I don't get the Christian line of thinking, many think eternal torture is good. I'm like....what? Can you all explain why you think this with out quoting scripture in a way that makes sense? God is a big boy, if you sin against him he can shrug it off with out throwing you in a volcanoe. The creator isn't so petty they need to eternally torture anyone who sins against them. Even if they're perfect and don't deserve people to sin against them (They dont deserve it) they created life knowing people would sin ahead of time, if you Create or do any action get ready to deal with the consequences of your actions. The creator obviously knew we'd sin against him eventually and obviously is a big boy.I believe the Creator created us to share the joy of eternal life with other beings because they're that good. Existing is great.It's as if you all are a different species or mentally retarded (as in, literlaly disabled mentally in terms of figuring out right and wrong) or insane.I believe the Creator eternally tortures no one and gives Eternal Life to all with temporary rehabilitative punishments because I think highly of the Creator and think they at least do the bare minimum to not be the devil.I could not love a creator who was going to even eternally torture satan. The Creator could just eternally mercifully imprison Satan after a fair punishment and test people them selves and pretend to be Satan to test evil people.There's no need to eternally burn anyone when the Creator is all powerful. The Creator would have to WANT to eternally torture to do it because they had evil in their soul. A good Creator would never want to eternally torture, especially when they're so intelligent and good they can rehabiltate anyone, even Satan. The Creator knows how to rehabiltate. I believe they will.
>I think highly of the CreatorThen you must not have much experience with Creation.
>>41854911>I don't get the Christian line of thinking, many think eternal torture is goodno they don't, they just obey God. personally i think its horrific. God is the one who thinks eternal torture is suitable punishment, i dont make the rules as a puny created creature, i just listen to himnothing you say and no argument you make is ever going to convince to rebel against God in the face of eternal torture. i get on him program, end of story. no questions asked
>>41855052you can worry about hell and other things about Gods nature, after you're safe and secure in eternity
Da mystery of chessboxing
yknow also, you shouldnt care OP. God is the micro manager of existence, not you. leave all the hard thinking about whats fair and whats not up to God. its a huge burden and drag trying to figure out all that yourself. dunno about you but im tired of it. i'd rather just let God figure stuff out without poking my nose into everything and hurting my brain, and chill doing other stuffGod is akin sort of to a benevolent dictator, you have a limited amount of time to choose whatever you want, but the warnings are there. God letting you choose in the first place is already an act of love. after that though its gg
>>41855112hmm this is a good train thought. following this, who has the endless "willpower" of God, other than God, to care about every crime and to right every wrong? to micro manage every little thing? freaking nobody does. that's why he's the original "will" that willed things into existence
>>41854911i dont think eternal torture is good. in fact i dont understand it at all. but ive experience proof that Jesus is real and He spoke of hell more than heaven in whats been recorded. so i have to believe it. ive also seen many convincing hell testimonies. however much i wish it wasnt real i have alot of reason to believe it is.
>>41854911>How is eternal torture good?They're spiteful little fuckers who like to see others suffer.
Proof that the Bible is the word of God:https://truthischrist.com/seven/fcbaptist.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/Bible-proof.pdf1 Cor. 15:3-4: “For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:” www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VRT2FFXntc1 John 5:7: “For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.”Rom. 3:23: “For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;”Jesus Christ is God who has come in the flesh from heaven. He died as a sinless sacrifice for the sins of the whole world to save you from eternal hell, the punishment for your sins. He was buried, then resurrected and ascended to heaven, and will return soon to judge the world. You can't be justified to God your own way, so will you choose His righteousness instead? (Rom. 10:3)Salvation is by grace through faith (Eph. 2:8-9) in the one, final, effectual sacrifice of the Lord Jesus Christ (Heb. 10:8-12) dying in your place as a substitutionary offering for sin (Rom. 5:1-10). His blood atonement made for you is finished, so if you have received the Lord Jesus by faith (John 1:12) in your heart, you're forgiven of all your sins and are saved, once for all; finally and forever! The gift of salvation can't be earned, it is a gift. Rom. 10:9: “That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.” Confess The Lord and Savior Jesus Christ in prayer, that you trust in Him, not your own deeds, He atoned for your sins on the cross.Eph. 2:8-9: “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.” After you're saved, you are a child of God and nothing will separate you from His love. (Romans 8:38-39)
>>41854911What do you mean by "rehabilitative punishments"? Look at the state of the world. It's so evil. Does that make people change their mind and turn to God? No. Why do you assume that that after punishment people will go "ok im not going to choose to be evil anymore". Here are broken homes, broken hearts, broken lives, broken bones, broken nations, death, poverty, disease, starvation, killing, shelling, and bombing, as usual, with no letup whatsoever. You say, "The trouble is that we need to get together, and we are working on it, but you 'prophets of gloom' have lost your faith in mankind, and you oppose our work so that...." Are you dead sure the cause of the trouble is not that you have lost your faith in the word of God and, upon rejecting His truth, have believed a lie in order that you might be damned (2 Thess. 2:10-12)?Unwilling to accept the revelation given by God, which deals with operations and methods in the moral realm (which lead to results in the physical realm), men have abandoned all hope of an absolute moral authority in line with the Bible. Their only hope now is to turn to an authority that denies or perverts the Bible and get their standards from this authority. Desiring this, according to His word (2 Thess. 2), God is about to grant them their desire (Jer. 21:14). A god who is all love is a perverted god. Love without hate is not real love. If you love cleanliness, you will hate dirt. If you love your wife and kids, you will hate anything that tries to harm them.The important thing to remember about God is His holiness. The love of God is rooted in God's holiness. All of God's love, in this age, is vested in the righteous life and sacrifice of Jesus Christ. Apart from Christ, God loves no man (John 3:16; Rom. 5:8); apart from Christ, the sinner abides in God's wrath (John 3:36: “He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.”).
>There's no need to eternally burn anyone when the Creator is all powerful.Just because He is all powerful, doesn't mean that He can't limit His power to give you free will.It's either people have free will to choose or reject God. If that isn't true, then they don't have free will.If God forces everyone to accept what He wants trough punishment, then that's not free will. IF you want to reject God, why would God be good if He brainwashes you to stop having free will and force you to be with Him? Wither that be trough punishment or some other method. No, God gives people what they want. If they want to reject God, God lets them reject His love. If they want to accept Him, God lets that happen.If God will allow a power to control things when this power is evil and malicious, then why would the passage in 2 Thessalonians 2:10-12 cause any wonderment at all? The passage merely states that God gives what a man demands and asks for. If he wants a lie, he gets it.If he will not take light (John 11:10), then light becomes lightning (Matt. 24:27). If he will not accept the truth of God, then he is exposed to a power that God has permitted to exist for the purpose of putting across a lie (John 8:44). The unregenerate seeker of truth cries, "Give me the truth." God says, "This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him" (Matt. 17:5). The "seeker" shouts, "Yeah, but what about all these other religions? Do you mean to tell me that you think that you're the only one that is right, and the rest are wrong?" God says softly, "Yea, let God be true, but EVERY MAN a liar" (Rom. 3:3-4). www.youtube.com/shorts/qzHWrQ2DHhQ (How to Prove the Power of Christ in 60 Seconds)www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCsPy4CY6hIwww.youtube.com/watch?v=cZ919YomJjMwww.youtube.com/watch?v=pcvFX5uIRb4www.youtube.com/watch?v=yS78mFJcvhQ
eternal torture might presuppose the 'eternal' significance of the determinants of causality i.e. in a universe with causal relations that may inpinge on free will or the future itself the actions are permanent and lasting.
>>41856459People keep forgetting that the One they sin against lives forever. In eternity, there is no past, present or future, so how can an unlimited sin be punished with limited punishment in hell? If you commit a sin, it lasts forever unless it is paid for. Why would it be fair that you simply just stop existing and now it's the same as if you never sinned? No. Something that is eternal lasts eternally.
Theres no eternal torture. They invented that lie to frighten you into giving cult leaders $$$>join my cult do these rituals give us $$$ or tortureNo
>>41856366>return soon to judge the world2000+ years of soonBtw did you know *every single christian church* has false prophecied this?https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unfulfilled_Christian_religious_predictionsEvery year the deluded religious people will repeat their collective psychosis. How many failed predictions of the rapture have there been? Christianity exists to frighten slaves into obedience to church authorities and make ridiculous moral demands on followers that their own church leaders also do not follow.
>>41856682Just recently there was a christoid mass psychosis event where some christians, based on some bullshit jewish holiday, believed jesus would return. People sold their cars to wait for jesus to carry them into the sky. Didnt happen. Every fucking year the christian false prophecy the same thing. Every year, they are wrong. For centuries this pattern of stupidity has repeated itself.The christian is himself decieved by a completely fallible text.The christian is himself decieved into believing only his cult will have a good afterlife and would vainly condemn most of the planet to torture. They proclaim to have magical powers like any other magician but cannot demonstrate any of those powers.Never trust a priest or prophet of any abrahamic cult.They vainly threaten not only their own followers w torture due to lack of obedience but also every other cult.
>>41856714The Christian vainly repeats his corrupted text, magically thinking he can threaten the entirety of the planet outside his cult with torture, and his leadership vainly and constantly repeats the same failed and false prophecies, for centuries. The christian believes in various nonsensical claims>sticks turning into snakes>demands to constantly cast out "demons">cursed objects >evil witches and wizards having evil magic powers>a singular entity created entire planet just to condemn most of it to torture over various "trangressions" against laws written by dead jews>this entity is somehow simultaneously omnipotent, omniscient, and omnibenevolent but also tortures people outside of the cult, or maybe not do ritual right, or didnt eat enough magic crackers and magic wine
>>41856745Another common christian religious psychosis is thinking god talks to them, or gives them special knowledge of the future, or that only they will have godlike power and other humans will be their slaves in the afterlife. Its raw schizophrenia. Ofc if you disagree you have a "demon" that they must "cast out", in exchange for a tithe of course...Then they get very seethingly angry when you point out how consistently wrong their religious leaders have been, for centuries.Also they cannot perform the miracles they claim to be able to do.No entity has any right to torture you after you die because you didnt join the right church.Its *constant fearmongering and pronouncements of global doom and destruction* from the false prophets of christianity.Every year>the world gonna end ook ook the world gonna endEvery year>world does not end>oh if you dont agree with our insane failed prophecies its bc r "god" has deluded youAlso Christian cult leaders do *every single sin* that they would condemn others for and their churches cover up child abuse.
My theory is hell isnt eternal and just last for one eternity. Which means begining to end. So one mega culpa and that's it. Science predictions the of the universe in 7 to 11 billion year.
>>41856682the bible says this would happen in 1st century CE lol obviously these verses aren't going to be popular in your churchesyou fell for a scam
>>41856366>sevensHow does this proof that the author is god? Every higher being can forge this. Human AI can forge this too. Good entities, evil entities, entities that want to control people by scaremongering.Could also be cherrypicking some calculations and conditions to fit a numerological narrative. There is no proof, that any of this is statistically significant, and that you cannot do this with any other book series. (How often is "Harry Potter" mentioned, in the HP book series after page 7 or 77 or 777 or chapter 7?)Result: KJB "Word of God"-theory NOT proven.>For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of GodWhy have all people sinned? Is it because god forced them into a sin-suit, that forces them to sin? Forcing someone to do something, that is punished by the enforcer, is the pinnacle of wickedness and evil.>The gift of salvation can't be earnedThis would mean, that there are absolitely zero conditions to be saved. No works, no faith, no repenting. Nothing.However, if you have to do something to get something, then we call this "earning it".If god wants everyone to go to heaven, why did he set up conditions to be forgiven? Why isn't he just forgiving everyone by declaring the sacrifice an absolutely unconditional act of reconciliation?God's top priority seems to be worshipped and to punish people for not doing so.
Because there is no eternal torture. And the allegories and parables were abused by the organized religion to change perception into the very shit Jesus spent the entire Bible fighting. Jesus would have sounded like the ultimate new age mystic if he deemed you capable of understanding to that degree. As far as the Bible goes. Literally only Mary got those teachings. Because literally only Mary could parse the true meaning behind the parables.
>>41861585you're in denial. it's real. reality does not contour or conform to your will, and any kind of explanation such as its the higher self controlling it to teach you a lesson or whatever is cope. you are an ant, and not a god. try to cover that up with abstractions and chaos as much as you want. reality doesn't care
>>41861605one thing even more persistant and overarching than consciousness itself, is the brutalness of reality. in 2026 its just a feminine form of brutalness. you live a "cozy life", but its still brutal AF in different ways. that brutality never misses a beat. count on it always being there. then when you cross over to the other side, dont be surprised when its more brutal than you imagined
>>41854911Not all Christians believe in eternal punishment. Actually many don't. I am a Valentinian Christian and I think eternal torture as a punishment and love are incompatible concepts and Nicean Christians are absolutely delusional to think the entity who feeds us that nonsense is an omnibenevolent God. The god Nicean Christians obey is the entity who tempted Jesus in the desert. The god of "this world", the god of matter and the god of suffering. That god merely cosplays as the one God. Maybe he even beleives himself that it's him...he is a bit of a fool. And his name is YHWH. (Pic related)
>>41861360>There is no proof, that any of this is statistically significant,The difference between the Bible and other "holy" books (or Harry potter) is that the Bible is a collection of eyewitness accounts of God's dealings with man. The Bible is a history book, verified by those who saw the events unfold. The Koran is not that way. It is an illiterate, epileptic egomaniac in a cave listening to an unclean spirit describe supposedly historic events from over 4,000 years before Mohammed was born. On top of that, there is not one shred of evidence that anything the Koran describes in history is true, unless it was stolen from the Bible. Every time an unsaved historian casts doubt on the Bible, an unsaved archaeologist digs up the evidence that shows the Bible was telling the truth all of the time. Go ahead, show me another book that is even 1% as incredible as the Bible, you cannot. Once you read the Book, you realize that it is God showing man what He wants them to know.>Is it because god forced them into a sin-suit, that forces them to sin?You either have God’s righteousness and go to Heaven when you die, or, you have your own righteousness and go to Hell when you die. You don’t go to Hell because you commit adultery or murder, neither stealing, lying or swearing. Moses killed a man and went to Heaven. David committed adultery and went to Heaven. Noah got drunk and went to Heaven. Peter cursed and swore and went to Heaven. A man goes to Hell because he looks God in the face and says ‘I am better than you are!’ If you reject Jesus Christ as your Saviour then you think you are better than the Lord and His way of salvation (Rom 5v6+8).>No works, no faith, no repenting. Nothing.So God should brainwash you to make a decision that you didn't choose to make and force you to be with Him? That goes against the very idea of free will.>why did he set up conditions to be forgiven?So that you have a choice. If you don't want the gift of salvation, you dont get it.
I used to be a Christian.I always knew it was wrong in my heart but was just trying to justify it retroactively. I always knew it was evil.
>>41861796Creating conscious beings in the first place is incompatible with love.The only moral way for a conscious being to exist, is as an Eternal and Separate God.
>>41854911Existing is only great as God.Conscious beings should never be created. Conscious beings only should be eternal gods.And that is the only thing which answers the Vertinguous Question. Any conscious viewpoint must be eternal and separate from any other conscious viewpoints.
>>41863133The Bible is the same nonsense of the Quran. For an example the first 5 books are pure nonsense>All of Humanity is descended from Adam and EveIf this was true we would be exinct before the flood even happened>A Flood covered the entire world for 40 daysWe would have evidence of this, we have none no layer of bones, no mass sediments, NOTHING.>Moses brought 10 plagues down on EgyptThe Egyptians were great record keepers. There is no evidence of a group of slaves ever rebelling in Egyptian art or literature. As well there is no contemporaneous sources detailing the plagues>The Hebrews traveled SinaiWe have no ruins of massive settlements in the barren Sinai Deseret that would have been needed to house these people, as well the rest towns they stopped at do not exist.>The Israelite's were promised CanaanThey we're not promised it, they we're from Canaan. All evidence shows the Israelite's emerged as a sect of Canaanites that believed in a unique religion that took one good from the Semitic Pantheon (YHWH) and made him the creator of the universe during the Babylonian Captivity after King Nebuchadnezzar II was particularity cruel to the Jews.
>>41863133>the Bible is a collection of eyewitness accountsSource: trust me bro>The Bible getting some historical stuff rightHoly cow, all of it must be true, no doubt.Bible: "Tyre shall never be rebuilt" ... ooops>Once you read the Book, you realize that it is God showing man what He wants them to know.Bible:"God: Kill the infants and sucklings of Amalek""Jesus: Hate your brother to be my disciple""If you hate your brother, you are a murderer without eternal life"...>sin-suit>dodging the questionPathetic>brainwashing is against free willDefine brainwashing, without making churches and missionaries look like brainwashers>god wants you to have a choiceThis would also be possible if he let everyone go to heaven and then ask them if they want to stay. God hiding himself is not necessary for having a choice.
>>41854911Ignorance… no one wants to deal with arrogant subhuman consciousness. So it makes the subhuman mind and body suffer. I agree with it.
>>41864771>If this was true we would be exinct before the flood even happenedThe way the world was back then is isn't the same as it is now. Life was longer and more fruitful and not as unstable as it was after the flood>The Egyptians were great record keepersOfficial state inscriptions were designed to showcase victories, prosperity, and the divine nature of the Pharaoh, rather than document national catastrophes, humiliation, or losses>We have no ruins Archeologists always keep finding new things, just because not every single possible thing from thousands if years ago in the Bible isn't found yet isn't evidence against it>All evidence shows sect of CanaanitesAll evidence meaning a theory by some dudes 4000 years after the events mentioned in the Bible? >>41865880>"Tyre shall never be rebuilt"https://www.gotquestions.org/Tyre-rebuilt-prophecy.html>taking the Bible out of context I can give it the meaning I want it to have instead of what it really saysthats how text works>dodging the questionI don't know why humans are forced to make the decision of choosing God or being condemned, but just because the Bible doesn't say the exact reason why God does it that way isn't evidence against it being so>Define brainwashing, without making churches and missionaries look like brainwashersControlling your mind to make you make a decision that you didn't actually make, but were instead forced to>God hiding himself is not necessary for having a choice.It's not just about making a choice, it's about making a choice while being influenced in the way that God wants you to be influenced in this world in order to be able to make that choice in the way God wants you to make that choice. If God was standing in front of you and asking if you want to reject Him, that would be the same as not giving you a choice to believe a lie. Its different compared to Him letting you choose if you want to convince yourself you want to believe a lie instead of the truth.
>>41867542>accusing others of taking the bible out of context, while taking the bible out of context all the time to make the contradictions go awaypatheticIf god was honest, he would reincarnate people like you into a japanese shinto family. To see if you still turn to Jesus, or if you just always follow the local thing.SPOILER ALERT: You would go to the local shinto shrine and make offerings for good luck.And this hypocrisy is why all cult believers are pathetic retards and deserve to be ridiculed whenever possible.
>>41854911>I don't get the Christian line of thinking,They're retarded, simple as.
>>41854911>How is eternal torture good?You haven't met enough evil people because you have had a very sheltered life and uninteresting life or you are one of the evil people without realizing it.
>>41870367Christians don't think it's just evil people being tortured forever, it's everyone who doesn't join their cult.
>>41870367Evil=you don't do what I like
>>41871087I don't like pedophiles, murderers, rapist, thieves, liars, cheats and etc. Got a problem with that sheltered boy?
>>41854911There are a lot of narratives that were hijacked by negative entities. >>41870367Evil people are just future victims of "their own" hunger. They can be fixed, and torture would only give them justifications to chew on.A lot of the people you find evil unironically worship "the god of this world", and he gives them presents in exchange. Ask a fucking grey if it's happy. Its life is misery so bad it leaks out of its eyes and into your soul. Not evil; just lost, in pain, lashing out, enslaved to urges that aren't its own.
>>41871115>They can be fixed,Woman detected
>>41871126No, women call for the death of all men If you want to tell a male poster from a female poster, look for genuine, non-show-boaty empathy, and you've found a man.
>>41871098Sheltered... LmaoNo really, you don't like what the bible says not to like. I've had my house broken into, several times. I'm alive because I'm that bad ass. I have an idea who it is (mafia). Have you lived such things? So much for sheltered, and that's just the tip. Life isn't doable in paladin mode, sorry to burst your Bubble. Even if you worked miracles, you can get posessed and hit with black magick, which will ruin your practice. I know a lot on the topic. And don't give me "God will protect me, because I'm one of the sorcerers that advice Christian larpers on Quora about the shit they pull on them, or rather I used to, I'm lhp now.
>>41871098You like this website, I can sense that, so I know you're lying about all of that.
