>>111056285
Does it matter? He'll still be a vtuber afterwards and collab with your oshi.
At most it just means they change models.

>>111056285
Damn, he even dropped his Alex Jones voice. He means business. Also, graduate already, fucking faggot. I don't know why they're hitting JPs before homo ENs, when you tranny chasing faggots were literally the fucking cause for all this hatred. But with that rant, you will probably get fucked anyway, so good fucking riddance. What a fucking blight in vtubing. Poor homo JPs, having to deal with YOUR shit.

>>111056447
Bro they mentioned StarsJP by NAME.
They fucked up their own branch no matter how desperate you are to blame someone else.
Similarly, if StarsEN follows, that'll be on StarsEN.
Until then, it's quite literally StarsJP's fault that StarsEN is being looked at like this.

>>111056512
If the problem was numbers, half of ID would be gone together with homoJP and EN. Whoever is pushing the muh numbers shit is either misinformed or maliciously avoiding the real issue, which is male vtubing is fucking toxic, which is 100% the fault of HOMO EN. JPs were doing fine before they came along, bringing their culture war garbage and their fucking entitlement. Why the fuck COVER thought it was ok to go about it like this, "stagerring" jp first and then en, but they should have gone en first for this situation, since they are the problem. Hell, skipp JPs, graduate only the homoENs and everything is fine.

DO IT FAGGOT

>>111056285
Damn… I really don’t fucking care

>>111056652
And yet they NAMED StarsJP, gen by gen. There is no staggering. StarsJP are the problem right now.
Blaming everybody else for your own failures does nothing to help your situation.
Even Astel fucking gave up on them.
Hell, even whining about male vtubers is insane when blaming EN since JP has Nijisanji. JP is JP and JP fucked up.

>>111056285
>>111056447
lol
I'll believe it when I see it
until then, this is all performative.
Just like their existence

>>111056652
>JPs were doing fine before they came along
Pfft HAHAHAHAHA

>>111056812
spotted the post-Council tourist

Wow an unironic homosister that's pretty rare

>>111056839
Seethe more tranny starsister your faggots were never good

>>111056652
What alternate universe do you come from?
Stars JP have been the runts of the company since the beginning.

>>111056839
EN was the only reason they rose out of 2view hell.
In some cases they never did. See Uyu.

>>111056966
Why is ID not getting downsized as well?

>>111057162
They obviously outperform the homos

>>111056285
It's wild how bad the stars EN hiring ended up being in hindsight

>>111057162
Because they're doing much better than Holostars JP. They're also integrate with the fanbase of EN and JP in a way that would upset the fans if they did get cut loose. The only people that (barely) care about Holostars JP are Holostars EN fans, and that branch is also on the chopping block.

>>111057216
The sad thing is, compared to the average male EN vtuber, their hiring was actually good. No one with sexual harassment or pedo stuff in their background unlike Nijj EN, the male vtuber pool is just that bad.

>>111057162
Because contrary to what the schizos in this board may tell you, ID actually brings enough money to sustain their operation

>>111056652
>If the problem was numbers, half of ID would be gone together with homoJP and EN
The lowest fucking ID can outsell all of stars EN combined.

>>111057162
Because they sold out a 3000 seat concert while homos can't even sell out a 100 seat karaoke at a con.

we hate them hope he graduated once for all

>>111056285
dude actually made his branch looked bad. i was expecting the dino guy to do that.

>>111057707
holy esl

>>111056285
It's astonishing that after all the graduations last year and the promises from management to do better turned out to be a fucking lie.
At this point they should just change the name of the company from cover to suisei.

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>>111057508
The homosJP sold out three concerts. Fat lotta good that did them.

>>111057743
Yeah and that makes you wonder what the hell is even going on there. Idolshit across the spectrum is selling out. Their in person events are also selling out.
What more do they possibly need? That's basically all of their big guns all maxed out. Unless if they're looking for funds to make another big gun in order to show a modicum of growth.

>>111057743
Pretty sure I've seen proof that that shit didn't sellout

>>111057727
They can fuck off right now if being an indie is so much better

>>111056285
Do it, faggot!

You obviously have reading comprehension issues.

>>111057743
>2022

Even with all of this, it's pretty clear haachama is next to go.

>>111057811
probably merch sells? concerts can sell out, but merch will always be the biggest moneymaker.

>>111057915
Problem is that everyone is getting fucked on merch sales. $50-$80 on shipping? Fuck that.

>>111057811
At this point the problem is clearly Cover. They've had years to fix this.
Somehow Niji can debut boys into instant success but Stars just can't seem to find an in in any market, likely due to Cover just repeatedly attempting the same shit over and over again despite countless examples of successful male streamers in both Japan and abroad.

>>111057898
Haachama has been clearly burned out for years now and should stop wasting everyone's time with half-assed returns only to disappear again a couple of weeks later because she felt like taking a train to the other side of the country in the middle of the night and then cry that her numbers are bad

>>111056285
so graduate already you stupid furry temu PirateSoftware dumbfuck nigger. take your shit and get the fuck out

Graduate to do what? Even with Cover's cut, you'll do better staying with the Holostar brand than going indie.

>$50-$80
Lmao someone is being too optimistic what with the war going on.

>>111056285
>males
Oh no, anyway...

>>111056839
>post-Council
Council was 2021, why coast around the fact that they have been in the dumpster for 5 years

>>111057977
I have no idea how she's able to persist for so long

>>111056285
who cares, I don't watch Holoshit anymore

>>111057811
>Idolshit across the spectrum is selling out. Their in person events are also selling out.
concert needs 10,000 ticket sales to turn a profit
sell only 7,000
blame the boys for not meeting metrics

>>111057811
>What more do they possibly need?
Income to actually fund more concerts without being subsidized by the girls' revenue.

Turns out that twitter updoots don't bring any money in

At least Cover fans can point to this and say the company doesn't punish talents for criticizing it.

>>111058242
chama...

>>111058242
They're just saying what we've known for years. Except retards are willfully ignoring it when they shouldn't. This shit can easily spill over and it had in some ways already.

>>111057162
why are some people so delusional on how ignored stars are compared to everyone else? it's like you have zero idea how bad they were doing viewers wise

>>111058212
They probably could've made that income if their physical merch wasn't cut off so quickly for the sake of artificial scarcity.
Seriously, they sell out in seconds because they're never allowed to put out enough units to break even.
It's like Cover only cares about the optics of "sold out" instead of satisfying the fans or making actual money.

>>111056285
Good, do it

>>111056285
Having listened to the rant now, Ruze comes across as having a bit too big of an ego.

I've worked in corporate for over a decade and I'm well aware of what kind of dumb decisions can be made. This wasn't it. He's painting a picture that everyone in upper management is stupid and worthless, and if they just did what he told them to do he would be able to fix everything. That's not a healthy mindset to have, and it's not healthy for the fanbase either because they're going to parrot his behavior.

>everyone in upper management is stupid and worthless
Always had been.

>>111058347
Oh yeah totally dude. Cover intentionally doesn't produce enough unit of homo merch because they hate money and for shits and giggles I guess .

>>111058347
seriously what is the difference between "sold out in seconds" and "sold out in a few days", everything still fucking sold out either way

>>111058423
His whole shtick from day 1 has been being an arrogant know it all. To his credit he at least has always owned up to it. He's just one of those guys that's confident he's always right and wants to hear himself talk.

>>111058347
You do realize that merch is made to order, right? The only thing that "sells out" are limited edition sets and that's because they are hand-signed and you can only have the talent sign so many post cards

>>111058474
just like PirateSoftware. not only does ruze look like him he also acts exactly like him

>>111058423
Upper management is saying no to even fucking Marine and taking a year to do so. I’m gonna agree with him here that a lot of the bean counters are stupid and worthless.

>>111058423
It makes more sense in the context of other holomem and even holostars constantly putting up with that kind of retardation.
The last homo to have a rant like this was Altare, who sent in some 3D equipment to get fixed because staff wanted to handle it only for it to get ignored for months. Eventually he just had them send it back so he could do the repairs himself after learning how and the box had a huge layer of dust on it.

>>111058347
Merch is made to order. Only limited sets with bonus signed cards or bonus bromides are limited.
Fucking retard.

>>111058242
>At least Cover fans can point to this and say the company doesn't punish talents for criticizing it.
Holostars are usually bulletproof unless they break NDA or really piss off management. If a Hololive talent did a rant this direct they would get in trouble and likely vanish for a few months. Haato for example who didn't even bring up Yagoo.

>>111057162
Indonesian really buy merch and send SC as the top 3 Hololive consumer even surpassing China.

>>111058423
Broken clock is right twice a day. Upper management has gotten in the way for even Suisei and Gura. They deserve every bit of shit they get.

>>111057461
sorry to tell you this, but bettel alone sells more than half of ID

>>111059354
The fucking Risu merch sales vs all homos combined chart has been posted a bajillion times in /#/ this past week.
I'm too lazy to fucking spoonfeed another one of you tards.
Anyone who believes him just search archive for it.

>>111057162
ID is like the Charlotte Hornets. The boys are the lowest performing team in the WNBA.

I thought at least as far as Starshit goes his numbers were only being beaten by Bettel and they were out performing some of the lower girls. Could have been birthday months though.

>>111059401
sure nerf

>>111058004
?
ukraine and gaza have been getting bombed for years now

>>111059354
If you going to lie at least use someone that doesn't have their merch track, bettel couldn't even sell half of his limited run merch, only 250/600

Why are people here so angry that someone is actually willing to call out management for the bullshit they've been pulling for half a decade at this point and for once is not a vtuber I care about so I have nothing to lose here

>>111060408
If cover corp was so evil and he could be successful without them he would have quit already.
This is just retarded shitstirring. He knows that if he quits he'll have to flip burgers.

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it's all just performative
he wishes he could be the next doki

>>111060408
I hate to say this but that nigga ain't Nimi or saba

>>111056285
UH OH BLACKLIVE
all of this is even worse when you consider hololive(holostars?) scouted like 75% of the people they employ

>>111061204
Cool story bro. Unfortunately if you go to /#/ you'll find out that cutting them off had no effect on Hololive views whatsoever.

>>111061254
sure but they still scouted these guys and are now just throwing them away like this lol it's even worse when you think about it, they should have just gotten rid of them all, not cut all funding and left them to die off. they still have to play their share to cover each time they get a donation so they pay their company that has just given up on them

>>111058212
Concerts are sponsored.

>trying to stir some shit
>no one actually give a fuck
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

>Anya is shilling merch to 1500 people
HoloID can literally do absolute numberpoison content and still destroy all homos. She's about to pass ruze with giga dramabuff
Yet tards on reddit claim stars have higher numbers because they're stuck in 2022

>>111057743
>>111057811
All three of their concerts had around a 1k capacity, the last one actually had some fans complaining they couldn't get tickets, and they used a service kaigai fans couldn't use too. Even though they did sell out the venue, it's possible the streaming tickets did not meet the quota, which is why the venue capacity never increased.

>>111060408
Because he's anti corporation and anti capitalism

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>>111058520
>>111058689
That's custom merch. StarsJP often released group merch based on a theme that was usually just acrylic stands and random badges/bromides. That merch was always stock and would sell out, especially AGF merch that they'd also sell on-site at the event. Fans even whined about it and would ask the talents to tell staff to increase the stock, which I think they did at some point because after AGF 2024 stock merch wasn't selling out as often as it did before--it still did, just not as crazily. Also for the last 2-3? years they weren't even selling most of it on the holoshop, but through animate/movic.

>>111056285
Bros hatewatching males

Be a man and graduate

I'm surprised this took this long.
Fundamentally, Cover Corp is a software company that uses idol shit as a front to finance their second-rate software and the purchase and maintenance of their state-of-the-art 3D motion capture studios. This way, Yagoo and his JP techbros can find and groom young girls that couldn't make it in the real world or as a part of an underground idol group, into marketable IPs. It's basically pimping but with a few extra steps. This is made especially clear when you look at where the company's cash is going: fixed capital expenditures (like the studio) and intangibles (like the software) have seen BILLIONS of yen. These ongoing long-term projects are easy to skim money off of by the way. Losing unpopular deadweights like the boys isn't going to do much because they had zero sway in the first place. Whether it's in terms of money generated or meaningful ties with the company's power players, losing them will be insignificant. There is no talent outside of a few JP girls that can unilaterally make demands, therefore there is no one safe.

>>111056285
I have never seen whoever this is in my entire life. and i've watched hololive since 2020
literally who?

>>111062209
>clip watcher since 2020

>>111056285
Blud went off on Cover, based

Fucking fuck off already, nobody actually likes these cunts, every tranny activist that supports them will never look at them again the second they can't be used as a weapon

>>111057162
>they made enough to sustain themselves
>their existence doesn't anger a large part of the Hololive fanbase
>they are cheap to keep and useful for making company-wide events merrier

>>111063350
>Reine is such a valuable connection they'll keep ID around as long as she wants it

>>111056285
He can fuck off. It just means less competition for me from wifing my oshi. I watch Hololive not to get cucked anyway.

>>111063477
You should watch Phase Connect actually

>>111063497
No. They are whores, unlike the girls of Hololive.

>>111056652
why do sisters believe its stream numbers only, as if Anya doesnt outsell all homos in merch.

>>111063585
They want to believe that because they can not those for free, they will always screech about superchats not mattering because they're publicly tracked andd they won't spend money

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Cover managed to fumble two of the biggest vtubers of all time(Gura and Aqua) and you expect me to believe there is nothing wrong with holo management and Ruze is in the wrong and speaking out of line?

>>111057727
Kek the management pain is prob the reason why Suisei came up with her own branch. Her career is better in her hands than Cover's

>>111059775
The strait of hormuz being blockaded is the problem for shipping costs

>>111056285
>a deadweight screaming about quitting
huh what is this called ?

They should all just fuck off already, bunch of failed faggots

>>111063917
Impotent threat

>>111061469
Whet drama buff?

What I don't understand is, Cover went out of their way to scout this guy and other members and still wouldn't let them do the things they hired them for. What the hell did they think would happen?

>>111064272
That they would contribute and not be cancer I guess

>>111064306
But they hired them because of certain things and then told them they aren't allowed to do the things they scouted them for. What kind of business model is that? How can you do that and act surprised when they don't manage to capture the audience that made you want to scout them?

>>111064340
>What kind of business model is that?
A retarded one. Just like all the corpo dick rider unicorn wannabes itt.

>>111056285
I really wanna try getting into vtubing as a male, but im worried that with so much drama and such surrounding male vtubers it will really hurt my chances by proxy, is it worth trying, guys? Or is it too far fetched?

>>111063806
I agree. Has there been a single talent in all of holopro that hasn't gone off about incompetent managers? I don't recall anyone else being this blunt about it.

>>111064730
It's fine. Don't take anything in this site as majority opinion. This place is just an irrelevant containment board where social rejects hangout 24/7.

His rant and threats to quit have no teeth specifically because he's a leeching homostar. Most people already want the entire branch shut down and the only people who legitimately have their backs are dramafags and fans of other vtubers who think killing Hololive will benefit their oshi.

>>111064730
just be a faceless streamer nigtard

>>111064340
Yeah it's a story we hear with the girls all the time. Oh marine made her best song ever and it got national attention?
CANT DO THAT ANY MORE LMAOOO!!!

>>111064730
The drama is coming from cuck brained retards. My favorite indie vtuber is a dude who streams games every day which is apparently more than the best majority of corporate vtubers.

This is exactly why Holostars as a branch should have been disbanded years ago. I guess Grimmi was lowkey right about Hololive experiencing troubles in her tarot stream.

>>111064691
Kek seethe harder, homosister. Unicorns won and your boys are headed for the trash where they belong.

>>111064730
>I really wanna try getting into vtubing as a male
That's a retarded idea. Stop being retarded and just be a regular streamer. There's literally no advantage to being a male vtuber. It's all disadvantage.

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>>111056285
Oh no! Imagine if they were FORCED to actually go to a real JOB! THE HORROR!

>wanted Armis MMD models released so people can make fan content(easy marketing)
>wanted merch rereleases(more money opportunities)
>was working on a 3rd outfit(an event that would draw more viewers than normal)
>Cover rejected all of these
and they wonder how it's possible their members aren't doing as well as they would like and are dissatisfied with the company?

>>111063806
four, don't forget Rushia and Coco; Coco was literally the most superchatted channel on the entire platform at one point

>>111065367
Well Rushia kind of dug herself into the grave. And Coco's problem is kind of unique compared to this stuff. Gura and Aqua were literally Cover's own incompetence in handling them with no outside forces causing that

>>111065422
gura is still the same even after leaving and aqua is complaining about all the work she needs to do now

>>111065471
and both felt this was better than having to deal with Cover management

>>111065332
>Cover rejects a bunch of shit a Homo wants because it's all a wasted effort
Based.

>>111057977
I will skin you alive when I found you.
>>111061506
I don't think is the case because they even announced Blu rays of the event.

>>111065332
>Got a whole 3d animated series that did nothing despite costing a fortune
>Demands new outfits even though they're nowhere near any milestones to deserve it
>Merch only gets released if it's in high demand, they can't even sell initial runs

>>111065332
>wanted merch rereleases(more money opportunities)
More like money wasting opportunities.
The people that already bought that merch first time won't buy it again, so you trying to resale it to much smaller group of potential buyers.
And for merch to be profitable you need to sell a lot of it.
Let's say he managed to sell out his merch to 300 people.
Another 300 batch won't sell to many when his audience is so small.
That shit would just end up stucked in the warehouse.

>>111058423
>I've worked in corporate
Streaming is not a corporate work, lmao
Cover is the only place that got this wrong.

>>111058704
retard

>>111065145
>>111064882

Is it really such a disadvantage? The main reason im so interested in it is id rather not show my face and be able to play a persona while streaming so I can keep myself kind of separated from it all, those are the upsides that come to my mind, anyway, what kind of downsides should I expect from doing this sort of thing?

>>111063806
how did Cover fumbled Aqua and Gura's careers? they aren't really ambitious

>>111065518
Grass isn’t always greener. I’m not saying they should go back and beg for their jobs. If anything, that’s a sign of good management that they were all able to leave on their own terms to pursue their own goals instead of creating a huge yab.

>>111065764
Just look at Oneyplays, Manlybadasshero or Vinny Vinesauce

>>111065764
just use an instagram filter and be a cucumber or something and you’ll get bigger numbers than being an anime guy

>>111065145
It's only a disadvantage because people like you have a chronic fear of men

>>111065784
usually comes down to perms and restrictions and how long it takes shit to get done

>>111065784
They literally fumbled their careers and the careers of the ones that graduated last year. You are beyond retarded if you are not seeing the issue here. This shit is going to go everywhere and this is an issue we've known about for years at this point.

>>111065820
Sakuna isn't streaming anything different from what the holos play, and Saba, well...

>>111065332
>wanted Armis MMD
wanted Cover to produced those models and Cover said no. Probably based on the metrics from the MMDs that were released for TEMPUS in Feb 2025
>wanted merch rereleases
wanted Cover to put back debut acrylics on sale. It isn't the talent's place to talk much about merch sale strategy of company produced merch.
>was working on a 3rd outfit
he was meaning to use tickets on a 3rd outfit but he gave up on that after deciding to pull a Selen. He'll probably make an anti corpo graduation original song instead. So predictable

There you go. Ruze is a smart guy but similarly smart people can see through everything.

>>111056285
Cover better act fast if they want to save their reputation.

>>111063806
>FUMBLED GURA'S CAREER
wtf are you nijipilled/phasepilled to the maxx ?

>>111065954
twitterfags can’t do shit after elon took over

>>111065764
>Is it really such a disadvantage?
Yes. If you're a male vtuber then most people will instantly assume you're a mentally ill sex pest and your tiny audience will consist primarily of psychotically obsessed ugly autistic women, trannies, and homosexuals. Your community will be a grotesque menagerie of unhinged drama and insanity.
>The main reason im so interested in it is id rather not show my face and be able to play a persona while streaming
Then just be a disembodied voice. There aren't any downsides to that.

>>111065811
You lost.

>>111065954
Best they can do is have haachama graduate

>>111063615
Stars EN makes more money in SC than ID, tho.

>>111056652
nah, their numbers are horribly low that they became unsustainable that's why they're getting axed. the girls will be treated the same way if they ever reach borderline 2view status

>>111065998
they barely make money from superchats. youtube takes half and management gets a big chunk of it to pay for their salary.

>>111056285
Do a flip

>>111065998
ID merch sells and they receive money outside of SCs on youtube. It's guaranteed that ID brings in more profit than HomoEN.

>>111057811
Astel said the other homos cbf doing these events and trying to tard wrangle the coasters into doing something good is too difficult and ultimately not worth the expenditure.

>>111066309
nobody does its why the homoshitters are such failures

>>111065422
>And Coco's problem is kind of unique compared to this stuff
Cover putting her in a banishment room is unique?

>>111066256
>Moving the goalpost

>>111065422
>>111065518
It's time for you to admit cover had nothing to do with gura not streaming and not finishing her alleged projects, if anything they bent over backwards to keep her around without streaming the minimum of 3 hours per week stipulated in her contract.

>>111066568
Cover didn't want her to quit, they HAD to put restrictions to Coco because she was always pushing the envelope, and Cover said enough is enough and after the Taiwan yab, the restrictions came after she made multiple mistakes in the year, from Kanata suicide joke to the Taiwan yab.
the restrictions put into her made her quit, ironically. But it wasn't on purpose, it was because she wanted more freedom to do her shit. And she had proven time and time again that she can't be trusted with more freedom.

>>111065975
>just be a disembodied voice. There aren't any downsides to that.
Streaming with some sort of facial emotional feedback is the norm. Deviating from expectations is already a debuff. Audio-only works for VOD style or essays, livestreaming is an exchange between viewer and audience that loses some of the magic when you lack the visual feedback.
Vtubing has negatives but selling voice only as a solution is naive at best.

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>please yagoo, just give us money please, ILL PAY IT BACK PLEASE JUST ONE MORE DAY

>>111056285
He's one of the few moid vtubers I like, RIP

>>111056285
don't let the door hit you on the way out, faggot.

>>111065998
Sobbing about ID is pointless, the branch exists to be Reine's hobby
If Jurtards family were as important as he likes to pretend, homos would survive but he's poorfag with delusions

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Clockwork

>>111065332
All of that shit costs time and money and it's obvious that they weighed it and saw that spending resources on all that shit would be a waste, and they would be right to think so.

Trans rights are not human rights
All trans are subhuman

>>111065332
>>wanted Armis MMD models released so people can make fan content(easy marketing)
If that's how this homo put it, as if it's just a copypaste job or something unrealistically simple, then the fag is being disingenuous as fuck. MMD models have to be basically re-crafted and converted from the originals, and that's all depending on how well the original was made and rigged in the first place. Spending the money to make and release mmd models for the girls, an act that makes cover ZERO money after the fact is one thing, spending those resources making a big fat nothing-maker for "talents" that are a net drain on the company's resources as a whole is a completely different story.

>>111066256
I doubt it. StarsEN makes 2x in superchats than ID does. That usually translate in the other revenue streams.
The thing ID has over StarsEN is that they are actually loved by the holo community and all of the talents. If they were to say ID was being ended, talents would be up in arms because the ID girls are beloved like a family pet

>>111058242
Which show just how dumb Vesper must have been

>>111070074
It’s really not that difficult.

>>111070117
superchat makes no money for the company

>>111071867
no, that is ID

>>111071720
They still have to pay someone to do it.

>>111065422
>Aqua
What about Aqua? Sakuna said that she graduated because she wanted to chill and do things at her own pace. Not sure what "Cover's own incompetence" had anything to do with that.

>>111069394
That sounds pretty reasonable, I don't watch Homostars myself either but I don't think they should be treated like shit by their company

>>111073250
>said that she graduated because she wanted to chill and do things at her own pace
Source?

>>111073311
>but I don't think they should be treated like shit by their company
The majority of the treatment he's complaining about boils down to them not spending enough money on the Stars. Do you not think there's a chance that might be different if more of the people like who who sympathize with them actually watched/supported them?

What went so horribly wrong with male vtubing?

>>111073838
A good amount of big male vtubers were revealed to be either sex pests or just straight up unpleasant people behind the scenes

>>111073342
Getting dick by me.

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>>111073838
>What went so horribly wrong with male vtubing?
Same thing that went wrong with all vtubing: Western "culture" draining into the industry like a cracked septic tank leaking into the soil.

You must understand that vtubing, at its heart, is the internet version of a Japanese host/hostess club. Cross-collabs don't work for the same reason mixing hosts and hostesses in the same club doesn't work. The working relationship between the male and female entertainers seeds jealousy and suspicion in the regular customers, poisoning the whole thing. This becomes all the more poignant when some of them decide to elope.

A lot of vtubers gaslit themselves into thinking they can do co-ed collabs, backed up by keyboard warriors that don't actually pay for any of this shit, while anyone who tries to stop them is just some incel that should be ignored. The problem with that reasoning is that the primary demographic of this market is chuds and fujos. If the women alienate the chuds and the men alienate the fujos then it's all over.

>>111074604
>Western "culture" draining into the industry like a cracked septic tank leaking into the soil.
>You must understand that vtubing, at its heart, is the internet version of a Japanese host/hostess club
The unicorn pandering only really kicked off around Gen 3 of Holo, before that Holos gleefully collabed with leeched off Niji males. It wasnt a western innovation

There's no way he gets away with shitting on cover employees this much without getting at least suspended or fired

>>111074710
>The unicorn pandering only really kicked off around Gen 3 of Holo
When did they start making the fat stacks of cash? Think about it.

>>111073311
>I don't think they should be treated like shit by their company
They should though. The girls were treated like second-class citizens while the Homos were coddled and pampered as they latched on to Hololive like parasites and almost killed it. Being treated like shit is karma.

>>111070117
>That usually translate in the other revenue streams.
It doesn't in this case. Homo merch notoriously doesn't sell. Superchats are their only revenue stream. ID meanwhile has multiple revenue streams.

>>111073311
Counterpoint: Astel says the other dudes are lazy as shit and don't even put effort in, they just want everything to be done for them

Who is right? The guy who earnestly wanted to be an idol or the newfag EN star who has done absolutely zero?

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>>111056285
Oh no, please, don't graduate. How will hololive ever recover?

>>111068122
>Streaming with some sort of facial emotional feedback is the norm.
No it isn't. Look at Vinny Vinesauce. What percentage of his streams have him showing his face? 1%? Existing as a disembodied voice is pretty fucking normal when it comes to being a male streamer and if you think visual feedback is required for effectively conveying emotion then you probably have some kind of autism.

>>111074761
February 2019 onward

>>111075075
Halfway between Gen 2 and Gen 3. See what I mean?

>>111073838
>What went so horribly wrong with male vtubing?
Male vtubers are what went wrong with male vtubing. Any man who wants to LARP as an anime boy on the internet is a fucking weirdo with brain problems, a condition which can be endearing in women but is simply revolting in men.

>>111074836
>They should though. The girls were treated like second-class citizens while the Homos were coddled and pampered as they latched on to Hololive like parasites and almost killed it. Being treated like shit is karma.
Indeed. Not everyone is some faggoty tourist that wasn't there for the hard times when shit like IRyS being ghosted by omegatranny about her model etc. happened, because he was too busy trying to enshitten EN with his homo project. Even earlier the retarded rules like the MC servers were separate for no reason. Collabs between en and jp seemed like they were actively not encouraged etc. Who's to blame? The en project coordinator who was that troon or collection of troons.
All that wasted momentum, for what? A moneysink no one asked for.

>>111074874
to be fair, astel only has experience with JP.
There's several extremely hard workers on the EN side, but nobody really seems to care about that. I know Altare, Axel, Hakka, and Bettel are constantly working on projects out of their own pocket, only really needing staff for perms purposes or to pray that they approve their shit within 1-2 business months.

>>111075200
and this right here is why corpo vtubing is gonna die in the next decade. this is a stagnation mindset. this is what leads companies to never experimenting or investing in new ventures. what happens when the anti-stars shitters turn that vitriol right back on the girls?

>>111075414
You mean like they always have doing with Kiara, Mori, Ame, Fauna or whatever is the current FOMO target?

>>111075200
>Male vtubers are what went wrong with male vtubing
Dunno, Niji seems to have figured it out. JP's still going strong with males and EN would've too had they not gone full retard and lost everything. They came out strong as hell despite LazuSydia's relatively underperforming numbers.
By comparison, Cover has NEVER managed to have successful male chuubas. Even at their peak, Mag/Ves were trailing behind Niji's men.

Cover is clearly the problem here.

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>>111075414
>what happens when the anti-stars shitters turn that vitriol right back on the girls?
The Homostar Revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for the vtuber race.

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>>111059354
>>111059401

>>111075414
>this is a stagnation mindset.
lol. It's not a stagnation mindset. It's a successful mindset. When an experiment has clearly failed(male vtubing) it's time to stop wasting time and money on it.
>this is what leads companies to never experimenting or investing in new ventures
Reckless experimentation and investment in new ventures is frequently what causes companies to fall into ruin. Cover was built on cute girls doing cute things and that's where its focus should be because that's what works. It's what the market wants. Their attempts to delve into other ventures have ended in failure.
>what happens when the anti-stars shitters turn that vitriol right back on the girls?
Unicorns have shunned homocollabers like Bae for years. That's nothing new.

>>111075540
>unique birthday merch vs generic acrylic stands
whoa I'm shocked
Next you'll tell me it's somehow surprising that gura's sushiro collab outperformed the rest of holoen's basic acrylic stands

>>111075511
They’ve been largely irrelevant. Like, that’s literally the worst anyone can say about them. The hyperbole and the retardation from entitled shitters is the core issue that will kill everything it touches. How the hell does a company grow if the fanbase wants only the same thing at greater and greater volumes.

>more merch
>more concerts
>more fan events
>more talents

People really ignore the strain of how much work that already is. Even with the Stars gone, there’s a litany of management issues that will perceivably go unresolved. So what exactly changes? Unicorns and gachikois alike get what they want. To management that likely means an okey doke to keep grinding out things as is. How did that work out for Fauna, Ame, and Gura?

>>111075695
>When an experiment has clearly failed(male vtubing)
Has it? Most of NijiJP's top vtubers are men, and they're competitive or outperform a considerable number of holo's top members. It's not even just NijiJP since male vtubers are regularly high or top end performers in the japanese market.

Cover's take on them though has clearly failed. Male vtubers work, but Cover keeps trying the same shit over and over instead of asking themselves why things aren't working for them.

>>111075709
>he doesn't know
Hahahahahahaha

>>111075789
>Has it?
Yes.
>Most of NijiJP's top vtubers are men
"Most" isn't a number. Be specific.

>>111075709
>but bettel alone sells more than half of ID
>B-b-b-but it's just generic merch
During his last limited merch drop, he only sold 200 units.
You lost.

>>111075776
>How the hell does a company grow if the fanbase wants only the same thing at greater and greater volumes.
It grows by offering the same thing at greater and greater volumes. You just answered your own question. Yes, more merch, more concerts, more fan events, and more talents. Offering more of the same successful thing at greater volumes is how companies achieve stable, long term growth and success.

>>111076064
kek
>what is a company supposed to do, make MORE of the product that’s popular and sells a lot?
>that’s stagnation. What you need to do is figure out how to make your customers unhappy and then do it a lot
>why? to attract a new audience who hate your customers and want to ruin their fun
>that’s what we call diversification and sustainability

>>111057162
>Why is ID not getting downsized as well?
Since collabs between Hololive ID and the EN and JP talents doesn't piss off unicorns or hurt merch sales. The issue with Holostars was never their current revenue but that unity lowers Hololive merch sales (which brings in the vast majority of Cover revenue). That is why Yagoo never attempted a mixed gen. Yagoo doesn't give a shit about unicorns but he does care about merch sales. Cover has been bleeding money with HoloEarth and Yagoo sacrificed Holostars so he could keep funding his Metaverse game.

>>111057727
>It's astonishing that after all the graduations last year and the promises from management to do better turned out to be a fucking lie.
Most of Hololive EN believed that management was better in 2023 and less than 2 years later they lost Ame, Fauna, Mumei, and Gura. I lost any trust in Cover after the 2025 graduations.

>>111065332
>>wanted Armis MMD models released so people can make fan content(easy marketing)
Cover is extremely incompetent but they are worried about what antis, coomers, and unicorn haters would do with official MMD models. Lewd HoloPro content, or literal porn, would piss off most Hololive fans and would an easy way to stir up fighting between Hololive and Holostars.

>>111076601
kys outfitschizo

>>111076064
>more merch
>more concerts
>more fan events
>more talents
Only "more merch" is possible at the long-term scale you're proposing here.
There will likely never be a concert series on the scale of any normal artist/band tour, even if the Numbers would suggest that there is an audience for such a thing. Suggestion does not equal Assurance. The same idea would apply to fan events as well.

And there's very much more likely no way for an ever-growing talent pool. Cover had already announced that there would be fewer talents being hired to try and grow the current roster. Exponential growth of talents is impossible; Hololive will never meet Nijisanji in that regard, especially with the rumored and confirmed management issues or the fact that they've already had to cut funding to Holostars JP. Even the fact that most financial priorities go into Hololive JP over Hololive EN should be a sign that the company overall seems to be in a state of turbulence.

Personally, if it weren't for the fact that it was necessary at the time, I'd say that Cover's worst mistake was going public.

>>111076015
is this the final chapter? 200 units between holoshop AND geekjack?

>>111076736
>Cover's worst mistake was going public
it was that or sell the company to pay back investors. what would have been better in your eyes?

Idk if it would play a factor but the thing with ID and JP merch sales is that geographic proximity makes merch far more viable. EN is essentially global so all the tariffs stuff and general shipping costs make it way less attractive for EN fans.

IIRC In one of those financial reports it directly said that Bettel and Ruze earned them more revenue than a few of the girls.

>>111076778
Yeah something like 200-240 unit/600
It's the ones from his 24h 3D stream

>>111076881
and how does that compare to the handwritten limited birthday in may 2025? and the handwritten daki set in sep 2024? looks like he switched from foil stamped to always offering handsigned, flooded the market and made them undesirable

>>111076847
That's why I remarked that it was necessary. I'd rather that it go public rather than be sold off, but doing so has led to its own set of problems in turn.
It would be nice if it could go back to being privately held, or at the very least restructured so that they are no longer beheld to whatever demands investors might have, but that would be a long shot.

If I could have my way, I'd vote that nobody should be allowed to hold stock in Cover or Nijisanji unless they show their waifu shrine.

>>111056285
>Looks like StarsEN is getting frustrated and ready to graduate in protest
don't threaten me with a good time lmao

>>111076989
>It would be nice if it could go back to being privately held
From what little I know it's not totally impossible for Yagoo and allies to buy back the company stock by stock (they already got majority anyways), he just doesn't want to or doesn't consider it desirable.

>>111077228
>he just doesn't want to or doesn't consider it desirable.
It would probably require more coordination and planning than a simple "ayy blud, lemme have your shares back" in an email, plus lots and lots of paperwork and faxing to make the buyout happen.

It may not be impossible but with the way things are going, it's probably just not a practicality. Business and finance do be like that sometimes.

>>111074756
Jurard never got punished for his hatemarketing speech/breakdown, nor admitting that he got inside help from Ollie, nor implying that all the holo girls are sluts behind the scenes. Groombullet never got punished after he was outed as a pest. Astel never got punished for YEARS of shitting on management whenever he could. Axel never got flak for collabing with the nuclear reactor that was kson.
Fact of the matter is, Holostars have always been treated with kid gloves since day 1, since they were yagoo's passion project. They could get away with anything they wanted to. In any sphere covet controlled, Stars were the golden goose, the one thing absolutely nobody was allowed to criticize, wag fingers, or even raise an eyebrow at. It took years and the immense pressure from investors for the company to finally pull life support for the branch that was killing everything around it. It took the most obvious and needed action for Holostars to feel even the SLIGHTEST amount of pressure, and they all folded like a house of cards.
Ruze isn't getting so much as a slap on the wrist for this, and you know it.

>>111076736
Cover's been very conservative with the number of concerts and fan events they do. There's a lot of room for them to grow in those areas before they hit the limit.
>And there's very much more likely no way for an ever-growing talent pool.
They can still afford to grow the talent pool and graduations prevent it from being ever-growing. New gens are like Cover's cheat code for freshening things up if they threaten to get stale.
>Even the fact that most financial priorities go into Hololive JP over Hololive EN should be a sign that the company overall seems to be in a state of turbulence.
EN seems to be getting treated as more of an equal to JP lately. I think Cover's favoritism towards JP is starting to correct itself. The success of the EN concerts probably has a lot to do with that.

>>111076377
Literally western media now for the past 20 years.

>>111074874
Astel never called anyone lazy or said they didn't put in effort. He said regardless of the amount of effort, Cover would still prepare things for them (which they also do for the girls). He was also referring to a specific period between their 1st and 2nd live, not in general. And he definitely wasn't talking about EN.

>>111077425
>Cover's been very conservative with the number of concerts and fan events they do.
That's what's keeping them successful for sure. They know what the market looks like, and they don't want to shoot for something beyond what they know will be a success. But there's a limit that they'll hit sooner than later, and what it ultimately means is that without personal/individual success, there is a ceiling.

>They can still afford to grow the talent pool and graduations prevent it from being ever-growing. New gens are like Cover's cheat code for freshening things up if they threaten to get stale.
That may also be the case, but what we're seeing is that most talents simply don't graduate. It's not like the 3D idol industry where people literally age out of their positions; a VTuber has the ability to do this for much longer than they might otherwise be "allowed" otherwise. Thus, we have girls like Sora and Korone doing this for seven to ten years despite being sexy, breedable hags.
Meanwhile, the graduations which HAVE happened have occurred primarily from disagreements and conflicts with management, which in itself is something that could be fixed with a few phone calls and a pink slip or two. The tradeoff there is that if/when that's fixed, there's less reason for the girls (or guys) to quit, which takes us right back to the eventual plateauing of talent numbers getting capped.

>EN seems to be getting treated as more of an equal to JP lately. I think Cover's favoritism towards JP is starting to correct itself. The success of the EN concerts probably has a lot to do with that.
This one is more of a personal theory, but I'm fairly certain that the favoritism isn't so much correcting itself as much as it's expanding outwards to include EN talent who are more interested if not overtly working towards JP bilingualism and idol industry work, along the lines of what HoloJP has been doing for years. I'd say that it's something to do with cultural differences and the gaps between what Japan expects of its idol streamers and what Westerners want from gaming streamers, which is something that I feel dates back to Magni/Vesper's departure. I can't recall if there might have been any other incidents in HoloEN along those lines, but with those two there was definitely a disconnect between what they offered as streamers and what HoloPro has leaned into since they left. The same might even be said about the girls who left in 2024-25 and what the company looks like now, but it might be too soon to tell.

>>111066732
Considering both were valuable marketing properties even if they never did anything ever again, losing them was absolutely Cover fucking up since it means they can no longer sell their image and their fans will go to the PLs rather than circulate in the Holobox.

>>111063806
There are so many people that graduated on poor terms and you chose two people that did everything they wanted to do then graduated into downscaling their activities

The only surprising part is Cover let this run for so long before they cut their losses. And while the talents themselves failed to garner an audience, you can't look at holostars and say "Oh yeah Cover really built a solid branch primed for success. Look at how they managed to prevent their generations from losing their most successful member every single time a week in. They made sure to explore market segments instead of repeating the same thing four times and failing the same way each time, too. Look at their high quality debuts with top talents and top character designs like Uyu or the other jobbers in uproar."

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>>111057811
>>111057743
Could be that Cover has an overspending problem? EIther bloated management or Metaverse Holoeatth

>>111080195
Cover definitely was burning too much on HoloEarth and even talents were calling Yagoo out for how much he wasted on that. The JP talents are most likely aware that Yagoo had to choose between Holostars and HoloEarth. That is why Fuma streamed a CEO simulation game where he bankrupted his company with a project called HoloEarth.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3qvw9lMbEA

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>>111080780
Not my problem

>>111080195
>>111080780
HoloEarth is still serving an active goal of the company by making them more resistant to platform fuckery, one could argue it doesn't need to be a whole ass MMO and I'd probably agree with that, but at the same time it's pretty reasonable considering how unstable even youtube can be at times, let alone the comparatively smaller companies they host concerts with

>>111080195
>>111080780
>>111082712
This is probably a subject for a different thread, but I wonder if Cover would ever consider (or one day might have to) stripping the MMO/metaverse aspects from HoloEarth and making it into something new. My question would be, what could they make with it?

>>111080831
Sexy jewess.

>>111064730
If you like streaming stream. If you like streaming as a vtuber stream as a vtuber. Just don't act like a freak and while people will initially treat you like a creep eventually they'll kind of tolerate you. If you care about numbers a lot then just do it faceless though.

>>111078066
>losing them was absolutely Cover fucking up
What else did you want them to do? Gura wanted out to keep all the revenue once it was made clear she had a bunch of diehard fans that paid out the ass for memberships and merch without caring if she disappeared for most of the year

>>111082970
Speaking strictly from a business standpoint, Cover should have absolutely offered to front that business and use their industry connections and existing infrastructural framework to leverage why Gura can make more money sticking with them instead of going at it alone with a new IP. At the very least, let her make a new IP but negotiate a persistent settlement on the continued use of the Gura brand.
Not doing this is obviously good for us fans, but it is still a massive failure since Cover gets left with nothing.

>>111076015
>During his last limited merch drop, he only sold 200 units.
yeah, out of 200.
That's kind of the problem here. They never even get a chance to sell enough to break even because the suits need to "SELL OUT"

>>111077424
>Fact of the matter is, Holostars have always been treated with kid gloves since day 1
or normal people have different priorities than mentally unwell third worlders on a mongolian fruit basket.

>>111083453
She was dead set in doing nothing and get paid more, sticking with cover would have meant she would have to do something once a year.
>Cover gets left with nothing.
They seem to be doing just fine.

>>111082767
A concert platform

>>111056285
oh no
anyway

>>111057948
>Somehow Niji can debut boys into instant success
>many literal who niji livers in the background
lol,lmao even

>>111075504
>niji DEAD
>cover is clearly the problem with having their JP and international branch thriving
sister u are retarded

>>111057162
They need to make it seem like foreign branches are thriving

>>111056285
>graduation was in the table
>never gonna do it
empty bluff

Ask Magni and Vesper how threatening graduation works at cover lol

>>111089599
“dead” to you maybe outside Japan but they’re the ones that can actually debut successful males. that’s been the focus lately.
>>111085480
one bettel isn’t enough. they’d need a dozen bettels.

>>111063806
>fumbled gura's career

you can lead a whore to water, but you can't make her stream

>>111056285
Whom?

All of this speaks for one sentiment: Cover, especially YAGOO, is fucking retarded for letting their passions go unchecked and causing even more unnecessary dramas, stressing out some talents, including the boys. They should have disbanded the Holostars branch before they (Hololive as a whole) got very big.