>>34726781
sigh i think i'll try to get their numbers before the class finishes. each girls' number after every class. problem is that two of em seem to talk to each other outside of school

I’m good. Getting a woman sounds like hell

>>34734308
it can be

Remember the right woman will entirely invest in you as a person and will go out of their way, not do finicky things and then forget you when times get tough.

>To the guy here obsessed with mental problems

Look all around you, are you in danger and am okay? Doesn't look like I'm doing anything to that.

I guess my issue with approaching women in public, even if they show some kind of interest, is I don't want to bother them. I don't wanna be that creep who's bugging women trying to just live their life.

I know, I know, if someone is attracted, it's impossible to bug, but you can't be 100%.

I was approached by a woman at work
God I love a nice cute black girl who will awkwardly say hi AND good morning super shyly and almost under her breath!

>>34734308
Life is hell, and with a woman, you can fuck it. With luck, you can make a copy of yourself to keep fucking hell.

>>34735696
Yeah you're going to jostle them, but women are devious, cunning creatures that deserve daily tests. They could just stay in the kitchen and make babies but they decided to walk around in public half-nude. You must insert yourself into their path so that they may one day find their proper place either with you or another man. THEY should be ashamed, not you.

>>34736007
>>34736000
Gave my advice, now, someone who has a 10+ body count like me, help.

Last girl I really liked dropped out on me before I could fuck her, it hurt, unfortunately, although it shouldn't hurt me anymore.
>girl working at store hits on me
>hit back, go on a date during her break, makeout a lot in the middle of it (I read this is bad because it makes you seem to eager)
>I won't be having sex the 2nd time I meet you she says while we're outside kissing haha
>she had my number from before, texts me 3 days later. I had not told her to text me or "see ya" at the end of date 1
>immediately set up a date a week later, she's busy. there's some offering of conversation, but she doesn't ask me a quesiton so I leave her on read for 5 days until a couple days before 2nd date
>2nd date arrives, we kiss/hug, find out she only has 2 hours, i imagined I'd have her all night, so disappointment #1
>near the end we makeout more, I get kinda antsy and try to set up date 3. in date 1 she called me cocky, I was not acting cocky here, I genuinely wanted to see her, thus ruining the illusion. I noticed an energy shift from her and immediately became cold. she reacted but then I tried to brush it off and kiss her again.
>got a text saying lets not see each other again.

My eagerness in wanting to set up date 3 was my downfall, unfortunately. You may not get this with a woman less hot and young as her, being older as I am, but a cautious tale. Keep up your persona with her.

>>34736007
Horrible advice

>>34736021
how so? it's not even advice, but encouragement. I don't think you know what advice means, you're on the advice board, by the way.

>>34736007
Taking the misanthropy out of your post and getting to the essence of your point, I suppose one could argue anyone hanging out somewhere in public, whether it be a bar, coffee shop, library, or even store, is, in some sense, open to being social, else they'd stay at home. This isn't always the case, of course, but most of the time it is.

>>34736043
you quoted me. I'd like to drop misanthropy, it's cringe. But yes your statement is the crux.

>>34735696
Just use hinge.

Other than frats how do you find a group of guys willing to go out every night and get laid? (try)

>>34735778
>I was approached by a woman at work
>hi AND good morning
anon i...

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>Hello, I'm anon, nice to meet you
>I think you're very attractive and I'd like to get to know you better
>Mind exchanging info so we can set up a date?
I don't understand how people manage to say anything other than that when approaching women without feeling like a slimy weasel. Even the fact that I'm leaving out the fact that I would like to fuck her feels like I'm lying by omission, although I guess it's safe to say that would be implied by merit of me going out of my way to talk to a woman in the first place.
Literally how do people get away with saying anything else?
>Man: Hey, I like your jacket, it looks good on you
>Woman: Oh, really? Do you now? Surely there is no ulterior motive behind that very real and authentic compliment that you would have expressed regardless of whether or not you would like to stick your dick inside me. Wow, how nice of you.
>Woman: Since that little compliment doesn't harbor any impure intent and was solely made out of your fascination with fashion, Would you like to see my boyfriends clothes as well? Hold on let me pull up some pictures on my phone. See how this t-shirt drapes over his muscular 6'5" body that you seemingly don't have. Oh, and look at his pants in this photo, you can barely see the outline of his massive COCK through them, what do you think, looks good, right?
How do women not immediately roll their eyes and dismiss guys that try to weasel their way into a conversation with them?

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>pump myself up by watching approaching videos
>go out to the boardwalk
>walk 10km
>barely approached one girl
>she just sort of kept walking

I'm an atheist but I went to this like hipster youth church thing with a friend it was cringe but afterwards everyone stood around and I had full blown conversations with 7 different girls who were actually interested in talking to me. Does anything like this exist in a secular setting?

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>match with cute petite greek/egyptian gamer girl
>she seems very enthusiastic and into me, laughs at everything I say
>had a FaceTime call already and been texting back and forth across several apps
>meeting maybe next week, planning to at least play vidya together this weekend online
Bros… how do I not fumble this Cleopatra?

>>34736523
>Does anything like this exist in a secular setting?
No. Secular people tend to be autistic or neurotic and/or asocial, usually pumped full of SSRIs and depression.

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>>34736523
bro, I've been going to the Traditional latin mass for like 3 years, and I've talked to one girl, who had a boyfriend, at this one event. There's zero community.
I myself am thinking about visiting these novus ordu lib youth churches just to meet girls.
btw, the point of postmodernism and secularism was atomizing individual and destroying community. Something something opiate of the masses. Sure worked. Everyone is alienated to shit.

>>34736542
You're supposed to go to Church for God, not to get your dick wet.

>>34736531
I heard from my friend all of these religious girls are the normal whores who go clubbing and fuck a bunch of guys they just sing to Jesus on Thursdays or whatever

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>>34736480
>worst she can say is no...

>>34736548
Your friend is probably a loser

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>>34736546
god wants me to get my dick wet thoughbeit

>>34736565
My friend is fucking all of these girls that's how he knows

>>34736569
Your friend is most likely lying to you. Get better friends.

>>34736597
Just because it's not working out for you doesn't mean players don't exist. He's shown me the videos. Every time we go out there are 3 new girls in the car. I've seen him get 4 phone numbers in an hour in the most random places. He is the messiah and I learn much from him

>>34736629
So suck his cock then, get on your knees and show him your devotion

>>34736546
>Genesis 1:28
>Ephesians 5:25
>2 Corinthians 6:14
>1 Corinthians 9:5
and btw, you are retarded and can't read. OG poster said "after wards"

>>34736480
Like idk man I'm no normie but just 2 things. 1 is everyone pretty much knows what going on but they just want it done poetically, ie hinting or inuendo. Like if shes showing a bunch of cleavage you could just say nice tits, or you could say nice top and she would still get the message. Not that I think there is anything wrong with the former but its just an example. Why did people say lets watch netflix and chill rather than come back to my place and lets fuck? Like imagine if a woman came up to you and just started talking about your cock all the time and even afterward she never shut up about it. She would just sound really whorish and you probably wouldn't want to wife her up, or even be around her after you're taken care of. Just think about how you would want a doctor to deliver bad news. 2 Also you glossed over the part where just be cause you find her attractive doesn't mean you would fuck her. Would you fuck her if she was trying to get pregnant and trap you in child support? Would you fuck her if she had aids? Would you fuck her if she sucked 16 nigger dicks 30 mins before? Would you fuck her if she never actually wiped her ass? Maybe take a few seconds to get to know her just don't hide your attraction and desires but don't unload some cringe dialogue or start coomer posting irl so to speak.

>>34736480
>How do women not immediately roll their eyes and dismiss guys that try to weasel their way into a conversation with them?
humm, they are attention seeking whores?

>>34735696
What u should do is approach but if she says no just be graceful and don't push it further. Make it a good experience for both of you. When she says "oh I have a bf" say "say less and have a great rest of your day" then move on don't leer or keep looking just go. In that way you are respectful and you let her always save face if she wants to be a bitch you bow out respectfully and it will just be a mirror to how she acts for herself obviously out of being self protective no doubt

>>34736671
Yeah but even if they're polite about it, it's possible I'm bothering them. To put it another way, 90% of other guys are the reason most attractive girls wear big ass headphones whenever they're in public now, they're like a big "fuck off" sign. Of course, the hope is I'm that other 10%, the group where they'd be happy I'm approaching, and I have no doubt I am for most girls, but still, I don't wanna be a bother.

>ugh can't I go anywhere without being hit on?
etc

Then again I've also heard stories of women complaining how no one approaches them anymore, but you get my point.

>>34736522
To be honest it gets easier. You probably in that stage where you are not fully committing because you're too nervous. Try approaching a random stranger (male) and asking for something socially acceptable. Now take note of your voice volume or projection, your facial expressions, body language heart rate and breathing etc. If all that is normal when you approach a girl they don't ignore you even if they don't like you.

>>34736681
Well I'll put it like this if you can't act without a guarantee because a guarantee is actually just a concept and doesn't exist in reality then you won't be able to move because you are constantly asking the thing that you percieve holds some kind of standard of being or rules on how you are supposed to act "what do I do, what is the right way, what do you want me to do" since you can't act without a guarantee you will suffer from neurosis until you are able to take risks

>>34736659
>Why did people say lets watch netflix and chill rather than come back to my place and lets fuck?
No clue, outcome's the same, so I don't get the run-around.
>Like imagine if a woman came up to you and just started talking about your cock all the time and even afterward she never shut up about it
>Just think about how you would want a doctor to deliver bad news
If it was authentic, why would I want anyone to stifle their thoughts and put them through some arbitrary filters? I don't get why people feel the need to obfuscate intent if what their saying and trying to get out of any given scenario remains functionally unchanged.
>just be cause you find her attractive doesn't mean you would fuck her
Maybe, maybe not, that's irrelevant though. Whether I will date a girl long term would depend on me getting to know her and I don't see how being indirect and vague is supposed to help with that.

>>34736681
>wear big ass headphones whenever they're in public now, they're like a big "fuck off" sign
btw thats not what that says, complete reddit narrative

>>34736722
Do you like listening to rap music?

>>34736722
It's a game, a dance, a symbolic means of acceptable communication to express desire. Part of it is to see if you're an acceptable mate (eg are you funny, are you clever, are you socially adept) and the rest is, like I said, a way to express sexual desire without being vulgar, uncouth, and awkward.

>>34736747
depends on what kind of rap you're referring to
>>34736748
The vast majority of people that I see stumbling around what it is they want to say aren't clever or witty. At all. And yet people seem to go along with it regardless, so clearly that doesn't matter.
I can wrap my head around being funny, but in that case you're trying to make the other person laugh, not necessarily get in their pants or date them.
I just don't get the indirectness is all.

>>34736799
Uhuh ok so would you say this is your ideal woman? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7o0upORtCw you don't find it trashy or anything?

>>34736814
If you were to represent the entire genre of hip hop on a spectrum, whatever you just posted would be on the opposite end of what I listen to.
Also, I don't like whores, I just get annoyed when people don't say what they think.

>current year + 11
>street approaching
Did you guys just read a bunch of PUA books from the early 2000s? The culture is different now. Women know all your tricks and are prepared for them. The guys they choose are not ones that just saw them on the street and thought they were hot.

>>34736722
>No clue, outcome's the same, so I don't get the run-around.
You’re probably autistic. It’s fine. I am too. But it explains why you’re results focused and don’t understand subcommunication. I recommend you read up on psychology and communication, especially in a dating context.

Also read the lyrics to “Baby It’s Cold Outside”. If both parties in that song only cared about the result (sex), the lyrics would look like this:
>Stay here and fuck me.
>Okay.
There’s a reason those are not the lyrics.

>>34736684
I was going to write it on the post, but I have approached girls before. Maybe like 20?
But I quit for a few years, because I don't really believe in it. I'd rather meet people organically.
I think this afternoon I really set out to do 10 approaches, but I didn't see any girls worth approaching, or some that I could have approached because they were "cute enough" but I really don't care. I think if you are going to approach they have to be your type, 8 or above.
Also, I was paying attention to see if they locked eyes with me. It's clear when they don't, do I don't approach those as there is no point.

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Reminder that she expects you to hit on her.

Beautiful women don't fuck cowards.

How do you subtly/gradually escalate into being more flirtatious if you're in a situation where it would be awkward if it turns out that they don't actually like you that way? Do you just compliment them and see how they respond to it?
I'm somewhat autistic btw, and the concept of flirting is kind of lost on me.

>>34737183
Tease gently since you can do that with anyone.

>>34737023
What if at the mere sight of my crippled form she begs to every god that would listen that I don't even consider coming anywhere near her, let alone express my attraction to her?

>>34737296
I have no idea how to do that.

>>34737341
I’m not good at coming up with examples from scratch of calling things from the past into mind. Maybe give me the scenario and I can think of something.

I'm trying to find the one I can actually make the long haul with. Shit's fucking sucked for the last 5 years with the circumstances I'm in. I'm a 5th year PhD student and I've been living in a different state than the one that was my home for most of my life. Here's the basic synopsis:

Year 1
>Move to new state. In a long term relationship at the time of the move
Year 2
>Been having problems with girlfriend and not digging the long term thing. We break it off. I start seeing this other chick in my doc program that also happens to be married, and yes I am aware. It's a whole complicated thing I won't get into here.
Jump to year 4
>I break it off with this chick because the guilt of being accessory to an extramarital affair is getting to me. It does not go well. Hard feelings and attachment both ways. She starts seeing someone else like 2 months later and I have a hard time with it. I start going on dating apps. I'm with a new girl each month for a 3 month span.
Year 5
>I hear from this gorgeous 10/10 I knew from high school and didn't think she even remembered who I was. We talk for a while and she tells me she always thought I was cute. I ask if she's interested in me, she says yes, and we plan on a date. Problem being she lives in my previous state and this inevitably comes up. She asks a couple days later if I'm ever planning on moving back. I say it's possible and ask if she's worried about that. She says yeah a little bit and she's also not feeling a romantic spark between us which totally throws me through a loop and I can't make sense of to this day. She asks if we can just be friends for now and I say yeah and I'd still like to see her which she agrees to.

We hung out a couple of times and I was nervous as fuck both times and I felt like she could tell. She's genuinely so attractive that I'm intimidated. It's been a long time since I was that attracted to somebody. I'll reply to this post with some added context before asking for feedback.

>>34737353
ok, so picture this:
>be me (fat loser chud)
>talking to stacy (8/10 PSL)
>We're at the college cafeteria with no Chad or Tyronne in sight
>I ask if the seat next to her is free
>she says yes (she doesn't)
>I sit down
>the tremors of my fat chud body slamming onto the bench create shock waves that transfer to my hands causing me to spill some of my food onto the table (oops)
>I open my mouth to talk, she puts her index finger over my lips and silences me, which naturally gives me an instant erection
>we proceed to eat our food in silence for the next 20 minutes
>need to say something to break the ice
What would you say/do in this situation?

>>34737366
>she's also not feeling a romantic spark between us
time to move on man

>>34737023
Every good looking guy I know gets approached by women on a regular basis.
If a woman likes you she will come and talk to you.

>>34737369
I wouldn’t say a single word. I would listen to what your fat rolls had to say. And that’s what no one did.

>>34737366
Tell me where I'm overthinking or being oblivious for certain things. It's been driving me mad trying to figure out where I went wrong or what I'm doing too much for.

So more about this gorgeous 10/10. When we initially re-established contact we texted/snapped every day for like a month. I look back now and kick myself for never talking to her on the phone. For some reason I just feel like that would have helped things. With the date, I have never lived in the city she lives in though I have been a few times, so I am unsure what all to arrange. I suggest a few things and she shoots them all down. She doesn't like laser tag or mini golf which are like the two premier third space activities in her city. I tell her I'll take a couple days to think about it after which she tells me she doesn't wanna go on a date anymore. I'm wondering if this is where I lost her more so than distance being the issue.

In the months following her telling me she didn't wanna move forward with dating we started talking less and less. She would still text me like every other week to ask how I was doing or send me a tiktok that she said reminded her of me and I would do the same. The last time I visited her we hung out for like the entire day. We grabbed some food, we went around to antique shops, and we found a picnic table at a park to sit at and talk for a while. I did not bring up anything romantic because she said she didn't want to continue discussing that at a prior point in time. I got her a bag of her favorite candy and gave it to her when I dropped her off at her car along with a note I wrote her just telling her how cool I think she is and that I'm grateful she reached out to me. She later told me she read it and that she appreciated it and hung it up on her fridge. No idea if she actually did or not. We now rarely talk. Maybe once or twice a month if that and it usually doesn't expand into a conversation.

>>34737391
The only reason I feel so stuck on this is because she continued staying in contact with me for as long as she did. Idk if she feels bad or if she is genuinely just nice like that. I feel so confused by this failure to launch. She never elaborated on what she meant by the romantic spark comment even after I asked. She just reiterated she wasn't feeling it.

I am about to move again to yet another state for my internship year. I've worked out these scenarios in my mind:
>I finish the internship and move back to my home state hoping she's still single and might rekindle her initial interest in me
>Being the only male in my internship cohort, I see what's up with the girls I'll be working with and whether any of them are interested
>I just happen to stumble upon someone else entirely at some point or another

For that last one, I don't even know where to begin. I am somewhat confident in my ability to meet women on dating apps because I've proven to myself that I can like 5 times before, but I don't really wanna do that. I don't drink alcohol and I don't smoke so I feel like that eliminates a lot of third spaces for me. The most social experience I have at any point is when I visit my buddy and we go to a karaoke bar which is always a wash for me. I hate being in loud, crowded spaces like that and my voice is always gone after one song so even if I were to strike up a convo with a stranger they wouldn't be able to hear me. I'm moving to a mid-sized city with a number of amenities but I have zero ideas as to what kinds of third spaces to look for where I wouldn't just be out of place and look weird. I feel like once I get talking to most people I can handle it alright, it's just getting started, mostly finding the right setting, where I struggle.

>>34737372
Rationally in my head I figure this is the case. I don't wanna just wait outside a door that has evidently been closed, I guess I'm just an autistic fuck and that unclosed logic loop in my brain is distressing for me. I feel like I've done something wrong because I cannot make sense of what she said without that resolution.

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>>34735696
I feel the same way but I look at it like this. If you really think about there is a balance to this whole mating dance. Women have the advantage of having endless options and not having to take risk by approaching, but the downside of getting a lot of unwanted attention. While most men have to take risk and struggle for every lay, but go through life largely unbothered. By being overly empathetic you are basically allowing women to have their cake and eat it to, and trust me they have no mercy on us for having to take risk, they enjoy forcing us to chase them and face humiliation.

I'm not saying to be an asshole about it, only that you're giving empathy to women who have none for you.

>34737432
>trust me they have no mercy on us for having to take risk, they enjoy forcing us to chase them and face humiliation.
Do not trust this incel. He has issues.

>>34736837
Co worker "hip hop" from people that aren't tapped into the scene is fucking garbage

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I feel like I'm like a dog chasing a car and I don't know what I'd do if I caught it. Girls seem to love me but I'm always hesitant to ask them out for whatever reason, either because I'd feel like I'd be boring or I just wouldn't know what to do or where to go.

>>34737672
Drinks or coffee next to somewhere interesting to walk is all you need for a first date. Find out something you like in common on the first date and make that the second date. I’ve done this with tennis, pickleball, and pool.

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>finally match on hinge after over 5 weeks
>holy fuck she's verified
>holy fuck she's cute and hot
>holy fuck she wants to watch the godfather together (prompt related)
/htgwg/, what DO i do? do i already start making plans for a date? i moved on to anime discussion after agreeing that we'd watch the godfather

>>34737783
You didn't schedule a time after she said she wanted to do that with you?

>>34737832
no i done fucked up

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Can you still get women if you don't have a friend group that you touch grass with?

>>34733668
Did anybody try the run club method how successful is it

>>34735696
>I don't wanna be that creep who's bugging women trying to just live their life.
Good, know your place

>>34738417
I'm an 8.5/10 who gets stared at by women in public all the time though. Women, I'm sure, want me to approach. I just can't break that holdup, that barrier of worry.

>>34738423
Ok, but i'm 8.6 actually

>>34738436
:O

>>34738310
Having friends is irrelevant if you're a Chad.

So I have been seeing a woman, first time, she is a bit older than me, got a job (I am currently on a community college, will get a job within a year).

She is not my girlfriend (yet?), we only saw each other 3 times but had 1 date, problem is, she seem to be always busy on weekends, while I am from monday to Friday, and I don't like to be the one always writing first.
Haven't seen her in almost a month, last time I wrote her to see if she was ok since we had a storm and if she was busy that weekend (she was), I have not written to her in 2 weeks now.

What to do?

If I were to guess from this limited information, she's probably not that into you and most likely is talking to/seeing other guys. I mean, that's what I would assume if I were you. Sorry.
I would try to find a different woman if you can. Don't keep putting more into this if you're not getting anything back from her, it will just make you feel worse about yourself.

>>34738490
Meant to quote >>34738481

Had a literal 3/10 lanklet dude come into work today with 3 8-10/10 asian women. He was peobably 6'5. Is it really just about height? Or is there something im just doing wrong?

>>34738514
>peobably
made me laugh reading that out loud

>>34738517
I dont bother checking my typing, but thanks for point it out because it made me laugh too

>>34738498
That sounds overly defeatist, I wrote her and I'll see what happens then.

>>34736837
Ok and all women have these sexual desires. "Whores" are just women more open and upfront sbout them. And that turns men off. Creeps are just men who do the same thing. Also another point would you like it if a woman started gushing about how much money you have? or your position on the social ladder? Or how preselected you are? Do you want her to tell you about how much attention she could get from dating you? or what she could brag about to impress strangers? or how she could make her friends jealous? Shes just being open and upfront about it right? Because those are all things women think about they just know to shut the fuck up about it.

>>34737385
Yes but its good looking + well dressed + has friends / social approval + confidence + not weird or a sperg + right environment. I doubt women are approaching men at the grocery store. And most guys here lack one or multiple of those qualities.

>>34737672
remember that 95% of the time normalfags just talk about daily life, other people or social relationships

>>34738481
If a woman isn't seeing you it just means she thinks whatever else shes doing is more important. Take that how you will.

>>34736856
There are no tricks its just walking up to a woman who potentially likes you and talking to her.
>The guys they choose are not ones that just saw them on the street and thought they were hot.
You could have said this in the year 2000 as well. And every previous year before.

>>34738630
not really, all of them are autistic slobs, which is why I'm friends with them in the first place. They just happen to be good looking.

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Is the idea that
>if she doesn't know you, she doesn't want to know you
a good rule of thumb to follow when considering whether or not you should talk to women?

>>34737857
It may not be too late.

>>34738310
Yes

The only thing you need to be a good mate is to be optimistic, a nice guy, and try to do right thing. If nothing happened at least life is good.

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>>34738720
>pic related

>>34738720
i wish my next gf has such massive udders

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>get like on tinder
>"see who liked you and match with them using our bullshit subscription!"
then how the fuck am i supposed to match with anyone without the subscription?

>>34739137
You have to swipe and see if you like them too, blind to exactly which ones liked you first. Usually those will be somewhere near the front though.

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You all, quit trying too hard to party all the time. Recently saw a group of girls chatting away about a party, and it was the most feminine thing I saw possible. For us guys we need to find fun and joy in being able to live while working as hard as possible. That is what will make us look like men like construction workers.

Ive basically been a tutor for a bunch of younger girls(i am 31, the oldest there is 24). I think the youngest (20) probably likes me, especially when i mentioned my age today. She kept exchanging looks inbetween and laughs at every joke i make and its obvious that she also is impressed that i came from a wealthy family background( even tho im broke now lol). Just for her as a person: she is quite a superficial girl and probably my least favourite in terms of personality there but lookswise she is definitely on top. But in three days is the exam and im kinda wondering: Should i ask her out on our last meet up tomorrow to come over to my place? I could also ask her out for a coffee after everythings over, but i really dont know if we vibe in that context and also she goes on vacation right next week so i think i should try to make a quick move on her. This would also be the first time i would ask that of a girl ever, so i cant compare this to anythibg else. What do you guys think, considering everything i wrote about her?

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>>34739516
Yeah can you sound like yourself instead of trying to be elite? You sound like someone who is trying too hard to be a responsible man while missing out on the fun his kids could have while drinking a beer, having a BBQ, and relaxing with his wife on the 4th of July. I don't know I think some of this website could use a bit of Southern.

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I drive a Prius. How big of a setback is this in getting laid?

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Im losing it lads. Fucked up with a woman I loved and its destroying me. She let me know how she felt by sleeping with someone else.

Its been 5 months and i've since
>gotten my own place
>better job (6 figs)
>gained a bit of weight back (already pretty fit but stress caused me to go underweight)
>got new hobbies
>dated a few women
>started to repair family relationships
>trying to get back into gym and church
>eating better
>running regularly

And I still want to die. I saw someone who looked like her outside today and its like i was shot in the chest and couldnt breathe for a second. I tried going to therapy and journalling but i dont feel like its been helpful. My spending is out of control and i'll probably stop therapy if my new job insurance doesnt cover it, not like it worked anyway. I feel like i left the sadness and crying stage a few weeks ago and now ive been mainly confused and angry. There hasnt been a day since it happened where i havent thought of her thought there have been a few times ive forgotten for a couple hours.

Regardless its been an almost constant argument or trial with her in my head for the past 5 months. I put rubber bands on my arm to snap when i thought about her and break the cycle, it only made my arm red as hell. I did affirmations all the way to work. I asked everyone i trusted for advice and their opinion on what happened. Concensus seemed to be yea, you fucked up, but she didnt have to do that and shes also either gaslighting me at the end or completely oblivious and insecure to not know i liked her. I tried one time to fix it once a few weeks later but it didnt work. Shes kind of a 304, she said she'd still fuck me but not committ to me, which is insane, and wanted to find a relationship now, just not with me. Never spoke again. Last night i couldnt stop the thoughts from sending me into a panic and i started hitting myself.

This is so stupid, i dont want to act like this but im stuck and dont know how to get out.

>finally find a girl on the apps without tattoos
>swipe right
>we match
>her opening message is advertising her onlyfans
It's all so tiresome.

>>34739696
Sounds like she sucks anon. You don’t want to be with a woman who sucks. Keep dating and you’ll find someone way better.

>>34739753
I know, its been hard to accept. Thanks anon

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>>34739751
Take one of the girls with the tattoos. You don't know if one of those biker girls make be good as a trad wife.

I'm 24 and never dated, got awful oneitis that took me nearly 2 years to get over. Where the fuck do I start?
Seriously? I live near the falls Canada side and seemingly people my age are just nowhere to be found. Not that that matters seeing as I fumble ever opportunity due to my shit social skills.
Are the apps really my only hope?

Where to meet women that doesn't require any form of cold approaching?

>>34739137
bro tinders a scam

>>34740241
Apps, common interests/hobbies that are done in groups in public

>>34740304
such as?

>>34740249
so it seems. there's too many bimbos on there anyway so i'm not going to waste my time swiping on it. same with bumble

>>34740346
Anon, you're too god damn afraid of being humiliated. Look at how humiliated I am for having a name on 4chan. Did I let that get to me? No. Am I still safe? Yes.

>>34740346
Hinge, Bumble, Tinder. Hiking, climbing, pickleball.

>>34740378
Can you even answer the question?

>>34740401
He's a literal schizophrenic. He didn't even read your post and even if he did, he wouldn't have the mental continence to provide an answer, and even if he did, that answer would be wrong.

>>34740520
I did read it. He has a confidence issue. I'm more concerned about how you read me, Mr. "I feel like I'm babysitting Zach". I think you're too distracted by how I tangentially ramble missing the point in my typing.

>>34740520
Calling me schizophrenic. ANON LOOK AROUND YOU ARE YOU IN ACTUAL DANGER OR IS IT IN YOUR HEAD?!

Once a woman blocks you, its completely over right? I still dont know or am hopeful
She even blocked me on insta where we never even messaged/followed each other and she has a private profile.
One moment shes all over me humping me the next im chopped liver.
Its been 2 weeks. Shes 23, hot, great tongue kisser. Im imagining she hooked up with a dude over the weekend before she sent the long text and eventually blocked. I just made jokes until she blocked me. Didnt beg for her back, it was only 2 dates
>t. 30+ yo with a 10+ body count

>>34740729
Anon, you'll find plenty more women like her. I thought a girl early in college was my time, at work, at a store, and many others and they all turned out to not be that. Went through what you did being blocked and ignored and getting cold reactions. Felt like the world was against me, even though it wasn't. She is out there anon, but she doesn't exist on a stupid ass website. She's your friend who will keep supporting you and loving you no matter what. She's so in love with you you don't even have to go through hoops to get her affection. Find that woman. Not someone who is like "OH ANON YOUR DICK IS BIG." and you're like, "I like Trump do you?" BLOCKED. Fuck that woman.

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>>34737783
>>34737857
i was able to steer the convo towards plans on meeting up
>sent 10AM
>now 11PM
>hasn't texted back
there's no way i fucked it up this fast and easily, right?

>>34740734
but what if i bring a younger hotter girl with me to her job at a cafe
Already have a hotter date lined up in a couple days

>>34740734
Even with women who i donthave to go thru hoops for leave me eventually

>>34740762
>>34740788
I know, but that's the art of it anon. You're figuring out who is really there for you and who isn't. I'll tell you if she really likes you, you do not have to compete for her. Like instead of awkward interactions where she swoops over to her friends and you're like a kid going, "hey what about me" and am easily ignored, would not happen. You want proof she likes you, and I mean really likes you? Tell something embarrassing and see if she trusts you afterwards. 95% of the time women who don't love do not continue if you tell something embarrassing about yourself.

Just jerked it to recent instagram swimsuit photos of this girl that I haven’t seen irl since 2015 (halfway through high school). I’m a late 20s khv that’s never been on a proper date. Where do I go from here?

>>34740829
Out the door and for a walk.

>>34735778
damn i didnt know my mailman was a faggot, he approached me this morning. motherfucker said "good morning" and "have a nice day" and everything. bro wants my dick

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>>34740868

>>34736856
I mean it’s not like PUA invented this, it’s been a thing for years. Ovid wrote about doing this in ancient Rome FFS. Also ironically enough it’s likely to work better now than in the past because so few guys are doing it. Used to be that every Tom, Dick and Harry would street approach and girls were getting swarmed. Now not so much.

Do any of you lads go out alone to bars and what not?
I feel like if you go out to bars alone, you'll stick out so badly and almost impossible to meet women when they almost always go in groups.
Idk man. This is just my situation as I don't have anyone to go out with.

>>34740910
You'll only stick out if you act weird. But I agree I've never managed to meet anyone at a bar, it's like the entire dating scene moved to dating apps

>>34740898
You and others aren’t doing it because of Ovid. You’re doing it because this was the preeminent method 20 years ago and you still haven’t moved on, even though the street approach numbers are among the worst of any method to get girls.

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The decline of men approaching women functions like a political shock even when nobody frames it that way.
It reshapes family formation. Fewer approaches mean fewer relationships, later marriages, lower birth rates, and accelerating demographic decline. That feeds directly into labor shortages, pension stress, immigration politics, and generational conflict. Governments can pass incentives but they cannot legislate attraction or courage.

Second, it polarizes gender politics. Many women interpret non-approach as disinterest or resentment while many men experience it as rational risk avoidance shaped by social sanction, economic precarity, and fear of misreading norms. Each side builds narratives about the other and political movements harvest those grievances.

Third, it weakens informal social trust. Approaching a stranger used to be a low-level civic act that trained people to tolerate rejection, ambiguity, and difference. When that disappears, people retreat into apps, algorithms, and identity-filtered spaces which harden group boundaries and reduce empathy.

Fourth, it shifts power to platforms and institutions. Dating apps, HR departments, and legal frameworks mediate intimacy that used to be negotiated face to face. That concentrates cultural authority in systems optimized for liability management and profit, not human bonding.

Finally, it produces downstream radicalization. Large populations of unattached men historically correlate with instability, withdrawal, or extremist politics. Most do not become violent but many disengage from civic life, work, and optimism itself which is politically corrosive.

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>>34741314
All of those trends were in motion long before the rise of dating apps. Instead of whining about them, get good photos.

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>>34741314
Like a child, women exploited systems built by men to support them based on their previous complaints.
Men are at fault for giving such power to women without scrutiny.
Now with these kid gloves on men can't even tell women to knock it off and their only solution is to not engage entirely

>>34736542
That's the worst part and sometimes the best part of being catholic. You get 0 bitches but at least no one bothers you

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>>34657341
got her number after class
>shows off her rings to me during class
>tries to get my attention
>plays with her hair when talking to me
>laughs at my jokes
>instantly agrees to go out when i suggest it
might be on to something. anons... i think im chad

are there any online courses about women/dating/self improvement etc that i can torrent for free?

>>34733668
What are some good tips for first dates? I'm going out for coffee tomorrow. I'm 30YO and a KHHV. I've NEVER EVER been on a date. Also a schizoid. I'm scared shitless of messing up or being too nervous.

PLEASE HELP

>>34741314
> rational risk avoidance shaped by social sanction, economic precarity, and fear of misreading norms.
Is it rational when the proportion of those worst case scenarios is actually very small? Or is it succumbing to media banking on shocking stories and believing those to be the norm..?
Just like women “choosing the bear” except the stats are vastly different

>>34741805
Jon zherka
How to manipulate women
It's paid content, i've never listened to it

>>34741823
Side hug when you meet her. Hold the door for her. Then just talk to her. Ask her about herself and share about yourself and anything else interesting. Side hug when you leave her. Ask if you can see her again if you want to.

>>34741833
He’s a chud. No it isn’t rational.

Girls have it so easy.
>I gave him a double look, why didn't he approach me!?

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>>34741893
thanks fren, had to search some shady russian sites but found it

>>34742107
All good. Some of his advice is free and on youtube. If you learn anything interesting, tell me.

>>34742107
Can you give us a link?

>went to school
>no girls ever attracted to me
>made fun of by women as a loser beta
>went to university
>no girls ever attracted to me
>girls didn't acknowledge my existence
>got part time jobs in summers
>no girls ever attracted to me
>got a full time job
>no women ever attracted to me
>moved to a big city
>no women ever attracted to me
>made online dating profiles
>no matches
>just went outside
>no women ever attracted to me
>regularly gone to gym for over 10 years and have squatted over 4 plate
>no women ever attracted to me
>now in my 30s
>no women ever attracted to me
>go on multiple holidays abroad
>no women ever attracted to me

Ok. Now what?

I am treated like total subhuman disposable shit that people want to get away from as soon as possible by everyone of every gender in every context and am too ugly to ever have any social life or get a girlfriend, or even get a date, or be taken seriously at work.

>>34743179
If you're seriously asking, then you become rich or insanely talented at something. Then the women will come.

>>34733668
Every time I date black chicks they're always immigrants and the culture clash is way too damn much for me. It's not quite as bad as not sharing a common language but sometimes it feels like it.
Is there any way to get over that barrier quickly?

tfw you go on a date everything goes perfect
you guys kiss at the end
she tells you she's never really kissed
you believe t sine she's 19 not in college went to all girls school in another country

you go on another date
it's hot af, logistics kind of shitty
you make conversation and connect
you hold hands
but you get that feeling that it's over
you'll probably never see her again

feelsbadman

>>34743520
be grateful that you got a date at all, you entitled fuck. not all of us are so lucky as to be able to go on one

Well, I overcame my social anxiety by telling this girl that her friend is cute when she stepped away to go use the bathroom at goth night. I ended up talking to her for a bit, she gave me her instagram after I asked but she never ended up approving my follow request. I don't think my approach was bad, I may have just fucked up as the conversation went along (granted it was loud as hell and difficult to hear her in there) but should I have asked if she had a bf during this encounter? How can I translate this to approaching women directly in bars? I go often and 90% of the time, I'll get approached by a woman who will say I'm cute or drunkenly ask me to meet her at her apartment later but I'm never interested in them - they're either too big or kinda chopped in the face

>>34743802
Honestly sounds like you're doing fine. All you need is experience. So keep at it, you'll pick up things along the way naturally. It's like any skill.

>>34743849
But how do I do the approaching myself when at a bar on a typical friday/saturday? The thought of walking up to a woman and talking to her is so foreign to me. I'm really autistic and need the first few steps written out for me. I think I can handle myself okay after the conversation is initiated

>>34743953
While normally i'd feel you, the bar is one of the places where it's perfectly acceptable, hell, expected to approach strangers. Just keep telling yourself that.
>Can I buy you a drink?
>want some company?
>Haven't seen you here before, what's your name?
etc

And keep in mind one of my personal favorite pieces of advice: whenever you're feeling awkward to approach, worried it might be weird or whatever, tell yourself this, how would you feel if you were approached? perfectly fine, right? even welcoming? you wouldn't think they were weird. so what you're doing isn't either.

>>34743953
Go up to them confidently (just standing up straight with a smile and look them in the eyes)
And say the following:
Hey we haven't met yet, I'm x
Or
I don't believe i've met you yet, I'm x

Literally that easy

Focus on character not your dick when trying to get a date.

>>34744073
That's how you become a friendzoned nice guy. Focus on BOTH

>>34743179
Even though you never got what you wanted, life is still good nonetheless.

>>34743179
>>just went outside
>>no women ever attracted to me
no women will ever come up to you and put your penis in her pussy. you suffer same mentally as ER. he also went to cafes and expected girls to approach him. thats not how it works lil bro

>>34743179
Looksmaxx obviously. Very few men are elite enough to have success while also being ugly. You're not one of them so maximize your looks. This goes well beyond your quads.

Got a cooking/movie date at my place this week. I wonder if we'll have sex. We only kissed on the first two (public) dates, but there was a lot of it and with plenty of tongue.

I have to start vetting my hinge likes better. This girl had S tier tits so I didn’t notice her hairline went as far back as 4 inches above her eyebrows. Almost set up a date. A really romantic date in fact.

How do I stop being too much of a pussy to make a dating app account? If I get rejected that will unironically be grounds for me to kms btw

>>34744350
You WILL get rejected, its dating apps we're talking about. Ghosting, flaking or no matches for extended periods of time happen to everyone, no matter how good a profile is. Not to say it's not worth trying, but you've gotta be thick skinned for it

>>34744350
yea that shit is demoraliziing to be honest bro
even if you get matches and go on dates
the chances of any one girl not rejecting you...
is like 1-10% maximum
meaning, you will not only get not swiped on by thousands of girls, you will not even be responded to by more than half of your matches
then, half of the dates you setup will be flakes
once you finally get a girl to show up there's a 90% chance she will just use you for a free meal
dating in 2020+6 is just fucked

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>>34744874
Haha I get a match maybe once or twice a month at most and I am unadded every single time after one or 3 messages. I have tried literally every single type of message as well. Ive used dating apps for around 5 years and i haven't gotten a date once. It feels very asymmetrical because just asking a woman about herself and talking about hobbies is boring and ick, whilst I fucking wish somebody would show enough interest to ask me about myself. I feel like dating is meant for other people and I am too reserved, neurotic, and boring to differentiate myself from the crowd despite being tall and not ugly. At least I have plenty of time to practice classical guitar and read lmao.

My classmate asked me to trade instagrams with her during class.
Is she onto me? Like, we sit next to eachother, but the most i’ve talked to her is like making some jokes.

at what point should a man give up on finding a wife and starting a family and start fucking hookers instead

>Send Hinge message
>It's a match
>No response to the question I actually asked
I made it a point to not follow up to women who won't even reply to the basic question I asked
Have half a mind to tell her outright that if she can't even give a one word answer I'm not interested
Are they shit scared or what? What is the major malfunction here?

>>34736480
What you are not understanding is that when you make everything clear then desire collapses. Flirting and desire and sexual tension lives in the ambiguity of things unsaid. When she has you in totality, desire usually collapses instantly. It's because of how we desire that this is so.

>>34736546
God anointed me a king of this earth and there is nothing you can do about it because he speaks to me directly and God's word is law.

>>34736548
And that's LITERALLY the right way to practice. Going hardcore into religion is a great way to cuck yourself. Your not supposed to do that, you should engage with culturally and not seriously because the more seriously you take it the more schizo and retarded you become until you are like scared to have sex and enjoy life because big boy faggot god might be judging you

>>34744295
You guys are so fucking judgemental and mentally ill and you know that when you judge someone you are really judging yourself because that's how you will act. Once you start getting into psychotic shit like girls hairline to tit ratio you are just going to put eyes on yourself the same way and it's neurotic as fuck. The less judgemental and accepting you are of others the less judgemental and accepting you are of yourself if you aren't a sociopathic piece of shit

>>34745142
No body gives a fuck except you and it will come off psychotic "I expect an answer to the question I asked" lol what the fuck are you even doing

>>34745142
The response is that they ignored you. And u think so highly of yourself that's somehow a direct offense to your ego

>>34744874
Skill issue.

>>34744921
Have you tried being fun instead? Do fun and spontaneous things and eventually you’ll become a fun and spontaneous person.

>>34745213
Hey
Basically I'm just not gonna date them (girls I don’t find pretty)
I know.... UGH I know ..... I'm sorry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's just that I'm not gonna date them is all
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHA

>>34745203
Wouldn’t this make you afraid of everyone knowing you’re a fraud?

>>34744921
post chatlogs

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>>34739696
This nigga fell in love with a whore

>>34744934
Yes, she's into you.

>>34733668
I have a crush on a whore, what do I do?

>>34745620
Cut all contact, stop seeing her, block her social media, try to avoid thinking about her, etc. Then go do something else or talk to other girls. It will wear off in like 1-2 months.

>>34745641
But why should I do that?

>>34745517
not how it works. you either have it or you don’t

>>34745517
Idk that isnt who I am, I am reserved and I have fun doing bookish stuff. I like drinking but partying and going out to busy bars brings me great disquiet despite going to many different parties through rugby. Im not spontaneous either I have to follow a strict schedule during my work week of practicing music and working out. If I don't follow it I will feel awful and do stupid shit. I want companionship with a woman of a similar temperament who likes weird and introspective stuff over socially validated stuff.
>>34745530
There is nothing of substance I just get unadded after I say a joke, ask them about a hobby they are doing, or whatever bullshit. Sometimes I try to be clever other times basic but the results are the same.

>>34745719
I didn’t have it but now I do so that’s wrong.

>>34733668
How do I get women who are highly disputed attracted to me?

>>34745748
sounds like cope to me

>>34745820
With what?

>>34740749
>two days now
yep i fucked it up. i fucking hate myself

>>34736542
I got ghosted by a girl at the catholic youth group. What is even the point?

>>34744934
Probably not

>>34746095
Sorry anon. But now you know for next time. Strike while the iron is hot.

Im going to visit a city for the weekend, a girl i know who lives there told me that she'd like to hang out with me and was very flirty about it.
I have a list of thing I want to do in the city, but all of them may not interest her.
Should I split up my activities and do those another day? Or bring her along for the day and do everything with me? Should I ask her what things she'd want to do or just make my decisions on my own?

>>34746856
Make decisions on your own, dont ask her because she will either go along with you and hate it the entire time or feel bad that your doing stuff without her even though shes would hate those things anyways. Asking her puts the pressure on her and is a lose-lose situation for her.

>>34746878
Makes sense. Should I tell her before I go what I have planned or make it a surprise day of adventure? Some of the stuff I want to do needs tickets and idk if its a dumb idea (for my wallet) to buy her ticket ahead of time vs telling her and having her get her own tickets.

>>34746925
Unless you know her well, and since your asking im guessing not, its better to ask ahead of time if its something she would need to dress appropriately for(shoes) or that you need tickets for.

>>34746943
Its an online friend, I've never met her in person, so honestly it could go very poorly. But these activties are real basic stuff like Zoo, musuem, riverwalk. Not like Im going to be climbing mountains and going underwater

>>34746990
Then as long as its clear to her that your going to be walking around quite a bit then its fine as a suprise. Some girls will assume apropos of nothing that a date will require less than 7.5 minutes of walking and were some uncomfortable heeled shoes and complain.

Is it weird to add someone on Insta you vaguely know out of the blue?

Look, autistic people simply come off as creatures to women. The best response to this is to be laid back to it, not react to it with vindictiveness. A mole rat doesn't get angry at the world, it just moves forward as we should as well.

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>match with girl on hinge (easy enough)
>we have a lot in common and text back and forth enthusiastically
>facetime that night for a while even, at work, so I'm at least certified not hideous
>she constantly initiates text with me over the next few days, lots of heats and flirting
>even play vidya twice online together and have fun
>go out in person for dinner and drinks
>her mood is clearly deflated and it ends kinda quick
>get a text later 'yeah youre really sweet and fun but i dont feel a romantic connection'
This kinda thing keeps happening.
Something about me in person inherently drives women away. I can get a lot of first dates and no second dates.
Please tell me why an unlovable monster like myself shouldn't just rope?
Every time it happens I consider it a little more seriously.

>>34747002
Awesome thanks anon. Hope it goes well and I get some fun out of it

Theres one issue on my mind, and this has happened more than once, especially when meeting with someone for the first time- she will talk a big game over text, but once we're together in person she will get embarrassed or shy and eventually nothing physical happens. Any advice on how to keep things light in the beginning and built momentum over the the day? Im wondering if doing too much activities in the city would tire her out and spoil anything for later that night

>>34747024
no that’s how i met my gf

Is there something wrong with being very unexperienced and dating a girl with a lot of experience? I've hang out with girls before but I never had a romantic date. I imagine girls I'd date would be a lot more experienced than me, could this cause problems?

>>34747334
If you want to jam things into place because you feel normal people aren't working, I guess. However, I think you need to help people overcome their fears of your outcast nature to them. Some of us simply are like alien creatures to people that people need to slowly trust over time to see we aren't as bad as people make us out to be.

>>34745514
yea, you're doing better?
what's your stats

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>>34747481
I average about a like a day in a metro area of about a million. I don’t swipe much but I get matched on 60-70% of those.

The first day I turned on the app I got 7 likes, but that was in a radius of 6 million or so. I once had four first dates in a weekend when I really put my back into it.

It was much easier when I was a Christian. Like shooting fish in a barrel.

>>34747539
that's pretty good man
i do get like around 1-2 matches a day perhaps a date a week or so
but i've just found it hard to convert any date into anything at all

which has been the frustration
it feels like they are using me

do you feel successful in dates, what's your strategy

>>34747272
You care too much about what a woman that is using dating apps as her main way to meet a partner thinks. Then again, you're on the app too, so maybe you deserve that

>>34747548
A date a week is excellent. If it’s not turning into more I wonder what’s going wrong. Could be you, could be you asking for dates with girls that aren’t good fits for you. My recent dates have been successful yeah. Good conversation, fun, light physical escalation, kissing, then a plan for the second date.

>>34747585
True, dating apps are kinda useless.

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I honestly feel so disconnected from this general. You guys are spending all this effort on girls... that aren't virgins, that you meet off dating apps, that make it hard for you and clearly aren't reciprocating. You're bragging about having success like this guy >>34747596, but your version of success is going on multiple dates, and you're still single and you're still on the apps. Seriously, what's the fucking point of this place? I thought it was to bag a high quality virgin woman to date and eventually marry? Isn't that what it's all about at the end of the day? You guys have completely lost sight of the point of dating.

>>34747607
I feel disconnected from most of the world, but I don't let it bring me down.

>>34747596
Possible, I have a feeling that any girl that chooses to go on dates with me, probably goes on dates with tons of other guys.
So the people I'm choosing are not necessarily choosing me.

For you, it sounds like naturally the girl is more compatible with you from the start
Because that tells me you're not really running any strategies or anything. Things just flow and she is receptive

My experience has not been like that.

>>34747607
Okay, I am part of that chain.
And I have two strategies:
One approach girls IRL, and this strategy has led me to meet many virgin girls.
But, the reason they are virgin iis apparent.
They just had a sheltered family life and are finally free. They are younger.
But, the pattern is that they feel pressured to become whores like all the other girls
And any attempt from a guy to stop that path is futile.

Now, that strategy is super low volume. You meet a nice virgin girl once to twicce a year

So it's not an effective strategy to find a wife.
Datiing apps just giive way more volume
And the gambling aspect of it is addictive.
You may find someone eventually...

My mindset is, if you're not exhausting all your options, you're not really advancing at a good pace.

>>34747607
I’m not looking for a virgin. I’m not a virgin. I’ve dated a virgin before. It was nearly two years before I was sexually satisfied with her. Dating app girls make it easy. They like you, you have a few messages of small talk or flirting, then you go on a date. What’s hard about that? There’s no failure in being single. Every currently married person was once single. I’ll probably end up in a relationship eventually.

>>34747619
They’re choosing you for that moment. Are you confident? Do you have an interesting life? I come off as someone they want to know more. I’m handsome, playful and I have plenty of stories.

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>>34747626
>Datiing apps just giive way more volume
Volume of shit. Your future wife is NOT on a dating app, therefore they are a waste of time. The dating apps and taking women from there on dates also has an opportunity cost. Your time is valuable. You could be spending all that time at the gym, maybe working extra shifts, reading books, working on a skill... anything to build up your attractiveness. So that when you do meet a high quality woman in real life, she will be interested. Or even just enjoying life instead

>>34747629
Because dating is inherently not a positive experience unless it leads to something. You could be doing literally anything else other than talking to a girl who it will go nowhere with. The only reason I think you even see your life as having any semblance of purpose is because you avoid mentally quantifying how much time you have actually spent on this bullshit.

How many dates have you been on total this year? Last year? I want you to quantify it, anon. Multiply the number by 4 hours, which is a massive understatement for how long it probably takes to go from swiping on the apps, to talking to a girl for a bit, to then taking her out and actually spending time on the date. Whatever number you get, I want you to multiply it by your job's hourly rate. What have you got? You have got the monetary cost of spending all this time on this bullshit. It's a lot of money, isn't it? And what's your reward? You're still single. I seriously don't think you understand just how much of a waste of time it is to be taking many women out on dates if it isn't translating to a fulfilling long term relationship. Having a 50% success rate is fine and worth the time investment. Having like a 5% success rate from dating apps? Genuinely unhinged

>>34747642
>Because dating is inherently not a positive experience unless it leads to something.
I don't agree. I like going on dates. It's fun to talk to girls and kiss them and feel them up and so on.
>You could be doing literally anything else other than talking to a girl who it will go nowhere with.
And I do those things on the days and nights I'm not on a date, which is most of them.
>The only reason I think you even see your life as having any semblance of purpose is because you avoid mentally quantifying how much time you have actually spent on this bullshit.
I don't think so.
>How many dates have you been on total this year?
10, all since late May I said.
>Last year?
0. I had a travel job that took up most of my time and I was in this phase where I thought I was meant to be alone. Plus I was living with my parents for most of it.
>Multiply the number by 4 hours
40
>Whatever number you get, I want you to multiply it by your job's hourly rate. What have you got? You have got the monetary cost of spending all this time on this bullshit. It's a lot of money, isn't it?
It's $0. I'm unemployed.
>And what's your reward?
I have a girl coming over tomorrow who really likes me. We're going to kiss. Then I'm going to feel her tits and suck on them. Then I'll give her oral sex and we'll probably have sex after that, then cuddle.
>I seriously don't think you understand just how much of a waste of time it is to be taking many women out on dates if it isn't translating to a fulfilling long term relationship.
I'll probably get there eventually.
>Having a 50% success rate is fine and worth the time investment. Having like a 5% success rate from dating apps? Genuinely unhinged
I don't consider any date a failure honestly, even the ones that I don't enjoy being on and leave me never wanting to see the girl again. They're all mile markers that point me in the direction I really need to go. They show me what I like and what I don't like. They also teach me about myself (contd)

>>34747642
>>34747671
(contd.) I'm genuinely thankful for every girl I've been on a date with. I remember all their names. I hope they're all doing well.

>>34747642
I like the way you think
I think the same way.
There is an inherent cost to meeting women.
But, being high value does not remove the cost.
It just shifts it to the future.

When do you choose to stop leveling up, and improving and start actually meeting women?
This is the conundrum.
I feel that people who can get regular dates on apps, have already done enough leveliing up that their pictures and lifestyle signals to girls gets them dates.

Also, volume seems to be the easiest to justify knob in the game. There may be other factors that influence your rate of success
But, some may truly be out of control, or locked behind copius amounts of time.
Take a good physique, to have a hollywwod level physique takes over 3 years in the gym.
Still would not be enough.
To get rich, would take insane levels of luck and skill that is also not realistic.
To be moderately fit, and moderately successful takes years as well.
And that seems to be the baseline

Volume seems to be the easiest knob to control in reaching success.
Things that raise your success rate are hard to quantify and seem to be mostly fugazi.

>>34747677
>I feel that people who can get regular dates on apps, have already done enough leveliing up that their pictures and lifestyle signals to girls gets them dates.
Everything that makes you more attractive to women is something you should be doing anyway. I mean think about the things women like.
>/fit/
>/fa/
>handsome
>good career
>social life
>hobbies
>interests
>good social skills
You could get all of these, never go on a date, and they would still make your life significantly better. Getting girls because of these things is really more of a side effect.

If you're not improoving you're doing life wrong.

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im obsessed with my married 40 yo female coworker

>>34747682
Exactly, that's just the baseline
If you're young you may have not achieved that yet
But for someone of my age, I feel I've achieved success in all those aspects
Yet, it still isn't enough is what I'm realizing
That's the lie they sell men

That, you become fit, you get a 6 fgure job, you finally get a sick tailored cucinelli fit, you photograph and play music proficiently.
It stll isn't enough.

Trust me. You will find out.
You as a human being is born with a success rate. And achieving success in all those aspects raises it multiplicatively. But if you inherent success rate is low, multplying is not as effective as you would think

Volume is still the best strategy towards sucess.

>>34741893
thank you so much for recommending him anon, hes funny as fuck and also the course is very well organized.

>>34747677
>To be moderately fit, and moderately successful takes years as well.
As someone both of those things, you're wrong. First, becoming moderately fit? Genuinely like 6 months to go from untrained to visibly looking strong and like you lift - way above average - as long as you do a strength routine and go to the gym 3x a week for an hour each day. Untrained guys overestimate how much time it takes by a lot.
And for monetary success? I'm a bit biased because my job offers overtime and pays more for it, but truth of the matter is you can save up a lot of money just giving up your Saturday each week for a year. Instead of going on pointless dates off dating apps, just go to work. You'll be saving money by not going out too, and in a year, you'll have more than you think.

I don't think you should prioritise either of these things over dates though... Dates that go somewhere. Not low quality low percent dates from dating apps. My point is that volume is pointless and your success in dating is not measured by how many dates you go on. In fact, the more you're going on, the less successful you are in my mind. You're wasting your life on nothing.

>>34747671
>>34747672
Fair enough, I don't feel the same way at all. To me, if it doesn't go anywhere, I've wasted my time. I was expecting you to have spent way more time on that than 40 hours too. But still, it's been 3 months since May. If you keep up the same pace, you'll spend 160hours on it over the course of the next year. I still don't think you realise the opportunity cost of 160 hours, IF you don't end up finding a good girl to long term date. I still think the volume approach of dating apps is a scam and your mindset (what you consider success) is very skewed. The only win in dating is a long term relationship or easy consistent access to casual sex, any other outcome is a waste of time and you need to treat it as such rather than something that's fine.

>>34747693
>Dates that go somewhere
that's the thing
you're basically stating:
don't go on dates that won't workout
yea that's like saying don't buy stocks that won't go up
it's just a fallacy

raise your success by only being successful...
yea that's not how it works

>>34747688
If we're being honest its really not enough to self improve for yourself, you have to improve in ways that women care about. Like its not enough to develop social skills, you'd get further just trying to be an asshole dark triad type. Its not enough to make money, you might need to do some tricking to get into some doors. The advice is just way too surface level.

>>34747688
You're still missing something. From reading your post my guess is it's your mindset. You seem to have fallen for several 4chan memes. Two that I can tell from just this post are
>a nefarious "they" working very hard to lie to men
>success being inborn rather than achieved
And I'm sure that there are many others. The attitude you need to believe these, or maybe the attitude believing this things results in, is unattractive to women. You may not tell girls directly about the "they" that lies to men, but you are always expressing (verbally and non-verbally) the mindset that led you to believe these things.

The solution might take a while, but it starts with not trusting what you read here when it's obviously posted by someone miserable who wants to spread their misery.

>>34738423
>>34735696
>I don't want to bother them. I don't wanna be that creep who's bugging women trying to just live their life.
>I'm an 8.5/10 who gets stared at by women in public all the time though
Then there's no reason not to? if you're actually that good looking you cannot be creepy unless you actively tried to.

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I have a well paid job (but remote with rare meetups in company's office) and hobbies (gym and language courses). The first and last time I had something resembling a chance to get a gf was two years ago. No potential gfs ever since. I dont find 95% of girls attractive and those who I do find attractive aren't in my vicinity or I don't have an opportunity to get to know them. Am I doing something wrong? Feels like I live just like other people live yet they are with gfs and I'm not.

t. 34 and VERY afraid I'll be in the same situation at 40

>>34747712
I worry about if I'm wrong and it's that 1/20 who doesn't find me attractive and doesn't want me to approach, I suppose.

>>34747711
exactly at the end of the day the goal post will always be moved
and it will be moved to something that is impossble to disprove
no it's not that you didn't acheive enough
you being on 4chan, or a belief you have is the cause of all your problems
that shit is pure fugazi, untestable.

what comes first the belief, or the evidence?
Throughout my life, I had vaying success with women. And as I got more handsome, more successful, that rate did not really improve substantially.
How I went from getting laid once a year to getting laid more often was just me meeting more women.

>>34747709
I do think you are up to something though.
The qualities that are attractive to women, the behaviors that are attractive seem to be in a way related to getting success in other aspects of life.

Okay. How about instead of hating yourself for being a 1-5 out of 10. You say, I have some issues, what can I do to move forward? Not go into this rabbit hole of negativity. Yes it's freaky you are a virgin at an old age, but you're supposed to look at it as a challenge to be your best self, not beat yourself up.

>>34747693
>Fair enough, I don't feel the same way at all. To me, if it doesn't go anywhere,
Well I'm a sperg who started off with very few social skills and very little self-awareness, so all social experiences function as clues for both of those things. I'm actually rather smooth now and know myself fairly well because I put myself out there, met people and tried things. Some worked out and some did not, but even the failures had plenty to teach me. For example, I went on five dates with a girl in June. Leading up to when she broke it off to me, she mentioned not being sure if I ever liked her and me not complimenting her much. So for my current girl and all future girls I will make sure not to hide how I feel and make sure I compliment.
>I still don't think you realise the opportunity cost of 160 hours, IF you don't end up finding a good girl to long term date.
I think you're overestimating how good I am at time management. I suck at it. I'm not productive at all. Dating is way better than what I usually do.
>The only win in dating is a long term relationship or easy consistent access to casual sex
Well then I expect to win soon by your definition. But again, all dates are "wins" to me, even the unsuccessful ones.
>any other outcome is a waste of time and you need to treat it as such rather than something that's fine.
I don't think I need to do that at all. Successful people seem to be pretty unanimous in thinking that failure is a key ingredient to success, not a waste of time. You know the Edison quote.
>I have not failed 10,000 times. I have not failed once. I have succeeded in proving that those 10,000 ways will not work. When I have eliminated the ways that will not work, I will find the way that will work.
Every "failure" with a girl teaches me something. I would not take back a single date.

>>34747724
I'm sure you can find some evidence that women are generally less attracted to men with shit attitudes if you look. But that fact seems axiomatic to me so I'm not sure why you would even bother.

>>34747699
>don't go on dates that won't workout
No, I'm saying don't go on low probability dates. Basically, dates with strangers from dating apps.

>>34747750
Those have great probability. I know so many relationships and marriages that started on apps. I know of none that started from a street approach.

>>34747733
>I went on five dates with a girl in June. Leading up to when she broke it off to me, she mentioned not being sure if I ever liked her and me not complimenting her much.
See, this is why dating is such a waste of time. You spend 20 hours with a shitty girl. You make one genuinely minor mistake. Instead of talking to you about it, she ends it and goes to restart the cycle of attention whoring on dating apps. And you're genuinely blaming yourself rather than the girl who wasted *20* hours of your time on nothing. You see her in a positive light. I could never do that. It's such a huge fucking scam. Any other activity, if you spend 20 hours on it, you would get something worthwhile. 20 hours at the gym, 20 hours at a job, 20 hours at a skill. But you have just spent 20 hours to learn one lesson to one specific girl, and I don't even think it's the correct one. Models says that complimenting a lot if it's not genuine is needy and offputting - you're doing it to get her to like you, not because you genuinely believe it. You've spent 20 hours to regress in your dating skill and get worse at it.

>>34747762
Street approach is in the same category as dating apps. It's still going on a date with a stranger. Both are dogshit.

>>34747750
fair point
it is probably optimal to have a life which generates interaction with women.
so that you know many women, and can then go on dates with the women you know.
i agree with that.
though, i've had a hard time making that a reality.
part of my 20s has been improving my social circle, going to events etc etc.
the rate at which i meet women, seems to not be enough.
there is no secret to getting more women into your life.
but idk, maybe someone here has found out how

>>34747765
>You spend 20 hours with a shitty girl.
I don't think she's shitty at all. I think she's pretty great. She has some issues of course but so does pretty much everyone.
>You make one genuinely minor mistake. Instead of talking to you about it, she ends it and goes to restart the cycle of attention whoring on dating apps.
Those weren't the primary reasons she ended it. The main one was that it was "like we were speaking two different languages." Having thought about it for a while, I think she was right. This wasn't a mistake by either of us, just an incompatibility. But I am going to take those other things she mentioned with me.
>And you're genuinely blaming yourself rather than the girl who wasted *20* hours of your time on nothing.
There's no one that needs to be blamed. Again, we just found out we were incompatible. That's fine. Very few people marry the first person they date. Dating the wrong people is part of the process. And I enjoyed every second of those 20 hours. They were really fun dates.
>You see her in a positive light. I could never do that. It's such a huge fucking scam. Any other activity, if you spend 20 hours on it, you would get something worthwhile. 20 hours at the gym, 20 hours at a job, 20 hours at a skill.
You couldn't be more wrong here. I actually lacked motivation to go to the gym before I started dating her. I went, but not very often, maybe one every week or two. Ever since I started dating her it's been four times a week, and this habit has continued to the present, well after the last time I spoke to her. I want the body I present to her, or any other girl, to be as good as it can be. I'm thankful to her for reminding me of how important fitness is to me. (contd.)

>>34747765
>>34747795
(contd.)
>But you have just spent 20 hours to learn one lesson to one specific girl, and I don't even think it's the correct one. Models says that complimenting a lot if it's not genuine is needy and offputting - you're doing it to get her to like you, not because you genuinely believe it.
So I'll compliment genuinely then. Easy. Models is also extremely clear that women want to feel desired, and I failed somewhat there. I won't next time.
>You've spent 20 hours to regress in your dating skill and get worse at it.
I got better at it actually.
>Street approach is in the same category as dating apps. It's still going on a date with a stranger. Both are dogshit.
Once you get to know them they're not strangers anymore.

>>34747781
They're called apps. If you can meet someone through your social circle and events, great. If not, there are thousands of girls on apps within 40 miles of you.

>>34747800
we circle around then, the whole convo was that apps generate cold, low -probability dates
so the high probability dates must come from non-strangers

meeting and generating non-strangers is the biggest bottleneck in dating today

>>34747795
>>34747797
I don't get your mindset at all. She didn't like you. "like we were speaking two different languages" is an emotional, indirect reason, it's genuinely awful communication and most definitely a lie. She's now also most definitely hooking up with some other guy. That doesn't bother you at all?

>>34747805
That's my point yeah. Would also add that the low probability dates are specifically not worth it due to the opportunity cost of spending that time working on yourself. Which will increase your chances when you do go on high probability dates and will overall make you happier.

>>34747811
>low probability dates are specifically not worth it due to the opportunity cost of spending that time working on yourself
see I tend to agree with all your points.
But, there is a caveat
Let's say you avoid those stranger dates, and live your life normally improving all aspects.
I feel that the date, the flow of it, the conversations, is in itself a skill that needs to be leveled up.
And non-stranger dates are too far and inbetween that wouldn't necessarily be enough to increase that skill.

So there's some opportunity cost avoiding dating app girls as well.
Of course there is a point, that is too much.

Yet, there is an issue I face in particular:
mathematically speakng, I may go on a social circle "high probability" date perhaps once a year. There is no guarantee that they will convert to long-term things.
It's still a probability. And the rates between high-probability and low-probability may be in fact closer than you imagine.

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I met a woman on a subreddit about a niche hobbit. We have been talking for weeks in private DMs, exchanged pics and talked about dating. She lives in another city in Germany, but in the same region.

She wanted to start talk politics with me, but I instantly shut her down and told her I won't. I have been stalking her reddit history afterwards and it's interesting, how active she was in feminist and man-hating subreddits, up until the moment we started talking with each other. From then on, only subreddits like Pokemon Go or fashion. Kinda curious isn't it? You think that will bite me in the ass later or was she an uncommitted feminist?

>>34748603
Women will spew misandry non stop on the internet until the moment they get a boyfriend then drop it immediately and only pick it up again after breaking up with their boyfriend. 90% of the time they aren't serious its just venting and complaining.

Just take salsa dancing lessons bro

>>34739696
Time heals all wounds, just remember that every time your mind starts wandering and you think of her. A few months down the line, you'll see someone else that looks like her, you'll be reminded of her again, but it won't hurt as bad. You'll say to yourself, oh yeah hope she's doing well, someone else will come along though. Hope you find what you're looking for though, gl.

>>34748603
>>34748615
Yeah what this anon said. It honestly isn't even a red flag or a sign of a crazy. It's legit just normal.

>>34748603
>I met a woman on a subreddit about a niche hobbit. We have been talking for weeks in private DMs, exchanged pics and talked about dating
Any advice on how I can have the same thing happen to me? This sounds like a dream

>>34747691
Where do I get that course for free? I searched and only found some site with a virus

>be me
>retail cuck
>admittedly really attractive woman comes up to me
>starts asking me something I don't know
>tell her I don't know but can bring someone that does
>starts to karen out
>immediately shut that shit down and get slightly hostile with her
>instant 180, starts being very friendly with constant preening

So it does work, I'm too jaded to care but that's interesting. She genuinely pissed me off though so that helps I guess

>>34749901
Nope. Not real, try again

>>34749952
Not sure what I gain from making up a story, easier way to get (You)'s if that's the goal

>>34747691
Yes, he's funny. I disagree with him on christianity though.
Did you learn anything interesting?

>two numbers obtained this week
watch out anons, chad is in the thread

>>34750160
See, its not so hard.

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getting numbers and going out isn't that hard. the difficult part is getting second dates. i've only gone out with two girls in my life and they both ghosted me after the first date. the problem is that i can't tell what i need to improve on, assuming that i'm always the problem
but third time's the charm eh?

>>34750160
Don't celebrate just yet, survive gettin ghosted first

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You can't let how people's defensive behavior is hurt how you see yourself. People are just naturally defensive about impressions they encounter and do judge a book by its cover. The right woman will look through this. The wrong woman will assume everything negative about you from your cover. People just live in a horrible world anon.

>>34733668
How do I seduce a girl? Is wining and dining enough?

>>34749592
on yandex search date iq 2.0 mega.nz
>>34749971
kinda yes but andrew tates course was better desu

>>34747805
Apps actually give you warm high-probability dates.

Most dating advice assumes alcohol consumption at some juncture or other. How do you do it sober?

>>34747811
>I don't get your mindset at all. She didn't like you.
Not liking me is not a crime. And she must have liked me some to spend so much time with me and invite me to meet her friends.
>"like we were speaking two different languages" is an emotional, indirect reason, it's genuinely awful communication and most definitely a lie.
There is literally nothing wrong with having emotion. And communication is very important, so if it's awful that's kind of a deal breaker. And it wasn't a lie, it was true.
>She's now also most definitely hooking up with some other guy.
Maybe. Maybe not.
>That doesn't bother you at all?
Why would it? I'm hooking up with another girl. If she has found another guy I truly hope he's the one. She deserves someone great.

>>34749185
Bro's dream is a hobbit redditor.

>>34750305
I've said it here before but charming women isn't actually much different from charming anyone else. So think about your interactions with people who aren't girls you want to out with. Do they like you? Do they think you're funny? Do they enjoy talking with you? If yes, then it's probably not your personality and may be your looks or something. If no, you need to make personality games.

>>34750929
Why would you want to? Alcohol makes dates so much easier and more fun I'm struggling to come up with a valid reason to not to use it. Stomach issues I suppose.

>>34750950
*gains

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>got two good reactions after sliding into this older chick's DM's
>maybe have one more shot
>still feel like I'm gonna get smoked
i'm scared bros

>>34750959
If the worst happens, keep your spirit while you drift away from her.

>>34750955
I quit drinking 8 years ago and I'm not going to start again.

>>34750970
based

>>34750955
nta, but i just don't like alcohol. also i do have stomach issues and medical problems that would worsen with alcohol. also most girls i talk to at my college don't drink. in my case, i'd like sober advice

>>34750950
i don't have friends so i can't learn much there. well, if i can't even make friends, then it must be my personality
the fact that i can get numbers must mean my looks and first impressions are good, but the girls later find out that they don't enjoy talking with me or they dislike the fact that i'm not getting intimate
that's all i can think of. i have no clue how to get people to enjoy talking with me. it seems like a natural trait

>>34751052
You don't need friends specifically. Anyone who can talk will do. Conversation skills can be learned like any other skill. I read several books that helped me with this among other things.
>How to Win Friends and Influence People - Carnegie
>How to Talk to Anyone - Lowndes
>Models - Manson
>7 Habits of Highly Effective People - Covey (especially chapter 5)
>Emily Post's Etiquette, the Centennial Edition - Post
>The Charisma Myth - Cabane
And if you search around I'm sure you can find other good ones.
>I don't have time to read
Then listen.

Disclaimer: Girls almost universally want someone who is fun and confident. If you're not both of those things, good conversation skills won't conceal that fact for long, so work on that too (may take a while).

I commute to work everyday, about 1.75 hrs there, 1.75 back. After doing this for a year, this girl from my old highschool class has started doing the exact same commute at the same times. It's been a few weeks now, and we still haven't said anything. How tf am I meant to even speak to her?
I've tried to make eye contact multiple times but as soon as she sees me, she just turns away or looks down to avoid me. She also always has headphones in, and we never spoke before in highschool so I assume she doesn't want to speak to me at all.
My first issue is I don't know how to naturally start speaking with her after it's already been a few weeks and she blocks herself off from me. Then how would I turn a conversation into something interesting or flirty instead of just basic catch-up. But then the worst part, if it goes badly or she doesn't want to speak and I'm just forcing it, then we have 3.5 hrs everyday of awkward interactions.
Do I just leave it and we never speak or am I being a pussy? Or both.

Does anyone here actually fuck? I have a question but I'm having doubts about whether anyone who actually knows the answer is in here.

>be me
>read this thread to try to get hope
>remember that im 5'2
>22 khv
>stop reading

>>34751103
>Models
i've been interested in reading this so i'll check it out. much appreciated anon