What are some shonen protags that earned their spot at the top instead of just being the son of someone powerful or getting a huge advantage early on?Naruto is son of a Hokage and has a super powerful beast sealed within -> failLuffy (One Piece) is carriyng the will of D and is mantling Roger's dream, gets supported by Shanks from early on and happens to eat THE most important devil fruit and happens to be the son of the leader of the Revolutionary Army -> failYusuke (YuYu Hakusho) turns out to be a half demon son from a powerful demon lord -> failDeku (Hero Academia) gets one of the strongest quirks gifted to him and gest support from the number 1 hero -> failGon from Hunter Hunter has an influential/powerful father and is from an important bloodline -> failTanjiro from Demon Slayer: powerful/influential father -> failIchigo (Bleach) has an influential and powerful father -> failItadori Yuuji (Jujutsu Kaisen) swallows an artifact that is connected to the most powerful sorceror of all time -> failAll Jojos are literally from the same fated bloodline -> failEdward Elric (FMA) is literally the son of god -> failGoku, at least during early Dragonball, is literally just a superhuman alien but I think he earned his position later on -> half successFor a genre that's all about believing in oneself, the power of friendship,hard work/determination and fighting against all odds, the MCs sure do just get everything handed to them on a silver platter.Also why do shonen mangaka feel the need to always have the protag's dad be somone super powerful/influential?Pic unrelated.
>>285932537>literally blessed by the mountain godreally nigga?
>>285932448why would you want a manga to tell children lies
>>285932556Uhm idk if you knew but: shonen manga is mostly fiction and escapism.An underdog struggling to the top by sheer determination and grit is cool, not everything has to reflect reality in... fiction. retard.
>>285932554Just a gag, not a powerup
>>285932556>t. consumes copious amounts of isekai slop where some incel loser is suddenly liked by 12 girls because that's his fantasy
>>285932566>retard.that wasn't very nice, please take this back
>>285932581why are you telling lies
I wanted to say pic related but he gets help from THE leading researcher on Pokemon.While we're at it:Yugi from Yu-Gi-Oh just happens to find an ancient artifact that is inhabited by the spirit of the god king of playing games lol
>>285932448It's questionable if you would consider it the top but Emma.
>>285932640
>>285932448Yup. Isekai is the superior genre for blessing humanity with Yuusha ga shinda.
>>285932702Isekai, especially modern iterations are very low quality.
>>285932448I think you undersall how much some fail.Ichigo is half everythnig with the best traits from everyting.Yuji is a freak (superstrength that no one questions or notices) that gets powerup after powerup handed to him on top on that.
He even gets a handicap
>>285932815>I think you undersall how much some fail.Undersell?Sure they do encounter hardships but I think all of their achievements are hollow given their situation because they were kinda "predetermined" to succeed. I think it's even worse when the author reveals their "divine" blood later down the line because it just cheapens the growth.Yusuke is the best example. He got through on his own in most arcs until suddenly>ackshually, you're half a demon and your dad is le powerful demonlord, that's why you're so good ;^]Or Lufy. Would've been way better if it was JUST the gum gum fruit, and not some mythic level godhood apple.
Guts>>285932448>happens to be the son of the leader of the Revolutionary ArmyI agree that Luffy is definately a child of fate trope, but how does his dad being a political activist help him in any way, shape or form?
>>285932537Gintama isn’t a total fightfag manga, Gintoki being the strongest has never been the focus anyway
>>285932448
>>285932908>GutsNot a shonen, despite what /a/'s post-post-post-contrarians want.
>>285932920If you bring up these literally whos, at least make sure the first 2 sentences of their biography don't spill the beans.
>>285932448>>285932895I liked the way rainbow dash is this in witch in broad daylight because everything you said is backwards. Intellectually you know she's supposed to be gifted but in the story she's just not. Even finding the actual child of destiny was just because it would upset someone more fortunate if she got there first.
>>285932908>but how does his dad being a political activistThat's retardedly reductive since he's the leader of the most important anti-world-government faction and his devil fruit is so hyped up by Oda that is hasn't been revealed to this day.It's even directly relevant since Dragon saves Lufy's ass in Loguetown with those very powers. Especially in the world of OP where heritage has this metaphysical effect it's pretty impactful that Dragon is Lufy's dad.
>>285932448>Tanjiro from Demon Slayer: powerful/influential father -> failNo? The fuck are you on about, his father was a sick man who sold coal
>>285933032It's more about the Honkami Kagura, which Tanjiro got taught by his dad who in turn got it taught by his dad.Turns out the most OP breathing technique just HAPPENS to be taught to the MC - by his dad.lol
>>285932993IDK why he had to do to Sanji too.>what, this boy became good at cooking and fighting? no, he must be some biological superweapon with royal blood!
>>285933077That's the joke: I could have been anyone. Tanjiro just happen to be the random guy that know the dance, and Muzan by killing for hundreads of years eventually fucks the one guy that still remember the dance, but its not something that makes Tanjiro a special kid. He never gets stronger than most pillars.
>>285932640I dunno, man, any day now Murata will tell us that Saitama is actually a son of God
>>285933155Which would be completely in line with satirizing shonen mang-who am I kidding....
>>285932448It's part of the power fantasy for children (the intended audience)
>>285932448>another dragonball bait thread where OP conveniently rules out every other protagonist>yet somehow gives only goku a pass>despite having the clear advantage of being an alien from a warrior race living on a planet of weaklings>whose father also made a wish on the magic wish orbs for him
>>285933209even as a child I always thought it was bullshit>>285933217that's relevant for early DB but as soon as the other sayajin arrive Goku's advantage is moot, that's why he fucking dies in the battle against Raditz you idiot.And Goku isn't even the prince of the Sayajins. Bardock is literally a low tier warrior.So in the scale that later DB operates on, Goku really came from nothing.
>>285932448 Battle-shounen have that retarded "eternal underdog" aspect and the retarded "level-scaling villains" that are somehow always just strong enough that they are stronger than the MC at the beginning of the arc, but also not too strong so that the MC can conveniently just train/powerup just enough to beat the antagonist and then be the underdog again for the next antagonist ad infinitum. And yet it's later revealed that they actually had supreme genetics or talent all along but they "just happen to be a late-bloomer" or they "just happen to have their power sealed for plot reasons". For MUH TENSION they are made weak and entirely reliant on asspulls, but then the idea of them being weak after all the power-creep they went through and long surpassed the weak antagonists that had been portrayed as superior geniuses at the start of the story that completely dominated the MC at first, just sounds utterly retarded, so suddenly the MC had "hidden potential" all along, which in turn entirely invalidates the "hard working weaklings surpassing lazy geniuses" theme from early in the story.That's why isekai is superior. The MC doesn't need asspulls because the MC winning comes from properly established capabilities. The world is unfair and the MC just happens to be the fortunate one at his new shot at a life, like the koi jumping over the dragon gate and becoming a proper dragon. There is no moral preaching shoved down the audience's throat about worshiping and protecting the status quo, no metaphor for "being a good obedient cog in the machine" being the correct thing to do. Instead the MC is able to be the nail that sticks out and actually has the power to not get hammered back in.Battle-shounen (and frankly, the NGE movies ending as well) is the Japanese corporate society's wet dream of propagandizing impressionable youth on never giving up and always persisting in being their obedient wage slaves. Isekai is the opposite.
>>285933277Narratively, both suck.Watching an isekai MC be a super god because>he just IS okay?!?!isn't any more engaging than the shonen protag being a gifted son of a legend.One is maybe less convoluted but being straight forward with your power fantasy doesn't make it "superior", it's still inane drivel for Otakus to escape into. That's like comparing different brands of American fast food goyslop.
>>285933303But it does hit on the current trend of vice signalling.>it's bad and I know it's bad, le chad yes hehe!Very appealing to 4channers.
>>285932448I love the Broquest character designs. Does anyone have the pic of Nameless Rank and File Soldier pointing at P'orc Druid up on his shoulder? I can't find it on the internet anywhere anymore.
>>285933263You're sound American
>>285933277Isekai is kibble for dogshit humans
>>285933263He's still the legendary super sayian
>>285933379you are sound very ESL.Ich bin übrigens Deutsch, du absoluter Vollmongo.
>>285932448Tanjiro Is not even the strongest character in his own series...
>>285933395What does that even mean?There's no prophecy or anything, no divine blood, no deciding gift or advantage. He just kept fighting stronger opponents and became stronger in turn.If he is "the legendary super Sayajin" then it's not because of some predetermined path.That's literally why Bejita is coping so hard because he thinks that HE should be the one, with his royal blood and everything. In his eyes, the lowly Kakarot never should've gotten that far.
>>285932448Cid, with the powers of autism, strives to be strong enough to punch a nuke and win.
>>285932618His story if one of persistence if anything
>>285933277None of the series in the OP have some hard work trumps all narrative besides Naruto which abandoned it pretty quickly. Only Nardo was built up to be an underdog. Narutards really ruined all discourse thinking every battle shonen had some retarded hard work vs natural talent dichotomy(which is stupid to begin with)
>>285933505>which is stupid to begin withtalentless underdogs winning by sheer grit and determniation is THE best trope in all of fiction and you're a dumb faggot if you disagree.
>>285932815Wasn't Yuji borderline genetically engineered to be the protagonist
