Agree or no?
>>144180765100% agree and I don't think that's even debatable.
posting a thread with a twitter op should be a bannable offense
>>144180765Dick has no reason to have civilian friends. It makes way more sense to hang out with Titans and Batfam, etc. on his off duty hours than him having some weak ass civilian job that doesn’t matter and civilian support cast that’s just arbitrarily there because genre conventions dictate it
>>144180816This, complain about Spider-Man not having any civilian friends I get. But Dick's been doing this life since he was 12. Being a superhero is just everyday life.
>>144180765Veterans, cops, and activists have their names shown despite fighting against powerful malevolent figures. The superhero identity stuff doesn't really cut it anymore, the public is more inclined to protect you unless if you're nobodies like Boeing whistleblowers.
>>144180765Agree. It's been a noticeable trend for a while that there's much fewer civilian characters in the Big Two these days.
>>144180994>cops ... have their names shown despite fighting against powerful malevolent figurespowerful malevolent figures like pet dogs or their own wives
>>144180765Does Bendis count as caring when he makes civilian characters just to claim rights to them?
>>144180994>Veterans, cops, and activists have their names shown despite fighting against powerful malevolent figuresYou mean fighting for them
>>144180765That's true.Superheroes don't feel like heroes anymore. They're not saving or protecting anyone. They are just dolls being slammed against other dolls.
>>144181484>I don’t read comics but here’s my shitty take‘Kay. Thanks for me playing.
>>144180765I’ll agree that secret identities are an antiquated idea when discussing how these comics could have a twinge of “reality” to them. But they’re also absolutly necessary in developing these characters as people. Superhero comics are fundamentally soap operas for boys so you really want those issues with them as civilians dealing with work family and their love life for those of us who like a fuller story. Ultimate spider-man (bendis) was the last time a comic really focused on that, and that shot itself in the foot by NEVER progressing the character in the slightest. I think hickmans ultimate is going to eventually suffer similarly by sticking him at an end game, but comic companies should note that the success of that comic so far has been embracing the civilian side of spidey
>>144181484A /co/mrade put it best when he said they're just celebrities with superpowers.
>>144180816>Dick has no reason to have civilian friends.But remember when he did?
>>144181550No. That’s how dull it was.
>>144180765>one guy is immediately killed and the villain and his aide threaten the other guy to never tell anyoneHonestly it's surprising how rare it is for others to find out a superhero's secret identity. Also this is the last arc of Taylor's run. None of this is going to matter.
>>144180765Maybe this is part of it.But I think there's more to it than this and it comes down to 2 things these lefty writers are always obsessed with: the idea of "the rebellion/revolution" and identity in general i.e. individualism.The idea of a lone person doing good on their own with a secret identity and otherwise blending into society is unappealing for both these reasons. It's vigilantism that often blurs the line between the good guys and the bad guys which is not what they want.The true "hero" in their mind always has to be part of a bigger "cause" that is undeniably right but almost paradoxically they also have to emphasize their individuality in that system. They can't just be doing good for it's own sake they need credit and they can't just be grunt #2 because that doesn't fit the fantasy.On a base level having an anonymous identity destroys the ability to have "accountability" and "transparency", words they love to use, and most importantly of all it destroys the ability to meaningfully virtue signal. Which coincidentally is probably the reason they don't like this website very much either.The ultimate leftist power fantasy is to be Che Guevara, Ghandi, etc... so that's what they make their superheroes to reflect. Leftists actually have way more of a hero complex themselves so they need everything to be overly serious and realistic otherwise it can't reflect their fantasy to fix real world issues. And people not being able to put 2 and 2 together that Clark Kent is Superman is not realistic. It's an abstraction from an abstract world. In a way it's really a more complex level of symbolism than leftists are interested in.
>>144181989>I think it's more to do with [absolute rambling schizo bullshit]why do we not inject /pol/tards with bleach
>>144180994>Veterans, cops, and activists have their names shown despite fighting against powerful malevolent figuresshut up stupid, those fights aren't personal or as intense
>>144182009They were injecting themselves with it for a while
>>144182009Shhh little baby anon, I know the truth can be upsettingIt's okay just go back to your comfort threads on twitter where everyone agrees with youEverybody is crazy except you and your friends
>>144182046lmao tru
>>144181550It was shit. The only note worthy civilian cast member was the Roarbach and the other female cop from the early Rebirth days.
>>144180765While he's right, the issue here is that Tom Taylor is a bad writer. 90% chance Zucco dies (probably from his daughter) since he was dead before this run anyways
>>144180765Is this comic run even mid?
>>144180816Exactly. The only friends he has that people care about are the Titans and Babs.
>>144180816dick's identity going public could expose bruce.
>>144181989>their fantasy to fix real world issuesBut that's the thing. They don't want to actually fix anything or help anyone, as that would make them obsolete and rob them of the attention and validation they seek. They want to be KNOWN for doing good, not actually do good. Just look up which demographics do the most volunteering and donating to charity.
>>144181542>Ultimate spider-man (bendis) was the last time a comic really focused on that, and that shot itself in the foot by NEVER progressing the character in the slightestOne anon suggested a while back that only the first six trades of Ultimate should be read and that's it.
>>144181989>It's vigilantism that often blurs the line between the good guys and the bad guys which is not what they want.But that's the coolest part.
The problem is:>Unbearable side cast who get replaced with the next creator.I mean the storylines with side characters are so soap opera bland that they may as well not even be there in the first place.
>>144180994Yeah and when they confront kingpin like villains Their family members are all at risk. What are you retarded? How do you not know this shit.
Technology just keeps advancing to where any villain with a little money and time could figure who they are. The fact more haven't is baffling.
>>144182765That just raises the question of why cops haven't kept up. They can easily get military tech in the budget.
>>144182770Babs has a magical algorithm that distorts or scrubs any close-ups of heroes from social media, except when she doesn't because nothing is consistent.
Secret identities existed because comics were for kids, and kids like the idea of having secrets. Of having something they know that the adults don't know. The average comic reader now is 35-45, with bitch tits.
>>144182787Because this is all dependent on how competent your government isOr if the mafia/cartel/criminal origination is getting outside helpMafia threatening cop's family members used to be a thing till cops and the government neutered them.Cartels meanwhile can threaten with impunity,Cops being threatened is still a thing in the US just more under the table.
>>144182824You think adults don't like the idea of having secrets? If anything I think middle aged adults probably fantasize about escaping to a secret life more than anybody.
>>144182770I mean that is suspension of disbelief inherent in multiple forms of fiction.
>>144181550No, not really. There hasn't been a reason for him to keep a proper secret identity and a bunch of normies around as supporting characters since the Grayson run.
>>144180765This is hardly a new thing though. You guys remember that video of Stan Lee helping design a superhero in the 90's and he's constantly pushing for them to humanize the guy or give him a weakness or marry him to someone and Rob Liefeld just keep replying with 'Nah, he's OverKill. Let's give him some wires, he's OverKill. Who else could he be?'
Heroes now lack any humanity and when they try and give them some humanity they speak like robots. I am convinced writers who spend too much time online forget the patter of normal human conversation and instead they act like a Pixar character with one up turned eyebrow being Whedon style whitty or expressing shitty flat bland talking points, back and forth, often with cringe dialogue or bonus points for some political point.
>>144180786100% agree and I don't think that's even debatable.
Complaining about Dick Grayson's secret identity is really complaining about Bruce Wayne's secret identity. But if Bruce didn't have a secret identity then he'd basically just be Tony Stark, or DC's equivalent, John Henry Irons. Or a middle-ground, like Michael Holt.Batman is Batman. He needs his secret identity. So so does Nightwing.
>>144184211their human moments is when they eat Fast Food with Other Heroes in Full Costume and say "omg this is sooooo tasty...."
>>144185180"Bruce Wayne is the secret identity" is pretty much canon as far as DC is concerned, which means it only matters as a plot device to explain how he can afford his tech.
>>144180765Anon, the *only* superhero that actually needs a secret identity in order for the concept to work are Spider-Man and maybe Daredevil. For everyone else it doesn't really matter. It's a Golden/Silver Age relic. Civilian plotlines are mostly just a slog and due to decompression plus readers demanding action every issue they are rarely a focus anymore. Frankly, at this point DC could make Batman and Superman's secret identities public tomorrow and it wouldn't change the core of these characters much at this point (in fact, they already did it with Clark a few times).As >>144180816 said, Dick already has the batfamily and the Titans, as well as whoever else you need like Defacer. You don't really need anyone else.
>>144181989>lefty writers are always obsessed with: the idea of "the rebellion/revolution" and identity in general i.e. individualismit's way simpler than that. modern comic writers are all about vanity and like to pretend they are celebrities for writing capeshit. the shitty x-men hellfire galas were the perfect representation of this when all the writers had the characters they self insert as have a shitty party with god awful attire that actual celebrities they are obsessed with have. comic writers are all vain and have an inflated ego, so the idea of somebody not flaunting the things they do to fellate themselves is completely incomprehensible to them. this is why the secret identity is dead.
>>144180786MUH TWITTEROh shut the fuck up. Go after the shill threads you're so concerned about the sanctity of your fucking board.
>>144180994Cops wear masks to raid drug lords all the time, because they don't want themselves or their families killed in their off-hours.
>>144180765I always hate to see this subject come up.While it's true modern writers put little importance and nuance into the heroes' civilian identities these days, I only ever see this sentiment come from social media types that would be far more content with slice of life AUs like Wayne Family Adventures than conventional superhero stories.
>>144180786Bot post
>>144180786Cropped out stats make me wonder if the OP between both is the same.
>>144182009>Redditspacing>/pooooool/!Everyone thinks the same about you migrants.
>>144186377>the shitty x-men hellfire galas were the perfect representation of this when all the writers had the characters they self insert as have a shitty party with god awful attire that actual celebrities they are obsessed with have.Holy shit, please tell me you have the pages dubsman.
>>144186714You don't have to announce that you're a bot.Especially since it's so self-evident.
>>144181037Leftoids beat their wives and rape their daughters
Scroll by and see an interesting thread about how comics have moved away from secret ID and civilian supporting casts but it looks like a bunch of politics shit?
>>144187490Leftoids have convinced themselves that "everything is art" and "all art is political" therefore "everything is political"
>>144180816>Get even slightly hurt by Bruce Wayne or Dick Grayson while they're illegally participating in vigilantism:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeXQBHLIPcw
>>144187518I don’t see any leftists here though
>>144180765It's a pity, because Clark Kent was always a more interesting person than Superman.
>>144187556They exist as the voices in his head.
>>144180994>>144181037>>144181436Fucking retards like you should have your heads bashed in for being this retarded
>>144187556>muh cops are pigsthats a leftist talking point>>144187582Classic liberal pig right here
>>144181037>>144187490>>144187556>>144187582antifags rape kids btw
>>144180765I'd say that it's more modern comic writers are just continuing a trend that's been around for a long time in other depictions of those characters.Look at how Batman evolved in the DCAU from having Bruce Wayne be pretty distinct from Batman in BTAS to basically being Batman out of the suit in TNBA to basically not existing in JL.Executives don't like that sort of thing since they feel it confuses viewers; Teen Titans basically treated their other identities as Easter eggs.
>>144187633Dont you understand that coulda been been one of them!Get rid of guns so people like him can be protected.
>>144180994You do know they keep names of things like swat members or agents as confidential right? They are not broadcast or shared unless they really really have to be.
>>144187673
>>144187597>Classic liberalA centrist or center-right ideology.>>144187633>anti-fagsPeople who dislike homosexuals.
>>144187597>>muh cops are pigs>thats a leftist talking pointHatred of cops is pretty much an across the board thing in practice. The main difference between the left and right there is that the latter talks about supporting them but, when it comes down to it, they hate them just as much as the most hardcore leftist.
>>144187689This and many other incidents killed any reconciliation for me.I will never ever willing work with someone or anyone that associates with these types of "people".>>144187702>A centrist or center-right ideology.you are none of those things
>>144187715>we need to keep our police on a tight leash so they wont become corrupt and power hungry, after all we still need them to enforce lawsvs>kill all cops, fry em in a blanket, ima vote in this person who will defund police. Wait why is crime rising?These are not the same.
>>144182787If the police were sufficient to fight against the bad guys, there wouldn't need to be super heroes.
>>144187716>you are none of those thingsSays who? I mean literally says who?I've been called all sorts of things due to my eclectic beliefs.Mostly from morons like you who see everything in a black vs white, us vs them perspective.No realising that most humans, most ideologies don't fit into perfectly neat categories.
>>144187779You are said Moron Why lie? You’re not fooling anyone. You went rabid the first moment some conservative talked trash about leftists. But never vice versa.You were clearly butthurt. That’s fine. But don’t pretend no one noticed you’re nowhere near center
>>144180765100% agree. Just look at Spider-man, they fucking turned MJ into a superhero.
>>144186377Holy projection, Batman!
>>144187743>Wait why is crime rising?Crime is at an all time low and has historically kept dropping after a momentary spike due to Covid related circumstances. A lot more violent crime happens in red states but right wingers don’t like to admit this because it ruins their narrative.
>>144188566Haha yeah, red places are crime ridden shitholes>black kid gets shot because he stole a car and tried to run down 5 police officersOh sorry be right back gotta burn my city down haha
>>144180765While it's true, I don't think this is what going on here. Taylor has been building (poorly) on Dick's civilian life as this philantrope millionaire and use the unmasking as a way to make it seems like Dick's life is in danger twice in his run, so he cares in his own way. But why would hack writers care about secret identities when they can kill off or wipe the memories of any inconvenient witnesses by the end? Taylor did the same with Blockbuster.>>144182734>couldIt would and should expose Bruce and anyone associated with him. That including Dick's sweetheart, which unlike the rest has a civiliain life thanks to being Jim's daughter.
>>144186417Yeah one wrong justifies another, two wrongs make a right.
>>144180765>US comics writers: People don't care about civilian lives or downtime here's 22 pages of setup for another super-fight and some setup scenes for the next issues super-fight>Manga: All our characters have rich social lives outside of fight scenes and we have entire volumes just dedicated to subplots that have nothing to do with fighting bad guysWhy are western comics like this? Are they just that narrow-minded that they don't understand that rich narratives are better than one-note stuff?
>>144188786>another fucking thread gets shitted up by an East vs West retardLike fucking clockwork, anyway your SHARTnime heroes are social retards, when they're not LITERAL RETARDS.
If you want a shining example of how removing all kind of civilian stuff from a character makes them into a big nothing look no further than Carol Danvers.Unless you are doing a pure space book like Silver Surfer, the greater power and importance you heap onto a character the more important it gets to show that they're still a person under there. You need to fucking know what they're fighting for. "Career military" was already a terrible idea for Carol but then making her just be Captain Marvel all the time was an even worse one because really what is there left of her as a person? She has a cat. She hangs out with Spider-Woman. That's about it. Since KSD's run Carol has just become an icon, a vague outline of a superhero with no clear personality other than "she's the BEST". I mean fuck me, that single scene of her in Rainbow Rowell's She-Hulk gave her more personality than she has had in almost 10 years worth of her solo comic. And her latest run even showed how little personality she has by putting her in a situation where she's in the Negative Zone half the time while the other character is on Earth and it in NO way causes Carol any emotional distress or problems other than "What if I can't punch somebody when it's needed?". She's so far detached from anything relatable there's no concern of losing touch with friends or family, no social life to speak of, no hobbies or interests.Characters don't need secret identities but civilian identities where they can be just people are vital to superhero fiction in general or else it's just smashing action figures together for 22 pages a month.
>>144180765Yes but also other reason lying beneath: Thanks to modern Internet the average Joe (i.e. the writers) has lost all idea of keeping privacy. So they don't care about doing it, not because they prefer the heroes, but because they can't comprehend why anyone would wish to keep parts of their life private and separated from their work
>>144188815>B-but what about...Yes there are exceptions to this obviously. Don't try to be fucking Sherlock Holmes by pointing out whatever character you feel breaks the "rule".
>>144188786>All our characters have rich social lives outside No they don’t.
>>144188786>Manga: All our characters have rich social lives outside of fight scenes and we have entire volumes just dedicated to subplots that have nothing to do with fighting bad guysBut that's false and not even comparable. In MHA, being a superhero is literally a job and thus the barrier between capes and civillian life is non existent.A more fairer comparison would be Kamen Rider, Ultraman, Cyborg 009, Devilman etc....
>everybody responds to the obvious b8 postcome on
>>144180994Except, several people within those institutions take on assignments where they are undercover, essentially creating an alter ego to perform the investigation. They wear masks when performing raids.When giving statements, witnesses are asked their legal names for the record. After this act they are sometimes sequestered away and placed in a new identity for their protection.Cops in every country suffer retaliation for their jobs. Fucking Border security agents are known for wearing disguises and taking obfuscation routes to their homes with are longer than necessary.
Oh no, Nightwing's identity is exposed. What ever will happen now...
>>144180765Hold up if this fatass found out dick is nightwing shouldn't he also have pieced together Batman is Bruce?
>>144181550No? Dick has NEVER had a stable civilian supporting cast member.Amy Rohrbach and Bridget Clancy are the only ones who survived multiple writers and never got turned into heroes or villains. Amy having been at the end of Dixon's run and the beginning of Devin's run, and Bridget being a lot of Dixon's run until issue 45 or so and popping back up for one cameo each in OYL and Taylor's run. And mind you according to comic vine Amy is in 43 issues and Bridget in 53 (and at least 2-3 of those in each are just trades counting as issues bc that's how comic vine works).Dixon dumped most of the early cast (with Bridget being the last one dumped) in favor of the batfamily.
