>>41098808

There are Buddhist monasteries around the Himalayas that claim they have records of Christ being there during his missing years. I tend to believe it. I view Christ as an OP mystic.

>>41098808
There is no Jesus is Gnosticism. It's a bullshit scam that uses the name of Jesus to try and mislead people into a bunch of lies that seem true.

>>41098808
>Are Gnostic Christianity and Mahayana Buddhism the same thing in different terms?

NO

>>41098818
>There are Buddhist monasteries around the Himalayas that claim they have records of Christ

This is an old hoax long since debunked.

>>41098938
How are they different if not encroaching upon similar concepts?
>>41098897
Then what is true? Because it's almost certainly not mainstream Christianity.

>>41098808
No.

>>41098808
Christianity is some kind of Greek Dionysus related... plagerism?

The Dionysus cults broke ritual rules and norms and challenged authority in the same way Christianity denounced all the laws of it's own religion. The dying and rising theme is the same, and it's clearly sourced from Greece and is written in Greek.

I remember wondering if the origin of the Greek wine god came from where wine was first produced, and this was then carried around and entered other places.

>>41100270
Christianity has a lot in common with salvific mystery cults in general (in so far as we know much about mystery cults). Salvation: just sort of something people were in to.

>>41098808
siddharta is more theravada no?

>>41098808
Both came into knowledge of the Source. Jesus was sent, Buddha obtained.

>>41099218
>it's almost certainly not mainstream Christianity.
yes, it is

>>41098808
not exactly mahayana, but you are getting close to something a lot of people have discussed, even academically. one major difference is that most gnostic strains don't really have any sort of concept of a bodhisattva like mahayana does, much less an emphasis on becoming one; there's also not a real parallel to śunyata doctrine, nor anything like anattā, both of which are quite central to mahayana. gnostic practice was also a lot more barebones, just as a result of existing for a much shorter timeframe. i think if the gnostics survived longer they might have developed into something strongly resembling mahayana, there are shared philosophies between the two, but it's hard to say they're the "same thing"

>>41100511
Too many gaps for in mainstream for it to be true. And the behavior of most Christians is demonic both now and historically. You shall know them by their fruits.

>>41098808
I've been exposed to a singificant amount of both philosophies and sorry, but absolutely not. Nothing Jesus said even approximated what the Buddha expounded, they are not contemporaries.

Jesus was a worldly Siddha.

>>41102351
This. Grew up Buddhist, from a Buddhist family, but got a deep interest in Christianity as I got older, and they are so unbelievably different in terms of view its insane.
I learned that the whole "you know... Buddhism and Christianity are super alike!" thing is usually followed by Christian conversion attempts.

Buddhism is fundamentally at odds with Christianity. This is proven by dependent origination, complete rejections of an omnipotent creator, the rejection of a permanent afterlife, the rejection of a fixed soul or identity, the list goes on. Buddhists also believe in self liberation, rather than salvation, its a project they have to personally undertake.

Also a lot of Christians seems to think Karma is some type of autonomous judgement system, its not. Trying to harmonize them and pass them off as compatible would require one or the other, or maybe even both to make massive compromises that would redefine either system into something it never was to begin with.

>>41098808
They both come out of different facets of Zoroastrianism and Mithraism from the Persian empire.

Read Jason Jorjani

Not quite. I'd lean into Vajrayana more if I were you. The real overlap is Shiva and Shakti with Jesus and Sophia (Barbelo).
>>41098818
So "Jesus" traveled a hell of a lot in his youth. First, his parents sent him off to Egypt to study in Qumran. He later travelled to the British Isles (see Joseph of Arimathea) to be initiated into the Druidic Mysteries, he travelled to Persia, India, Tibet and apparently even some of the Greek world too (some say he inspired the stories of Apollonius of Tyanna).
In the East, he was known as the Prophet "Issa".
>>41100270
>Christianity is some kind of Greek Dionysus related... plagerism?
Sure, minus the part about plagiarism.
The whole "he's Dionysus" thing was a posthumous change; he and his friends did enjoy the Kykeon, however. In fact, there are frescoes to this day underneath the Vatican which depict a man (clearly Dionysus based on the art) surrounded by 12 other men and they're all seemingly drinking from one chalice.
>The Dionysus cults broke ritual rules and norms and challenged authority in the same way Christianity denounced all the laws of it's own religion.
So the Demeterian Mysteries of Eleusis were the real inspiration for the Bacchinalia festivals. When they were banned in 183 BC, it certifiably was not because they "broke ritual rules and challenged authority". Saying something like this only reveals an evident dearth of affiliation.
When they were banned, the real reason was because of the tendencies of those who imbibed the drink to have a strict aversion to War. I'm sure you can imagine how that was bad for business considering Rome's patron was fucking Mars-Ares of all deities.
>Greek wine god came from where wine was first produced
So it was Beer before Wine. Mead was a big one in there too (see Honey). Dionysus isn't the only "I'm in the drugs, guys" god. It's a hell of a lot more Osiris (Blue Lotus), Asterion (Cannabis), Demeter (Beer - Ergotized), Ayahuasca (Mother Ayhuasca), Iboagine (Panther), etc.

>>41100460
Shakyamuni was the creator of Buddhism. Mahayana, Theravada and Vajrayana are all afterthoughts based on my understanding. This is a knowledge gap that I have, however, and ironing out such a detail was never important to me. I'd love to be told if I'm wrong.
>>41100302
Interesting claim. By all means, elaborate on other examples of "Salvific Mystery Cults". That's not a popular term in Comparative Mythology or the Occult world necessarily, as far as I'm informed.
>>41100506
They're cousins.
Are you familiar with the Saka, Sacae or Shakya, anon? Did you know Ptolemy, "Jesus"' father/grandfather, was from Macedonia? Did you know Macedonia was adjacent to Greater Scythia, Anatolia or Asia Minor, the area now comprising modern Turkey?
Did you know that all across Europe, people were called Saka, Sacae, Danaan, Danann, Gael, Gaul, Galatian, etc? Did you know that, anon? Isn't that odd?
>>41102351
Doesn't Siddha look a little like Sidhe?
I'm sure it's just a concidence. Sidhe doesn't mean anything like Siddhi, right? None of these words are similar, so we probably shouldn't waste any more time thinking about this.

>>41098818
And Glastonbury abbey claims to have been built on top of the location of a primitive church constructed by Christ himself from waddle and dob during the lost years. Neither claim has any real evidence other than how much either stimulates someone's fantasies.

>>41102517
>Buddhism is fundamentally at odds with Christianity.
Buddy, read again.
You're looking for Ialdaboath, Moksha, muh prison planet, Shiva+Shakti banging like Jesus and Mary the Magdalene, you're looking for Manjushri having the same Flaming Sword as Jesus. You're looking for the "Mortification grants Siddhis" rhetoric, which Jesus was famous for (see Essenes).
Frankly, I could do a lot here. Either you're miserably uninformed or you're just playing some sportsteam LARP.
>>41103545
>constructed by Christ himself from waddle and dob during the lost years
Not necessarily "Jesus", no. Maybe his progeny. You know who Eber Scot and Nel are, right? Goidal Glas?
>Neither claim has any real evidence other than how much either stimulates someone's fantasies.
They did make it pretty easy to hide when they burned all the books (they being the Romans), yeah.

>>41103503
Dionysus was a mad god more like Odin than a peaceful one. What are you talking about? Bacchanalia was banned in Rome because of the trash that happened there.

https://archive.org/details/396241694-kris-kershaw-the-one-eyed-god-odin-and-the-indo-germanic_202111

>>41103599
Boy, what a fun link that I won't be clicking. I'm sure it's super rad.
>Dionysus was a mad god more like Odin
So you mean to say "Frenzy", which is the literal translation of Wodanaz.
>What are you talking about?
I'm elucidating the gaps you have, I'm drawing more parallels so that other people can jump in the pool and play along with us and I'm enjoying making my mix-match game look like yours (sort of) - a way to compare notes I guess.
>the trash that happened there
Interesting. It's weird how your claims seem to contradict mine, but I can say a lot more about it without relying on any links. You, on the other hand, can only throw a measly three sentences at me from memory, relying entirely thereafter on words someone else wrote.
How novel.

>>41103532
>By all means, elaborate on other examples of "Salvific Mystery Cults". That's not a popular term in Comparative Mythology or the Occult world necessarily, as far as I'm informed.
Its not intended as a piece of terminology, just a description of the general trend. Bronze age views of the afterlife were pretty bleak, based on what we can reconstruct, and people didnt find that very satisfying. During the iron age in to the classical period mystery religions with a focus on some sort of better afterlife or resurrection after death became commonplace around the eastern Mediterranean. The eleusinian and dionysian mysteries are referenced in several classical works and while the injunction against profaning their secrecy seems to have been pretty well kept. The quest of a god or hero to the underworld, a figure that dies and rises, occult initiations. Eluesinian mysteries and demter/persephone, Dionysian and orphic mysteries and the death resurrection of zagreus, there is some evidence of an Isis mystery religion although that in my opinion is probably not an ancient but a ptolemaic syncretism of the isis/osiris myth (there's even a story about isis burning the mortality out of a child while disguised as a nursemaid while osiris is in the undreworld which is an exact retread of the homeric hymn to demeter). The mystery religion of Cybele featured rites dedicated to the death and resurrection of Attis, and mithraism, too, off the top of my head, and given that they are mystery religions there's probably loads that didnt come down to us.
There was just a sort of general trend toward initiatory mysteries that focused on a descent to and re-emergence from the underworld and offered some sort of hope for a better afterlife than the ancient view of a shit hole where your shade ate dust for eternity.
Christianity differed by being proselytising and exclusive, while anyone could be initiated at eleusis and still worship Zeus or whatever.

>>41105828
This is probably why Jesus was held to have descended in to hell while dead, because the Hellenes that made up many of early Christianity's converts sort or expected that as part of the process. Ritual homophagia may have been inherited directly from dionysian mysteries or maybe they both drew from common sources, but it's certainly an important part of Christian rite. In many ways Christianity was a mystery religion that came out of the closet, but it was part of a long tradition of Eastern Mediterranean religions focused on salvation.

>>41105828
Interesting info on mystery schools/religions

Any sources you’d recommend reading on these

You can do the same things that Jesus Christ and Buddha did they simply awakened the full potential of their mind with the mind you can fly and teleport but not everyone can access that level of consciousness

>>41106565
You can't do any of that with the Saturnine constraint on the world.

>>41106497
I don't know any good modern books about them to be honest, I got a couple good lectures on them once and I read a bit of classical literature. The fact that basically every Athenian was in a secretive cult that we know very little about is vexing.
The greeks seemed to think that religion was not for writing down, so basically any scholarship is based on looking at the oblique references initiates were willing to make in public contexts. The closest thing we have to accepted mystery religion scripture in the greek context is the homeric hymn to demeter, which I guess was written down for its poetic value and attribution to homer. It's a telling of the rape of persephone but is full of details (the bearing of two torches, the drinking of kykeon, the relling of dirty jokes, the attempt to save a mortal child by removing his mortal half) that are likely (according to me) etiologies of actual occult rituals. Read Aristophanes' The Frogs, it has a song by a chorus of eleusinian initiates, who are in the underworld but pretty happy to be there (torches and dirty jokes included), contrast that with the afterlife of the uninitiated as presented in The Odyssey or Sheol of early hebrew writings or the afterlife in that one story about enkidu seeing the underworld.
The bacchic women in the chorus of the Bacchae by Euripides talk obliquely about posthumous salvation as well, torches too also you should read the bacchae its good. Aeschylus was put on trial for profaning the mysteries and some scholars think it was because the themes of Prometheus Bound tread to close to talking about fight club but I'm not sure about that. There are loads of references. Pindar does it, I'm convinced Plato's the Myth of Er is acknowledging the moral value to society of a religion that offers more than the bronze age underworld and was informed by mystery religions.
I think Mithraism and Cybelic mysteries are better documented but I'm better informed on greek than roman religion.

>>41106739
The exception to all this is orphism. The orphics actually wrote a lot of shit down. Euripides even has Theseus make fun of them for it in Hippolytus. From memory there's not a single view of it but orphics reworked the dionysus myth. In the orphic version, zeus transformed in to a snake and rapes persephone, she gives birth to Dionysus zagreus who seems to be some reappropriation of a more ancient version of Dionysus as a god of fertility and agriculture. Baby zagreus is eaten by titans and zeus blasts the titans to bits with his lightning, from the fused remains of tainted titanic matter and zagreus's divine soul emerge human beings. The orphics believed in reincarnation, a thrice born dying and resurrected Dionysus (zeus eats zaggy's heart before impregnating semele and re-impregnstes him in her instead) and the value of bodily and spiritual purity. The spark of divinity left by the gruesome death of the son of god makes human salvation possible if you walk the right path.

>>41100511

You must be mentally deficient. You think the lowest common denominator are the ones walking the narrow path?

>>41106787
There are a few adjacent things that I wouldn't call mystery religions going on at the time as well.
Pythagoreanism also believed in reincarnation and the need for spiritual and material purity, but frankly there were more like the modern notion of a cult as a specific community than something like the mysteries are Eleusis.
Egyptian religion was probably the very earliest source for the notion of posthumous reward and punishment being universal. Keeping mind that the ancient greeks only had like 53 people being eternally punished in total and basically the only way to get in to the Elysian fields was to marry in to Olympus. Even Achilles says the afterlife fucking sucks and it would be better to be a slave working the plough than to be the most honoured dead man. But I don't count Egyptian beliefs (the passage through Duat, the negative confessions and trial, the eternal reward of the field of reeds or the punishment of consumption by maat) as a mystery religion because it wasn't a mystery, it was just religion. That's why i figure that Isis mysteries were a later greco-egyptian development. There probably wasn't a need for cults.
Lastly there's hebrew salvation. Bronze age Israelite afterlife wasn't any different from the homeric one, but various sects didn't love that. There's a body of literature (usually called Merkabah or Hekalot literature) that details the descent of the soul of the mystic (yes descent) through the palaces of yahweh and the beholding of the chariot throne. Some of that corpus (i think) discusses the mystic joining with the angelic host, becoming an angel (after Enoch) or becoming like one. Hekalot practices may have influenced Paul, who seems to talk about having one of these experiences in 2nd corinthians. A trend toward Jewish sects imagining a happier afterlife was probably also influenced by exposure to Zoroastrianism, which held a view of posthumous judgement and reward.

Basically the Mediterranean was primed for a saviour.