>>42068916
God? God had nothing to do with this. That all human beings. As for why, read the book, the tally for the game with "no rules" gets read at the end. How much faith have you in your Father?

>>42068916
If you think God is some old man wizard sitting on a cloud directing things on Earth I have bad news for you.

Neanderthals, stone-age and bronze-age Homosapiens, even more modern tribal humans were raping their daughters, sons were impregnating their moms and sisters in a cave somewhere. Of course much worse through history. For example, compared to Genghis Khan, Epstein was nothing.

>>42068916
If you were told the real truth about Epstein, the REAL why this and why that you wouldn't wanna hear it and wouldn't agree with it anyway so just don't even ask. Take a hint like everyone else and Leave it alone like the rest of the world is doing.

>>42068924
Many religions believe that God is present everywhere and omnipotent. So he is aware of the suffering of the children and could intervene any second, but actively decides not to because?

>>42068955
It simply isn't possible to answer that
However what are our options here: God is evil and malicious, God is good and has some reason to let it happen, God doesn't exist. Which of these actually alleviates the suffering in anyway? Btw none of these are actual arguments for or against God's existence in the first place, at least not very good ones

>>42068970
I'm not arguing against God being real. I am just at a loss to understand what the f*** is going on. My guess would be that God is real but he's no omnipotent.

>>42068974
Then he wouldn't be God.
I think our mind is not meant to comprehend all of the evils of the world in the way that the internet gives us access to. There is a part in the bible where Jesus tells Peter about his (Peters) unpleasant future, and Peter says "what about John?!". Jesus essentially tells Peter not to worry about John and to worry about himself.
I'm not saying you shouldnt care about evils in the world and all that, but it's very hard to discern them in detail to as deeply a level as the evils happening within your own life and community. I mean anyone could just watch true crime shit about kids suffering and fear monger themselves but obviously it isn't mentally healthy.

>>42068916

Lets twist it.

Why did humans let Epstein Island happen? All the big Players knew about it. Politicians. Police Officers. Princes. Queens. Kings. Members of the UN. Rich People. Poor People. Security agencies. etc.

Humanity is a shitstorm. If God had to intervene every time someone did something he would have to intervene every second all over the world at the same time for the rest of human existance and I bet he got better things to do then babysit adults.

And Epstein Island is just small shit compared to what happens at other places. Google Potta parties. And Thats not the end of it. Humans are the most disgusting fucks in the universe.

And consider that God maybe has other planets and Universes to attend to aswell.

Stop electing disgusting leaders. Stop fighting for degenerate kings. Stop raising your daughters as whores. That would be one step in the right direktion and stop blaming God for what You do against each other.

>>42068916
nigga have you read daniel and revelations?

God is distant from this place, our world is a war between satan and the demiurg

>>42068986
Christians say free will is needed for a meaningful relationship with God, but in Heaven you can't rape children and have a relationship with God so being able to do that isn't needed. No?

>>42068985
Why are you blaming people when God could literally solve all of this in a second?

>>42069015

Are You retarded or something?

>>42069049
ARE YOU? You are pointing your fingers at humans who will NEVER be able to change this or prevent this. It always happened and it will continue to happen because it's part of nature. The only entity who could prevent this for good is God.

>>42069049
Most sexual abuse happens from family to their own children, this has nothing to do with who you elect as president or how you raise your daughter, dumb fuck.

>>42068916
I wonder if it comes from a change in how agency is seen.

Were you are ment to have agency , but one could make objective aberations from them , and at that point what must be done is just revert it back , by men of faith ,and god helping them out.

I mean , of all interesting evils in the world , epstien seems to steryotipical , it really should not be something that people in the past did not thought about before.

So I assume the logic is that epstien must be reverted and that is such the will of god.
But the exact philosophical mechanism , I am not sure of.

>>42068955
god doesn't have feefees
also consider that the sole I experience is contrasted with the evil acts of god, that maybe the evil is just the matrix

>>42069056

Your own politicians, Police, kings queens and security agencies are letting this happen.

Gods job is not to babysit You. God has better things to do. Learn to elect proper leadership and stop fighting for degenerate royals.

I bet humans was sent here because they are the biggest fuckups that ever happened and that they got a chance to prove themselfs but failed Ultra hard. I bet God is tierd of You fucks and dont give a shit about You anymore.

>>42069113
This shit happened since the dawn of time in EVERY CULTURE no matter where and how. It's human nature. Humans are selfish and degenerate. Some humans will molest and hurt children, it absolutely does not matter who is president. Cavemen already did this shit.

Yes humans should do their best to elect well and fight evil, but victims will NEVER STOP unless God intervenes. He should be blamed.

>>42069059

Yeah. Humans are the ultimate fuckups. I bet Thats Why you're here. Learn to fucking behave.

>>42069119
>Cavemen already did this shit

How do You know?

And as I said. Humans are the ultimate fuckups. The Only way to end human shit would be to destroyed humans completely and Maybe that cant be done because good humans can still be born.

>>42069131
Because it's part of nature. We already found trauma consistent with violence on skeletons, burial contexts suggesting conflict/abduction and genetic patterns that suggest male-dominated reproduction. So things like violence, rape, etc. You think caveman had an age of consent and were respectful to women? Please.

>>42068916

Define God. What is God to You?

>>42069140

Yeah Maybe he dosent give a fuck about You. Maybe You messed with the wrong guy and ended up here. Who knows. I know whining about your own behaviour wont solve it. Thats the damn sure.

And removing free will is not the option anyone want. So. Learn to fucking behave.

The Abrahamic god obviously does not exist, that's why everything seems so ridiculous. It's not a genuine context.

>>42068924
Free will is bullshit.

>>42068916
How old do you think Mary (from the bible) was when she gave birth to Jesus?

^
Furthermore, what do you think bat mitzvahs and bar mitzvahs mean?

>>42068916

What is God to You? What is the Universe to You? Can You describe him and his powers please.

Do You think God is like superman and that he can fly from one side of the universe to this planet just to stop a rape Victim from geting raped every time it happens? I dont know if God can do that.

Maybe he and his buddies are busy stopping a supernova from killing a bunch of super qute babie bunnies in a galaxy far away when something happens here.

I dont think God is some kind of cosmic Cop that comes running for your rescue every time something happen. But if you mess up completely and makes him angry i can guarantee you that you will be in deep shit when he gets your hands on you.

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>>42068916
>What's your religious or spiritual view and why do you think God was just chilling and watching while children got trafficked on Epstein Island?

Almost everyone in the bible/torah/quran had what most people consider today to be "child brides", since most of those religions/cultures consider you to be an "adult "once you start puberty (around age 12~13).

Women have been trafficked for most of humanity's history. It wasn't until fairly recently when the concept of courtship or "romance" even mattered to most people. Prior to that you either purchased your wife (dowry's, arranged marriages, etc.) from her parents, or you just outright kidnapped her from a village or caravan or something.

Women were legally considered to be property almost everywhere in the world up until like the early-mid 1900's. They couldn't even really own property or bank accounts until like the 60's, and I think things only lasted like that for that long because people thought that God wanted things to be that way, or at the very least had no problem with it.

Pretty much the only person in the abrahamic canon that didn't fuck kids were the women, and Jesus, and we all know what happened to him.

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>>42068955
>but actively decides not to because?
I suppose it could create dependency

>>42070332
We already are dependent on a lot of things, why not on God?

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>>42068916
Because he's probably evil.

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>>42068916
Its not gods fault you cannot control your animal urge to stick dick into everything.
That is literally the only thing that distinguishes us from dogs that hump your leg the first chance they get.
Self control you either got it or you don't

>>42068916
God as in the one does not intervene in worldly matters.
God as in yaldabaoth, the ruler of this realm gets a kick out of fucking with conscious beings.

>>42069107
>doesn't have feefees
>makes humans in his image
shiggy

>>42069113
They aren't mine, faggot, and you're stuck here too.

>>42068916
the epstein issue is designed to wake up normies to the evil around them, so that when (((a savior))) comes, (((he))) will be worshipped.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rpU51S26hrA

>>42068916
you have to understand that god isn't a separate entity.
the one is everything, and everything that exist is a part of it.
as above so below, just like you have dark parts within, so does the one.
you are not consciously aware of all parts of your psyche, and especialy not the dark parts and your power to directly influence and stop them is limited.

anyway, the one isn't good nor bad, it's just is and you are a part of it.
regarding how this world came to be that's another story.

>>42068954
This!

>>42068970
god is nor good nor bad, it just is.
it won't interract in worldly matters.

>>42068916
satan is the prince of the world, God is exposing darkness right now to take the metaphorical blindfold off non believers eyes while confirming Christians beliefs but many will still not heed/hearken and they'll fall into the pit of fire forever unfortunately

>>42068954
>>42070390
stfu shlomo, there is no truth i'd not want to hear.
and i'd take my bet with the epstein story.

>>42068916
The material realm is specifically where souls go to live without God and to be transgressive.
you are here because - like the rich jewish men - you want to be the enjoyer of existence, instead of God.
They just do it more than you.
The point of religion is to realize this is bullshit, and get out of this place.

>>42070393
>confirming Christians beliefs
lmao, you are even more lost than a caveman would be.
it is better not to know than to think you know something wrong.

>>42069015
you have to whole heartly accept God in order to get into heaven. If you had the most minimum desire left to rape or to fornicate in general you would not get into heaven in the first place.

>>42070393
>kids have to experience the trauma of rape even though God could save them with ease because God wants them to be slaughter pigs as an example for darkness
huh..

>>42070398
there are ways to enjoy existence without being in such a fake and gay realm.

>>42070414
Yes, it's called serving God. thats how you get out - you go back to putting God at the center of existence.
There are relatively very very few souls in samsara.
We are the ones that wont learn.

>>42070419
>>42070405
god is not something separate from you.
also stop mixing western and eastern concepts that makes you look retarded.
the only thing needed to get out is to remember your nature, that's it.
the one does not care or want you to "serve" it.

>>42070439
>god is not something separate from you.
Correct, though again you put yourself in the center.
You are not independent of God is more accurate.
>stop mixing western and eastern concepts
I at least didnt.
>the one does not care or want you to "serve" it.
दैवी ह्येषा गुणमयी मम माया दुरत्यया ।
मामेव ये प्रपद्यन्ते मायामेतां तरन्ति ते ॥ १४ ॥

आब्रह्मभुवनाल्लोका: पुनरावर्तिनोऽर्जुन ।
मामुपेत्य तु कौन्तेय पुनर्जन्म न विद्यते ॥ १६ ॥

श्रीभगवानुवाच
मय्यावेश्य मनो ये मां नित्ययुक्ता उपासते ।
श्रद्धया परयोपेतास्ते मे युक्ततमा मता: ॥ २ ॥

Are these purely eastern enough for you?
Do you need a translation?

>>42070465
i did not ask you to give eastern or western shit, just not mixing them up.
and i don't care about any religious bullshit.
you don't need it, all the answers are already within.
god isn't even a being that talks or interacts with worldly matters, it just is.

>>42070481
>just not mixing them up.
And i didnt.
>i don't care about any religious bullshit
Funny, that's God's last instruction in the Gita.
>Abandon all varieties of religion and just surrender unto Me. I shall deliver you from all sinful reactions. Do not fear.
You dont need religion.
You need to serve God.
Religion is there to help most people get to that.
For those that dont, there's samsara.

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>>42070397

>>42070398
>kids get raped so "le soul can play a game"
Yeah this isn't an excuse or explanation that helps the child in that moment.

>>42070489
>Religion is there to help most people get to that.
so basicaly neoplatonism for the masses.

my point is that you don't need anything but your own consciousness, that's it.
and le samsara is fake and gay, yes this realm is a form of prison but we are gods and can get out with not too much difficulty.
also karma is bullshit.

>>42070506
i don't believe in god, i know.
i have first hand experience with the divine and mystical, no need to believe or worship if you know.

>>42070489
>>42070509
also "god" as in the one is not something that can be served or need serving.

>>42069119
Adam and Eve chose independence from God, siding with Satan in governing themselves. Satan and mankind have proved themselves unable to rule, so God waits for people to realise this and declare the message of Jesus Christ his son, and his return to rule over Earth.

>>42068924
About the same as children of satan such as yourself...

>>42070542
Do you know how demented this logic is? That God doesn't help a child being ass-raped by a jew even if the child begs for help because... uhhh some million years ago some dude called Adam and his girlfriend did something I didn't like, so now you will get raped and I'll just watch. Is God a psycho in your view?

>>42070542
Itt: unquestionable lack of pressence
"No dude trust me: gods make religions because it was all a tv contest and you had to compete for prices".
I guarantee you the Christian larpers you see are all in the pocket of a demon or demons themselves.
I know this because:
a) I'm a demon
b) We assaulted heaven
c) killed everyone

>>42068916
Either he isn't real or he doesn't care, everything else is just cope.
>>42068924
If a human can stop children from being raped and killed at no risk to himself and chooses to just watch it instead, would he not be a monster? If you think your god should be held to a different standard then your morality just amounts to Might Makes Right.

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>>42070552
Children are responsible for the mistakes of their father. It seems to be a law of the universe. Jesus sacrifice provides an escape from the sin of our progenitor if we have faith in it. Never again will there be claim risen against God that will be humoured.

>>42070567
Punishing people for actions they did not commit contradicts basic principles of justice.

>>42070567
Christian not outing himself as a sociopath when the Problem of Evil comes up challenge (impossible)

>>42070567
What sin retard?
"No, you see, god is making this tv contest where you compete for a vacation, and we get to preach it in the occult board where no one is an ignorant twat, I'm sure the nigra who killed Jesus personally will convert because that's totally the guy were after"

>>42070567
people like you is why satanism exists.

Long story short:
>Guy killed Jesus
>Satan somehow is convinced he can talk him into turning Christian
>They parrot the filth wherever he goes
>The guy is a god himself so he's legit legit gonna punish himself
Lmoa

>>42069103
Why do you type like a retard? You wrote this much and had time to read over what you typed before posting and still couldn’t punctuate or spell properly.

>>42070369

No im not stuck here bitchboy You are

>>42070587
>>42070590
>>42070592
>>42070596
You don’t need to bang your head against the door. It’s unlocked.

>>42070617
No one is knocking on empty doors.
Jesus got snuffed.
You even talked the issue on 4chan.
Now, you parrot him.
I'm the guy who killed him, personally, so I particularly will not convert.

>>42068916
I find this logic in the trearth wierd.

To some degree , I think is just either multiple people thinking about dumbfounding stuff about what reality has to be and getting autism.
This to a point is understandable , in the 21st century that is all of us.
Or is that anti abrahamic squizo/fed.

But like , like really like.
Isn't this kind of an argument for esptiens? , that he is justified.
I would understand if this argument was said after someone with genuine plans or even someone who did stop esptien.

But saying this argument while we stay around in our fat asses all day , doesn't incriminate all of us, to a degre.
And to a degree , everything we stand for isn't that compromised?
Isn't the only one who could be gods either jefreey esptien himself , or the people who killed them?
But all of them thought child rape is ok.
Then its Ok? I mean they are out new gods now?

I know we aren't as sigma as god is ment to be.
But isn't that just making excuses , the end result is still 0.
We are still a race of 0s , and I just find that wierd.

I know this isn't the intention , but it kind of just sounds like , jefery killed god and replaced him.

You get me?

>>42070624
You don’t express your thoughts in a cohesive way.

>>42070631
I neednt insist nor explain myself.
You're not gonna convince the guy who killed Jesus to accept him.
Period.

>>42070609
Why would I not type like a retard in a place like this.

>>42070635
Tell that to the guy before you.

>>42070567
I need to amend this. The children are not responsible but they do receive the RAMMIFICATIONS of their parents actions. I’m sorry, what I said was wrong.

>>42070644
Not according to el biblio.
Anyway, a group of demons became demon Gods and killed the gods of light.
I was there, I'm also your conversion target.
Since I'm the guy who personally killed Jesus, and received lots of rewards, tangible, from it, I'm not converting.
I can tell you this same thing in other tongues in hopes you're less retarded in different idioms.

>>42070660
Ezekiel 18:20. I really do apologise for what I said. That was stupid. But I can’t read your babbling

>>42070670
I'm also unable to read, fren, when you talk bible, I lose that ability.

>>42070637
That’s a fair point but do you not want what you write to be easily readable or do you just not care? Or are you retarded?

The gods won't interfere needlessly.

I think God is perhaps real and omnipotent but it takes time(ages) to interact or directly influence this reality. Perhaps he created it and in doing so is stuck in a state of constantly/knowing/doing and has to exert himself to maintain gravity and the air moving and the tides and everything else so he can intervene but is unable to at the present time while he powers up and maintains causality

>>42070675
trice of all those things

>>42070679
I mean , evil billioner satanic pedos.

that isn't your average walk in the park.

>>42068916
We (our ancestors) allowed it to happen. They abandoned God for money. They inverted Gods laws. And now it is our responsibility to correct it with our own free will. If we dont correct it, it will be our fault.

>>42070916
Bro... humans always raped and hurt kids, everywhere. God never did anything. Punishing people for actions they did not commit contradicts basic principles of justice. The average child diddler is an uncle or father, not a demonic jewish billionaire. Even in that cases God is just passively watching as it unfolds.

>>42068916
>God gives humans free will
>"WOW THANKS GOD!"
>Humans do horrible things
>"OMG HOW COULD YOU DO THIS GOD?!?!"
Stop blaming God for people's sins.

>>42068982
Only Abrahamics ever argue that. Every person needs to ask themselves what level of power they personally would consider necessary for a being to be a "God" and if such beings deserve reverence or even worship simply because of said power.

>>42071234
If I was God I wouldn't have given people free will and nothing bad would have EVER happened.

>>42071337
No free will would mean that love is impossible. God evidently thought it was worth the cost of making evil possible if it meant making love possible, which is correct.
So you're free to disagree with God, but you're obviously wrong.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandeism

Because the Earth has been ruled by demons since the original sin of Adam and Eve this Earth will always be corrupt until the second coming of Christ when he will clean and reset this Earth with a new and improved humanity with Christ as its ruler

>>42071363
Then he isn't omnipotent then.

>>42071509
>t. mindless retard who just regurgitates things without thinking about them
Omnipotence does not involve the capability to do literally nonsensical/contradictory things, like making a square circle.
Love IS an act of free will, by definition, so saying that God must not be omnipotent if he can't make it possible to love without free will is like saying that God must not be omnipotent if he can't make heat cold. It reveals nothing but your own stupidity.

>>42071587
I have literally seen Christians claim that God could and simultaneously couldn't create a mountain he couldn't lift.

>>42071459
>>42068916
The Jewish god is a demon. All gods have been a problem for people, until they figured out the ways of sating them and picking the right gods who didn’t demand human sacrifice. The Bible and Christianity came and destroyed all that knowledge, and many of the gods have joined the false rebel spirit, Yogwehsatan, in his deception of the masses.

This is why going back to old religion completely is useless, the myths and lore have developed for 2000 years.

The devilgod does not lie, he just twists the truth. This is why the Bible is so addictive and mind capturing. It is the story of the Source, which is a power above the gods, but it is twisted and hijacked by Jewish prophets and witches for their false Armageddon Satanyahweh takeover.

Christianity causes good men to not resist evil, it allows their bloom and rule. It is said in the Bible they WILL ALWAYS be ruled by evil men. This book is a curse, it is their god, the book is the spell, it is their god, and it is a lie. Look how they use it to justify their false war, to control people. After Charlie was killed they pushed it hard, it’s the original “trust the plan” psyop. Much like Jews reject it themselves and act like they hate it until people turn away from it, playing along like it’s their enemy, so do demons and fallen gods play along with the Christ plot, “being delivered” “fleeing from the name”, it is an act. These beings are made to deceive, and they do deceive all.

Many things are happening, we are in a unique time, and must be vigilant.

>>42068916
Allah simply makes it legal with some rules. Just ask one of these countries Afghanistan, Algeria, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Brunei, Egypt, Iran, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Libya, Malaysia, Maldives, Mauritania, Morocco, Oman, Pakistan, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Tunisia, the United Arab Emirates, and Yemen

>>42071363
If that's true then can we sin in Heaven or is Heaven devoid of love?

>>42071698
If I've decided that I'm never going to eat donuts again, it's still possible for me to eat donuts, I've simply chosen not to. Ever again. Heaven is like that, only to a far greater degree.
Of course we will still have free will, but we will have definitively chosen never to sin again, and our souls will have been purged of all attachments to sin.

>>42071621
>some Christians are retarded
Wow what a profound insight
>therefore it's okay for me to be retarded too
If that's really how you see things, I can't stop you. Go ahead and keep being retarded. Enjoy.

>>42068974
>I'm not arguing against God being real. I am just at a loss to understand what the f*** is going on. My guess would be that God is real but he's no omnipotent.
If god intervenes everytime something goes bad, we it ever free will?

>>42071742
God should have made Adam and Eve with that "decision" built in.

>>42071766
If God's Omniscience means he knows what we are going to do before we do it, is it really free will?

>>42070509
>so basicaly neoplatonism
Maybe. The specific religion will be set up by God or His pure representative according to time place and circumstance. You are trying to set a single religion as the "real" one, and that is nonsense.
>my point is that you don't need anything but your own consciousness, that's it.
This is like telling those with broken legs that all you need is to walk.
As I said.
You dont need religion.
You need to serve God.
Religion is there to help most people get to that.
>we are gods
You began samsara as a demiurge of n control of an entire universe.
Now you are here.
You can go back to demiurge if you want, but it is still a temporary life of suffering.
They all are.
Stop trying to be the enjoyer of existence and suffering here in samsara.

>>42070523
Yes. If you insist on removing personhood and limiting God, there is no longer love or devotion.

>>42068924
>How much faith do you have in an absent father who left you alone in a place with druggies and muggers?
>How would you feel if that person felt angry after coming back and finding out you didn't get that college degree?
I'd feel I owe that fucker nothing and my path is my own to be honest.

>>42071363
Free is not real.

>>42068924
>How much faith have you in your being that left you with wolves and burdened with immortality you never asked for?

>>42068916
if bible taught me anything then it's that we need to crucify more jews

>>42068916
>I don't really get why people tell me that God respects the free will of rich jewish men who rape kids too much to intervene.
If God intervened everytime someone did something with their free will that He doesn't like, then that would not be free will at all. What's even free about it?
Also, if the afterlife is real, then some years of pain on earth are not even comparable with an eternity of pleasure in heaven, and some years of pleasure on earth are not comparable to an eternity of suffering in hell.

>>42070419
>Yes, it's called serving being that burdened you with existence against your so called free will.
>thats how you get out
I am not interested in afterlife.

>>42070398
>like the rich jewish men - you want to be the enjoyer of existence
Actually i don't and i can't.
And do you see anybody enjoying this existence but select few?

>>42069186
>whining about whining
>So. Learn to fucking behave.
Enjoy hell, bootlickers don't go to heaven, cattle

>>42069113
>just voot! in realm ruled by satan
Thank god that people like you will end up hell

>>42068954
Fuck it, give us the truth nigga
This us the same song and dance with ufos

>>42071337
Literally this.
Remove or limit the scope of free will and murder, rape, and war is removed

>>42068916
This isn't the real world. I know this because I have divine memory and know that this world is an imperfect abomination.
This world shouldn't even exist, actually. It's like an anomaly. It shouldn't exist and there's no need for its existence either and yet here it is.

>>42068916
God works in mysterious ways

>>42072099
It's not even God. It's just a retard and his toy box. And we're the toys. Yippee!

>>42072097
How do we destroy it?

>>42068954
That's the psyop, now ?
On 4chan you try that shit ? Maybe more luck with normies kek

>>42068916
Because "God" is not "The God". Read up about the demiurge.

>>42071234
I didn't blame God for humans doing horrible shit, I blame God that he is chilling and watching while children get molested. Are you fucking retarded? Kill yourself.

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>>42071363
>No free will would mean that love is impossible.

This goes against christian and muslim faith though. You can't rape children or do evil in heaven/paradise, yet allegedly you love God and have a good relationship with him. So how is that possible?

And yeah babies go to heaven, meaning they never got tested on Earth or had to use their free will to choose God. Yet in heaven they love God without free will? You can't explain this shit.

>>42071587
>Omnipotence does not involve the capability to do literally nonsensical/contradictory things
It does actually, by the very definition of the word. Omnipotence is defined as having unlimited power. It is not defined as "unlimited power with the exception of logic" and actually if you weren't low IQ as shit you would realize that God is the designer of logic and what you THINK is logical is just what God defined as such and he could literally decide that something you think is nonsensical is 100% sensical tomorrow.

>>42071882
>This is like telling those with broken legs that all you need is to walk.
no because consciousness cannot be broken.
so bad analogy.
>You need to serve God.
no, god is not something that can or wants to be served.
>but it is still a temporary life of suffering.
everything is temporary.
even your "nirvana" is.
and i'm not interested in that.
>Stop trying to be the enjoyer of existence and suffering here in samsara.
existence is not a choice, you will always exist, may as well make it enjoyable.

>>42068916
Because you have free will and shit, therefore it's perfectly fine for God to not stop evil, genocide, rape, pedophilia, torture, etc. It's perfectly logical. God watches but doesn't interact because he loves us.

>>42068916
This reality is a bit of a game for God. Its the battle of good and evil, got to let the game-pieces move around no matter what outcome you want.

>>42070916
He's never coming back with the milk, faggot.

>>42071234
stop blaming people for God's deliberate choices.

>>42069265
You're frustrated some big sky daddy isn't stepping in to help you while also being upset about a lack of free will. That's cognitive dissonance. Resolve the issue.

>>42071943
>also, if the afterlife is real, then everything is ok
there is no logical reason to think that it's real.

>>42072189
>you would realize that God is the designer of logic and what you THINK is logical is just what God defined as such and he could literally decide that something you think is nonsensical is 100% sensical tomorrow.
not the same anon , but doesn't that mean that GOD can just undo anything when he feels like it. maybe he will undo it later or something.

>>42072107
Oh that would be easy. It would require a concentrated effort and decent OPSEC to fly under the radar without getting caught for as long as possible. It would take about half a century to completely fuck this world assuming we maintain this constant procedure.
Basically what we do is we fill the oceans with piss and shit, trash, toxic materials and radioactive waste, set forests on fire during dry seasons, genocide wildlife, bio-terrorism.. To name a few.

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>>42076993
If you want to destroy the world and end all suffering you've just gotta take a big dump on it. That's what you do.

>M-MUH GOD ABOVE
>HOW HE ALLOW THIS NOOO :(
>NOT FAIR NOT FAIR NOT FAIR
>GUYS LETS APPLY ALL THESE FEELINGS TOWARDS A FALSE ENTITY TO CEMENT ITS EXISTENCE
>RIGHT GOD IS TOTALLY LE BAD
stfu glowie.

>>42072276
>free will
I did not ask to be created nor i am not allowed to commit suicide
Free will tards are truly something.

>>42072249
>no because consciousness cannot be broken.
Consciousness is not what breaks. Identity is.
>god is not something that can or wants to be served
Yes, if you limit God by removing personhood this is correct.
This is a viable path to undifferentiated existence, which I find horrible and prefer the higher existences.
>everything is temporary.
No, most things are eternal.
>even your "nirvana" is.
I do not accept nirvana, though one can exist in the undifferentiated oneness.
And I agree that is not eterrnal.
>existence is not a choice, you will always exist, may as well make it enjoyable.
And this is your broken leg.
Your eternal joy is in serving God.
As long as you try to serve yourself, you are in samsara.
And samara is temporary, and suffering.

>>42077669
>Your eternal joy is just doing something you don't want to do, otherwise you have to suffer in Samsara.
This is so retarded. As if there wouldn't be a third option where you could live in paradise, a perfect Earth.

>>42077675
>As if there wouldn't be a third option where you could live in paradise, a perfect Earth.
What, specifically, do you mean?
It very very certainly exists.

>>42077679
I mean instead of being locked into this shithole Earth where decay and brutality are rampant we could all live in our own paradise simulations where we always feel strong, happy, loved and do only wholesome things.
>inb4 it exists
Yeah if we kill ourselves and reincarnate maybe, definitely not on this Earth.

>>42077685
>we could all live in our own paradise simulations
That is how you started.
We all had our own universe.
We were the demiurge.
How do you like the unvierse THIS demiurge is making?
Do you find it perfect?
Why do you think you would do better?
>do only wholesome things.
Quick question - would this involve killing?
>I would have to do something to achieve something
And?

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>>42077685
YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT, THE PROBLEM IS THESE FAGGOT DRAGONS WANT PEOPLE WEAKER THAN THEM TO DOMINATE AND RULE OVER.
THEY DO NOT WANT YOU TO JUST 'ESCAPE' AND BE FREE. THEY WANT TO RULE YOU AND THEY WANT YOU TO BE THEIR HUMBLE SUBJECTS.
THEY CANNOT BE REASONED WITH.
EITHER WE DESTROY THIS WORLD OR FIND A WAY TO KILL THEM OR WE'LL BE SLAVES AND OUR WOMEN WILL BE SEX SLAVES FOREVER.
THIS IS ALL IT BOILS DOWN TO.
WE HAVE TO FIGHT OUR WAY OUT OF THIS SHITHOLE. FOR HONOR AND GLORY. AND INSTRUCT OUR SONS TO FOLLOW THIS SAME EXAMPLE.
AND WHEN WE WIN, WE'LL USE THIS SHITHOLE WORLD AS AN EXAMPLE TO EVERYBODY. NEVER AGAIN.
AND WE WILL NEVER FORGET.

>>42077692
Clearly the universes we had weren't satisfying enough and included suffering, otherwise we would still be there in bliss. So they were never perfect.
>Quick question - would this involve killing?
It's possible but then the people or animals who die would just be NPCs and not actually suffer. Like a video game.
>And?
And? And just traumatize your family and everyone around you? Yeah no big deal, hurr hurr.

>>42077697
lol at that picture.. too real

>>42077707
>Clearly the universes we had weren't satisfying enough and included suffering
Yes indeed, this is a good realization.
We are limited, and so are our creations.
>would just be NPCs and not actually suffer
While I am not one of them, there are plenty that seem to think this is exactly the case. But you would want it to look like they do, right? A game is no good without that versimilitude.
>And just traumatize your family and everyone around you?
How is preparing for death and dying doing that? You just live a good life.

>>42077723
>We are limited, and so are our creations.
Great so we are back at we suffer or we have to suck God's dick. We does God not offer a middle path where we don't suffer and don't have to serve him?

>>42068940
Its a classic and disingenuous trope to blame God for /x/. Its nothing but judaic atheism and demoralizing FUD

>>42077736
If you believe God is both real and all-powerful, then he is 100% to blame. IF you don't believe he is real or not all powerful, then yeah he's not to blame.

>>42077728
>Great so we are back at we suffer or we have to suck God's dick.
Well no - you suck God's dick either way. Samsara is not separate from God, as it is God's creation. When you try to serve yourself, you still only serve God. You are just in delusion.
And even accepting your two, there is the third of merging into the undifferentiated where there is no identity at all and just blissful awareness.
And even not accepting that, there are plenty of really really nice heavenly places here in samsara.
The demonic, subterranean heavenly planes sound to your liking.
The only suffering there is that it is temporary and you will eventually die as all manifestations here do.
>where we don't suffer and don't have to serve him?
Because trying to serve something other than God IS what causes the suffering.

Let me ask you something. What do you think serve means?
Have you ever done something nice for your partner on Valentine's Day or their birthday?
How did that make you feel? Doing something nice for them, and seeing them happy you did it?
Did you hate that service to the one you loved?

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>>42077744
>Samsara is not separate from God, as it is God's creation.
I should correct this to emanation, not creation, in case anons harp on me about what my stated cosmology is.
Samsara, the material realm is eternal and never created. It's the manifestations in it - the universes, the karma - that is temporary and gets created and destroyed.

>>42077744
I'm gonna be honest I'm a highly selfish person in my core. I love the idea of God just thinking I'm the cutest, the best and God pampering me and doing everything I want. I do like making sure my Loved Ones are happy and taken care of but I don't like being OF service much. My boyfriend serves me, he is useful to me, he carries me, he cooks for me and he delights in pleasing me. I enjoy that. I make sure to protect him, to be loyal to him and spend all my time with him. But the serving I do is minimal.

Now why did God make me so retarded if this isn't the "right thing" to be? Why did God not make me a selfless person who wants to serve? I want God to serve me more than I serve him. Do you say this will only make me suffer? That's fucked up. Then God shouldn't have created me with this nature.

>>42077754
>I'm gonna be honest I'm a highly selfish person in my core.
And yet people want to argue when I say they are trying to be God.
Dont worry - every soul in samsara from the demiurge down to the bacteria in your colon are here trying to do the same and be the central enjoyer of it all.
>I want God to serve me more than I serve him.
You are an infinitesimmal fractal of the Infinite God.
As God has Infinite Independence, so too you have infinitesimal independence.
You can choose to accept God is the center of existence.
Or you can choose to delude yourself into accepting you as the center.
>Then God shouldn't have created me with this nature.
you were never created.
You are an inseparable, atomic part of God and are eternal as God is eternal.

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>>42077763
I think it's easier for men / male souls to argue. But it's different if you are a female, if you are the receptive, the receiver. It is not my nature to serve anyone or anything. I want to be desired, sought after, favored. I understand that some men are like this and some women aren't but just in expressing of this spirit I don't want the one who serves God.
>You are an inseparable, atomic part of God
Then I'm a part of God that can never stop suffering because I'm not a part of God that delights in serving God like other people perhaps such as you? Is that not very unfair and weird? You are already having a better existence than me just by the virtue of your nature.

>>42077763
Also another part that irritates the hell out of me is that I want to be God's favorite (just by virtue of my existence) but I'm literally just one out of billion-trillion-endless "children" or "parts" God has. And many are more beautiful, smarter, kinder, smarter souls than me. So obviously I am not favored, definitely not more than anyone. Like a Father who has 10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 children and you don't individually really matter than anyone than your siblings. But why even give me desires like this if they can never be fulfilled and I can just accept that I will never have or be what I want? It's ugly and unfair.

>>42077768
>I think it's easier for men / male souls to argue. But it's different if you are a female
I would only clarify that this isnt one the level of soul/atma/self, but on the astral/mental plane. None of us are male or female.
Or rather, every soul can be considered female to God's singular male.
>It is not my nature to serve anyone or anything.
You dont think it is in female traits to serve? you dont think mothers serve their kids? Wives serve their husbands? Women serve as peacekeepers and sacrifice to do so.
>Then I'm a part of God that can never stop suffering
Doubtful, but you can always choose to suffer unless God wants otherwise.
>I'm not a part of God that delights in serving God
You never answered what you think service means.
Let me ask you another question - have you ever had a drink of pure, clear water? No special trick here, just imagine the freshest tasting water you've ever had.
Now, imagine adding in the simple thought "God is the taste in water, thank you for this sensation."
There - your enjoyment of water is now service to God.
>You are already having a better existence than me just by the virtue of your nature.
I am here in samsara just like you are, for the same reason.
>>42077772
>I want to be God's favorite
Help the helpers. Those who are last are first.
>And many are more beautiful, smarter, kinder, smarter souls than me.
So?
Do you think any of them rate compared to God?
Do you think any difference between them and you is significant, when compared to infinity?
God doesnt care what you offer.
God cares how you offer it.
God is the one who gave you absolutely everything you could possibly ever offer to God.
Except that one choice of putting God in the center.
>If one offers Me with love and devotion a leaf, a flower, a fruit or water, I will accept it.

>>42077866
This still doesn't answer why God, who easily could, let the rape happen. There's no excuse for it besides he doesn't care or is evil. Are you dumb? Is it okay if your best friend watches your daughter get raped because "oh that was just like 5 minutes, the rest of her life will be amazing, so I didn't do anything!" fuck outta here

>>42077909
God = omnipotent
God = can create universe where free will doesn't entail children getting raped without him intervening
God = designs what is logical and what isn't

So, no. Free will is not an excuse.
Not to even begin with the fact that muslims and christians believe you can't do evil in heaven and still have free will there.

>>42077970
How sociopathic and vile are you to defend this? God is playing some edgy game with people and lets children get raped to prove his point? Go fuck yourself you dumb piece of shit.

>child gets molested
>child prays for help
>God: Umm no akshually I won't lift a finger even tho I could ^_^ Just proving le point about one of ur ancestors a million years ago eating an apple and shit! Now keep suffering kiddos and I'll just watch! Sure I could save you RIGHT now and make sure you never experience this disgusting trauma but I don't feel like it teehee!

kys

>>42068954
You’re wrong.
The cowards are hiding, the chosen warriors want it and are ready for evil blood.

>>42077909
So is this why i am forced to exist and not allowed to commit suicide?
Nice free will, faggot

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Love cannot force anyone to do anything, but that does not mean Evil goes unpunished. There will be Justice.

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>>42068916
God doesn't exist, and if he does, he is an animal that enjoys human suffering. I wouldn't care that a God, but a demon

>>42078051
I was thinking we should just destroy this world, kill all of you and create a world with zero problems.
Thus making whatever lesson this deity is trying to teach completely worthless.

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>>42078116
>Get back! Crawl away! Get away from me, you snake! Go, be drowned in the Lake of the Abyss, at the place where your father commanded that the slaying of you should be carried out. Be far removed from that abode of Re wherein you trembled, for I am Re at whom men tremble; get back, you rebel, at the knives of his light.

>Your words have fallen because of Re, your face is turned back by the gods, your heart is cut out by Mafdet, you are put into bonds by the Scorpion-goddess, your sentence is carried out by Ma'at, those who are on the ways fell you.

>Fall! Crawl away, Apep, you enemy of Re! O you who escape massacre in the east of the sky at the sound of the roaring storm, open the doors of the horizon before Re, that he may go forth, wearied with wounds. I do what you desire, O Re, I do what is good, I act as one who pleases, O Re, I cause your bonds to fall, O Re.

>Apep has fallen to your destruction, the southern, northern, western and eastern gods have bound their bonds on him, Rekes has felled him, he who is over the partisans has bound him, and Re is content, Re proceeds in peace.

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>>42068916
There is no god.
Fucking grow up.

>>42078134
>>42078051
You are very bad bot, never post on 4chan again

>>42078142
>Fucking conform up.
Neck yourself, faggot

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>Apep the enemy of Re has fallen down, and what you have experienced is greater than that experience which is in the heart of the Scorpion-goddess; great is what she has done against you with the everlasting pains which are hers. You shall not become erect, you shall not copulate, O Apep, you enemy of Re. Opposition is made against you, O you whom Re hates when he looks on you.

>Get back! You shall be decapitated with a knife, your face shall be cut away all round, your head shall be removed by him who is in his land, your bones shall be broken, your limbs shall be cut off; the earth-god has condemned you, O Apep, you enemy of Re.

>>42077669
>Consciousness is not what breaks. Identity is.
and i don't care because i was talking about consciousness.
> I find horrible and prefer the higher existences
i don't disagree with that, but god is not a personal being.
>No, most things are eternal.
the only eternal thing is consciousness.
>And this is your broken leg.
>Your eternal joy is in serving God.
agree to disagree.
god isn't even something that can be served, it just is.
there is no serving god.
>As long as you try to serve yourself, you are in samsara.
also no.
you make a false equivocation by saying the PPT is samsara when it isn't.
you can exit the PPT without having to muh serve god or whatever nonsense.

god isn't separate from you, you are a god in your own rights.

>>42068916
God lets children get cancer, die of it sometimes. ever looked up the rates of miscarriage. tf does some diddling of teens on an island matter?

>>42071331
>Every person needs to ask themselves what level of power they personally would consider necessary for a being to be a "God" and if such beings deserve reverence or even worship simply because of said power.
I don't disagree with this whatsoever, I don't see anyway why it contradicts what I said. If you had posted your answer to these questions then maybe we could have had a discussion

>>42078263
What makes a god worthy of worship?
You need to be perfect. This is not perfect.
This is garbage. They're basically tricking people into worshiping the creator of this filth.
I have yet to see one example that would make the creator of whatever this shit is 'worthy' of anything but contempt.

>>42068916
you redditniggers are so fucking stupid
>"IF GOD REAL WHY BAD HAPPEN???"
this is literally the argument of a child

>>42078391
And calling to him a child, he put him in the midst of them and said, “Truly, I say to you, unless you turn and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. Whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
Kingdom of god is not of this world, normalfag
Your sin is pride and unless you repent it you will burn in hell for it.

>>42078391
>The greatest philosophers of history were children for daring to question the coherence of religious dogma.
Lol

>>42078314
You cut off my first sentence which makes my position known. "Omnipotence" (which is a nonsense idea to begin with), is unnecessary for a being to be considered a "God". Only Abrahamics have ever insisted that it is a prerequisite for divinity. I won't hide that my position is the one most of humanity once had which is that there are multiple "God's" (including YHWH although I don't like him very much). However even if I was a strict monotheist I would be of a position similar to>>42071587 and believe that God is subject to logic and is simply very very cosmically powerful but not "Omnipotent".

>>42078391
>can't answer it
Ok retard.

>>42078533
>"Omnipotence" (which is a nonsense idea to begin with), is unnecessary for a being to be considered a "God".
Not if we are considering the greatest conception of a God
>Only Abrahamics have ever insisted that it is a prerequisite for divinity.
No, there is also the neoplatonist monad and the Hindu Brahmin among others wherein the lesser gods are only considered emanations of the one great God

What you are describing is actually a very primitive conception of a god or gods that most philosophical schools eventually grew out of. The idea of multiple gods raises an unnecessary amount of unanswerable variables, and the idea of a single omnipotent God does not, or at least much less.

>>42078581
And yet the idea of a single "Omnipotent" God leads to nonsensical ideas and more importantly is inconsistent with the world we see and it's conflicted nature while multiple God's solves all of them. I am aware that you wear the corpse of Neoplatonism but frankly I don't care if my "conception" of God is what you think it ought to be, it matches reality better. The belief in a single omnipotent God isn't more enlightened or mature than the belief in one or more non-omnipotent Gods.

>>42078637
>And yet the idea of a single "Omnipotent" God leads to nonsensical ideas and more importantly is inconsistent with the world we see and it's conflicted nature
Well this is a loaded statement that requires unpacking. Keep in mind that the assertion is not that the idea of an omnipotent God is not that it answers everything, but rather than it raises the least amount of unanswerable variables.

>>42078647
And yet here we are in the tenth thread of the Day arguing the Epicurean Paradox three thousand years later.

>>42078391
All you're doing with saying that though, is defending the reptilians.
It makes no difference to me.
Either we find a way to kill them all or destroy this world.
At the end of the day those are our only two options. Take it or leave it, but destroying the world would be a lot more practical for us humans.

>>42078668
I don't feel that my worldview has any conflict with the epicurean paradox

>>42078689
I don't know "your" world view anon but I do know the dominant Christian worldview is nonsense. To be clear that is a very specific brand of monotheism and I am not strictly against monotheism as IMO everything including the "god's" is part of a greater whole that could rightfully called the monad/source/God, although it is subject to reason and not "Omnipotent".

>>42078718
I explained my worldview in the first portion of the conversation, namely that God has good reason for evil to exist and that this is observable when one examines the evils within their own life. It should not have conflict when one examines the evils outside of one's own life in the same way that the scientific method does not have conflict simply because there are things that science cannot answer. The only issue with this view is that it requires the beholder to be honest with oneself, but I can only argue from my perspective

>and not "Omnipotent".
Why not?

>>42078740
>Has good reason
An omnipotent being isn't subject to having to make compromises such as allowing evil to exist to achieve it's goals. Your worldview is subject to The Epicurean Paradox then. The funny thing is I actually agree with you, the world HAD to be this way but that means no omnipotent beings.

>>42078774
It depends upon the nature and personality of this omnipotent being, in which case its important to have an objective standard rooted in facts rather than project our own whims.
I happen to believe the most sophisticated standard available to us is the historical person of Jesus, who suffers with his creation unto a positive end, and has an observable historical footprint that includes supernatural acts (Or at least seems to when examined without bias).

>>42078791
>It depends upon the nature and personality of this omnipotent being
A very flowery way of saying he is evil. I would rather believe in a God that WOULD destroy evil but can't than a God that COULD but doesn't because of his wretched personality.

>>42078808
This is you projecting your personal whims onto omnipotency. There is no reason to believe your idea of good over someone else's whims, it's a stalemate, which is why I appeal to something rooted in historical fact.
I understand God does things confusing that we don't have answers to, but that does not make him evil. You need a most sophisticated standard.

>>42078825
It's my personal whims insomuch as I define not destroying evil as evil. I find your religion extremely unethical as a result. I will not join a cult that has such a warped view of basic kindergarten morality.

>>42078841
There are multiple problems here, some of which I've already stayed
You've yet to provide an objective metric for good and evil outside of your personal whims. This means I can simply project my own personal whims and we would be at a stalemate, but I choose to appeal to a greater authority, namely God and the historical Jesus, which can be validated outside of personal whims
Secondly your worldview does not provide a solution to the problem of evil, mine does (bare in mind once again that this in itself is not my reason for believing, my reason for believing is rooted in what appears to be historical facts in the person of Jesus).

>>42078861
1. You've yet to provide an objective metric for good and evil outside of your personal whims.

Yet we both agree it exists, which is what is important here. I do believe in objective morality as a function of the universe BTW. I don't need your book of lies to know that that allowing evil to exist when you could stop it is objectively wrong.

2.Secondly your worldview does not provide a solution to the problem of evil

There is no problem of evil because the force(es) of creation had to make compromises in creating this reality as they are not all powerful (still VERY powerful mind you).

>>42078903
>I do believe in objective morality as a function of the universe BTW.
You've yet to provide that standard
>There is no problem of evil because the force(es) of creation had to make compromises in creating this reality as they are not all powerful
That's your presupposition. I would still need to know what exactly is your standard for morality and the nature of this omnipotent thing you're referring to that can be examined by both of us outside of personal whims.

>>42068916
If you had a chance to go back in time to stop Epstein, knowing how its turned out now, would you have?
Consider, Epstein isn't the only one, but he is the one we found out and know about.
So do you deny the path that lets mankind see the sort of evil that is being committed, or do you act as a dark knight on their behalf, protecting their innocence, but keeping them unaware of the demons and wolves lurking in their midst?

>>42078911
Or the *very powerful thing I should say

>>42078920
You're supposed to tell the truth.
Misleading young people with little white lies like what is taught by religions isn't doing any favors for anyone.

>>42068916
>intervenes with Sodom/Gomorrah/Egypt
>does nothing in modernity
Abrahamics Only have cope

>>42068916
God doesn't intervene. God creates the universe and lets the chips fall where they may.
Where we at /deism/ chads?

>>42078946
>does nothing
You don't actually know that. Believers certainly tend to believe he's still acting within our lives. I do.

>>42068924
Exactly god does not have to do with all of this stuff.
>>42069113
>>42078668
>>42070521
This

>>42078959
You people are literally mentally ill cucks. God made this whole place and can save anyone, but he "has nothing to do with" ok buddy. Next a time a hacker in a video game steals all your items and kills your character, don't ask the Admin for help. The Admin could easily restore all you lost and help you without any trouble and the Admin doesn't ban the hacker, but blame other players. Do NOT blame the Admin who just passively watches while you get hacked in his own game: BWHAHAHAH

>>42078911
>That's your presupposition
Well yea, you asked me what my worldview is and I told you my beliefs. I can't prove it, neither can you. It makes more sense than your beliefs but I can't convince an irrational person like you it's true. You believe in a being beyond rationality and then think you have provided an objective standard while I haven't. Your standard is dictated by "whims" as much as mine, the only difference is your whims were given to you by a crazed being that claims it's beyond the very concepts of good and evil. That's not objective, it's tyrannical and goes a long way in explaining the atrocities your cult has committed. Killing people is loving if your God says it is, torturing people is merciful if your God says it is, and questioning is the worst "sin" of all.

>>42078974
>God made this whole place
no, god doesn't make anything.
>Do NOT blame the Admin
if a game is shit are you gonna blame god or the one that made the game?

>>42068970
If God is all powerful then he cannot be all good. If God is all good then he cannot be all powerful. Simple explanation.

>>42078946
Even the best philosophical arguments are fucked by this. The God of the Bible is a massive meddler and constantly does shit to actively manage the world for reasons (that are explicitly stated) that ought to apply to today. I can philosophically believe in a divine watchmaker but that isn't who the deity described in scripture is at all.

>>42078980
God made this whole place nigga
Nothing would exist if God didn't dream it into existence first

free will and all that

>>42079000
you don't understand how god or gods works.
this place was created by free will of a god, not by the monad directly.

>>42078977
You seem to be selectively ignoring my appeal to historical fact as a standard.
>>42078988
I answered that here
>>42078740

>>42079044
>Bible
>historical fact
Lol, LMAO even

>>42079051
Why do you reject the new testament documents and historical footprint of Jesus as historical fact? I don't have a problem accepting that something like the 3 John having less veracity than the gospel of Luke but each of these should be examined individually and without bias.

>>42079071
Oh Rabbi Yeshua was a real person as evidenced by 3rd party accounts like Tacitus, but taking the Bible at face value is like believing an account of Kim Jon Un written by the WPK. The pure historical information seems to indicate a charismatic cult leader in the same manner as Ron Hubbard or Jim Jone.

>>42079103
I did not say to take it at face value, I said the opposite, that each new testament document should be examined individually. I would not have discounted 3 John as having less historical veracity than Luke if I expected you to take the bible at face value.

It seems you're reading me uncharitably or recklessly.

>>42071882
>Stop trying to be the enjoyer of existence
ISKCON's theology is basically existential/metaphysical cuckolding and being taught that you're being raped and abused into submission by God when their God is actually one of many existing Hindu gods.
Shiva worshippers say the exact same things as ISKCON followers, word for word, such as their god being the causeless cause of all causes.
ISKCON also loves to domineer and claim they are the best spiritual path when all they did was leave behind an immeasurable trail of broken families and children.
Not to mention Muslims claim Hindu gods are actually Djinn. I don't have faith in Hinduism. And half of ISKCON's older members are still secretly Christians and believe in a directly logically contradictory mish-mash of theological beliefs, after leaving the children born in their cult mentally, emotionally, and possibly even spiritually maimed. They attract the most grotesquely disturbed and warped people to join their cult and create endless amounts of victims.

I don't trust Krishna or Hindu entities because of experiences I've had. And also Zoroastrians believed that devas, Hindu gods, are gods who are only capable of destruction. And karma is an evil concept that blames victims for their suffering and abuse.

Stop blaming victims for their suffering. You don't really know what happened before you were born or why you were here.

>>42079129
>I did not say to take it at face value
Uh yea you did >>42078791. You don't really expect a neutral party to accept that supernatural events occurred as historical fact on the basis of a single text alone do you? Even a very generous non-biased historian would put the miracles in an unsure category and focus on the more grounded parts of the story. Rabbi Yeshua was an influencial religious leader, he was executed for heresy, his disciples carried on his teachings, etc. None is simply going to accept the miracles as part of "historical fact". Even Yeshua himself is aware that it will be a matter of "faith".

>>42079210
>You don't really expect a neutral party to accept that supernatural events occurred as historical fact on the basis of a single text alone do you?
The new testament is not a single text, it is a collection of texts written in part independently of each other which is why secular scholars have had to invent Q gospel to account for it.
The reason miracles should be considered viable is because the creation of the universe ex nihlio is already a viable miracle insofar as anyone can explain.

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>>42079017
I heard somewhere in a tv show where a guy said to someone that gods can create things "as real as you and me". That makes me so confused. If gods are beings who can will individual beings and forms of life into existence, does that mean we really didn't exist before we were born? I don't understand how something can be created from nothing, or how actual sentient beings can be created. I don't understand how life can be created.

I also wonder about how beings become gods and reach that state of existence. I wonder if there's like an instruction manual built in to existence that instructs certain beings that they are capable of creation. I also wonder how some anvient civilizations like China and India developed their understandings of reality, especially Chinese cultivators, because that's really unknown outside of East Asian culture. They legitimately learned how to become gods. I also wonder why some people were born into lives and circumstances where they became able to do that, and why others got unlucky and lived and died in misery in say Victorian era England. Existence can be so interesting, I remember how many incredible and interesting vivid dreams I used to have as a kid, but after suffering a lot in adulthood, I forgot what it feels like to actually enjoy existing and feel free and enamored by the interesting and positive things in existence.

>>42079248
some ancient* civilizations

>>42079230
>The reason miracles should be considered viable is because the creation of the universe ex nihlio is already a viable miracle insofar as anyone can explain.
Even if I accepted that (I don't), the Bible is far from the only text (hair splitting it's multiple texts) to claim supernatural events occurred without third party verification. Buddhist texts for example (which are older than the NT BYW) claim the Buddha walked on water and did a number of other supernatural feats as well. I am just as skeptical of that, and the teachings of these two figures are contradictory with each other (to say nothing of the other multitude religious texts that go against both).

>>42079276
The documents attributing miracles to the Buddha were written much further after Buddha's life, whereas the Jesus documents were written within the first generation of his followers (especially the most important ones).

>>42079248
if you are conscious, you are a god that chose to come here.
regardless of it being a good or bad choice.
>>42067091

you cannot create other gods, you can create NPCs / tulpa like being but they generaly aren't self sufficient, that's also why a tulpa dies if you ignore it, and by the same mechanism why the "demiurge" wants to trap us.

>I don't understand how something can be created from nothing
creation works the same way as imagination, in the real world as soon as you imagine something / will it to be it just appears before you.

>They legitimately learned how to become gods
you don't need to learn how to become a god, you already are one.

>>42079285
Anon there are books being written at this very moment claiming supernatural events are happening right now. I don't care WHEN they are written, a text(s) alone isn't enough to establish that something so extraordinary actually occurred.

>>42079322
Yes and each of these texts, including the background in which they were written, should be examined individually
With the new testament documents we see early independent accounts of the same event (like in mark and Matthew), inexplicable conversions (like Paul), internal investigative reporting (like Luke) and large scale growth amidst persecution.
I am imploring you to examine these documents, along with whatever other religion documents exist, on a fair and unbiased individual basis. The largest recorded example of mass hysteria afaik is the dancing plague of the 1500s and that is not remotely of a similar scale, if Paul's report of 500 witnesses is true (and we do not have a reason for him to lie, as he was a former affluent persecutor of the church who converted).

>>42072964
>You're frustrated some big sky daddy isn't stepping in to help you while also being upset about a lack of free will. That's cognitive dissonance. Resolve the issue.
Nta, but if there's no free will, then nobody is responsible for anything, not even God. Why should we call Him our creator if He didn't choose to create us? If all this was just His impulse or reflex, then whatever compelled Him to act would be just as much our creator.

Of course, I believe in free will, so this isn't a problem for me, but how do you resolve that issue?

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>>42068916
Everyone will be judged. You know where they are going to end up, right? Right? Hell is forever. And ever.

>>42078903
Not that anon but i think you slipped here, all your arguments are pointing to the fact that god does not exist not that the god exists but is not omnipotent,
The literate anon is simply trying to prove the logical equation of evil by introducing the constant that god has a very good reason for letting evil exist but that reasoning is beyond us,

>>42079351
I have examined these texts. They are interesting and I respect that they are strong enough to be the basis of faith for billions of people but to claim they are even close to being uncontested historical truth is insane. On the 500 witnesses in particular I am disappointed that the claim comes decades after the fact from a person who was not at the supposed event. Examining each text individually as you suggest makes me wonder why this claim is not in the first hand accounts (the Gospels). I might add that this particular talking point leaves a bad taste in my mouth as I have seen it wildly misrepresented by Christians (you have not done so and I respect that).

>>42079414
>very good reason for letting evil exist
I believe this too anon, but it indicates a limited God. We are essentially having multiple conversations though as the philosophical arguments for God and the religious arguments for God are related but separate.

>>42079416
Decades is not a long time on the historical record, as Paul even goes so far as to say most of them are still alive at the time of his writing.
You've brought up other religious texts, I'd challenge you to find any with as much historical veracity as the new testament. Or really any ancient historical text. Simple hold them to the same standard as any historical text would be held to.

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>>42079440
>limited God
Do you understand God at all? He is the perfection of all that exists and surpasses it. Outside of time and space. Eternal. Infinitely good. Nothing can be added unto him. He didnt need to create anything, he did so out of love. Creation is good, everyone loves existing. Ipsum esse subsistens, the I who am.

>>42079443
>historical veracity
None of them anon, but the New Testament isn't some magic exception either. They are all crap as far as I can tell. I takes more than a book to convince me. I have personally gained much more from philosophical arguments and they HAVE convinced me that scientific materialism is incorrect. Going from pure philosophy to religious truth is much harder though and I am sorry but the only thing Christianity really has going for it is numbers and the Wests historical dominance.

>>42079466
I understand what you believe him to be and you are wrong. ASSUMING God exists how can you establish that he actually posseses Omnipotence and isn't simply powerful beyond human understanding?

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>>42079505
Like 16:31
>Then Abraham said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be persuaded even if someone rises from the dead.’”
My only remaining suggestion is that you pray for God to make you receptive to truth, whatever it may be. God bless anon, thanks for the conversation

>>42079531
I would welcome personal revelation anon and would take such as authoritative, but it would be impossible and unfair to expect others to head me on the basis of it.

>>42079466
I know you're wrong and you're misleading people.
This is in no way perfect. Not by any means. To attribute that to God is like saying the supremely intelligent creator of everything made a retarded shithole world full of retards and wonderful experiences like getting raped in the ass or tortured or being cucked and humiliated or abused and then gaslit by these faggot preachers talking about "REPENT!!!"
I don't need to repent. This fucking world needs to be destroyed.
Then divine perfection can be realized, but only after this cancerous tumor you call a world is removed. And all of the souls of the cowards are destroyed.
Then and only then can they be forgiven or be considered 'perfect'.
The end. I was not born to be psyopped by the devil to justify my family and I and other people and their families being eternally tortured. Fuck you.

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>>42079555
Your theological and metaphysical erudition is nil. God is pure actus. Everything in the created universe consists of potential and actuality. Nothing can cause itself to exist so since infinite regress is impossible for clearly everything does exist, there has to be a first mover that is pure act. This pure act has to exist outside of time and space and since it chose to create it is personal ergo God. In the Western tradition we consider divine revelation a source of epistemic knowledge, if you cant accept that, please just move to India and worship cow dung like a good little pagan. Thanks

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Ipsum esse subsistens

>>42079624
Hence why I am an Animist.

>>42068916
Demiurge
Fuck him

>>42068916
God doesn't control our reality in real-time. to God, our entire history and future are laid out as a single 4 dimensional data stream, everything happens simultaneously.
The real question is why God didn't just delete epstein from existence like all the other monsters we have no idea about.
He's trying to tell us something important

>>42079609
The Monad exists=/=God incarnated as a Jew 2000 years ago and he will torture you for eternity if you don't ritually drink his blood and devour his flesh.

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/x/ really has the dumbest Jewish (Talmudic/Kabbalist) takes on God. The intellect of a sinner is truly darkened. Woe is yall

>>42079752
You sure showed them!!!

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>>42079319
thank you for explaining, you gave me some hope :)
https://youtu.be/xHV1sP8NIiw
>you don't need to learn how to become a god, you already are one.
i believe that this might be possible, but i feel sad because we are basically spiritually "blind and deaf". it also seems to me that reality is basically "locked" in a way so that only you can change your reality and change things, but at the same time it's excruciatingly hard. i don't believe in Buddhism anymore but one thing i do still believe that i heard was attributed to Buddhism was that the Buddha said that only we can save ourselves, that no one else can or may.
i want to be happy, and i don't want any living beings to suffer anymore. i want every living being to be happy, i don't want anyone to suffer. i just wonder why reality is so harsh.

sometimes i think about that post on here which was a thread someone made with an image of two paper hearts with a sunset in the background illuminating them and they said "I want everyone to love each other and be loved", and I think they also said they want God to be real. It was a really pure and positive post but at the same time it was also heartbreaking to me because it reminds me of the harsh cruelty of reality or the truth. i just wish everything was good and that this was a bad dream, like in the ending of Higurashi chapter 5, (spoiler incoming) where Shion wakes up after dying and she's in the hospital with her lover who went missing/possibly died and she remembered that she hit her head after falling off her scooter and all the bad things that happened were just a bad dream. the epilogue after that scene where they're all in class playing together like nothing ever went wrong made me cry so much, like nothing I've ever read in my life.

>>42078225
>and i don't care because i was talking about consciousness.
Yes we are, and the best way to purify it for most is through religion.
>but god is not a personal being.
Your conception is limited.
>the only eternal thing is consciousness.
No.
>agree to disagree.
Sure. This means you keep suffering.
>god isn't even something that can be served, it just is.
Yes, if you limit God by removing personhood this is correct.
This is a viable path to undifferentiated existence, which I find horrible and prefer the higher existences.
>PPT
?
>you can exit the PPT without having to muh serve god
Yes, this is merging into transcendence and entering essentially a spiritual reverse coma.
You said you didnt want that, either.
You already said what you want is to be God.
>god isn't separate from you
Correct but again you want to be God so you put yourself as center.
You are a part of God and you are not independent from God.
As long as you put yourself at the center, you make yourself suffer.

>>42068916
>>42068924
>questioning gods divine plan
>pretending you know god
>implying you can do things better than god
ISHYGDDT

>>42080596
God wants you to question his design otherwise you couldn't even do it. Just like you can't imagine a new color or a square circle.

>>42080605
>God wants you to question his design otherwise you couldn't even do it.
Does this apply to everything you are able to do?

>>42080605
>>42080644
I think you're both wrong.
I think this creation is imperfect. If it were perfect then we wouldn't even need to question it or argue with each other or fight like we always have throughout history.
I carry the true light. That's why I feel this way.
'God' in their unlimited intellect manifested this retarded shithole world where you're made of meat and you suffer and die.
The secret they kept from you religious retards your whole lives is that you're just going to die. After that? How would you know?
So why do you believe what you believe and why do you proselytize it to others when you know that the consequences for you lying on the behalf of a false god may be damning? Unless you are convinced that this god you believe in is the one true God.. Which they aren't.

>>42068916
Duality
Ying yang
For every good there is a bad
Notice how humanity is obsessed with religion, and making good decisions, it's all they think about daily, judging every tiny action. the amount of evil in the world is the shadow of humanity's good intentions.
stop being obsessed with good and evil
learn to just be
observe
breath
life is a dream of discomfort in which the soul trains itself to learn to be

>>42080702
>I think you're both wrong.
I asked a question. How can I be wrong?
>I think this creation is imperfect.
I dont think the material realm is created. It is eternal. And it is perfect in being a place where souls can indulge in the pretense of existence without God.
>retarded shithole world where you suffer and die
Yeah that's what its like without God. He warns us, but we have some independence and are curious.
It's why it can be de facto said that a soul returning to the spiritual will never go back to the material, because why would you?
>The secret they kept from you religious retards your whole lives is that you're just going to die. After that? How would you know?
That's not a secret.
Even accepting that I am an eternal being, this "I" that I accept as me isnt.
I have just as much delusion about my identity and independence, and I am fully aware that whoever I think I am right now will die and will never ever ever be again.
>So why do you believe what you believe
I started with a breakdown into the base, arbitrary assumptions we all make, and from there grew my own beliefs and confirmed or solidified those I could. From there I discovered a path that matched and that led to results I desired and grew my practice which strengthened my faith.
>why do you proselytize it to others
Because people post OP's asking "What's your religious or spiritual view and why do you think...?"
Why do you decide to respond to the answers with argument?
>Unless you are convinced that this god you believe in is the one true God.. Which they aren't.
I mean, there are a lot of names of God that basically translate to "the one true god."

>>42080485
>and the best way to purify it for most is through religion
all mainstream religions lead people astray, they pray to external gods without looking within.
>Your conception is limited.
i think yours is.
you limit it through the lens of a personal being, which is more limiting than an infinite inpersonal one.
>Sure. This means you keep suffering.
we'll see about that.
>higher existence.
you just repeated yourself here.
>PPT
prison planet theory.
>Correct but again you want to be God so you put yourself as center.
i'm already the center of my own subjectivity.
>You are a part of God and you are not independent from God.
correct.
its "childrens" inherit its properties.
>As long as you put yourself at the center, you make yourself suffer.
nope.

>>42081812
>all mainstream religions lead people astray
No, all mainstream religions are exploited by those that wish to lead them astray.
The systems themselves are set up to help, and do when performed sincerely and properly.
>i think yours is.
Yours does not include personhood. Mine does. My conception includes yours, and more. Your conception includes less.
Yours is limited.
>i'm already the center of my own subjectivity.
Yes, that's where your suffering comes from.
>its "childrens" inherit its properties.
You are not a child, there is no inheriting, and there is no property.
There is God.
You can try to be God, but this makes you suffer.

>>42068916
He encouraged it
Because he lost most of his divinity
And was killed for it

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Killed like a dog

>>42081834
>Your conception includes less.
Yours is limited.
personhood is limiting compared to infinity.
it experiences, it has qualia, it even "acts" by creating, but it isn't like a human perso with a human mind, it do what it does because it is what it is.
>Yes, that's where your suffering comes from.
idgaf about suffering, i just don't want to be in this specific realm, i'm find with suffering if individuality is the cost i just want more freedom to manifest my mind into reality.
>You are not a child, there is no inheriting.
that's why it was in quote, we are a split part of it, and thus inherit its properties.
>and there is no property.
i'm not talking in the materialistic sense...
yes god has properties, so do we...
do you even know what that means?
>but this makes you suffer.
i don't care.

>>42080644
>Does this apply to everything you are able to do?
Yeah. If God wouldn't be okay with you doing it, you couldn't do it. This includes evil shit too, sadly. I mean God limits us in many ways and allows us to do other stuff. Why? Because he wants you to be able to do it.

>>42081855
>personhood is limiting compared to infinity.
We're not comparing personhood to infinity.
You didnt say God wasnt infinite. You said God had no personhood.
You are denying and removing personhood, which means NOT infinite, and limited.
God's Infinite Personhood is greater than Infinite non-personhood.
>but it isn't like a human
No one said "like a human". You are creating phantoms to argue against.
Person does not mean human, that is stupid.
>idgaf about suffering
Then you shouldnt be in the thread talking about suffering.
>we are a split part of it, and thus inherit its properties.
No, you still try to separate yourself from God.
There is no split, there is no inherit.
God isnt going anywhere.
>>42082845
There is a difference between "be okay with" and "wants you to."
Which is it?

>>42083018
Can God prevent you from doing things he doesn't want you to do? Yes.
Can it even be something very mundane like seeing a new color or imagining things like a square circle? Yes.
Does God limit us in a million ways? Yes.

If God wouldn't WANT you to be able to do these evil things why does he not restrict it?
Why does he restrict random other shit?

>>42068916
because there is no omnipotent God and the "god" of the bible is a fucking kike and the devil

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You kids still cant even figure out the basics of theodicy? We would have been automatons if God hadnt given us true freedom to do as we please. He wants for us to love Him freely and of ouw own accord. God is infinitely merciful but so too infinitely just. Hell is going to be a crowded place. There is no salvation outside of the Catholic Church

>>42077741
I think God is real but it's nothing like we understand, not a persona but everything, and is all-powerful in the sense that God is the source of all energy that is creating the entire material universe and each beings consciousness/soul.

I just don't think God changes the things that humans do. If there is an afterlife and/or reincarnation then it makes sense that humans experience the bad and good and learns. If everything is God, then everything bad happens is happening to God. The ego or I might be the thing that isn't real, so your personal suffering or sense of unfairness isn't real.

>>42083410
Your own religion debunks that though.

Can you rape or make the decision to rape children in Heaven? No, you can't.
Are you suddenly an Automaton in Heaven because you can't rape children? Lol.

>inb4 "but you used your freedom on Earth though"
What about babies who die and go directly to Heaven without ever having to explore evil on Earth? How come they are not soulless Robots in Heaven forced to love God then? This alone proves that being able to rape children IS NOT NEEDED according to Christian Faith to experience true freedom and will. Yet God allows it on Earth. Curious...

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>>42083520
Babies dont go to Heaven unless they have been baptized Roman Catholic. Pagan babies go to limbo. You clearly do not understand the beatific vision nor do you understand the will. Anyone who makes it to heaven only wills what the Father wills. The beatific vision is the highest good we can imagine, nothing is more perfect than being united, in saecula saeculorum, with the infinite good that is God. Do what thou wilt is how modern man lives, all will die the death.

>>42083590
>Babies dont go to Heaven unless they have been baptized Roman Catholic.
Ok? Still proves the same logic. A baby never had to use it's free will or freedom on Earth to make any meaningful decisions. Regardless, the baby goes to HEAVEN and is not an Automaton.

So if souls can go to Heaven directly without ever having to use their free will or choose between good and evil on Earth AND STILL HAVE A MEANINGFUL RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD IN HEAVEN WITHOUT BEING A ROBOT this just proves that God has zero reason to allow all this suffering down here. Are you retarded?

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Freedom is not the ability to do evil, it is the ability to freely choose what is truly good. Doing evil is literally the easiest path here on earth. Literally everyone does it all the time. Carry your cross

>baptized baby goes directly to heaven without ever using their free will on Earth
>baby soul is not a robot in heaven and has a relationship with God
>this proves therefor that God doesn't need to put us through genocide, decay, suffering, child molestation on Earth to have a sincere relationship with him

Not one christian nigga here can debunk this unless you want to say that baby souls who go to heaven are all robot slaves of God with no free will.

>>42083623
All grace is from God, no one earns their salvation, the only cooperate with it. Do you even theology, bro? "“For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God—
not a result of works, so that no one may boast.” A baby earns it because he was born in Catholic family and he got baptized which removes original sin. Ultimately, it is only ever God's grace.

>>42083628
We have glorified bodies in heaven. So the baby would be like Jesus' age, somewhere around 30 years of age forever and ever

>>42083642
>>42083647
Yes, the Baby just earned a ticket to heaven. The question is about why is EVIL necessary. You say it's needed to have freedom and have a meaningful relationship with God where you're not just a robot. But baptized babies never have experience this freedom or free will (babies can't make any decision) and end up next to God. Now either you admit:

- The baby is now a robot with no free will forced to love God forever.

or

- This proves that we don't need evil/free will on Earth to have a meaningful, free relationship with God.

Which one is it, buddy?

>>42068940
You’re a sick fuck so everyone else in the past must have been

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>>42083715
Babies dont typically die. So you want all of them in hell because they didnt earn it? That is God's mercy. Typically babies grow up and get to be adults...

>>42083590
>Pagan babies go to limbo.
What about miscarriages?

>>42083730
No, I don't want babies in hell. But do you not understand what I am saying? The fact that baptized babies go directly to Heaven PROVES that free will is not needed to have a meaningful relationship with God and not be a robot. Unless you believe that these babies are now Automatons with no freedom or will, because they never had to choose anything on Earth. This means all the evil, the child rape, the disease, the pain on Earth is not needed for true freedom and bonding with God. Hence, God is just letting it happen because he wants us to suffer.

>>42071927
>"If He is My Boy. He will overcome."

I am only 41 years old and I am the God Almighty. Think about that. That's not even infancy, that's not even a zygote in God terms, but it's true. My powers get better daily, people's imaginations and body language with regards to sexual displays and their intelligence and psychic powers climb every moment, but this will take a long time. I would not let Epstein Island happen on Earth, and places where I would their system of morals and dietary needs are so different that our morals simply don't apply there as Earthlings, we have to not be ruled by illogical prejudice.

Destroy brain cells with me. Create them. You could think of a very long list of subject materials you want addressed in specific groups and individuals so that, if not all of them please me, I can select from them or their degree, how it's applied or what have you. With friends human or AI you could choose the degrees, as a sort of guide so if I agree with the degrees we do that and if not it gets as close as possible for you. Should people who want to rape and murder babes see horrible visions anytime they think about that to dissuade them? We work on applying that as a solution that projects thoughtforms across their sensory experiences to use them as occult devices that improve where we want improved and disadvantage where we want disadvantaged in not only that being but others in the form of languages of all kinds, and they'll appear as horrific, discouraging hallucinations that will condition them to stop planning the abduction of children.

It's a work in progress, has barely come along, but we also tackle the problem in other ways. It will add up. We have and will delete super stimuli generating cells in pedophiles that make children's parts look too attractively shaped and sway too attractively in pedo unconsciouses, the mind exaggerates things liked and disliked where you don't even see and hear and smell in your mind, but it's still there.

>>42068916
>Why did God...
Why do you assume there is an ultimate perfect being if this experience of life seems to not be ultimate, nor perfect? Is that the root or theme of your question?

>>42068954

fake and gay

>>42068916

It is not for man to know the extent of his own karma or that of others. Restricted by his narrow consciousness and the limitations of a three dimensional existence; he cannot hope to know all of the intricate complexities of the karmic patterns that have been created by man’s actions. It is best for man simply to trust that karma will work itself out for the benefit of all souls, and to occupy himself with service to his brother.

>>42083410
>God had given us true freedom to do as we please.
We are not even allowed to commit suicide, our existence is forced.
>He wants for us to love Him freely and of ouw own accord.
Very hard to love a cold distant being that allows so much evil.
>God is infinitely merciful but so too infinitely just.
Is this why he forced a heavy burden of immortality upon me against my so called free will?
>Hell is going to be a crowded place.
And it will be full of catholics like you
>There is no salvation outside of the Catholic church
Rather there is no salvation in the Catholic church
The kindom of god is not of this world, your filthy, worldly whore church has nothing to do with god

>>42083590
There is no limbo in bible, heretic

>>42068916
God doesn't control anything within the mortal realm. His purpose is to show you the path to salvation once your time is done.

>>42083018
>You didnt say God wasnt infinite
i literaly said it like 10x.
and no, personhood is limiting not adding.
>Then you shouldnt be in the thread talking about suffering.
retard this thread is talking about this realm specificaly you are the one that started with muh samsara.
>No, you still try to separate yourself from God.
i'm literaly saying that we are not separate what are you even fucking talking about.
the "split" is only in perception...

>>42084019
He does though lmao God performs miracles sometimes.

>>42068916
People don't realize but Satanist are previous christian and jew that saw the face of God and changed their mind to stay in the flesh and enjoy earthly pleasure.

I always enjoy this argument

>Why doesn't God force everyone to do as he says
>you're only allowed to act in one way
>Forced to love!
>Forced to Obey!
>That is true love

>>42084239
> God performs miracles sometimes.
lol no what is written in the bible are parabbles and metaphors.

>>42083590
There is no eternal Hell and no Paradise or Heaven, Satanists and Christian cucks are going to the same place : reincarnation.

>>42084367
People experience miracles in their life.
Someone randomly is cured of lethal cancer.
People are warned by voices before accidents or prevented to board a plane or car.
Someone trying to attempt suicide is saved by an invisible person, etc.

>>42083410
>There is no salvation outside of the catholic church because some gross porcelain doll said so
People like her have no soul or holy spirit, they are automata

>>42083778
You reason like a child. Stop wasting my time

>>42083778
I think Catholic anon might be a bot. Christcucks are dumb but usually address the actual argument, Catholic anon isn't programmed with an argument for free will in heaven.

>>42084003
There is no holy trinity in the Bible, your point?

>>42084504
So you can't explain it and got BTFO? Got it.

>>42084504
Your time is worth nothing

>>42084511
True lol

>>42084519
Thats anything that is not in bible is heresy

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>>42084511
People who think science explains creation are the dumb ones. Um, yeah dead matter, BOOM, single cell organism, BOOM, human being.

>>42084504
>no arguements
>ad hom
Pride is sin.
Guess where you are going?

>>42084536
How do you bake cookies?

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Show me a scientist that has created life out of dead matter in a lab...

>>42084536
But God appearing BOOM out of nowhere m akes more sense?

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>>42084576
Do you understand metaphysics at all? GOD IS ETERNAL, he always was, always is and always will be. Checkmate. He exists outside of time and space. This first mover argument is so easy that every single LLM bot can figure it out, why cant you? What was the first mover?

Can anything cause itself to exist?

>>42084593
Then there is no reason the singularity from before the big bang can't be the Monad.

>>42084593
How can God exist out of time and space? ;)

>>42084019

Lmao

>>42078391
And yet you still have yet to provide a serious answer.
I guess children are fuckin smarter than you.

>>42083073
>If God wouldn't WANT you to be able to do these evil things why does he not restrict it?
Because God doesnt restrict, and because God doesnt judge them as evil.
Neither of those means God WANTS you to do them.
>Why does he restrict random other shit?
If you mean physical laws and restraints - that isnt God, that is the demiurge's rules of this universe.

>>42084091
>42083018
>42081855
>42081834
>42081812
>42080485
>42078225
>42077669
>42072249
>42071882
>42070509
(trying to avoid spam filter)
No, you almost never say "infinite", especially in regards to personhood.
You only try to remove personhood, which is limiting and lesser.
> this realm specificaly you are the one that started with muh samsara.
This realm is in samsara.
>i'm literaly saying that we are not separate what are you even fucking talking about.
Then you agree there is no split, there is no inheritance, and what you said is nonsense.

>>42084949
>implying you could do whatever oyu want outside of the Demiurges prison
Do you think you could jerk off on God's face if you wanted to if you leave Earth? Or does God restrict that?

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>>42084779
>Monad
Jewish gnostic brainrot. God is a personal being, he chose to create. A blob of nothing has no will nor an intellect, it cant do anything. All modern men now think like Jews.
>>42084784
How could the creator be part of the created, silly pagan? A contigent being cant be the creator. All contingent beings have a beginning and an end. God doesnt, he is eternal.

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>>42084963
>samsara
Look the buddhist teen entered the big boi chat. You know buddhism is for women, right. What did buddhist civilization achieve? Yep, nothing. The whole world today uses Catholic institutions: universities, schools, hospitals.

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>kids in the west
>teenagers are all buddhist
>boomers are all gnostics
Sin darkens the intellect. Catholicism is true. This is the ultimate red pill.

>>42084964
I think I could if God wants me to.
What does Earth have to do with any of that?