>>40972704
>s there any proof to that?
proof is look how many autistic pedophile "crusader" larpers are desperate to deboonk it. just go on youtube and look how many multiple hour long GNOSTICISM DEBOONKED videos there are. if it wasn't true people wouldn't be this desperate to deboonk it.

>>40972704
Jesus quotes Isaiah and David, speaks highly of Abraham, and speaks directly o both Moses and Elijah during His transfiguration. This alone should tell you everything you need to know. Gnostics are clueless.

>>40972704
It's my headcanon, which is the only canon i respect.

>>40973543
Or you know, maybe it's because people take these things serious and don't want others falling into such obvious lies? The fact that you fell for them should tell you a bit about yourself.

>>40973554
>Look Pastor Childfucker I'm debooooonking, Look at how hard I'm deboonking just like you taught me :))

Pathetic

>>40973543
>if it wasn't true people wouldn't be this desperate to deboonk it.
So I guess the holocaust is real.

>>40973548
Jesus calls Abraham a fool

You got tricked by the Jew into following Jew prophets and Jew laws

>>40972704
If you are white, not cucked by evangelical pastors wanting your money, pedo priests and willing to see through the lies then any presence of this desert faith should vanish from your life

>>40973574
>So I guess the holocaust is real.
Yes.

>>40973554
>*hylic barking noises*

>>40973579
Cool so jews are le oppressed and god is a le jew
Thanks

>>40973578
>any presence of this desert faith
Gnosticism is not a desert faith, it was born in Greece

Also, I've been saying this for years, Gnosticism is -- and the Gnostic gospels themselves say this, I'm actually shocked that I'm still having to explain this -- NOT ABRAHAMIC.

>>40973584
>Cool so jews are le oppressed
yes
>and god is a le jew
....no? I don't see how you figure these two statements are connected.

>>40973576
>>40973579
>>40973570
You guys ask questions, act like animals and then cry about Christians ruining the board. Either hold a discussion or don't bother. Stupid threads like this are the reason why the quality of this board has gone down. Look at how none of you address the points and devolve into complete fucking idiots. And you have the audacity to call me pathetic. What good is gnosticism when it's practitioners act like the equivalent of shit flinging monkeys?

>>40973543
Yes
>>40973574
Sure was. The psyop about the holocaust is that hitler killed more rebels and aryans than jews but big noses want all the spotlight

Threads like this are a perfect deterrent against gnosticism. Only complete fucking retards would see the people in this thread larping as gnostics and would think
>Wow look at how hyper intelligent they are acting like fucking retards and ignoring everything said and dismissing it with buzzwords. I want to be like that!

You guys are doing a great job! Keep it up!

>>40973593
>act like animals and then cry about Christians ruining the board.
nobody even mentioned Christians you schiz, that word appears 0 times in this thread.

>>40973602
Welcome to 4chan where glowfucks like you sling shit everywhere. Imagine caring what others think on this Antarctic human milking board
>but but think of the what the normies will say
Goooooo back

>>40973609
>Threads like this are a perfect deterrent against gnosticism.
And that's based, what makes you think we wanted you anyway? ~,o

>>40973589
Interesting how the most oppressed people run half the banks, hollywood, media, and what we can say

>>40973611
Its clearly a thread geared towards Christians since it speaks about who Jesus spoke of and how He felt about certain things. To claim otherwise just solidifies my point in how fucking stupid you guys come across behaving this way.

>>40973619
Point being (fucking sad I have to spell it out for you) by acting like retards and engaging as retards, you're only going to attract similar fucking idiots as yourself who already behave that way and are going to take it as an invitation to become just like yourself. Which you're right, is based. Cause gnosticism is fucking stupid, and only idiots like yourself would fall for such an obvious spiritual trap.

>>40973625
so what? you people don't own Jesus. stop trying to make everything about your ingroup, sometimes the conversation just isn't about you?

>>40973632
>only idiots like yourself would fall for such an obvious spiritual trap.
Says the guy whose biggest hope -- the euphoric daydream that brings him to his knees with tears in his eyes -- is that the Demiurge might one day move him into a comfier pet cage.

yeah, sure. I'm the one falling for an obvious trap. lol

>>40973637
Again, completely missing the point and acting like a fucking idiot. A question was asked, and answer was given, then you fucking clowns try and bite back with petty insults, ignoring what im actually saying and coming off as entirely arrogant and insufferable douchebags while still completely blind to all of this.

All while calling me a "hylic" lmfao.

>>40973620
>most oppressed people
Most jews are low level slaves, just like every other group only a few get to experience the elite lifestyle

>>40973641
Once more, not one of you have addressed my point. You just take my responses as an invitation to retort with petty and childish insults. You guys are a fucking joke, I hope you understand that.

Right right. So anons,was Jesus opposed to the old testament god?

>>40973644
>Again, completely missing the point and acting like a fucking idiot.
calm down, nobody's mad at you so don't be mad at us. I didn't write the Nag Hammadi texts, they were written thousands of years ago by people much smarter than myself. Don't shoot the messenger bro, just read them for yourself, no one's telling you you gotta take my word for it. So if you don't like the cut of my gib then just ignore me and drink the wisdom straight from the tap, just read the texts bro it's all in there

>>40973646
>Once more, not one of you have addressed my point. You just take my responses as an invitation to retort with petty and childish insults.
Then why do you keep posting? Like... humans have free will, if nobody's taking you seriously then maybe go do something else? No one's forcing you to be here bro

>>40973673
every human with a conscience is opposed to the OT god

>>40973675
Gnosticism is bullshit meant to spread lies against a legitimate covenant between man and God and trying to disturb what it represents by introducing false doctrines that don't match up with what is spoken of in thr canonic gospels. I've read parts of thr gospel of Thomas and noticed to glaringly obvious things

1)it doesnt read like the canonic gospels. It reads like some stupid Indian scamming yogi guru scumbags trying to mislead people away from the true faith by confusing them with nonsense.

2)the gnostic gospels just cheaply imitates the canonic gospels and is prone to taking to verses/teachings of Jesus and trying to combine them into one thing, which doesn't work.

>>40973673
Yes and that was already answered here
>>40973548

>>40973683
>Then why do you keep posting?
To poing out a glaringly obvious issue that you are so desperate to dismiss. You want an echo chamber not a discussion. Don't talk about things if you can't properly argue them.

>>40973688
So true, the Canonical gospels have a real solidity and specifity to it, while gnostic gospels seems to be written by some insectoid intelligence ( demons ).

Anyone honest can see the difference between the theology of the canonical gospels and the skyzo babble of the gnostic writings

>>40973701
>So true, the Canonical gospels have a real solidity and specifity to it, while gnostic gospels seems to be written by some insectoid intelligence ( demons ).
A conman with a silver tongue is probably going to speak with more solidity and specificity than a physics professor with asperger syndrome, but I'd still trust the professor's moral judgments over those of the conman.

Sorry but if you can't see how "just go into the light bro" is an obvious con then I can't help you

>>40973708
You are such a dishonest person it makes me wonder if you actually believe any of what you say, or are just being paid to be a dumbass on the internet.

The canon is perfectly fine if you can understand what you're reading. You're again being a dishonest person by avoiding the topic of discussion and trying to move the discussion against "perry old men" as if such an obvious wrong assessment should blind me to the fact that youre imply a dumbass with no real argument.

So these are the types that are drawn towards gnosticism, huh?

Its so easy to say you practice the real one without giving any credible evidence. Just face it, you're no different than a dumb fuck scientologist standing around the street corner trying to sell people on your bullshit. And it's only other clueless people that buy into it.

>>40973701
Agreed. Its like talking to someone for so long and interacting with them. You would know if you were texting them simply by how they conduct themselves in a discussion and how they express themselves.

>>40973720
The funniest part about all of this is that you've ironically fallen for the silver tongued con man. You've fallen for the age old adage of
>it's obscure, therefore it must be true

>>40973725
>You are such a dishonest person it makes me wonder if you actually believe any of what you say, or are just being paid to be a dumbass on the internet
bro I'm reaction-bullying you because you're annoying and off-topic, read the room

>>40973731
>You've fallen for the age old adage of
>>it's obscure, therefore it must be true
This is a bad faith argument because if Gnosticism was the popular thing you'd still find reasons to reeee at it

Reality check: It's 4chan and people are going to have beliefs you don't agree with, get over it lol no one's mad but you

>>40973740
I've been trying to remain on topic this whole thread. You're the one incapable of being on topic because you don't understand the material yourself. You cope by telling me that you're reaction bullying when in reality youre just trying to save face cause you haven't a fucking clue about any of this. Don't bring up topics you can't properly discuss. Even worse, don't accuse others of what you yourself are guilty of.

>>40973754
>don't accuse others of what you yourself are guilty of

I haven't accused you of anything bro wdym

>>40973749
You guys really are fucking stupid lol. Not one of you have addressed any points I've made about the actual topic and just keeps repeating that im mad without actually having a discussion. Gnosticism is easy to insult because it's so obviously wrong that anyone who legitimately practices can safely be dismissed as an idiot. The funniest part about this is that gnostics get this extreme sense of arrogance calling others NPCs and "hylics" while acting like complete fucking idiots, pulling shit out of their ass and claiming it's true. I can see why it was hated so extremely insecure the past.

>>40973763
You accused me of being off topic. Oh wait, this is your epic reaction-bullying. Ah! You got me *<[]8^)

>>40973766
you're saying more words than me which means you're taking this convo more seriously then me which means you're mad

>>40973766
>I can see why it was hated so extremely insecure the past.
*i can see why it was hated so much in the past

stupid autocorrect

>>40973779
Yea, that's the issue. I'm taking a topic of discussion serious for the discussion, in which the whole point of the thread is discussion, in which you're not providing proper discussion and rather saying none of this is to be taken serious apparently. Which defeats the whole point of the thread, right?

You guys just want to blogspot without anyone telling you why you're wrong. It's fucking sad.

>>40973788
>blogspot
*blog post

>>40972704
Pro-tip: If you're having trouble interpreting a verse, cite it and ask for help. Don't start a thread with some broad generalization based on nothing, it gives off troll vibes.

>>40972704
"Jesus said: If those who lead you say to you: Behold, the Sovereignty is in the sky!, then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they say to you: It is in the sea!, then the fish of the sea will precede you. But the Sovereignty of God is within you and it is without you. Whoever recognizes himself shall find it; and when you recognize yourselves you shall know that you are the Sons of the Living Father. Yet if you do not recognize yourselves, then you are impoverished and you are the impoverishment."

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>>40973850

>>40972704
Malkizadekh (however you spell it) is labeled as a priest king of El Elyon in Genesis
>Abraham encounters him pre-covenant
>Abraham tithes to him showing his inferiority
>Abraham gets blessed by him again showing his inferiority

In Deuteronomy 32 El Elyon gives the nations of the earth as inheritance according to the number of the Sons of God, YHWH's inheritance is Israel.
>Makes El Elyon supreme over all the elohim, YHWH is one such elohim
>Dead Sea Scroll version confirms this distinction, not the later translations

Psalm 82 is explicitly El Elyon giving shit to the elohim for their horrible work ruling over their inheritance - and condemns them to die as men do - possibly incarnate. Could be metaphor for earthly judges, but then it deifies men without merit simply due to legal power
Jesus says in the Gospels, that no man has seen the Father
>Not Jacob
>Not Moses
>Certainly not the Jews whom he calls sons of the devil, for their actions

The Book of Hebrews says Jesus is the eternal priest king in the order of Malkizadekh (however you spell it)
> Closing the loop and revealing Jesus as bringing humanity back to knowing the universal God - Most High - El Elyon
>Not the lesser national deity YHWH

>You dont need gnostic texts to make the distinction between YHWH and Jesus clear

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What the fuck is wrong with you people?

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And again I saw with mine eyes as I slept, and I saw the heaven above, and behold a star fell 2 from heaven, and it arose and eat and pastured amongst those oxen. And after that I saw the large and the black oxen, and behold they all changed their stalls and pastures and their cattle, and began 3 to live with each other. And again I saw in the vision, and looked towards the heaven, and behold I saw many stars descend and cast themselves down from heaven to that first star, and they became 4 bulls amongst those cattle and pastured with them [amongst them]. And I looked at them and saw, and behold they all let out their privy members, like horses, and began to cover the cows of the oxen, 5 and they all became pregnant and bare elephants, camels, and asses. And all the oxen feared them and were affrighted at them, and began to bite with their teeth and to devour, and to gore with their 6 horns. And they began, moreover, to devour those oxen; and behold all the children of the earth began to tremble and quake before them and to flee from them.

>>40973850
>If those who lead you say to you: Behold, the Sovereignty is in the sky!, then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they say to you: It is in the sea!, then the fish of the sea will precede you.

Matthew 24:23
At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or, ‘There he is!’ do not believe it.

You see the cheap imitation?

>>40973871
You know nothing. The judges were regarded as gods to the people since they held the authority to do what God is only allowed to do. Deuteronomy 32 speaks of no such things.

Both Isaiah and king David prophecy precisely to the finer details of the death Jesus would inevitably suffer.

>>40973881
Shut up retard

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>>40973917
74 And as touching all this the eyes of those sheep were blinded so that they saw not, and (the eyes of) their shepherds likewise; and they delivered them in large numbers to their shepherds for 75 destruction, and they trampled the sheep with their feet and devoured them. And the Lord of the sheep remained unmoved till all the sheep were dispersed over the field and mingled with them (i.e. the 76 beasts), and they (i.e. the shepherds) did not save them out of the hand of the beasts. And this one who wrote the book carried it up, and showed it and read it before the Lord of the sheep, and implored Him on their account, and besought Him on their account as he showed Him all the doings 77 of the shepherds, and gave testimony before Him against all the shepherds. And he took the actual book and laid it down beside Him and departed.

Gnosticism was an attempt to force the christ cult back into the orthodoxy of Greek mystery religion.
Islam was in turn an attempt to force Gnosticism into a Semitic orthodoxy

>>40973935
Jesus called all to repentance, not just the people who you think are "based".

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>>40973950
1 And I saw one of those four who had come forth first, and he seized that first star which had fallen from the heaven, and bound it hand and foot and cast it into an abyss: now that abyss was 2 narrow and deep, and horrible and dark. And one of them drew a sword, and gave it to those elephants and camels and asses: then they began to smite each other, and the whole earth quaked 3 because of them. And as I was beholding in the vision, lo, one of those four who had come forth stoned (them) from heaven, and gathered and took all the great stars whose privy members were like those of horses, and bound them all hand and foot, and cast them in an abyss of the earth.

>>40973945
Gnosticism was an attempt at Jewish subversion against the new covenant that they deny from their own God because they want to maintain the old covenant that allows them to live materialistic lives whereas the new covenant is a purely Spiritual covenant meant to cleanse humanity of our fallen state and return us to how God intended.

>>40973959
No one’s interested in your fetish fag boy

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>>40973950
And those seventy shepherds were judged and found guilty, and they were cast 26 into that fiery abyss. And I saw at that time how a like abyss was opened in the midst of the earth, full of fire, and they brought those blinded sheep, and they were all judged and found guilty and 27 cast into this fiery abyss, and they burned; now this abyss was to the right of that house. And I saw those sheep burning and their bones burning. 28 And I stood up to see till they folded up that old house; and carried off all the pillars, and all the beams and ornaments of the house were at the same time folded up with it, and they carried 29 it off and laid it in a place in the south of the land. And I saw till the Lord of the sheep brought a new house greater and loftier than that first, and set it up in the place of the first which had beer folded up: all its pillars were new, and its ornaments were new and larger than those of the first, the old one which He had taken away, and all the sheep were within it.

>>40973959
Just know I'm not reading your posts.

>>40972704
Why was Jesus in a public park with a naked boy?

4 And then that valley shall be filled with their elect and beloved,
And the days of their lives shall be at an end,
And the days of their leading astray shall not thenceforward be reckoned.
5 And in those days the angels shall return
And hurl themselves to the east upon the Parthians and Medes:
They shall stir up the kings, so that a spirit of unrest shall come upon them,
And they shall rouse them from their thrones,
That they may break forth as lions from their lairs,
And as hungry wolves among their flocks.

6 And they shall go up and tread under foot the land of His elect ones
[And the land of His elect ones shall be before them a threshing-floor and a highway :]
7 But the city of my righteous shall be a hindrance to their horses.
And they shall begin to fight among themselves,
And their right hand shall be strong against themselves,
And a man shall not know his brother,
Nor a son his father or his mother,
Till there be no number of the corpses through their slaughter,
And their punishment be not in vain.

8 In those days Sheol shall open its jaws,
And they shall be swallowed up therein
And their destruction shall be at an end;
Sheol shall devour the sinners in the presence of the elect.'

>>40973970
Again, you know nothing. Would the sinful woman in Luke 7 have sorrowful repented if the Lord had not called thr sinners to repentance? The whole point is to acknowledge your sin and repent. It isn't a secret club so that only you and the people you pre-approved of are allowed to partake in.

Ultimately, it is the Lord's judgment that matters. And He has shown that He can take even the most evil and corruption men and turn them into instruments of rightrousness.

>>40973979
You really need me to post the copy pasta?

>>40973979
No one’s interested in your gay jewish fetish

>>40973548
Gnosticism proper mostly takes a nuanced view of the Old Testament that is willing to see different prophets and passages as being from different spiritual beings who may not be all good or all bad, and it also allows that some of jt was just added by humans (Maybe in line with Jeremiah's "lying pen of the scribes" and Colossians' " “Do not handle! Do not taste! Do not touch!” All these regulations refer to things that perish with use; they are simply human commands and teachings." See also http://www.gnosis.org/library/flora.htm)

It's only Marcion who wholly rejected the Old Testament, and if you see Gnosticism as the original Christianity, Orthodoxy and Marcionism might then be seen as opposing simplifications of it for the masses, one saying the Old Testament is all good and all from God and the other saying the Old Testament is all bad and all from the evil creator deity.

>>40973997
Why was he arrested then?

>>40974010
No one’s interested in your gay delusional fetish, jew

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And that 30 sheep ascended to the summit of that lofty rock, and the Lord of the sheep sent it to them. And after that I saw the Lord of the sheep who stood before them, and His appearance was great and 31 terrible and majestic, and all those sheep saw Him and were afraid before His face. And they all feared and trembled because of Him, and they cried to that sheep with them [which was amongst 32 them]: ' We are not able to stand before our Lord or to behold Him.' And that sheep which led them again ascended to the summit of that rock, but the sheep began to be blinded and to wander 33 from the way which he had showed them, but that sheep wot not thereof. And the Lord of the sheep was wrathful exceedingly against them, and that sheep discovered it, and went down from the summit of the rock, and came to the sheep, and found the greatest part of them blinded and fallen 34 away.

>>40974020
Jesus was a Jew.

>>40973979
He was wearing a tebennos (a Greek formal garment very similar to a toga), but lost it when a soldier grabbed it to try and detain him. The passage is probably meant to be a metaphor of some kind, abandoning worldly possessions for salvation etc.

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And I saw till they laid down that sword, which had been given to the sheep, and they brought it back into the house, and it was sealed before the presence of the Lord, and all the sheep 35 were invited into that house, but it held them not. And the eyes of them all were opened, and they 36 saw the good, and there was not one among them that did not see. And I saw that that house was large and broad and very full. 37 And I saw that a white bull was born, with large horns and all the beasts of the field and all the 38 birds of the air feared him and made petition to him all the time. And I saw till all their generations were transformed, and they all became white bulls; and the first among them became a lamb, and that lamb became a great animal and had great black horns on its head; and the Lord of the sheep 39 rejoiced over it and over all the oxen. And I slept in their midst: and I awoke and saw everything. 40 This is the vision which I saw while I slept, and I awoke and blessed the Lord of righteousness and 41 gave Him glory. Then I wept with a great weeping and my tears stayed not till I could no longer endure it: when I saw, they flowed on account of what I had seen; for everything shall come and 42 be fulfilled, and all the deeds of men in their order were shown to me. On that night I remembered the first dream, and because of it I wept and was troubled-because I had seen that vision.

>>40974009
I think another thing a neoGnostic would probably have to suggest is that the New Testament we have is one that got worked over by orthodoxy, not the original, and that the originals of at least Paul's letters and probably Mark, Luke, and John were more Gnostic-friendly. And I think a case can be made for that, but at that point you've accepted that *so much* of scripture is wrong and that the originals are absent that a reasonable NeoGnosticism would probably have to admit to being a "religion" that isn't founded on scripture at all. Which, to be fair, the original Gnosticism as founded on scripture as orthodoxy anyway. But still it leaves it pretty ungrounded.

>>40974065
Why was the boy there with Jesus alone in Park to begin with? Why did the boy run away for?

>>40974091
*the original Gnosticism wasn't as founded on scripture as orthodoxy anyway

>>40974094
No ones interested in your gay jewish delusion fetish, Mosheberg

>>40974067
Didn’t read

>>40974094
Secret Mark implies that he was Lazarus of Bethany.

>>40974091
Personally I think it was Peter and Paul that did the working over.

The Church was created to lure people away from worshipping the serpent. The historical figure of Jesus was a serpent cult leader and the reason he was used as the main character.

>>40974123
Then who do you think is responsible for preserving Jesus' true teachings? Thinking that Christianity was corrupted within a century or two leaves at least some time for evidence of a correct Christianity to be preserved, but if Christianity got back-to-back corruption right out of the gate, it seems pretty pointless to speculate about whatever Jesus might've actually thought.

>>40974009
The entirety of the OT is valid and shows the Lord fulfilling His promise to Abraham. There is no evil happening there, just human minds thinking they can judge God.

>>40974169
1 Corinthians 2:16, " 'For who has known the mind of the Lord so as to instruct him?' But we have the mind of Christ."

>>40974135
What the actual fuck is this schizo nonsense?

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>>40973979
>>40974065
>>40974094
>>40974113
>that running away made it fall off?
It literally says that he was seized, but fled naked, leaving his garment behind. Which means this young man was in danger of being killed or arrested by the mob, so he did what was necessary, stripped off his linen cloth, and ran away.

>why was he in the park so scantily clothed with jesus in the middle of the night?
Because that's how people dressed back then. It was normal for people to wear an inner garment that was made of linen cloth (pic related). That is the equivalent to long johns,) which eventually just became underwears in todays world.

> thats not whats said for a reason
That's exactly what was said.
mark 14:46
46 The men seized Jesus and arrested him.
Jesus was already seized by the time this debacle occurred.

>you wrote a whole paragraph, and once again, had nothing of value to say.
The irony is hilarious.

>>40974185
Exactly my point. Those who argue against the OT and claim God in the OT is evil or has done wrong while claiming Jesus is good an the NT is correct are idiots who don't understand anything happening in the Bible.

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>>40973997
Who again, canaanite?

>>40974197
That's the only defense they have. On the contrary, which modern nation nowadays, aside from the most absolutely pozzed, third world hellhole, would allow rapes to happen at public sight and not only have the passersby do nothing to stop them, but also join? Imagine that behavior happening on what was supposed to be a -rich- prosperous city.

We really can't establish how hellish the past was beyond a certain point. Maybe if we lived it we would also agree with God on a great reset.

>>40974208
Why are you posting a picture of your boss?

>>40974241
People tend to forget how brutal life back then was, and how big of a game changer it was for a nation like Israel to establish a set of laws with moral integrity. Having to deal with warring nations who want to challenge you due to having the reputation of a powerful nation led by a powerful God. Completely blind to the fact that many nations were offering their kids as literal sacrifices, whole towns of sexual immorality (Sodom and Gomorrah) and things like this.

Even living in this modern day, it's obvious why Revelations was prophesied. I have seen just how evil things are here on earth. Like, really seen and I fully understand why it's all going to happen. Not much has changed since Jesus roamed the earth. We still have a powerful group of jews running things that are persistent in trying to discredit the Christian faith and enforcing laws that they themselves don't abide by.

>>40974190
>literally says
depends on the translation which is the problem.

>>40974190
>you wrote a whole paragraph, and once again, had nothing of value to say.
This is addressed to which post?

>>40974268
it's a copy pasted response for a copy pasted accusation.

>>40974259
It really doesn't. This cheap cop out of an answer doesn't work here, or anywhere really. Because it doesn't matter the translation, what matters is whether you have or don't have the Holy Spirit to properly make sense of things for you. Even if you were to read the Bible completely unedited, untranslated in it's complete raw form, you still wouldn't understand a single thing, because you clearly don't have the Holy Spirit in you.

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>>40974258
No, Jews are just the scapegoat for a much larger cosmic problem that includes fallen angels like Azazel proffering hidden knowledge to incels on the internet, all centered around the Lovecraftian weirdness of big black dicks and the disgust, confusion, and insecurity white humans feel, including Jews, when seeing these strange sights on the internet. The fallen angels thus answered with the red pill, turning humans into violent savages.

No one wants to talk about what it really all means, which is why they didn't include the Book of Enoch in canon

It's a cosmic horror that will never be lived down

>>40974306
And here is yet another example of people talking about things they clearly don't understand. And yet another example of people trying to engage in a discussion, but don't actually want to engage in a discussion. They just want to voice their opinion, completely disregarding any points you've made. You've addressed nothing I've said and just continue to spew a bunch of bullshit and the worst part of it all, is that I bet someone read your post and thought
>wow, he knows what he's talking about

The sad part is that you're clueless.

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>>40972704
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanat_Kumara

>>40974167
>Then who do you think is responsible for preserving Jesus' true teachings?
The hidden traditions descended from the Essenes. Though you're right in that I don't think scripture as orthodoxy is particularly important anyway.

>>40974290
>It really doesn't. This cheap cop out of an answer doesn't work here, or anywhere really. Because it doesn't matter the translation, what matters is whether you have or don't have the Holy Spirit to properly make sense of things for you. Even if you were to read the Bible completely unedited, untranslated in it's complete raw form, you still wouldn't understand a single thing, because you clearly don't have the Holy Spirit in you.
Thanks for the response. I thought I was going to debate a learned scholar. Instead
>the Holy Spirit confirms my bias.
Have a great rest of the day anon.

>>40974318
No bro. I feel how weird it is. It feels like goodness doesn't exist, which is why I'm a paranoid person.

After the red pill hit the mainstream, immediately black males were everywhere. You did it to yourselves, whoever put that out there.

>>40974327
There is no such thing as a learned scholar without the Holy Spirit. That's just how it is, and you can pretend it's any other way, but that just shows your lack of understanding.

>>40974333
No, you don't know shit.

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>>40974346
Have you read the longest parts of the Book of Enoch? It's all in there in even the most simple metaphors. Do not be dismissive

Not really. It was a radical idea that came up a century later. A Greek Christian who only had the Gospel of Luke and John and a few of Paul's letters finally got a hold of the Septuagint and was disappointed with the apparent contradiction of the Old Testament God. Jesus' disciples continued to worship Yahweh and went to the temple in Jerusalem so much that the temple priests told them to stop preaching Jesus or they would be permanently banned. Paul, Peter and Matthew accepted those terms and continued to worship there when they visited. This is an indication of they were devoted to the Old Testament God that they considered to be the same God. If Jesus preached about a Demiurge they would have known and been against remaining silent and would have stopped going to the Temple. Gnostic Christianity appeared after the Council of Jamnia in 90 AD when Jews finally had an official policy of not allowing Christians in the synagogue. It only made theological sense to claim Old Testament God and New Testament God are 2 different gods after the official religious schism. When they were not welcome even if a Christian just sat down and shut the hell up.

>>40974355
I don't trust any modern translations of Enoch, just as how I don't trust any books on Christian mysticism in general. All you need is the Holy Spirit. Holy Spirit with no bible > Bible including book of Enoch with no Holy Spirit. However, Holy Spirit + Bible = Perfect.

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>>40974393
You're trying to lead people astray. The entire black male impregnating women of other races and creating abominations is only in the Book of Enoch, and it never could have been about a time prior to today

>And again I saw with mine eyes as I slept, and I saw the heaven above, and behold a star fell 2 from heaven, and it arose and eat and pastured amongst those oxen. And after that I saw the large and the black oxen, and behold they all changed their stalls and pastures and their cattle, and began 3 to live with each other. And again I saw in the vision, and looked towards the heaven, and behold I saw many stars descend and cast themselves down from heaven to that first star, and they became 4 bulls amongst those cattle and pastured with them [amongst them]. And I looked at them and saw, and behold they all let out their privy members, like horses, and began to cover the cows of the oxen, 5 and they all became pregnant and bare elephants, camels, and asses. And all the oxen feared them and were affrighted at them, and began to bite with their teeth and to devour, and to gore with their 6 horns. And they began, moreover, to devour those oxen; and behold all the children of the earth began to tremble and quake before them and to flee from them.

>>40974405
Here's the attention and the (You) you so desperately crave. Don't expect any more from me.

>>40974091
The most gnostic book in cannon is Revelation. Funny that it gets written a few years before the first gnostic gospels get written. You cannot make sense of some of those prophesies without the gnostic esoterism. Like who is the eagle rescuing the woman about to give birth. It is Christ in his pre-Jesus form. While the Gnostic gospels are generally wrong theologically there is so much esoteric knowledge that helps make sense of some of the most difficult parts of the Bible to understand.

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>>40974411
People are always going to ignore the Book of Enoch because it's almost so clear in prophecy that it disturbs the mind when you reread it year after year.

It's best not to dwell on it or you'll go crazy like me

I may have to get drunk again

>>40973965
>the new covenant is a purely Spiritual covenant meant to cleanse humanity of our fallen state
and yet look at how material modern-day mainstream grandma Christianity is. Christians are obsessed with corporeal things; the corporeal resurrection of Jesus. The corporeal resurrection of all faithful humans on the day of whatever, and the corporeal immortality of the faithful in Heaven etc.

Christians are obsessed with material wealth, material political power, and material means of maintaining their material power. Christians love material things and hate spiritual things, we're talking about the same people who think meditation is "satanic." I mean how the hell (no pun intended) did that happen? Something is seriously "off" about Christianity, you got sold a big fat fib son I'm sorry

>>40974440
And yet they tried so hard to ban the Gnostic gospels because they don't WANT you to understand the esoteric truths, they don't WANT you to be spiritual. They want you to eat the bread and drink the wine and sing hallelujah and have all the outer (superficial, material etc.) trappings of the religion with none of the spiritual substrata.

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It's just best not to dwell on it

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>>40974464
That is also in the Book of Enoch

>74 And as touching all this the eyes of those sheep were blinded so that they saw not, and (the eyes of) their shepherds likewise; and they delivered them in large numbers to their shepherds for 75 destruction, and they trampled the sheep with their feet and devoured them. And the Lord of the sheep remained unmoved till all the sheep were dispersed over the field and mingled with them (i.e. the 76 beasts), and they (i.e. the shepherds) did not save them out of the hand of the beasts. And this one who wrote the book carried it up, and showed it and read it before the Lord of the sheep, and implored Him on their account, and besought Him on their account as he showed Him all the doings 77 of the shepherds, and gave testimony before Him against all the shepherds. And he took the actual book and laid it down beside Him and departed.

>>40974464
Honestly the best post on the thread this far.

>>40974333
Checked those Christ trips. Praise KEK

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>>40974487
The red pill came out and blacks were everywhere, and then Trump came along like a remote-controlled golem and caused everybody to become violent and unhinged.

>>40974476
so wait is the Sheep Lord like Jesus's battle form or something

>>40974496
I agree. Trump derangement syndrome is real. I don't know what it's going to be without him in the white house. I don't think Republicans have another Trump. They've been spineless for so long they'll probably relapse after Trump.

>>40972704
Isn't the entire point of Christianity that it brings the Greek wisdom to the stupid tribals and whoever wants to convert good, whoever doesn't can rot with their dumb tribal god(s)? The Dead Sea scrolls clearly show Gnostic-like teachings, and even the New Testament shows the Devil ruling the earth and Jesus rejecting him.

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>>40973906
David and Isaiah prophesying through the mediation of YHWH does not in anyway automatically collapse the personhood of YHWH into EL Elyon or vice versa. The Logos is preexistent to the elohim.

What you said is also your interpretation ofc, which brings me to my next point:

Revelatory truth must be interpreted to be understood and disseminated - and theres an enormous practical likelihood that that gap between what people can understand through interpretation is exactly why YHWH is such a shitty deity in the old testament - the resolution of understanding increases 100 fold once we have the words of Jesus.
>Interpretation is still necessary
>But it requires absurd layers of abstraction to allow for the things the old testament God 'communicated' to the Israelites.

>And anyway
>To know anything, you must know it directly
>Not know it only intellectually
>Jesus invites us to abide in him and unify with him in a relational and experiential way, to live in him

The human frame named Yeshua is quite a bit different in the Astral than what doctrinal institutional Christianity thinks him to be.

And honestly, if you must have scripture, a straight reading of the NT brings you way closer to the truth then any layered doctrinal interpretation or denomination - including the gnostic ones.

If anyone wants to ask for clarifying details from Jesus as he lives now in the immaterial realms - he doesn't have dail up but there's answers that I have taken down over time. Feel free to ask

>>40974516
I'd rather stay focused in the hear and now instead of having my life revolve around paying my dues for the afterlife country club.

tl;dr I ride with the Devil.

>>40974541
Isn't that hand position Jesus is using in that pic from free masonry for punishment?

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>>40974546
Well if there was a contemporary appearence of the man
>It certainly would mean judgement

Its a modern reconstruction I made based of astral visions, the hand gesture was not intentional but quite fitting nonetheless.

Judgement is ultimately causal desu, it's just the consequences of going your own way as a fractured part of the whole who has no interest in reunifying. You literally get what you deserve based on your vibrational disposition - you don't have to call it karma, but it's the same thing.

The only escape from all that debt of action and impulse is dissolving into the Christ - nothing else gets you out of this matrix, but unlike the gnostic rendition - the matrix is not inherently bad or evil, it is the necessary playground for the unfolding of the souls desire for seperation from God. Its here for you as long as tou still want it - when you've had enough - you dissolve the fracture and go home.

Judgement is causality
Mercy is reunification

>>40974543
Then may the devil keep you satisfied.
Whenever you've had enough the Logos is still there to let you come home.

But you'll have to wiggle your way back to a human life at least
>And that may be way more unpleasant then you're prepared for
>But His will be done nonetheless
>God bless you anon

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>>40974516
The teaching is the Logos, no mistake there. And reassuringly it can be derived a priori from consciousness itself.

So its realer than real, it is the preexistent order required for anything to be 'real'

>Like platonism it is in practice elitist
>Stratified by capacity for wisdom
>The tribal mind, will continue to cling to what it understands

The development levels in picrel (sorry for the resolution) are a good conceptual overlay in observable stratification of peoples.

>Maybe 1/3 have the capacity to be saved
>The others would need serious conscious development
>Maybe why the gnostics posited that a majority of people are non salvageable NPCs
>They need more lifetimes to cook

>>40974327
The Holy Spirit is not falsefiable or externally verifiable by anyone.

Being entirely subjective and self diagnosed its a moot metric by which to measure understanding or fidelity to Christ.

Jesus did give a good falsefiable test though
>You shall know them by their fruits
>Good fruits, holy spirit present. regardless of institutional status.
>Bad fruits, no holy spirit present, again regardless of institutional status.

If a secular man consistently bares good fruits in life, then Christian or not, he is loyal to the Logos. But without knowing it, he will get a proportional reward according to his karmic balance, not absolute liberation.

And by their fruits, denominational Christianity is a mixed bag, so clearly its not all 'for the Lord'. Its more often for material wealth and power - but some good fruits still make it through.

>>40974619
Heaven isn't a test of man's wisdom or intelligence

>>40974675
>Heaven is not
>Salvation is

Theosis requires full understanding and constant ongoing alignment with grace and the Logos. Belief alone as the is good, and will get you a wonderful outcome after material death

>But full union has a prerequisite of understanding and adherence at all levels
>And without bare minimum intelligence someone just doesn't have the capacity for abstraction and insight required to start
>The intelligence bar is not that high
>Intelligence is only one aspect of consciousness
>But even an intellectually dumb person can have intuitive experiential insight into the truth

>Wisdom is not only bound to intellect
>But intellect is a gift when seeking wisdom

>>40974703
nope

>>40974667
Isn't this just like common sense? Do people not think like this?

>>40974706
Fair enough
Enjoy your ride
>If you look a little further, actually read the koine greek you'll see the difference between salvation into aonic life, which ends
>And reunification with God, which is unconditioned by time

If you're content with aonic life, you should be, its a great deal.

>>40974724
No logical reasoning is not common sense sadly.

Most people you'll meet barely reason, or know how to reason, or go by anything else than their emotional impulses.

>>40973543
I noticed that nothing makes christians seethe as much as gnosticism/nag hamadi gospel questions on forums or facebook groups. Just mention it and you'll get a load of replies that start with, you're going straight to hell.

>>40974872
They're well trained dogma dogs
>If they had two braincells to rub together
>They could read all positions and discern the truth for themselves

>>40974724
>Isn't this just like common sense? Do people not think like this?

bro when I was growing up as a Pagan teenager in bible thumpy la-la land a very common question I got asked was "dddduuuhhhhhh if no bibel then what's stopping u from raping and killing and stealing everything >:?"

No these people don't have common sense, they literally believe having basic scientific literacy is "satanic". Of course I assume that's also brain trauma from being circ*mcized at birth, but all the fear-based conditioning of being brought up in conventional burgerprotestant Christianity sure doesn't help things

>>40974883
I think this is exclusively an American Evangelist thing, they seem to be the dumbest people in the world.

>>40972704
Ask God. You useless piece of shit.

>>40974943
It's a simplification of CS Lewis's "The Abolition of Man".

No. This frame of reference is dumb too. I highly suggest reading Plotinus' criticism of Gnosticism. Afterward, Neo-Platonism and Gnosticism blended heavily. This rhetoric about the Demiurge and the whole archons and prison planet and old testament bad, material world bad, etc., all of it is very antiquated.
I suggest looking up Saklas, Abraxas and/or Gadreel/Samael. He's the Ialdaboath, like Plato talked about.
>what was it really about then?
It was about the Matrimony. Jesus and Mary the Magdalene married and had at least one daughter. The Merovingian line, for one example, descended from this family.
Jesus was the Bridegroom of Sophia, whose avatar was Mary the Magdalene. "Jesus" came to the material realm to rescue her, after she grew confused. Their (re)union rescued her and the child they shared set things in motion from there.
They both belonged to powerful Bloodlines and their marriage was meant to consolidate power of sorts. This made certain people unhappy (and the guy already had a knack for that to begin with). They fled to an area where their family was prominent, even if distantly.
This is where your Grail Myths come from.

all religion is brainwash

jesus died for you

it's just a metaphor

you die for you, you are your own savior, you need to take responsibility for your life

you need to sacrifice your ego and fight hate , and lies , that pop up in your mind via thought especially when you feel some emotion of anger or envy towards another human being , no matter what color race or creed

there you go

this basically sums up the entire belief system


if you pray for 1 thing.. pray for wisdom and wisdom only

>>40973645
Yikes - swing and a miss, Levi...

>open thread
>scroll down
>demoralization and rage bait pics
Gnostics are into something and (((somepeople))) are not happy about that