The man's priorities are in order.
Website comment:>That moment you think it’s safe to finally unclench your jaw and whoops! That was load-bearing, now you’ve collapsed into a pile of broken bits.>-AshleyPatreon comment:>I know lots of people hate Sonorie but I can't help thinking she's kinda cool. Plenty of flaws, did lots wrong, but I love a deeply grey character who, if nothing else, tried to remain true to what they believed in.>We'll see this little group briefly one more time, but until then, let's go see if Duane managed to find Sette. He's got a final date with a tiddybird.
medic Chea rides again!
>defeats Karl>save's the queen>reunited with daddy>immediately starts trying to fix his boo-boosChea is a good girl.
>>146435742Her white poncho isn't just for show, she's a white mage! Though in this lighting it looks more beige. Beige mage.
>>146435607>I can'tMy man Toma is fed up with manipulative bitches. It's daddy time now. Elka's face in the 6th panel cracks me up.
>>146436608eh, I don't think Toma is doing it to spite the queen. Or at least, he'd give the same response even if he was convinced she walks on water.
Based Toma, priorities his daughter over his own queen.
>>146436608>>146436632I don't think he's fed up, but I do think this little by play is meant to be as close as someone like Toma can get to acting, if not insubordinate, then at least passive aggressive. It's pretty clear the Queen's plans have blown up in everyones' faces, and even if Toma is ride or die, he wants to make it clear what his priorities really are. As long as he can look after Chea, he's in, and the Queen not betray his trust further in that regard.Remember, Toma was basically going to commit suicide by cop a few chapters ago, throwing himself into an unwinnable fight rather than confront the drama in his life. He's come back manfully, but between Elka and Chea, he's really come around on what he needs to focus on, even if he's still loyal to Queen and her plans.
>>146436608>>146436632>>146436735Toma is telling her to stand on her own. It's like a nicer way to say "STAND UP"
>>146436842I think you're right. The way he says it so deliberately... he's telling her, in the only way he can, that he needs her to hold it together. Because he's injured, he has his very young child to hold onto and protect, the limitations are clear. In other words, she just has to get it together, stand up, keep moving, and deal with whatever she's dealing with later.
>let's go see if Duane managed to find Sette. He's got a final date with a tiddybirdYesss.... Duane's senet beast tally is going to increase from 1.5 to 2.5. 2 at least.
>>146437008>Duane's gonna kill/maim every single "god" in the settingA true son of Ssael
>>146437008How though? He's got no pymary inside the khert, and I doubt he could hurt her further with just his bare hands.
>>146437800>He's got no pymary inside the khertWhat's to say he's not going to discover it? At least one other human apparently could manipulate the khert itself.
>>146437800He's a big strong soldier man ghost and she's a starved and disemboweled girl ghost. I imagine he can kick her tailed ass without much trouble, since she doesn't have a body to bear Sette's soul-destroying claws.
>>146437867>>146437856Jacaranda's there though. I doubt he would let Duane hurt her further.
>>146435723As a certified Queen Hater I... well, first of all, it's more like a dislike than a hate. I find it hard to outright hate fictional characters in general. Anyway, my problem isn't so much the queen herself. Characters like Ruck and Starfish are also perfectly hateable, and plenty of people seem to have felt (or still feel) a virulent hatred for Quigley. I feel like the writing keeps bailing her out, both morally and physically. And I feel like the journey of Toma and Elka is cut short by the focus on the queen, and the word of god that she is, in fact, "kinda cool". Contrast that with Duane, who we are still allowed to think is very cool while also acknowledging that his blind nationalism and zealotry were wrong and poor character traits. In a story where he learns that the Crescians are just normal people and that he's a shit person if he doesn't respect that, it feels weird to see a character responsible for so much misery treated so reverently. Overall it has set me to thought, and made me realize that despite the majority of the comic taking place in Cresce I can describe it the least well of the nations we've seen thus far. The identities of Sharteshane and Alderode are well established. Even Ulestry gets a big, defining trait, though we don't see it much. But Cresce just seems have had every punch on it pulled. I can't properly describe its culture aside from being a generally nice place.So what would I have expected? Toma and Elka bursting into the room in the middle of Ruck and the queen's little dialogue. No time for little villain talks like in the plays, this is war. Maybe some hard choices need to be made. Maybe the Alds do burst in and inadvertently help out. Maybe Roger's soul dissipates and these Alds realize the deep shit they are in, and more hard choices need to be made.For me, this works out too neatly and I did not enjoy it. Feel free to ignore me. But I do feel that this is a big blemish on an otherwise near perfect story.
>>146437800Pymary doesn't affect senet's directly anyway, and yet he killed one and fucked another sideways. Have faith in the lad. Where a beast needs a beating, he will find a way.>>146437975>Jacaranda's there thoughJacaranda is a tourist. He won't do shit. He just watched Sette eat his sister's eye.
>>146438043What I find funny is that with villains like Starfish people generally agree that he's a good character, but noone is going to call him a good person. But with the queen it seems not only do the majority of people say they "like" her, they extend that into they approve of what she's done and say they'd do it themselves in the same situation. Doing deals with a literal devil, starting wars, persecuting an entire race, hiding military facilities under a childen's shrine, calmly bringing about the deaths of thousands or tens of thousands for some supposed greater good, feeding a possibly autistic gay man to a rape snake one torturous piece at a time over weeks or months...If you made her a white man and put a red cap on his head with "Make Cresce Great Again" written on it those people would have a sudden revelation. It reminds me of when Cope warned tumblr that they would hate the King of Sharteshane before his appearance. Dude did nothing wrong, especially by comparison to queenie.
>>146438117> and yet he killed one and fucked another sideways.Yeah, with pymary. You can't affect them directly but you can still use it to fight them.But that doesn't work in the khert.
>>146438240Anon what the fuck are you talking about
>>146438248>But that doesn't work in the khert.It doesn't need to. Like I said, have faith in the lad. Tittybird already got half broken by her own silver monster, Duane will find a way to add to her woes.
>>146438258You're not on patreon, are you.
>>146438043Agreed. Lately I feel like characters are held to wildly different standards by Cope. Quigley gets a "love and come to God" speech from Duane, which might be just a bit too much. And by "a bit", I actually mean she overdid that by a little. In my mind I feel like Duane should have been more stern with him, if still forgiving. But those are not my characters, so what do I know.Bell's final pages felt outright grotesque, cartoonishly overblown in how deranged-disney-villain he looked and acted. His treatment in the story is even harder to justify when it's revealed shortly after that he WASN'T this way willingly. He was a better man, *mind-raped* by a snake on QUEEN'S ORDERS.A queen, that of all people involed gets off this pain train with a few bruises, a mild fright, a pat on the back and most her problems solving themselves for her..Hello? Cope? What the fuck?And then there's Duane, whose (lack of) virtuosness seem often be judged against the standards of Jesus or Siddhartha Gautama. Even if by any other measure the man has virtue in excess of anything that can be reasonably expected of a normal human being. Considering his circumstances it's a damn miracle that he doesn't kill peaceguard on sight, keeps his wits sharper than those who don't need to hold off madness every waking moment of their lives, and is willing and able to see and start fixing past mistakes while helping others to fix theirs along the way.
>>146438317I have to wonder if Sonorie will continue to be portrayed as sympathetic, or if this is merely the beginning of a darker turn for her. With the other branches of government decapitated, is there much to stop her from making the monarchy a bit more absolute? She doesn't have the Dammakhert trick anymore to make Alderode's defeat "bloodless," but Ashley has already pointed out that Sonorie can rationalize mass bloodshed to herself pretty easily in pursuit of her ideals. Ashley mentioned Sonorie's Dammakhert takeover would've soon been followed by a genocide of the Ssaelit and Soud, and I believe the wording she used was that Sonorie would've viewed it as a "breaking eggs to make an omelet" situation.
>>146438360>Ashley has already pointed out that Sonorie can rationalize mass bloodshed to herself pretty easily in pursuit of her idealsRuck pointed it out to her in story, also. But it was seemingly brushed over.
>>146438317Yeah, pretty much. The other Anon perhaps puts it slightly controversially, but I see a big gap between the things the queen has objectively done and how they are judged compared with other characters. Admittedly, this has been boiling for a while in my mind, because I have long held the queen responsible for matters that others have excused. Specifically, Bell's rebellion and the Inak genocide. Which people have said isn't her responsibility, because that's Bell's decision, not hers. But I've always held that she's the queen, and it's her responsibility by virtue of that alone. If she can't keep her hounds leashed, they are still her hounds. A guy running rampant with half the army murdering a minority with impunity in her lands is her fucking responsibility whichever way you cut it. Then we get the admission that she had a much greater hands in it than previously thought, and then... nothing. It was OK because she had good intentions.I need some fucking acknowledgement that the queen was in the wrong. I need some faith to be shaken for this all to work for me. If all this had gone the same way, but it ended with Toma hearing her bullshit and walking away with Chea while leaving the queen there, I would have been happy. Or even with him begrudgingly dragging the queen out with barely hidden disgust, putting himself aside for the good of the nation. Just... something.
The reactions to Sonorie, Duane, and Lemon's character arcs just reeks of people getting so wrapped up in their headcanons that they completely ignore what's actually happening in the comic when they're even slightly contradicted.
>>146438421By all means join the actual conversation instead of just shouting snide remarks from the sidelines.
>>146438421Do tell, please. What is it that people ignore here? Far as I can see people only simplify for brevity. Not everybody has the time and eloquence for writing coherent walls of text.
>>146435768Honestly, if Chea survives all this she's going to grow up to be a real force to be reckoned with.Most *adults* in this situation would be a complete mess by now, totally overwhelmed. But this child is not just keeping it together, but doing what little she can do to help those around her. That fact that she isn't a traumatized, bawling babe by now is a feat.
>>146439456That can be a problem later in life, too. That said, her dad's EMIL FUCKING TOMA so she might have simply inherited his nerves of steel.
>>146439456I think a lot of people fail to give credit for how resilient kids are. A lot of kids go through garbage situations that break adults and come out more or less fine. It takes experience to know how fucked up the world is, and how hairy the situation you're in is. Also, Plat kids grown up with this shit and are treated as active combatants (because they are), so it isn't even rare in the world of the comic. I like Chea because she's nice and means a lot to characters I like, but she's not particularly special.
>>146437856The man got the codes from the big bird herself
>>146438412I don't think Sonorie not getting punished is the same as justifying her actions. Plus I think part of the reason Sonorie is still alive is because her death create an entire succession plot that we can't just ignore. Remember Bell is gone, Nary killed her sister, and a bunch of top people just died. In cope's on words it would be a mess.
>>146440575This. Sonorie needs to survive because the story becomes a mess right now if that doesn't happen, and Sonorie needs to be presented as sympathetic or at least redeemable for that survival to be palatable.
>>146438412The Queen is absolutely in the wrong on a lot of shit and has a literal mountain of bodies to her name to show for it, a significant number of them her own people. Toma and Elka have witnessed a lot of it first-hand and they may have some opinions about it but right now they simply don't have the luxury. I personally think there's a good chance Toma resigns his commission the moment it's safe to do so and walks the fuck away.That said she's the ruler of an entire nation. She's going to get viewed and judged on a different level than a lone individual, and some things viewed as barbarous by said individual will be viewed as awful but necessary on hers. We have been shown that, at least on a personal level everything she's definitely aware of it all and that it's not all sunshine and rainbows in her psyche. She's probably just hoping history views her as doing what needed to be done to let her kingdom survive her era, being a celebrated or storied ruler doesn't seem to have entered the equation.
unsounded as a text is really concerned with how people react to their mistakes and regrets, how they live with them, and how they deal with themsonorie has been consistently portrayed as a woman who deeply meditates on the problems presented to her- she approaches stormy situations with caution- and has even publicly floated forgiveness and capitulation as a way to end conflict. she was on that train since chapter 13, not twenty pages after Matty introduces the "mean makes mean" concept. i dont think its a coincidence that she echoes that sentiment in talking about what reaching for violent strength and revenge gets you- "Hatred hooks its fingers. In the end, perhaps they will only hold the void."sonorie believes in forgiveness- she believes in regrets. in her confrontation with ruck she was going to have them taken from her so she could be more like Bell. she DOESNT want that. she wants to learn from her mistakes. she wants to provide for people. she wants to minimize violence, suffering, and turmoil. it makes sense that, narratively, she succeeds. but even then she's lost the trust of the crescian people- of toma, the good man. she will have to win it back somehow
>>146440575I'm straight up saying that I would be happy with a resolution to this where she's still alive and in power. I'm not in the business of demanding characters I don't like are killed off. My problems with the queen are:1) There seem to be no narrative consequences for her actions, involving either her or the characters who hold her in high regard (Emil & Elka). Which belies the themes we have thus far seen in the story. Many characters with flaws have seen them examined, often brutally. The queen's schemes mirror and are involved in Tittybird's schemes, but the difference in how the story treats them is stark.2) The resolution of the queen and Ruck's arc seems to have subsumed the resolution of Emil & Elka's arc. Emil's great stand was fighting Bell instead of saving his daughter, which feels wrong. Instead, the queen saves his daughter for him and he just wanders in at the end. Conveniently after the queen has said anything that might shake his faith in her.Ultimately knowing that the queen was being favored by the narrative made the entire sequence with Ruck anticlimactic, because the moment you realize that you know there are no stakes. No-one is at risk, except cock-deer. Who we've been told was the queen's best friend (and should thus be considered a narrative cost), but which we've barely been shown. We liked her because she was honest about wanting to see some dicks. All of it was way too smooth for a comic where people are bastards and die like bastards.>>146441037We'll see what Emil & Elka say, but they haven't said it yet. At this point I'm expecting them to keep up their loyalty, to be honest. I already feel like this isn't the best resolution to their arc. But we'll see.>She's probably just hoping history views her as doing what needed to be doneThe thing is, I think can confidently say that yes, it will. Because I'm under the distinct impression that Ashley goes easy on the queen always. Which is my sore point.
>>146441619>The queen's schemes mirror and are involved in Tittybird's schemes, but the difference in how the story treats them is stark.Tittybird is a direct antagonist to Duane and Sette and has created a very tangible giant monster thats attacking the city. I feel like her larger scale goals are treated with the same scrutiny and sympathy as Sonorie's, she's just very actively trying to kill the main characters right now. >All of it was way too smooth for a comic where people are bastards and die like bastards.I think its more accurate to say that lots of people die, and lots of them were bastards. This isn't a comic about karmic punishments. Matty is still running free, for example.
>>146438240Forgot about>quick started the revolution that lead to death of TWO whole god damn cities (YOUR CITIES) just to make an enemy of your opposition
>>146441619>The thing is, I think can confidently say that yes, it will. Because I'm under the distinct impression that Ashley goes easy on the queen always. Which is my sore point.I just don't see it. She likes her characters, as she should, but I don't see the preferential treatment.
>>146442624It feels that way because at the moment the only punishment she has suffered for her actions are internal. She got lucky to get away from Ruck, the only human to hear the incriminating conversation is a child, and all her political rivals are dead. It's all very convenient. This could change in the future but we don't know what will happen so we can only judge what we've seen.
>>146442762Again, that can be chalked up to Sonorie being a major political force, and anything that happens to her has to be accounted for as the story moves forward to Alderode. things that happen are not decided by who Ashley likes best or who Ashley thinks is the most right.
>>146443017Yes it can, but likewise favoritism can't be fully ruled out either. And I'm not even saying she can't stay in power. Just someone telling her to her face that she fucked up is enough really.
>>146443258I feel like Ruck has been pretty thorough in that
>>146443374I'm talking about a human. With only Ruck knowing the truth will most likely forever remain hidden.
>>146443464Toma and Elka at least know of the weapons lab under the shrine and the fucked up way they generated the storm shield, they can easily infer that she knows more about what happened here than just a simple incursion/invasion
>>146438240With lefty people, its not what you do, its what you are, they are just "like that", everything is about the progressive stack and shit, it eats up every part of their being, all the things they talk about.it isn't even about love or helping people really, they view black people as lesser "pets" to take care of, but are completely obsessed with doing so, all my friends are lefties and all they do is talk about how to help black people or how things affect black people.none of them interact with black people, I do because I also have a few black friends and coworkers and I'm working poor and my friends aren't.its really gotten old.
>>146438360"darker turn"? she's outright as diabolical as fucking Palaptine, she's just delusional in that she thinks this is all leading to greater good shit.she's commited acts that make a ton of really dark villains in fiction seem pale by comparison, she's up there with Archie's Eggman in terms of henious shit.
>>146438421I suspect a big part of that is the pacing. Stuff from just a few chapters ago, which would but take a couple hours to read today, took years to get through.
>>146444197you might be schizophrenic
>>146441619Every aspect of the queen's plans has blown up in her face (the silver, Bell, her sister, Litriya, the Black Tongues, Ruck). She's been shown on page to be hurt and shaken by the harm her actions have wrought. Her objectives are now out of her reach, and all of this has been rubbed in her face by the monster she's responsible for unleashing.It's true that her political opponents are gone, but at the cost of her nation's stability as a whole, which is again contrary to her goals: with Bell she wanted to head off a coup, not decapitate all the other branches of government.I can't help but think you must be seeing Ashley lay out Sonorie's ideals and plans and express sympathy for her outside the comic and extrapolating favoritism that just isn't present in the story presented in the comic.
>>146435723I like the queen as a character and it's been a ride seeing all her high level machinations blow up and her having to grapple with the very real fallout in front of her face. Doing her best to keep Chea alive despite her plans resulting in the deaths of soldiers and families like Toma and Chea is a great way to illustrate her conflicted nature and explore the question of "doing the right thing" that shows up in other characters and conflicts like with Duane. It's one thing to be a high level elite treating lives from a safe distance as abstract numbers and pieces on a game board. It's another to watch the violence of your choices unfold before your eyes. Now the question remains if she'll learn something from this or delude herself with sweet lies like Duane "never lost a lad" Adelier.The politics sperg trying to pivot this into some big statement about the big leftist boogeyman he's concocted in his head because he thinks the queen's getting off easy needs to take a chill pill.
>>146445095>The politics sperg trying to pivot this into some big statement about the big leftist boogeyman he's concocted in his head because he thinks the queen's getting off easy needs to take a chill pill.It's human nature to read into things what they want, projecting their own biases and ignoring the parts that don't fit. You shouldn't get too excited about it, because you will see it over and over in life (providing you pay attention) and it doesn't do your health any good to go round getting excited at absolutely everything.
I like Sonorie because old women don't often get portrayed as political schemers in government and that's fun to read. Also I like her design.
>>146438240You can’t be seriously comparing her to fucking Starfish.
>>146447353In terms that they are both characters in the Unsounded webcomic that readers respond to, yes of course I am.
>>146447787Do you think there might possibly be some difference between their characters and actions that may cause people to view them differently? Nobody’s treating Starfish like he’s some deeply nuanced character.
>>146447828NTA, but they're both secondary characters who got a lot of page-time. How much hairs do you want to split before people are allowed to compare characters and audience response to said characters? His whole point is that nobody had trouble condemning Starfish for his terrible actions because Starfish is a deeply unlikable person. We even have the luxury of him being fat and ugly, so not even the fujo's will latch onto him. In contrast, the queen is a nice little old lady. She's your mom. Or grannie. And this Anon is saying that people are willing to let a lot of shit slide just because she's nice. With which he might have a point, because you seemed to think just insisting that it's offensive to compare her to Starfish was enough of an argument on its own.
>>146448141>people aren’t charitable to the unrepentant pedophile, rapist, and human trafficker with no actual deeper inner world or remotely sympathetic motivations for being the way he is because he’s not a cute granny and they’re leftists or somethingIt’s not offensive. It’s just silly. People are sympathetic because we’ve gotten a glimpse into her head and know exactly why she made the choices she made even as the comic condemns her for her failures. They’re completely different types of characters.
>>146448141Thankyou, I was too distracted by work to reply properly.
>>146448141NTA and I agree, but I don't believe a lot of people associate Sonorie with their moms or grannies. Sonorie doesn't give off a motherly vibe at all, more like one's slightly distant but well educated aunt.
>>146438240>>146444197>>146448141Do you just look at a character's appearance and put them on the blizzard diversity chart, or do you occasionally read the words next to the pretty pictures and draw conclusions from those?
