Why is Tim Drake not as popular as Dick, Jason, or Damian?
>>144637634Gaaaaaaay.
Jason and Damian can't sell a series for 10 years straight.
>>144637634Dick>sexy as fuckJason>brooding edgy boyDamien>precocious smug daddy’s boy Tim>uhhhh he’s a nerd? And gay?
He was meant to be the "smart one" but Barbara replaced him when she became Oracle, and she's still the smart one even after coming back as Batgirl. He was then turned into the "normal one," but who gives a shit about the normal one?
>>144637634His gimick of being the smartest Robin is one that very rarely translates well to Batman. Batman is great at a lot of things but the awkard truth is despite one of his monikers being "The World's Greatest Detective" very few writers actually focus on Batman detective stories. It's such a rarity that when a writers decides to focus on this fact like The Long Halloween or the recent Batman film they often make it a Batman solo story because Batman as real noir detective as is feels almost like an "event" and they don't want some other character to steal that thunder. So Tim is stuck as an eternal understudy with a gimik that is not used often yet when it actually is, focuses on Batman as a means to make Bruce look better.
>>144637735>but Barbara replaced him when she became Oracle,Babs was Oracle before Tim existed, or at least about the same time. Her tech skills were also shown before Tim.He was the normal kid who got swept up into this stuff from the beginning. The tech skills were more an extra but not really that prominent
>>144637634Tim was doing great until Identity Crisis. His father was killed, his step mother went an insane asylum in Bloodhaven (where she probably should have been nuked, but nothing was ever said about it), his gf was killed in War Games, and his best friend died in Infinite Crisis. Then Damian was introduced and his spot was taken and he became the Robin in some terrible Teen Titans books for years. The whole Bernard fiasco was just the final straw to change the identity of a character with 25 years of history in a way that no one would like or asked for. If they weren't going to pair Tim with Kon, I have no idea why they picked an obscure supporting character which hasn't been seen in a decade.
>>144637634Jason art got more likes than the rest. It's better to question why the rest aren't as popular as he is.
>>144637634Robin and TMNT comparisonLeonardo >Dick> the oldest and prodigal sonRaphael > Jason > the brooding bad boy Michaelangelo > Steph > the happy go lucky one. Karai > Damien > the actual blood child (Shredder, Splinter, Al Ghul, Wayne)Donatello > Tim > the smart oneThe problem is that Tim doesn’t do machines like Donatello.
>>144637891the better question is why no one pays money for Jason's products when he's in a starring role, but like his characterThe easy answer is that Jason can't actually do what people want(kill bad guys) but in general Jason has become more of an iconic image that a character to a lot of people.
Cause he's a fucking nerd.
>>144637891Because women and gays who corrode every medium they set their sights on are more terminally online than normal people.
>>144637870I've come to despise the Tim and Kon friendship and wish it didn't happen at this point. In general I'm not a fan of team books impacting the main books but I get it, still acting as if a character who appeared maybe once in Tim's first hundred or so issues is now the most important person in his life feels egregious. That whole OYL era where he was attempting cloning Kon was where Tim really lost his way as a character. How can you have Robin playing mad scientist with clone tanks, or thinking of taking Faustian deals to resurrect the dead.
>>144637634>Fucked Jubilee>Fucked CassCAN'T HAVE THAT, MAKE HIM MISERABLE thanks didio
>>144638199>normal peopleYeah because "normal people" are the ones who would like characters like Dick, Tim and Damian more lmao.
>>144637634Pretty nice art.
>>144638849Are you a fag, a woman, or both?
>>144638863He is right, though. You think a character like Dick who is famous for his backside and Tim who is actually homo would be popular among the normal crowd? And Damian is pretty hated because of the movies.
>>144638910>You think a character like Dick who is famous for his backsideDon't forget his gay costume.
>>144637634Zoomers, I swear. Over the entire history of comics Tim Drake was the second most popular Robin after only Dick. He had a solo comic that ran continuously for a decade. For everyone born in the 80's Tim was THE Robin, no other Robins even existed.>why is he not as popular NOWBecause they made him a fag.
>>144637634Is Tim really less popular than Damian? He was Arkham and GK games after all.
>>144637634Cause of who they become after Robin>Dick: NightwingBadass, sounds like someone who's Batman's equal>Jason: RedhoodAwesome, sounds like someone who beats the shit out of criminals>Tim: Red RobinLame, sounds like a restraunt
>>144637634There was a time Tim was popular as fuck. But the past decade has just been DC shitting on the character relentlessly with a slight breather during Tynion's 'Tec.The reason no one likes Tim is the same reason no one likes Jon anymore. DC turned them into dogshit characters and treat them like shit,
>>144637634At least he's not Duke.
>>144637870>in a way that no one would like or asked for.I would like it, and I asked for it. The writer they got to did it just doesn't know how to write.
>>144637634Why are all modern DC artists weebs, fujos or fujo-weebs?
>>144637634Dick and Jason are uber popular. Tim and Damian are fairly neck in neck. It depends on cycles and who gets used more in stuff.>>144637735Id argue the opposite. Ever since tim became the "smart one" barbra became dumber.
>>144637911No one likes Leo
>>144638999That's a good question. Damian is hated by casuals
>>144639264That was another thing: they fucking broke up Tim and Steph and gay'ed Tim off screen! The whole thing reeked of cowardice and incompetence.
>>144640327They didn't gay'd him off-screen. He had a long multi-part arc about accepting he might have feelings for a man if you have more than a modicum of reading comprehension. The rest is true. We should have seen him struggle touching Bernard, struggle telling Steph, struggle coming out to Bruce and everyone else. All of this was brushed off off screen.
>>144637911>The problem is that Tim doesn’t do machines like Donatello.He doesn't?
>>144638999They are probably about the same now right now with Damian having a slight edge but Damian has never achieved the level of popularity Tim had at his peak, even with how much DC aggressively pushes him. Tim had the benefit of being Robin at a time when comics still had some appreciable level of readership and most of his mainstream appearances are far more liked than Damian's.
>>144640368>He had a long multi-part arc about accepting he might have feelings for a man if you have more than a modicum of reading comprehensionBut that's the thing, it might be subtext but it's still subtext.Nothing about the story is overtly about Tim being bi. It's treated completely matter of fact that Bernard was someone he used to know and now has some attraction to, not him coming to terms with the idea that he likes other guys. It's just treated as him realizing his attraction to Bernard, specifically.That's fine, but if it was him doing the same thing but the person he leaves Steph for was a girl, he'd come off like an asshole. Hell, he basically broke up with his old girlfriend for Steph initially, but Dixon realized he couldn't just have Tim ghost her and had him try to figure out how to break up with her, because confronting something like that is something a responsible person learns to do.
>>144640892Look, if you're a waifufag I'm really not interested in discussing further, so let me know in advance.In case you're not a waifufag, you should realize your post veered off and lost the plot. Fitzmartin being dodgy about what it's actually like to come to grips with bisexuality is a real issue, and I guess you could see it as Tim only having to come to terms with liking Bernard, not men. That's one thing. How he broke up with Steph is another matter altogether that's unrelated to the execution of the story. The broke up prior to the story. It was off screen. Nowhere was it said Tim did it badly, or like an asshole, or because of his attraction to Bernard. That's the out-of-universe explanation. You're conflating things.
>>144640950>Nowhere was it said Tim did it badly, or like an assholeI mean, no, but the fact that he did and then completely ghosted her does make him seem like an asshole.
>>144641022He was ghosting the entire Bat-Family.
>>144641040He was in contact with Babs at least, doesn't make him seem like any less of an asshole honestly.
>>144641096He wasn't in contact, Babs called him to find out why he was ghosting everyone. I'm thinking you're a shippingfag.
>>144638091His popularity is so odd. It’s honestly hard to name anything he had a starring role in that was good and where he was written well. The reason why the movie was so well received was because it took the comic and smoothed contrived things and it’s abrupt ending out into a self contained story. They then proceeded to do nothing with him that was like the movie AKA the thing people in general liked so I don’t know why people still like him honestly.
>>144640950>Look, if you're a waifufag I'm really not interested in discussing further, so let me know in advance.I'm not. I'm just using points relevant because such a plot has been done before with Tim and we know how he would deal with such a thing. Outside of the subtextual discovery of bisexuality, the plot beats have been done before, in a way that felt more satisfying and didn't come off as cheap.We see why Arianna and Tim's relationship starts to break apart.We see why Tim likes spending time with Steph and why he would choose to drop Arianna in favor of StephOf course Fitzmartin was trying to make it about him discovering his bisexuality, you can tell it from the jump where he's looking at a gay couple and getting lost in thought. But I'd wager two things>she was trying to sneak the reveal past the radar, so she had to be subtle>there's really no story in Tim being bi in general because..who's going to judge him for it? If his dad was alive you could have him as the bigot because jack drake was a punching bag anyway, if he was in school their could be some tension, but the rest of the batfamily would just be "ok, that's cool".People have conflicts with coming to grips with their non-hetero sexuality largely due to social factors. Being contrary to what their family, work, school, friends, whatever expect. But since Tim's community is largely other tolerant heroes at this point, just making him fall for another guy isn't a story. You could have him explore a feeling like he isn't physically attracted to Steph anymore, but the story dances around that. Being what it is, a story of Tim falling in love with another person, it simply isn't good. It doesn't properly tie up a previous relationship and relies on a sudden, off panel change as a set up, and the way his attraction to Bernard is written feels sudden and shallow.
>>144640327I hate these faggots so much holy shit. No way he’s actually bi if he dumped that cute Steph right there for a guy named fucking Bernard. Calling it now he’s gonna get some shit where he realizes he was gay all along and finally coming to terms with his true self or whatever kek
>>144641210They could’ve had Jason be homophobic. Wasted potential. Or done >>144641311 but for real. Truly wasted. I realize now the reason Faggot Tim is so lame because they took the most boring route with it. Not even the Tim and Kon fujos are happy.
>>144641362>had Jason be homophobic.>character most famous for being written by Judd Winnick>homophobicI forget that most people on this board are either really young or have no knowledge of pop culture.
>>144640440All these Tim versus Damian arguments tend to gloss over that DC has literally zero trajectory for Damian other than him existing. Most of his stans' arguments boil down to "his dad is someone important" which is how you wind up with a Quicksilver situation. God forbid anyone points out Batman can have 2 sidekicks.
>>144641504If anyone was going to be homophobic it'd be Damian, considering his grandpa.
>>144641504Well he never had his chance to make him a bisexual underage prostitute and he’s not writing him now so yes. He should be homophobic. It would be funny.
>>144641535The thing is, just being the son of Batman is good enough for a 15 year old character. No one expects more because how can Batman be anything but Batman's son now? Batman not having blood family unless it was another Earth was a cardinal rule until Damian broke it. Tim was thought irreplaceable because no one thought another Robin could work. Three of them sounded like the most you could do. He was made to not be an orphan because three orphans sounds like too many. His trajectory was to be Robin until he grew up, in which case he'd bow out(but that was at a nebulous future you don't expect comics to reach)If Damian is still trying to adjust and trying to sand down his edges in 10 years, people will complain and take issue with him more overtly. As is, he's got a place, even if it's not being handled well.
>>144637634>character is literally the second most popular character in the entire company behind only Batman>take away everything unique about him>"durr why no popular no more"Truly a question for this generation's greatest minds.
>>144640440DC tried so hard to push him as "THE BLOOD SON" which ironically backfired badly on Damian.
>>144641872>character is literally the second most popular character in the entire company behind only BatmanYeah, let's not go crazy.
>>144637634I'm 44 and Tim Drake became Robin around the time I started reading comic books. Tim Drake will always be my Robin and Tim Drake is not a HOMO!
>>144641914At his peak, he absolutely was, and there's hard sales numbers to back it up. It's not even "everything Batman touches sells" either because this was Tim on his own or in other books without Batman.Granted this is also coinciding with the rest of DC being so far in the trash that they pretended to kill off Superman to pump sales, but it's still not hyperbole. He was extremely popular, they took away everything that made him popular, and now he's nothing.
>>144641885>backfired badly on DamianIt's the only thing keeping him relevant. If any other Robin had that personality, they wouldn't last a year without backlash, but because Damian is the heckin' blood sonnerino he sticks around.
>>144641171Because he's cool.
>>144641989Tim Drake was so popular that he got 2 limited series which sold huge numbers which then ran into the characters 1st solo series in its creation since 1940.
>>144642006I think it made him relevant within DC more so than the readers. They were so desperate to makes him work that they forced him down people's throats until they finally accepted him.
>>144637634Tim was doing fine in comics before and after Damian was canonized until New 52 made a mess for everyoneTim got obscure in other media thanks to those DC direct to video cartoon movies using Dick and Damian all the time and skipping him entirely, Jason at least got his Red Hood story animated
>>144642068New 52 ruined DC Comics for me. I still haven't been able to go back.
>>144641989It's because he was Robin at the time. Anyone on the outside just assumed he was Dick IE the Robin in all the adaptations at the time.
>>144642062>>144641989Wasn't this mostly because of Robin's death which created a huge buzz around the Robin brand? If Tim was the Robin in the 80s instead of Jason, I seriously doubt that he would find this level of success.
>>144642113Good point. Death of Jason Todd and costume redesign...
>>144642101Nerd.
>>1446421296'2 nerd at that.
>>144642113>>144642122If Tim wasn't popular in his own right then it never would've been sustained.
>>144641116I'm not the anon you were replying to.
>>144642113>Jason made Tim popular with his death>He also made him irrelevant with revival Ironic.
>>144641611Damian is lowkey homophobic, but we aren't ready for that.
>>144642174True. But shortly thereafter Knightfall happened. And then Azbats and then Prodigal. All stories with a lot of a Tim Drake in it. Comics in the 80s and 90s were so much fun. I feel sorry for you youngins. Ya missed out.
>>144642006Damian's the baby, gotta love him.
>>144642174Tim was able to win over fans eventually on his own, but he wouldn't have such a successful launch without Robin's death. It what made people give him a chance in the first place.
>>144642245And Jason's death what made DC pay attention to the Robin brand and makes sure to push it when before they tried to bury it.
>>144642245That and he wasn't a Richard Grayson clone.
>>144642066Moreso people outside of comic readership. The DTVs seemed popular enough. Batman has..a son! gets the rubes in.
>>144642113I agree with this. Let's be honest, if Tim was the second Robin instead, he would have no chance of success.
>>144642051Is he though? He’s just a whiney bastard with daddy issues when you peel off the shiny edgy paint.
>>144642219Wtf I love Damian now
>>144641171He is a good with interesting backstory and a seriously cool design. His meta history with DC makes appealing too.
>>144642390Yes. You see him as whiney while people think he is tragic and justified in his anger.
>>144642107But we're not talking about people on the outside, we're talking about people who went on the inside and picked up the comic.And learned about Tim Drake. And liked him well enough to keep buying his books.>>144642113There was a big boom in general thanks to Batman 89 and BTAS, but if that was enough, Jean-Paul Valley would've been a bigger character than he ended up being. He was Batman in an era of highest sales, and he ended up torpedoing sales because he wasn't considered likable by the audience. If people didn't like Tim, he wouldn't have lasted. Creators who worked in the batoffice in the 90's have been upfront that Azrael's book only lasted because of Dennis' otherwise solid sales; it was given to him as a favor, basicaly. This was back when people actually wrote letters to comics. A lot of 90's Batman is steered by people writing in and giving feedback.Stephanie Brown went from being a one-off character to a semi-regular because of reader feedbackDick got more brotherly moments with Tim because readers liked thatThere's more one-off stories in the mid-90's because readers complained about crossovers after Knightfall. I really wish letters pages were better preserved because they're such an interesting time capsule.
>>144642498c2c comics can still be downloaded quite easily if you know where to look. DC++ Hubs
>>144642498While yeah, DC tried hard to makes Tim likable and they were desperate for him to work after they saw the value of the Robin brand (and got a smacking from the exes for their voting stunt). Jean wasn't a likeable by any means and no one was ok with replacing Bruce.
>>144637634Because he is literally just a placeholder for Dick and has no real purpose or gimmick on his own. People hated Jason Todd, but Dick was too popular as Nightwing to become Robin again, so they made a substitute Robin who could easily fit into any Dick Grayson shaped hole in a Batman property, be it comics or cartoons or merchandise. He's very much designed so people who think Dick Grayson is still Robin can watch/read a Batman story and not notice.All the other Robins have a thing. Dick is both the original and has being Nightwing, Jason Todd has coming back to life and being an anti-hero/anti-villain with his own identity as the Red Hood, and Damien has being Batman's son and the whole "Smartass Brat" gimmick. What does Tim have? Nothing.
>>144637643FPBPGays represent, even on a generous estimate, only ~10% of the populationEven if we say gays are disproportionately likely to be into comics, it's still a limiting factor, especially in the era of identity politics and self inserting where people aren't inclined or allowed to care about characters that aren't "LITERALLY ME"For every queer saying "omg he's literally me" you have 9 normal people saying "I can't relate to this," and frankly even queers seem to prefer just headcanoning the other Robins as sekret gays. Naturally, TimSteph or TimCass shippers of old are massively jilted and just want out.
>>144642609Pretty much this. Tim was created during a time where it was easy for him to find a success and dc was ready to push him as hard as they can.I do think Tim is a better character than Damian, though.
>>144637634They assassinated his character with the gay bullshit.
>>144642688Tim Drake was poised to be Batmans successor. The storyline was explored in Teen Titans. And we, the readers, were told he was smarter then Bruce. Everything they built up with that character over a decade was thrown out the window in 2011.
>>144642688>Dick was too popular as NightwingLmao. Titans was already losing popularity at that time and the reason why they didn't make him Robin again was because it would be impossible to de-age him, not because Nightwing carried such a huge value on his own.
>>144642737I refuse to read any new DC Comics because of this very reason. Same thing with Alan Scott. I'm still pissed they had the audacity to change him to homo in the main DC Universe even though he's been a straight man for almost 100 years now... I was told back in the 90s they just wanted to be left alone and get married... WTF...
>>144642789Teen Titans with Drake, Connor, Bart, and the others was a HUGE success. Re-energized Titans for the 21st Century.
>>144642792Exactly this. Finally, someone with balls and a spine posted this. Tim has been dating girls for the entirety of his character ever since his debut and suddenly DC turns him hay for no reason at all. It didn't help with Seph acted like a cuck and hugged his new boyfriend right after he broke up with her.
>>144642688>who could easily fit into any Dick Grayson shaped hole in a Batman property, be it comics or cartoons or merchandise.This is very much not the case for any of Tim's early history. You're beaten over the head with Tim being the third Robin and not Dick in 90's comics. you can argue it was for the merch- But by the 90's all the merch shifted to using BTAS or whatever current movie branding over comics anyway. >>144642738This was a bad storyline for Tim though, and one wiser writers int he 90's knew to avoid. Dick will always overshadow Tim as a choice for a Bat replacement. Dick literally replacing Batman twice and Tim's bat future being a bad one killed any chance of that happening in all but the imagination of Johns Tim fanboys. Who also made him a creepy mad scientist trying to clone Kon.
The homo thing ruined Tim for good, but wasn't doing great before it.And let's be frank, if IC or BR never happened and Tim never lost his father or the Robin mantle, would he still be popular?
>>144641860People already are complaining Damian is spinning his wheels narratively and keeps being an asshole. Furthermore, he's actually kinda trapped as a character. You're right, if Batman has a son then why would anyone else be Robin, but, by the same ticket, why would Batman's son be anything but Robin? Damian is the inheritor of a mantle that will never pass to him and locked into stasis by the mantle given to him.
>>144642907Without Damian? He might not be still struggling as hard as he does today, but I don't think he will stay popular.
>>144642789Nightwing has value and popularity outside the Titans brand (hell he hasn't been in the Titans for years) both solo books and batbooks in general.
>>144642461>>144642495His backstory is mild compared to what others have been through even with his own associates. He threw what was basically an elaborate violent tantrum because he was mad what was his father figure moved on from him after he got himself killed and didn’t kill a man for him and won’t let him kill people now. That’s ridiculous. He’s still mad about it too.
>>144642737>gay
>>144642971Wtf did they make him straight again?
>>144642961>His backstory is mild compared to what others have been through even with his own associatesOk, I can't take this seriously. Jason by far has best backstory out of all Robins and him stealing Batman's tires was truly iconic.
>>144643020That was his 2nd origin. Pre-Crisis, he was a circus orphan, just like Grayson. Not only that, but he wasn't dark haired. The writers even made Bruce make Jason dye his hair. Retarded shit going on over at DC in 1985...
>>144642907>would he still be popular?Yes because losing his dad made him a lesser version of Dick and Jason. Frankly it was too late for it to really feel like a tragedy. Tim was effectively raising himself and taking care of his father by then, having a 16 year old pretend to be Bruce's son is just weird. Having Damian vs him as blood son vs adopted felt hollow because Tim as an adopted son had only just started like a few months before. It's like Morrison thought Tim was like Jason or Dick and thought of Bruce as a father, instead of a mentor. It made Damian's claim to Robin so much more obvious, because why shouldn't the son have it instead of the guy who was a latchkey teenager next door?Without losing Robin he'd still be stable. The book sales had slipped in the late 2000's(largely owing to the character losing his way) but they were more stable than most other DC books.
>>144642337Sure, but you're talking about external context. If Damian hadn't been introduced by Morrison everyone would have bitched about the retconned in ColdSteel the Hedgerobin.>>144642495How the fuck is Damian tragic?
>>144642961The funny thing is..Bruce DID try to kill the Joker. It took Superman telling him not to to hold him back. Gordon ("by the book!") would likely have told him the same thing.
>>144643015He's still into women i.e. not gay.
>>144643119The character is ruined now. Simple as. There is no going back. And you can call me a bigot all you like. I'm not spending my money on the shit anymore and neither, apparently is the current generation. Which means comics will not survive the next 15 years as we know them. Sad really.
>>144643068Yeah and? His pre-crisis origin is irrelevant and hasn't been a thing since the 80s (though, he still have some seriously fun stories that I actually enjoyed). Everyone who mentioned his backstory obviously means his post-crisis origin and I'm pretty sure you know this.
>>144643103>How the fuck is Damian tragic?They were talking about Jason, anon.
>>144643119No he’s not. Why on earth would he dump his girlfriend of several years at the drop of a hat and get with a fag named Bernard if he was into women? He’s secretly gay.
>>144643103>>144643202How the fuck is Jason tragic?
>>144643222Bisexuality is not that unfathomable of a concept.
>>144643070How? How would stand out in N52 or current DC?
>>144637634He has autism.
>>144637634Tim is lame. Starting with his name. Tim? He sounds....weak. I'm not going to pretend Dick Grayson is the best character ever but he is famous as being the first super hero sidekick who eventually grew up into his own hero identity. So he has seniority.Jason on the other hand is famous for being Batman's greatest personal failure and when he returned he had the angry bad boy thing going on. Damian is Batman's actual blood son even if he is a more violent knock off of Jason being Bruce's actual son cements his importance even if he's a controversial character given how long it took to give Batman a blood son (like seventy years after Batman was created).Tim really has no hook. I wouldn't even call him the intelligent nerd of the franchise either because Bruce is supposed to be the intelligent man of the franchise. Tim is frankly a PART TIME ROBIN who should have respectfully bowed out and retired once he saw he was no longer needed and I think DC fucked up by killing his family. Tim walking out and living happily as a civilian with his family or better yet out of Gotham to stop dealign with psychos would have been great. But noooo they just had to keep him in the Robin role and he's an adult now and it feels awkward when there's an active little child Robin around already (Damian). Better to retcon Tim out of existence.
>>144643020Dick and even Damian were more memorable in introduction.
>>144637634he never was properly animatedDCAU Tim is just JasonYJ Tim never had a spotlight
>>144643266No bisexual would abruptly dump their cute long term girlfriend for a fag named Bernard. He must be gay and they are slowly working up to it. He will never be with a woman again anon. He’s been NARD’ed.
>>144643263Are you kidding me? He was a homeless kid come from a broken home who got a moment of happiness when he was adopted by Batman just to die tragically after getting betrayed by his own mother. To make it worse, he had to dig out himself out of his grave, was suffering from brain damage for a year and then got dipped in the lp just to find how out that his killer was still playing cat and mouse with his adopted father like nothing changed. Dude is tragic.
>>144643119Anon, I know you know he will never be straight again. Not a single character DC turned into gay went back to dating girls again. They fear the backlash.
>>144643342And yet, he is more popular than them.
>>144643279Being Robin and carrying off consistent sales for almost 20 years before that. If he maintained his personality, role, and supporting cast or dynamics there's no reason to think he'd be unsaleable. Notice how all this discussion about him being irrelevant only comes because of DC changing so much about him?
He's never had the juice. I was a kid of 10, already reading comics when Robin #1 came out, ostensibly the target audience, and he felt bland even then. Especially compared to the hip young Superboy at the same time.
>Damián is basically just a knock off of Jason!!>this adaptation of Tim is actually just ripping off Jason!!Why are jasonfags like this? Do they have a secret monopoly on common character traits or something?
>>144643399They call whiney like just went into vacation and came back angry for no reason like his didn't die brutally and was brought back brutally.
>>144643494>this adaptation of Tim is actually just ripping off Jason!This is true. They literally admitted it themselves.
>>144643494Tim fans will also tell you TNBA Jason is not Tim.Seriously cite one character trait of TNBA Jason that's anything like the Tim in comics in the 90's.
>>144643425>Jason>more popular than Dick>the iconic original character that Jason was a failed callback/ripoff ofKek no. He failed as a replacement for him then and now there’s no world where red hood is more popular than nightwing. Once Damian the blood son gets more into the public light and seen as the tragic edgy violent one of the family Jason will be basically shelved and forgotten.
>>144643532*tnba TIM, freudian slip.
>>144643494Oh boy, you would be in surprise when you find out that they actually confessed that wanted Jason, but they weren't allowed to use him so they to settle by making Tim Jason 2.0.
>>144643518Post source. Because >>144643532 is basically just a collage of schizophrenia.
>>144643587>a collage of schizophrenia.They're literal parallels.
>>144643559Someone copy/paste the arguments that were made in different thread to answer this guy.
>>144643320>when he returned he had the angry bad boy thing going onHelps that his name is Jason.
>>144643070Sorta agree. Tim losing friends and family then Bruce shoving him to the side because Bruce's jackass, psycho crotchspawn demanded daddy's undivided attention could have been powerfully tragic, but DC would never publish a story where Batman being an asshole is explicitly a negative nor would G-Mozz tolerate not having his royalty generator front and center all the time.
>>144643320>it feels awkward when there's an active little child Robin around already (Damian)Damian's a teenager now with a girlfriend so Tim's 100% obsolete.
>>144643569>doesn't want to end up as someone’s pet charity case>winds up richest man in the city’s (failed) pet charity case >forever memorialized as nothing more but a hard lesson for said manIt’s just not fair…
>>144643459You weren't the target audience. I was. And I was 13 when Robin #1 came out and I was superhyped for it. Because, ironically, Tim Drake became Robin when I was 10. lol
>>144643020>Jason by far has best backstory out of all Robins I recommend you watch the 1990 movie Dick Tracy. Or at least the first 15 minutes of it.(I'd recommend the 1933 Dick Tracy strips but that'd be more time and money to get the cheeky reference I'm saying Jason is meant to be)
>>144643608Got ya. Thankfully, the thread wasn't dead yet.>Boon: No other DC character got such a huge reaction like Jason did (talking about Injustice)>Martinbrough (Red Hood current writer) earlier this year went to Tunisia to promote one of his children books and was surprised to see many Red Hood fans coming to greet him. IN TUNISIA.In China, they actually made a birthday event for him where fans gathered to celebrate him.In Japan, they once made a Keychain merch for the batfamily. If you buy the entire box, you will get unmasked Jason as a bounce (he already has another with his mask). The box sold out quickly because of that.He is the only Robin who actually got a huge and expensive status.>once they added an exclusive merchandise for Red Hood in SDCC and it was announced that it sold out in 2 minutes. He made it to YJ because there was so much demands (and cheer whenever his name was dropped in one of these panels) for him.>They made a Samurai Batfamily status. Jason is the only one who got four different styles.
>>144643402>into gay went back to dating girls again.Once again bisexuality is ever lost. I mean have you seen John Constantine. His most consistent love interest is Zatanna.
>>144643609It would be kind of funny and hard to take his whole schtick seriously if his name was Tim
>>144643682Dumbass, only Golden Age Batman's going PD. The first fucking appearance. None of the modern shit's going PD for bout a century from now.
>>144643682Shit... You may be right...
>>144637634> false equivalentIt may change in the future but currently Damian and Tim play in the same league and both struggle as Robin or outside Robin. There is a huge gap between them and Jason or Dick.
>>144643682>Implying will survive for another 100 years>>144643691He is strangely quite well loved in Asia.
>>144643695The bisexual thing was also treated like a joke in one of the cartoon movies.
>>144643587There was an interview in one of the TNBA DVDs that talks about them taking influence from Jason Todd.
>>144643691So your whole argument is that because he has a fujoshi fanbase in Asia that means he’s more popular than fucking Dick? That’s pathetic. And also slightly confusing because Jason is ugly and looks old.
>>144643691Jason played a huge role in two mangas and tragic cameo in a third. They clearly loves him in Japan so him to some mangaka to write him.
>>144643691Red Hood's got global mass appeal. Hes a gun toting vigilante with a cool recognizable look. They could literally put out a movie and market it to people who liked John Wick.
>>144643782Funny how selective you are about what you wanted to see and ironic at the same time.
>>144643782We get it, you're an autistic loser.
>>144643789Tunisia in Asia? Freaking Murican education.
>>144643789He'd be one of the delinquent types over there. IE he'd have more balls than most manga protags.
>>144643813>>144643816Not an argument or proving a point of any kind. Sorry anon. Maybe in another 20 years of floundering he will finally reach the level of Nightwing.
>>144638250It's funny they gave Tim the red and black to try to homage TNBA, but had to default to that in-story excuse for the color change. Wasn't helping the allegations back then.
>>144643682.t guy who doesn't know how copyright or trademarks actually work
>>144643833Nta but China and Japan are in Asia anon.
>>144643802Yeah a movie about a cool hero who gets to kill the badguys, but you know now the important badguys. Maybe he can kill KG Beast or uh, Tzin-Tzin
>>144643898Just have him kill Black Mask.
>>144643858Nobody but nerds care bout Nightwing.
>>144643691King even questioned once in some years ago about why people loves him so much because there was a huge cheer when he was mentioned.
>>144643925You saw what happened to him when he was thought to have killed the penguin but didn’t actually. What do you think would be done to him if he actually did kill one of these guys? He’d probably die.
>>144643946>in some+panel
>>144641362They could have Jason be supportive of Tim until he finds out he's a total pussy at even being a good bi boyfriend and cucks him by taking Bernard away.
>>144643950Nigga what? Nothing would fucking happen. There would be no superheroes in the movie. Just Red Hood killing dudes.
>>144643944And apparently only Japanese fujoshi chicks care about Red Hood. How fitting.
>>144643691And yet, DC failed completely to capture his popularity. How can they this painfully incompetent.
>>144643965No.
>>144643990Old fucks are too stubborn to adapt.
>>144643645So what you're saying is that ten years from now Damiannis going to be getting his buttcheeks blown out by Colin.>>144643782>having a fanbase doesn't mean the character has a fanbase!Strange hill to die on but at least you'll be dead.
>>144643973I could dig that but getting rid of hero shit all together would take away a lot of history and motivations from the character.
>>144643691Only insecure dick fans can turn this into a bad thing.>he is globally liked? H-how awful!
>>144644015Damian's into goth chicks, my guy. He's as straight as they come.
>>144643946>>144643691so are they buying the comics?>comics don't matter!Ok hope they're buying a lot of merch then.
>>144644040It will require for DC to actually push him and give him a good book, but alas.
>>144644018It's literally just Batman, dude. Dude was Robin, dies and comes back. Maybe have Batman be dead and Jason wants revenge.
>>144643320>Better to retcon Tim out of existence.Tim is one of the more popular DC characters. It dumb to suggest getting rid of him when there are so many characters being pushed that have hardly any appeal. Instead of getting rid of him just fix him.
>>144643990They would need to make him a pretty troubled bad boy with emotional angsty shit to appeal to his fanbase. It would probably work and finally the gap between RH comics and his fans would be closed.
>>144644070Nobody cares about comics. They need to make a Red Hood movie, show and video game.
>>144644038characters have had kids and multiple hetereo relationships and get turned gay.People in the 90's Robin comic letter pages were calling him a dog for juggling so many girls.
>>144644089Red Hood the coloring book, Red Hood the lunch box, Red Hood the breakfast cereal
>>144644089True, but they might have a chance to attract a new younger audience if they actually bothered to push him instead of screwing him over and over again. They really missed their chance.
>>144642219It's because he's part Arab. Arabs simultaneously the most homophobic and most homosexual of any demographic.
>>144644121I don’t know why but I think he’d like having his own breakfast cereal
>>144644162>and most homosexual of any demographicWhy do people try hard to push this meme?
>>144644202Insecurity because they are the only ones left standing against the homo agenda.
>>144644164It turns the milk red
>>144638091>why no one pays money for Jason's products when he's in a starring role> why do fans not waste money on garbageComics are mediocre as fuck and non-cape nerds or new comers are not conditioned to consume and support slop. Add to it that DC doesn't like letting Jason shines in comics and love the "he's responsible for everything bad that ever happened to him". They don't even like to explore his character and most often use him as the broken robin with no pay off for whatsoever because he's not the actual focus of the book in which he stars in. I don't see how it's hard to figure how Jason who attract normies or casuals wouldn't translate well into comics sales.>in general Jason has become more of an iconic image that a character to a lot of people.That's true for every DC character and the company is 100% to blame for it thanks to flanderizations and canon being a total mess.
Tim Drake is the gay robin now and that's it.
>>144644038And Tim was into big titty blondes. Face it, Damian's a couple years out from getting PLAP PLAP PLAP'D.On a more serious note, I 100% believe that if WB gets any flak online for sidelining "the gay Robin" then film Damian is going to be made gay in an easily edited out for the Chinese release sort of way.
>>144644085>Tim is one of the more popular DC charactersRobin is. Tim just happened to be him for awhile. Things change.
>>144644100He didn't juggle shit though. He barely did anything with those girls.
>>144644272Cool.
>>144643973>There would be no superheroes in the movie. Just Red Hood killing dudes.At that point why even make a Red Hood movie? Dead Robin comes back and avenges Batman by..tarnishing his legacy?
Tim still has the fact that he’s better than Jason going for him but that’s really it. I feel bad for him.
>>144644333>And Tim was into big titty blondesSaid big titty blonde got pregnant by another dude. If I was him, I wouldn't even bother having a relationship with her.
>>144644437No-kill rule doesn't fucking work. Batman died because he didn't kill his villains.
>>144644397He went on dates, fought crime with them, went on adventures with them. It's a comic, aimed at young boys. Making out is enough.>But Kon-Tim juggled more actual girls that were into him than Kon did.
>>144644136I feel that DC spent a lot of years being in denial about his popularity or just didn't understand it. The way they handled him in the aftermath of UTH was a pure bitterness. You can feel that some writers were really unhappy that he was back.
>>144644378He's still more popular than 95% of DC characters.
>>144644451>I feel bad for him.He's not real, freak.
>>144644479But there are no villains in this hypothetical movie. Batman got killed by generic mooks?
>>144644498Got any proof?
>>144644437UTRH is literally DC most popular animated movie. Normal people aren't having hard to understand his point and the tragedy of his character like some nerds apparently are.
>>144644516There are no superheroes. Doesn't mean there aren't any villains. They're more like the ones in Azzarello's Joker book. Grounded psychos and criminals.
>>144644452she gave up the baby and got fit and tight again afterwords so it's all good.
>>144644570Nah, I still wouldn't. I'd fuck her, but I ain't committing to her.
>>144644556UTRH is a movie with Jason as the antagonist, or at least in an anti-hero role, playing in an ensemble cast of Batman and Joker(among others).You're proposing a movie without any of those characters.
>>144644594good news, Tim didn't. He fucks men now.
>>144637634>damianthis is a reach>jasondebatable>>144644498all significant batfamily members are more popular than all other dc characters outside of the major JL figures
>>144644479>
>>144644607Batman's still in it, dude. He's just dead. It's another Batman-only universe. No Superman, no Justice League.
>>144644653But are there magic reviving pits?
>>144644646Didn't Batman bring the Joker back to life through the Lazarus Pits?
>d-dick and Tim are totally the most popular! Believe it!Do you people live under a rock?
>>144644653What made UTRH and Arkham Knight popular is Bruce and Jason's dynamic. Jason avenging his dead dad who was disappoint in him seems lame.There's a reason gunsguy movies generally give them a woman or child (or pet) to avenge, they're innately more sympathetic than an older man who died standing a chance or made his bed.
>>144644667No. Grounded universe. Batman dies instead of Jason, so he becomes Red Hood to avenge him.
>>144642219>small, taut-bodied pre-pubescent boy>not scared of gaysMaybe he's not as smart as he thinks.
>>144644709Inigo Montoya though. https://youtu.be/kBC5Z_bH74U?si=bl1hZQhTzg0Bz3Jl
>>144644708I noticed that some cape fans are really out of touch. They think their very small community is all that matters.
>>144639199>At least he's not Duke.The Batfamily already has a black guy.
>>144644709Didn't even need Nightwing in UtRH. Could've just made Jason the first and only Robin and it still would've worked.
>>144644786Yeah, Luke was a decent character.
>>144641989>>144642113It also helped that Tim was part of KnightfallQuestEnd, the biggest Batman event of that time so they had material to give him instead of making him entirely a support character.
>>144642006Damian being the blood son is a double edged sword. It keeps him relevant (so long as it's unique to him) but it's also a bunch of tropes and subtexts that work against what Batman and Robin may represent to a general audience.> 40 yo batdad> eugenism> blood child versus adoption>>144642066>They were so desperate to makes him work that they forced him down people's throatsHarper, Duke, Punchline... It's par the course with DC. Tim was the same and Damian is lucky he was introduced when he was. The only time they dropped the ball after a year or two (and turned it into a shitshow on top of it) was with Jason and all of these characters came after him.
>>144644670I don't remember that, when did that happen?
>>144644716I seriously don't think Jason would start killing if Bruce died.
>>144644844In some comic. Joker died so Batman brought him back because he had the information he needed.
>>144644856We had a whole animated movie recently that says otherwise.https://youtu.be/ZHFvELji-OE?si=DNBTEswmMQ6407y5
>>144644876"Some comic" is very vague, please be more specific.
>>144644500Not yet anon. But soon…
>>144642711well yeah, conceptually damian is a nightmare straight out of the big book of sues. when he works it's only because someone is making a serious effort to avoid his baked-in problems.
>>144644843It mostly backfired with the Twitter crowd (who DC is really trying to win over) when they tried to push him as THE son which is why DC stopped doing that and started to acknowledge the Robins as his sons again.
>>144644914Google it.
>>144644755The fact that so many can't grok normies perfectly get Red Hood, magical resurrection and all, is troubling.
>>144644947But Twitter's gay as fuck. Appealing to them makes the entire Batman IP lame and gay.
>>144644646I think it’s the principal of the matter when it comes to that specific guy. Of course the jonkler is gonna end up being revived. Doesn’t mean that he shouldn’t face retribution.
>>144644843>that work against what Batman and Robin may represent to a general audience.I'd argue that's exactly why you can sell Damian better than the other Robins. People joke about Bruce taking in orphans and putting them in costumes because it just sounds ridiculous in the frame of Batman being "realistic" that we see now. Allowing Dick, recruiting Jason, and sanctioning Tim to be Robin seems irresponsible and irrational, no matter how many panels of training they get. They're someone else's sons that he's allowing to risk their lives over.But people understand taking a son into the family business.
>>144644708More popular than Jason at least kek. Only women and edgelords like that fag.
>>144644976Said son was also raised by assassins. So they can't accuse Batman of creating child soldiers when others did it to him first.
>>144645001Says the guy who likes that superhero shit.
>>144644967Don't exactly disagree, but DC trying to make Damian as the only that matter to Batman wasn't a good take either.
>>144642789>Titans was already losing popularity at that timeIn 1988? Nah, the Titans were still going strong but by 1992, yeah it was a trainwreck.
>>144645001>fagWell, he isn't the homo or the one who is wearing a homo costume. So, this is a pretty ironic comment.
>>144644856He’d probably kill the guy who killed him, he said so himself, plus he wanted to kill two-face for killing his real dad even though he was kind of a scumbag before he ended up backing out of it. So maybe. I don’t think he’d go full mass murder but he was always a bit less adverse to it.
>>144645022Says the guy who likes fucking Jason Todd
>>144645001Wait, who cares about fagwing then? You are telling me there's actual guys who unironically likes him?
>>144645108Come on, it's totally "manly" to like a male character who is famous for his backside.
>>144645055He sure acts like one though. I swear whenever he gets brought up it’s because he threw some sort of emotional fit like a little bitch because he didn’t get what he wanted.
>>144644949You made the claim, the burden of proof is on you man.
>>144644976>>144645005You've got that wrong. You can sell Dick and Jason given the circumstances of their origins even if you can debate the in-universe morality and wisdom of doing so. You can't do it for Tim because he's just a latchkey neighbor's kid and you can't do it for Damian because he's a goddamn psychopath who needs therapy and deprogramming.
>>144644967Twitter is for normies anon. Which is a more appealing audience than people into comics or even DTV animated movies from 14 years ago. A cutesy batfamily panel that leaves the comics twitter ecosystem is more valuable to WB since it preps normies up for James Gunn's plans.
>another Tim thread becomes about Jason
>>144645150>he threw some sort of emotional fitIf only this actually happens instead of him being so overly forgiving of Bruce every single time he wrongs him.
>>144645183Jason and Dick would need therapy much more because they aren't Bruce's sons. Being Robin IS Damian's therapy and deprogramming.
>>144639199Duke is hetero and has swagger.Meanwhile, Tim felt awful after his penis touched Steph.
>>144645005that doesn't make things better. if anything, it's worse. when real people use real child soldiers, the child soldiers are supposed to be taken away from fighting and rehabilitated for normal lives, not put to work as child soldiers for someone else.
>>144645206For real, when the last time he throw a fit? Damian is the one who is famous for that.
>>144645244The infamous Solemnisanction smirks that his Steph-hate is validated and says yassss, her pussy killed Tim's love for women>>144645198EVERY TIME
>>144645198Tim threads at least last around 150-200 posts before becoming about all about Jason. Dick and Damian threads usually don't make it past 30 before that happens.
>>144643532I like to call him timtodd.
>>144645206I like chill Jason. Batman is mental and there's no point wasting time getting angry at him.
>>144645294The fujos on Livejournal like Monkeycrackmary loved called him "Timmy Todd"
>>144645198He will always be famous.
>>144645291It was kind of become about Jason from the beginning.
>>144645254But Bruce letting Dick and Jason become Robin makes it seem like he's the the one making them soldiers.
>>144645282Oh that’s who Solemnisanction who you were talking about from the other thread is.That crazed anti-StephBrown anon from weeks back.Whatever. I still DC should use those steps to make Tim relevant again and make Steph bi also.
>>144643990super hero audience =/ the rest of the world. It takes a very american protestant mindset to twist a streetwise orphan and child soldier into a bad apple, or use avenger archetypes but makes it about "morals" or really-really insist on a no-kill rule.
>>144645198>IT KEEPS HAPPENING Whats his secret?
>>144644496>I feel that DC spent a lot of years being in denial about his popularity or just didn't understand it.Jason Todd was an obstacle to the man who made it his mission to rebuild Batman from the ground up... his way. Denny was king and his word was law in DC because of his work on Batman, so when Jason got popular, it shook the foundations of the Bat-editorial.
>>144645370A few anons seem to know his lore and where he gets around, but don't look too long or your head hurts from the crazy.
>>144645369yes, it's different problems. there are the soldiers he created basically out of a misunderstanding of how to handle trauma and then there's the one who was premade that he took in and knowingly put to work. damian being robin now is more irresponsible than dick or jason being robin then etc. tim is somewhere in the middle because of timeline and the weirdness of his joining process.
>>144645411By Starlin's word, he didn't even want to use Robin but O'Neil was forcing him to.
>>144645427O'Neil was also the guy who OKed Starlin's works knowing well it would get under the readers' skins. Hell, O'Neil was the guy who greenlit ADITF knowing well that his job would be secured and Starlin would be the sacrificial lamb.
>>144645206He has always been that way with his parental figures. Took care of his homeless addict mother, wanted to kill a man to avenge his deadbeat criminal father, literally died using his body to shield the mother he knew for a day who sold him out and watched him get beat to death. I think the dude has always been desperate to hold onto what he has left of “family” even if he gets a bad deal in the process.
>>144645421Here's the thing, lowkey, all those "raised to be an assassin" characters...people WANT to see them be cool and use their skills, not be rehabilitated and made normal. Because it's fiction and we can glaze over the real world trauma.Laura in Logan ends the movie at peace and implying she wont be a superhero. But people wanted her to return in a future movie in a costume, fighting. Cassandra Cain should've been given a tutor and a stable home life, not a costume. But her fans want her to be Batgirl and use the skills she was programmed with.
>>144643691There's something both hilarious and cathartic in knowing that characters like Joker and Jason Todd have become favorites of the downtrodden and icons in their own right while characters like Superman and Wonder Woman flop repeatedly. I guess it's because I'm done with how patronizing those characters are and the editors at DC are by extension.
>>144645576Oh, of course. This is only criticism in the context of periodic criticism of Batman for doing this thing we accept he did and don't mind because it's fictional and cool. The comics have tried to have their cake and eat it too with child soldiers and occasional lectures about how child soldiers are bad.
>>144645150>I swear whenever he gets brought up it’s because he threw some sort of emotional fit like a little bitch because he didn’t get what he wanted.Anon if a child got murdered, then brought back to life and his dad let his murderer live another day I'd probably get a lil upset too.
>>144645710Did he not see the good solider case? Water under the bridge that whole being tortured to death and blown up and the murderer gets off Scott free thing.
>>144642066The hilarious thing that Damian was accepted because of his team ups with Dick and Jon, not really because he is "the blood son".
>>144645768Probably because Batman being a father isn't really a new concept and it's not like he raised Damian from infantry like Superman did with Jon. So, what's exactly made him different from the other Robins? DC really thought "Son of Batman" was a novel idea.
>>144643695>I mean have you seen John Constantine. His most consistent love interest is Zatanna.You say this like it's a benefit to Zatanna.
>>144645820And Damian really spent most of his time being angry at Batman and running away from him.
>>144645768Yeah, it's kind of funny how some people talk about Damian and Bruce when they don't have much of a relationship.
>>144644437Honestly, the premise of Jason Todd getting dragged out of heaven, and returning to life only to realize that Gotham City since his death has gotten EVEN WORSE and deciding that Batman's methods are not enough is more than enough for general audiences.
>>144645946Bruce and other DC heroes had to have all sorts of schizo visions of dead Jason before the Prime punch retcon. Ollie even got to see him cloud swinging in Heaven.
>>144645291>Dick and Damian threads usually don't make it past 30 before that happens.Dick threads becoming Jason ones is the best part of any Dick thread. t.Dickfag
>>144646001It doesn't help younger Dick and Jason could be clones with their hairstyle
>>144645946Guys did they recolor the UTRH comic? I'm looking up images and some are images are different colors.
>>144646059The digital releases of comics can be pretty different. Some older stories have this weird smeary digital color effect that looks like a kid tried to play coloring book.
>>144646059Before the 2010s most comic images you saw online were scans, done by hobbyists and amateurs who's scanners would make colors look differentNow most comic rips are straight from the digital releases, which are straight from the original files. So that may be why.
>>144644947I doubt twitter is that relevant or is very representative of the general audience who goes to movies or buy games, especially if we're including non-americains. >>144644976I'd argue you don't see that all the story elements you have to introduce with Damian, or how these are not what the general audience expect to see in a "realist" Batman or just Batman. He's not the easiest Robin to establish. >People joke about Bruce taking in orphans and putting them in costumes because it just sounds ridiculous People joke about it because Batman and DC are prudes and nerds who panic or sperg if Batman isn't rationnal/a role model or if Robin is a child soldier. Which is ridiculous from an outsider perspective. Casuals had no problem with Hit-girl and Damian being his son or a little assassin doesn't make Bruce less irresponsible if that's the issue for you. >PicLone wolf & cub isn't pushing its MC as that sort of role model and outright state than by chasing after revenge the father is cursing his son/ruining his future. He even states that killing him would be more merciful fate than forcing him down this path at the very beginning of their adventure. The child could be the offspring of his enemy or some random orphan he met on the way and the story would still work the same.
>>144645820I mean, Morrison introduced Damian only a couple years before Bruce "died" and Dick took over. I think he introduced Damian knowing he already had DickBats planned in advance.
>>144645493He's also the guy who came up with the poll idea.
>>144643691Wasn't there a wrestler who come to show wearing Jason's mask and later revealed that he likes him?
>>144646220He knew what he was doing. What parent is going to let their kid play with the phone in 1988? >>144646257Jon Moxley in NJPW
>>144646257Yup. The best part is how quickly people while watching the show recognized the mask and we have some here who claim that he isn't popular.
>>144637634He was more popular than Damian has been to date. He's currently not as popular because editorial and writers decided they wanted to focus on the other characters instead of him, so he didn't get good stories written about him that kept his fanbase alive.
>>144637634no one but pedophiles like damian.
>>144646257Years ago, there was a professional athlete who talked about how Jason was his favorite character. Honestly, I have to admit that it's pretty impressive how popular he became despite how little he got.>>144646274He wasn't even wearing his iconic hood, but his current mask and yet they still recognized it.
>>144645291/co/ likes to complain about things that are shit way more than they like to talk about things that are actually good.Dick and Damian threads dying while Tim and Jason threads last till 500 confirms all of that
>>144646257What did you guys think of Jason no-selling Dick's flippy shit? I think it was pretty disrespectful that after the match he cut a promo telling Dick to take that shit back to the indie league in Florida.
>>144645590If Jason ever got adapted I could see him having the same trajectory as Deadpool>Really popular first movie>second movie where people are getting tired of the joke as he's hit pop culture oversaturation>third movie that needs to get carried by a bunch of guest starsI can just see people complaining>3 movies in and he still didn't kill the Joker?
>>144646390Jason is a no-dimes faggot who went into business for himself and still couldn't get himself over. Literal Jannetty.
>>144646257>>144646358So much for only women liking him
>>144646413I think they'd let him kill Joker in a potential Red Hood movie. Even '89 did it.
>>144646423It has never been true and it's just a cope.
>>144646423He is the most manly Robin. He appeals to both men and women.
>Jason is a no-dimes faggot who went into business for himself and still couldn't get himself over. Literal Jannetty.
>>144646475Kek
>>144646384But nothing with with Dick or Damian is particularly good as right now, especially not with Damian.
>>144646384>Jason threads >last till 500Lol
Jason Todd was never a draw. You think just because you draw some blood, act like a heel, and bury jobbers that you're suddenly on the level of Batman. What a dipshit.
>>144640950I like how this poster completely dropped off after this post because there's really no defending how the story was handled.
>>1446377011993-2008. That's 16 years straight.
If Fitzmartin was told to write a Tim run with NO ROMANCE I think it could work.
Jason Todd came back at the right time in history. Had he comeback the same four years after ADITF, everyone would have called it shit.
>>144637911love that you have Steph and didn't just do "the four boys". :D
>>14463895516 yearsand he became bisexual AFTER he lost his popularity. I honestly think that the coming out story was supposed to make him more popular. Which was stupid, but ya know, DC.
>>144646691Well, it definitely would've been a sleazy stunt all right.What do you think the universe would be like had Alan Grant's pitch of Lonnie being Robin III happened?
>>144646787>What do you think the universe would be like had Alan Grant's pitch of Lonnie being Robin III happened?I legit think Lonnie would have gotten even more hate than Jason.
>>144646830They would've had to make him dye his hair to start, DC marketing didn't want to accept any ginger Robins.
>>144646787Probably would've been a closed story arc. Alan Grant wasn't too fond of batfamily stuff(even though he ended up writing a very great Tim Drake) so he would've probably just had him attempt to see things from Bruce's POV, disagree, and move on. It was just an idea he floated but there were no serious plans.>>144646711Steph was honestly a better Robin when she became one than Tim was in terms of character dynamics at that point.
>>144646883It's a shame Steph's era was basically a stunt.
>>144646413>If Jason ever got adapted I could see him having the same trajectory as DeadpoolI don't see it considering the joke wore itself thin during the first movie.
It's fucked up that a rich guy decides his brand of justice is right while doing everything in his power to prevent a guy from the streets dishing out much-needed street justice.
>>144646830You act like Jason was super hated. This guy had a priest writing eulogy for him.
>>144641535>DC has literally zero trajectory for Damian other than him existingFrom higher up perspectives both Tim and Damian exists so that there's a Robin while still keeping Nightwing around.>God forbid anyone points out Batman can have 2 sidekicks.That just comes down to it that mostly are bothered if there are multiple superheroes running around using the same name. Red Robin is just not different enough. (Miles gets away with it due to a massive shill campaign and playing the race card).
>>144647117After doing some research, I have become convinced that the so called hate was overblown by DC due to the backlash. The vote was even quite close.
>>144647117I remember a guy who said that his father dropped DC for good because they killed Jason.
>>144647117I'm not saying Jason was a complete heat magnet whom everyone hated but given Lonnie's character, I think it would have eclipsed that of Jason's. also>it's real
>>144647160Yeah, the margin was pretty small and O'Neil even talked about how some guy apparently had an auto-dialer for the kill number.There was some little Florida girl that wrote in upset about them killing Robin, but then there was all this panic that comic shop owners had to calm down by telling people it was an inferior Robin that died and that Dick was fine.
>>144647117>>144647160Jason was literally the Scrappy Doo of Batman: character that legitimately increased viewership, but was massively hated by older "not muh" grognards, and has his hate massively overblown because the grognards got to rewrite history.
>>144647160There's a Reddit thread asking people of the time what it was like, and a bunch of them weighing in on whether they voted "Live" or "Die". Some funny responses.
>that time Dick threatened to beat the shit out of Danny after he told him Jason died
>>144647228>that comic shop owners had to calm down by telling people it was an inferior Robin that died and that Dick was fine.That doesn't makes sense. TT was extremely popular in the 70/80s so how the heck people who read comics didn't know that Dick was Nightwing?
>>144647217That was actually a touching eulogy.
>>144646968Hindsight is 20/20, but it would've felt more natural if she stayed as Robin until Damian, Tim had more time to grow into another role, and things otherwise played out the same except Tim maybe has an identity that isn't Red Robin.
>>144647279Combination of fans who legitimately liked Jason being met with snark from neckbeards, and casual audiences who only remembered the Adam West show and maybe a few Silver Age comics hearing from word of mouth.
>>144647279Probably casuals that only watched Super-Friends or the live action Batman show, or didn't read Titans.
>>144647279Because even though comics sold better in the 80's, we're talking more like hundreds of thousands and not the millions of people who'd watch Batman 66 or the superfriends cartoon or just generally people who knew Batman and Robin but weren't reading comics now. It was a national news story at a time where everyone watched the evening news.
>>144647302Dixon did have that pitch where he became Blue Beetle, but then it was only meant to be temporary and his classmates Star and Danny would become a Beetle duo.
>>144647312>Combination of fans who legitimately liked Jason being met with snark from neckbeardsGod, I hope those neckbeards stayed in comics long enough to see Jason return. And knowing neckbeards they definitely did.
>>144647345Yeah, but the huge backlash was mostly coming from parents getting angry at the vote and how a child friendly character was killed in such brutal way. It wasn't really because they thought it was Dick. Jason was already mentioned by name in the news.
>>144637634He’s a faggot, alright
>>144647388There's one guy who talked about how he wanted to vote "Die" as a kid, but his mom scolded him and grounded him for that.
>>144647376Yeah there was some rage on the DC message boards and Newsarama in that time, including one man threatening to take Batman and Detective Comics off his PULL LIST (gasp) until DC rectified their error and re-killed Jason.
Imagine it's 1989 and you're getting some comics for your kid and the neckbeard wearing a leather jacket over his My Life with the Thrill Kill Kult shirt while he is flipping through a box of Hellblazer and Swamp Thing comics smiles to himself when you ask the comic vendor what happened to Robin.
I think you also have to take into account that people will also just vote for the 'wrong' option because they think it would be funny.
>>144641914Maybe Dick outdid him but he was definitely on the “Mount Rushmore.” Lots of people (I.e. me) liked Tim because of the cartoon, then you go to the comic store and see had his own series, plus Young Justice. Tim was a big deal once.
>>144647470There was exactly one person that said they voted "die" to see if DC would really do it, and wound up crying when they saw it really happened.
>>144647481I imagine there were more and they just didn't regret it.
Bros...
>>144647217Father Canedo's still around as a musician, has a website and Facebook and all.
>>144644202The ones that don’t go full fundamentalist come off as a bit zesty.
>>144647388I feel that DC tried to cover it up by pretending that the backlash was just people being "confused". They clearly didn't expect Jason's death to blow up on their faces the way it did and the Exes being unhappy with it made it worse for them.
>>144647598The marketing department needed their Robin for merch, after all. The decision to kill Jason was what motivated Tim Burton to decide they didn't need any Robin for Batman '89 though, and so Ricky Addison Reed lost out on his chance to play the version of Dick that was in the early scripts.
No more brother wars...
It's kinda interesting how things changed. When Damian died, hardly anyone cared besides the nerds. It says a lot about how irrelevant DC has become.
>>144647632Because no one expected him to stay dead.
>>144647715And probably because kids don't read comics anymore so parents wouldn't know or care.
>>144647632Jason died when people still thought that big name comic deaths would actually stick. Even when "comic book death" became a meme, the old saying was "only Uncle Ben, Bucky, and Jason Todd stay dead," which made Red Hood and Winter Soldier hilarious. The 90s and especially 00s ended all delusions that fans would take deaths seriously anymore, yet moron writers still try and go "no really it's for real this time honest!"
>>144647733I don't think they would have cared even if kids still read cape comics. Things changed and kids aren't as sheltered as they used to be with iPhones and the internet being around. DC also doesn't matter at all anymore.
>>144647274>Danny still likely dead, weird Nu52 cameo in Vibe aside
>>144647715To be honest, I don't think people would have cared even if they expected him to stay dead.
What makes Red Hood work but Winter Soldier cringe by comparison?
>>144647970>Red Hood workHe has like arguably one good story, and even then, some people will tell you it's actually shit.
>>144647970Anon, Winter Soldier is the successful one.
>>144648019>>144648032Lmao
>>144648032>Winter Soldier is the successful one>isWS gained some fame thanks to MCU, but he is already forgotten.
>>144648060Winter Soldier got to actually be Captain America.Jason was such a shitty Batman that he got defeated by being told to go therapy, and then became a Red Pill-wearing ginger.
>>144647970He has a writer who is good at writing him.
>>144648032This. Just like Carol Danvers.
>>144648078Even MCU fans back then realized that he was just one hit wonder who would be forgotten quickly. He was what Jason haters claim he is, a guy who was only liked by women.>>144648087>Winter Soldier got to actually be Captain AmericaWhat a huge accomplishment. I remember how successful the idea. In some bizarro world.
>>144648163>He was what Jason haters claim he is, a guy who was only liked by women.He just doesn't have that angst setup that Jason did after getting his brains bashed in.
>Bucky>more successful than JasonThe haters are getting desperate.
>>144648163Bucky quickly became irrelevant because Steve/Tony became the popular ship after CW.
>>144648213It's not that Jason couldn't be more successful, it's that WB drags it's ass adapting stuff.Bucky rose and stagnated in 10 years when DC still can't get a Robin in a movie.
>>144648163The movies had to age Bucky up to give him the adult sexual appeal in the first place, pre-WS Bucky in the classic comics was but a kid too
>>144648266Nolanverse was so adamant about no Robin, and Snyder decided the only Robin to live and die was Dick. Maybe things will eventually turn around.
>>144648266Bucky isn't successful. He didn't carry his own movie and the show he got was more focused on Sam. He was part of MCU, but didn't leave a lasting impact.
>>144647355Still, Steph was going to be Robin for 6 months at least, twice as long as she got in the actual event.
>>144648266WB and DC are their absolute worst enemies. Marvel post-Shooter at their absolute best still can’t touch DC at their best, and WB’s is so poorly run that you can’t help but cheer their downfall.
>>144648329>He didn't carry his own movieAnd Jason never will.
>>144648536Indeed because DC and WB are basically dying and I have a little doubt that they will be able raise again. Yet, Jason is more relevant and popular than Bucky could ever wish to be.
>>144648580DTVs don't matter dude.
>>144648163People were actually confused by who the heck is bucky when the Civil War movie came out. I even remember laughing with some mcu fans about it.
>>144642952Are you missing brain cells? Titans media is the main reason why Nightwing is popular. Dick was part of the titans even in comics for a long time. You batfam shills are really delusional.
>>144648580I do have a feeling that we are witnessing the end of era. Marvel will follow after them quickly because these two can't survive without each others.
>>144648586Which makes Jason's accomplishment a bigger deal. Bucky made it to the big screen and still couldn't surpass Jason in popularity.
>>144648634The arkham games are more popular than any Titans media.
>>144648536Jason was the biggest draw of UTRH tho
>>144648699>>144648586
Why are you talking about bucky? He is so irrelevant among marvel fans.>>144647621I actually liked Jason & Tim brotherhood. It makes more sense for them to get along than hating each other.
>>144648704Lmao this like the other anon saying Jason Todd having fans in the MENA and Asia doesn’t count
>>144648745I think the "Jason would be a hardcore homophobe because he's a streetkid" shit is cringe, but pairing them up also seemed random and like Lobdell was just doing it because he had carte blanche on them.
These threads prove that Dick and Babs are the most boring members of the family.
>>144648940That's why they're perfect for each other; it prevents them from ruining any other characters they would be in a relationship with.
Did Jason even get to date anyone as Robin?Also, how would you fellas set up Jason's and Tim's next steps as characters? I haven't been keeping up with the comics, so I don't even know where they currently are lolAlso, I just noticed that I need DonBrothers edits with the Batfam
>>144648634dickkori shipper just woke up
>>144649049>Did Jason even get to date anyone as Robin?Does Rena count? She was his Pre-Crisis gf.
>>144649049>Did Jason even get to date anyone as Robin?Nope, one of his laments was not having a social life due to Robin duties. him and Tim were basically opposites, Tim had an active social life and Jason was all-in on Robin.One thing that's been pondered is that if Steph was around when Jason was, she'd have been a good match for him since he'd have no civilian ties to keep him from dating her as a hero.
>>144649035Can’t agree more. I hope they get married soon.
>>144649147Jason would have fucked Steph in the Redbird. Street rats be like that.
>>144649271>"That Tim's a special guy. you know he's good clean and wholesome">Batman ain't get mad when he took Steph out in the Redbird. Batman ain't say shit. And Steph is the sluttiest girl in Gotham and this dude took her out in the Redbird and Batman ain't say shit>If I took Steph out in the Redbird, Batman would lose his mind. Cause he know Steph's getting fucked that night.
>>144637634Gay
>>144638250One of the flaws/features of Tim Drake's character is his drive to fix things, even when it makes no sense to pursue such a path. It's why he tried to fix Batman and Robin, why he was convinced Bruce was alive after Final Crisis. Going too far for Kon makes sense in his character.
>>144646679Sorry anon he’s proposing to Bernard soon
>>144645282I thought Jubilee ruined Tim for other women.
>>144648676A big screen Jason movie would flop. Nobody has a reason to know who he is or particularly care so any effect he could have had on the audience is lost. People don’t like Robins in general and most think there was only one and Jason was a particularly bad one.
>>144648940>he didn't read Babs' solo series that was full of her being a giant goddamn mess of a human being
>>144647274I still don’t get why he reacted that way and was like crying and shit when he found out when they weren’t even bros. It’s not like he particularly liked him.
>>144650340Red Hood's a more acrobatic Punisher. The masses would love him.
>>144647113>It's fucked up that a rich guy decides his brand of justice is rightThat alone is fucked up but DC and fans are too busy framing anything about Batman or Batfam as a positive to care about that.>>144647504The two kind of confessions that come more often are 1) fans who didn't like the concept of Batman having a sidekick and 2) People who were curious to see if DC would actually commit to kill off Robin.
>>144648745> It makes more sense for them to> waspy boy and streetwise urchinI disagree, it's a forced dynamic and it's unbalanced at that. These two grow up in completely different environnement. Even their experience as Robin are polar opposite. Realistically there shouldn't be able to connect or care about each other, much less bond.
>>144637634Because he's a cocksucker. And they hooked him up with the wrong guy.
>>144649035This. > two black holes that negate each other>>144649049I've seen someone describe Jason as the lonely Robin and it's a way more fitting than any label DC went with. Jason's world was small. He just had Bruce and no time outside Robin or regular school. Alfred and Babs were irrelevant back in the days so they never interact. Dick crash once and goes back to his life.
>>144650340>A big screen movie would flopFixed that for you. Current WB can't do movies and the UTRH storyline would demands some actual built up. Such as introducing either one or two Robins or explore who Batman is as a mentor/big brother figure, which wasn't a thing on the big screen since Schumaker. That shit is too complex and human for nerds and bots to understand or develop.
They should've kept Tim Drake as Red Robin.
>>144651224Like the restaurant?
>>144650869Just because they grow up in different environment, doesn't mean that they have nothing in common and can't get along. What reason does Jason has to hate Tim and vice versa? Dick and Tim grow up in different environments too.
>>144651614If I was a guy who grew up homeless and spent more time on the streets than not I’d hate the rich kid who replaced me even if he was the nicest guy and he’s not kek. Imagine that guy getting everything you could’ve had and him being far closer with the only people you had left in your life than you ever were. I get why he should resent him and vice versa honestly. Tim has no reason to like him and Jason has every reason to hate him.
>>144651739Jason was literally adopted by a rich guy and he hasn't been concerned about money since he was 9 (never mind that his family wasn't really poor before his father was jailed). Jason can be petty, but he isn't that petty to hate someone just because they had a better childhood. Tim has no real reason to hate on Jason either.
>>144651224red robin is a terrible namethey should have found something else
>>144639199Duke Thomas is unequivocally a better character than Tim Drake if you compare both from 2013 to present.
>>144651739I wouldn't say Tim was closer to Bruce and Alfred than Jason ever was.
>>144651777Us lower class types typically don't like upper class types by default. Different values, different views.
>>144651777Jason spent a year and change living with Bruce Wayne when he was a teenager. His mom was a druggie and his dad was a common criminal. What are you talking about?
>>144651739it sounds like you're a fucking retard then.
>>144651937Jason was with him for a few years. He became Robin at about 13 and died at around 16.
>>144651925That anon's point is pretty clear. Jason is part of "the upper class" since he was adopted by billionaire and we really never saw him being specifically bitter about the rich.>>144651937 #Jason was with Bruce since he was 9 and died at 15. H lived in the streets for like a year before he was found by Bruce.
>>144651992>Jason was with Bruce since he was 9That's Dick. Jason was older when Bruce adopted him. 11-13.
>>144651777>Winick: In my view, he hates Tim without even knowing him, without knowing anything about him or ever fighting him or being alongside him, he hates just the idea of him. He’s the one who came after him.Jason hates the idea of Batman allowing another kid to be Robin after his death, not just who Tim is.
>>144651010Anon, every person under the sun knows the pop culture basics of Batman. He's a rich guy named Bruce Wayne whose parents died so now he fights crime as a vigilante and has a kid sidekick named Robin who's usually an orphaned acrobat named Dick Grayson. Everyone knows all that. All you need to do is a flashback scene where Joker crowbars Jason to death, and a small piece of dialogue after the reveal that Jason was his sidekick who died instead of using a bunch of movies just to set up the backstory.
>>144652012>After the events of COIE, it was decided to revamp Jason. Incoming writer Max Allan Collins made him a NINE-year old street urchinIt was also stated that Jason meeting Bruce storyline was a flashback and 3 years has passed.
>>144652027Winick also wanted Jason to be a ch*ld prostitute. I wouldn't take his words as law.
>>144652082Damn, that nigga died at 12 years old? Shit, that's some HBO shit right there.
>>144652082Heh so Bruce did actually raise Jason after all.
>>144652094It was the 00s. Edge was in. Writers wanted to push the envelope as far as they could get away with.
>>144652104At that point, yeah he would see Bruce as his dad.
>>144652096He should have been 12, but DC made another time skip to makes his death "less" worse. They had him die at 15 so Jason was actually with Bruce from 9 to 15.
>>144652117Then the New 52 made him Robin at 14 and die a year later.
>>144652129N52 made every Robin older with shorter time spent as Robin to fit them all in the 5 years timeline they made so Batman can stay young. It really doesn't matter anymore since it end up being changed.
>>144652146Isn't it 10 years now like in Zero Hour?
To be fair, at this point, I'd rather just have multiple Universes and Timelines that were ALWAYS kept apart. Let me read about the further adventures of Batman & Robin (Neal Adams 70s), and then let me pick up some issues of Batman & Robin (90s Pre-One Year Later). I want Jason Todd still dead. I'm tired of dark and brooding Bruce Wayne. I'd rather have Batman TAS or Batman: The Brave and Bold Animated.
>>144652153I give it less then 10 years before I can tell this to A.I. and it will do it for me.
>>144652153>I'd rather have Batman TAS or Batman: The Brave and Bold Animated.We get it, you're a manchild who likes watching cartoons.
>>144652094>no argumentKWAB
>>144652152DC timeline doesn't makes sense and they give up on the idea of trying to make it work.
>>144652177>KWABI don't know what does this even mean, but says a lot of things that shouldn't be taken seriously at all. Never mind that he never wrote Jason and Tim together nor has given us any insight about what Jason think of him in comics.
>>144652174I'm a man-child that loved all previous iterations of Batman. Each respective to their place in actual history. I like 50s Batman for it's nonsense. I love 40s Batman for its pulp. I adore 70s Batman because of Neal Adams. Etc... I'm a true Batman fan of all media. Except MODERN.
>>144652153>I'm tired of dark and brooding Bruce Wayne. I'd rather have Batman TASWhat a contradiction
>>144651614>What reason does Jason has to hate Tim and vice versa?Same anon and who say they had to hate each other? I'm saying they should be indifferent and not able to relate. 1) Tim was a huge hater and a jerk to dead Jaybin, so you'd know the answer to your question if you knew where these characters come from. 2) What is there to reconcile when two people live in total different realities, and when one of these two has their foot on the other neck to keep it that way. My complain is that it's not an organic build up but a forced dynamic that benefit Tim way more than Jason.
>>144652202This page should be enough to show how much Jason felt about Bruce having another sidekick. Also, Jason saying he's a lot like Mia didn't mean Winick wanted him to be Mia 2.0.
>>144652372Jason Todd served a better purpose as a martyr.
>>144651892Retarded take. Duke is one of the worst Batman characters and has absolutely no business be considered part of the "Batfamily"
>>144652409Thank God I have no idea who "Duke" is other then the leader of G.I. Joe.
>>144652409This. Jason Todd is the team black guy but nobody wants to admit it.
>>144651777Jason lived 2-3 years with Bruce, their relationship was rocky by the end because they had different values and pretending it's not the result of their upbringing and experiences is a wild take. Also why would you want him to hate the guy who give him a roof in exchange to be Robin because of he's filthy rich? What does that have to do with how Jason should feel about Tim...
>>144652372How this page translate to Jason hating Tim's gut? It's understandable he would be upset just like Dick was before him and Tim with Damian. You aren't helping your case.
>>144652341>Tim was a huge hater and a jerk to dead JaybinTim literally stated that he want to be a hero just like Jason.
>>144651892Truth
>>144652056> Everyone know Robin's nameNot true, especially outside America.>All you need to do is a flashback scene where Joker crowbars Jason to death, and a small piece of dialogue after the reveal And you'll get not emotional investment in return since surface level build up give very little pay off. You'll check boxes like an exec to make a 1:1 adaptation of the utrh movie that won't works on not nerds. You don't need a bunch of movies, but two is the minimal requirement here because utrh is one of those story that take into account that time does pass in Bat-land. Utrh isn't a stand-alone and is definitely not a good introduction/entry point to any of these characters.
>>144652442>their relationship was rocky by the end because they had different values and pretending it's not the result of their upbringing and experiences is a wild takeLmao, they had issues because they wanted to kill Jason. It wasn't the result of "natural progression" of Jason's so called deep rooted hatred of the rich.
>>144651941A rich kid and a homeless kid aren’t ever gonna be pals man. It’s just unrealistic. Cope
>>144652174Is there that big of a difference from comics and cartoons if it’s capeshit? Like outside of some exceptions where some darker themes are explored or some grey morality explored I don’t see how one is much more mature than the other. Cartoons just often omit blood and drugs etc but that doesn’t make it more mature if it’s not handled in a mature way when it is included.
>>144652435Jason wishes he was black. (Even fighting crime on the Hill and getting a black girlfriend)But he ain’t.
>>144642701Gays are reason why jjk, Tokyo Ghoul, Naruto, snk, kny and death note very populer and mainstream
>>144652612He also literally believes Jason died because he was reckless and impulsive who didn't think things through and that he (Tim) would serve nobody as a dead hero. He pushed the envelop of the bad robin/rotten apple and had other character reassures him he was nothing like Jason.
>>144652726Since when did he have a girlfriend?
>>144652672And yet they were actually "pals". Also, "muh realism".
>>144652747His current miniseries
>>144652747Since forever? He went through 5 different girlfriends since he came back.
>>144637634Wasn't he supposed to be the normal one but took it away?
>>144652638>It wasn't the result of Jason's so called deep rooted hatred of the rich.Get better reading comprehension because I'm not talking about "deep rooted hatred" of anything or "natural progression".
>>144637634Dick = original, so he's going to get the most popularity by default. Is Tim really less popular than Jason or Damian though?
>>144652753No they weren’t kek. I can recall maybe like two times they were amicable with each other. It doesn’t need to be realistic always but it should be believable and nothing they have done has made it believable that those two would want anything to do with each other. It’s more sensible writing to have them disdainful towards each other.
>>144652791>Dick = original, so he's going to get the most popularityTopest kek. Even Tim surpassed him in popularity at some point and was doing better than him.
>>144652588It’s more than just him being replaced. It’s about how Batman disrespected his death by allowing Tim to be Robin.
>>144652811Read actual comics instead of making judgment based on out of context panels you read in Tumblr before you start arguing with me.
>>144652768Now how’d he manage that
>>144652819>It’s about how Batman disrespected his death by allowing Tim to be RobinI don't remember him having an issue with that.And use Johns's terrible issue on TT as a proof.
>>144652829Doesn’t everyone on tumblr want them to fuck or something. I don’t know what to tell you. They aren’t friends. I don’t think they particularly care about each other either.
>>144652851>And use+don't
>>144652851Literally in the thread >>144652372What I don’t get about the TT issue was why they colored his bare legs yellow. To save his dignity?
>>144652863Actually, they are in comics. The fact that you hate the idea of them getting along because you apparently think every single person would automatically hate a person because they are rich wouldn't make untrue.
>>144652208No one cares, nerd.
>>144652851>>144652866>I don't remember him having an issue with that.>”He hates just the idea of him“>”He’s the one who came after him”>>>1446523722deep4u
>>144652819>It’s about how Batman disrespected his death by allowing Tim to be Robin.It's hard to believes Bruce ever respected Jason's death or life for what matter when you hear how he justify taking the kid in, or when he cover up his murder to keep his secret identity safe. Not mentioning how the victim blaming starts as soon as Jason's body hits the ground.
>>144652947Don't you ever get tired of this?
>>144652899I do. A Batman fan who doesn't respect modern Batman is a good nerd.
>>144652963This, the thread is going die soon, but I have to say this. Stop crying over this. DC is mediocre who let their bias affect their storylines regardless whether it makes sense or not. Sometimes they blamed Jason, other times it's Batman who blames himself for what happened. One thing was clear that he loved him and his lose affected him deeply.
Tim has found his niche among the Robins.
>>144652947Yeah, and how long did it take for him to have another sidekick? A year or two? What a piece of shit. It doesn’t matter how much he cries about Jason’s death because his actions say otherwise.
>>144652999>>144652947>>144652819Why didn’t he just adopt a new kid that he actually loves and name him Jason? Is he stupid?
>>144652963No.
>>144653018He tried to kill the Joker too, but Superman wouldn't let him.
>>144653018I agree. It’s not his fault though maybe he wasn’t that attached to him yet before he died. His new guy should’ve looked just like him and be named Jason 2 in his honor.
>>144652999I'm getting tired of people whining about something that happened before they were even born. DC even stopped doing that so stop making such a huge deal over it already. Jason's problem with Bruce in UTH wouldn't have made sense if he supposedly was always awful to him and disrespectful of him.
>>144653021There's actually a kid running named after Jason.
>>144653068I remember the story. The moment was touching and it was a nice gesture.
>>144653060Even if he was awful and disrespectful to him sometimes it would be hard to blame him. Jason was kind of a little shit.
>>144653068>>144653080When did this happen?
>>144653091I would because he is the one who decided to take responsibility of Jason. It's not like he forced himself into him.And don't use my comment to push your terrible take about how Batman never cared about him.
>>144653036What about after that? Did he try to kill the Joker again? >>144653055No, he shouldn’t let anyone be Robin, at least not until UtRH.
>>144653137Shortly after he died.
>>144653158No but he beat the shit out of him while screaming the boy’s name one time. Killing him wouldn’t bring him back anyways.
>>144653018Between 3 months and a year.>>144653060Winick is following up to the Jason was a bad and violent robin retcons and UTRH wouldn't makes sense if not for that.
>>144653187But it would stop the Joker from killing more people…
>>144652999>he loved him and his lose affected him deeply.Idk, maybe? It change nothing for me since I care more for the victims of a system than the people who can abuse it.
>>144653321Yeah until he comes back to life lol
>>144651892I would have been fine with duke if he was an Dickbats 2nd Robindesu they should have stopped adding batfamily members for Bruce after Damian got madethere's more than enough batfamily members aroundif he needs a black friend, just make black lightning and the other outsiders more prevalent members in the family
Richard Grayson is NightwingTim Drake is RobinJason Todd is DEAD. That's it for me.
>>144653688It’s kind of funny he was only dead for like six months. Like why be so dramatic about it why didn’t he go on a vacation or something
