>but they can't ever show European contact as something possibly benefitial if things change for both side.>You can't play some Native American nation that converts to Christianity and gets papal support to holy war against the pagans. Despite that being something that would make sense historically if Spain had fumbled the arrival in the Americas.If we went on a historic basis, shouldn't that be how contact with Spain works?>play aztec minor>don't usurp the aztecs>spanish show up>swear fealty>coalition war versus aztecs>win>all are now spanish vassals>highest opinion with spain annexes the rest>your religion: Catholic>your tag: New Spain>receive pops from Spain>become Mexican>colonise the entirety of the US>say hi to the Yaqui>declare independence>start a war with Texas>export save file for Victoria 3
>>2131489>they've really dialed in the map it looks greatWhat kind of CPU and AI enabled GPU do I need to maintain a cinematic 22fps and for 5x speed to at least run at 1x speed after a hundred years have passed?
>>2131590They really should let you continue playing as the higher level subject in cases like this with achievements still enabled. Maybe as the new colonial nation you could eventually return to your native roots. I'm sure there are other parts of the world where this would work well too.
>>2131590>to this day, the Tlaxcalans are reminded by other states that they were the first traitors
>>2131373The Inuits came from the old world, they migrated from northeast Siberia into North America in the 11th century (so funnily enough the Norse are more native to Greenland than the Inuit are)They're probably the people who introduced the bow and arrow to North America.
>>2131658Literally no one cares about Tlaxcala nowadays, the state is so irrelevant that the stereotype around it is that it doesn't exist rather than it being full of traitors.
>>2131354iirc the norse fucked off because of the climate not being suitable for their lifestyles and the colony not being profitable enough, the clashes with the thule people were only one part of the problem
>>2131658Traitors to whom? Because I am sure as hell there was not so much love between Tlaxcalans and Aztecs.
>>2131590Ironically the closest thing to that were the Metis, where they some "semi-civilized" status and even some of them were recognized as honorary Frenchmen and were, more or less, in friendly terms with France as a whole. But then, the Hudson Bay Company bought the rights for the Hudson Bay basin and the Metis had difficulties to settle in those lands, and then France lost Canada to Britain, thing that basically fucked any chance of them being relevant.
>>2131541>Compare the UI with eu4 and tell me it's fineIt is.
>>2131502Thankfully that seems like the type of shit that will be piss easy to mod out, even if I'd rather it isn't there in the first place.
>>2131543You know what's the funniest thing about the rediculous graphical requirements? It's because their incompetent developers are incapable of rendering the UI and the game at different resolutions. You want to run the game at 4k so you actually have enough screen space for all the menus? Sorry, that means we're going to spend 100% of your GPU rendering our detailed playdough ass map you won't look at once lmao
>>2131702It's genuinely baffling how much time and effort goes into the terrain map because I think not even 5% of the players use it. The default should be a basic ass political flat map (e.g. Vicky II)
>>2131658they weren't even the first to support the spanish and they didn't 'betray' the aztecs
>>2131702>rediculous graphical requirements>3060 for 4K
>>2131704Anon the vast majority of players use the fused political/terrain map.You are like that autist lambart complaining that they changed WASD into something that moves the map rather than changes map modes.
>>2131747>the vast majority of players use the fused political/terrain map.Yes because there is no other choiceWhat is that supposed to prove?
>>2131704>The default should be a basic ass political flat map (e.g. Vicky II)VII's default map has terrain on it though
>>2131686Im pretty sure the aztecs used them as cattle, literally. Captured, sacrificed and ate them in the flower wars.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oh2ti9ofEVg Europa Universalis V - Feature Video: Population & The Living World
>>2131837some of you nerds can tell what country this is by the screenshot alone
>>2131849it's not like Hungary is some obscure country
>>2131849Nigga don't act as if Hungarian national contours are difficult to discern
>>2131849It is Hungary shaped
Will this game be good bros?
>>2131849Identifying countries by their silhouette is not a difficult task most of the time.
>>2131864I just see the outline of my side profile?
>>2131864Reading filenames is not hard for most
>>2131863They are letting quite a lot of people playing the alpha version with many detailed videos about the gameplay even now, so I guess it will be playable at least
So tired of having to watch all these e-celeb trash but I'm also so fucking desperate for crumbs of information.
>>213187780% of what they say is probably a lie anyway
>>2131873I'm getting minor hints of access journalism but to me everything points towards a competent game coming out. I'd wager it's 3 leagues better than EU4 at launch.
>>2131837switzerland my beloved...
>*crashes your game*
How hard would it be to mod back in the genocide natives button from EU4?
>>2131887There are much more complex mechanics to do this now so I don't think it is necessary. Now you'll even be able to capture them and sell them or deliberately infect them with disease.
>>2131886>>2131888I swear by this logic something like Japan should be split up by family and many countries should be split up by accent. I highly doubt this many abos had unique cultures.
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/developer-diary-1-population-and-living-world.1857075/Welcome to the first development diary for Europa Universalis V! That's right, Developer Diary! On the not so super secret game Europa Universalis V.This time hosted by the community team, represented by myself PDX Ryagi. We'll be going over some broad topics, for deeper details and design philosophy we'd highly encourage you take a peak back at our Tinto Talks series. A handy megathread can be found here. But without further ado lets get talking about quite possibly the heart of EU5, Pops:EU5 is the fifth edition of a franchise that spans over three decades of development, but this time, we’re introducing what can be considered a revolutionary approach to world simulation and population management, moving beyond the abstract numbers of its predecessors to try and create a truly "living world.”Spanning the centuries from 1337 to 1837, we hope to immerse players in a historically rich and dynamic world where every decision has tangible consequences for both its inhabitants and the environment itself. The heart of EU5's living world is its "pops" system, which aims to simulate every single living individual that existed in 1337 at a granular level. Unlike previous version of the game, where population was a more generalized statistic, EU5 portrays individual working people, each with their own needs, wants, and roles within a nation.Population Map mode of Hungary at the start of the game (1337)These pops are the lifeblood of a nation; without them, buildings shut down, manpower is nonexistent, and colonies fail to populate. Managing your population effectively is a top priority, as they require feeding, work fields and industries, armies and navies to defend and expand, and even ready wealth for taxation and investment.Burghers in Pest 1337
Each pop has an assigned culture and religious beliefs, leading to diverse populations in almost every location—with hundreds of religions and thousands of cultures in play, it's rare to have a completely homogeneous demographic split. Culture and religion are not merely cosmetic; they directly impact different game systems, such as cultural prestige, available advances, different mechanical behaviors, and the literacy of the population.For example, a single social class, such as peasants, inhabiting a single location in Iberia, can be made up of various cultural and religious groups like Catalan Catholics, Andalusi Sunnis, and Sephardic Jews. Players must decide how to balance the wants and needs of their diverse population while navigating the friction that political, cultural, and religious differences can cause.Demographics of Diverse Spanish province - 1337Speaking of social class, these are categories in which the population is split, making it possible to promote and demote pops based on available jobs and demand. Different buildings employ different types of pops: Where burghers and laborers primarily produce goods for the economy, nobles and soldiers provide the defence, and clergy provide literacy. But their attributes matter as well—for example, a more literate clergy will also be better at converting other pops.Promotions in Paris Mid gameThe pops system makes EU5 feel more like a world simulator, where every choice shapes a nation's social fabric.The dynamic nature of pops extends to their needs and their responses to player policies. Pops require essentials like food, clothing, and luxuries, which are integrated into EU5's reworked trade system, about which we’ll talk in detail in a future Dev Diary.Pop needs in France mid game
>>2131898Doesn't Japan have that whole silly Kyushu/Saigoku/Togoku/Tohoku crap?
With surplus food and general prosperity, populations will grow, and pops can even be promoted to higher classes, if the necessary jobs are available. Conversely, food shortages due to war or poor harvests can lead to starvation, shrinking both your workforce and military potential. Natural disasters and diseases, such as volcanoes or smallpox, can devastate populations, especially in densely packed cities, forcing players to balance population management with economic growth.The fertile soil of naples does not come from nowwhere… The Dangers Map Mode will help you navigate especially active seismic regions. Neglecting pops risks inciting rebellion, while satisfying their needs boosts productivity. Happy burghers lead to thriving trade, and content peasants result in higher food production. Beyond individual pops, EU5's living world thrives on dynamic interactions and historical events. Important historical occurrences like the Black Death or the Reformation trigger "Situations" with unique mechanics. For example, the bubonic plague might specifically decimate urban pops, forcing players to quarantine cities or lose trade income.A world before the plagueA world devastated by the plagueKeep in mind the Plague is a dynamic, following trade and crossing borders. Different playthroughs will yield different results and levels of pop loss! We also have game rules allowing you to randomize it's spawn date, spawn location, or turn it off entirely if you so wish.Events will have impact beyond just flavor: Losing pops directly influences your gameplay by weakening your economy and military.
Pops are integral to EU5’s estate system. The nobles, clergy, burghers, and commoners all have their own ambitions and privileges. Granting these privileges will often influence multiple estates at the same time. For example, granting serfdom rights to nobles might oppress peasant pops, reducing their happiness while boosting nobles' loyalty. Conversely, freeing commoners could spark economic growth, but also anger elites.Mobility of the commoners is sure to make peasants happy. But think of the poor poor nobles...EU5 tracks pop literacy and wealth through the game, influencing technological progress and trade efficiency. Advanced nations like Venice will benefit more from having literate pops to stimulate innovation, whereas nations with lower literacy will have a harder path towards reform. Cultural and religious diversity add another layer of depth. Promoting a state religion might help to unify pops, but will certainly alienate minorities, exposing you to unrest and potential revolts. While assimilation is possible, it is a slow and costly process—you’ll need to spend precious resources like diplomatic finesse or military strength to ensure its success. This intricate system ensures that every nation feels unique. After all, ruling the cosmopolitan Ottomans should be vastly different from managing the more culturally homogeneous Ashikaga Shogunate.Cultural Breakdown of Japan mid gameCultural Breakdown of Ottomans mid game
The world map in EU5 is Paradox's most ambitious to date, meticulously crafted from historical sources and reaching from 1337 to 1837 and featuring over a thousand playable nations. For example, the Holy Roman Empire is depicted as a myriad of tiny states, each with distinct pops and borders, with some locations and nations as small as single cities.To make this granularity possible, the map is split into approximately 30,000 detailed locations, which serve as the base building blocks of this world. These locations can be anything from rural hubs focused on food production, to sprawling urban centers. Beyond the settlements themselves, geographic features play a crucial role in gameplay. Each location is defined by its climate, vegetation, and topology. These three elements directly impact strategic decisions; for example, cavalry will dominate the flat plains, while infantry excel in hills. The map's visual splendor enhances immersion, with seasonal changes like snow-covered alps in winter and lush Indian plains in monsoon. These changes are not just visual; they provide tangible game effects, such as blocking army movement or disrupting production. Rivers and straits act as strategic chokepoints, vital for trade and defense, as exemplified by the Bosphorus when the Ottomans sought to secure trade routes.
Navigation of the world map is facilitated by an updated and advanced mapmode system. With over 70 different map layers, players can adapt their view of the world to zero in on whatever specific information they need. This includes familiar political map modes outlining national borders, as well as map modes for geographical and topographical changes, raw goods (RGOs), markets, and more.Climate Map modeRaw Materials Map mode (These are your "RGOs")Topography Map ModeAll these map modes are organized into a new UI dock, complete with a search function and the ability to set advanced hotkeys.
Start date population mapmode, 1337A screenshot of the same population made mode from a game in 1770Whether players choose to let their population starve while burning enemy farms, allow varied cultures to flourish, become an industrial powerhouse, or maintain traditional feudal values, their choices will have profound impacts on their pops' food, health, security, and even their willingness to fight for or against them. A War Ravished locationAfter the location has recoveredIn conclusion, we believe that the ambitious simulation of every single living individual from 1337, coupled with the vast and detailed map, is what truly sets EU5 apart, making it a deep and immersive grand strategy experience.The detailed pops system, with its cultural and religious depth, transforms every province into a microcosm of society, responding to every decision by the player. From the fractured Holy Roman Empire to the sprawling Yuán Dynasty, EU5's world feels alive and offers endless adventure, where players must constantly adapt and make choices to determine the fate of their nation and its people…at least, until the next game starts.That's all for today! Don't Forget you can Pre-Purchase Europa Universals V now.
>dev diary 1this is so weird
>>2131126>In-Game purchasesPay to win mana loot boxes confirmed
>>2131837When will we get a game where more pops isn't always more better and adding pops can actually make things worse?
>>2131911>improper use of it'sIt's over.
>>2131936Its over.
Leaked build where , sirs?
>>2131943The Russian site where you get dlcs
>>2131888Gubbi-Gubbibros..we're so back
>>2131926Seems like disease should be an easy way to prevent people from sitting on max pop locations if they made it right. If they made pops increasingly needy as they approach pop limit it would make sense too
>>2131915>When I look at this re-emerging Byzantine Empire, it warms my heart. Unfortunately, there is no mention of how long it took to reach this stage.That particular screenshot is from 1770! Though keep in mind different playthroughs will be different and everything is still WIP so not a perfect accurate representation of release version or your experiences. Lot of factors at play.>Can wee see cultural and religious map of Europe of that 1770 save? I'd like to see how many minorities still exist at that time.Remember all from a WIP (Already outdated) build :D
>>2132000That looks pretty bad. What's the point of having pops if the whole game is just gonna be magically converting everyone to your culture?
>>2132000Greek wank
>>2132000This is very strong anti-turk racism and i will not stand it.
>>2132000and yet another reason why 1337 was a shit choice
>>2132000>1770>granada still exist>protestant portugal>no prots in germany>orthodox naples>muslims in italyLMAO
>>2132000>>2132009Another issue is that half of these shouldn't even need or warrant converting in the first place. Why would Naples try to "convert" Mediano? Or the Silesians the Czechs in Bohemia proper? You shouldn't culture convert in your culture group at all imo aside from some edge cases like Castilian removing Andalusian. In general, this game has far too big a focus on culture for the early modern period as well but that's a secondary problem.
>>2132012I used to defend it but not anymore. They didn't even do anything interesting with the alt history 1337 allows. I'm pretty sure they picked it SOLELY because of byzaboos.
>>2132017You overestimate the number of byzaboos outside the forumt. moderate byzaboo
>>2132012There will be a 1444 mod don't worry
>>2131968I wish you were right
>>2132015The think the idea is to have a dominant culture within your group so you can model the normalisation as elite culture process that historically happened in the early modern period and give people some ability to play with it (e.g Norman iso Ile de France as the dominant culture in France). I think the culture penalties for non-primary cultures in your group are small and manageable so should be ok.That said some of these are dumb (wtf is Angevin culture supposed to be? The accent?)
>>2132000>Prussian Azovvggghhhhh hooooly
>>2132000And the AI is incompetent, what a shocker. Looks like I'm gonna have to mod the game to buff historical countries and have them focus on consolidating their region to avoid this ugly border gore.
>>2131871>if only you knew how bad things really are
>>2131968ha nice try, unfortunately, i check every day
>>2132000>late 1700s>Spain isn't unified>France isn't unified>Britain isn't unified>ENGLAND isn't unified>protestantism barely exists>muslims in Italyoh lawd it's horribleno wonder they refuse to show the political map of this game lmao
>>2132000>entire player country is one homogeneous blobYep, it's over
>>2132079I'll just not do it
can you change your primary culture in EU5? I want to make a trve turkish byzantium
>>2132079Seriously, what's the point of adding 40 different Mbugu cultures if they're all just going to end up blurple anyway
>>2132069I feel like something has to be up with this specific campaign Maybe the Byzantium was messing with every other nation
>>2132000>steppe is now mongol
>>2132091Cool alternative history scenario
>>2132097Only if it's because the actual mongols reformed an empire and not something dumb like the Golden Horde starts with Mongol primary culture
>>2132103Golden Horde starts out as Mongol
>>2132105That's retarded
>>2132043I know that's what they have the cultural unification decisions for which work well imo. But cultural conversion as an active process by the state otherwise rather than mass adoption through achieving cultural supremacy should never be done within your own culture group and arguably would be rare in general.
>2 months to release>No footage of the game past 1420>We don't know the size of the game in Gb>We don't even know the achievementsIt's over
>>2132129>No footage of the game past 1420Starting to see the reason why too
>>2132129It's 20gb
>>2132135Bloatware...
>>2132105Starts as primary culture Mongol, but only ~5% of the pops are mongolThe mongol culture splatter in >>2132000 is kazani, astrakhani and nogai culture in 1337
>>213212995% of games will end after 100 years tbqhmost players will make it to 1600 once in their entire life
>>2132135Source?
>>2132144Honestly I regularly make it to the late 1700s in EU4 if I'm going for a long achievement or doing some RP.
>>2132000>tunisians taking over Italy>granada still there>mongols in ukraineYikes, it looks like total ass.
>>2132163People posting here aren't the majority
>>2132144Ive only witnessed 1600 in 2 of my eu4 gamesi only play meiou
>>2132172How do you stop that early?
>>2132000What a fucking disaster, EU3 tier culture map. >>2132012A later start date wouldn't fix most of these. Only difference is that the balkans and anatolia would be 90% turkish and muslim instead of greek.
>>2132172Why do you play shit mods?
>>2132184name one good mod without dev mana
>>2131171>with leather, paper, some hammering and a sword, 0.5 slaves are turned into 2 slaves!?Why is an Indian market building employing Anglos?
>>2132205The input slaves are slaves that work at the slave market, the other slaves come from the monthly enslavement aka consuming pops to make them slaves
>>2131886>>2131888>look up the different countries>404, no history foundLet me guess, you colonise it by conquering provinces and then growing the abbo pop to work in your fields and mines without any immigration whatsoever? That EU4 update was retarded abbo worship, I wish Paradox had to kiss their descendants' toes.
>>2132000what the actual fuck happened in the steppe?
>>2132216>Marseille&Siena Sunni>Sardinia&Sicily Sunni>Granada still trucking on>Prussian CrimeaInshallah.
>>2132213>consuming pops to make them slavesHow did people become slaves back then?All I thought of it was that African tribes gained them through war, if you could consider it to be equivalent to European or Chinese wars of the time, and then markets were places the product was taken to, not created at, like how you don't grow wheat in a market town.I dunno how Indian, Korean or Roman slaving worked, or really any slaving from every country on the planet. I don't even understand how indentured servitude worked which I assume is not in EU5 because it wasn't in EU4 and plantations I assume are solely (Afro) slave labour.
>>2132000>Prussian CrimeAzov-sisters, we won.
>>2132222People were sold to slavery all the time to pay debts.
>>2131886>>2131888how many cultures do Italy, France or the Balkans have then? 6 gorillions?
>>21322403French (Sunni), Breton (Atheist) and Bosniak (Shia).
>>2132245Europe
>>2132240Im Italian and I think the 6 or 8 italian cultures they completely made up are way too many. Northern/southern/sardinian/sicilian are enough.
>>2132255>Im Italianmy condolences
>>2132255Public school?
>>2132255But if we are going by the logic they use on the abos that is way to little. Every Italian city should have a unique culture.
>>2132268It's not really their logic, it's (((modern academic))) logic. Italian is a single language, but Papua New Guinea has 500 separate language families, just trust the scientific progress.
>>2132269>Italian isAnd to think that all European languages weren't codified properly until the last couple hundred years
>>2132269>Italian is a single languageIt's a single language NOW. It was not even 150 years ago
>>2132218>Marseille&Siena SunniThis is the thing that bothers me the most . The player and definitely the AI should not be able to get little footholds like that overseas surrounded by hostile states except in certain situations like Gibraltar. If you send your army abroad you should get insta invaded by neighbours to punish you
>>2131886One province culture groups is such a retarded conceptThe entire point of cultures in games like these are to link multiple provinces together with some kind of shared trait
>>2132222It'd be weird if indentured servants weren't in EU5, it was a pretty important source of population for new world colonies. Though since individual pop wealth isn't tracked it'd probably be represented like a law that adds colonial migration
>>2132269Italian is a single language because somebody compiled a bunch of words and said "this is italian". when you don't have writing and you live in isolated primitive bands that's what you get, cross over a hill and everyone speaks a different language.
Witnessing someone learn how languages and cultures homogenize is a wild experience.
I seriously don't get why people are complaining about the development of the game so far. PDX has been incredibly open and earnest in their adjustments to various aspects of the game and still remains in continuous dialogue with forum users. It's useless to bother trying to impress everyone though I do think there are some things that need to be adjusted still;>Ruler portraits look only slightly better than ruler icons and models from Civ 6 yet worse than CK3I'm not too worried about this since its a feature that's carried over from Stellaris and can be cleaned up easily.>AI balancing.This will probably be the focus of the closing months of the development cycle.>GraphicsThey look fine enough, but some aspects feel only slightly better or slightly worse than what we had in Imperator.>OptimizationThis is going to be the make or break point for this game.I don't expect PDX to be lazy with EU5 since this is going to be their flagship for years to come, but this also means that the game can flounder if not enough people make the work profitable.
>>2132285I think the portraits actually look better than CK3 in some ways. Everyone should be glad they didn't go the direction of Vic3 with portraits though. The amount of children I've seen with grey hair and receding hairlines...
>>2132285>Optimization>This is going to be the make or break point for this game.Have you looked at the recommended specs for the game?They are asking for a high-tier CPU from 2023.This game requires a better PC than Battlefield 6.
>>2132291That's why I'm saying this. Optimization (as a meme) usually tells how lazy a developer's work is due to it being backloaded onto the consumer's hardware. My machine is more than capable, but I know that it shouldn't have to be for a map game. I am hoping that this is the aspect that improves the most over the coming years. I know they did with CK3 as it loads smoothly even with total conversion mods.
>>2132291That is for the 4k settings though. Most people don't have monitors the size of their wall and don't need to use that.
>>2132277>cross over a hill and everyone speaks a different language.Have you ever traveled before? This is true everywhere, even in modern day Europe. Speech can vary greatly from village to village, and some may not even be mutually intelligible. We still call those "dialects".The difference is because modern linguistics are dominated by a kind of person we call splitter. Look it up.This is all pointless anyway, whether you believe them to be real languages or not making each individual Aboriginal tribe a separate culture is just stupid from a gameplay perspective.
>>2132285It's because they are shielding themselves from disappointment by being disappointed in advance. It's genuinely a skill issue and I've started to get tired of pretending it's not. The amount of disappointment remains the same whether you're incredibly hopeful or incredibly pessimistic.
>>2132294I don't think the CPU will have a lot to do with the graphic setting
>>2132285>OptimizationHonesty, I wouldn't worry to much. Generalist has said that his pc is barely above the minimum requirements, and he don't feel any slowdown until the 1600s if I remember correctly (that would be over 260 yeas into the game). Every content creator has stated the performance of the current build is much better then the one they had a few months ago, and paradox still have two more months of possible optimization. My biggest fear is that the great divergence aren't properly models and thus don't really happen and places like east Asia and India is much better then Europe due to their enormous population and population > everything else. >>2132291Isn't the recommend specs based around playing the game in 4k60fps? I remember when I used to play paradox games on my old shitty lap it really help with performance by playing on low resolutions, so I would guess you would gain a lot of performance by just not playing the game in 4k.
>>2132284China has been 99.9% pure ethnic Han for thousands of years you muttoid
>>2132306Han is a mutt race
>>2132295>modern linguistics are dominated by a kind of person we call splitterTo be fair it doesn't help that the lumpers wrecked themselves in the last few decades with shit like Altaic which impacted credibility elsewhere where it would have been better used. Part of it was Cold War nonsense too i.e. the Russkies are lumpers so all good American linguists are splitters and the US won.
>>2131888>>2131886I did a little cursory indroduction to the topic, and it seems like they are going with the idea that tribe = culture. In my view, this means there's around 10x the cultures compared to a reasonable division. That 10x is clearly less in some areas, and more in other areas.
>>2132017They picked it for the Angloids. They wanted them to larp as the Angevin Empire in its full glory.
>>2132319It's not. If they went every "tribe" it'd look like this. What they actually did is take every possible language split of the Pama–Nyungan language family to the max and used that as the cultures. It's why the north is so heavily balkanised while Western Australia is just one.
>>2132305>I remember when I used to play paradox games on my old shitty lap it really help with performance by playing on low resolutionsLol, you wish. The game's interface only works at 1080p and they already admitted that if you try using their highly-touted UI scale to play at lower resolutions the text becomes unreadable
>>2132144>>2132163People only will play to the very end if Paradox, somehow, release a EU5-V3 save converter, and that's only if you play V3 as well.
>>2132312Everyone but the sentinelese and the congolese pygmies are mutts.
>>2132326This is what they did with some tribal additons.
They really should have the Maori arrive by event or something in EU5 for more flavor. You should be able to switch to a Maori tribe if you play as a Polynesian nearby with some ominous event. Then you can have a cool adventure through New Zealand encountering all the unique species while more waves of settlers arrive over time to compete with you. It would be unique and feel like an easter egg almost by how you'd play as them.
>>2132326>Nullarbor PlainAre you telling me abos lived in the entiretiy of the desert except this one tiny patch? What's so bad about Cook?
>>2132312This is true, and still makes me laugh how the CCP pulled a "France" and homogenized every single culture and people as "Han" even when they were their own thing back in imperial times. There were some exceptions, of course, like the Uyghurs, where they were too far or too irrelevant to "convert" them.
>>2132079I will mass import slaves with my fish and ivory sales to populate vinland and end up so mutted that it'll make the USA look like a homogenous ethnostate.
>>2132329>that's only if you play V3 as well.I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy
>>2132340It is funny seeing the long Mandarin tentacles knowing that they are paths of genocide.
>>2132340That's the language map, not ethnicity map - and not even a really detailed one at that. Everyone in the south east would consider themselves Han though maybe the Yue, partially due to their external dominance, chafe slightly at Mandarin's linguistic favouritism. Nor was the homoginisation you're talking about something the CCP did desu. The "5 Races" being defined as an extensive Han with a few others goes back as far as the 100 days reform and slightly more defined with Sun Yat-Sen. Technically, the CCP recognises a lot more than those 5 besides.
>>2132338There's also east of the Arrernte.
>>2132338No water.
>>2131794Aztecs used pretty much everyone around them for their flower wars and for sacrifices. Their days were numbered, the Spanish were just the catalyst of their downfall.
>>2132442Yeah, if not the Tlaxcalans, the Purepecha were already starting to use metal weapons, so the Aztec dominion was already in its last years.
I vow not to savescum in EU5 []
>>2131243if I remember correctly the aonikenk (aka tehuelches) spoke their own language until the araucanians/mapuches (those who lived between the maule and tolten rivers) started to conquer and dominate them since those guys were getting driven out by the spaniards, the mapuches learning to use the horse helped a lot with this
>>2132305>and he don't feel any slowdown until the 1600sSlowdowns don't mean the game doesn't run slow, it means the game starts chugging like meiou in 1600, holding up on month ticks and autosaves and what ever else and goes slow up to that point.
>>2132306>china is italy or australia Ok retard
I vow to actually play it for more than an hour when Sweden becomes orthodox and culture converts to Norwegian because they forgot how to make an ai
>>2132266>>2132268If you think other italians convrrting to the "emilian" culture is something that would happen or that the lombard territories under Venezia felt under occupation by foreigners you are a hopeless mongoloid
>>2132510That literally happened with Tuscan culture though
game seems intriguing but i cant play for shit
>>21325121) standard italian is not tuscan despite what reddit says2) the piedmontese unified Italy, do you think all the other italians became piedmontese?3) I guess subcultures in game are part of the same group, but all italians still shared a common cultural heritage4) to a venetian a german was not the same as a lombard, he was a foreigner, while the lombard was not.
>>2132516>standard italian is not tuscan despite what reddit saysNTA but what is it then? I thought Tuscan was the prestige literary dialect that was chosen thanks to the various heavyweights the language had, like Dante and Machiavelli?
>>2132376The upper class may identify as Han, since the peasant was mostly ignorant, still it is always more about culture rather than race, to differentiate between the barbarian and the civilized. This is the biggest reason why china can wholeheartedly accepted being raped and ruled by foreign invaders as long as these people also converted to be han. The concept of race or racism didnt really existed back then until it was imported by fucking European lmao Fun fact, both vietnamese and korean elites also used claim to be Han
>>2132516>1) standard italian is not tuscan despite what reddit saysIt is, obviously it evolved by being used by non Tuscans and becoming a lingua franca for centuries but the basis of it is Tuscan
>>2132525NTA but you're correctModern italian is heavily derived from medieval tuscan. It's the result of the effort of 1500s intellectuals to shape a common language using Alighieri, Petrarca and Boccaccio's works as reference.
>>2132000>It's just because I needed to draw the line somewhere or else every single comment would be "Post X mapmode in X region">And before I know it I am posting a river maps of India at 4am.>You'll get more maps throughout the weeks to come!Ryagi's reddit comment on why he didn't post a political map along with those. What did he mean by this?
>>2132327>The game's interface only works at 1080p and they already admitted that if you try using their highly-touted UI scale to play at lower resolutions the text becomes unreadableBut low resolution testing is utterly fucking trivial and can be done on modern monitors... How the fuck do you have a scaling UI that cannot scale to lower resolutions?
>>2132525Im the anon and this>>2132546He is wrong in basically everything.>>2132545This map doesnt prove anything. Ok mongs, step aside that this is going to be a quite lenghty post.Italian is way older than the 16th century, it stems from the 12th-13th century, but it's probably even older than that. And the florentine school (dolce stil novo) was NOT the only school that shaped the language, the sicilian school for example played a very important role too and it inspired the florentine school, and in the sicilian school you didnt just find sicilians but poets from all of southern Italy.It was a multi-layered and multi-generational "project", which aside from its use in poetry and science had other, very practical uses. For example it has many loans taken straight from latin and other local italian languages.The pronunciation of italian itself is closer to the roman dialect, but this dialect and tuscan are extremely close to each other to begin with, and they are close to sicilian and neapolitan etc.And its evolution didnt stop after Boccaccio but it continued, Goldoni was venetian and his plays were extremely popular and they too shaped the language, and this is just another example.If an italian listens to songs from the early modern period in the local dialects he will notice that they are very close to each other and most of they are all understandable, more or less.And if you take into account the actual culture it gets even more complex because even if we say that standard italian is tuscan (it is not) then a neapolitan that speaks italian is still not tuscan, at all.Seeing lombards being converted to emilians, "mediani" (kek) converted to neapolitans etc is retarded.
>>2132326>>2132326There's 100 languages with the most granular subdivision presented, there's around 200 cultures in the game and around 300 tribes on the map. I think it's pretty fair to say they're going with the idea that tribe = culture more than language = culture.If they were truly going down the path of language = culture, there would be around 50 cultures.
The AI definitely should be programmed to be very reluctant to assimilate cultures belonging to the same group as its state cultureAt least in Europe, can’t speak for Asia or Africa
>>2132589I think it would make sense if the AI didn't do it actively, but it happened naturally due to administration and literacy. This would also justify having a gazillion different shades of the same culture.
>>2132290>the amount of children I've seen with grey hair and receding hairlines...people just looked older back in the olden day
A fun little thing on the map..When you zoom in on the map, you can tooltip every building and see what it is.. This also includes RGO's..
>>2132655>game is modeling millions of buildings on map that no one looksI guess we found where the graphical performance is going lmao
>>2132658yes into soul
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/developer-diary/tinto-flavour-38-29th-of-august-2025-portugal.1857322/Tinto Flavour #38 - 29th of August 2025 - PortugalHello, and welcome one more Friday to Tinto Flavour, the happy days in which we take a look at the flavour content of Europa Universalis V!Today will be taking a look at the content for Portugal! As a Tier 2 country, it’s an interesting enough country in the game, as it played an important role during the period, having over 60 DHEs, and numerous content assets. Let’s take a look at it, without further ado:
As usual, please consider all UI, 2D and 3D Art as WIP.
Let’s take a look at the structural content of Portugal, starting with Estates and Government, as usual: Also, the flavour Parliament name: Starting Works of Art: As I promised last week, today we will be taking a look at the unique Naval Units that are available for the Iberian countries, an important part of Portuguese content, all unlocked by different advances. First, we have three different types of Caravels, for the first three Ages of the game:
And then, two types of Galleons, for the Ages of Discovery and Reformation: Let’s take a look now at the unique advances of Portugal:
All of these, when it comes together, allows for Portugal to become a dominant maritime and colonial power early on the game. But, as you might know at this point, this is not ‘gifted’ - a player playing with Portugal has to research these advances, build these ships, and create a strong enough economic power base that allows for the exploration expeditions to take place. If succeeding in this, the potential wealth and power that could be achieved would greatly return all these initial investments made.
Very attached to that, we have the narrative content available for Portugal. While the first century or so has more events based around the court, its development and intrigues, around the Age of Discovery, the content will be much more related to the exploration and colonization of new lands - the Golden Age of Portugal:
Which may be updated later on:
… And much more, but that’s all for today! Next week, there will be four posts, as per the new schedule: Monday -> Tinto Maps Feedback for Scandinavia (yes, Johan has allowed it, finally)! Wednesday -> Tinto Talks for two more of the mid-game, America-related situations, the Columbian Exchange and the Colonial Revolution! Friday -> Tinto Flavour about England!And also remember, you can Pre-Purchase Europa Universalis V now! Cheers!
>>2132671>As a Tier 2 countryPortubros... this wasn't supposed to happen...
>>2132693>Colonial Revolution!God Bless America
>>2132694>chudhan goes to Spain>immediately starts the Portugal slanderYou're not a Spaniard, Johan.
>>2132655we Port Royal now
>>2132655>b-but the map is le empt-ACK!
can you toggle off the ugly ass 3d portraits or do they want you to install a mod to get rid of them?
>>2132753Mod, though possible that they are hard coded
60 DHEs feel so low comparatively speaking for a country so important
>>2132758Hopefully they are hard coded
>>2132671>tier 2i am english and this makes me seethe
>>2132770The grand old alliance has been triggered. Paradox must perish.
>>2132693LET'S GO ENGERLANDKILL SUM FAKKIN NATIVES
Johan:When we started with making content for EU5, we went with 3 categories in how much focus should be spent on them.Tier 1 for the major great powers who impact the timeline the most. France England Ottomans Castile / Spain Muscovy /Russia Austria Yuán / ChinaTier 2 for important ones and those that you all love playing Byzantium Venice Brandenburg / Prussia Portugal Sweden Denmark Poland Mamluks Japan Delhi Holland / Netherlands Timurids / MughalsTier 3 for everbody else we wanted to make content for, everything from Mali to Scotland goes here.
>>2132779>bohemia not importantbasedt. germ
>>2132693>>2132691>>2132690>>2132688>>2132687>>2132682>>2132677>>2132674>>2132671>no macau content
>>2132783Bohemia's relevance is directly tied to the number of Germans that reside in their cities.
>>2132779>Austria is the most important country so it's the last to be revealedBased
>>2132758they should fire their whole art department
>>2132793And make AI Art, instead.
I really hope the Portuguese have an event for the Pirates of the Caribbean shit in Malacca.
>>2132741Even Johan knows Portugal's influence in the world was just a blip in history.
>>2132688>Impregnation mechanicsWhat an advanced game
>>2132802do they have farting mechanics like ck3?
>>2132808every individual fart is simulated
I hope this is good. The early modern period is so extremely kino, but the EU games always came off incredibly shallow to me. I have played a few MEIOU games, which I did like, but it was very clear the game wasn't meant to be modded like that.
>1) If you're looking for some late-game figures, look into the Marquis of Pombal and the Count of Lippe, pavia. The Count in particular is an overlooked figure that was important to modernise Portugal's defensive infrastructure. Sort of a Portuguese "Vauban". Late-game content is really important because a weakness of playing Portugal in EU4 is that it gets boring past 1600.>2) Another thing to keep in mind is to not limit content to just the naval and colonial matters. The "Battle of Ourique", "Ordenanças" and "Caçadores" advances are cool. but the empire was formed just as much by force of land as it was by ships, so never let it skew too much into the boats.>3) Another thing to consider is to add narrative content for Portuguese expansion into Iberia, particularly Galicia and Leon, which are regions with a lot of historical and cultural significance to Portugal's history. It would be a wasted opportunity not to seize on this.>4) Another cool thing you could do is add an option for Portugal to transition from the "De Borgonha" dinasty to the "De Aviz", even if there isnt a succession crisis, since the Aviz are cool, popular monarchs in Portuguese history.>5) Please, please, please give that Vila Viçosa panhandle to Crato That thing drives me nuts.1. We have Late Game content for Pombal, in a dynamic way - it's an event that selects a member of your cabinet: We also have an event about the Great Earthquake of Lisbon:The illustration is a placeholder; we're looking forward to a more impactful one.By the way, there's a cool graphical effect happening in the 3D map after an earthquake event:2. There are more advances and content, but we only show some in each TF.3. As that're something more narrative and alt-historical, it's something to cover through the game mechanics, not through the flavour content, for the base game.4. We have events about the establishment of an Avis dynasty, indeed.
>Will Inés de Castro be of Galician culture, as she was historically? Moreover, will there be any type o content that links Portugal to Galicia (events, claims, rebellions, cultural unification)? In a similar vein, I think an era of Traditions/Renaissance advance to represent Galician-Portuguese lyric would be nice. How can Don Dinis be mentioned when cantigas de amigo, amor, escarnio e maldizer are nowhere to be found? 1. She is of Galician culture.2. There's an event about that, from Pedro de Barcelos, his bastard son:>Can we have a peek at the terrain and population maps?>I remember there was a lot of constructive feedback on the topics of the terrain and especially population distribution.1. You might notice that we have added the Serra da Estrela, made some other changes: 2. We are doing some more corrections to the Population map mode, in general; we'll show it in a separate post for the entire world when that work is completed.>>2132677>>2132682>What's this value?It being 0 looks like a bug, we'll investigate it.
>Thank you Tinto Team for another inspiring TF! I’ve been waiting a long time for this one, since Portugal will be the first nation I’ll play.>As someone from Brazil, I’m especially curious about how Colonial Brazil will be represented, so I’d like to ask a few questions:>Will there be special buildings or mechanics related to the slave-based sugar plantation economy in the Northeast (Engenhos de Açúcar)?>Are there events or mechanics regarding the Bandeirantes expeditions into the interior of the country?>Will there be content for the Gold Rush of Minas Gerais in the 17th–18th centuries? And perhaps even the Inconfidência Mineira?>Will Brazil get events tied to the Jesuit missions and their conflicts with colonists and the Crown over indigenous rights (such as the expulsion of the Jesuits in the 18th century)?1. The Triangular Trade system is portrayed by the game mechanics.2.3 & 4. Not as of now, but I'll take notes for the future.>1. Is it possible to purchase Goa from the Indian countries? Also, is it necessary to colonize the Cape of Good Hope before making contact with India?>2. How does Portugal gain benefits while holding territories or buildings along the Indian coast? I believe it's impossible to include Goa in the Lisbon Market, but is there a way to transport goods from the Indian market to Portugal at low cost?1. It is possible through the base game mechanics, yes.2. It is recommended to establish outposts around the Cape of Good Hope.3. There are Trade Offices as foreign buildings, which allow for getting Market Presence in such distant markets. Als, after the Age of Reformation, a new sujbect type will appear, the Trade Company, that would greatly increase this capacity in distant lands. When that Market presence has been established, you can trade the goods to your metropolitan market (and neighboring ones) for a good profit:
>If battle of Aljubarrota happens, could we have Monastery of Batalha as a work of art if Portugal wins?>Is there any content about the Sebastianismo?>It was a "Arthurian-like" common myth around early Modern Portugal.>D. Sebastian I disappeared while fighting the Moroccans, abd was never found alive or dead. After that, people started to believe he would come back someday to return Portugal to it's glory.>As expected, it never happened, and IRL when ended up with the Iberian Union under Spain.We don't have 'Sebastianismo' itself, as that's very tied to the Succession Crisis that happened after his death, and the subsequent crowning of Philip II of Spain as king of Portugal. However, we do have an event about the campaign of Alcácer Quibir:
>>2132799>implying they don't already
I wish there was a way they could delay the travel of information based off of envoy time or something. It would be cool if your holdings in Asia could come under attack and you wouldn't find out until months after the attacks started.
>>2132865it'd be funny if the map was filled out incorrectly based on exploration
https://youtube.com/shorts/G4wkMZtnLog?si=od4bfffReIC-R8lM
>>2132865>>2132879I was thinking about a similar concept, where technological advancements in transportation of people and information would allow you to receive a lot more accurate info about your realm, neighboring countries and what not. Borders could literally change from blurry lines to well defined boundaries as the game progresses.Though I don't know to what extend this would be appropriate for a GSG/map game.
>>2132899watching youtube shorts should carry the death penalty.
>>2132779>muh Mali did it even survive the 15th century
>>2132909Anon, they HAVE to worship blacks, you don't understand.
>>2132908those shorts are the first time they show clearly that circassia has been split into multiple tagsthe autist retards at the persia and caucasus mal feedback thread are probably cumming of joy rn
>>2132908I don't like it either but the PDX sales department thinks otherwise
>>2132902The primary issue is that that's a lot of work in both design and implementation. It's not something you can just handwave together with no thought.
>>2132902Imagine if the map could use random maps based off of innacurate historical maps for the land you aren't actively trying to colonize but have lightly explored. It could upgrade to a more accurate one if you discover more and eventually you'll reveal more and more of the accurate map around your colonies and outposts as you get better at mapping. This could not only help a feeling of discovery and make explorers useful longer, but it would also sufficiently disorient the player, making the situation more historical. You could tell a colonist to go to one region thinking you know it well but you may have misjudged the innacurate map and ended up sending the colonist to an area that may be less profitable or more dangerous. This would take a lot of graphical coding to make work correctly though so it may be too hard for Paradox only to result in something some players may hate. It would be interesting if the terra incognito for the rest of the old world at least looked like the old maps of it the Europeans had before rediscovering Asia (maybe even vice versa for Asian countries if they had any similar maps of Europe). This would just be a texture change and thus easier to code but would still be pretty interesting.
>>2132921of course, you'd most likely need to build the entire game around this concept for it to work and be satisfying to play
>>2132942That's not really true. You can have a data structure like weighted graph displayed in many different styles. That's actually not a problem in itself in terms of gameplay. If you put in the effort, you could likely make all existing paradox games work that way. The problem is putting in the effort. Just building one map is a lot of work, but now you'd have to build many maps.
>Two months to release>Couple dozen people with early access>Not even one of them is willing to leak the game>Not even the gypsy who got kicked out of the early access programmeWhat the fuck is going on?
>>2132967youtubers are basically employees of game dev compares at this point
>>2132967I don't see why they don't just release it earlier and give the finishing touches as updates. Even if it performs poorly at first, it is still better to have something to play while waiting for them to finish optimizing the game. Hype very well could die down in the time before release. October especially has some sort of weird gateway effect that can make you forget about things, lose interest, change mindset, etc.
>>2132967Vic 3 was leaked because it was a shit game and the testers wanted everyone to laugh at itEU5 hasn't leaked because it's a good game and testers that play it want it to succeed
The main thing I’m worried about this game is the roads. Building an aesthetic and practical road network was my favorite part of Imperator, but the road network for each territory was pre-defined, and sometimes they would have ugly and goofy looking branches that dead ended and didn’t connect to anything (because they were going towards an empty territory you didn’t have a city in) and it always triggered my tism
>>2132973Absolutely not, that doesn't make a lick of sense. The hype won't die down in two months but it will certainly die down if they release the game in an unplayable state and take months to fix it. You're free to argue that game will be broken at release anyway because it's Paradox, but you can't make business decisions based on that.
>>2132973That's what they're already doing. You really think the game will be optimized and finished on 1.0 release?
>>2132973You're just thinking from the standpoint that you want to play right now. What they're doing makes sense. Once the game is released, they have to prioritize fixing bugs.
>>2132975Roads are totally custom, the main issues i foresee are the AI building shitty roads and us being unable to destroy them, or the optimal strat being to build roads in every location which will look bad
>>2132982In Imperator, I would delete AI roads by editing my save file. Each connection between two territories was just one line of text. Building an aesthetic network was very important to me. I agree about spamming roads everywhere being ugly, mechanically it’s the optimal approach, but I haven’t done that since civ2 since it looks stupid.
>>2132982I hated that in Imperator
>>2132970They have allowed every content creator to make money off the game, so pretty much.
How fast will I be able to kill savages?
>>2132988I'm sure someone will find an exploit that allows you to get to the New World very early on.
>>2132988Europeans can't be colonised AFAIK
>>2132992I thought Yuan could colonize Europe at the beginning of the game due to prestige difference or something?
>>2132000I want to see a transformed cultural landscape, not just make it all one color, paradox!
>>2133004We should be able to get organically forming mutt cultures
>>2133023I think they may have said that's a thing. In regards to mestizos, wasn't there some genetic study claiming that most of the race mixing didn't happen until the 19th century?
>>2132779>Tier 2 for important ones and those that you all love playing>Sweden>DenmarkWho?
>>2133063Denmark got a sort of reputation as the villain in EU4 due to them nearly always rivaling you. They probably want to give you a flavorful enemy to fight.
>>2132973>releasing beta versions of our games that players have to beta test as full fledged games isn't enough, give them the alpha versions good pr
>>2132779>Denmark in tier 2What did the danes do besides being the eternal swede's punching bag?
What if you take a bunch of loans, but the banking groups you have debt to cease existing before you pay anything back?
>>2133114oy vey you can't do that, its antisemitism
>>2133120They can go on a nice vacation to the new world
>>2133114Dunno, but they have said that you can just refuse to pay them.
England Feels DIFFICULT in EU5
>>2133094>>2132981Crippling addiction to mappies takes a toll on the brain.
>>2133114This happens early in the game by event, some of the banking nations get btfo and if you had loans your debt can be cancelled
what if you have loans and just decide not to pay them back
>>2129343These are the nations that I feel will be powerful at game start:BohemiaMamluksCastilleFranceEnglandChagatai/TimuridsDelhiYuanAnyone else?
>>2129343My first game is gonna be as Mali or Yuan and I'll conquer and culture convert all of the euroach peninsula, and post it here to own the chuds
>>2133176Japan could be powerful depending on how easy it is to unite and how much internal shit they throw at you afterwards. If it is long and devastating to unite the country and you get many revolts and coup attempts afterwards though, it may not be a good choice early on.
>>21331800/10 try harder
>>2133176The ERE obviously, in 1337 it could still reasonably have had yet another Alexiad tier golden age of recovery had it been under a capable emperor.
>>2133170Israel bombs your house
>>2133194>least mentally ill byzanturdboo
>>2133176The Pope because he makes bank
>>2133185Isn't Japan divided between a bunch of tiny states?
>>2133200I don't think any italian nation stand as this particularly powerful, maybe Naples but idk
>>2133199Let me live my "this how the Roman Empire can still win" dream, man. We only needed like 3 Basil II emperors in a row to stabilize the situation forever (till the next inevitable disastrous civil war).>>2133176Talking seriously you got the Marinids (and their last attempt to reimpose Muslim rule over the peninsula) and the Hungarians trying to impose their will over all their neighbours.
>>2133201That is why I said you'd probably have to unite it as quickly as possible. You may have to rush Sengoku and then end it as soon as possible. Although, I believe they said you could avoid it too. But I'm not sure if that will be preferable or not. I could see a giant civil war being a perfect opportunity to secure more power and wealth for yourself.
>>2133205Oh yes, Hungary, Morocco and Poland do feel strong and kinda like dark horses, the others in my list are the ones who feel exceptionally powerful compared to everyone else, especially the Mamluks who are so big and rich and all its neighbors are pathetic one or three province minors
>>2133205>we only needed 3 napoleons to turn ulm into a global empire
>>2133200Papal gameplay should be like playing as a giant money bag surrounded by desperate people. Being the center of Europe may give many powers, but it also puts you at the end of many things.
Playmaker said Bohemia is the strongest nation of all of Europe
>>2133215I'm gonna play Bohemia first and I'm going full Hussite
>>2133095The Kalmar Union started around those years and lasted almost two centuries.
>>2133209I mean, 3 capable emperors in a row isn't technically impossible, you got the examples of old (Nerva, Trajan, Hadrian...) and closer examples like Alexios, John and Manuel (who somewhat fumbled the ball but was more unlucky that incapable); though the Palaiologos dynasty seemed to lack the capacity to provide them (either through adoption or biological means).
>>2133200The Pope should be strong until the Western Schism happens and his power is diluted by half.
>>2133222>though the Palaiologos dynasty seemed to lack the capacity to provide themThe Palaiologoi were a mistake. The Komnenoi should have restored the Empire.
>>2133224you should be able to avoid the schism if you play well enough
>>2133222you said 3 emperors like basil ii. basil was far, far more than capable you've got to remember before him byzantium was a rotting corpse who's greatest achievement post arab conquest was recapturing crete from pirates.
Byzantium was doomed after the 4th CrusadeThere was no coming back from it.
>>2133231Eh, either an incredibly ruthless and resilient war leader like Basil or a sneaky (yet still military able) diplomatic chameleon like Alexios to provide breathing room for the empire (with 20 years of reign at least I think), the second and third ones can be somewhat worse but still need to be capable enough to consolidate the gains of their predecessor and leave a clear undisputable heir, so they would need to be at least slightly better than John tier.
>>2133237>>2133231>>2133222The only comparable Komnenos to Basil was Manuel even with his unluckiness. From the Palalogoi? No chance. That anon is right in that if you need 3 Basil's in a row it's over. Even those on the forums who suck off Andronikos III can't claim he was anything more than an above-average ruler and I'd say outside of them the agreement is whatever qualities he did possess get boosted by everyone before and after him being completely dogshit. Byzantium was doomed the second the Catalans wrecked Thrace imo as everything after that is one emperor or another bargaining on piece, area or function of the empire to salvage another.
>>2133254>The only comparable Komnenos to Basil was Manuel even with his unluckiness.Alexios may not have been as good as militaryman as Basil but he compensated it with being half-snake, his ability to seemingly seamlessly juggle all enemies of the empire to almost always come on top one way or another was a critically needed skill in 1337, though i will admit even he might have been surpassed by the absolute state of Byzantium then. And yeah, we all know the Palaiologos dynasty wasn't up to the task in real life, this is just a thought experiment in feasibility.
>>2132779>game start in 1337>pope is only tier 3
>>2132779The amount of new world tags with flavor is absurd. I suppose they don't really have anything else to do though.
>>2133275Well all the blue ones in south america mostly share the same stuff since they're meant to form Tawantinsuyu. We've seen the north american ones and they're pretty basic.Considering tier 3 includes shit like georgia and orissa(?) the bar isn't very high
>>2133275They're for the americans who will play them once then realize natives are still boring to play
>>2133286Hey, that's me
>>2133166I think the debt can get taken over by another bank through an event, would be really broken otherwise
>>2132658They're obviously not gonna be loaded when you unzoom
>>2133176Mali is OP.
>>2133368The French king btfo the templars to cancel his debt
>>2132779>Germany and Italy as important to world history as Ethiopians and west african jungle niggersMein Gott...
>>2133233Maybe instead of blaming the venetians for all of their woes the greeks should have stopped with their endless civil wars and literal backstabbing. Maybe
>>2133382I'm sure that's what they thought would be the case for the individual teeth on cities skylines 2 sims too but here we are in the world of el paradoxo
>>2133176Korea and Vijayanagar are going to be the most broken nation,they have a lot of good stuff going for them.-Some of the highest population density in the world, which works very well with the control mechanic.-Relatively stable countries.-Their stronger neighbors are going to collapse (yuan and dehli), and don't really have any anyone that can threaten themVijayanagar-lots of valuable recourses (comparted to European countries)-Given their previous factors they have insane early game wealth potential, which lead to being able to built lots of research buildings-their advances + eco + hindu religion give them probably the best research speed in game, so even when they are missing institutions, they can stack up a lot of older techs that the Europeans don't have time to reaches -Can soft expand in to all of their neighbors easily Korea-I think they have the largest (or at least one of the largest) homogeneous population of the game, this is not only one of the most important starting conditions, but it also frees up a lot of culture capacity for others peoples (jurchens , chinese, japanese) -Also have lots of good advances.-Can do the same tech shenanigan as Vijayanagar (a little less effective though)
>>2133409>their advances + eco + hindu religion give them probably the best research speed in gamethis is so fucking retarded, catholicism and protestantism should have by far the highest research speed
>>2133434Yeah it stupid, Generalist said that Catholicism is by far the worst and have really bad mechanics (from a modifier perspective). Christianity is also generally bad because it can't directly take slaves, with nothing to compensate for it then being able to buy pagan slaves from muslim slave traders.
>>2133434Didn't it just go sanic because printing press made it way cheaper to spread discoveries? Ottomans shat themselves even harder by refusing to use printing press outside of printing religious texts.
>>2133446monateries spreading knowledge across the entire continent and universities created specifically for scientific research were christian institutions
>>2133176>YuanThey're basically forced to collapse.
>redditors making up excuses for the bullshit 1770 map Kek, we are at the cope phase
>>2133453Universities started as teaching theology, law and something else. It's less that Christians were scientifically minded but all the education institutions were Christian to begin with when they started branching out.
>>2132779The flavor distribution is also retarded, as flavor means unique content (mostly a good thing) and OP advances. That countries like Norway and Lithuania don't have tier 3 flavor, but countries which aren't relevant for the much in the time period like Orissia, Ethiopia, Georgia, the Knights, multiple native north americans and jurchen OPMs (it 300 years until Qing conquest).Norway was still a relevant kingdom in Europe as their just past their peak strength and hadn't been crippled by the black death yet.Lithuania is still on the rise and only gets more powerful as the golden horde collapses and they convert to Christianity.This just mean if your playing Norway or Lithuania and keep your countries relevant (something that wouldn't be to unreasonable), your handicapped because most other countries have arbitrary bonuses than you don't have because pardox hecking loves random ass meme countries
>>2133457>when they started branching out.And why'd they start branching out?
>>2133457It was mostly medicine, law and finance at first because it was in very high demand.>It's less that Christians were scientifically minded but all the education institutions were Christian to begin with when they started branching out.Non-christians did not create these kind of institutions tough, they were stuck with the equivalent of catheral schools.
>Tier 2 for important ones and those that you all love playingThis also BS, especially considering lots of places in Europe like Norway (including Iceland and greenland), Lithuania, and Ireland, Wallachia. Are more popular then Denmark.
>>2133464It wasn't even universally Christian but European thing.
>>2132967>Not even the gypsy who got kicked out of the early access programmeLiterally who?
>>2133399cope Hans your little Free Cities and Petty Duchies were nothing more than speed bumps for Valois, Bourbon, Habsburg and Hohenzollern bvlls
>>2133480Don't forget Brahmin from Delhi
>>2133400>instead of being Greeks and blaiming others, the Greeks should've stopped being Greeks
>>2133464It was generally the least religious christians that created those things in europe, Christianity was actively hampering them. More over you have been blown out on this already but higher education existed everywhere, not just in europe.
>>2133506Nta but the Church was always the forefront of science throughout history. The times they had a problem with a scientist was because they wanted proof before they more widely adopted something. Even more modern things like the Big Bang Theory were discovered by the Church. The Church only started to lose its scientific edge as research institutes started to take off. Most scientific stuff in other countries was also handled by their respective religious groups in the past. Religion is pretty much the backbone of human civilization.
>>2133517>Church was always the forefront of science throughout history. That's only technically true but not relevant for the purposes of the discussion. Rich and powerful were always the sponsors and facilitators of development back in the day because only they had the free resources to devote to non survival activities. Successful religious groups categorically were rich and powerful (otherwise they wouldn't be successful) so it's only natural that they would play a part. But that's only a historic quirk not some kind of law that states that religion promotes science. It's much more accurate to say that science happened despite of religion than because of it which is demonstrated again by the fact that it was always the least religious that were pushing the boundaries within the framework of their societies. A medieval scientist may seem very religious to us but would be very atheistic to a priest of the time etc. Same thing with stuff like monasteries making books, their primary purpose was to make bibles and other religious texts, the least religious did religion adjacent things likes philosophy or natural sciences which were much more helpful in developing science.>Even more modern things like the Big Bang Theory were discovered by the Church.This is just not true. >Most scientific stuff in other countries was also handled by their respective religious groups in the past. This is true which is the other point why the comment isn't relevant because as you can clearly see other religions had more or less the exact same role as Christianity did in developing sciences in their respective regions, some of them could very easily be said to have a bigger role. The primary difference between religions isn't their support of science but rather which group ended up winning history. Places like middle east and africa were losing to Europe even before Christianity was a thing and China suffered mostly from their own success of exterminating all peer competition.
>>2133526>This is true which is the other point why the comment isn't relevant because as you can clearly see other religions had more or less the exact same role as Christianity did in developing sciences in their respective regions, some of them could very easily be said to have a bigger role.They didn't and they couldn't. Religions are not the same and christianity has the strongest affinity to scientific advancement.
>>2133526>This is just not true.Georges LemaîtreHe was actually laughed at at first because the big bang theory sounds religious
>>2133538That's wrong though
>>2133540actually, you are wrong
>>2133540It's true actually. Hindu and buddhist monks were fucking useless when it comes to scientific advancements and muslims stopped trying once proper islam became more entrenched.
>>2133539Yes I know who he is, your post is still wrong, one scientist who happened to be a priest on the side doesn't mean that "Big Bang Theory was discovered by the Church". Most of his work wasn't clerical in natureMost of coworkers weren't part of the churchThe man himself wasn't like "I do this for god, the spirit and the holy see"etc. etc.Guys like that are first of all the exception as is clearly evident from the list of other names associated with big bang or really physics at large and how many of them were priests vs how many priests there were vs non priest physicists, even a cursory look immediately reveals how under represented priests and other clergy are in pushing these sorts of theories forwards. Second it should again be stressed that "the church" as a whole has to be dragged kicking and screaming into yielding ground on physics especially, there's still lot of these guys around who believe earth is 6000 years old let alone accept big bang theory as any kind of valid theory about how the universe came to be. The fact that you take one guy, attribute his mainly secular achievements to "the church" and try to use that singular point as evidence on how "the church" somehow helps is the primary problem with posts like this.>>2133546Christian monks don't do any better when they happen to be in any non western European nation. I mean fuck bongs came up a with a religion of their own just because their king wanted a divorce and they somehow became the dominant power. I guess divorcing your wife is just so pro science religion, much wow. It's almost as if christian achievements are primarily western European achievements.The idea that Christianity somehow uniquely supports science is not only just wrong but also a classic case of vapid post hoc reasoning.
Two things I’m wishing for in EUV:1. Expanding into North or West Africa as a European power is extremely costly. The Barbary coast should be a constant thorn in any Mediterranean players side2. Countries shift into other countries depending on the culture around them. If I as an Irish minor conquer the British isles, it should be more likely than not that England-in-exile tag shifts to Normandy or Acquitane
>>2133409If anything it would be extremely hard for korean or east asian countries to pass any reform, especially in a peaceful, stable period, since they are conservative as fuck
>>2133559>England-in-exile tag shifts to Normandy or AcquitaneI always wished stuff like this would happen in EU4. I hated seeing Spain or England on some random islands still retaining the exact same culture and system as if it were WW2. I also felt like when random Dutch tags got exiled to the New World that they should've been able to form something new. This would also remove annoying stuff like a Delhi that only exists in the steppe.
>>2133559i have the feeling we will need mods for both of your wishes
>>2133467That's the whole do you plan to play graph from the forums. It's not the most popular countries to play and if EU4 is anything to go by the answer will be France and England.>>2133473Ludi.>>2133506NTA and this just isn't true. It's also your central point lookinh forward so your argument isn't correct. Measuring religiosity is something hard to do even in terms of modern anthropology besides and in general there's a preference to take people at their words. In terms of actions your "less religious" medieval scientist differed in no meaningful way from what the average person would think a "hood Christian", "good Muslim" etc would be like as well if they weren't explicity part of religious orders - you later contrast a priest vs "medieval scientist" but aside from the fact that second category isn't a contained thing very often your scientist would be a priest in the first place. You're just wrong anon the other anons are right.As an aside, and to an extent, for Europe specifically there's even an argument as big cause of the great divergence was the specific structures of the Catholic Church uniting and ordering international political, social and scientific development across the continent in a way other regions didn't really have. It's a much more controversial thesis though and outside this argument besides but interesting to think about.
>>2133558>Christian monks don't do any better when they happen to be in any non western European nation.Because thy are not catholic. Are you dense? The entire point is that the catholic church as an institution encouraged sciences more than other religions, be they christian or not.
>>2133593>NTA and this just isn't trueIt's absolutely true. You make the mistake where people living in religious society somehow are benefiting from the religion instead of advancing science despite of it which is again the actual reality of the situation. Of course all medieval scientists were christians because that's the world they were born into but the most christians weren't the scientists nor was science pushed by the particularly hard liners of any given religion. Scientific progress categorically congregates to the least religious of a given society as much as it is possible in a given time. Clergy simply happened to be the guys that had lots of spare resources to spend and thus had the time to ponder orbs and figure out what a zero was. This was despite of their religion however not because of it. Often times the leading figures in science were found in other similar but secular institutions where people had free time, for instance the wealthy aristocrat types that pushed science in western europe.
>>2133620>You make the mistake where people living in religious society somehow are benefiting from the religion instead of advancing science despite of it which is again the actual reality of the situation.No you're making the mistake of ignoring modern anthropology, creating post-hoc groupings (again medieval scientist isn't a thing - you bring up priest vs one but many would have been priests, monks etc so you start from a point of already deciding everyone who you could call so "doesn't count" which is begging the argument) and working backwards to support your argument. At the end of the day anon you'll have to actually back up your claims and you can't.
>>2133597>Because thy are not catholic. Catholics perform significantly worse than protestants despite being demonstrably more christian in their theology but more importantly for this topic in terms of their organization and resources. Globally Catholics also lose to Orthodox today but historically they were more relevant than them at least. If the premise is that Christianity helps science then it's very strange how the vastly inferior protestant sects mogs Catholics despite the vastly superior resources Catholics would have to "push science" with. It's almost as if less Christianity is better for science.In fact as soon as you take your eyes off western European advances the christian science idea is exposed pretty immediately. The north-south divide is already above. The more christian and much wealthier christian organizations of the south lose to the less christian and weaker christian organizations of the north exactly because their are less christian despite their weaker funding. Conversely rich universities and rich countries and rich institutions outperform poor ones categorically. Then you got the east-west divide. West Europe despite being demonstrably less religious mogs east Europe again despite their religion. You won't see people bring up Ukraine, Romania, Slovenia or Poland as wins for Christians despite again their demonstrably more principled outlook on religion.Then you got the new-old world divide. Mexico is the perfect case study which has been primarily christian very populous nation since the 1500's and same thing with lot of other African and south american places and despite of that they produced practically 0 scientific progress because again it's not Christianity that's doing the work but rather western Europe
>>2133624>north south divider>open book>united kingdoms with little threats to their borders and thus prosperity in the north and little divided kingdoms who are the battleground of every war in the south
>>2133623>again medieval scientist isn't a thing - you bring up priest vs one but many would have been priestsAgain this is completely irrelevant. The people in the past were religious because that's the world they were born in. They advanced sciences despite of that not because of it. It "doesn't count" for the obvious reason that the progressive thinkers were not only in their own words less Christians but more importantly for this discussion ostracized by the church at large. The church was in fact categorically behind of the sciences of the time. You are the one working backwards to support your argument by noticing that in a society where 100% of people were Christians the people who did the science were also Christians and thus attribute their claims to Christianity but again as I have demonstrated this is just false.
>>2133526>Rich and powerful were always the sponsors and facilitators of development back in the day because only they had the free resources to devote to non survival activities.There were many people who were rich and powerful who weren't part of the church or weren't Christian at all and yet they did next to nothing compared to the church.
>>2133631I suppose monopoly of guaranteed massive resources made it easier for the church.
>>2133570The way I’d do it is to give each diverse realm a ‘metropole’ mechanic. Spain’s metropole for example would be Iberia. If Iberia is lost, they have to shift to a new metropole, and take its culture and such. Other parts of their empire should bail as well; Mexico revolts if Spain moves to Naples
>>2133632>monopoly of guaranteed massive resourcesThis was also applicable to many groups.
>>2133629Germany was full of tiny states that warred much more than most of the southern European states and were objectively poorer than them for most of Christian history. But again that's largely irrelevant, successful people make successful states. If you want to support the "christian = science" claim then you need to explain the counterexpamples, not nitpick the successes. Why doesn't the boon of Christianity expand to cover Brazil or Poland or Romania or Slovenia or Greece or Mexico or Angola? Why is that Christianity seems to only help western Europe in particular and only seems to help the parts where Christianity is the least important and least powerful when science in every other case seems to progress fastest with more resources? And why is that the rich and powerful catholic church loses to basically non church protestants? >>2133631By the time rich and powerful could realistically be separated from the church they were essentially the sole contributors to science, they were also the sole contributors to science before Christianity was even a thing.
Please don't turn this thread into a /his/ religious debate
>>2133630>The people in the past were religious because that's the world they were born in.Which is a post-hpc construction. You've decided that they would be different if born elsewhen but you can't say so if you're being intellectually honest with yourself. You have a point and you're working backwards from it. What we do know of these people is that they like the mass body of society would be regarded as good paragons of virtue like any other normal person - and many of the more prolific would be regarded as holy men and women above that c.f. all the Islamic scienctisis who were also heavyweight religious poets and scribes for an example.>progressive thinkers were not only in their own words less ChristianThis your only actual claim and again you can't back it up. In addition you've moved from "scientists" to progressive thinkers which aside from being yet another nebulous category is almost entirely to fit in a few non-scientists and scholars in ignorance in the overwhelming general body nor would said people be ostracised either.
>>2133636I want him to at least source 5 people instead of vaguely gesturing. INB4 Fredrick II as his only example as well.
>>2133638>Which is a post-hpc constructionBut it's not. Your logic is like saying that aliens can't make science because all science is done by humans. The facts on the ground at the time were that they were religious but that doesn't mean that religion was the only way to make science or even that it helped science.>You've decided that they would be different if born elsewhenThat's obviously true and you are a retard if you can't see why that is. People aren't genetically christian retard, every christian is indoctrinated. Obviously they won't be christians if they don't grow up in a christian society. Yet they will still be high IQ individuals capable of innovating. >You have a point and you're working backwards from it.Again false>What we do know of these people is that they like the mass body of society would be regarded as good paragons of virtue like any other normal person - and many of the more prolific would be regarded as holy men and women above that c.f. all the Islamic scienctisis who were also heavyweight religious poets and scribes for an example.And that's precisely why your point is wrong.>This your only actual claim and again you can't back it up.Been done already, just because you ignore it doesn't mean it's not backed up.>In addition you've moved from "scientists" to progressive thinkersTo the time period these were the same people. >nor would said people be ostracised either.This is just what happened, you are literally ignoring historical facts now, even facts provided by the church themselves let alone by the people being persecuted.
>>2133635>Germany was full of tiny statesAll under the authority of the Holy Roman Emperor. Just cause german nobles had more autonomy then a english count doesnt mean they were independent. The emperor literally decided to cut off all of modern dax Czechia of reciving any trade despite it being in full rebellion.
>>2133635>they were also the sole contributors to science before Christianity was even a thing.Yes, western Europe, very famous for its leaps in scientific advances in the BC era.
>>2133643Roman empire was for it's time arguably either #1 or #2 place to be. Greeks would also be considered quite advanced for their time. You put the arbitrary limitation of western europe, no idea why would would do that besides a weak strawman.
>>2133624Why are you talking about modern day are you legitimately retarded?
>>2133644My nigger your entire argument has been about western Europe advancing solely because of its aspects outside of Christianity.
>>2133645None of that post is about modern day.>>2133646Please quote the part where I say that in that reply chain. If you can't separate different angles of an argument from each other work on your reading comprehension.
>>2133641This argument starts about the Church's boons when it comes to scientific development. You can complain about aliens being excluded as there are none but there were some who stand out non-noticibly - again it's you who can't give examples and you who bring up a false actually religious vs societally religious dichotomy, where those who do "the science" where actually secretly or not so secretly less religious only to drop it now as you have no core point. As you point out no one is genetically Christian (genetically religious is something that's actually debated as a humanity-wide trait interestingly enough) and even the standout examples we have of dissenters contribute little uniquely to the realms of thought and discovery this argument is about. Again give me 5 or I accet your concession though this is mostly not to piss off that anon who asked earlier not to turn this into /his/.
>>2133658>again it's you who can't give examplesI have given several, you simply choose to ignore them. I have no idea why you do that. >where actually secretly or not so secretly less religious only to drop it now as you have no core pointI not only demonstrated that point but I also did not drop it, work on your reading comprehension
>>2133647>those weren't the words I said so now I can weasel out of what I was arguing now that it's inconvenient>get some media literacy
>>2133662Yes, the words I have said do not match with what you wrote. That is the text book definition of a strawman. Reading comprehension is not media literacy but you could use both I presume with this level of reading comprehension.
What Paradox should do is model how refined you religious institution is. Having a stable organized one will give you research boosts among other things to represent the work such an institution can do. It could give something interesting to weigh when considering switching religions as it will send your institution into disarray. Some religions may start with hopelessly undeveloped institutions though so it may be advantageous to switch to a more organized religion. if your religious institution is more organized it will also carry more penalties to abandon it (and it may even trigger events and whatever where they revolt or plot against you). This will keep you from easily switching between Christianity and Islam for instance just because one happens to be more organized at the moment. You may also be able to get rid of religious institutions all together later in the game and under some circumstances which could be advantageous if you rule over many different religions.
>>2133409I hate this meme in strategy games of Korea being the tech country because sejong made an alphabet once
>>2133679Korean nationalism really goes unchecked everywhere nowadays. Gooks are getting really cocky.
arguing with redditors is so fucking boring holy shit
>>2133660>I have given several, you simply choose to ignore them.You didn't give one. Only vague allusions. I accept your concession by the way in regards to the 5.>I not only demonstrated that point but I also did not drop it, work on your reading comprehensionYou did lol.
>>2133559>1. Expanding into North or West Africa as a European power is extremely costly.This is how it currently is for west africa, supplying an army fighting there is difficult and expensive because you have to move goods into the market for supply, plus the provinces have malaria that hurts colonization speed hard>The Barbary coast should be a constant thorn in any Mediterranean players sidethere is no strait between Iberia and North Africa so it's a thorn in the sense that you can't just march over there in 1338 and eat the whole coastlineBut I struggle to imagine a proper player Castile actually having problems here, their navy should be so massive compared to north africans they'll eventually overwhelm them>2. Countries shift into other countries depending on the culture around them. If I as an Irish minor conquer the British isles, it should be more likely than not that England-in-exile tag shifts to Normandy or Acquitaneyeah this definitely isn't gonna happen on release but there's more chance for it in EU5 compared to EU4 at least. Since formables in EU5 barely mean anything and are mostly a name change, it'd be harmless to add a bunch of "exile formables" or "lose state formables", whatever you want to call them, where if a country gets btfo from its titular territories it changes its name. Like if Venice loses Venice and only holds Morea it might change its name to Morea. In some cases keeping the original name fits though, like with the (northern) Yuan and (southern) Ming.
>>2133687If you refuse to read I guess I accept your concession.
It would be cool if the United States gets a CB to end Barbary piracy if it is still ongoing when the United States forms.
>>21335591. is probably not going to happenIn two different late game screenshots, theyve shown Muslims blobbing into Mediterranean Europe, so Christians blobbing into Mediterranean Africa will also be easy
>>2133695I don’t see why that’s incompatible. Europe has a more amenable climate and terrain for expansion
>>2133695Both did so historically with a lot worse technology The real important point will be how easy it is to expand into Sub-Saharan Africa. It should be hard and nearly impossible for Euros with Muslims having a slightly easier time but still a lot of difficulty.
>>2133704Muslims didn't really expand into sub sahara, they just converted the people.
Really I’m just sick of Spain and Portugal conquering Morocco, Algiers and Tunis every game. It’s so ahistorical and uninteresting
>>2133717It's ahistorical in that it didn't happen not because they didn't try lol. There were multiple expansion attempts by the European powers into the Maghreb before the modern era they just usually ended up bogged down and going fuck anywhere. Tribal, nomadic, dry and hilly terrain isn't the most ideal place for temperate, settled societies to move into but it's not impossible. The issue with EU4 (and now presumably EU5) was that the north Africans could never push back the intial coastal landings like in real life and like usual in EU4 once they lost once they kept on losing whe realistically any victory would galvanise them and make sure any recurring war and occupation even worse than the initial one.It's part of the larger issue imo that garrisons cost nothing when they should be a manpower and financial drain especially in places where you couldn't recruit the locals after the conflict. I'd even argue the majority of your manpower should go into said hostile garrisons in the early game with a maybe a choice about hollowing out the garrisons for the field armies in desperate times ala the Frankokratia.
>>2133723The invasion of Tunisia that was the Kingdom of Africa is another example.
>>2133695>so Christians blobbing into Mediterranean Africa will also be easyWell the only reason this didn't happen is because the Ottomans were strong enough to stop it. Then later on they were outclassed and Christians did in fact claim all of North Africa.There's no reason that, if there's no strong muslim power with a good navy to prevent it, the Christians couldn't set up another kingdom in Africa. Actually Sicily held the islands off the coast of Tunisia until just 4 years before the start date and historically they retook it for a while.
>>2133700...and an advanced, warlike and numerous population.
>>2133623>No you're making the mistake of ignoring modern anthropologyIgnoring modern anthropology is actually correct and extremely based.>t. several decades of experience with modern anthropology
>>2133736Except it didnt happen before the Ottomans eitherMuslim navy has nothing to do with itThe problem is your foothold in North Africa is surrounded by hostile states and tribes who have a massive local advantage
>>2133630>The people in the past were religious because that's the world they were born in. This is where you're correct if you take your statement at face value. If there was no Christianity, you might have all the same advancements. Nothing says Christianity was necessary in any way.>They advanced sciences despite of that not because of it.This is so incorrect that your previous statement turns incorrect. You could debunk that on the idea level to hell and high water, but I'll use a real example.You should look into why the church actually persecuted things like heliocentrism. You probably have a narrative that's constructed after the fact rather than one that's rooted into the actual reasoning. I think the more detailed version of the story actually illustrates something key about the Catholic church. It was a scientific institution.
>>2133911 (me)I'll clarify what I mean. Galileo Galilei did things that had been done before. He got persecuted by the "scientific" establishment for how he justified his findings, and that institution happened to be the Catholic church. Heliocentrism was controversial at the time on scientific grounds rather than spiritual. That's good context, but it's not so important for the whole story. He did his work for years with no issue until he refuted counterarguments to his work by stating that the scripture could be use to justify his work, which was deeply heretical.
>>2133931And then there's the fact that the Pope gave his model some counterarguments, and if you read between the lines, he calls the Pope a simpleton. He was kind of a problem child. The Inquisition notably objected to him teaching theories as fact when they hadn't been proven.
>>2133546>and muslims stopped trying once proper islam became more entrenchedMore like when Muslims leaders started to listen to midwits like Al-Mansur instead of scholastic chads like Averroes. Hell, even Christians actually appreciated Averroes' works better than the Muslims.
>>2133882Fair but he's not opposing it on grounds you probably do he's just straight up ignoring it because he's working backwards for his argument.
There should be a meter of how strongly your people believe in your religion and it should increase discipline. I remember hearing something about Sweden having some of the strongest soldiers for a point in time because they were content with marching through enemy fire. This is because they viewed whatever happened as the will of God. Either they march forth and help take down the enemy, or they die a valiant death and go to Heaven. I suppose reformed already has this in a way based off of what they showed with the whole predestined thing.
>>2133911>You could debunk that on the idea level to hell and high waterYou didn't do that and you can't actually do that>It was a scientific institutionThat's once again meaningless, all churches were "scientific institutions" of their times simply because they were the places where people with time and money could ponder the zero while peasants had to focus on farming. That's irrelevant to weather they science is progressing despite of them or not. A simple example would be if universities randomly killed half the people attending, they would still produce science, just significantly less effectively than now which would mean science was progressing despite of them. This again does not counter but in fact supports my point how science advanced despite of religion. In your example you fail to consider that it's entirely irrelevant that church may have liked galileo at some point, the sheer fact that he could be arrested by guys with pointy hats for merely offending another guy IS the proof that proves you wrong. It's fairly obvious to understand that if instead of a church all of the intellectuals like galileo from your example or better yet anyone for the past 1500 years lived in a world without church, they wouldn't have to deal with the church as inhibitor of progress, yet alone even a more perfect system for scientific advancement which means that any system that doesn't follow that is in fact inhibiting progress and progress happens despite of that. The fact that most guys have to waste most of their time thinking about and talking about imaginary sky dad just so few people may have the time to do science is the slam dunk for why progress happens despite of church. You can take catholic church, remove the church and god and you end up with an organization that's more effective at pushing science than what it was before. This is again obvious on idea level but demonstrated in practice trough out history, not least of with by the protestants
>>2134095>There should be a meter of how strongly your people believe in your religionThis would be impossible to know, and it's not like there were census where "religious fervor" was quantified a thing. You could argue people in the past had more fervor, yet you still had stories about some nobles or even kings taking young boys as "favorites", having affairs left and right, bribing priests and religious leaders for favors, looting entire cities after some battles, and crap like that.
>>2133898>Except it didnt happen before the Ottomans eitherIt did. The ottomans and the constants meddling of other european states saved north Africa from conquest.Morocco surely was the toughest nut to crack of the bunch
>>2134139>Morocco surely was the toughest nut to crack of the bunchWhich happens to be the further North African state from the Ottomans. And which had Ceuta and Melilla occupied by Christians since the 15th century, so obviously the Ottomans and crossing the Mediterranean is not the problem and the fact that its covered in mountains and hostile tribes is the problem.
I didn't want to ask this on the forums since it doesn't warrant a post of its own, so I'll do it here: does control pass through vassals? So, for instance, what level of control will France exert to its exclave of "Roman Flanders" via the County of Flanders?
>>2134139>>2134146To be fair in the case of Spain, they barely touched Moroccan lands after they discovered America, besides the Tordesillas Treaty basically forbid them from touching anything from Africa because that was Portugal's jurisdiction, and when the Portuguese tried to meddle in Moroccan affairs, they fucked it up badly.
>>2134155It would be interesting if it actually had a penalty so decentralized realms would be weaker. It also may balance well since I'm sure you'll make a lot of income from vassals that fully control their provinces.
>>2134110I see, you're working backwards from your conclusion. The other anon was 100% correct.
>>2134303Other way around, work on your reading comprehension
>>2134366So what would you call finding things irrelevant BECAUSE it fundamentally affects the conclusion? In reality, there's very obviously interaction with the conclusion. But, in order to make that case, you have to make the borderline schizophrenic claim that it's irrelevant. I will move the presented logic into another context to show why it's borderline schizophrenic. A hired worker chops down a tree, but they could've easily been replaced by another worker, so they didn't really do anything to chop down the tree. Since they very well could've been replaced by a better worker, they hindered chopping down the tree if anything. As I said, you're correct in the sense that the tree could've been chopped down either way, but you go into silly territory when you say the worker didn't chop down the tree. Assuming that there would've been a better alternative just because there could've been a better alternative is some really dire mental gymnastics. I'm going to make a guess that you've heard the inverse logical error, and that's why you're so adamant about this. Guess what, it's a logical error in either direction. A potential doesn't discount the reality, and reality doesn't discount every potential. A counterfactual (in the sense of an scenario that has not happened) isn't fact, by definition.What is used to justify the argument could be used to justify the opposite. That's what makes it incredibly clear that someone is working backwards from the conclusion.
>>2134377>So what would you call finding things irrelevant BECAUSE it fundamentally affects the conclusion?I explained it very clearly why it was irrelevant. If that is the conclusion you got to, work on your reading comprehension.
>>2134389And I'm saying your logic is schizophrenic. How about you respond to that?
>>2134396I just said how I respond to that. The response is the same for that post too.
>>2134400Well, then your response is also schizophrenic and does nothing to address the problem.
>>2134401I don't believe I can teach you to read so no it doesn't really help the problem.
>>2134403My mistake, you might just be schizophrenic instead of working backwards from your conclusion. By the way, it really seems like you're now working backwards from the conclusion that what you're saying is reasonable. It can't be that you said something unreasonable, it must be that I didn't get it.What contradicts the idea that you said something unreasonable and multiple people understood it and thought it was unreasonable?
1337 start date is superior to 1444 solely because Canary Islands, Madeira, and the Azores haven't been colonized yet, which means almost everyone in europe has the potiental for early colonization. Genoa, Venetia, maybe even byzantines are in range of those islands
>>2134407Again work on your reading comprehension is all I can say on the matter that hasn't been explained in my posts already. If you have another argument feel free to present it, otherwise consider your concession accepted.
>>2134410I thought so. Nothing contradicts the idea that multiple people understood you perfectly and still thought you were unreasonable.
>>2134413multiple illiterates don't a literate make but yes concession accepted in that case.
>>2134409Byzantium will be too busy taking Turkish BBC to colonize
>>2134416If you can contradict that idea, do so. It's a pretty damning concession that you can't.
>>2134418Just did, work on your reading comprehension
I hate 4chan flame wars mostly because it eventually becomes incomprehensible and you lose track of who is saying what. Just discuss EU5.
>>2134419You didn't.>multiple people understood you perfectly and still thought you were unreasonable>multiple illiterates don't a literateSeems like you have to fundamentally alter the claim to even pretend to contradict it. That's the unfortunate condition when you're chronically running conclusion first
>>2134420>>2133636This
Not one of the religion-science correlation discussion anons but if either of them is still interested, this video details the way christianity was commonly experienced and affected education in Western Europe in the late medieval and early renaissance period. (sources are included as footnotes and in the description)https://www.youtube. com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
>>21344091337 nerfs Sweden since they have to waste their time and money colonizing Finland.
>>2134436They get that trough their missi I mean their events
>>2134473How fun that we've returned to early EU3.
>>2134436I hope Finland doesn't exist as a nation that revolts or whatever. It was only invented in 1809 near the end of the game's timeline.
>>2134503I think it should get cores through events, assuming the provinces it spawns on are Finnish-cultured
>>2134503>It was only invented in 1809Nah, the Duchy of Finland existed way before that.
>>2134535I can't find proof of this
>>2134541https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duke_of_Finland
>>2134569Thank you
>>2134582It's fake, don't believe him.
>>2134582It's real, believe him.
>>2134586The sources are a bit suspicious
>>2134586>>2134589Whatever you say, Johan
>Pick Albania>Conquer a beylik>Switch religions and become a beylik>Conquer all other rival beyliks>The "Sublime Porte" will refer to the Albanian Empire, inheritors of Romekino
>>2134684>Pick any other country >Conquer Albania >Induce famines and let every disaster fester >No more Albanians>It was too easyNow for the rest of the Balkans
Can you play tall in africa yet
https://youtube.com/shorts/58vlHYFER6g?si=gX7r4zxe3Hs_HYOfebin
>>2134742I think he just broke his NDA
>>2129343why does the new one look fucking worse? It's way less readable
Did we have a Venice diary?
>>2134697if they allow you to become the capital of slave trade for both Muslims and Europeans maybe
>>2134742>>2134813what a retardwhy would anyone do this randomly?
>>2134851because Paradox allowed them to do so
>>2134851>why would participate in an advertising campaign in exchange for money, truly preposterous
>>2134742I hate you retard, you don't embedd youtube shorts, you are spreading an irritating format.https://youtube.com/watch?v=58vlHYFER6g?si=gX7r4zxe3Hs_HYOf
My wishes for Eu5 are:1) Eurocentrism, where the world outside of Europe stays behind in development and has to, as some point, enter a struggle for its survival against the overflowing europeans;2) Uncolonized Africa and diminishing colonization returns, where Africa become interesting only in a few strategical ports, of which the profit is only in their strategical geographical position, to control trade and have a close position to dock ships; further colonization of Africa should be detrimental;3) Heterogeneous landmasses, at least some pieces of land that are disconnected in an empire, like english Balearis or genoese Crimea
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/tinto-maps-11-scandinavia-tinto-extra-maps-1-north-atlantic-feedback.1857606/Hello, and welcome to another Tinto Maps Feedback post! Today, we will be reviewing the region of Scandinavia! And with it, we'll also take a look at the North Atlantic region. Countries:You might notice that Åsbo and Laholm now start as part of Denmark; there's an event chain about their transfer to Scania/Sweden early in the game.
Also, a screenshot of Norway's holdings at the start of the game: Dynasties: We now have this cool graphical asset in the Dynasty map mode, where you can see all CoAs. Country Ranks & Types: You may have noticed that we now have a new color scheme for the Country Types.
SoPs:
Locations: Added the following:Locations - 18 Tofte (central Norway) Stryn, Vik & Laerdal in Sogn Province Hornborg in Båhus Utlandet in Västergötland 6 more locations in Karelia, removing the wasteland there. 2 more locations added to Finnmark Kobenhavn, Slagelse, Vordingborg, Falster to Sjaelland Kirkjubaejar in IcelandLakes Added the lake ‘Mjösa’ (lake near Hamar in Norway) Added and Exaggerated lots of lakes in FinlandWastelands Added 3 wastelands in NorwayRenamed the following: Locations (only corrections. Additionally, renamed all locations to the standardized form): Lubeck >Lübeck Kopparberget > Linde Kyrkslätt > Sjundeå Sikkalatva > Siikalatva Joutsa > Sysmä Koppo > Koppö Kotka > Kymi Ulfsby > Ikalis Somero > Lohja Salo > Sauvo Kouvola > Elimäki Fredrikshamn > Veckelax Lahti > Hollola Tammerfors > Birkala Hjelmeland > Ryfylke Glommadal > Glommadalen Jaeren > Jæren Vestglomma > Hedmarksvidda Tryssil > Trysil Tönset > Tynset Höfn > Holmur Renamed all the Canary Islands base names to use native Guanche names (while keeping the Spanish ones for the dynamic location localization)
Provinces:reworked the following: Lappland/Lappmarks Österbotten Karelia Renamed the following: Bohus Län > Båhus Akershus Län > Akershus Bergenhus Län > Bergenhus Areas:
>>2134848There are vast areas of arable land in africa that are bigger than euro countries who get 10 million provincesTheres no reason why you can't build an empire there
Cultures:Huge overhaul in north and east. Religions: Renamed Suomenusko to Muinauisusko Reworked the distribution of the different religions
Languages:The first screenshot is Language Families; the second is Languages; the third is Dialects.
Markets: And that's all for today! See you on Wednesday with another Tinto Talks about the Columbian Exchange and the Colonial Revolution, and Friday, with the Tinto Flavour for England. Cheers!
Well, this thread will slide into purgatory for a few days, but there is already an unused EU5 thread right here.>>2126226
>>2134920and where are you getting the domesticated animals in big enough numbers without some arab or european trading them for stuff?
>>2134932I like how much detail Iceland hasIt is nice to have every little place in the game well designed with interesting geography
>>2134932It's very autistic but it kind of bugs me how Iceland's capital location just manages to miss the little blob of much more habitable oceanic climate and flatlands terrain.
>>2134943We only post in threads started by the Paradox employee who reposts diaries
>>2134943We'll just get a new thread on Wednesday
>Balkanoid in the Scandinavia thread complaining about the devs quickly answering questions in a fresh 9 page thread instead of their old 1000 page schizo threadKEK
>>2133467>Kievwhat is this russiphile hatespeech?
>>2135165Isn't the "Russian" way of spelling it also the English way?
>>2135166I believe that their contention is that the anglicization is based off the Russian pronunciation instead of the Ukrainian one. The short answer is yes. If you check any English text published before Russia invaded it will be printed as Kiev. Ukraine has had some kind of propaganda/relations campaign for years to try and have that changed but nobody cared before the war became a hot topic.
>>2135166it was always called Kyiv, chud
How fast can I remove S*mi people?
>>2135223depends on how much money you want to waste on an army stationed there and consuming all of sami region food
>>2135223Depends on how fast you can get cultural hegemon
>>2134892Why is there a weird GAN filter over this, does youtube do that automatically?
>>2134921The harbors seem arbitrary to the point of being wrong at places. What is their process for determining them?
>>2135249>What is their process for determining them?Given how they immediately accepted every single change and suggestion regarding harbors on the forums, I'm guessing they don't have one lol
>>2135253I can see a lot of the other decisions on some level, but it really seems just plainly incorrect not to have green at the old Finnish regional capital (Åbo) and having green at the current capital, which was basically a purposeful construct made to distance Finland from Sweden. The current capital was a small town that grew only after Sveaborg (Suomenlinna) fortress was set up there.
>>2135253>>2135263Paradox is bending to insane nationalists from irrelevant countries because they don't want to piss them off. Harbors have to be everywhere so every shithole can form some giant overseas empire.
>>2135263Helsinki has a better harbor than Turku, it's irrelevant that it wasn't built up, that's not the criteria for natural harbor. The actual problem is that Turku doesn't have it's own. They probably just want to force historical outcomes with that though
>>2135269natural harbors aren't some rare thing lmao
>>2135280If you split any coastline enough you'll find a harbor
Renamed all the Canary Islands base names to use native Guanche names (while keeping the Spanish ones for the dynamic location localization)
>1. What lead to choosing Sápmi People instead of Sámi People? This is like saying "France People" instead of "French People", rather odd?>2. Are there Sámi people in central Norway and Sweden? It seems I can see some on the map but maybe their minorities in other locations are two small to see? I made a post about southerly Sámi in the previous thread for further reading: post1. We'll take a look at that, thanks.2. Yes:>Does Sweden start with any colonies in the north? If so, could we see the Colonies Map? No, these are the ones that you have available at the start:
>>2135289WOKED
>Is Stockholm the one city in Sweden, and Visby, Åbo, and Kalmar towns? Is that why they are highlighted on the 3D-map? > Greenland as a vassal of Norway is still a thing ? Yes:
>>2135294What a horrible face to look at. He's going to lead his men into battle.
>>2135296He is the most European European to ever European
>>2134908I wonder how/if Paradox will handle Denmark during the Kingless Time. It should really be a situation where Denmark is mostly ruled by the von Holstein family, and the assassination of Duke Gerhard of Holstein leading to the ascension of King Valdemar "Atterdag" IV and reunification of Denmark.The history of this period is pretty crazy and a his actions are what later led to the Kalmar Union.
>>2133467Makes me wonder why they don't call Cusco and Aztecs Tier 2 given these stats.
>>2135335These aren't stats. This is the forums "who do you want to play" thread mentions collated. Eu4's actual stats had France and Enlgand miles ahead of everyone else for one.
