>Zoomie, playing Warcraft 3 campaign for the first time>Normal difficulty>Missions have no challenge, just steamroll everything without even needing to remember to use stuff>Hard difficulty>Way too fucking hard, every mission becomes a grinding slog where you have to make a max pop army at the start and it takes an hour to beatWhat gives lads. I can't really nerf myself enough for normal to be fun but it feels like hard is designed for people that know the levels already and have played a bunch online. Original btw, not reforged, and I have healthbars displayed with a script so its not that.
>>2151152Just keep playing until you get better. Use control groups, memorize spell hotkeys. There's a handful of missions that are absurdly difficult, mut 90% isn't that bad. Always mix in siege units since the damage buildings take is crushingly low from most other sources. Use static defense at home and be strategic with your assaults - kite enemies, take quick expansions, attack the base when the army is moving out, etc.
>>2151152Git gud or git filtered kiddo
>>2151152Any specific missions you're struggling with, for example? Name a couple. I recall the undead campaign being a bitch early on when you have very little unit choice and just have to hammer everything with hordes of ghouls. Oh and the last undead mission in TFT is one that I had to cheese by surrounding Illidan with shades.Speaking of, cheese away! Mass towers, invisibility, sneak around with zeppelins etc. The AI cheats so you might as well give them a taste.
>>2151152Work, work
git gud
I need to know what missions you find too easy. If you find the first missions in the campaigns too easy, brother, just stick with normal.
Difficulty problems aside, why do you guys think almost no other RTS copied the RPG elements in wc3, why does everyone want to be starcraft so much. Favorite element so far is exploring the map and finding creep camps and merchants for items, and having your hero level up throughout each campaign is genius. >>2151225>Always mix in siege units since the damage buildings take is crushingly low from most other sources.One thing that impressed me is how good the enemy AI is regarding those, you really need to keep them protected because the fuckers make a beeline for my meatwagons every time. I don't remember the AOE2/AOM campaign doing that.>>2151429I played most of the Human campaign on normal after trying a couple of missions on hard, then have sort of been swapping between on Undead. I finally did the mission where you have to kill three mages, I ended up cheesing by just spamming Frost Wyrms, the Knight/Griffin combo just shredded my army so fast I couldn't micro my dudes quick enough. Now I'm on the final mission after, defending Kel'Thuzad, which after 1 try seems impossible. HOWEVER I'm now learning you can change the fucking game speed from the menu which seems like something that should have been in the tutorial because the first guide I read said this mission is borderline impossible on fast.>>2151585Last 2 missions of the Human campaign (burning the ships and Frostmourne) were super easy on normal, but maybe the scaling gets better on the other campaigns. To be honest I'd much rather just play on normal and leave hard mode to the sweaty online players, but it feels like normal is designed for no control groups no micro no abilities and hard is 45 minutes of ballbusting.
>>2151595I sympathize with this them. I found that normal was too easy, too. The difficulty on Hard was inconsistent at times and there's 2-3 missions that felt like absolute cock and ball torture to me. I'm guessing that the difficulty is more consistent on normal.
>>2151595>why do you guys think almost no other RTS copied the RPG elements in wc3It works in WarCraft because its a fantasy setting, having a bunch of heroes leveling up and picking up items is part and parcel of the fantasy genre. It wouldn't work in Command & Conquer's semi-real world setting, could maybe work in StarCraft's sci-fi setting, but in general, it mostly a fantasy thing. Which does show how great the game is in that the OG devs were able to lean hard into the genre to create unique mechanics no other RTS has.Age of the Ring mod for Battle for Middle Earth had a much more simplistic variation in their campaign, certain heroes could pick up certain items in certain missions but it was generally locked to specific characters. >>2151595>Now I'm on the final mission after, defending Kel'Thuzad, which after 1 try seems impossible.The final undead mission is usually the first mission that fucks people up because its essentially 1 v 3, and no real way to cheese the mission because the final 2-ish minutes have a giant wave of steam tanks to fuck your defenses with. It was the first mission I had to cave and watch a playthrough for.Basically, use any excess gold to build extra black citadels at the entrances to the altar to help defend.The Orc campaign was a nasty difficulty jump for me, because I feel the Orcs heal isn't as reliable as the undead or human, getting used to it was a pain in the ass, especially for the Cenarius mission.
>>2151595There were many RTSes that already had heroes long before WC3. Blood and Magic or Jurrasic Primitive Wars come into mind. Both from 90's.
>>2151595> why do you guys think almost no other RTS copied the RPG elements in wc3Because it’s not actually that popular. Age of mythology sold a SHITLOAD less than aoe2. Wc3 got popular because of the maps. Everyone in highschool would trade custom scenarios; we’d spend more time crafting some stupid DBZ episode into a scenario than actually playing the game itself. Not many people I knew liked the base game itself, BECAUSE of the rpg mechanics
>>2153306I agree to this to some extent. Hero gameplay in RTS isn't actually all that engaging. It's fun in some ways and for some people. In general, it's kind of a clunky concept. Warcraft 3 did a phenomenal job that considered.
>>2153392They did so well that fans got rid of the clunky RTS mechanics and created the most successful game genre ever
>>2153400I guess the truth some people were/are unwilling to face is that MOBAs just cut the clunk and clutter out of hero-based RTS games
>>2153613i want to see how league-like sc2 would be if it actually has moba heroes and mechanics, the game is already very fast and not clunky at all
>>2153663Aeon of strife is a custom map in SC2 anon.
Holy shit how am I meant to do the Orc chapter 6, the one where you have to send your army on Zeppelins. There's too many fucking Gryphons, raiders and wyverns just die before they can kill them all and trying to destroy the aviary is a nightmare because everything runs a beeline towards catapults the second you put them down. Even a max capped army dropping gets wiped out before it destroy enough of their base and then they rebuild before I can send a second army so there's even more fucking GRYPHONS. I HATE these Gryphons dude.
>>2151152Hard is rough, especially in the expansion.I ended up tapping out in one of the UD missions.
>Arthas/Kerrigan gets corrupted by the Undead/Zerg and gets the last laugh in the expansion after a setback in the original game>Jaina/Raynor goes their own path after losing their partner and forms an alliance with the Orcs/ProtossIf it ain't broke, don't fix it.
>>2151152>Hard difficulty>Way too fucking hard, every mission becomes a grinding slog where you have to make a max pop army at the start and it takes an hour to beatthis is just a skill issueyou need to go faster because the ai expands too
>>2154269bro it's not even a hard missionwipe out light blue in 20 minutes and the final battle against dark blue takes 5 minutes
>>2154474Yeah turns out I was way underestimating Tauren, and had totally forgot about how broken Bloodlust is.>>2154468>you need to go fasterHonestly I'm finding the opposite, what I needed to do is build 20 towers on my base and then correctly figure out what unit combinations are best, the micro turned out not to be as important as I thought apart from making the most of my hero abilities and not fucking up with my catapults. It's quite satisfying.
OP here, this is my limit. I can't do it, even using a guide and saves. I feel like I'd have to spend way too much time until I get the perfect micro and don't make a single mistake. Upside is the orc campaign was super fun on Hard, felt by far the most balanced and satisfying. Going to just see if I can do this on normal and stop them getting past the human base lol.
>>2153613Managing an economy isn't clunk and clutter, but I can see how an increasingly browned customer base would result in some simplification being embraced
>>2162461WCIII barely had any economy management. Trying to use that as an argument is a concession.
>>2162504>barely had economy management>as much as any other rts of the time
>>2162528LMAOWC3 economy was extremely dumbed down. The most popular RTS games had the least economy management and WC3 had the most bare bones economy of the big titles.
>>2162535How was wc3 dumbed down compared to starcraft
>>2162562>he's actually defending wc3 economy>brings out Starcraft of all games to contrastlook, it's as complex as the game need it to be, but that's more pathetic than the earlier 70 IQ take about economy management
>>2162535>>2162570Most games do not have an upkeep system. It's a huge learning curve for new players and completely counterintuitive to how RTS usually play.
>>2162570>non answer I accept your concession
>>2162581That mechanic is more like making the food limit soft instead of hard. It's not especially complex. It speaks more to the idea that the economy is simple. I'd argue that something like Counter-Strike has equivalent level of complexity to the economy.In but this exchange was more about mirroring a shit flinger's retarded brain goop. Economy in Warcraft 3 is kind of like the action economy in chess. Both players just get one move. There's barely anything noteworthy there, but it plays into a larger picture.
>>2151152That's how it is with every strategy game, there needs to be challenging difficulty mode between normal and hard.
>>2162622Arguably, that's every game, and even then you have problems. If you have infinite development resources, I think 5 is a golden number.Starcraft 2 had it right with 4 difficulty settings and achievements. Achievements are a good innovation in general.
>>2162588Ah I see the issue here, you don't know what economy is
>>2162679Words aren't perfect vessels, and no that's not the problem.The issue is that a shit flinger comes up with an extremely pointless objection about the economy management of Warcraft 3 of all games. There's extreme amounts of economy management in every MOBA if you really extend what you mean.It's a purposeful misunderstanding by a person who didn't have anything to say. I don't know if you're him or just misguided and kind of slow in the head.
>>2162735I am him and your ability to not understand what economy is is rivaled only by your inability to comprehend what you're reading or follow a reply chain
>>2162749So humor me for a moment then.A hero based RTS is kind of clunky as a concept. This is the topic you inserted your retardation into.Seems like you're just retarded then. You don't know what any words mean.
>>2162763>humor me for a moment>proceeds to say nothingYou are actually brown
>>2162777The implicit request was to make the case you aren't just being retarded. Seems like you can't even pick up on that.
>>2162782This is hilarious. Seeing you trying to use language is like watching a jeet trying to use a toilet
>>2162785There's so much you're not picking up on that it's crazy. On a scale of 1-10, how self-aware do you think you are?
>>21627909/10
>>2162939Considering the circumstance, there's a really easy way to tell if you gave yourself too high of a score. Do you realize you were being a monkey? If no, you were 3 at best.Do you know WHY you were being a monkey? If you have no internal answer to that, anything above a 6 is silly.
>>2151152Reign of Chaos is pretty easy, all things considered. However, there is a pretty notable difficulty spike in some TFT missions, especially in the Undead campaign.
>>2151152Reforged fucked up
>>2151152>it feels like hard is designed for people that know the levels alreadySo retry a couple times until you know the level
>>2151595WC3 AI is hard coded to go insane for heros and siege units. They have a retarded priority because they kill buildings fast.You can cheese the AI with Mortar team, a paladin and a bunch of rifles.Mortar team draws everyone's aggro and you can go and kill their workers while the paladin heals the team, it is really stupid.
>>2151152Play Warcraft II pepega
>>2151152>hard is too hardThere are only 2-3 maps that are truly difficult. That one undead map where you have to assemble the key to the elf gate and two others I forget.
>>2159452Only mission I did on Hard (for easter egg). It was great but it was fitting to fight overwhelming odds for fate of world, entire campaign like that wouldn't be fun
>>2151152It was pretty difficult for me when I was like 9. I replayed it on hard when it was remastered and killed Archimonde at the first base before the timer ran out. I also discovered that creep buildings dropped items, up to the mask of death in quality. Even as a little kid I was an autismo that built farm houses and towers near creep buildings.
>>2151152>Normal is too easy>Hard is too hardA tale as old as videogames.
