This game has spoiled me as far as QoL in gaming goesI don't care if you like it or not, if you're a SucKom moldy sandwich hugger or campaignlet or whatever, what I'm saying is that the QoL that this game has introduced is by far the best experience in controlling anything in an RTS and makes me uncomfortable to play anything else now. I want this level of easiness to play to another game like Age of Empires or even Starcraft clones. Runs on any potato seamlessly with 8v8 people as well, looks incredible, is a proper sandbox and supports modding as well on top of being free.But I don't want more BAR. I want others to realize how much they have been sucking lately and how mogged can they be. I want more RTS with different flavors and rules in my life, not only more TAs, but with this level of quality.
>>2193516>Runs on any potato seamlesslyLikewise I can't speak for how the game is to actually play, being a mostly Brood War and Turn Based bab, but similar to you it's spoiled me on the fucking optimization, turning this game on made me question whether anyone else was even trying. Haven't seen a game so smooth since MT Framework was new.And then they somehow improved performance when adding in the new lighting? Sheeeeeeeeit
>>2193516Zero-K is ugly as fuck but it has every major feature BAR does and a few extra like auto skirmish.
>>2193516>This game has spoiled me as far as QoL in gaming goesWait till you play Zero-K.BAR and Zero-K share the same game engine, but, where BAR focuses on graphics, Zero-K focuses on gameplay and mechanics.>>2193533>And then they somehow improved performance when adding in the new lighting?That was down to a well known issue with the GUI, there was an option to fix it over a year before the Lightbringer update, but the decision was made to hold back on the fix in order to increase the impact of the update.
>>2193516it lacks any humanity
Yeah, I played Zero-K for a while, then picked up DoK, which even has pretty much the same unit composition (raid, riot, skirmish, artillery, assault, AA), and out of habit I wanted to put my railguns neatly atop the crest of a dune with a single right-click-drag but it didn't work...
>>2193642Zero-K is fucking great, but it surprisingly runs worse on my laptop(as in barely) while BAR can easily handle 1v1 or even 2v2Shame.
>>2193877>out of habit I wanted to put my railguns neatly atop the crest of a dune with a single right-click-drag but it didn't worklol, had the same, I went into DoK after playing spring engine games
>>2193516What does it do better than AoEII in QoL terms?
>>2193642>>2193710ZeroK non-players can leave
I will not join your discord server
ZeroPlayers are the most obnoxious bunch on the board. Their ugly Cruelty Squad looking game is only remembered by proxy of SupCom and BAR but will never ever shut up about it
>>2195329Nah, BARbois are worse.They can't accept that BAR is "SupCom at home" and ZeroK has better mechanics.Not saying it's bad, it triumphs in its mediocrity and holds a comfortable niche between the two, but will never hold a candle to their strengths.The problem is BAR has been copying SupCom for so long it's never going to break out. Even their latest rebalance is shaping up to bring the game more in line with SupCom.
>>2195384This is a BAR thread
>>2195390It's more of a thread about QoL.
>>2195384>The problem is BAR has been copying SupCom for so long it's never going to break out.This! Bar will never be something special until it shakes the chains of emulation and steps out of SupComs shadow.The SpringEngine is a fantastic game engine and capable of so much more than BAR uses it for, but the BAR devs are content to sit on tradition and afraid to upset the playerbase. BAR could easily pull ahead of ZeK if it (ironically) took some lessons from ZeK and mixed up the formula.
>>2193516>say retard>get bannedFuck off BAR mod cucks
>>2195384Why would I accept that when it's older than SupCom?
>>2195970Because you're making a common mistake in thinking that.Advocates want you to belive a mod, of a mod, of a mod of a mod running on a different game engine is the original mod.Under that same logic SupCom is TA, which predates all those mods.
>>2196033No that's dumb. BA isn't that different from BAR except for Legion.
yea its hard to go from games where you can scroll in/out to fixed camera distance bullshit
>>2196125>BA isn't that different from BARBut BA is not BAR. They exist as two different entities and the existence of BAR does not predate SupCom.
I've been playing BAR and ZK just a bit, but BAR is just at first sight just more developed by far and it's really goodWhat makes ZK better in your opinion?
>>2196730Doesn't cling to the old TA unit roster so much. Doesn't have nearly as much bloat as BAR with its superfluous units and buildings. Units can actually see shit - in BAR most of them are so blind that their view ranges is about half their weapons' ranges. Cleverly streamlined economy without being primitive.
>BAR>Zero-KBoth are TA clones which is kind of gay, SupCom is better than TA so Sanctuary: Shattered Sun is the one to wait for.
>>2196861Could you elaborate on those?
>>2193516>Runs on any potato seamlesslyCrashes and burns on AMD cards. I'm talking hardlocks the comp where you have to turn it off.
>>2197319>Crashes and burns on AMD cardsDisagree, but I'm running the Linux version so ymmv.I get memory crashes instead :-(
>>2196730>Streamlined costs.Metal cost = Energy cost = Buildpower costConstructor reclaim rate = build powerMakes it so much balance metal/energy economy, and now you can actually easily tell how long something will take build. Lower reclaim rates also mean that you can't just have 1 constructor reclaim aftermath of a huge battle in seconds. Wreck fields actually become valuable areas and you gotta fight to secure control over them.>Diminishing returns on energy to metal conversionThis is more a FFA thing, but i dont like how you can get a highly productive economy while hiding the corner of the map that has zero resources whatsoever>Unit roster BAR suffers from the original TA baggage, having a lot of units that are way too niche or sometimes just useless>TerraformingPersonally i dont care about that, but its supposed to be really col that you can build walls, trenches and ramps of all kinds of shape. Too bad the interface is clunky, and the pathfinding AI hates player-made ramps.>Advanced unit AIThat one i also dont care too much about, but it is nice that you are at lower risk of losing half your army because you stopped looking at your dumb units for a few secondsBAR devs have done tremendous work giving Balanced Annihilation a visual makeover (And sneakily renaming it from Balanced Annihilation: Remastered into something more distinct). They have proven that just giving it more modern visuals is enough to attract a decent player base. It is unfortunate there arent enough dedicated autists who would apply the same makeover to Zero-K
>>2197207I don't feel like writing a whole dissertation, so I'll just focus on the economy part because it's designed so elegantly.In Zero-K you only have one type of mex and no metal makers - you only get extra metal by overdriving your mexes connected to energy grid with excess energy at a diminishing rate.Unit costs are very legible - a unit that costs 100 metal also costs 100 energy and 100 buildpower, so at a factory with 10 buildpower consuming 10 of each resource per second it takes 10 seconds to build one.Energy is used almost only for factories, mexes and overdrive. Most units and turrets don't need any, though some larger turrets need to be connected to a grid with sufficient power, but still don't consume any energy while firing.The first factory you pick is build for free and instantly, allowing you to do stuff right away. You can build the same units as your teammate by placing a cheap 'factory plate' next to his factory. Resources are shared evenly between teammates.
>>2197207>BAR vs ZeroKhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKkyNN1zrf8
>>2198154>It's just BAR but different>And much more uglyI'm dissapointed because the differences look enticing to try new things, but it is absurdly ugly and unpolished. I wish the ZK team spend as much time developing the game as they do shilling it for the 50 players it got.
>>2198867>muh graphicsOpinion disregarded.
>>2193710>BAR focuses on graphicslol what
how do learn this game
>>2207939you don't fuck off
>>2208245>only person posting in the BAR thread is a zero-k player who wants to cancel the gamekinda funnyso many unit commands. at first I found it strange that only artillery units could use attack area but then I realized its functionally is exactly the same as attack line. the units don't randomly select a position in the circle, it just assigns each unit in your group an attack location marker the repeat toggle is probably my favorite functionality. automating transport drops and unit construction with combat engies feels cool. I wish there was a better way to automate repairs. I've been playing bots and using lazarus/butler bots to keep a welder push going but it's annoying to micro the positioning of the repairs bots>play scavengers with a friend>get completely fucking washed each timedamn this mode seems unforgiving. I assume there's some strat that trivializes it and it's a nightmare otherwise?>watch a beginner's guide>it talks about player's roles in team games and that how you play is predetermined by what map you pick and where you startwell that seems lame. is that really how multiplayer plays out?
>>2208510>I wish there was a better way to automate repairs. Make a custom keybind to select units below a certain % of health, hold shift when zooming out to find, tell them to move within the visible repair circle range.
>>2208510>>it talks about player's roles in team games and that how you play is predetermined by what map you pick and where you start>well that seems lame. is that really how multiplayer plays out?Not really just don't play Crimson IsthmusAnd you can set an area holding R for repair and then click Repeat On and that unit will run to repair anything on that
>>2207939spectate people
>>2193516Such as?
>>2208510>roles in team gamesavoid All That and Isthmus (the maps)
AAAAAH FIX THE SERVERSI WANT TO BLOW PEOPLE UP
>>2198867>I wish the ZK team spend as much time developing the game as they do shilling it for the 50 players it got.ZK team is basically non-existent. ZK has been in maintenance mode for many years now, and i dont think there has been a single point in time when it was not ugly. Even when in relatively "active development", ZK never had a lead 3D modeler who would be in charge of unit models. All ZK has is a mishmash of various unit models created by different artists at different times, with no unifying visual style whatsoever.Redoing all those models would be a massive undertaking. There is nobody volunteering to do it for free, and the game does not generate any revenue to hire anyone who would do it for money.
>>2222998>and the game does not generate any revenue to hire anyone who would do it for money.You're telling meThe shills are doing itFor FREE?
T1 Legion Naval is out!And they're shit! Not only do they look ugly bit they're asymmetrically designed to the point of clearly impractical design choices. The hybrid heat/drone ship is the only interesting one of the bunch.
>>2225538i cant play naval to save my life
so are you niggas gonna post screenshots to sell the game or what?
>>2228075game is for playing, not sellingtake your executive function pills and just play it if you're interested
>>2228573idk if i'm interested there are no pictures
>>2228573>game is for playing, not sellingI wouldn't be sure about that, they have plenty of banners saying they accept 'donations' and those donations are used to 'support' the devs by providing them with a wage.
>>2208510Sounds like you'd enjoy Zero-K more.
>>2223194Zero-K fags are pretty much loonix evangelists
it intimidates me
>>2231238Can you do us a favor, stop with the jelly and leave it at the door.Every BAR thread is the same:>Zero-K has better mechanicsYes, we know>SupCom came firstYes, we know>Let's try and shit on SupCom's/Zero-K's fansOr maybe we could actually discuss what makes BAR the better game...It appears to me out of the last half dozen threads, any actual discussion of BAR boils down to how hostile the community are (which your actions are highlighting) and how legion/balance changes are slowly turning it to shit. And this thread is no exception. So, please, lets try and have a positive discussion about what makes BAR a game worth playing, if you're truly a BARfag share some of your positive stories.Personally, and contentiously, I'm liking the way Legion is coming across, although it needs a land based Heat-Drone carrier that's not the Rampart. And the legion commanders ability to spawn a small army is silly, spawning drones would have been inkeeping with the teams mechanics. I also hate the way the AI likes to 'improve' my T1 Mex's and Rampart and is ingornant of their utility purpose.
Why discuss BAR when we could discuss Zero-K instead?
any idea how do hardware bans in BAR work? They have some fingerprinting shit which recognizes my smurf accounts after I change the IP and remove all BAR files from disk
>>2195774>The SpringEngine is a fantastic game engine and capable of so much more than BAR uses it forTrue, but it's also single-threaded which means adding game-side logic kills performance. The units are insanely unresponsive which kills my desire to play BAR. Zero-K is fine because you don't micro the units anyway.
>>2234418Why would you smurf if you don't know how to evade?
>>2234680If you're playing against humans then you do need to micro. Units do have some automation to dodge projectiles and close in or kite, but they do not know which engagements to take or avoid. Maximising your unit engagement while minimising theirs also has a massive impact, which the AI doesn't know how to utilise effectively. Zero-K has more unit micro than BAR since attrition is more important, but less economy micro than BAR due to higher build power of constructors for their price, quadratic economy and no energy converters.
>>2225538>The hybrid heat/drone ship is the only interesting one of the bunch.I like it. But only because the AI is bugged and the it hasn't been fixed:If you issue a fight command it will sit back like a carrier, attacking with its drones. And the heat-ray will only be used defensively when enemies approach it.If you issue a move command it will charge in and use the heat-ray offensively (beam weapons do more damage up close).It gives the unit a nice duality.Unfortunately the model sucks.Sadly the devs are planning to fix it by having the fight command ignore the drones so it sits at maximum range with the heat-ray (where it does minimum damage).
>>2234418read the source code, I think CPU ID is used as well
>>2234418why would you smurf in a lobby based gamethere's no matchmaking to dodge
>>2235962lobbies can be limited by OS levelsometimes you want to stomp on other low level players with cheese stratsyou want an alt account to yell nigger
>>2234418There is an entire community of BAR smurfs who will glady show you how to ban evade with impunity. Would you like to know more?
>>2235962because i got banned for not being up to date on what words are not allowed in moral codes of western fallen nations and then banned some more for drawings or something, not sure, they don't even give an actual reason but copy paste a paragraph from their TOCthere is no way i'm humiliating myself by kneeling before these discord trannies and asking for forgiveness
>>2238082>there is no way i'm humiliating myself by kneeling before these discord trannies and asking for forgivenessThen don't. Step up your game.
FUCK BAR MODSI'LL SAY RETARD IN MY GAME AND YOU'LL JUST SEETHE AND BAN MEOOPS TOO BAD I CANNOT BE BANNED
>>2238082>Waah I chimped out on chat and got banned! The West has fallen because people don't want to play public games with people who act like niggers.
>>2195384Above all BAR is an mptranny game made by mptrannies for mptrannies
>>2239932>BAR is a SupCom ripoff that identifies as a different mod.
>>2193516I've been checking out BAR recently. I preferred the way SupCom faction look, even if it was cookie cutter. In BAR I can't tell the factions apart as they're very samey, which makes it seem, pardon my retardese, soulless
>>2241356>In BAR I can't tell the factions apart as they're very samey, which makes it seem, pardon my retardese, soullessThis is a problem with BAR's dev direction, they want the game to have eSpurts potential so every unit must be balanced, countered and have an equivalent on the opposite team. They also insist on parity between factories, which means the unit roster is ultimately both bloated and bland.As for the soul thing, you'll never get soul when your focus is on copying another product.
>>2241394>every unit must be balanced, countered and have an equivalent on the opposite teamNo no, my problem isn't even the functionality of a roster per se, I can stomach that somewhat, it's the visuals that suck the mostThere's that loading screen with two commanders or whatever, and if it weren't for the colors, I wouldn't be able to tell them apart at all. Meanwhile, have this random pic for comparison>As for the soul thing, you'll never get soul when your focus is on copying another product.Fair
>>2241394This is how you can tell the devs are TA-poisoned. The entirety of supcom's lifespan we all clamoured for more faction diversity and GPG waffled because they just didn't want to have to balance any asymmetry. Only the TA purists liked the near-perfectly symmetrical factions, because TA was nothing but Arm mirror matches.
>>2241394>This is a problem with BAR's dev direction, they want the game to have eSpurts potentialYeah this isn't true at all. They would much rather the playerbase was casuals. They hate everything esports. Any changes that benefit the competitive players is because the users cried long enough. Most changes get overruled.
>>2193516I enjoyed BAR, especially since it's free and open source and Linux native. Very high quality for an open source game.Very active multiplayer community with tons of replays you can watch, including sometimes hilarious chat.https://www.beyondallreason.info/replaysHowever, I found like many in this subgenre, the games take forever to get going and tend to drag on a bit long.After struggling to get into Planetary Annihilation for years, I tried it again and really liked it.When BAR is just starting to get interesting, PA is well on its way or even approaching the end game.In addition to shorter matches, it has a larger variety of really good AI and more metastrategy.Most annihilation games suffer from surrender syndrome, while PA gives you opportunities to surprise your opponent when you're up against the wall.Also air is a lot more useful, unlike BAR where you can outright cancel it without much difficulty.So I thank BAR for re-introducing me to PA.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mO1N_gehg-M
>>2242229>including sometimes hilarious chat.
is it even possible for them to fix the lag issues? I've be stalling on replacing my ethernet cable, so for now I'm on >600mbps which is bearable. But it's crazy how even with that the game just stops working after 30 minutes.
>>2242100>Yeah this isn't true at all. They would much rather the playerbase was casuals. They hate everything esports.>Just ignore the player OpenSkill ratings>And the season leaderboards>You should also ignore the official 1v1 Alpha tournaments which feature cash prizes, cash ain't real in this economy...>Might as well ignore the dedicated tournament page on the website while you're at it,>And stay off the discord for good measure...You had me fooled.
>>2241394>every unit must be balanced, countered and have an equivalent on the opposite team. They also insist on parity between factories, which means the unit roster is ultimately both bloated and bland.>This is bad because i'm a shitter
>>2241394....would you prefer the game be unbalanced?are you retarded?anti competition zoomers are so stupid
>>2242660Being bland and bloated has nothing to do with being a shitter, it's the result of shit design choices.
>>2242699>would you prefer the game be unbalanced?If it makes the game more fun and interesting, absolutely.Do you object to people having fun.Were you traumatised by a "fun" incident late one night involving your daddy, a 6 pack of bud light and half a pickle...
>>2242783bad balance doesn't diversify content, it reduces itjust play against easy bots if you like unbalanced situations. there's even a handicap setting if you want
Anyone that thinks balancing makes the game less fun doesn't actually understand what balancing is. Educate yourselves and read https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/334920/view/3875973926280115015
>>2242789>bad balance doesn't diversify content, it reduces itDisagree, casual players will happily use, abuse, avoid or workaround unbalanced mechanics. This actually fosters diversity.On the other hand, eSpurters and tryhards will constantly make use of exploitable opportunities in order to increase their ranking because they need that +1 skill rating to justify themselves.
>>2242809see >>2242807
>>2242807>In any case, the rule is responsible for keeping the 100 or so units in Zero-K unique, useful, and interesting.>At the other end there are games that seem balanced [such as BAR], but at the expense of any interesting unit variation.
>>2242783>>2242768The first time i read about people complaining about balance i thought it was a memelord trying something new, but then I realized there's people that really don't understand the game, a game, or rules, or design choices. For these people they only see the product on surface and take it as a movie, graphics and fee fees. Never go indepth of why things are the way they are, nor have the curiosity of doing so. They never look for improvement of oneself, and would rather play into a sandbox with infinite resources. I guess that's fine, but in an RTS is just abysmally retarded. Then again, these people cannot describe what is "balance" or "fun" to save their own statement. They just "feel" and "know" what they want.These people do not play the videogame. Do not listen to anti-balance fags. They're noise.
>>2242826I'm not arguing about BAR. I'm just saying you don't actually know what balance is. If BAR is boring due to its balance then it does seem balanced but it's not actually balanced.
>>2242807Part of what I like about the whole ecosystem of TA-likes and Supcom successors is that it's probably the only genre where game devs treat balance as an integral part of game design and not a customer satisfaction department where you exile underperforming devs to make them quit.I get that this mostly comes from the fact that these projects spin off of balance mods for TA and supcom but it's cool to realize I argued about balance theory with these faggots on GPGNet and the bbs forums back in the day and they actually did something with those ideas they had.
>>2241394You don't need to copy supcom to have distinct factions. The vast majority of RTS games have factions that rlare distinct from each other either visually or functionally, if not both.
>>2242807their design blogs are pretty good
>>2242809You are a retard.
>>2241394>They also insist on parity between factories, which means the unit roster is ultimately both bloated and bland.Yeah, like everyone needs a mobile radar and jammer. I like how Zero-K handled it, despite having even more factories, by letting you morph stationary radars/jammers into mobile units.
if you don't have 1000hrs in game (silver rank) on top of having at least 35OS and you use the word "balance" when talking about this game, you are a fucking retard
>>2242957What I get from these is that competitive players are like naughty children who break their toys and then cry they can't play anymore. A lot of effort must be spent to prevent players from cheesing the fun out of the game.
>>2244298in a manner yes, that's the nature of competition. competitive people are going to optimize and a poorly designed game will break when you try to optimize itall competitions, from athletics to creative to games, have rule sets for this reason. to keep things both fun and fair (balanced)good sportsmanship comes into play of course. most people don't respect bug abuse and consider anyone who exploits bugs to win a fagif you don't find competition fun then don't play competitive games. it's literally your own fault for doing something that upsets you
>>2244298do people like you actually not play to win or perhaps you are just bad at the game and angry about it?
>>2238287
>>2244346>>2244361>it's literally your own fault for doing something that upsets youIt's not that. I'm just saying that after reading these I realized that from the devs' perspective supporting a competitive game is basically unending daycare. You have grown ass people behaving like spoiled brats: playing rough, arguing about it, demanding nerfs, then crying even more after the patch gets released... Then, after the babies are done throwing a tantrum and realize nobody's giving them attention, they go back to playing again, because what else would they be doing? Can't imagine a person who'd willingly put up with this on daily basis.
Engine update deployed
>>2244812Why do you trust your own perception so much when you have never played the game or interacted with its community? Have some doubt in yourself. You'll make better decisions that way.
>>2244812That's how any gamedev job is.
>>2244812>Can't imagine a person who'd willingly put up with this on daily basis.you're describing the vast majority of work dutiesconsumers are retarded and will bitch about anything. devs should focus on making good games
>microing sharp shooter>can't figure out target priority because all vehicle units look the sameAAAAAHHHrolled a couple tumbleweeds into an artillery linethat felt pretty good
I love these fatboisThey can tank an absurd amount of punishment and just stomp the cuntish usual armada defenses
this is the opponent teamdo you play or leave the lobby?
>>2246602>AustrarlianNah thanks, I'm out.
I'm scared of joining online lobbies :(
>>2246874>I'm scared of joining online lobbies :(If you want to try online play start with a game that doesn't require registration (openRA is a good starter), not only is it anonymous but the player base tends to be pretty open and supportive.The problem with game like BAR that are free-entry + ranked is they attract the worst of the ePeeners. BAR has a particularly toxic player base because the majority are playing for rank in a team based game. It's why one of the go to 'tactics' for new players is to build their collectors, suicide and watch the 'pros' play out the rest of the match using their resources. It's a shallow attempt at exploiting the game to the detriment of newbies (who nobody cares about because they're not ranked).
>>2247725but I like BAR
>>2247857Then stick to skirmish. The current AI is barebones but you can make it a challenge by giving it cheats.
>>2246874Just play and learnPeople don't mind anyone and certainly you know, don't talk if you don't want toThe people saying >free-entry + ranked is they attract the worst of the ePeeners>>2247725is overrated and its just """ranked""" anxiety.Play Rotatos, play with friends, play Raptors or Scavengers in coop, play the missions, or play skirmish by yourself. It's alright.
https://youtu.be/h-YlX0IVpzg?t=4993This game is as fun to watch as it is to play it
>>2248147What would be your reaction to me finding that video boring.>45min of econ. >Match is basically nuke vs anti nukes which is why they weren't attacking with their armies. >Bases explode in chain reactions meaning even an indirect hit is enough to cripple the enemy base in its entirety. >When the enemy pushs back it wipes out the enemy base because if the same "all buildings explode" chain reaction.>Even the caster is unsure if the enemy the enemy commander was destroyed during the base wipe or because they suicided/ragequit because, in the end, it all looks the same.
>>2246602>this is the opponent teamseems like an easy win, where's the issue?
>BAR boasts physical projectiles>Projectiles are coded to no-clip allies.
>Like RTS games, hey this one is free people saying great stuff>Download play 2 skirimishes and win>Join Noob Friendly lobby>Try to play MP after few skirimish matches.>Choose some Front Position a 1000 pings move>Move to side Sea Position>Start building up see a free max, build an extractor>1000 pings wtf are you doing bro>play some sea try to be useful by building destroyers>build some naval generators>some times passes dude rolls with subs destroys my naval generators>1000 pings, people writing IDIOT on the naval generators.Why is this genre dead again?
>>2256024What projectile does this?
>>2256024...?
>>2256179Plenty, the weapons are tagged collidefriendly = false,
>>2256024>Friendly fire is still a thingU kno u don kno
>>2255168Is hard to get at that moment we see in the videoThese are the best players playing well coordinated and testing endurance
>>2257346If only you knew.
>>2257382oh noes everythns rong now
>>2258021>everythns rong nowIf by everything, you mean your assumptions yes.Honestly, I don't get your mentality. It's like the BAR community gaslights itself over facts then gets upset when presented with them:SpringEngine copies from SupCom:>"No, that's not true, that's impossible!">SpringEngine devs have gone on the record in interviews saying they were inspired by itBAR came out after SupCom:>"BAR identifies as a different mod">Identifying as something else doesn't make you that somethingBAR projectiles noClip allies>*Insert your gibberish*>Code is as old as the engine.
>>2193516>I want more RTS with different flavors and rules in my life, not only more TAs,Good luck lmao, there was like five original RTS games in last two decades
>>2258316>All this copeI am having fun with BAR tho
>>2194187What is DoK?
>>2264559Desolation of Kareen:It's a pretty generic rts set in soulful universe but with some serious sjw plot issues.It's meme worthy because the whole thing is basically "You should trust women implicitly. Men and religion are evil, even if they're trying to save you from damnation. Women, even when their actions result in genocide should be revered.
>shitcom fag (singular) still having a melty over his dead gamelol lmao
>>2264559Deserts of Kharak
only recently got deep into Dawn of War, learning basic RTS skills. I've improved significantly and even have some multiplayer victories. downloaded BAR and only toyed around for a few minutes in a skirmish, but it almost seems overwhelming. my starting commander unit has like 20 different button/actions and there's a massive amount of units. can anyone spoon-feed me some beginner tips?
>>2279602learn hotkeys instead of clicking as soon as possible, those actions should become second nature, your thoughts should translate to battlefield commands almost seamlessly
>>2228573okay, show me pictures then so i can judge whether i'd be interested in playing this or not
>>2242699>would you prefer the game be unbalanced?yesthe most fun games are those where all the factions are equally imbalanced
>>2281189>the most fun games are those where all the factions are equally imbalancedIf everyone is "imbalanced" then no one is, retard-kunYou don't know what balance is cause you don't learn the games and look upon rules
>>2279602It's not that complicated, those commands are helpful stuff that you will find the use laterArea Mex is very useful, drag a circle and builders and Commanders start capping the Metal Extractors automatically. Repeat On makes the unit do the last action forever, like RepairThe most useful hotkey is ctrl+alt while building to drag a square grid of the same building, like wind gens or mines. You can space the grid while doing this with Z or X. Another cool one is pressing ctrl while ordering units to move. If you do, they'll march at the same speed, making them not break a formation.
>>2281281>If everyone is "imbalanced" then no one is, retard-kunwrong, nigger-kun, because that's called asymmetry. balance implies there is a level of symmetry, doublenigger-kun
>>2281426Asymmetry would imply my big cock on your little plump ass and you wouldn't like thatJust like imbalanced units on your base
>>2281936>he hates imbalance because it reminds him of his time with his uncle every thanksgivingkek
>play front on isthmus>get lucky and destroy your lane opponent base in 5 minutes>he quits>get an erection from that>enemy team calls for restart vote because of him leaving even though he is already dead>one retard in our team votes "yes" and the game stops>call him a retard>get reported>get banned for a week>get banned some more while i was already banned for reasons unknowngame is good but the people are retarded
>>2193516>Trying to build a T2 super cannon>Using T2 builders>Have 6+ builders assigned to the task>I HAVE METAL>I HAVE POWER>Progress is fucking stalled>ETA spazzing out and slowly counting UPWARDS>Adding more builders lowers the stalled timer... which remains stalled at the lower value...What in the fuck am "I" doing wrong? I really liked the game up until the fucking T2 "surprise reveal" when I found out the commander can't (?) actually build anything and every game is now ending with me eventually getting out APM'd by the fucking easy AI because apparently the "perfect for your first game" AI still fucking steamrolls me because I can't micro 51+% of the fucking map AND learn everything about every fucking unit at the same time. Easily one of the best RTS I've played but holy fucking shit I'm tired of the fucking endless APM APM APM APM APKM APM APM APM APM APM APM you lose! because you aren't clicking 20,000 things a second and are actually trying to THINK instead of spamming commands to win.
>>2193516Im glad this game become more popular this is insane.
>"good guys" generic western faction >"bad guys" ebil/nazi/soviet faction>ancient ayyylmaos high tech full of spikes and lasers What gimmick would you like to see on a hypothetical 4th faction?
>>2283798space hitlers
>>2283651build construction towers
>>2284014>>2283651And jammersIf niggas know you are building long range plasma cannons they will target them
>>2193516What the fuck is up with the AI?>Playing SAME AI level>Yesterday not really trying, make a base, experimenting whatever, eventually lose multiple rounds>Today can't even set up a basic fucking base without getting rushed by over half a dozen tanks when I'm just barely starting to make units >I'm actually trying this time and playing more efficiently >I didn't even know about the fucking metal / energy storage tanks my first run>Still fucking lasted longer then than I can now?Is there some sort of auto-difficulty "Left 4 Dead Director-AI" bullshit going on behind the scenes? I know about the radar but am I seriously expected to rush XYZ ASAP every fucking round? Pretty sure I built a radar much later in the previous games than I'm getting wiped at now to boot.
>>2284902Also, why the fuck does the game only download/update ONE map per launch now? I went through the initial bunch on install but it's still consistently doing this?
>>2284902Okay seriously, WHAT IS THIS BULLSHIT?>RUSH 3 miners>RUSH 1 storage>RUSH 2 power>RUSH 1 power storage>Oh the AI already has AIR this time>RUSH Aircraft>DOUBLE BUILD AIR BUILDERS>RUSH to build miners 4+5>RUSH to start building sentries at the same time>Sentry is almost done>AI COUNTERS WITH SOME KINDA FUCKING AIR EMP DRONE I'VE NEVER SEEN UNTIL NOW>Sentry finishes building, can't even fireI'M PLAYING THE SIMPLE FUCKING AI!!! I CAN BEAT THE HARD C&C ZERO HOUR AI WITHOUT LOSING A SINGLE FUCKING BUILDING BUT EVERY FUCKING MOVE I MAKE IN THIS GAME IS INSTANTLY COUNTERED. >Build units firstNO POWERNO METAL>Balance themJESUS FUCKING CHRIST I SHOULDN'T HAVE TO FOLLOW AN EXACT FUCKING SCRIPT ***VERBATIM*** IN ORDER TO STAND A CHANCE.
>>2284933perhaps you shoud disable shit you haven't learned yet. You can disable air units or t2 units with game options. Makes learning the game easier
>>2285030But he's making a very good point, the game is pretty specific on base construction for the first few minutes. Stepping outside this build order is risky and normally spells doom.If the game allowed you to pre-build your base, in a similar manner to Metal Fatigue, it would take away a lot of the inital tedium and make the game more accessible to players who aren't apm sperglords.You'll hate me for saying this but even Zero-K does a better job by allowing you to place your first factory for free allowing you to avoid the inital bore.
>>2285095EXACTLY THISI've been restarting my game dozens of times now trying to figure out what to do, running into a brick wall of>NO POWER>NO METAL>NO UNITSand being forced to reset in order to not waste any time considering I'm fighting an AII FINALLY manage to get a foothold on barely 25% of the map, any attempts to expand are immediately destroyed as I have no fucking clue how to attack units let alone fortifications with an army I'm STILL in the process of "getting around" to building one instead of just reacting while trying to build a defence.>Build the fucking jammer blocker thing (and of course there's several, i used the JUDA whatevery)>Enemy still goes ballistic attacking JUST a fucking T2 powerplant>Final phase now, enemy army is starting to whittle away what little I've managed to build>Fortifications are falling because DECAY due to accidentally moving a builder 85%+ through building an artillery array>Anti air is fucking gone because the anti land artillary either didn't build or can't hit for shit despite a fucking being on a fucking cliff. So long story short, I FINALLY FUCKING WON>Because the AI threw his commander at my wall of towers for NO REASON despite controlling over 75% of the map and bombing me into yet another PERPETUAL>NO METAL!>CAN'T BUILD!!! (Can't build converters FAST enough or GOOD enough to matter either)>You'll hate me for saying this but even Zero-K does a better job by allowing you to place your first factory for free allowing you to avoid the inital bore.Sad thing is I figured out how to queue nearly an entire base before clicking start (except for snap-placement of mines, because of course that doesn't fucking work)This game has gone from one of the best RTS I've ever played to one of the worst GAMES I've ever played. It's starting to feel like every aspect of this fucking thing is designed to look and sound as cool as possible, but secretly designed from the ground up to do nothing but piss me off.
>>2285095>>2285134>players who aren't apm sperglordsWatch a tutorial about blueprints
>>2285148>REAL TIME strategy>Use blueprints like it's fucking FactorioSo the game is just shit then? That's disappointing, they're so fucking close to doing something great but insist on ruining it for no reason.
Zero-K won. You start building units within the first second of a Zero-K battle while you have your constructors building things in a queue. More apm is spent on the frontlines instead for more sophisticated battles.
>>2285163>can't do enough apm>here you can do this>REEEEEE NO LIKE THATOk?>>2285170Then play it
>>2285186Yeah I consider being able to outright copy/paste base layouts as cheating and APM is cringe. Having a copy/paste basic setup also won't prevent many if any of the problems I encounter later in the game, particularly:>Enemy MacGuffin waltzes into your wood-chipper>YOU WIN!!!I'm not even sure how I'm ever supposed to play a satisfying game now, I've never really enjoyed playing RTS against people, though it's been ages since I've tried... Although even the term "metagame" wasn't a thing back then so why even bother?
>>2285197Blueprints are not cheating you actual fucking retard.
>>2285256I don't give a fuck whether or not it's "uhm ackshually" cheating or not you fucking mongoloid. BEING ABLE TO GOOGLE A FUCKING BASE AND COPY IT WITH 0 FUCKING EFFORT MAY AS WELL BE THE SAME DAMN THING.
>>2285197>micro bad but automation also bad>ai too good but also ai too dumbyes, please do not bother with multiplayer
>>2285281Nice job having 0 reading comprehension. >AI steamrolls the whole map>Also suicides for no reason>This is proper game design according to you apparently. Having a fucking MacGuffin character you have to defend instead of a "Town Centre" is fucking cancer game design.
>>2285275No.
Oh I get it knowIt's called 'beyond all reason' because you literally have to be in order to put up with this dogshit design let alone think it's any good.
>>2285298You're just shit at the game and are too stupid to figure out how to balance your econ while blaming the game for it. I figured that out when I was 7 playing Total Annihilation. Why are you more retarded than a 7 year old, anon?
>>2285308Riiiight, it's *my* fault building stops despite having both resources and 6+ builders because I didn't know to do autistic shit like build "construction towers" when EVERYTHING ELSE worked differently and without them....A dozen fucking plates on a stick require less attention than the fucking econ in this game. AND IT ADDS NOTHING.
>>2285308>Use blueprint base>Just do *EXACTLY* ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXY&Z for basic econWhen exactly am I supposed to actually PLAY the fucking thing? At the ass end of T2 when I can finally stop following the fucking METAGAME SCRIPT?
>>2285281>use script to automate process/action>get banned for cheatingIt's a no-win scenario
>>2285329Why are you more retarded than a 7 year old, anon?
This conversation proves that Zero-K won.
This game makes me sad that RTS is a dying genre.
>>2285900No until you play it
>>2285134>I've been restarting my game dozens of times now trying to figure out what to do, running into a brick wall of>>NO POWER>>NO METAL>>NO UNITS>and being forced to reset in order to not waste any time considering I'm fighting an AIget attention span, bro
>>2286329>AI has 0 downtime>Have to build EXACT sequence or lose due to resource shortages>get attention span, broGet a fucking clue, retard.>>2285411Make like the AI commander and fucking kill yourself. Also, nice job ignoring literally EVERY point made in this thread.... Fucking pedophile can't stop talking about 7 year olds.
>>2285900ThisJesus fucking Christ, imagine actually being this fucking deep in denial and defending this game as if single unit win conditions weren't the fucking bane of early RTS games. >>2285411You seem to forget the part where they literally won despite not playing "as well as you when you were 7" cocks deep anyways... Because the game is that fucking shit.
>>2285411I bet you're actually shit at RTS and can only play this game worth a damn because you've literally been playing the exact same fucking game and build order that you googled last year when you were 7.
>>2286655I'm not the one struggling with the easy AI that does nothing and failing at figuring out the simplest thing in the world. It's noone's fault but your own that you're doing stupid shit like building energy and metal storage before they're necessary and blowing your economy up, then not expanding your economy to support what you want to do.
>>2286660>YOU DIDN'T DO EXACTLY XYZ!!!!Exactly my argument you absolute fucking finger-paints-with-his-own-shit-retard. >>2284933>I SHOULDN'T HAVE TO FOLLOW AN EXACT FUCKING SCRIPT ***VERBATIM*** IN ORDER TO STAND A CHANCE.The fact you're claiming I'm building STORAGE too soon, when any other options result in the UI screaming YOU ARE WASTING RESOURCES!!! at me, then somehow simultaneously blaming me for both starting an economy and not building it and enough units despite doing nothing but that proves that both you and this game are literally BEYOND ALL REASON.Fucking kill yourself. Holy fucking shit, wish I had read the thread before installing, the fucking warning signs were all over the place. >>2247725> It's why one of the go to 'tactics' for new players is to build their collectors, suicide and watch the 'pros' play out the rest of the match using their resources.>>2255168>45min of econ. >Match is basically nuke vs anti nukes which is why they weren't attacking with their armies. >Bases explode in chain reactions meaning even an indirect hit is enough to cripple the enemy base in its entirety. >When the enemy pushs back it wipes out the enemy base because if the same "all buildings explode" chain reaction.>Even the caster is unsure if the enemy the enemy commander was destroyed during the base wipe or because they suicided/ragequit because, in the end, it all looks the same.LITERAL FUCKING CANCER.>>2256091>Build something?>1000 pingsYa fuck anyone for thinking they should... I dunno.... Build 3+ extractors in the fucking SPAWN ZONE and maybe a storage container to collect resources while they setup a base.... But I guess that's a RETARD move apparently..... Collecting the resources you start with in an RTS? That's obviously a fucking mid-end game move bro...
>>2286674You build energy storage and metal storage to ease the transition into T2 or to ward against low wind. Neither of these are an issue early. Buliding either before you even have a factory going is going full retard and crippling yourself for no reason. I don't know how you managed to be low IQ enough that you couldn't connect spending the small pool of metal you start with on something with no payoff and not having enough resources to smoothly get a factory off the ground, but you did. Your mom deserves an award for most alcohol chugged while pregnant.
>>2286674>YOU DIDN'T DO EXACTLY XYZthere is no exact build order that you need to follow, even "pros" in tournaments use 1000 different openings for each map. You just need to understand the economy and stop doing retarded shit
>>2286705This.
anon post your replay ID, no one has watched you play and you seem to noob to actually know where you mess up
>>2286705>even "pros" in tournaments use 1000 different openings for each map.That's a load of hog and we all know it. If you're looking to bait him, do better.Changing subject, how are people feeling about the new T1/T2/T3/EX. split they're pushing? Outside of Legion development the devs have been pretty focused on bringing the game more in line with SupCom.
>>2287021>in line with SupComI think upgrading Comms could be very fun.
>>2287021it's not, the number of initially built mexes, solars, winds, turrets, etc., the choice of a lab, a faction and units build order, all that varies from player to player, from map to map and from game to gameof course some choices are more popular that others (just like in every fucking competitive game) but even in tournament we still see exotic stuff, like the guy who went minelayer early in the latest BPL
>>2286642Kek git gud faggot
>>2287154And won his match, and lost another match where he did the same thing by literal pixels because the enemy comm dodged them by the skin of his fucking teeth.
>>2287154>>2287372>Played a gimmick and won because he caught the enemy by surprise>Tried it again and lostThis is the classic fool me once approach. As much as you may like to tout it as 'competitive' the reality is, it's not.So yeah, if you're going to claim it's one of a "1000 different openings" then you also giving credit to his "kill my own econ" as a legit opening, because technically, it is...
>>2287447No, it wasn't. It was literally a matter of the comm barely missing the mines the second time around, and if he'd manually detonated and thrown his army at the comm right then he'd have won. He didn't lose because he went minelayer early, minelayers are an extremely cheap unit and strategically useful. He lost because his opponent had a more solid gameplan and execution elsewhere and he failed to capitalize.
>>2287447you clearly havent seen any of this
>>2287662thats a whole lot of cope kiddo
>>2288024You can literally watch the last tournament on Youtube.
>>2288058>Played a gimmick and won because he caught the enemy by surprise>Tried it again and lostDid I stutter.
>>2288452Mine layers aren't a gimmick and if he'd been paying more attention he'd have won the second time he tried it too. You don't lose a match because you built an early mine layer, they're half the cost of an instigator. That's too cheap to cause a failure cascade the way rushing a stronger T1 vehicle like a Pounder can.
>>2234418I still remember how they banned the top 1 player because he was smurfing on a troll account, and it took quite some time for them to find it outIn my case they found out even after my internet provider changed, so they probably log other shit like hardware ID and maybe some OS parameters or geo location
At this point it's kind of a meme saying that ZK has better mechanics than BAR, but that mechanic of the first lab being free unironically mogs the shit out of BAR
>>2288831>At this point it's kind of a meme saying that ZK has better mechanics than BAR, but that mechanic of the first lab being free unironically mogs the shit out of BARAnd now you know: just because it's a meme, doesn't make it untrue.
supcom is stinky poopoo I am trans and love the BAR discord haha!!
>>2288831Totally a meaningless thing like that completely decimates another game
>>2289061You think it's meaningless because you probably consoom slop like modern AAA and gacha shit, you're blind to game design, it's all "just a game bro". You probably don't even perceive when a game has trash UI and how it hinders your gameplay
>>2289076Just build your first building, bro
>>2286775this>>2284933 like who the fuck builds storage at start in a 1v1? that will fuck you over, just think about itor why would you rush to air, just get 1 or 2 anti air units out of your already existing fac and two turrets to def your base that's it instead of seething just look at a single video on YT that explains the basicsthis is like starting to play Age of Empires and getting upset when stomped as you try to research every tech upgradeand I say this as a ZKfag
>>2289342>like who the fuck builds storage at start in a 1v1?Plenty of noobs. I had an Isthmus game today where a front player started choking on wind because he had only 3 turbines to support his con turret, constructor, com and a lab. His next step? Building an e storage. I've also seen a metal storage front opening.Somehow the "S" in "RTS" does not scare even the biggest retards.
>>2288831except BAR also has that and most people somehow don't like it ;)
Protip: Place mines with shift and alt to grid build, and space them with z or x
>>2289372Most BAR players are isthmus or glitter shitters.
>>2288781the data collection is in the source code
>>2288781I can show you a discord full of smurf virgins who dedicate their lives to making alt accounts in BAR and shitting up the game.Needless to say, based.
>>2291702From what I heard smurfs and “competitive pros” is the reason why Soup Com FAF fell off, how close BAR’s case is
>>2291750>>2291702If only these games had private lobbies
>>2289478true but the mine layers are really stupid. they can't contribute build powerso they'll run through each other and interrupt each others construction which will then decay and time out
>1v1 against a friend>air>heavy transport first unit>lift commander>D gun their factory and extractorslolwould this ever work in a lobby?
>>2293557Maybe if you manage to not be seen
>>2293557this is why they nerfed light transports to be unable to pick up comm
>>2293750>Find something fun>Devs nerf it because "muh serious indie rts balunce"It's sad but BAR isn't the first and won't be the last to fall to this curse. The devs want the game to be taken seriously and are putting too much effort into destroying fun in the name of balance.
>>2295558>early com bombing>funI don't like the balance obsession, but I wouldn't save some lame cheese either
>>2291750at some point it's just smurfs playing others smurfs and nobody else left, and that's exactly what these niggers deservein an ideal world all competitive games would go to the lengths of Quake Live skill ranking systems that goes beyond the ineffective basic barebones ELO dogshit
Wake me up when BAR gets autism like thishttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLURHkOyurg
>>2295558obviously you can still do it, it's just not disproportionately effectivebalance whiners are so silly
>>2295940>cheese This is why the gentlemen's agreement exists. It allows one to have their cheese and dine upon it with crackers and tea.But alas, I fear this level of sportsmanship is lost to those of fragile egos.
>>2193642Wut?
>>2296480>balance whiners are so silly>Lower damage vs com>range reduced 380->360, now deals 25% instead of 100% damagevs air >now deals 25% instead of 50% damage vs air Latest balance changes contains a noticeable amount of damage vs. specific units nerfs.Convince me a salty disco-troon didn't get mad and cry about their air-support getting countered unexpectedly.
>>2193516>SucKomshould said 'SucKum' haha
>>2193516the game literally has less qol than supcom idgi
BAR is dead lmao only trannies play itThe current devs are retarded niggers and have killed all the good work past devs did. They also stole it and are trying to make money off stolen work by better devs.Lmao @ bar devs get rekt faggot niggers
>>2301955If that was true your cringe ragebait wouldn't be necessary.
>>2301583>the game literally has less qol than supcom idgi
> * Legion Scylla, a special hybrid battleship that can sprout legs and walk on land! Sports a burst fire plasma cannon and two shotguns. At this point they're not even trying to hide their plagarism
>>2302570>wow ancestral progenitor technology for the 30000000th time :O!
>>2302570I love these niggas and other hybrid units from ra3hopefully they will steal more of them
