>replaces shadowcatwas she better or worse as the resident new girl?
>>144538834Better. She was more fun. Only thing she had less is that she really only had a meaningful dynamic for logan and gambit. She also had better dynamics with generation x than kitty did the new mutants.
>>144538834Kitty > Jubilee > Idie > Armor > X-23
So much better, Kitty is inflated by aging gen Xers who has a crush on her. I have no nostalgic bias for Jubilee, I'm a zoomer, she's fun and Kitty is a whiny bitch.
>>144538896Lol nah. Idie and armor are so boring.
>>144538834Better, at least compared to post-Claremont Kitty. Jubilee was way more relaxed and down to earth, and just overall more genuine. Post-Claremont Kitty reeks of a upper-middle class liberal who's only into heroics to make herself feel better.
>>144538834They kind of have the opposite problems. Kitty has better overall dynamics with her respective X-Men team. However character wise she is really lacking because the only role she ever really played was just the little sister to everyone. Meanwhile Jubilee never really felt as connected to her team outside of her dynamic with Logan. But as character she's a lot more bombastic then Kitty has ever been and can be more fun to read. Who is better largely all depends on what you want out of a team book.
>>144538912Id say kitty is good..when she stopped being the kid. Jubilee was fun all along.
>>144538834Better, more fun, better powrs, her dynamic wuth wolverine was cute.
>no one makes any good jubilee fan artwe just take what we can get
>>144538921Yeah but they have better relationships with LoganAnd suit the "less experienced member of the X-Men" role than Laura can because she's an experienced assassin
>>144538951Have you even really looked?
>>144538952Idk, armor just feels too much like a re-do of kitty for me. And idie feels very botched . But it had potential. Having 3 so close also hurts their standing.I mean laura doesnt really do that role, she's just tied to logan.
>>144538834The problem with shadowcat is even back then she was starting to become a mary sue as everyone who became a writer wanted to fuck her.
>>144539010It's no wonder why she was sidelined in the movies.
>>144538926But what about that time Logan and Nightcrawler conspired to lure Colossus to a bar and start a fight with Juggernaut so Colossus would get his ass kicked or worse because Colossus decided he did not want to fuck a then underage Kitty? Logan and Nightcrawler have no sympathy for Colossus and when he calls them out on how he could have died they both just tell him "you should've fucked the underage jewess, tovarisch!"
>>144539053>But what about that time Logan and Nightcrawler conspired to lure Colossus to a bar and start a fight with Juggernautthey didnt even know juggernaut was there, since they didnt recognize him without his helmetwolverine recognized his scent but decided that it was better to leave sleeping dogs liecolossus only got into a fight after accidentally spilling beer on juggernaut who responded by whacking him through a wall
>>144538834Jubilee is fun. Kitty's so full of herself all the fucking time. Current Kitty is the self-insert of most female writers.XTAS worked so well with Jubilee and people remembers it more than EVO with Shadowcat.
>>144539038Ellen Page played the annoying know it all part quite well.
did they?
>>144539249They absolutely did.
>>144538834Well, Shadowcat was supposed to be the headliner for Excalibur but that flopped.
>>144539187Evo is pretty popular idk.
>>144539249God, its amazing how the show managed to suck all the life out of sunspot as a character and make him jubilee's most boring pairing
>>144539249For the sake of my sanity, I choose no.
>>144538921X-23 is a lazy character
>>144539249"For your 18th birthday we told Roberto to take your virginity away"
>>144539287I wouldn't say it flopped, given the length of its run. It was also supposed to be more a continuation for Captain Britain's solo, before ultimately falling deeper into the X-Men hole. I know Warren Ellis gets shit on a lot (rightly so for the most part) but his run wasn't completely terrible either, and it pulled the book away from being just another generic X-title, at least for a little while.Every other iteration of the title absolutely did flop, though, and don't even justify their existence.
>You will never spend a day being a mall rat with Jubilee during the '90s.
>>144539340Eh, she had more character than ide or armor.
Still my preferred ship for jubes.
Kate is such a lame ass character her actress turned into an actor.
>>144538834>replaces shadowcatPerhaps the New Mutants were Kitty Pryde's original replacement: she would mature and ultimately join the X-Men as an equal, while TNM take the role of kid heroes for young readers to relate.
>>144539542They werent that much in the main x-men book desu, and by the time jubes debuted they were more separate.
>>144539448Not really. She mostly just existed in a constant state of >I'm a weapon but I learn to have friends on repeat though most of NXM and Academy and then the writers pretty much stopped even attempting to give her a consistent personality at all.
>>144538834White is always right.
>>144538834She's actually likable as a person, what most unlikeable thing about her? She a kid that's it vs Kitty who just a mess.
>>144539658Not really, in that run she grew and changed. She only got reset for her solo later. And blaming characters instead of bad writers like bendis (who couldn't characterize anyone)is stupid. And that's more than idie or armor got lol
>>144539618And Kitty had been on Excalibur for a few years. X-Men didn't have a "kid" for a while there. Rogue filled the role, I guess.
>>144539689Well yeah, jubilee was made to fill that role.
>>144539681She hasnt said racial slurs. But here that's a con.
>>144539681>what most unlikeable thing about her?The baby.
>>144539455It was cute
>>144539686Shes been a personality devoid charisma vacum from introduction and hasnt changed because thats her default. all of that trauma and social retardation allows women to project on her.
>>144539764I dont know, i think she definitely had a personality under kyle and yost, (taciturn and literal minded in a technical way while not having a lot of actual understanding of the world is a personality ) outside of that its debatable. But it wasn't until bendis where that got removed. And again, its bendis.And idk, laura is popular with people. Armor and idie arent.
>>144539773Laura has a thread with 300 posts 2 decades after her introduction, what do the other two have?
>>144539764Maybe? But armor is just a generic teenage girl and idie has the same personality Laura has to begin with.
>>144539775Armor has appearances in popular media.
She smol
>>144539809One anime that is largley forgotten (it is pretty good tho, just never really discussed) vs two cartoons and the most popular movie with wolverine which made 600 million dollars and a popular fighting game (as well as 5 other not particularly popular games).
who the fuck is 'idie'?>>144539796middle haircut and jacket on right under outfit.
>>144539811What's her type?>Synch>Skin>Chamber>Tim>That one guy from her ongoing>Sunspot (TAS)>Iceman (EVO)
>>144539828The girl with half ice half fire powers from generation hope. She's not super memorable.
>>144539829>X-23>MonetJubilee bi as fuck
>>144539832sounds like a shitty middle school OC
>>144539833>X-23Eh, the one particularly romantic moment between the two is just laura trying to kill herself using jubilee to do it.
>>144539838Generation Hope is probably the worst attempt at a new gen. Only transonic was half cool.
>>144539801Armor at least has a back and forth with Logan. She's the teacher's pet X-kid who wants to actually graduate to X-men and we saw her go from kid in over her head to actual super hero. She's not a complex character but she IS a character. >>144539773>And idk, laura is popular with people. Armor and idie arent.Spider- Gwen is popular with people, you want to pretend that means anything?
>>144539847Yes, so is laura. Cold weapon finding humanity is pretty archetypical but its a character. You can dislike the character, but its a character. You seem to be confusing that you don't like that type with the idea that it somehow makes it a less legitimate character type.
>>144539847Good that you ignored any point to focus on that. Point is there's stuff to make laura different form logan's other sideckiks. Everything armor does jubilee and kitty already do for logan. And everything idie does laura already does.
>>144539847Google Translate.
>>144539847And every other writer forgot that characterization. If that's a point against laura it sure is a point against armor.
>>144539838She kinda like Storm except she was considered a demon due to her powers in Africa while Storm was praised as a goddess. I'm still amazed that they have never talked to each other.
>>144539893Isn't that just nightcrawlers shtick?
>>144539827What two cartoons?Her first appearance where shes a shitty oc donutsteel deviant art creation and like always a random bastard pops up and acts like a retard to a guy it thinks is its father?And...?Plus a movie fucking no one has seen or wants too?
>>144539915his thing is being a tranny/lesbian buttbaby and way to dunk on the chritian chuds
>>144539920Where she had two popular episodes. . More than what armor had with one forgotten anime lol.Logan made 600 million dollars. Sorry that means plenty of people wanted to watch it.What even is your point? You can dislike Laura. But she's in media and she's popular.
>>144539915No because he looks like a demon.
>>144539937Are you ok?>>144539947Well yeah but being treated like a demon for being a mutant. Seems like it's the same
>>144539955He wasn't the only one. Remember when "killcrops" were a thing?
>>144538834Jubilee>Laura>Armor>Kitty>Idie>cannonball (he was Logans side kick for a second)
>>144539965You're right. Just saying Kurt is the most famous example of one.
>>144539870>If that's a point against laura it sure is a point against armor.Perhaps but the key difference is that Laura gets way more appearances shoved down everyone's necks regardless of who's buying them or not. You want to argue Armor's underwritten then fine I'll agree but she's also under utilized unlike Laura who has to become the center of attention in every book she touches.
>>144539893Sounds even more like a bad oc desu
>>144539945Jubilee is in xmen97.Laura? nowhere to be found.Two eps of a forgotten mid xmen series.And the weakest part of logan.wooo>>144539955Oh...you havent hears about nightcrawlers new origin..
>>144539993She only did so in new xmen (and she didnt get the most page count there). And in that one armor got shoved in at the end too. Laura was a non factor in academy. She got two issues of any focus under bendis. And all her appearances in teams since she just growls like wolverine and does nothing. Also the point was that armors personality also got entirely removed later. Not being underwritten. Neither is.
>>144539998We are talking in relation to armor. Who just showed up in the anime that's the second least talked about xmen show.And she is the emotional core of that film. You can't have the movie without her.
>>144540020>And she is the emotional core of that film. You can't have the movie without her.Doesn't mean Logan wasn't doing the heavy lifting. She's a plot device.
Both Shadowcat and Jubilee are going to be significant characters in the later part of my fanfic series. They're teens in the 80s, and the school is run by Scott and Jean because Xavier is ill and decrepit(mixture of a hard life, space radiation from going to space for a while, and age. He was in his late 20s to early 30s in the 60s when the fic begins). They're both contemporaries with each other, along with Rogue, Gambit, Colossus, and countless others. Their generation is much more an ensemble cast, compared to the previous x-team that Scott and Jean grew up in which was smaller.Sadly for these new mutants, the attempt at a cultural revolution for mutant acceptance back in the 70s was mixed at best, and now in the 80s snide veneers of tolerance and rapidly advancing technology is leading to a silenced mutant minority in danger of a revitalized Sentinel project, where instead of spec-ops in Stark funded and engineered power armour like they were in the 70s, they're full on robots.
>>144539833Get out of here with that shit. Is it really improbable for a person to have close friends of the same sex without getting shipped with them?
>>144538951>>no one makes any good jubilee fan artDisagree.
>>144540470Is this from porn?
Aren't the only versions of Shadowcat that people tend to remember usually the one from the X-Men Evolution cartoon, or from the original Ultimate Spider-Man comics?
>>144539287Kitty was never supposed to be the headliner of Excalibur. That was always supposed to be Captain Britain. Kitty and Kurt were put on Excalibur as a super cynical move by Claremont to force people to buy the book, by effectively purging two of the most popular X-Men from the main title and forcing fans to have to buy a spin-off to see their new adventures. The consequence of which was that it basically caused the two to be omitted from the biggest commercial period of the franchise and resulted in a generation of fans giving not one single fuck about either, much to the butt-hurt of those Gen Xers who worshipped Kitty. And Harras kept them in virtual exile because of a huge amount of hubris where NO X-Book COULD BE CANCELED and only until the 1998 35 anniversary celebration year, did Harras finally have the balls to kill Excalibur and move them back to the main roster, where writers shoved them down readers throats and then some to "make up for lost time".
>>144540545we need vanilla porn starring jubilee that does not turn her into a titty monster>>144540564she was the go-to junior team member throughout pretty much the entire 80s, which is why the original X-men series pilot starred her and was named pryde of the X-men which did well but was not picked up because marvel went bankrupt not long after
>>144540545Rogue-Like by Oni
>>144538834Why has Kitty done to make /co/ hate her again?
I liked her as a vampire.
>>144538834Personally, I prefer Jubilee, she’s more fun to read.
>>144540679i really miss this era
we need to start a comic about superhero girls of all races from the age of 14 up to 20 (some anons have adult woman fetish) who all date and get fucked by older white men.
>>144540669Used the n-slur
>>144540669There’s a lot of reasons but I’ll break it down to the most popular, she’s often used to make charecters gay.
>>144540669Jew, she’s so jewish her power is to be untouchable.
>>144538834>Isn't a sanctimonious prickAlready better than Kitty plus the nerds who wiafued her haven't taken up writing spots and ran the franchise into the ground like Kittyfags have
>>144538834I've always really liked her outfit.
>>144539665Anyone what to tell him
>>144540669The same thing that happened to a lot of landmark characters from the Claremont era: writers don't know what to do with her, and every attempt to give her the spotlight just makes her more unbearable.
>>144538896this guy is right.
>>144538834Jubilee is a hundred thousand times better than Kitty. Jubilee has a personality. Kitty is just a blank slate that gays self insert themselves into.
Kitty is the Wendy and Marvin of 'X-Men'.
I am a boomer who considers the original Claremont X-men an all time GOAT cape run and I hate the 90's and hate Jim Lee but even I can admit Jubilee shits on Kitty.
I love jubilee but i wouldnt say kitty sucks either.
The smartest thing anybody ever did, was leave Kitty out of the X-Men cartoon and films.
>>144540679>>144540737That era was a huge missed opportunity. It was interesting to see vampirism as a metaphor for depression.
As a young Jewish girl, it's highly likely that Kitty had a hairy pussy.
>>144541038How? She can't brainwash them like Jean
>>144540679Vampire Jubilee was awful, I'm not sure how her character managed to recover after that nonsense. Not that I mind, Jubilee deserved better than to be Marvel's attempt to cash in on Twilight's popularity.
>>144538912Aging Gen Xer hereI never liked Kitty
she was great in 2005-2012
>>144539455In as much as Paige has been thoroughly and completely ruined forever, I'm okay with it.
Kitty doesn't dress up like a whore
>>144538834Kitty was a know it all bitch.Jubilee was a coquettish cunt.
>>144539811>First girl is Chinese >Bangs Cass next
>>144539893Simone writing Quentin as this universally despised butt monkey is surprisingly basedIn one of the other books he calls Magneto "Professor M" and his response to Cyclops is "He's going to die on an away mission soon right"
>>144540243The lesbians and lonely creeper shippers love to turn hets homo/bi because they like the fantasy of turning out a straight girl and the lonelies litterally don't have any concept of friendship and are well...alone.
>>144538896Where pixie is?
>>144540579Bro, no one has given a fuck about kitty pryde in nearly 50 years and she's at best a fun side x-man with an interesting powerset. Nothing about her brings anyone to the book and the incessant push of the character has actually made people drop books. >>144540669Despite how unpopular she is now, she has the jew shield that magneto has so she can't be killed off or done dirty like everyone else. So we're kind of stuk with her. >>144544235She's seen more sausage then an all you can eat oktoberfest celebration during cannibis cup. I mean, she'll hear x-23 talk about how many men she HAD to sleep with and chortle silent to herself before screaming rookie numbers! Not realizing that x-23 isn't bragging but confessing.
>>144539010The problem with Katherine Prydewitz is that the bitch in the 80's was literally Blossom from the TV show, a complete bitch even in her cartoon years later.While Jubes was better, and hotter.
>>144539811>We could had got Jubes keeping Tim straight alongside StephPain
>>144540943based
>>144545177Jubes and steph are very similar.
>>144544113Desu paige and chamber were always kinda weak as a pairing desu, someone once called it "they date cause they're both white" and I dunno if I disagree. I do think for a while jubes has had stronger chemistry by just being bros (she and skin are also kinda underrated). But yeah paige really has been aimless.
>>144538834Way better character. Shadowcat was and always has been a giant bitch.
>>144545177Gifs you can feel the pain
>>144539455
>>144539937Such a stupid retcon.
>>144546898People liked azazel???
>>144539847>Armor at least has a back and forth with Logan.Armor is a complete nonentity as a character. It's amazing that she's been around for as long as she has and has zero notable personality traits, zero stories of interest, absolutely nothing. Fuck she has less than Miles. I assume the reason for her creation was that Whedon couldn't do the Kitty/Wolverine sidekick thing because Kitty was too old but he probably hated Jubilee (Jubilee's popularity is a recent thing, a lot of fans hated her largely because they were Kittyfags mad that she "replaced" their waifu) so he creates his own teenage Asian sidekick for Wolverine to replace her.
>>144546898Yeah, they should’ve just stuck with Kurt being Mystique and Christian’s kid, instead of getting Destiny involved for no reason
One thing I don't really like is that Jubilee now is written a little too much as the "sassy cool older sister" type and feels too much like a self-insert for millennial/older zoomer women at times. Read Generation X or her time in Uncanny, especially post-Claremont. What made Jubilee great was her kindness and empathy. She could be an annoying smart-mouthed brat but, probably because she'd been through a ton of shit already, she had possibly the largest heart of any X-Man.
>>144545021Never actually sidekicked for LoganShe's more Kurt's sidekick if anythingAlso Colossus's constant victim
>>144547426She's anti jubilee. Its pretty clear.
>>144539832>>144539893Quentin might actually count as the Logan sidekick more than Idie
>>144538834Better overall especially Post-Claremont. Jubilee just comes across as more fun, relaxed and down to earth. She's someone who i'd befriend in a heartbeat.
>>144548019If Lobdell ever "got" a character, it was Jubilee. You can say a lot about his writing but he always wrote her really well.
>>144547463Shouldn't have involved Mystique or Azazel in the first place. In a world with billions of people, and mutants being born at random, there's no need to make anyone biologically related. He should have been just some mutant gypsy kid who was persecuted because he happens to look vaguely like a demon. And for being a goddamn gypsy.
>>144538926That's a very good summary of the differences between Kitty and Jubilee.>>144538939Jubilee just comes off as so much cooler than Kitty. And someone who'd fit in with the Avengers.>>144539187I think both XTAS Jubillee and EVO Kitty are equally as remembered.>>144539542I'm pretty sure that was indeed the intention.>>144539681Her Baby, but that's a nitpick more than anything.>>144539773She definitely had a personality under Kyle and Yost. But i'm not sure how much of a personality she's had outside of 2017's Logan.>>144539832I had to look her up just to remind myself she exists.>>144539846I never read it, i fell off the X-Books by then.>>144539857True there is. But I have no idea how much of that stuff is explored.>>144540011Armor has only recently gotten a personality again. With Ultimate X-Men.>>144540055She easily could have been, but she actually has an arc.>>144540156What's the name of the fanfic and where can we find it?>>144540564No , but they are the most well-known versions.>>144540572Putting Kitty and Kurt on Excalibur really hurt their popularity. At least Kurt appeared 3 times in X-Men TAS. Kitty didn't even get so much as mentioned.>>144541238That's pretty much the main reason.>>144542782No certain versions of Kitty are good, but Jubilee is just more likable.>>144542819I might have to read some of those books. >>144545140I'm only vaguely aware of that sitcom.>>144547765I wouldn't know i don't read the X-Books anymore.
>>144548495Liu overplayed some parts and was more roboty there, but that, avengers academy and circle of four still kept that characterization generally. They just flubbed some backstory stuff (liu mostly). But post bendis laura..hasn't been written very well.On the tas thing, it'd be pointless for kitty to show up when all her stuff went to jubilee. But now she's on 97 and I got no clue why.
>>144545177>>We could had got Jubes keeping Tim straight alongside StephDon't forget Secret, his side piece from Young Justice.
>>144540679Thank fuck that shitty vampire arc is over with the stupid baby. That was insufferable.
>>144549034She is still a milf.
>>144548786Well i know not to bother with post bendis laura now. I don't know why Kitty is in 97 either since all her stuff went to Jubilee. Hopefully Beau knew how to make her fit into Earth-92131.
>>144550371Maybe, the x-23 deadly regenesis mini was alright. And maybe the new writers will write her well, they're at least remembering her history apparently.And yeah, but 97 has characters that didn't exist in the 90s too like dust.
>>144538834Better, shadowcat sucked. I still to this day don’t understand how she became the favorite of so many comic writers.
>>144550620She was their age and approachable unlike the bombshells jean and ororo.
>>144550682>>144550715Kill yourself coomer
>>144538912This. Kitty was always fairly mediocre and she only became worse as all the nerds who had crushes on her growing up became writers and started making her an insufferable mary sue.Jubes has always been what she is: a silly, fun sidekick kid appeal character.
>>144550715>>144550682Jubilee should be more petite
>>144538834I am biased for Jubilee cause I grew up with the cartoon. One thing I will say is that neither teen girl character really seemed to successfully outgrow being a teen girl. They're really not that relevant any more as adults. Every new thing with Jubilee, like adopting a baby and becoming a vampire, just doesn't really work for me.
>>144551071cry more.>>144551573yea, next time, went overboard with the boobs, but I wanted a chubby mall rat from all that sugar in her bubble gum and junk from the food court.
>>144539863"Aren't you shaming your ancestors by complaining all the time." Would make more sense in this context.
>>144551668>*draws thing that looks nothing like the character*NOOOOOOOOO IT'S THE CHARACTER
>>144550029It doesn't count since Jubilee just found that kid.
>>144552171That's hot tho
>>144547224He's unironically not only part of the peak of that run, low as the bar may be, but actually really fun as a villain even if he ultimately has the same nonsense powers as like 3 other big bad doomsday mutants. And at the fucking least he had a bit of a unique personality for an X-villain at the time as being kind of a huge smarmy cunt back before that was a common thing. Post-Krakoa Sinister is basically just Azazel personalitywise and it's a huge improvement.
>>144548439He was supposed to be the son of nihjtmare and grandson of mephistoHis teleportaion isn't his mutant powerIt's his demon birthright and he teleports to his hell dimension.He's also not supposed to be blueHe's supposed to be pitch black, they just used blue highlights so you can actually see things on him. BUT Claremont had a hair up his ass about his creepy trans shape shifting male that presents as a female OC Mystique being Nightcrawlers daddy instead. But Shooter put his foot down and told him he'd personally beat his ass in the middle of the office if he tried.But claremont wanted his OC to be tied to the Xmen and be mystiques offspring in some kind of way so...you had that origin.Problem with this is, it made no fucking sense, and added absolutely fucking nothing in terms of story or drama or anything.It's just something that's informed and no one does anything withHell I think Nightcrawler was retconned blue at that time to make it easier for his OC fap fantasy character to be tied to him and thus the X-men. I say he should be nightmare's son, black as pitch, and it his teleportion be retconned into a magic birthright that send him going into his personal hell dimension that he is the godking and ruler of. Hell of a lot better then all of that bullshit.
>>144552482>>BUT Claremont had a hair up his assHare. He had a HARE up his ass.I swear, the entire internet is retarded. Almost any website mentioning this idiom says "hair," which makes zero fucking sense.How can a hair be wild?You know what IS wild? A hare. A wild, fucking, rabbit. And since the main meaning of the phrase is to be excited and jumping around about something, the comparison to having a wild hare/rabbit jumping around inside you becomes obvious.When did it become so hard for people to add two and two together?
>>144545541Paige and Jono as contrasting venn diagrams overlapping at "depressive episodes" that they kind of pulled each other out of was something I enjoyed, but I'll not fault someone for not liking it.It was his big canon ship but she utterly fell off the rails after Gen X ended. Just dating whatever creepy old man will have her.
>>144552714I dont think it was bad mind you. Just that it felt like the weakest part of the book. Tho desu I mostly remember it just feeding into those things than helping too much.I do still like paige for what its worth. Tho I just think chamber and jubes ended up having good chemistry because they don't have that sorta negative drama and it allows for both to just not deal with problems.(Skin is choice 2 but there's zero art of the two anywhere).
