Whenever it comes to addressing issues regarding anime and manga romcoms aimed at men, it is quite common that the first thing one usually mentions is how the male protagonist is portrayed as a "loser", only for the work to never give you reasons to consider him one, leading to narrative incoherence.You only have to watch the first episode of any of these to see that the protagonist, at best, is an introverted geek boy who cannot or does not want to interact with others voluntarily, preferring to stay in his comfort zone. Wakana Gojo (My Dress-Up Darling), Ichikawa Kyoutarou (The Dangers in My Heart) and Takuya Seo (Gals Can't Be Kind to Otaku!?) are a clear example of this, the three are easily protagonists with whom any introverted boy can identify and even more so if they follow their backstory.And while we can criticize how they always end up falling in love with the conventionally attractive protagonist of each of their series, it cannot be denied that each one has significant development as characters, becoming more open to social relationships with others and finding comfort in the company of other people who share or respect their tastes, and all this without ceasing to characterize themselves as somewhat geeky introverted boys.So definitely, the label of loser cannot be applied to any of them, since they never actively do anything that causes the rejection of third parties and therefore contributes to their involuntary isolation from the rest of the characters.
This in a way reminds me of the tropes that were often used in romantic comedy films of the 2000s, which generally featured one or more male protagonists actively seeking to fit into a social group that actively rejected or isolated them, regardless of whether the protagonists were good or not, which led the latter to want to prove their worth to the rest and be accepted, usually seeking to sleep with a woman, affirming and demonstrating that their manhood and her value as a person depended on whether she was a virgin or not.
you need less words in your shitposts bro
This is the key point people tend to miss when critizing stories like this. The male protagonist of the story isn't just the primary point of view - he's also the character who must undergo the most change in order to succeed. He is the character who must confront and overcome his flaws in order to find the happiness he desires.So he has to start off at a bit of a low point, so that he can reach a new peak by the end of the story.It's such a fundamental aspect of male-focused love stories in general. It's almost as old as story telling in general. It's the classic formula - if the brave knight wants to marry the princess, he has to slay the dragon first.And this is why the "main character is a loser who somehow gets the girl" critique can be somewhat annoying at times. The entire point is that the main character must prove that he is not a loser in order to be worthy of the love interest - or really any love or respect at all. He has no intrinsic value as a person until he achieves greatness.
On the flip side of male characters having to prove they’re not losers, there’s also the tendency for female characters to prove they are losers for disinterest to be justified. As if the guy should be inherently grateful that a girl looked his way (unless there’s already a fan favorite love interest).Furthermore, even though Shoujo romance is rife with the genderbent dynamic, there are far fewer complaints with an unremarkable girl gaining the one-sided attention of an incredibly popular boy.In both instances, fans treat female characters as if they have inherent value in romance, even in blatant self-insert stories.
>>287582333"loser" in this context just means "anything that doesn't validate the frail masculinity of the one complaining". Most romcoms never portray their male leads as losers or even introverted. They usually have no problem socializing, have their own groups of friends and have hobbies they are happy with. They are only "losers" in the sense they don't have a girlfriend.
>>287582396>This is the key point people tend to miss when critizing stories like this. The male protagonist of the story isn't just the primary point of view - he's also the character who must undergo the most change in order to succeed. He is the character who must confront and overcome his flaws in order to find the happiness he desires.why do the majority of romcom protagonists never grow or change then?
>>287582396Not only is this fundamentally wrong since different stories require fundamentally different protagonists in order to work, it is specially wrong for romance. You need both the man and the woman to be put to the test, otherwise there is no point in them getting together.
>>287582856Examples?
>>287582346>I didn't fail because I didn't try and that makes me a winner
>>287582333>it is quite common that the first thing one usually mentions is how the male protagonist is portrayed as a "loser"These kind of male romcom protagonists make more sense when you realize they're playing the traditional role of the heroine in romance, only somehow even more spineless and passive and showing even less personality.
>>287583782
>>287582333Tell everyone how much Raku from Nisekoi improved from the first chapter to the last one.
>>287582333My scope on romcoms is limited but I don't think I've ever seen anyone who had actually read the respective manga and thought the MC was a 'loser'. The people who put the labels on them are people who were literally never going to read them in the first place, like >>287583782.>>287582396>The male protagonist of the story isn't just the primary point of view - he's also the character who must undergo the most change in order to succeed.I don't think this is the case. Most I've read and watched have tons of growth from both sides.
>>287583782Female romance leads are even more spineless and devoid of personality than their male counterparts, don't lie.
>>287582333Is this the worst clickbait? You have to be retarded if you don't know shit, but is clear you are the skirt wearing faggot that pretends he has a wife.Those aren't losers because of it, they are losers because they are herbivores that don't know how to deal with girls simple as that.
I’d take a horny loser protag over someone who’s embarrassingly dense or adverse to something simple like holding hands. Being a loser or unassuming isn’t the issue for me, it’s how their awkwardness and meekness get taken beyond comedic means. There’s hardly anything male about them. It’s why I like Chikan Otoko the most out of any romcom. The MC is a loser but he’s not so pathetic that he doesn’t know what he wants and he’s not afraid of going after a girl. He actually has qualities of an actual male teenager
>>287584136>I’d take a horny loser protag over someone who’s embarrassingly dense or adverse to something simple like holding hands.That seems to be an unpopular opinion here.
I dislike how mangaka confuse being a pushover as the same thing as being kind or nice when there’s an obvious line
>>287582981I do not have to give examples of the herbivore because it means I do have to waste the time of reading this bad and evil genre that makes the Japan the weakest.
Anyone else see the irony here or should I explain it?
>>287584274So why the fuck are you giving your useless opinion on something you don't even engage with?
>>287584095There's no such thing as a "herbivore", a lack of experience doesn't make them losers. The point is overcoming that lack.
>>287584274A genre can't be bad. Only individual works can.
>>287584336>There's no such thing as a "herbivore"
Why are you all replying to this? OP literally just copied a reddit post
>>287584136If you don't criticize female leads forvl the same thing, you're a hypocrite
>>287584378And you know this because?
>>287584274>I don't have [examples] because [/pol/ buzzword] >btw I don't watch itEgregious. Tourist going all out.
>>287584374'No way, fag'-ing a woman is the chaddest, most alpha shit you could possibly do, how is this herbivore behavior?
>>287584076False. The classic shoujo heroine will generally have some fire or feistiness or spunk that leads to some friction or bickering with the male lead in the beginning. And if she doesn't, she never gives up despite all the hardships she goes through and tries to remain sweet and cheerful, and she will stand up for what she believes in. These female romance leads in shoujo are good models for femininity. The kinds of male romance leads discussed here are not good models for masculinity.
>>287585554And then he gives in anyway because he isn't no way fagging them he is just a bitch who is scared of tits.
>>287582333Nice post, OP! Upvoted!https://www.reddit.com/r/CharacterRant/comments/1sqhd26/the_miscategorization_of_romcoms_protagonists_as/
>>287585771>I know I have seen this beforeAnon, I find you guilty.
>>287585809when something smells like reddit you triple click it and google search, more often than not the top result is reddit
>>287585809Takes 5 seconds to highlight and drag text to a new tab to search the web for it, which is a skill lost to newfags these days.
>>287585937>>287585978Nice try.
>>287585771r/CharacterRant is unironically alright as far as most subreddits go
>>287582333Nice digits, so you get a reply.If it looks like a loserthinks like a loserand acts like a loserit is a loser, no amount of divine providence that is bestowed to the creature will fix it.If you don't want a beta boy bitchmade cuckchair warmer be called a loser, don't make him a betaboy bitchmade loser, it is that simple. Design a decent enough looking human being with reasonable interests, goals/motivations and not the most pathetic looking pile of insecurity sludge that exists to eeek-oook at girls and bow his head down when any male enters the room. He doesn't have to be 7'9 uber roided chad thundercock with 6 phds in full nelson, just a normal human being not human shaped sludge.
>>287584420>copy part of the post>put quotes around it>first result is a reddit post which is verbatim
>>287586351>I do this to all postsYou are not talking your way out of this one.
>>287586068The story almost never portrays these characters as losers.
>This man committed a crime and I have proof>HURR HOW DO YOU KNOW, DID YOU COMMIT THE SAME CRIME????
>>287586473I do this to posts that look like copypasta.
>>287585726There is zero difference between the average shoujo romance lead and the average shonen one.
