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Let me open this thread with first and foremost highlighting the chain of posts of the user "The Cusp" from his ancient thread in DreamViews called "The Nature of Dream Control", that's now available on the extra resources section. Absolutely essential oneirosophist reading. You will find the same conclusion about reality in which /one/ is founded upon.

Gem

Ok, where are the people that have grips with John stuff, now we can discuss it along with Neville and see what's happening.

I will use the waiting method you mentioned to manifest a redbull drink, cheers!

>>41111635
Waiting method? Do you mean the alarm one?

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Dumping this awesome thread. Any thoughts on Castaneda stuff?

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>>41111583
I've only ever had one dream I remember from my life.

I was a German soldier in winter 1944, and I kicked open a door and bombs were going off and blood and snow and tears were flying all around me and the voice in my head said if you don't stop running forward you won't die. And I didn't, explosions were all around, blood tears, and snow, and I kept running and shooting. That was in 2009. Do with this information what you will.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rg__zq_HZ1g&t=3s

>>41111680
Interesting. Also, just to mention something related, does anyone remember that guy that lived an entire lifetime inside a dream and woke up from a coma?

>>41111639
Yes B.T.W I will start reading the U.L tomorrow

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>>41111715
Nice. Tell us if you have any doubt or observations.

>>41111719
I must be open minded, that's it, thank you

>>41111612
How do I get instant returns? I tried doing a command session and when I opened my eyes what I wanted to be there materialized in front of me wasn't there. From the parts of UL I've read this is because your conclusion is your command, yet I don't remember subtly concluding during the session this would take longer than instant. From my probably bad interpretation of the texts merely comprehending and identifying with the attributes is supposed to bring it, yet it didn't? I've tried multiple times, UL has worked for non-instant returns but every system I've found haven't yet shown me a step-by-step solution to the materialization/supernatural block.

>>41111714
Cool, thanks for your feedback sir :D

B.T.W, can i skip the email questions/answers or save them until i am done with the core material?
i rather jump into John's actual work

there does not seem to be an index here to know where can i start reading the actual material of John, any number's page i can start with?

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>>41111730
>How do I get instant returns?
The problem with this question (for me, and anyone else really) is that it could have happened for an infinite amount of reasons. So anyone telling you why or not something happened or didn't, could be, most of the time wrong. My approach to UL is that no matter what happens or not, I'm free of evaluation of any notion failure or success, so i don't mind. Remember that the point of the material is grounding you in mechanical facts, and acknowledging reality as a dream, so you advance pedaling perception-experience and let the result lead the way.

In short, keep going. You are already "that", so at some point in your future sessions, you will find out why something didn't happen or happened. Like a "revelation".

>>41111737
It's optional, but i absolutely recommend it. It has very common doubts about UL answered by John itself.

>>41111756
The OP is already tight, but here's the index that the girfag shared in some past thread; Universal Line recommended reading guide (Using as index the complete works PDF along with the ATWA epub). From first to last:
- ATWA 2000 (Avaliable as separated EPUB)
- ATWA 2000 Text & Stories (Pg. 624)
- ATWA Story 37 (Pg. 170)
- DBS Protocol (Pg. 85)
- Shared Emails (Pg. 165)
- GoCotU (Pg. 125)
- IAT Painter's Guide (Pg. 172)
- IAT (Pg. 179)
- Advanced Portrait Painting (Pg. 281)
- Advanced Financial Gain (Pg. 317)
- A Deeper Look At Your First Two Essentials (Pg. 394)
- Q&A #1-3 (Pg. 420)
- Q&A 1 Updated (Pg. 1)
- YLOVEALK (Pg. 527)
- OAP Series (Pg. 576)
- ILKRH (Pg. 664)
- ITOCSMRH (Pg. 723)
- Misc #1 (Pg. 414)
- Misc #2 (Pg. 468)
- Misc #3 (Pg. 622)
- Misc #4 (Pg. 652)
- Misc Images (Pg. 786)

>>41111764
OK, i will start from page one, thank you

>>41111770
Before reading the Q&A, read Advanced Portrait and Advanced Financial Gain, as well two essentials. The Q&A is an answer to those.

>>41111769
okay, i will surely check out the whole thing without an exception, following that guide, albeit i have a PDF version

>>41111583
So can I use this to become a hot girl

>>41111774
Thank you again
will do

>>41111779
The complete works is the only complete compedium we have of the papers. It's unorganized, maybe it was made in a rush, so i hope the index clear things up a bit. ATWA was the earliest one we have of him, and it was released in epub format for a better compression.

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>>41111788
You can, but if you get serious about it, please, tell us how it goes. Also
>pic related

>>41111792
Good, Good

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>>41111677
His community is certainly interesting...

>>41111800
>>pic related
Based but if you were a hot futa why would you stay here

>>41111827
If you could do anything, period, why would you stay in a place that you don't like? Most of the time, is that some people just don't know better, but that's just a hollow guess.

>>41111835
Yeah exactly. If I woke up as a big tiddy futa no way in hell would I come back to this reality to blogpost about it instead

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Relevant pic.

>>41111840
Dreams are flexible. You wake up, you return to the "baseline" or your accustomed instance of the world. In theory, if you could have a persistent dream any time you want, you could go back here and report back your experiences. This is the foundation of lucid dreaming as a practice after all.

Check this out about "persistent dreams": http://www.dreamviews.com/blogs/hyu/persistent-realms-other-lucid-dreaming-techniques-i-use-39218/

What this anon could have done, is create a dream world where he engage with his sense at full, and could go back whenever he want just like that. But if you decided to stay there, would you return? And if you did, would be the same instance from where you departed?

>>41111858
I've had lucid dreams as a futa. If I permanently had a futa body I'm not going back to my current one

>>41111800
>You can, but if you get serious about it, please, tell us how it goes.
But thanks anon. I was shitposting but I DO want to be a big titty futa with a huge futa cock, so I'll be serious lmao

>>41111899
Remember that any person could do anything for any reason. Only what you do and your reasons count. It's the only thing you can live after all.

Got the ATWA EPUB, as well as the complete works in PDF already
I feel like i am about to reach God mode, bros, but first i have to grind the texts

>>41111991
It will be fun, this is how ancient wizards did it, its like studying some ancient alchemical text lol

>>41111998
Must remain optimistic and confident about my ability to get through the text

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>>41112003
In the context of manifestation and magic, i think this brings a new perspective in asceticism. Is there ANYTHING more worth pursuing than magic? Especially when this world is your playground? I'm in agreement with John, Carlos and George about the fact that magic is simply who we truly are. Even as kids, we have the vague, intrinsic notion of that idea.

>>41112029
I mean, we all talk about life being suffering and various problems, but what if there is a way to make life fun and comfy and beyond?

>>41112043
forgive the grammar issues, am sleepy

>>41112043
The original Oneirosophers realized that staying in suffering was a human choice. Nothing to be ruthless with the fellows out of the loop, but it's simply what it seems to be the case. Its really hard for a person attached to a dogma to recognize that we're all free will agents on a journey, even if we pretend we are not.

>>41112057
Original Oneirosophers ?
Who?
i thought it was a recent trend in reality creation

>>41111756
I recommend starting with Advanced Portrait Painting, Advanced Financial Gain, and First Two Essentials. Before that, John didn't used the Universal Line metaphor, and it were early stages with a more holistic approach, while past these texts and before Universal Cosmic Master, John started to use the vedic lingo. So these three papers i mentioned are the middle ground, and give you the most essential idea on what UL is truly about at the core. At least that's what i think.

>>41112068
Check the OP

>>41112079
>holistic
I mean secular.

>>41112079
lol not sure if i should start with that or this approach
>>41111769
but given you are the anon who put time and effort into creating and running this general, i am going to follow your suggestion out of whim

>>41111938
>Remember that any person could do anything for any reason.
Well, being a "big titty futa elf girl with a 20 inch futa dick" seems like a decent choice to me
Where do I start

>>41112104
The OP seems like a good starting point :)

>>41112088
you mean Carlos Castaneda?
I had the impression you were talking about some mystics from the ancient times, sorry for the mis understanding

>>41112113
T-the *cough* the Op... anon, read the entire thing please aaa! *dies*

>Original Forum
https://old.reddit.com/r/Oneirosophy/

>>41112088
also yes i have seen that subreddit before, we already talked about it and how/why it got closed alongst of the dimensional jumping sub

>>41112117
yes, yes, don't worry, but when you said "the original" i had the impression of something older in time, sorry again, but yes i have lurked that subreddit since i have seen it linked by you in a former LOA bake

>>41112109
Well, there's a lot there. I mean in terms of exercises I can do tonight

>>41112118
Well, the idea of Oneirosophy comes from there, so when i say original oneirosophers, i refer to them, including TriumphantGeorge. This general is not about them, of course, if not about furthering this branch of magic that they proposed. Remember that this is for archiving things using your own faculties at the fullest extent, and uncovering reality as it truly is: Your dream unfolding.

>>41112137
I just like the sound of this because it seems simple and closer to the intuitive idea we have about magick/manifestation, instead of:

>nooooooooo, you gotta mental diet
>noooooooooooooo, you gotta detach
>nooooooooooooooooo, how dare you say you are tired of waiting for many months of 0 improvement
>nooooooooooooo, how dare you check the 3D

I love Neville but we have to admit his system has too many rules and regulations

>>41112155
after many months*

>>41112155
>>41112137
seriously if you are God as Neville says then why does it have to be this complicated?
i never feel like a God practicing the law

>>41112155
As a personal opinion, i personally reject every single thing that is new thought or occultism (like magick in general), they are different faces of the same coin to me. In the case of magick, it's just a bunch of woo woo spooky bullshit that's seems more for halloween decoration than any pragmatic application, but it's the less worse of the two, at least is obvious that the return doesn't come from there. New Thought it's more detrimetral because it condition the individual to regulate in arbitrary fashion his already functional pattern recognition and to dimiss his own intellect. Hell, that's why this exists:

https://www.reddit.com/r/NevilleGoddardCritics/

Anyway. Im going to use an analogy: Oneirosophy is a videogame, the game starts, and the premise is this one:
>This world is your own dream.
That's the fundamental fact you have to act upon for the rest of your existence, with all that implies. After that, it's pretty second nature to sort the useful information from the junk.

>>41112175
Almost a decade for the Neville general to figure this out, and it was impossible to make a wake up call. Sad! The worse part is that taking reality as it is could actually make his stuff to function. Just replace "Assumptions" with intent and decisions. Which one sounds better?
>Just assume
Or
>Just decide
It's your dream. You don't have to assume. You just have to know the facts, and decide for yourself.

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A God by defination knows no limits, if he wills something, he gets it in no time, he would not need some arbitrary limits and rules

>>41112155
George basically extracted everything useful from Neville and made a synthesis that explained the basics in a more technical way. If nobody has read Neville before knowing about George, i don't see the utility of doing so now imo.

>>41112155
I also forgot:
>NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, you have limiting beliefs deeply engraved in your subconsious that prevent you from manifesting

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>>41112175
>>41112203
We, as dreamers, are beyond "God". God could be many, there exist various types of Gods. The "ultimate reference field" is one. You are your world, and beyond it.

>>41112193
again, i love neville, but how the hell do they expect me to feel like i am the operant power in my reality with all these rules and regulations

>>41112212
>So, erm, how do i troubleshoot?
>Not my problem bro just assume lmao

>>41112224
Amazing

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Posting in the greatest thread on 4chan right now.
You guys may not realize it, but we are making history here.

>>41112232
it's just silly man, for the people who want to convince you that you have divine-like powers

>>41112248
and it has not even started yet

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>>41112193
Btw, making remarks here: I said MAGICK, with "K" at the end, not magic. Magic is what this general is for, like the one from the disney sorcerer's apprentice film. You dancing among the stars and rejoicing with your unfolding dream imagination, unapologetically, unbounded. The true spirit of reality.

>>41112271
cute

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>>41112029
>In the context of manifestation and magic
Not to argue about semantics, but they are one and the same. Keep that in mind.

>>41112271

Amen brudda. I practice Magic im a fucking wizard. Magick is for narcissistic fat losers with painted nails that hang out with trannies

>>41112372
This. Wicca is cringe.

>>41112372
Crowley basically added the "K" to it, as far as my limited knowledge

>>41112386
I never get nothing about "western magick" in the first place. It's so dumb
>Yes, indeed, we can summon all these ancients spirits that wagged battles along my ancestors and gave us the promethean flame and the enochian astrological knowledge. We will bend le reality to our le will...
>WHAT?! ASKING FOR FIVE DOLLARS?! Nuh-huh, can't do!

We are going to be doing a lot of retrospective in shit like that from now on lmao

>>41112419
had no idea they were like that, keeeek

>>41112419
BTW, can you tell me about your journey with manifestation and magic and how you arrived to John's stuff? i would love a detailed story

wow I was so into this like 6-7 years ago. watched that jim carry documentary about him identity switching to andy and other characters on acid and legit believed in this stuff for 6+ months.

>>41112155
>>41112212
you have forgotten:
"Your desire/affirmation/assumption did not feel natural to you man"

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>>41112436
It's really simple. I was just a malcontent lone wolf kind of guy that had this vague sense that "everything was connected" and that "something was up". Suddenly, one day, as if i was just guided by some strange presence, i stumbled with the LoA general. I read neville stuff, and it FUCKED ME UP COMPLETELY, but, at the time, it was exactly at the moment that ULAnon and SMAnon arrived to make contributions about reality, which leads me to John, and then, to the legacy of Oneirosophy.

Some people say that UL stuff fucked them up, but for me it was COMPLETELY THE OPPOSITE. It was thanks to George and John that i got my shit together. That's how i concluded and decided that the path i wanted to partake in my life as long as i exists had to be the one of the Oneirosopher. Its also so much fun! To see the life like one of careless youth and know beforehand that there's so much to look forward to, "expansions opportunities" as John would say. And also, the idea of "being all alone" and this world being my playground were just the icing on the cake for someone who doesn't want to be part of society, and always liked being a lone wolf. Now i know that i can be the best AT THAT.

LoA never made sense to me because...
(1/?)

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>>41112490
Because New Thought is like acting like retarded women! I'm a man, i love artistic depictions of violence in media, i love bitches and titties, i love cash, i love being racist and fun banter, i love inserting myself as the hero, i love acting aggressive and assertive in a Travis Touchdown or James Bond fashion, i just love having fun according to my own nature. Feeling?! ""Positivity""?! PRAYER?! Fuck that hippie trash, fuck this noise. Being a docile sheep is for some, but not for me.

I was, perfectly fine acting like myself, so why would i change that? Behavioral remedies are for the cattle that has no identity of his own. They don't care about self preservation because they don't have nothing to preserve themselves. I don't give a fuck about that. Living by your own rules, doesn't that sound appealing? Whatever happens, or not, i have no regrets whatsoever. This material, this path, this general, and this inner realization, is my reward for being true and loyal to myself, let the world burn to ashes! I'm BEYOND that.

Truth feels so good.
(2/2)

>>41112525
>>41112490
Awesome but what do you mean by: "Some people say that UL stuff fucked them up"?

Do you mean like they could not handle the power?

>>41112537
They can't handle the facts. Why do you think people over at the Neville general reject John findings EVEN if his stuff just simply works at long term? Why do you think there's so much misery in the iron age? As the logic follows, everyone reap what they sow. Look around you for instance, what do you see in the catalog? Most of the trash in that ocean of mud is mostly endless scaremongering and wilful ignorance. "Yeah dude, i believe in god BUT I WILL NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER GIVE MAGIC A TRY I SWEAR", it's stupid.

I remember showing Paolucci stuff to someone i personally meet, and he just read the ULAnon cheat image that get shared sometimes in the Neville general; and he just lost it! He was having a breakdown and started to give me some schizo babble like if something just broke inside of him or whatever, i had to calm him down and just suggest that he forget about it. That's how it is, you can't drag people to this, this is self discovering and personal transformation, they have to find out on their own.

Some people won't agree with me with this one, but that's alright, but my suggestion is to tag along with people that are already in the know, that are already "part of the game". You won't discuss a videogame with someone that is not playing it, right? Is more constructive to your path stick with other Oneirosophers, so you don't have to spoonfed forever.

>"Where do you get this stuff?"
>Direct them to this general, do it yourself

As simple as that...

>>41112581
Awesome, Thank you

>>41112581
but yes, many people are born as cattle by nature as Aristotle says, especially in spirituality related circles

>>41112608
No problem. Remember that i'm just an anon, and i have no intentions of being a tripfag, despite how strong and obvious my way of writing is. Keep your eyes on the prize, and your feet on solid ground. Good night, and sweet dreams

>>41112626
G.N, i will start reading A.P.P.T.U.L tomorrow

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>Thread theme
https://youtu.be/6D8P6RDKbos?list=RD6D8P6RDKbos

I have been practicing or trying to practice various forms of the LOA for 5 years now. I've read all of Goddards work, Ernest Jones, and Joseph Murphy. I couldn't get any of it to work consistently. Almost two years ago I decided to abandon it all as I felt I was just deluding myself. Anyway, yesterday I came across SMAnon, read the pdf, and I attempted the hand raising thing. It was right before bed and I spent about 10 minutes. Nothing happened during the session. However, I slept fucking horribly, feeling disoriented and stressed all night long. I didn't dream of anything particularly interesting. It's 2:30 in the morning and I cannot sleep. I'm curious if anybody else had a reaction like this one? I should note that I'm very skeptical of all of this, and the only reason I gave this new (to me) method a chance was because SMAnon said that belief didn't matter. When I used to "practice" LOA as Neville and others described I always felt very stressed out by intrusive thoughts. Sorry if I'm not completely coherent. Tired, and don't feel well. Sorry if this isn't the correct general - came here from the /loa/ one. Just looking for some help/insight.

I feel like synchronicity at least can be fully explained by what we know about the reticular activating system.

Good morning, have a fine day ahead all of you

So, i found about some fun stuff:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mage:_The_Ascension

>Reality is not fixed, but rather a set of agreed upon assumptions enforced by the collective will of humanity, the Sleepers. Mages are those people who recognize that reality is not static, and realize that through the application of their will, usually channeled through rituals or other similar "mystical" or "scientific" practices, reality can be changed
Mages are these individuals with the power to warp reality, who know the power they possess and use it to the best of their ability.

The problem is, of course, that everyone has that ability. And there are seven billion people in the world.

You can change reality to suit your whims. So can they. You want to fly. They don't believe you can.

This conflict in belief between you and everyone else is called Paradox, and the consensus (the unconscious beliefs of the rest of mankind) metes out punishment through Paradox.

Paradox can cause your magic to go haywire, cause physical damage to you and the area around you, or even manifest as a sentient entity, intent on making you pay for breaking the Laws of the Consensus.

Of course I am not saying this is exactly what John is implying or saying, just noticed the wacky contrast