Frieren herself barely talks about anything else. We just share her rage autism.

>>284597985
Because anons want to fuck them

>>284597985
Because of the culture war bullshit surrounding demons. No one gives a shit about this generic crap otherwise.

>>284598015
This plus certain "people" feel attacked when the bad guys are played straight.

one guy spamming plus people lusting after aura i guess

>>284597985
Because the "debate" (flamewar) surrounding the nature of demons is the singular interesting element of the setting and the story may as well be concluded in a thematic sense by the point Fern grows up if not earlier.

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>>284598015
this

>>284597985
Pretty much because the text and the subtext are totally at odds because the author came across an ethical topic that is actually fairly complex and subject to debate, but he didn't do it justice because he obviously didn't understand what he was doing. So, a bunch of characters made a bunch of verifiably false proclamations of fact about the topic despite proving themselves wrong in-universe. Also, the writing is just bad. The worldbuilding blows, character personalities are all some variation of flat & autistic.
All this + stupid people are annoying and make any of these conversations 1000% more annoying and retarded than they need to be, because there's lots of smoothbrains that want to weigh in on the nature of consciousness despite being barely conscious themselves.
Anyway, we've been all over this.
>TLDR
Bad writing on a philosophical concept. Plus a sycophantic, retarded fanbase that won't accept that the writing failed in that aspect because the author was ignorant. Also, despite their ignorance and being provably wrong with evidence from the series, we keep having these stupid threads because, ironically, stupid people are immune to all arguments; they can't understand what you're saying, so you can never prove them wrong.
I remember similar threads about Psycho Pass.
>>284598159
No its because they're badly written.

Because there are over a billion pajeets and they're mindlessly horny.

>>284598309
Frieren won you lost and got raped

aura the jobless reverse isekai fucking when

>>284597985
They're not, schizos (like you, no doubt) just keep posting the same copypastas over and over because they want to work up some kind of mob against the story. It's probably assholes who feel called out by what demons in Frieren consistently do.

>>284598540
No, they're just badly written.

>>284597985
Because you're mentally ill and bring up this topic every week.

>>284598576
you're badly written

>>284598032
retard

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>>284598309
Frieren haters talk a lot but never say anything. And they are the ones talking about bad writing

>>284597985
Is this the same faggot that makes the same thread claiming frieren is bad/setting a blank thread to hate on it every week? I appreciate your dedication

>>284597985
oikaphobia

>>284598159
>>284598309
Case in point.

>>284597985
Because most threads are made by retards that never watched or read it, so the only thing they can engage with is the topic they have learned about from the threads.

>>284597985
No one cares about the demons, it's just haters using them to shit on the show.

>>284597985
It's insane how much hate Frieren gets when dogshit like FMAB and Steins;Gate are just as highly rated while being far worse.

>>284597985
Because is mostly a show about nothing, is either demons or retards spamming "uoohhhh elf pussy".

>>284598787
That entire post was about how the writing for the demons fails. You can't refute a single bit of it.

>>284598971
You didnt say anything retard, nothing to refute. Looks like a gpt wall of text

>>284598971
There was no need to respond to me specifically, yet you were triggered enough to do so.

>>284599073
>>284599080
I pointed out how the shows writing fails. The characters make false proclamations about the subject of demons constantly and yet the writing never acknowledges it. Its awful writing. Also how the worldbuilding sucks, how the characters suck. You'd know this if you actually read the post instead of just skimming it because you're too much of a fanboy to accept any criticism of your godawful show.

>>284598866
Both of those shows have a decade long history of being fellated by midwits which makes them "classics" regardless of their quality.

>>284599143
I didnt watch the show,but I know you are a retard

Because there's an autist wood incapable of basic reasoning who constantly makes new threads about it, and probably some trolls who do so as well because it constantly baits shit-slinging students with guaranteed success.

Demons are the most interesting part of Frieren, unfortunately 2/3 of the show is Frieren remembering some useless shit Himmel said or did, and pretending it has some powerful message. So annoying.

>>284599217
See? He's already here >>284599143
Also, who's*

>>284598866
I like steins. Nothing remarkably bad to say about it, the mc was cool and it is the best time travel centered show i have ever seen (is not like there are good ones)

I never finish Fma because the mc is unbearable

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Did Frieren fixed the evil race dilemma ?

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>>284597985

Because there is a demon loving contrarian schizo that constantly makes the same thread believing he is being somewhat controversial that just won´t stop no matter how many times he is proven wrong.

>>284597985
Nothing else to talk about because everything about it is uninspired. The only talk of this show is demons or how gooners want to have sex with the characters

>>284599318
>>284599235
>>284599217
Literally everything that I'm saying are some of the most common complaints about Frieren's writing, when you look past the constant culture war shit surrounding the show. No, your right wing culture warrior Twitter account that hails this show as a masterpiece because of the demons doesn't count.

>>284597985
Should we talk about the terrible magic system instead?

>>284598866
Both of those shows have dedicated hatedoms here, Frierenfag. Cry harder.

>>284599518
Yes. How come the humans survived the demon war even though the magic made to fight demons has only existed for forty years?

>>284599538
>Both of those shows have dedicated hatedoms here
Which they fully deserve. And their fanbases are piss poor as well.

>>284599451
>No, your right wing culture warrior Twitter account that hails this show as a masterpiece because of the demons doesn't count.
I get the this is an anonymous image board and you don't know me or anything about my beliefs, but holy fuck this shit is the height of irony. I hate rightoids and /pol/scum with a passion. I just also hate (You) for being too retarded to grasp simple concepts that are both explained and illustrated in enough detail that there's nothing to misunderstand.

>>284599609
Dragon Ball logic, dude with a stick can beat the strongest thing in the universe.

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>>284599677
>"Demons only communicate to deceive."
>Seconds later, shows demons communicating with each other, to share information, with no humans in earshot.
Then this shit happens right before your eyes, you're too retarded to grasp the implications, and then you're back at it again next thread.
Look, I'm going to be real with you; I think you're a fucking idiot, and I think talking to you is a waste of my time. We've probably already had this exact conversation twice already, and you just can't understand it.
Sorry. You're a retard.

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>>284597985
I do find funny that they make a big deal over them being the worst thing ever and having no emotions, but them they do show them having emotions and later show that some wizards and humans are just as bad as demons or even worse (just look at how they casually and legally send people to their deaths during the wizard trials without a care in the world, how they basically segregate people based on power level or how the smug bitch killed a bunch of randos and people doing their jobs for shits and giggles), Frieren and her dead pedo hero saving the world for demons in the distant past didn't do shit, if anything it is almost just as bad but in a different way, magic users seem to put themselves over any other being and can find loopholes to kill others and/or make them suffer for cheap laughs, even between them if they happen to dislike other's ideology

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>>284599752
>the same op with the same shit again
You dont have nothing better to do?

>>284599752
>I'll feign to take it too literally so i'll make a point so I can manipulate people of this thread and somehow feel smarter
Hello demon. ---->oven

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>>284599861
Okay, so she was wrong, and she was contradicted. This casts everything else she says in doubt, which, keep in mind, this entire debate is just whether or not you take the characters at their word, or if you're going to use your eyes and think for yourself.
Frieren's word is already doubtful on this matter because she's biased, and she's already been shown to be wrong once. So, maybe we conclude that you need something better than Frieren's opinion? Which you lack.
Even the demon saying what he says at the top is contradictory since he's saying something he believes is true and isn't trying to deceive anyone when he uses language.

>>284599518
This

For a show focused in a wizard MC, magic in Frieren is pretty shallow

>shoot magic lasers
>magic shield
>healing

>>284599621
Same as Frieren.

>>284599313
It's because of the contradictions between what's said about the demons and what's actually shown. They act, talk and think like human beings when no human beings are watching them. Yet they're supposed to be just mimics that don't understand anything.

>>284599923
>Even the demon saying what he says at the top is contradictory since he's saying something he believes is true and isn't trying to deceive anyone when he uses language.
You are so fucking retarded, i cant believe it. The same thread over and over talking about the same fucking shit because your english knowledge is as limited as your critical thinking, a thread debunked every fucking time but you keep creating it every 2 days because you dont have hobbies or loved ones. Like, what is the point of setting a discussion thread with the same arguments everyday? Thats not how it works. Only to spawn 3 retards more that hate on inoffensive pixels because those are loved and not them.

>>284600098
You didn't refute the argument.

>>284600045
The show also seems to try and make this weird connection between having emotions and having morality or not being evil. The idea being that demons are evil because they don't have emotions like empathy or guilt. You can be a completely emotionless being and still have morality on an intellectual level even if you don't have innate disgust or aversion to doing evil things. It's not even close to a good enough justification for the demons simply all being evil.

>>284600112
I checked the archives and saw that the number of threads youve repeated is much higher than I thought; its not normal. If you are autistic, I think reddit is better for you

>>284600176
I'm not seeing a refutation.

>>284600202
Check those threads

>>284598637
You can literally lay out all of your arguments and reasoning in front of Frieren fans and they'll just sit there, brain in hand, pretending like you haven't said anything.

>>284600222
I'm checking those threads and the majority seems to be me repeating myself over and over and over because nothing of what the people are typing in response are addressing anything I've said.

Frieren amazing lesson(that involved getting people kill) was to throw a dog in a room full of meat and then go "look the dog eat the meat, I'm so smart ohohoho", the demon was actually trying to be nice and give back something but nobody bother to EDUCATE HER, and no being really really nice is not education. Easy top 10 most retarded moments in anime.

>>284600176
Dont waste your breath he'll just do it all over again in 4 days and everyone will reply to him as though they've never discussed the topic even though /a/ is dying and we arent getting any new visitors

>>284600045
>>284599752
>yes, let me drop the act in the middle of the human castle because I believe it's just me and my demon loli walking next to me haha im so clever haha there's zero chance anyone could overhear me or whatever
I hate when midwits latch onto such a weak gotcha

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>>284597985

>>284600264
Anon, do you think that
>They were talking about deception, therfore it still counts!
Counters
>Talking about deception is not the same thing as deception itself
Which nobody has an argument against.

>>284600326
There's literally a knight in the background of that panel too. It's so beyond retarded.

>>284600407
>>284600382

>>284600501
>I don't want to have arguments because I just want to consoom product
>I deliberately entered a thread about something I disliked and got mad! How can this be happening!

Demons are just highly evolved mimics. They're like a curse placed upon sentients. They aren't good or evil, they simply are. It is in their nature to kill, just as it is in a tiger's nature to hunt deer.

>>284600546
Who are you quoting?

Culture Warriors decided to adopt the subject as a very loose analogue to their culture wars so it becomes constantly brought up by them.

>>284600239
>and the majority seems to be me repeating myself over and over and over
We've noticed.
> because nothing of what the people are typing in response are addressing anything I've said.
Demons only speak the human language to deceive (humans).

There you go, that is the answer, that demons learned human language to deceive humans, you just don't like it. Everyone else gets that Frieren and Lugner were not being hyper literal and the humans part did not need to be spoken. Normal people immediately understood this yet you make a thousand threads and posts demanding what? That people stop liking the show because you didn't understand this? That it is "poorly written" because you alone couldn't put 2 and 2 together? You didn't find something damning everyone else missed, everyone heard it and understood what was meant by it.

>>284600590
That doesn't make any sense. They're intelligent on the level of a human being and sentient. They have their own system of morality too. That's like saying you can't hold a narcissist accountable for their behavior.

>>284600407
>Talking about deception is not the same thing as deception itself
Meaningless distinction. Furthermore, I don't understand what this means in the context of Frieren. Talking about deception can allow deception in different contexts; what are you trying to say?

>>284600620
>Demons only speak the human language to deceive (humans).
Okay, so then why are they shown constantly speaking human language to exchange information when human beings aren't around? That directly contradicts what was stated earlier by both Frieren and the demon.

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>>284600590
Wrong

>>284600620
I think op has autism, which is why he has more trouble understanding. It's not a bad thing or an insult, it's the only explanation I can think of

>>284600673
How the fuck is saying
>There's a difference between talking about an action and the action itself
A meaningless distinction? That's the entire crux of what we're taking about. The act of deception is not the same thing as talking about it. The demons are not using language at that moment to deceive. That completely contradicts what the demon and Frieren herself says. You are trying to over intellectualize this to the point of absurdity.

>>284600628
Demons don't really kill out of maliciousness/spite, to get ahead, or for thrill like RL murderers. They're mostly compelled to kill because of their nature, and don't seem to put that much emotion or thought into the act. It's just something they gotta do, like breathing. There are cases where the demon logically knows that killing would be a risk, but still does so anyways due to their compulsions.

>>284600682
It's a show for an audience first and foremost.

>>284600750
>Demons only speak the human language to deceive (humans).

>There you go, that is the answer, that demons learned human language to deceive humans, you just don't like it. Everyone else gets that Frieren and Lugner were not being hyper literal and the humans part did not need to be spoken. Normal people immediately understood this yet you make a thousand threads and posts demanding what? That people stop liking the show because you didn't understand this? That it is "poorly written" because you alone couldn't put 2 and 2 together? You didn't find something damning everyone else missed, everyone heard it and understood what was meant by it.

This anon responded you then. /thread

>>284600771
Macht didn't kill someone for fifty years. Nor did the demon girl for a long period of time. They clearly have self control over their own actions but yet the series also wants to treat them like mindless beasts. It makes no sense.
>>284600778
What you're saying sounds like the author is so uncreative he had to contradict himself just to explain things basic things to the audience.

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>>284600803
>I-its not meant to be taken hyper literal
Faggot. The demon says "Only one reason". They are then shown using language for more than that stated one reason. How the fuck are you possibly defending this shit?

>>284600832
>What you're saying sounds like the author is so uncreative
That's apparent just by looking at the manga and anyone who hasn't realized it by the tournament arc deserves the series.

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>>284600771
>They're mostly compelled to kill because of their nature, and don't seem to put that much emotion or thought into the act. It's just something they gotta do, like breathing. There are cases where the demon logically knows that killing would be a risk, but still does so anyways due to their compulsions

>>284600832
>Macht didn't kill someone for fifty years. Nor did the demon girl for a long period of time.
Their minds are completely alien from our own. They kill because that's what demons do, not necessarily because they want to. If a demon has an opportunity to kill, they will take it. If there are no marks to kill, they just wander around not doing much. They're a lot like robots, in that sense more than living beings, which makes sense as monsters in Frieren aren't really "alive" like you and me.

>>284600861
>Normal people immediately understood this yet you make a thousand threads and posts demanding what? That people stop liking the show because you didn't understand this? That it is "poorly written" because you alone couldn't put 2 and 2 together? You didn't find something damning everyone else missed, everyone heard it and understood what was meant by it.
>I think op has autism, which is why he has more trouble understanding. It's not a bad thing or an insult, it's the only explanation I can think of

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>>284600883
Yeah, and Ubel is often called a human demon by the fandom.

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>>284600873
How infuriating it must be to see someone more talented and creative than you, huh?

>>284598309
>we keep having these stupid threads because, ironically, stupid people are immune to all arguments; they can't understand what you're saying, so you can never prove them wrong
You give these freaks too much credit. Some of it is autuists just repeating themselves so they can have a "comfy" thread talking over the same points for eternity. Some of it is absolutely mods trying to artificially boost engagement which is why the Demon threads are not only allowed but protected

>>284600682
>Okay, so then why are they shown constantly speaking human language to exchange information when human beings aren't around?
Because they need to exchange information between each other.
Information is exchanged through language.
The language the demons chose is the same as the humans.
The only reason they chose to adopt the human language over another language is to deceive humans.

Everyone else understood this is what was meant.
>>284600731
Yes, I think he is so locked in on this that there is no getting him to understand. I tried a few weeks ago, no idea why I am trying now.

>>284600909
>Normal people
You mean retarded Frieren fans that willfully do not want to see the contradictions like everyone else reading the series has. These contradictions are so obvious, it's insane that more people haven't picked up on them.

The demons are stated to only use language to deceive. They are then shown using language outside of deception. This is a contradiction. You don't have an argument.

>>284597985
evil people see themselves as the demons and get upset that the main character kills demons

>>284600958
>Because they need to exchange information between each other.
So they don't even have their own language? What kind of retarded writing is that?
>Information is exchanged through language.
Yeah so why couldn't they just have one of their own? Instead they decide to contradict themselves immediately.
The language the demons chose is the same as the humans.
>The only reason they chose to adopt the human language over another language is to deceive humans.
Yeah, and then they are shown using that for more than just deception, which directly contradicts what Frieren and the demon says.

>>284600916
>Macht is an outlier
>Soltair is an outlier
>The demon child is an outlier
How much goal post moving do we have to do here?

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>>284598866
What a retarded post, FMAB literally has a schizo dedicated to shitting on it.

>>284600958
OP is an evolved mimic. He speaks human language only to get (You)s. No amount of explanation will do anything because he doesn't understand words, only that they get (You)s.

>>284599313
>Did Frieren fixed

>>284600916
>fandom
Irrelevant.

>>284598159
>certain "people" feel attacked when the bad guys are played straight

I would say it isn't so much about the bad guys being portrayed as bad guys, but more about how the solution is portrayed. In western society, bad guys are often given lenient sentences, and savages from foreign lands are imported in large numbers while we are told that they are smarter than us, that we need them here to do our jobs for us.

We have forgotten what our grandparents' generation knew: that we are the peaceful civilization, we believe in universal morality; and the others are barbarians who only pretend to agree with us for the sole purpose of exploiting us. There was a great post on Kiwi Farms about "Izzat," which basically sums up the situation as it stands. The parallels to demons are unmistakable.

>>284601299
This is more retarded culture war nonsense. Get the fuck out and stop infecting anime.

>>284599819
Based

>>284601299
Do demons have designated mana streets?

>>284601333
Not an argument. All you're doing is using our language for the sole purpose of manipulating us into not noticing the menace you pose.

>>284601260
>no argument

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>>284601369
Holy fuck the meme is real.

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>>284601299
>There was a great post on Kiwi Farms

The state of Frieren's defenders

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>>284601412
Subcontinentals never seem to be able to use our memes.
>>284601437

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>>284601473
>Admitting it
Lmfao.

>>284597985
because the show is shit and there is nothing else to talk about

>>284601521
>>284601493
>>284601473
No one cares about your retarded schizo paragraphs from a tard site.

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>demons are depicted as savage beings who only speak human language in order to deceive humans
>for some reason, a lot of people who have access to the internet are really offended by this
>"it's because their culture is literally the same as demon culture and they're afraid of being found out and treated like Frieren treats them"
>"SHUT UP YOU RETARDED SCHIZO PARAGRAPH TARD SITE BLOODY!! YOU BICH BLOODY!! YOU FUKKING BLOODY!!

>>284601737
>any living thing with human-like logic and reasoning, which the demons demonstrably have, should be capable of coexisting with humans
>the series doesn't really explain why they can't, other than characters word-of-god turning to the camera and telling us "trust me bro, they just can't"

>>284600968
>Demons only speak the human language to deceive (humans).

>There you go, that is the answer, that demons learned human language to deceive humans, you just don't like it. Everyone else gets that Frieren and Lugner were not being hyper literal and the humans part did not need to be spoken.

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>>284601780
Is this hate or a poor analysis of the plot point?

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>>284601780
>the series doesn't really explain why they can't

It's a good story because the author shows why the demons can't coexist with humans. The target audience doesn't need it "explained" to them.

>>284601846
>It's a good story because the author shows why the demons can't coexist with humans
>shows why

No, he doesn't.

>>284601790
>Demons only speak the human language to deceive (humans).
Okay, so then why are they shown constantly speaking human language to exchange information when human beings aren't around?
We're getting to the point I talked about where I have to keep repeating the same arguments over and over again because nothing you're saying is addressing them.
>I-its not meant to be taken hyper literal
Faggot. The demon says "Only one reason". They are then shown using language for more than that stated one reason. How the fuck are you possibly defending this shit?

>>284601995
You are unobservant.

>>284601840
I'm not seeing any arguments.
>>284601846
The series never sufficiently explains it. The demons have everything needed to change their morality and coexist with humans. They already have their own set of morality, there's no reason they couldn't adopt another.

So what do we do once the author decide to make demons evolve and learn to live with humans?

>>284602029
>speaking human language to exchange information when human beings aren't around?
You mean like when they are planning their next attack on the humans?

>>284602053
>The series never sufficiently explains it.
You fundamentally don't understand the concept of show, don't tell. It's like I'm speaking to a curry-flavored brick wall.

>>284598309
Demon lovers cant admit that objective evil can exist

>>284602087
>You mean like when they are planning their next attack on the humans?
Anon, talking about deception and planning attacks is not the same thing as deception or attacking itself. They're using language for exchanging information, not deception. They're using it for more than just deception, meaning it contradicts what Frieren and the demon says.
>You fundamentally don't understand the concept of show, don't tell.
The series TELLS us that demons are incapable of coexisting and yet shows that they have all the traits capable of being able to coexist with humans.

>>284602116
Because morality to them is just a way to exploit white Christians.

>>284602155
I'm not going around in circles with you on this any more. All you're doing is ignoring all contradictory arguments and repeating the same nonsense you say in every thread.

>>284602222
That's because you can't refute anything. Everyone who argues with me on this either completely ducks, dodges, only addresses certain parts of it, or completely avoids it all together. No one has a refutation for this because it's true.

>>284602254
>ucks, dodges, only addresses certain parts of it
Literally what you are doing right now. Fuck off.

>>284602284
>Getting so mad he can't even copy and paste correctly
>No u that doesn't make any sense

>>284602313
The fact that you even think quoting text on 4chan involves copying and pasting says it all. You do not belong here. Just because you speak our language (even then, we can barely understand your accent) does not make you one of us.

>>284602353
Stop crying because you can't refute any of my arguments.

>>284602029
>Normal people immediately understood this yet you make a thousand threads and posts demanding what? That people stop liking the show because you didn't understand this? That it is "poorly written" because you alone couldn't put 2 and 2 together? You didn't find something damning everyone else missed, everyone heard it and understood what was meant by it.
(>>284600620)

>>284600045
Even if that was true that doesn't make it a bad writing. Characters thinking wrong just because they think they know isn't a bad writing.

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>>284601780
>the series doesn't really explain why they can't, other than characters word-of-god turning to the camera and telling us "trust me bro, they just can't"
That's because the characters don't know why, neither do the demons really. It's been stated multiple times that they do not need to do it to survive but do it anyway even though it is to their detriment.
It is hinted that the purpose of the Demon Kings war was to somehow prevent demon extinction in the long term as guided by an oracle who saw the future. Demons are made of mana in the shape of a biological lifeform. In my opinion they were made as a self replicating weapon that grew and evolved into many different directions. Monsters being the original form that could be set on an enemy and Demons being an unexpected and uncontrollable offshoot. They eliminated Elves as a priority so they might be their original creator.
Ever see the movie Screamers where humans they created autonomous killing machines and the killing machines seized their means of production and started improving themselves until they had more or less sentient models but they still retained their core function. Like that but with magic.

I rarely watch anime or movies in general because their fundamental idea of evil is so poorly thought out
>uhh and there are these, like, dragons, and they, well most are bad right but this one shows remorse and

But here we have evil presented as an uncreative perversion only capable of copying humans
And they disappear in a puff of smoke when killed, they have no substance

Tolkien rightly wrote similarly about evil as uncreative and a 'void', powerful and corrupting.
Now I'm not saying Frieren is up to that level or correctly expressing an Augustinian concept of evil
But it's far better than any media I see or read, though I rarely watch stuff because it's so retarded in this regard
I liked Frieren, hope they don't fuck up S2.

They WILL fuck up the inevitable live action, you can bet on it

I mostly talk about animation and choreography but then again I don't read threads like this one that are basically twittertier moral outrage bait meant to catch retards like 284598309

>>284602408
>Normal people
You mean retarded Frieren fans that willfully do not want to see the contradictions like everyone else reading the series has. These contradictions are so obvious, it's insane that more people haven't picked up on them.

The demons are stated to only use language to deceive. They are then shown using language outside of deception. This is a contradiction. You don't have an argument.
>>284602409
Frieren is never framed as in the wrong for her beliefs or is acknowledged as wrong by the character in universe. There's a blindingly obvious distinction here that doesn't need to be stated.

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>>284602254
>Youf fan regiut anyfing i am a fenius fu all yonlyf dodfes mi. Fieren is vad becof ai font laikit.

>>284602477
The amount of seethe coming from this post is hilarious. Because if I was wrong, it'd be so easy to refute me.

>>284602459
>never framed wrong
She doesn't need to be? We are viewing story from her point of views, with points presented from her party and people surrounding her.
Back thousands of years ago people of certain tribes thought the world was standing on elephants and turtles, and there was no one to refute them amongst their people, because they share this belief.

>>284602459
Op since you know about good writing and you think great works are bad then name a few good ones, just to have more reasons to laugh at you

>>284601846
this, if you need to be explained why a rabid pitbull or a drunk monkey will eat up your face after seeing it happen already, youre mentally retard and should go back to twitter

>>284597985
because muttmerica unfortunately exists

>>284602502
(>>284600620)
This anon explained it to you very very clearly

>what do you mean the cute girl I want to fuck so badly is a villain that must be murdered without mercy? I can't self-insert into the redhead fucking them if they kill them!
Every single complaint about Frieden's demons in a nutshell. Retards should jack off before posting.

>>284602433
I have never seen that movie, I have never even heard of it. Is it good?

>>284601995
You need to think (when you watch something you need to think. Probably a jujutsu or csm fan)

>>284602531
>She doesn't need to be?
Yes she does actually. If you want the audience to believe that Frieren is wrong, you have to show her and acknowledge her actually being in the wrong. The series has constantly affirmed her beliefs regarding the demons no matter how extreme. To say that she's wrong would require doing a complete 180 on how the audience perceives her and her actions.
>>284602565
Okay, so then why are they shown constantly speaking human language to exchange information when human beings aren't around?
Third time now. We're now in the stage of repeating things over and over.

>>284602591
>If you want
and if author doesn't? Why would author want that? It's a story of Frieren the Slayer, not "Can I save every demon if I level up to 9999 in gacha Isekai". You are so retarded, I can't.

>>284597985
Christcuckery.

>>284602584
It's okay, kind of low budget and the effects are a bit hokey but it's not bad. You can watch the whole thing on YouTube if you don't mind 360p.

>>284602591
>Okay, so then why are they shown constantly speaking human language to exchange information when human beings aren't around?
So how do you expect them to communicate? I'm not saying that's the only way; I'm asking you how you think they should communicate. I think (besides it being easier to explain to the viewer) demons speaking the language they learned over generations is simply logical. But again, you've taken something too literally, which obviously isn't the case. I think it's a very shallow critique of the show and reinforces the fans positive view instead of showing something negative, which is what you're trying to do.

Guys, but what if The Thing was actually good all along? That plot is so shit, that it doesn't show why The Thing couldn't co-exist with Antarctica team

>>284602627
>and if author doesn't?
Then that's bad writing if she's actually meant to be wrong about the demons. There's a blindingly obvious distinction between these contradictions existing in the writing and the characters and story acknowledging them. I shouldn't have to explain this.

>>284602691
>bad writing
It's not though? It's quite an old trope of character not knowing all the details, I shouldn't have to explain this either.

>>284602679
Literally anything else than retardedly talking right in front of a guard while they think no person is watching them. Show them telepathically communicating? Show them having their own language instead of using human speech to talk to each other? The author of this story is so uncreative he can't think of any way around this problem, despite the very obvious ways of doing so? It's shit writing.
>>284602709
It is bad writing because she's never framed as in the wrong for any of her beliefs about demons no matter how extreme. These contradictions are never brought up and actually acknowledged by the characters and story. The only time the story ever legitimately tried challenging Frieren's beliefs, she was proven right again. How much longer does this have to go on before you admit this is a problem?

>>284602777
>It is bad writing because she's never framed as in the wrong for any of her beliefs about demons no matter how extreme.
Because she's right.

>>284602827
Then why is she clearly wrong about them using human speech only for deceiving people? Why is she wrong about them not understanding the words they use when they use them all the time with each other when nobody is around? Why is she wrong about them being mindless beasts?

>>284602863
You have also been deceived.

>>284602927
You mean the fans have by believing the writing is good?

>>284603036
The writing is good enough to get the point across. You have taken the show's conventions too literally and have forgotten the humans that it is meant for.

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>>284603097
No it isn't, considering that there's people like me pointing out these obvious contradictions that literally anyone with a functioning brain could see.

This one panel contradicts everything we know about demons and yet it's never brought up or mentioned again.

>>284602777
>Literally anything else than retardedly talking right in front of a guard while they think no person is watching them. Show them telepathically communicating? Show them having their own language instead of using human speech to talk to each other? The author of this story is so uncreative he can't think of any way around this problem, despite the very obvious ways of doing so? It's shit writing.
You are thinking very literally about a english phrase. Furthermore... what does it mean to deceive by speaking? First, you have to gain the trust of others, right? If I give you real information but I know I'll deceive you: is the real information part of the deception? Is it possible to deceive with every word? It's an extremely ambiguous concept. Basically everyone understood it, you are simply not right. I understand what you're saying, but it's overthinking. If they could only use language to deceive, it would be very ambiguous and would end bad; having a mental language or another language wouldn't solve anything (besides, it's not convenient for them in many ways). At the moment, it's something that's understood, you can't take every sentence literally.

>>284603136
You have been refuted and you don't even realize it.

>>284603136
But what do you hope to gain by repeating all this over and over? No one's going to change their mind because you're simply wrong. You're wasting your time, and besides, you're wrong

>>284603235
>You're wrong
With no argument saying how? Pretty much the average experience of trying to communicate with a Frieren fan.

>>284603185
>You are thinking very literally about a english phrase.
Retard. They say, "Only one reason". One reason doesn't automatically mean multiple reasons. It doesn't mean actually using speech outside of that one reason.
Doesn't matter what they were discussing. They weren't using language at that moment to deceive. They were using it for reasons other than deception. Talking about deceiving people is not the same thing as deceiving people. Meaning it directly contradicts what Frieren says.

Anon, tell me. How am I supposed to interpret what the demon says when he says "Only one reason we speak like humans"? Does one reason actually mean multiple? Does it mean using it for reasons outside of deception? Does it mean use it to communicate information and not deception? What does it mean? Am I not supposed to take an absolute statement as absolute just because you want to make it seem deeper than it actually is to avoid having to realize bad writing?

Demons being a purely evil species is good writing, and the only reason why faggots mald about it is because they wanna fuck Aura.

>>284603312
Not when they give them all the capabilities required to coexist with humans. If demons are pure evil, then they shouldn't be sentient. If the demons are sentient, they shouldn't be pure evil.

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>>284603286
im done

>>284597985
becasue pseuds want to sound smart, so they latch on to something they can argue in bad faith about, in a show about chick doing literal sidequest and things being as black and white as they can be

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Why Frieren fans are so defensive about Frieren's writing? It's been proved over and over how flawed it is, yet we keep getting threads with 300 replies every week.

>>284603335
>I can't refute your factually correct argument waaaa
Yeah we know.

So are demons real? The demon defenders make a pretty strong argument for yes.

>>284603331
>one cannot be pure evil if one is sentient
Jesus Christ.

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>>284598231
Konosuba did it first. Yet they never get shat on for it at all. This whole few minutes is just "demons" in a nutshell.

>>284597985
Only shounetards hate furieren
>inb4 frieren is shonen
I talk about the trashy and action ones like jjk, csm, naruto...

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>>284603403
And they spared no stops making the plant monster super adorable and cute, despite it all being fake so she could eat them.

>>284603368
>retards arguing in bad faith
>other retards replying to them
the essence of /a/, tsumari - you're all dunces

>>284603401
Yes actually. To be pure evil means you cannot ever be good. If you're sentient you have the ability to choose to do good. Meaning you cannot be evil.

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>>284603442
This whole little bit was a perfect encapsulation of this demon debate. Women fawn over the "demons" claiming they can't be that bad or evil, but whoops - turns out they ARE actually that bad.

>>284603368
Its op repeating the same argument over and over and over again when people gave him the solution 37 threads ago. The reality is that he is wrong, autistic and that frieren isnt very flawed. This reminds me to the fma haters. You can dislike it or think it is basic but overall is not very flawed. People just like to shit on popular things they dont like,even if they are good.

>>284603463
>To be pure evil means you cannot ever be good.
No, it means you *will* not ever be good.

>>284601473
>>284601521
this was actually kind of interesting but i have literally zero fucking clue what it has to do with anime

>>284603312
I want to fuck Linie, but I'm not mad about it.

>>284603544
To be sentient means you have the ability to choose not to be evil. You can't be pure evil if you have the ability to choose not to be. The demons are demonstrably sentient, meaning they have the ability to choose not to be evil.

>>284603368
Retards replying to retard bait. It works, so mods dont give a fuck. Goth mikasa>>>mikasa

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>Frieren's fans have to compare their super acclaimed show, highest rated anime in MAL with comedy Isekai to prove their point


Hahahahahaha

>>284603463
>you have the ability to choose to do good. Meaning you cannot be evil.
bravo /a/

>>284603532
It's me repeating the same arguments over and over because you're not actually addressing anything I'm saying.
>>284603593
Case in point. Nobody actually can respond to this.

>>284603612
>nobody can respond to my retarded argument
the fuck is there to respond? you're stupid, that's it.

>>284603639
>He admits he can't refute the argument

>>284597985
There's nothing else to talk about. The characters and story are boring as fuck so the dog shit demon writing for people to argue about is the only thing that can fill a thread.

>>284603573
>You can't be pure evil if you have the ability to choose not to be.
Yes, you can, if you always choose to be evil.

>>284603648
what argument, the one i quoted? okay then
>you have the ability to choose to do good. Meaning you cannot be evil.
so if we take for example stalin, he had the ability to do good. as in, he was physically and mentally capable of, say, picking trash out of the ground and throwing it in the bin, a good deed - so by your logic, he can't be evil
correct?

>>284603682
Like demons?

>>284597985
A dedicated spammer

Willful ignorance is the worst kind of ignorance.

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>>284603401
He is right, faggot, but for sure the average frieren fan or native Isekai watcher never touched a philosophy book in their entire life

>>284603702
Correct.

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This thread reminds me of when I was forced to help the kid with the bad grades at school. The poor thing was mentally challenged and a lost cause, but I found him funny. Over time, I grew fond of him. Thanks to that, more people started to know him because nobody paid him any attention. I wonder what became of him today? I don't care, but he made me laugh. OP reminds me of him; every week we get together to watch him say the same silly things, and he never makes any progress. So nostalgic, it brings tears to my eyes.

>>284603682
No. If you have the ability to choose at all, then you can't be pure evil. The fact that demons are sentient means that they can't be pure evil.

>>284600250
>the demon was actually trying to be nice and give back something but nobody bother to EDUCATE HER

Retard. Demon Chow. Future Victim.

>>284603768
define "pure evil", specifically in contrast to "partially evil", "mostly evil" or "barely evil"

>>284603756
>I'm going to go on a smug and condescending rant because I can't refute anything he says to protect my feelings on a mid tier at best anime

>>284603844
You've been refuted, you just don't like it.

>>284603836
To be pure evil means you can’t ever be good. To have intelligence, morality, emotion, and the free will that comes with that means being able to choose to be good. Demons can still choose to be evil (many do), but the entire species cannot be treated as evil if they have a choice.

That decade of "Muh Morally Gray" "Le Heckin Misunderstoodorino" "I canz Fix hims!" really did a number of zoomers brains

Something simple, earnest, heartfelt, played straight, no nonsense, by the books trope as "Demons are evil monsters, kill them" brainbreaks them

>>284603882
Nothing of what anyone has said here has refuted the argument. What's happening here is
>I make argument
>They attempt to make a rebuttal
>I smack down that rebuttal
>Repeat step 2 and say the same things over and over again

>>284603892
>To be pure evil means you can’t ever be good.
okay so circular logic, thanks

>>284603927
>I smack down that rebuttal
>shit that never happened

What if a demon decides to kill all the other demons? Would he still be "pure evil" from humanity's perspective ? And from demons perspective?

>>284603882
>being proven wrong and blown the fuck out
>refuted
pick one

>>284603927
>I smack down that rebuttal
lol
lmao
kek

>>284603898
Except Demons are not well written. You're so embedded in the culture war that you're praising something for having a trope you like even when it's done poorly.

>>284597985
because the only knowledge of them being complete monsters come from frieren and she’s a complete raging asshole whenever she sees one.
not the best source of information.
there’s bound to be a demon that will contradict her

>>284603984
For his next line, I predict "Le Frieren changed her nature, whynut Demons@@!!!!@!@!!"

>>284603954
>>284603969
Keep coping it's hilarious. .

>>284603966
it doesn't matter because "pure evil" is a retarded argument thought up by retards. there's no such thing as pure evil

>>284602777
Jesus fucking christ, you are so far down in the weeds you've missed the fucking forest.

Demons are just a race of human-mimicking monsters. They are the plant monster with titties designed to draw horny men into their trap. They are the sirens drawing ships into the rocks to their death. They are the monsters crying "help me" in the deeps woods to attract dumb altruists. They scam humans so they can eat them.

They don't need their own language. They are independent. They are monsters. They spawn more of themselves then go on with life - no parenting, no shared culture. None of that. So what if they cooperate? Wolf packs can cooperate because they are social. Doesn't stop them from being monster types in fantasy. We don't need a treatise on wolf monster society - they are fucking fodder for the hero to slice down on their journey. Orc are sentient, they use the "common" language. Yet they still attack human society in fantasy and look to rape our women. No one bothers making "peace" with them because the ORCS DON'T WANT PEACE. You can't live with what wants to destroy you. And this is where modern NPCs have a massive meltdown - they are told they MUST live with people who want to literally rape & kill them, and they accept that. That is why this story triggers them and forces them to issue copium and mental gymnastics in post form.

Frieren is right because she's been reality checked too many times by actual demons to accept any other narrative about them from delusional women like yourself who would rather be eaten by a demon that admit a demon is going to eat her 100% hands down.

>>284604022
If you have a rebuttal to that, then state it?

>>284604032
TIL Rape can be justified in some scenarios, who knew demon-lolcow was so based.

>>284604038
So what are argument recycling posters then, huh Mr. Smartypants?

>>284604077
Demons are evil and thus must be killed

>>284604038
>Orc are sentient, they use the "common" language.
this is great, cause there are orcs in WH40K which are LITERALLY some sort of genetically engineered fungus made for war, they can still talk, make weapons and vehicles and form warbands or whatever, and literally NOBODY in 40k argues that this somehow makes them non-evil or whatever

>>284604038
Demons demonstrably have all the sentience, intelligence and the understanding of both their own morality and human morality to be able to change their beliefs and coexist with humans. The series has not given us any reason for why they cannot do this.

They're "independent" except for when they constantly band together to fight humans. In which case, having their own language or way of communicating would be preferable and less retardedly written. They don't have "parents or parental affection" except for this scene I guess. >>284603136
The series tells us that demons are just monsters and animals, but animals (and other monsters) don't behave like that. It says that demons lack empathy, but their characterization is more like demons have the Evil Gene and are cursed by an evil deity such that their reasoning and understanding of the world inevitably misleads them into evil, even when they are trying to avoid it, and even when it's completely self-destructive and self-defeating for their goals.

Animals are not like demons. Wild beasts are not intelligent and able to communicate with other species. Wild beasts do not understand human morality or strictly adhere to their own. Wild beasts do not possess all the components necessary to adopt human morals. Demons do. They are incomparable to animals.

If the demons have all this intellect and self control over their own behavior, then it makes absolutely no sense why they can't adopt another moral code to coexist with human beings.

You're absolutely retarded to not understand the even more retarded writing you're trying to defend so desperately.

>>284603403
Konosuba is a comedy that is well rounded as far as anime go and when it comes to rating anime it's about right in the grand scheme of things. Frieren takes itself seriously and tertiary anime ""fans"" claim it's the best anime ever to exist so rightly all its flaws are out put front and center whenever people decide to bring it up

>>284604110
cool story bro but whom are you quoting?

>>284604159
They Demons, They Evil

Also lol anthropomorphism

>>284604038
Also
>no shared culture
That's completely untrue considering that they all believe hiding mana to be morally wrong and other demons dying to be wrong. They clearly have some type of culture to be able to believe this. This isn't even explained as being part of their mimicry since it's something only Demons care about.

What would Himmel do?

>>284604284

Fall for the inhuman monsters tricks because of a cute face one time, become emotionally scarred from the horror his own mercy wrought on the innocent and spend the rest of his life killing them on sight like a proper human hero should do

>>284604198
And it's better than Frieren.

>>284604159
>It says that demons lack empathy, but their characterization is more like demons have the Evil Gene
Both of these can be true. After all, they are made of the same substance as monsters. Their very essence is that of mana in the facsimile of biology.

>>284599752
>>284599923

Those are clearly lines that are meant to communicate that they lie to the reader and not lines that make in-universe. It's poor writing in the same sense as character A telling B something they should already know for the sake of exposition. It's not poor writing in a sense that this supposedly makes the the claim that demons only use human language for lying untrue.

>>284603573
It's a fantasy creature. It doesn't have to perfectly map in a particular logical framework.

>>284604892
>It's fantasy so it can be poor written
This is the level of Frierentard arguments now.

>>284603573
You really have no idea how morality works, pseud.

>>284605071
He knows how to get (you)'s though.

>>284605071
>>284605149
Okay then prove what I said wrong?

>>284605149
>>284605071
I'm noticing you guys can only do
"You're so stupid" in response to any of my arguments and not refute any of them.

>>284597985
Because nothing else in the show is remotely interesting.

>>284598309
Don't be so mad Demon

>>284605840
You're so stupid

Stop bumping this retarded thread

>>284606047
It honestly wouldn't surprise me if at this point all these threads are just op talking to himself

>>284597985
I just want to fuck Aura

We humans have to stick together.

>>284597985
because theres nothing else to talk about

>>284603136
Where is it demonstrated that demons lack a sense of ego?

>>284606185
Parental affection is something is that is stated they do not have.

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>>284603724
I have read the superior philosophy book

>>284604137
You are retarded as you mary sue protagonist Frieren as the same as Rey Skywalker. Retarded Frierentards söyboys

>>284606859
Based and redpilled my fellow ChadGOD
Frierentards belong in >>>/pol/ and
>>>/lgbt/

>>284598309
>So, a bunch of characters made a bunch of verifiably false proclamations of fact about the topic despite proving themselves wrong in-universe.
why do characters have to always speak objectively true? a character can never be misinformed? or have a bias?

>>284606476
Unless you've cropped something out, I don't see parental affection.

>>284606898
>why do characters have to always speak objectively true? a character can never be misinformed? or have a bias?
Because these are word of god characters made by the author. This is not some super nuanced work of fiction.
>>284606937
The demon jumping up and down excitedly asking for praise from a superior doesn't count as parental affection?

>>284597985
Idgaf I just want to say that Lugner is hot

>>284606957
Not necessarily. Demons are proud. Their society is structured around displays of power, and those displays being acknowledged. The child is motivated to seek recognition because it feeds its ego and establishes its position in the system. Failure to be recognized risks being discarded and left to fend for itself, increasing the likelihood of death by coordinated humans.

>>284602062
The day frieren's party gets the Token Good Demon is the day all conversation collapses

>>284607773
That's not how demon society works. The only thing they care about is strength, that's it. Being a useful henchman does not in any way improve their social standing. You're doing the same thing the author does and project human socialization/culture on demons even though they should not work that way.

>>284609204
Superior demons obviously assign some value to inferiors otherwise they wouldn't have a cooperative hierarchy in the first place. Being excluded from that due to failing to demonstrate value is disadvantageous to the weak individual. This is less cultural value and more survival probability.

>look like humans
>act like humans
>nooo, they're only pretending to do it!!
This shit isn't "for kids", it's for mass consumption. A lot of isekai or Japanese fantasy is like this. Very cheap, not hard to write, and it's newer than the one released a season ago.

At least it's nicer to look at than western garbage.

>>284598309
Blah blah demon words can't trick me

>>284606120
Fuck off blizzard

Frieren is not a work about whether or not demons should be considered human or where the boundary between human and demon lies. It actually tries very, very hard to tell you not to worry about it. Its all about human connections when ideals, perceptions, desire time etc don't match up. Demons are written this way so the story can have intelligent antagonist and so that their way of life can be shown clearly as antithesis for the actual themes of the work.

>>284598309
I don't care about this trash but defend your slander of Psycho Pass now.

>>284603819
>I just wanted to give back the kid to live in peace
Frieren just needed to give her education.

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niggers think I watch Frieren for the demon killing... but I watch Frieren for the Sky.

>>284597985
Mainly because Frieren is very middling narou-kei series otherwise, and a lot of people don't get that they are ultimately just generic jrpg mustache twirling baddies which are also meant to be a foil to Frieren.

>>284609890
yeah why else would lugner and that other (linie?) do aura's work? or aura do the maou's work? some give orders somehow. there's hierarchy.

The demon discussion is a rehash of the orc debate from Lord of the Rings. Whether or not orcs are redeemable was a big discussion point in LotR circles, with even Tolkien changing his mind about it. If you think the Freiren author arrived at the correct answer while Tokien himself didn't, I have a bridge to sell you.

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>>284597985
There are too many of them to handle all of them reasonably
They are organized
They are too powerful
There are no institutions to lock them up forever to see if they can rehabilitate
They kill and manipulate and destroy for seemingly no reason other than to perpetuate themselves or enjoy themselves
They are basically Mohawks from HnK but in a fantasy setting and not lead by freakishly powerful martial artists, I don't see anybody complaining about Mohawks getting BTFO in Hokuto no Ken except dumb peaceniks.

>>284611604
hmm both have their perks.
chinpiras entertain you doing "hyahha!", while some demons are fucking hot.

>>284609204
This guy is literally copypasting my argument from earlier threads and still nobody can counter them.

By the way, there are two of us. I'm the guy who came up with >>284603136 originally. The OP reposting everything is one who wrote this >>284598309.

We both have the same view, and are apparently the only Frieren readers with above room temperature IQ. I mostly stopped engaging in these threads because Frieren fans are braindead sycophants so it inevitably goes nowhere.

>>284610317
Frieren is not Isekai

>>284612022
it's native isekai

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>>284611576
Funny talking about the orcs in Tolkien when there's another native Isekai/ rpg fantasy/ D&D-like show that specifically deals with the orc debate, in the most bland, basic narrative approach possible.

Shockingly, both shows are magnets for low IQ racists, just like this meme >>284601412

>>284597985

Because liberals don't like the idea of an inherently-evil fantasy race due to their suppressed belief there are inherently-evil races irl.

>>284612736
Was Tolkien a liberal?

>>284604038
>No one bothers making "peace" with them because the ORCS DON'T WANT PEACE. You can't live with what wants to destroy you. And this is where modern NPCs have a massive meltdown - they are told they MUST live with people who want to literally rape & kill them, and they accept that. That is why this story triggers them and forces them to issue copium and mental gymnastics in post form.

This makes more sense than anything else I've seen including my own post.