Project 2501 aka Puppetmaster is on TV!She's pursuing a career reconversion as an anchorwoman.Wish her luck!
>>290256072what a slut!
Did we get this scene?
>>290256124if you tickled her cooch, would she feel it?
>>290256151looking bouncy there, major
>>290255760Why does it want to be a human
>>290256166she wants to be alive. Not human but alive.It's just my theory, but I think it's because she's been programmed to be good at Conway's Game of Life (hence why she talks about giving "points" to companies, it's a term from that game)in the 80s it was considered really cutting edge in mathematics to apply this shit to other fields of study, information theory nerds like Shirow really liked this "everything behaves like a lifeform" stuff, pic related.
>>290255760Just what the world needs, another talking head.
Why Major doesn't hire any females into her group, is she afraid that she would quickly pump and dump them right away and that would bring scandal?
>>290256340rude
>>290256361she fears competition from classier, more gentle women
Sarutards are the new cancer of /a/, bravo
>>290256361Because she's the hottie. There can't be two hotties.
Puppetmaster is AMERICANmore like BURGERmaster amirite?
>>290256088would be a 10/10 with nipples
>>290256118Didn't manga experts say Motoko was born male? Why should she be reacting like this to bepis?
I will say this as much: I'm glad Science Saru adapts the manga version of GITS because it exposes its mediocrity in all its glory from the technobabble to the cringe-worthy anime-style humor. May this be a lesson to weebs who think faithfully adapting a source material makes for a great adaption, IT DOESN'T!!A GREAT adaptation changes the original material to fit a new art form. Copying a story word for word or scene for scene nore often than not fails because different mediums work in DIFFERENT WAYS!!The Shining? Stephen King is the epitome of human mediocrity but Stanley Kubrick elevated what was a mediocre novel into one of the greatest horror movies ever made.The Lord of the Rings? Peter Jackson took a dense epic fantasy and turned it into a concise trilogy. Those three movies are now considered one of the greatest film trilogies EVER.Shrek? More than half of the population probably doesn't even know that Shrek started off as an obscure children's book. And that movie is one of the greatest animated movies ever made PERIOD.Jurassic Park? The dialogue was robotic, and consisted of too many expository info dumps. Then came Steven Spielberg and he did his magic, and now that movie is considered one of the greatest movies ever made and birthed a multi billion dollar franchise, just like Oshii did with that mediocre technobabble manga by Shirow and turning it into one of the greatest sci-fi movies ever made PERIOD!Shirow owes his entire career to Oshii and thanks to him, he can retire and do what he likes doing most (like making blacked porn).>t. someone who actually attended film school and studied screenwriting
hehe neat
>>290256980You got scammed anon. They taught you nothing.Next time make sure you complete step 1 first: "understand the source material"You have no right to criticize the new anime if you don't even follow its plot.Pic related that's you
>>290256980about about you attend chan school and study postwriting so you don't sound like a fag
>>290256980>t. someone who actually attended film school and studied screenwritingThat's nice, buddy, can you tell the class what movie this shot is inspired by?
>>290256980you write like a faggot kys
>replying to copypasted reddit posts
>>290257028it's a small small world after all
>>290256340Gettin' real sick of your horseshit, Carlos
>>290256340MAMORU OSHII DISAGREESAPOLOGIZE
>>290257195Recognizing that Oshii was visually inspired by Blade Runner doesn't magically make a messy 1989 manga script good. Borrowing Ridley Scott's cinematography to elevate a pulp comic book is literally the EXACT auteur theory point I was making.With that said that specific framing with the silhouette against the massive window overlooking a towering, indifferent vertical city isn't just a cool Blade Runner reference, it's also a GOOD case of visual storytelling. It communicates isolation, entrapment, and existential weight entirely through composition, scale, and negative space without a single line of dialogue or clunky technobabble in the mediocre Shirow manga.>>290257198>Chainsmoker CatAs long as the world keeps cooking low quality slop, my will to live only grows stronger. Literally Beavis and Butthead for those that don't like Beavis and Butthead.
>>290257442>Blade Runneraaaand swing and a miss!unlucky!
>>290256980This post ignores that none of these adaptations work without the quality of their source material in the first place. it's tone seems to assume the source material is worth nothing and everyone should expect the adapters could shit out gold bars from nothing even if they didn't exist.
>>290255760I don't get this part.I don't get why aramaki sent an unvetted rookie alone in over his head. That seems very at odds with how S9 is handpicked elites.I don't get why they just offscreened it. Shame about the death.
>>290258381the Shell Squad is handpicked elitesthe rest of S9 is just trying to expand as fast as possibleand it's not like the guy's mission was to fistfight Koil
>>290256361She's actually the biggest misogynist in the group.
Would david martinez and motoko be friends? I think they would
>>290258511Motoko would literally Chauvin his ass
Why is she sad?
>>290258820she's gonna shove what in his ass?
>>290256166humans are the rulers of that world, while right now AI is considered an object that could be bought, sold, "enslaved" and just treated as an object. Thus by being recognized as a human it would be the first step to gain autonomy
currently watching episode 6. what happened to motoko between episode 5 and 6?
>>290256890even if that theory were true, she is confirmed bi anyway, so it wouldn't matter what sex she was born as
>>290259122she became momentarily heterosexualthankfully it's cured by episode 7"she's gay when her hair is blue" is very funny visual shorthand, though
>>290256980Yurifaggots finally realized even the funnier XD version of GiTS required brains to digest. Meanwhile GiTS fans can enjoy all versions. Feels good man.
I've said it before but it's amusing seeing anime/movie onlys react to the new series, you can tell so easily they've never touched the manga
>>290259120>right now AI is considered an object that could be bought, sold, "enslaved" and just treated as an object. Oh, so you mean EXACTLY LIKE A HUMAN in GitS?
>>290259365They certainly do it but it's constantly emphasized that it's illegal to do it and 'toko often arrests and murders people for doing it
>>290256890Maybe it has 2?
>>290256124>no nipples
>>290259525ah so that's why she's sad here>>290258958
>>290256199I was not aware Conway's Game of Life had a scoring system.
>>290256980the seething prancing film faggot is correct
>>290259589from what I understand it's more about prioritizing certain squares to alter the behavior of the cellslike "go get this square and don't let go"
>>290257477congratulations, with this pointless gotcha you managed to be a worse fag than the film major
>>290259732I'll take that W
>manspreadinguh uh, maybe she really was a man before...
>>290258381They made the mistake of assuming Yano could handle a tailing mission on his own since he was one of Batou's trainees and that Koil wouldn't just kill anybody tailing him.The only person to even ask if it was a good idea was Togusa, and nobody is going to take the grandmaster of KOing himself seriously.
>>290259849She's just proud of her custom cyber cooch. if it were up to her she'd lift her leg and take a piss to make it extra smelly. As a power move you see.
>>290256118
>>290260241If only somebody with that body type were around...
>>290260241how big was that cybercock?
>>290260533Here lies Batou.He never scored.
Would Project 2501 make a good girlfriend?
>>290255760This looks AI generated.
Honestly I don't care if it's pretentious or cringe or whatever, I love it.It made me feel like watching anime 25 years ago, modern anime just doesn't do stuff like this anymore.I should rewatch some old stuff.
>>290261419RUDE
>>290261419
>>290260241>>290260684Maybe she didn't know there was an option for them to come in "that" size.
>>290262114Sounds like what an AI would say!Can 2501 crack a captcha? I don't fucking think so!
Me on the right.
>aug 20 now in niplandit's Atsuko Tanaka's death anniversary btw
will we see tsunagi from the human algorithm animated?
Is the show going to be less than 12 episodes? Looks like there's only 3 manga chapters left in the first part
>>290262759I'd like that. She's Togusa's NEW WIFE
>yfw last episode's post-credits scene and this appears
>>290263037how do you make that work???
>>290262759Ew no
>>290256980I don't think Shiro owes Oshii anything. Shiro's works started getting adaptations long before GiTS. Meanwhile Oshii has been irrelevant for the last 20 years. He should be grateful to Shiro for getting his 15 minutes of fame.
>>290264108>Shirostop replying to yourself Anon, we can tell it's you
>>290264108Oshii was already doing pretty good with Patlabor though.
>>290262211Lies and slander.
I'm two episodes into the new series. What's the general consensus here and anyone know how Japanese viewers are feeling about it?
>>290264236Over here among people who actually watched it: Goes really fucking fast, requires rewatches to parse everything together, really fun otherwise, and makes ya think.By the way the intro of episode 3 was botched, then it goes back to normal.Dunno what nips have to say about it
>>290264037don't fucking disrespect the Tsoon you FUCK>>290264214If 2501 is so smart how come she ran right into traffic like a white girl leaving a frat house party huh?
>>290264491Ew, disgusting brat
>>290264817She's Togusa's wife, I'll have you know. As a matter of fact, she's his baby-momma, if you wanna know the truth about it, bish.
>>290264943>Delusional single motherAbsolutely disgusting.
>>290264943Picked up.
>>290265690She just put some dude's ghost in her womb, anon. It ain't like that.
>>290265773>some dude The fucking minister of Foreign Affairs. AGAIN WHY IS IT ALWAYS FUCKING FOREIGN AFFAIRS THAT'S TRYING TO PULL A SATURDAY MORNING CARTOON VILLAIN PLOT?
>>290256890Yaass! Trans Motoko is canon
>>290265773GIWTWM
Is this me or Major in this show is progressively turning from gremlin to SACtoko?
>>290266285Not really, but she is learning a few lessons along the way I guess. Next episode should be her at her most serious
>>290255760That's New Dominion OVA, right?
>>290266357yep.A ton of character designs are recycled from GitS in that thing
>>290266346I was referring to the design changes.
>>290265873Nobody would take it seriously if it was the Ministry of Agriculture, Forests, and Fishieries.
>>290266395Not sure I follow, she looks the same as in the beginning of the show, doesn't she?
>>290266411Season 1 of SAC it had the Ministry of Health, Labor, and Welfare.
>>290266411>Ministry of Agriculture, Forests, and Fishieries.I mean, have you seen the amount of seemingly banal anime that get official endorsement from them? maybe there is a money laundering scheme somewhere in there
>>290266490>Episode where S9 has to investigate an anime studio that's allegedly embezzled millions in MAFF funds and still has yet to make a single episode of "My Middle Schooler Girlfriend Loves Plain White Japanese Rice"
>>290264318>requires rewatches to parse everything togetherNo? Everything seems to be pretty clear. Well, longer notes may be hard to read at runtime but you aren't expected to anyway.
>>290267109I'm telling anon what the consensus is, and I've had to explain plot details to quite a few people
>>290259149>>290259487>>290256890>>290266173The fuck are you fags smoking
>>290267240they're shitposters from sharty, they have a very specific humiliation fetish that involves really poor, obvious attempts at trolling in order to bring attention to their fetishes.Think of it as a 6 year old teasing a girl to get her to notice him without having to admit he loves her. It's like that, except what they want is to be reduced to sexual slavery.It's part of their website culture.
>Some look on the soul as amazing, some describe him as amazing, and some hear of him as amazing, while others, even after hearing about him, cannot understand him at all.
>>290267581meds schizoGitS is a trans friendly animeread the manga
>>290266411On the other hand, something like the Ministry of Origami trying to suddenly take over the world economy would be really fucking funny.
>>290256166AI's are too perfect.Imperfection is the key to sustainability.
Folks, I'm gonna pinch the major's cheeks!
>>290267704>>290267581>>290268042It don't even work in lore
hello i am indian
>>290268617Good night sir
Motoko starts believing in God
>>290266834If only Section 9 had lasted more than a year before this week's episode, there could have been more time to put in more banal cases like this.
>>290268723literally yes, but God is more like some kinda azathoth tendril thing
Why is the thread so dead on episode day?
>>290259849those shoes look super cute in that position.
why does the animation keep changing so much they are giving these directors too much freedom
>>290263037Really? Didn't notice
>>290268116>Agency for Cultural Affairs attempts coup because the government cut funds for their youth origami classes
>>290269145yeah it's ballerina slippers, but she's sitting like a big ol tomboy.The contrast is great
>>290268959>Why is the thread so dead on episode day?Yesterday was episode day and 2 threads hit bump limit.>>290205203>>290233704
>>290268959we're running two threads simultaneously
>>290266834>My Middle Schooler Girlfriend Loves Plain White Japanese RiceI'd watch the FUCK out of that
What if the major was 3 ft tall?Would she be able to still do her job just fine?
>>290262759The first arc was decent, the next two less so.
is this gonna be 10 or 12 episodes long? can anybody estimate from the manga length? I don't like reading.
>>290269986She's able to do her job but she has to ride in Batou's coat pocket instead of getting her own Fuchikoma.
>>2902705782 more episodes, MAYBE three>>290270728very lucky guy, then. If he doesn't piss her off.
>>290270889>2 more episodes, MAYBE threeNice. I enjoy short animes. My attention span, you see.
>>290271041i know, same
If you call her Major, it means ________If you call her Motoko, it means ________If you call her Shousa, it means ________If you call her Miss Gorilla, it means _______If you call her Mira , it means _________
>>290271264chingchongchinabot
>>290268569it do
I don't mean to start the oshii wars again but I just watched 1995 for the first time. I did everything out of order (I started watching 2026, then watched Innocence because a friend spoke highly of it, then read the whole manga, then caught up with 2026, and once it got to the puppet master I had to finally see how the film handled it).Gorgeously animated, awesome vision and music, but that's why I was expecting something crazy when Motoko linked up with 2501 and there was jack shit. They smush the two puppet master encounters into one conversation and the only smidge left from the first one is the angel imagery, which feels thrown in at the end of the fusion discussion purely for vibes and doesn't hit anywhere near as hard as it did in the manga or 2026.On the other hand they did well making the fusion and Motoko agreeing to it feel more dramatic than it did in the source material, by literally having it happen in the sights of the sniper rifle. But the choice feels so much more earned if Motoko has first had that mind boggling spiritual experience that reduced her to tears, and then been ripped back out of it.Innocence is the more interesting film by some margin even if I don't love everyone constantly playing quotation tennis.
>>290271146>>290271041>>290270889>>290270728>>290269986Didn't she get a child looking body after this one became unusable was or was that just the films.
>>290271664Just the film.In the manga (and shortly the TV show) the temporary body Batou hooks her up with is...quite different
Now we've finally arrived at the Puppet Master shit it feels so out of place. I never read the original manga, but boy must it be a total mess.
>>290256980Okay so is it bad because the manga is shit, or is it bad because the manga was good but simply doesn't work in a different medium and changes would be necessary for the conversion from a medium to another, which is it?
>>290273157I mean he's pretty clear on it being bad because the manga is shit
>>290272124What was it
>>290274102Poor Paz, Borma.Is this official art?
>>290274102They're very proud of Ishikawa's windbreaker, aren't they?
>>290258820David chadtinez rizz that milf
>>290274102Ishikawa one (fashion) step away from squatting in a slavic tracksuit.
>Fucking humans
>>290264108>Oshii has been irrelevant for the last 20 yearsOshii could make an exhibition about his own shit on a platter and people would pay premium to go watch it.
So what exactly was the puppet master in solid state society?
>>290274274Poor Saito, forgotten by both the artist and anon.
>>290274102wow, the major's head is fucking huge.
>>2902627902 chapters for the finale probly, but otherwise it will be a short one.
>>290269235SS has always been the wacky direction studio.
>>290274102Ishikawa went to some haunted hotel with his wife and son, get possessed by GHOSTS and he tried to kill his family but get frozen.
Look this is Kusanagi's true face without cosmetics. opinions about it?
>>290275516
Puppet Master's host body had some great tits and resting bitch face
>>290275516I think she had spine implants, no way is it that curvy naturally.
>>290273304iirc some street punk who tried mugging them
>>290275560great tits but no nipples
>>290275789Here's hoping the blue ray delivers.
>>290276163>Blu-ray>2026Anon....
>>290271551Yeah, everyone dropping quotes all the time makes Innocence feel up it's ass, but it is a great film.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZyKKV3xvsY
>>290275516I will only fuck a gynoid if she has a working womb
>>290274536>fucking humans
>>290261456I didn't understand what anyone was saying the last third of the episode
>>290255760So the Puppetmaster unironically did nothing wrong? It was all the fault of that other Section? Am I understanding it correctly?
i wish the opening and ending songs were even half as good as stand alone complex. that's my only complaint. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BR7NlJ-HdWc
>>290256980There isn't a single anime adaptation that is better than the manga
>>290277403bravo kojima>>290277718well it's not like 2501 ever expresses any remorsebut yeah section 6 is behind it all>>290271551>thrown in at the end of the fusion discussion purely for vibes and doesn't hit anywhere near as hard as it did in the manga or 2026.yeah pretty sure that's the point>and Motoko agreeing to it feel more dramatic than it did in the source material> Motoko agreeingAre you SURE that's what happened?You might wanna rewatch it real quick.
>>290256166For the exact reasons laid out by the manga and the original film.However the major's motivation is twisted to be a foil of the puppetmaster's motivation, the puppetmaster's motivation itself is extremely faithful.
>>290278886if we're assuming the puppetmaster is being 100% honest in the movie, that is.
https://files.catbox.moe/s9w8el.jpg
>>290275560Why would a military android have tits? Do they house radar equipment energy reserves?
>>290282228Tits and a useable vagina are major military assets.
>>290274536>It was like she was looking at ghostless garbage
>>290282228That android wasn't made for the Puppet Master specifically, and from there it's two things.> Most people need their body to be human for psychological health> The general population responds to human androids better
>>290268723I was actually surprised by that scene, they condensed the original material so well that they got the point across more elegantly than the manga did.
>>290269986she just needs to enter the batou-type prosthetic body.
>>290276388>Yeah, everyone dropping quotes all the time makes Innocence feel up it's ass, but it is a great film.think about it, they're dolls pumping out somebody else's thoughts that are stored in their memory banks, it weaves beautifully with the movie's themes.
>>290284054Haha the only time Batou gonna have Major in him.
>>290278807>Are you SURE that's what happened?Are you implying movie Major didn't agree and got raped into the mind fusion by the puppet master instead? Or some third thing?I thought it was the premise in basically every version of this story that she consents to it. Hell all the changes Oshii made to her character, playing up her age and her existential melancholy, her desperation to dive into PM, seem intended to make that eventual decision more intelligible.
This faggot made 1 million views with the gif I made and that I posted herehttps://x.com/Level1Neko/status/2090097198927130968
>>290285419Maybe you should have posted it on twitter where that kind of dogshit belongs then. You could be enjoying all that attention from spambots.
>>290285419How do you think the Backrooms anon feels?
>>290285419Sorry for your loss?
>>290285419Think HIV positively. At least you won't get DESTROYED by HamonBeat like he will be.
new art
>>290285660her hair should have been more iridescent, but I like it.
>>290269908That's right anon. Now get married and have tons of children to tend to the rice fields.
>>290275516Oh fuck an evil brain
>>290280442Fun fun fun
Slowly making my way through the episodes, on episode 6 now. I like how colorful the show is, and they're finding ways to stay along the familiar story beats without copying it straight up, but I'm not connecting with basically any of the characters. One of the starkest differences from SAC is that SAC felt like literally everyone was competent. I don't get that impression from anyone, even Aramaki is getting caught off guard, but I guess stories where no one makes mistakes or is bested is dull.The tank in Ep 6 being an amalgamation of the T08A2 and the HAW-206 was cute, but it lacked the impact that the original had. I dunno how to feel about the series as a whole but I haven't been so turned off as to give up on it.
>>290256166It doesn't want to be a human, it wants to live. Under a physicalist approach to the hard problem of consciousness there is no reason to believe consciousness cannot exist on a mechanical hardware, and since our sapience arose on its own as our brains became more complex, so did the computers in GITS universe and from said complexity arose the Puppet Master
>>290280442Can any anons explain the significance of each image she's seeing?
>>290256980>t. someone who actually attended film school and studied screenwritingWhy would you admit to being a faggot?
>>290255760Rehabilitating villainesses is fun!Do you guys think 2501 would have an easy time or a hard time becoming a productive member of society?
>>290255760what filter is able to replicate a shitty VHS rip so well like this
>>290288145Between the Egyptian and Babylonian religious idols, the long black thing was a hypothesized alien craft that went through our Solar System.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1I/%CA%BBOumuamua
>>290288016>The tank in Ep 6 being an amalgamation of the T08A2 and the HAW-206 was cute, but it lacked the impact that the original hadthis is the original
>>290257195>>290257442Anon was obviously trying to get you to guess The Searchers (whether it’s true or not). Everybody steals that shot. Even The Odyssey did it this year.I have no idea why you’d guess Blade Runner besides sci-fi android plot. There’s no scene in the movie with a shot like this.
>>290288145Gnosticism, it's always gnosticism
>>290285660What are those?
>>290288016>One of the starkest differences from SAC is that SAC felt like literally everyone was competent.Funny reading this after just finishing the episode where Togusa massively fucks up going undercover at the definitely-not-autism home and nearly gets pasted to the wall.
>>290288491No.
>>290284947>Are you implying movie Major didn't agree and got raped into the mind fusion by the puppet master instead?Yep, that is precisely what I'm implying. I've been banging on that drum for weeks whenever the topic comes up.> Hell all the changes Oshii made to her character, playing up her age and her existential melancholy, her desperation to dive into PM, seem intended to make that eventual decision more intelligible.Not quite.It makes her decision to pursue the Puppetmaster more intelligible for sure, but when it comes to fusion, not really, because she was looking for proof that her soul exists, and for more autonomy. Losing her identity to fulfill someone else's ambitions is the exact opposite of what she was after.Anyway if you're taking her expression in this screenshot as proof that she consented, I suggest you take a good look at the Puppetmaster's proxies. See if you notice a couple of patterns emerge.
>>290288145tree of life>>290288491in a very loose sense onlytheosophy would be a better guess
>>290284232I'll go one step further:1- it makes the use of quotes in the first movie more unsettling and suspicious in hindsight2- it weaves into another theme: the inability to directly access somebody else's feelings and thoughts. You always need to use a medium between you and someone else. Quotes are a really clunky way of doing that, and it's not the only one that the movie showcases
>>290288016The fact that they all fuck up at some point is intentional.Ever since Appleseed volume 1 Shirow has been very eager to show that long-term plans and one-size-fits-all solutions never work, because something unpredictable always happens and nobody's perfect. Instead you need to improvise and adapt, which is what Section 9 does all the time.Think of it as a lifeform trying to survive and expand.
>>290288887I wish the pupper master would rape me too
>>290289344Sorry, that one's reformed, she's a good girl now. No more rapings.You gotta post the movie one, the one with a macho voice. Then you can get some rape going.
This is cereal experiment lain?
>>290289870hello slopanoncan I get uuuuuuuuuuuuha gen of the movie version of Motoko over here>>290284947doing this face?
>>290289870now do aramaki dressed as gendo, batou as shinji, and togusa as kaworu
>>290288381That's a screencap from a DVDrip of a 1990s OVA, no filters.The DVD just isn't super detailed, it hasn't been remastered.
>>290288887If it's just going to forcibly fuse with her, why did they include the part where it spends five minutes giving her the whole spiel explaining its motives and asking very nicely? Isn't the point that it's intelligent enough and knows her well enough to know she'll agree?The ambiguity about whether she actually loses out in the deal also seems, again, completely intentional and central to the dilemma, not something that can be conveniently shut down with subtle context clues.
>>290289527>she's a good girl now.Quotes from raped spook.
>>290290530He's so happy he gets to type.
>>290291294He's just like me fr
>>290256980>cringe-worthy anime-style humorimagine saying this on an anime site
>>290291294Why do so many shady scientists have long noses? I'm starting to notice
>>290290884good questions all around>why did they include the part where it spends five minutes giving her the whole spiel explaining its motives and asking very nicely? Because it's easier if the target agrees, same reason why the SimExes it feeds people play into their personal fantasies instead of being 100% original. I'm not implying that rape was the Puppetmaster's #1 priority, by the way, but what we see is that it resorts to more and more extreme measures to remain in control as the conversation continues.first it controls her bodythen it freezes her audio and visionthen it cuts Batou's monitorthen it freezes Batou's armAnd when all of that still isn't enough and Motoko keeps biding for time, while the S6 helicopters are overhead, it just goes "fuck it" and takes over her mind.>Isn't the point that it's intelligent enough and knows her well enough to know she'll agree?Well she doesn't agree so evidently it didn't know her that well.>The ambiguity about whether she actually loses out in the deal also seems, again, completely intentional and central to the dilemma, not something that can be conveniently shut down with subtle context clues.I didn't put those context clues in the movie, Oshii did. I'm picking up what he put down. Besides, it's not much of a dilemma if you don't get to say "yes" or "no" before it happens, is it?It's also quite possible that the merge wasn't complete: the puppetmaster was decapitated almost immediately; we don't know how much worse it could have gotten.
Why blow up the puppet master?Why did he all of a sudden grow a body to use and then move towards S9? What was it running on before if it came into existence into the sea of information spontaneously?How is it even possible that it didn't die on the spot when blown up?
>>290291559>Why blow up the puppet master?to destroy evidence>Why did he all of a sudden grow a body to use and then move towards S9?to seek protection from S6, it knows S9 are the best of the best. it had to build a body because S6 tried to trap it into a blank cyberbrain, so it constructed a body around it to escape>What was it running on before if it came into existence into the sea of information spontaneously?servers and cyberbrains of various people, if I recall.>How is it even possible that it didn't die on the spot when blown up?just enough hardware left
>>290291727>S6 tried to trap it into a blank cyberbrainWhat, when? It's always just been hacked proxies showing up so far, this is the first we time it appears as in person.
>>290291559>Why blow up the puppet master?The puppet master was key to all S6's extremely illegal manipulations of world markets and politics, letting it get out and start blabbing about those things was kind of a liability.I guess the reason it sought out S9 specifically is a spoiler if you've never seen any version of this story adapted before, or read this thread, but it'll be obvious by the last episode.
FAT Project 2501 behind.
>>290291973what a LEWD MK Ultra robot
>>290290530>batou as shinji, and togusa as kaworuMega gay
>>290291797yeah I know, the guys from ep 2 and 3 just had their memories fucked with, I'm not saying they were 2501 in the flesh.But the fact is, visibly you can run 2501.exe on a regular cyberbrain. The system specs are very reasonable. Not much bloatware going on despite the FAT ass as seen here>>290291973
>>290292493Visibly you can run project 2501 on a prayer and scrap metal even.
>>290292567 Post-ascencion yeah. It's played as a joke in the manga but it seems like she's taken refuge in a bisque doll. But then Togusa had it exorcised so she went "fuck, back to Motoko I guess..."
>>290288016>they're finding ways to stay along the familiar story beats without copying it straight upbruh
>>290292756What an ugly kid
>>290293172Please understand, her dad is a rookie.
>>290293302Rookie of the year.
>>290278720Oshii GITS
Truly GITS was never worth anything and the movie was the only reason it became notorious to anyone without shit taste, lel
>>290294474>>290294345but you haven't even seen the movie...
>>290264194Only the first patlabor movie was good and the 2nd one bombed financially
>>290268799Not like we get anime that lasts longer than three or four months at a time anyway.
From what I've gathered there are two nets? One is just the internet and the other is some weird miltiversal force connecting all living things, and the term is used interchangeably for both?
>>290294754I did
>>290295745Usually the former is pluralized in most translations to avoid confusion. They go "the nets" or "the networks". Here they didn't I guess.But the capital N Net is indeed a cosmic force that connects all things and has existed for millions of years (if not forever)
>>290295359I liked patlabor 2 and 3
>>290295890Are the movies the only Patlabor related thing you've ever watched or read?
>>290295745Yes. And from what I understand, the latter network is the universal electromagnetic one or more likely the "unified field theory" force's network
>>290296061well it's made of yin and yang so it's really the kooky david lynch interpretation of that concept
>>290293302>>290294166He's been in the section for a few years now, surely he's no longer a rookie.
>>290296401they'll give him a rookie of his own to make him feel less like a rookiea really dumb guy who looks like Kramer and acts like him too
>>290295466In-world, I mean. Shell Squad's first mission we know of was, what, March 2029? The status quo of the whole series is being shaken up massively, and we're only about halfway through 2030!
>>290288564
>>290296713Hey if all of Detective Conan can take place in under a year...
>>290296142It's better to not try to understand.
>2501 started archiving Section 6 logs 183 days ago in order to leak them to section 9THAT WAS BEFORE THE SECOND EPISODE2501 WAS A GOOD GIRL ALL ALONGSHE WANTED TO DEFECT FROM DAY 1holy fucking kino
>>290297129No that part is the easy part.The tough part is understanding exactly how the Naga reactor is supposed to work and more importantly why it DOESN'T work.That's tough.
>>290297602Kissing good girl 2501!
>>290297752I mean you can't do much else with her, she's only got her mouth left...
>>290297822I'll get her a new body, silly.
>>290277691something something about the meaning and origin of life and matter, as hinted in the scene where the puppet master was captured and made a reference to primordial soup
>The puppetmaster runs out of batteries>her consciousness disintegrates>she taps into Motoko's brainwave as a last-ditch attempt to survive>disintegrates anyway>her consciousness reappears out of fucking nowhere.>Motoko thinks it might be some weird electrical phenomenon or someshit.>Turns out it's basically the Force.> now they're both ghosts in the traditional sense of the word.Motoko Kusanagi is now Lisa Lightsaber.Bravo Shirow.
>>290288016daily reminder batou fucks up in episode 1 of sac.
Which shirow manga should I read next after GITS? Appleseed? I just need more of him
>>290298293The obvious answer would be Appleseed, yes, it's the closest in tone and contents to GitS and is also the most obvious sequel to the Koukaku Kidoutai franchise, lots of SWAT action and geopolitics and mutants and musings about SOCIETY and LIFE that resonnate with GitSThere's the GitS sequels: Human Error Processor and Man-Machine Interface. One is grounded, the other is fucking bonkers, most people myself included find them a bit underwhelmingI personally would recommend Orion if you wanna know more about the weird supernatural shit, and its moral implications. It's also got really really goofy characters and tons of high spectacle actionIf you just want goofy cops doing goofy shit, Dominion and especially Dominion Conflict. I think Dominion Conflict is his best manga. But it doesn't fit well in the chronology
>>290298293Appleseed or Dominion if you're looking for something close to GITS. Might as well read all of his manga if you like it since everything except Appleseed is short.
>>290256980>t. someone who actually attended film school and studied screenwritinghow did that work out for you anon?
>>290298550>>290298589Thanks. I've read 1.5 and 2 already, I wouldn't be so foolish as to ask otherwise.
>>290299001if 2.0 didn't freak you out too much with all the technobabble, you'll be fine with Orion.
>>290288416>this is the originalIf he knows the tank models then he knows that and is baiting.>>290298285>daily reminder batou fucks up in episode 1 of sac.I wouldn't call it a fuck up because it is such a non standard thing and it is not like any checks for it moving forward. It's like when a character in a spy show is chided by everyone for forgetting to check a dead bad guys teeth for cyanide capsules even though no one has checked for them before or after that episode. At least no one gives Batou shit for it.
So this guy's name is translated as '"Krolden" Which I guess sounds vaguely Polish.But I read somewhere that a better translation would be "Kurilldin" which would make sense since the action is taking place in the Kurill islands.Can any moonrunes-speakers tell me if that's accurate?
God I love Shirow’s works. He’s earned the right to make blacked porn for the rest of his life.
>>290301602>God I love Shirow’s works.PROVE IT
>>290280442this part was pre evangelion in terms of mindfuckeryhideaki took notes here
>>290302030well they added a lot of shit there that wasn't in the manga, in order to make the point clearer
>>290300741I think you mean a name like Kyrill? As a German I think Krolden sounds kinda Durch but not Polish. No idea about Kurilldin
>>290300266>At least no one gives Batou shit for it.They don't show it but they were indeed making fun of him for it.
>>290256088>No nipples unlike the manga We MAPPA's Ranma now, I see, no nipples looks dumber than swimsuit censorship
>>290302819well, swimsuit censorship was sexy, so nipples would have looked worse than it did.
>>290302819Just put them on with your imagination like the women have been doing.
>>290268723>No nipples
>>290300741Is it his name or his moniker? Król is a Polish surname meaning King, and denn being Old English for pasture (mainly for pigs), which was changed to den when suffixing it to a place name (and came to mean woodland pasture, which is where you would keep a pig). King of the Pig Den or King Pig (in his) Den, kind of sounds like an unintentional bastardization of the transliteration, but could also be a masterful pun (as in the "King", some retard who thinks to highly of himself, went into the pig pen, and didn't make it out). What does he look like in SAC? As krol can be a nickname that means curly (in Dutch I guess).Anyway, if it can be trusted, the 2026 actor's Japanese wikipedia page has him credited as:>クãƒãƒ«ãƒ‡ãƒ³>KurorudenAnd shoving that into Google translate gives:>ChlordaneWhich apparently is a man-made organochlorine chemical mixture once used widely as a broad-spectrum insecticide. Which seems more like something a Japanese author might research and use as a name.
>>290302880that's manga-accurate, however. Ghosts are nippleless
>>290276163HAHAHA!!! Science Saru doesn't do nipples, idiot what you see is what you get, that's how it is for most anime that goes directly to streaming now
>>290255760>Censored the nipples Bravo Science Saru, very manga accurate, very brave
>>290303008
>>290302894>Król is a Polish surname meaning KingYeah that's what I was thinking at first too.>Which apparently is a man-made organochlorine chemical mixture once used widely as a broad-spectrum insecticide. Which seems more like something a Japanese author might research and use as a name.Shirow literally had the dogs in GitS 1.5 named after some chemical solutionso also a good explanation
>>290303020not censored>>290302898
>>290288145Sun HatIncense burnerFetusEarthWorm thingsome kind of maskCaduceusdon't knowdon't knowsunflowersJapanese festival lanterns and flagswhat appears to be a star formation nebuladon't knowDandelion seedsThe Puppetmastera quantum chemical electron density and electrostatic potential plot of the non-classical 2-norbornyl cation, illustrating a symmetrically bridged three-center, two-electron carbon bonding system.Chinese terra cotta figurine, I know I've seen it beforea Sumerian or Babylonian terra cotta figurineno ideaHathorOumuamuatwo Assyrian reliefs of genies using the pine cone of ritual purificationno ideaQuetzalcoatlAztec corn godNoh maskno fucking clueJupiterwhalesno ideahummingbirdDNAmore Assyrian imagery of ritual purification
>>290303008>>290303020Not only the nipple removal, but the boobs' shape looks like shit in the anime as well
>>290303008>>290303094>*Claim to be "le manga accurate"* >*Make Puppet Master look like the 90s movie version but with censored nipples, rather than the manga version* For what purpose? I doubt those who like the movie would watch this version, Hell! I don't even think the manga fans will watch this version given all the Japs on Twitter complaining over the changes
>>290303076yeah so this is pretty standard new age stuff, everything is alive, the universe is alive, it's like a tree, spirituality + pseudoscience syncretic stuff with a dash of ancient aliens and intelligent design thrown in.we knew that going in.
>>290303163Because it's airing on terrestrial television and Fuji TV are not willing to run afoul of regulators.
what if Motoko looks like THIS?
>>290303462I would go to pound town on that ass
>>290303601same, I'd drill a hole in there and lubrify her servos.It's natural grease
>>290303422Reminds me of how a few months ago when Hokuto no Ken was airing, they basically made two different versions of the episodes so that it could air on regular Japanese television but still be uncensored on Amazon Prime. I'd like it if that became the standard, but I can easily see how that'd be a pain in the ass for most studios.
>>290303163Be careful not to trip over any mountains while walking through your garden.
>>290255760Showa style hurts my eyes
>>290304166That's early Heisei style.
I love this show but I cant understand a shit they are saying (yes I have the subtitles on) when they explain the plot, am I retarded ?
>>290275516>Replace every bone structure besides the one that breaks and destroys your nerves when you do heavy lifting>In a synthetic body with super strength
>>290304516Presumably the spine is no longer the load bearing structure in a cyber body
>>290291559>>290298271So, did Batou fuck everything up by crashing into the car?
>>290304442the plot is really dense but it's a good excuse to rewatch
>>290304772No, the guy hitting the detonator fucked everything up. Unless they pre-prepared a snipers and took the kill shots with no chance to surrender, they were never getting that head intact. They were always gonna blow it the moment the car was forced to stop.
>>290304840Should've had the Major kill the driver. She's good at doing that.
>>290303076>Caduceus>padlock, an attempt to prevent what is happening/rejection of Caduceus>don't know>sunflowers, warmth>glass wind chimes, summer>star formation, could be looking up at the sun (with inorganic eyes that can do that, which might also have edges that reflect and cause a false halo)>don't know>Dandelion seeds, again summer>Major's memory of PM>combination of three things>Dogū, misfortune>Haniwa, death>no idea>Hathor, afterlife>Oumuamua, alien/unknown>two[...]genies[...] - 1 pinecone, you do the math>Who's that Pokémon? Ouroboros>It's Quetzalcoatl these are tied together>Centeotl>Noh representing Major >bubbles, diving?>Jupiter, God>whales, subconcious?>no idea>hummingbird>DNA but also plants; growing, entwining, branching; ties into Centeotl>unification>>290303206
>>290303163Are you that schizo from mal who has been rambling like a madman about this episode?
the dialogue in this scene was literal retarded nonsense. they should've just had Caude rewrite it
>>290306194what the fuck is that translation
>>290306343Who cares? It’s jeetbabble. >robots have souls an shieeeet
This episode was extremely embarrassing for pseud animefags who still don’t actually understand the Jewish implications of Eva.
>>290307200>who cares>robots have souls an shieeetah yes, who cares... about one of the main points of ghost in the shell.
>>290291512What we see isn't one-sided rape, but a reversal of active/passive sexual roles. The Major is initially active. She seeks out the PM, faces a physical challenge, and forces herself into his body. Only then does the PM turn the tables and top her, forcing himself into Motoko's body.
>>290307301…Robots do not have souls, Rajinder.
>>290307334i'd like to point out that the original manga covers this concept as simply as possible compared to every other iteration, and you still can't grasp it, jorge hernandez.
>>290307380I will consider reading the manga. But so far it’s on the same level as Spielberg’s AI propaganda.
>>290307333There's a pretty fucking big difference though: Motoko was never planning to rewrite the puppetmaster's consciousness, or to trick it with a simulated experience. She just wanted to communicate. It's like the difference between breaking down someone's front door on the one hand, and breaking down someone's front door, pissing on his rug, fucking his wife and stealing his TV on the other hand. >>290307405What, AI? That movie's rather critical of AI.
>>290307993>that movieThe absolute state of chatbots.
>>290307856she's so CUTE!
>>290308018Spielberg made a movie at Stanley Kubrick's behest called AI. I thought that's what you were talking about, obviously.
>>290308040Warui, a bit drunk. As with anything made by kikes, you need to realize that it’s a thousand year old plan that they are imposing on you with the watchful eye of Satan.
>>290308065then why the FUCK is the AI kid presented as selfish and stuck in his ways to a creepy obsessive degree in that film?>thousand year old planNo they're just good at speed-chess
>>290308107Who cares? The dumb goyim got the fee fees when he found his teddy bear in the submarine or whatever the fuck.
>>290266411meanwhile in reality they make millions on corrupt land grant inside deals. Smokey the Bear is a snake in the grass
>>290300741Naming yourself after a location makes absolutely no sense.
>>290264108Hey, Oshii actually has an actual new work this year.
>>290255760so uh gits 2026 is anime of the year at least? i haven't seen anything that good since... i dunno when. dungeon meshi is the closest contender? but it's a recent production also.feels like anime is back.
>>290307333Motoko insisted on diving into the puppet master without adequate protection, so she could access it in its virgin form before anyone else. Unlike the PM her conscious goal was not reproduction, but she is still responsible for what happened to herself.
>>290309472meant for >>290307993
>>290304840Why didn't they invest in nonlethal control weaponry? Even today, sound or other "merely crippling" tech is around, just seldom used, but surely with their tech level they'd have something like this around if they anticipated scorched earth. They're police.
>>290309472Oh I agree, I'm not one to go "never blame victims", she definitely was reckless and wrong about quite a few things, not to mention selfish, but she saw it as her peer, so I don't think her attitude towards the Puppetmaster was predatory.
>>290309352As far as I'm concerned it's anime of the century in spite of its flaws, but objectively your assessment is more sensible
>>290309643i wish more studios would actually make good animations. wast majority of anime is just slop that could learn from fucking dreamwoks at this point.
>>290309602They're glowies
>>290309602>Why didn't they invest in nonlethal control weaponry?Kinda hard when your targets are cyborgs with god knows what adaptations. Even then, I don't think there are any non-lethal control weapons out there that work fast enough to stop a guy in a car from pressing a button sitting right next to him. Hacking would usually be their best bet but they are probably running in autistic mode which is why they needed a physical detonator in the first place.>if they anticipated scorched earth.I don't think they anticipated anything, one moment they are discussing the Puppetmaster with important guests, next all hell is breaking loose, she's gone, they are following them, it turns out the visiting Section is behind it, they stop the car and boom. They just flying by the seat of their pants here, I doubt they even thought about an explosive fail safe to begin with.
>>290309602It makes sense to me, it's police targeting other police who surely know about police standard, non-lethal procedure. Cyborgs sound harder to taze/drug/otherwise incapacitate without hacking or bullets to the joints.
>>290304948>POFbad major!
>>290256980You are not entirely wrong, but just like the source material can be shit, the adaptation crew can also be shit - which is more likely since it is usually more business-driven than the original creator.Look no further than The Hobbit trilogy for how the same master behind LOTR can fuck it up completely due to business demands.I would say statistically the originals will hold greater quality, but that adaptations can also improve on shaky foundations by taking a more authoreal approach.Ignore all the niggers just chimping at you for having an opinion.
>>290311009but that's not his opinion, anon, it's a troal poast, which is why it's not entirely wrong, just 90% wrong with just enough truth to lend it credence
>>290309614Neither is a victim, it's a top/bottom dynamic. Mokoto never said "yes" in this version but more importantly she never said "no" either. In the manga the PM initiated a connection with her (in their second meeting where they fuse) so it is more important that she affirms her interest. The PM is only guilty of interrupting Batou when he tries to interfere, but nothing indicates Mokoto wanted to pull out anyway. If she had her way they would have connected before anyone else showed up.
>>290311031>but more importantly she never said "no" either. Yeah because she's being hypnotized. That's why I pointed you towards her expression. Maybe I wasn't explicit enough about it but she's having feelings of ecstatic joy implanted into her like the other victims of the Puppetmaster did.>In the manga the PM initiated a connection with herIt did that in the movie during the boat scene, of course it knows Motoko is interested, it made her interested.>The PM is only guilty of interrupting Batou when he tries to interfere, but nothing indicates Mokoto wanted to pull out anywayPlease remember that I already mentioned that the Puppetmaster freezes Motoko's audio and visuals.She can't hear Batou, she can't see him, she can't see the helicopters overhead, therefore she has no idea how pressing the situation is or how much the Puppetmaster is gloating about freezing Batou's hand on top of all that.This isn't a top/bottom situation, top/bottom implies informed consent, the Puppetmaster is removing information from her, and when that still isn't enough to get her assent, it goes for the SimEx. A roofie, in other words.Again, I'm not removing responsibility from Motoko, but the Puppetmaster is approaching this whole thing like a manipulative psychopath.
You fucking normgroids and your fag terminology are overlooking the very real fact that Motoko wanted all of this to happen from the second she jacked in and she's happier for it.
>>290311208Obviously she's happy. You'd be happy too if you got slipped a roofie that never wears off. That's the point of a roofie isn't it?>Motoko wanted all of this to happenThen why is she expressing so many doubts and asking for guarantees that aren't given to her? She's fascinated by danger, we know that for sure, but she got way more than she bargained for.
>>290311281>Then why is she expressing so many doubts and asking for guarantees that aren't given to her?Because she's a woman
>>290311340good point.bitches, man
>>29031128What's your point, the first contact with an entity of unfathomable means and goals that is trying to escape annihilation is scary and hard to define? I can give you an answer: yes. Nevertheless, reducing that to e-brain rape is probably why 2501 didn't seek you out for merging.
>>290311552I'm not reducing it to a rape, I'm insisting upon the fact that, among many other things (initiation or what have you) this experience is also a rape, which indelibly tarnishes any sense of wonder and fulfillment you might derive from it.My point is that it's a bad ending. Motoko thought she could learn some kind of deeper truth, instead she got blasted with illusions. She thought she could achieve autonomy, instead her will got altered by another being's. She thought she could be appreciated for her inherent value by a kindred spirit, instead she got used as a neurological cumdump.
>>290311149>she's having feelings of ecstatic joy implanted into her like the other victims of the Puppetmaster didYou mean this bug-eyed expression? It's shock that his life is a lie, not joy. Mokoto's body has a strange expression because whoever is in there is metaphorically climaxing and also meeting god/the wider net. The Major drills him for info the entire time, at times expressing skepticism. Nothing indicates he is controlling her thoughts or putting words in her mouth. >She can't hear Batou, she can't see him, she can't see the helicopters overheadBatou is a killjoy who wasn't supposed to be there, and the helicopters can be hacked. The PM is assertively cutting out distractions, so he can give her the info to understand what is happening.
>>290311801That's a lie
>The bitch answered my DMs and came into my home, what was I supposed to do? Kick her out? And then what? She'd tell everyone I raped her, which is NOT what happened.>Of course I took her phone and car keys, that's what I always do, it's normal. Imagine some guy, some crazy ex-boyfriend tries to interfere, I gotta protect her.>Actually yeah I think her brother or something tried to take her away. I broke his arm. I had no choice!>No she doesn't know I did. Why would I tell her? That's insane!>Anyway then the bitch starts asking these stupid questions, like "blah blah blah what if I wanna see someone else, what about my passport, are you sure this is safe...">So I pour her a drink, you know, to relax her.>No of course` it wasn't JUST alcohol, what am I, a broke bitch? No I got her the good stuff. Of course. I'm a gentleman.>I know she didn't say "yes" but more importantly, she didn't say "no". I mean she didn't say much of anything after that point...>She's still with me to this very day!
>>290311836>It's shock that his life is a lie, not joy. Wrong picture, that's Corgi, you meant to post the Garbageman crying. And even as he's crying, the garbageman can't get rid of his feelings of love, they're implanted forever into him. And before that, he's quite happy, smiling in spite of his shitty job, much unlike in the manga.In the picture you posted, Corgi is indeed supposed to be smiling, even after getting brutally injured. See the storyboard.they also have the same stare.
>>290311889Explain why.
>>290311836As you can see, the garbageman is bug-eyed before understanding that his life is a lie
>>290311836and this guysmiling as he gets arrested, also bug-eyed
>>290312000There's no fucking way to interpret what we saw as a Simex, we weren't seeing it through Motoko's eyes, the camera is not Motoko's POV.
>>290312371Considering that it's from the point of view of her body, and that the puppetmaster can control it entirely, that's a trivial distinction to make. After all, at this specific point, it knows the helicopters are overhead, meaning it expects its original body to get blown up, and therefore needs to switch Motoko's perception back to her own body ASAP.Now, if you're talking about the reverse-shot here>>290284947With feathers falling onto her, I'll remind you 1- that people seeing their own bodies as they're having a near-death experience is commonplace. Easy for the puppetmaster to fake that2- that those feathers previously appeared in a POV shot. You can even see scanlines on the feathers.
>>290311801But that's the point. Do you complain about tragedies having bad endings? One day humanity is going to meet an entity that exceeds its capabilities, and maybe even get used in the same way humanity uses other species. In fact, 2501 bargaining in a limited way with Motoko is already an extremely benevolent, heavily armored plot, because the struggle for survival among humans rarely generates the human concept of justice, let alone the struggle for survival for something that is only human-adjacent.
>>290312371I will also add that the garbageman also saw his fake daughter as an angel, and that Corgi stops midway through his chase to gaze up at the sky. Turns out there was a plane passing nearby.The angel in Motoko's vision is just one of the helicopters, distorted through the SimEx.>>290312732Oh I didn't mean it as a point of criticism at all. I just want to point out that this is what Oshii is doing precisely so that we can judge it as what it is: a tragedy.And the villain in this tragedy is the Puppetmaster.>2501 bargaining in a limited way with Motoko is already an extremely benevolent, heavily armored plotto me it just looks like it's trying to make things easy for itself. Its facial expressions don't indicate benevolence, they indicate smugness and even some cruelty.
>>290288135It's still just an AI in a robot body. It's not an animal, plant or a brain in a robot body that had a real body when it was conceived.By the way, is it mandatory to have an implant to your brain that exposes you to be hacked by others like Major making others punch their own faces?
>>290312991no there's people with no implants at all out there
>>290311923>I know she didn't say "yes" but more importantly, she didn't say "no". I mean she didn't say much of anything after that point...I won't go through every idiotic analogy, but as I said she was coherent and critical throughout their conversation. >>290311801>She thought she could achieve autonomy, instead her will got altered by another being's. She thought she could be appreciated for her inherent value by a kindred spirit, instead she got used as a neurological cumdump.Review the boat scene. She is absolutely not looking for validation as she is. She is torn between a desire to develop and transcend her limitations, and the knowledge that her present identity can only exist within those same limitations (the body and mind are one, and it belongs to the govt). While she does not think in terms of reproduction, her compulsion towards evolutionary destruction is ultimately quite similar to the PM's motivation, which is probably why they are attracted to each other, in addition to being complementary forms of life. In the end, she is able to overcome her fear and together they embrace their passion, destroy themselves, and become a new being.
>>290313419>I won't go through every idiotic analogy, but as I said she was coherent and critical throughout their conversation.Yep, which is why she didn't say yes, and she probably would have been even more critical if the Puppetmaster hadn't isolated her senses so that she can't hear Batou or see what's happening to him or how the Puppetmaster is reacting to it all.>Review the boat scene. She is absolutely not looking for validation as she is. She is torn between a desire to develop and transcend her limitations, and the knowledge that her present identity can only exist within those same limitations (the body and mind are one, and it belongs to the govt). That's a better way of putting it, yes, but that tension still hasn't been resolved during the ghost-dive. She still expresses concerns for retaining her identity even as the Puppetmaster tells her exactly what the self-destructive part of her would like to hear. And like I said there's a big difference between being attracted to danger because you see it as a source of vitality on the one hand, and actually wanting to die.
>>290313419>In the end, she is able to overcome her fearNo, the Puppetmaster erases her fear by manipulating her brain. A SimEx doesn't just alter your senses it alters your emotions too. Corgi was still smiling as his leg was broken.
This guy kinda looks like a shia cleric
>>290314208Ishikawa hates reddit.
>>290313600She was the one one that penetrated the PM, and he effectively said "yes" by letting her in without resistance. By the time they got to the good questions they had been going at it for a while, there is no reason to expect her to affirm consent at that point. What she might say if there is a problem is "stop" or "turn my eyes back on" or "I want to say the way I am." Instead she went with shit like "why did you choose me?" >>290314067It's obviously still there. In her second to last question, she asks for a guarantee she will be able to remain herself. He does not lie and says there is none, and they continue. It's clear she is still afraid of losing her identity, and would like to avoid facing that fear if possible. What I mean by overcoming fear is not that it goes away, but that she doesn't allow it to restrain her ambitions. In short there is nothing indicating unwillingness on her part so any rape analogy is absurd.
>>290315397>What she might say if there is a problem is "stop" or "turn my eyes back on" or "I want to say the way I am." Instead she went with shit like "why did you choose me?" yes because she has a morbid fascination for danger.If that fascination had been strong enough for her to overcome fear she would have said what she said in the manga>It's obviously still there. No I mean after thatat this point>>290284947this is where the SimEx startAnyway if all it takes to signify consent is for Motoko to braindive, why not go ahead immediately? Why let Motoko talk at all?It expected consent, didn't get it, and went ahead regardless.
>>290312991>It's still just an AI in a robot body. It's not an animal, plant or a brain in a robot body that had a real body when it was conceived.Ok, and? None of this affects whether it is sapient or now. Imagine if you somehow managed to scan every single neuron and every single synaps in your brain and reconstruct all of that on a computer, every memory, every personality trait, placed in a virtual reality indistinguishible from the real world. What do you think would happen if someone asked who they are? They wouldn't perceive themselves as a copy, or an AI with someone's memories, it would think it is you because it is you, because there is no distinction between a neuron and a transistor, same software, different harware. Denying it sapience because "it's just made out of circuits and computers and they aren't sapient" is like saying humans aren't sapient because we are made out of non-sapient cells.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnPo0eTIRJQ
>>290315563Yeah, it's just a copy. Cells dies, circuits and metal just rot. It's still artificial.Motoko had a good idea when she questioned if she already died years ago. She's just a brain (and spine) in a metal body owned by the government. The moment her brain stops functioning it's the end for her.A "good ending" for her would be able to find a body that could be maintained on her own. But she herself is a flawed character and wants to keep doing what she does with S9.
Oh, is this the slop troons were vehemently defending on xitter and bluesky? Looks cringe.
>>290256980>t. someone who actually attended film school and studied screenwritingI've never met a film student that actually understands movies. It's similar to the way all psychologists are crazies. Anyway GITS is the weakest Oshii, just watch Avalon like a normal person.
>>290316243>Yeah, it's just a copy. Cells dies, circuits and metal just rot. It's still artificial.You die as well, your neurons can't replace themselves. And what is your definition of artificial anyway? Man made? Non-organic? Why does biochemical computing creating sapience by chance get a pass but technological computing creating sapience does not?
>>290316639artifice is a product of directed intent
>>290315511>yes because she has a morbid fascination for danger.She doesn't. The times she really endangers herself (swimming, fighting tank, connecting with PM) are in pursuit of her desire for transformation. I already explained how the manga's setup is different. >Anyway if all it takes to signify consent is for Motoko to braindive, why not go ahead immediately?Your "SimEx start" is when they nut. You can't do that immediately you have to build up to it.FYI Corgi's face is described in your storyboard as blank and empty once he is relieved of his identity, not imparted with "ecstatic joy."
>>290316639A pass on what? I'm not saying a computer can't "think". Just that Puppet Master is a robot with an advanced AI. Doesn't have cells, can't make or wasn't made by another of its own by itself and so on. The "a" in AI means "artificial" and like the anon said, >>290316819And the basic definition of data transfer is that the receiving end of said transfer is just a copy. The Puppet Master in the robot body is different than what it was "traveling" on the internet (by copying and erasing its data where it was before).It's the old principle of "teleportation" where a copy of you is created on the destination and you are erased at the starting point, so to everybody else, you "teleported".
>>290317342>The times she really endangers herself (swimming, fighting tank, connecting with PM) are in pursuit of her desire for transformationTransformation through proximity with death yeah, I don't see how that contradicts what I said.>Your "SimEx start" is when they nut. You can't do that immediately you have to build up to it.I'd say we've had more than enough buildup. All that remains is to remove her fear.>FYI Corgi's face is described in your storyboard as blank and empty once he is relieved of his identity, not imparted with "ecstatic joy."well here it says "as if a burden had been lifted", not that he's been relieved of his identity. Spiritual ecstasy is generally described as feeling like you're weightless, it's been a motif since st Augustine. So I dunno if the translation sucks but it kinda reinforces my pointBut regardless the fact remains that he has the same expression as Motoko, and that simulated experiences don't just disappear like that. Very unlikely that his just faded away right now.
>>290318097You said she does not tell the PM to stop because she is fascinated by danger. This is inaccurate. She is not fascinated by danger, she has a desire to escape her current limited form. Proximity to danger will not transform her, but she is willing to risk danger to be transformed. The film also associates instances of this desire with reckless acts because her evolutionary impulse will destroy her identity. >well here it says "as if a burden had been lifted", not that he's been relieved of his identity.He assumes that expression when Kusanagi presses him about his past, i.e. when the burden of his false identity is lifted. He is not described as ecstatic and the other puppets do not appear to be either. The face associated with puppets is a blank, doll-like expression. Mokoto in that shot has the same wide eyed face seen in previous frames where the PM was in her body. The more reasonable explanation is just that the PM is still in her body. Possibly they are both in her body, as this is the moment they are fully merging, and her head is what stores their offspring.
How old do you think Motoko is? Ie how many years ago was she born from 2029. I've seen some people suggest that she maybe in her 50s to 60s, which is a weird thing to think about, a hyperadvanced cyborg being born in the 1970s and watching Star Wars as kid.
>>290319760> she is willing to risk danger to be transformed.Up to a certain extent. She never fully commits.>He is not described as ecstatic and the other puppets do not appear to be eitherthey're all smiling at some point though, even before understanding anything about their condition, and have a fascination with angels. And all of it is fake.But the "pressing him about his past" thing might be significant, thanks for bringing that up.>The more reasonable explanation is just that the PM is still in her body. Possibly, but that doesn't bode well for the implicit consent theory either if what we're seeing is the puppetmaster's satisfaction and not hers.
>>290319914MMI says the body she got as a kid was the right age so she wouldn't get psychological development problemsso she's probably just as old as she looks: mid-late 20s; SHE'S A ZOOMETTE
>>290274102Ichikawa is the only one who isn't cute
>>290274913Necessary for her huge brain.
>>290321624He's the fourth cutest Section 9 member by technicality.
