>learn a little Japanese>dialogue flows better>jokes make sense>puns actually work>anime becomes 10x more enjoyableI'm sorry for doubting you elitist assholes. I don't think I can go back to English subs now that I've seen the light.
how do you get both subs to appear at the same time
>>285694086Cheerio!
>>285694086I'll watch it with Japanese subs if I can get both subs to appear at the same time and no Chinese subs.
>>285694152>>285696258You're in luck, somebody already made jp+en subs.>https://jimaku.cc/entry/2141^ download the "[AnimeKaizoku] ... ja-en.ass" subs
>>285694086But you'd need to know British type of english (not to be confused with other countries' english/engrish) to understand what 'cheerio' and 'chesto' means,... no?
>>285694152>>285696258
>>285696609>2160pThey're finally making anime in 4K now? Took them long enough
Where do the screencaps of new releases with Jap subs in episode threads come from? Netflix only?
>>285696609Fair enough
>>285697709If the subs are colored/styled with a transparent underlay like pic related, they're TV subs (from AT-X, Tokyo MX, etc)Netflix subs I think are all white on black, like the pic in the OP.
>>285698547Which one can I watch for free with the widest selection?
>>285694086>>learn a little Japanese >>characters talk like literal retards
>>285694086>be dekinai>still recognize when trannylators write fanfictionits too blatant too often
>>285699237If you just want the subtitles, they get ripped often.
>>285694086How did you start learning?
>>285694086The best thing about understanding jp is you don't have to fixate your eyesight at the bottom of the screen anymore. I always just thought it's no problem looking at the subs and the actual show at the same time, but holy shit it felt so liberating to be able to just relax your eyes and watch the show freely. I can sort of understand where dubfags are coming from , but experiencing media at their original language will always be superior.
>>285696609now I just gotta figure out how to do this in mpv
>>285702515lmao, dubfags don't even look at the screen
>>285694086>jokes make sense>puns actually workyep, watching shows in Japanese is way more fun partially because of that
>>285694086puns are the most horrible kind of jokes in any language that existI'm glad I don't understand any of these "joke"
>>285702806also sometimes they barely even translate what is saidI refuse to believe that English speakers are so dumb that they don't know what standard deviation is
>>285694086You have taken a bite from the tree of knowledge, and will never be able to walk naked without shame again.Welcome to the other side.
>>285694086I'm surprised that Double language subtitles didn't take offWould be great for language learning
>>285702872>You have taken a bite from the tree of knowledge, and will never be able to walk naked without shame again.imagine being this cringe and conceited about learning a language and spotting a pun lmao
>>285702859The translators didn't know what a standard deviation is, so they couldn't translate it.
>>285702913nekopara has an option for double subtitles
>>285702859TL note: a hensachi of 25 is equivalent to an IQ of 62.5
>>285702914What is this monkey ookooking about?
>>285703178it's the bottom 1% of humans
>watching love live superstar season 3>get to the keke episode>listening to characters speak chinese while reading subtitles in japanesethat shit was weird
>>285702859to be fair, sometimes you have to simplify the TL to get it together fit the timingjapanese can be ridiculously dense with meaning at times, what with each syllable being an equivalent of a full english word
>>285703694>japanese can be ridiculously dense with meaning at times, what with each syllable being an equivalent of a full english wordlol, lmao evenJapanese is less efficient at encoding information because of its grammar, it has to put a lot of syllables (which all have the same length in Japanese) on a word to convey conjugation. Japanese is also incredibly context-based, meaning you have to mostly guess what the other party meant.Just because you have one Chinese character representing a word doesn't mean you can just speak that out loud. Because the reading of a kanji is more often than not more than two syllables long. Japanese isn't Chinese after all.
>>285703934>Japanese is less efficient at encoding information because of its grammarsome parts are more efficient, some parts are less efficientgrammar does often look like a hiragana saladbut nouns tend to carry a lot of meaning
I'm officially done with the JLPTwill take it again when they add WRITING and SPEAKING
>>285694086>Know enough Japanese to know subs are often inaccurate >Don't know enough Japanese to watch without subs I suffer
>>285704158Nouns on their own don't mean anything if you don't have an action doing something with them.And to express those actions you need the "hiragana world salad" as you put it.On average, Japanese is bad at encoding information which is why it needs to be spoken faster to convey the same information in the same time frame.
>>285704235congratulations, you are now the equivalent of a japanese middle schooler
>>285694086>learn japanese>anime becomes benign
>>285694086>posts one of the few examples that require at least high intermediate to start enjoying
>>285704762that's when you start reading Murakami novels and then eventually you'll get to Heian era poetry
>>285702913Think romaji subtitles could also be useful?
>>285704663not so sure about thatfound this on the internetJapan-born Japan-raised 16-year-old whose first language is Japanesethey still failed a bunch of questionsI bet most middle schoolers can't do 180/180
>>285704800the dazai I've read (in english) has been pretty good, also wanted to get around to heike full novels in jp just seems daunting as an audio onlylet
>>285704879Honestly, Visual Novels might be a good middle ground for you then. You have the audio to rely on but typically all of the narration is written only so you have the chance to get used to reading prose.There's plenty of excellent VNs which have either only gotten bad adaptations or even no adaptation at all
>>285702739Like this:mpv --sid=4 --secondary-sid=1 You.and.I.Are.Polar.Opposites.S01E03.1080p.NF.WEB-DL.JPN.AAC2.0.H.264.MSubs-ToonsHub.mkv
>>285694086I feel you.
>>285704235Now take the kanken.
>>285704823How would a Japan-born Japan-raised 16-year-old whose first language is Japanese even be allowed to take the official JLPT? Isn't it just for foreigners? Don't they have the nihongo kentei for natives?
I've studied for like 7 months now and I'm only N5 level. I might be a little too retarded for this.
>>285707117You are already better than 90% of anons .
>>285707076Japanese citizens can take the JLPT if they want tothere's just no reason for 99.999% of them to take it thoughalso it's most likely that person grew up foreign in Japan since you can't juggle citizenships in Japan
>>285702739I've been using a mpv based player called memento that lets you choose one set of subs that show on the bottom and one set of subs for the top. You can also set it to hide the top subs unless you mouse over them, so you only check them when you don't understand something. Also lets you mine words straight into anki. It should work with all your existing scripts and configs if you copy them over to the memento app data folder.https://github.com/ripose-jp/Memento
>>285694086Well done anon, howeverPuns are garbage so I'm glad I don't understand them
>>285707117It never gets easy but it gets a little easier. Once you can reliably start reading stuff progress starts to speed up. It just takes forever to get to a point where you can read manga other than Yotsuba
>>285694086You're pulling back the veil that is localizers. The more you learn, the more you see just how full of shit they are and how they ruin stories with their bullshit.
>learn a little Japanese>dialogue flows better>jokes make sense>puns actually work>anime loses it's magic by becoming too familiar
>>285704348Same, but at least it's no worse than watching with English subs. At least now I know enough to be able to look away from the screen every once in a while.
>>285708643I don't think the bullshit is intentional, at least not 90% of the time. It's just incompetence and being dealt a bad hand of untranslatable puns, dialects, or kanji-related stuff like pic related. As I learned, I started to feel sorry for them.
>>285708643>>285709458if you want to get angry at a translator, read this:https://www.polygon.com/2019/7/18/20696081/metal-gear-solid-translation-japanese-english-jeremy-blaustein/
>>285707117That's about average I'd say.
>>285709563I don't need to get angrier. It's been a problem for decades.
>>285708643The more I've learned the more I've realized most of the time localizers and translators get it right. The more I've been able to appreciate truly great translations that effortlessly capture tone and meaning. Not that there aren't bad translations, not that there aren't examples of whole cloth fabrications, but on the whole things are usually pretty well thought out. And, by human nature exploited by monetized outrage culture, people are less likely to say thanks than pick small errors or stylistic choices apart. Easy to point out something is bad, hard to make something better.
Unrelated but I thought this was funny.
>>285702859Use of deviation to mean intelligence is not idiomatic in English. As always TL is correct and /a/ is retarded
>>285710358>>285709458Don't fucking defend these people. They've done more harm to Japanese media over the years than you realize. And they're malicious about it too. Yeah I know "not all are bad" but I've see enough.
>>285710886You don't need to reduce everything to us-vs-them bullshit. Localizers and translators laid the groundwork for you and I to even know Japanese media exists.
>Localizers and translators laid the groundwork for you and I to even know Japanese media exists.People for whom this is unironically true are now old enough to post here.
>>285711117Jesus, I didn't realize I shared a board with Matthew Perry
>>285710493>is not idiomaticas if someone like Hachiman would say some normalfag idiomatic linesthere is Yui for that
>>285711185I mean sure nerds overlaying subtitiles onto VHS tapes are technically translators too, but obviously not the ones that matter in this context.
>>285710886Video game translators seem to be the worst. Manga and anime translators are often incompetent but they don't seem to hate the content they translate.
>>285711358>ERRRM THAT THEM DOESNT COUNT>IM TALKING ABOUT MY THEM SO I CAN GET MAD
>>285711421translators are oklocalizers on the other hand are faggots who deserve death
>>285710358I feel this way also. Lots of time where I find myself thinking "damn that was pretty clever." I should start saving examples, but I'm sure it'd be a waste of time and the people on this board would tear any examples apart anyways because they're not translated exactly according to their own personal translation philosophy.
>>285711570Outrage culture has been the norm for so long that maybe it'd actually be seen as a breath of fresh airI'd read a thread of em
>>285694086It is actually incredible but >learn a little Japanesejust a little and you do actually start picking up on a lot of things.
>>285711570they may be clever once in a whilebut quite often they also get basic things wrong because English translators are also obsessed with trying to guess the context that didn't even exist in the original work
>>285710493>Use of deviation to mean intelligence is not idiomatic in Englishand then you see posts like >>285712158
>>285708723>anime loses it's magic by becoming too familiarif anything anime becomes even more magical because you gain the ability to watch / read / play untranslated obscure works that barely anyone even knows about
>>285711941Regarding context, the most common errors I see are ones where translators basically translate each bubble independently and lose track of the subject. This is more common in the world of manga. An example is the recent anime Ikoku Nikki. There is a conversation where one protagonist is talking about how her mother used to call the other protagonist "Makio-chan", even though they were women in their 30s. This gets a laugh from a side character about how funny that is, a very serious and introverted grown woman being talked about like that. And then the protagonist follows that up with a line quoting her mother, "Makio-chan is a writer!", and a follow-up about how she never got the impression that it was strange. With the 'it' subject being the -chan honorific. >それにしても 「槙生ちゃん」 って新鮮だな一ちゃん付けで呼ばれること少ないからな あの人>そうなの? お母さんが呼んでたんだよ「槙生ちやんは小説家なんだよ」 って だからほとんど会つたコトなかったけどそんな感じしなかったよく話間いたよThe manga TL messed this up because the translator was working bubble by bubble and translated the final lines to be about how the mother never gave an impression of Makio being a writer. Because they misunderstood the context of the second line's subject after it was split over several dialog bubbles and thought the 'never got that impression' part was referring to Makio as a writer. The anime probably worked from the script in bulk and the translators that time understood the context and translated the line correctly.
>>285712195It absolutely is idiomatic. e.g.>you have lower quartile IQ>my Rattata is in the top percentage of all Rattata>this is in the top 10% of incomeRegardless, it's completely understandable even if you didn't pay attention in middle school or something. You lose some nuance in just how bad the bottom 25% with regards to a bell curve really is but that's it.
>>285708723>>285712591a bit of both you get some deeper understanding, sure, but at the same time you learn that elements that felt mysterious and exotic are actually pretty pedestrianand honestly, English often sounds coolerlike when reading Blamein the setting that is utterly unlike our own culture, there is this inscrutable organization with a cryptic name Toha Heavy Industriesand then you learn that the sci-fi hieroglyphs are just kanji, and that 東亜重工 literally means "East Asian Heavy Industries" and that the characters have been referencing Earth all this timehilariously, there is even a real, boring company that goes by that name
>>285714010>cryptic name Toha Heavy Industriesnot sure what is cryptic about it, it sounds mundanethey made some pretty cool weaponry thoughAs for Blame even if you know neither English nor Japanese you can enjoy it just fine, it is not dialogue heavy and the actual plot barely existsIt is basically the Dark Souls of manga
>>285714241I never said you can't enjoy itI said it probably reads as more mundane to a Japanese personalthough I was surprised to learn that Killy's name is not just katakananaturally, I can ultimately only speak with confidence about my own experiences
>>285704813That's a horrible idea that accomplishes nothing.
>>285714383>I said it probably reads as more mundane to a Japanese personEven to an English person it sounds just like some corpo like Mitsubishi or somethingI don't think the author even intended it to sound not mundaneI bet that his intention was the opposite - to make the readers ask themselves why such mundane things exist in a totally non-mundane matrix-like world. Or he just didn't care about that at all
>>285714486I believe he said somewhere that he was inspired and maybe awed by these massive industrial companies that seem to make everythingso I'm fairly sure that it was meant to be a somewhat more esoteric and/or sinister version of the real-life thingit is a great plot device
>>285708643>>>/v/
>>285710493It doesn't even mean intelligence. It's referring to school test scores, not IQ tests. And even then, it's not referring to an individual's test score, but the minimum test score required to apply to the school that they went to.Hensachi is a status symbol.
>>285711057> Localizers and translators laid the groundwork for you and I to even know Japanese media exists.Trying to erase the historical importance of scanlators? Fuck off, shill.
>>285716588scanlators are translators
>>285708723>learn a little japanese>find out that character names often have a really simple meaning instead of just being a cool name for a cool character>character doesn't feel cool/unique anymore because the identity and personality of the character would have been obvious from the start if you had known what the name meantMakes me feel baka whenever that happens
>>285717845I know that feel regarding ahiru
>>285717845>find out that character names often have a really simple meaning instead of just being a cool name for a cool characterI was surprised once I realized when watching Kabaneri with Japanese subs that Mumei's name is literally "No name"Made so much sense
>>285707117I'm at 8 years and still at N3. We're all gonna make it eventually bros
>>285711185Actually the Dutch did it before Matthew PerryActually the chinese did it first if you wanna be real
>>285711941sometimes they're good, sometimes they're bad, most of the time they're completely unremarkable
>>285714486Mitsubishi's full name is literally called Mitsubishi Heavy Industries
>>285717985>名無しholy shit, she's literally called "anon" in japanese
>>285718729yep, she is our girl
>>285710358I think localization is a fun game for multilinguals to do to as a brain teaser or for fun in a group of fellow multilinguals, but I can't handle it in my reading/watching material. My autism pushes me to know the original intent.
>>285713352Jesus Christ. Is this a pro translation or a shitty scanlation?
>>285714960If you think this bullshit doesn't affect anime too, you're stupid.
>>285721112ScanlationReputable group, probably just a brainfart incident or the translator taking a break between lines pages and forgetting when they came back. >https://mangadex.org/group/d7c41f1a-0b3c-4fd0-a209-46151ca74bb0/hi-wa-mata-noboru?tab=titles
>>285721841It effects dubs I guess. If you watch dubs, you should also >>>/v/
>>285724392eh, dubs are kind of a different beast entirely because you're way more constrained by timing and lip flaps. but also lmao >dub
>>285724530My point was that it doesn't really effect subtitles.
>>285724656It absolutely does.
>>285724757>simulcast subs from a normalfag anime on a normalfag serviceAnd then you look at 99.9% of all other subs and they're fine.
>>285724867Anon, all our subs come from normalfag services now. Everyone just scrapes from Horriblesubs
>>285725001Doesn't really change what I said
>>285696258All Japanese subs are Chinese subs.
I've gotten to the point where, when watching anime, there's SO MUCH STUFF I just know the meaning of by ear, but it's mostly stock phrases and really common words. I've never even tried actually learning Japanese but I can often kinda look away from something and still know what's going on. I feel like this is pretty much as far as I can go without actually making a real effort to learn, but it might not be too hard to learn now...
>>285694152>>285696445>>285696609somebody should make a jellyfin plugin for this.
Alright /a/ what's the definitive best textbook/guide for japanese sentence structure? I read Tae Kim for particle basics and it's brevity and lack of extreme localizing is appreciated, but his insistence on dropping furigana to make you scroll up to his key to coerce you into using kanji preemptively and his constant need to make retarded analogues to english in an attempt to dunk on it or be funny really detracts from it.
>>285726006Yookosofuck genki, all my niggas hate genki
>>285726006Tae Kim is peak because his guide is terse and dense so your time is not wasted but if you need more get the 'A dictionary of Basic Japanese Grammar', there's also an intermediary and an advanced but I don't think you'll need it Jim, also there's nowhere to run regarding Kanji so just be a good boy and slurp it up.
How are current GPT/Gemini/Claude at jp? I've been writing my porn sloppa in romaji as training and it's been pretty fun, but I can't tell if the shit it's "teaching" me is in any way correct
>>285724757Yea, these days the only way to avoid these shitty dubtitles if a show happens to be a simuldub is to just watch the ESL version of the show.This is currently happening with Medalist where the English Disney Plus subtitles are dubtitles while the SEA Disney Plus subtitles are not.
>>285727412and we had managed to go for so long without anyone mentioning mtlway to ruin it, anon
>>285707942>picrelThere are websites with them, otherwise just go to Bookoff in Japan and fill your carryon with manga for next to nothing.>>285707044Never heard of this but level 2 seems doable except that it tests writing. Assuming the others don't, passing pre-2 seems straightforward.
>>285727812>There are websites with themthe issue is getting high quality rawsthe easily accessible ones are, amazingly, lower resolution than scanlations
>>285728376> easily accessible onesBuying digital is easier than pirating and yields better results. Yet a lot of scanlators use pirate raws because they don't want to support the creators.
>>285694086Elitists and schizos are ALWAYS right.Sooner or later time always proves them correct.
>>285728532>Buyingdo you get to download the images? because if not, then it's renting, not buying, and fuck that
>>285728844t's not even renting. it's like they show you the manga panels on their phone after you pay them and they walk away, and you can't call them up later and ask "hey bro, can i see those pics again" and they answer "sure but you have to pay me"
>>285728844It depends on the store but most have reader software that lets you download. For cases like Kobo you can remove DRM if you think that matters.It's not renting because you don't make regular payments. There are however subscription services to read manga magazines and volumes.
>>285707044/int/djt/ says kanken is for w*men
>>285694086The best part of it is that you're not locked into consuming only what gets translated. It means you can consume whatever you want, regardless of the mainstream opinion. You also get to find hidden gems that translator groups miss.
>>285729375>you can remove DRM if you think that matters. I do think that mattersI don't want to encourage drm and will not pay for content that uses it, even if workarounds exist to remove it>reader software that lets you downloadrequired proprietary app is also a deal-breakerbut if you have legal sources that allow you to download raws directly, then I am interested in becoming their customer
>>285729394/int/djt/ (and /jp/djt/ while we're at it) is a bunch of faggots, don't listen to them. In fact, don't even listen to /a/djt/ either
>>285729420DLsite has DRM free pdf for some publishers.There are solutions to rip from web viewers via tools like Hakuneko or user scripts though you won't get the proper epub format that way. Mihon extensions exist for a small number of sites but they're usually limited to chapters and won't access volumes or magazines.
>>285694086English subs are dog shit right out of the gate because the voice actors they always use are awful
>>285729490what did he mean by this
>>285728999That's chapter shit where you pay to access to (part of) a chapter for 48h or similar. They typically let you read the second latest chapter for free and give you access to older chapters without paying money.
>>285725261As OP said, the small gains are really quick.It may take many years and tens of thousands of hours to be actually fluent in the language without relying on a dictionary, but the hardest words to learn are the easiest ones to translate, you can start understanding all the untranslatable bits of anime and manga after less than one year of moderate study.
>>285726006There's no substitute for building your own feeling of how Japanese sentence works by just reading reading and reading a lot, but the best guide is https://imabi.org
>>285727812>except that it tests writing. Assuming the others don't,lollmao, evenThis is level 10, the lowest level,for 1st graders: https://www.kanken.or.jp/kanken/outline/data/outline_degree_example_10m.pdf
>>285708723>learn a little Japanese>dialogue flows better>jokes make sense>puns actually work>you can watch livestreams with anonsOn a totally unrelated note, Symphogear livestream threads were fun
>learn a little japanese>start reading yotsuba cause "immersion is important" and this is one of the easiest ones>2 chapters in realize that yotsuba's speech bubbles never use kanji, only kana>"oh. because she's a small kid and doesn't know any kanji yet"untranslatable
>>285694086I wish I had the drive to learn Japanese.
also, my favourite kanji at the moment is 感
>>285730611I think 咒 is funnybecause it's an alternative character for "curse", and the kanji looks like a frown
>>285708723>learn a little Japanese>realize it's a an unga bunga caveman language>appreciate the animalistic nature of humans anyway.
