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Poolside Edition

Previous Thread: >>11050980

Discuss lewd games, share your projects, and have others critique them.
Post pictures (/d/ related, preferably) to inspire developers and keep the thread alive.
Check the archives before posting requests:
https://desuarchive.org/d/search/subject/%2Fdgg%2F/

>/dgg/ Game Catalog:
Password: lewd
https://scriptbin.works/u/Opekst/dgg-game-catalog
>New thread guide & template:
https://pastebin.com/196MgvBQ
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>>11066248
games for this feel?
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>>11066248
cute!
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>>11066240
thank you for not using the worst fucking OP image i have ever had to endure for this general.

on-topic: am i missing out on any good futa on male/femboy games? i know of and have played
>tales of androgyny
>pandoras forest (S tier)
>femboy survival
>max the elf

i feel like that's probably all there is of note, kind of a niche genre. i've been scouring the internet for this type of stuff for the better part of a decade so i'd be surprised if i missed anything.
>>
>>11066400
>am i missing out on any good futa on male/femboy games?
You must have not looked that hard if you missed Star Periphery.
>>
>>11066408
>>>/aco/weg
>>
>>11066418
it looks even worse than I remember it
>megamind
>granny
>dyke
>dke 2
>dyke 3
>main character, the ultimate basedboy
>regular girl
>regular milf
>>11066433
I'd like to hear what it was made with because I seem to remember it saying it was DAZ. If it isn't, then they sure tried to make it look like they use DAZ for some weird reason. Sci-fi was mistake, I wish we'd uninvent science.

My biggest problem with the game is that it looks like the dev or the dev's friends shills it all over 4chan including on /v/, ritualposting it with no tact or remorse. It's hard to get into something that you associate with deranged schizos.
>>
thoughts on Rogue Femme? it has some /d/ elements like monstergirls (goblins, catgirls etc.) and futanari
>Overview:
>This is a Roguelike Card Game in early development! It contains Adult Content like nudity.
it has AI art but if the gameplay is at least fun (ready: sexy) then it could be kewl
>>
>>11066455
if it was made with shitty art I'd probably love it, like Dungeon Depths is just kisekae and low-tier graphics but I'm fine with that. Looking at AI makes my head hurt so a whole screen of it is even worse.
The kinks are all there I'm sure I'd love it otherwise.
>>
>>11066462
>>11066455
oh fuck, I just checked the Patreon and the $5 mentions a hand drawn version. I'm still gonna wait on it but I'll keep an eye out. If anyone knows more about it, do post about it.
>>
>>11066462
yeah I'm not a fan of AI either but I can look past it if it's not completely horrendous
>>11066468
I didn't know that there was a hand drawn version, guess I'll just wait 3 years to see where the project went and download it then. I personally care about gameplay the most so I figure waiting is just the best thing
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>>11062106
Working with tokens is easier and more clear to the player. Hypnosis (and parasites and crests) were added really early on, and don't really work as well with other mechanics. If I were to do it again, I'd merge them with the token and equipment system instead. So now they are a bit forgotten since they aren't really tied to the core game mechanics.
I'm adding a grapple that increases hypnosis now though (pic unrelated).
>>
>>11066452
>I'd like to hear what it was made with because I seem to remember it saying it was DAZ.
The dev said that they use blender to make the images in one of their patreon posts.
>My biggest problem with the game is that it looks like the dev or the dev's friends shills it all over 4chan including on /v/,
That sucks. I heard about that but thought it was just schizo ramblings.
>>
>>11066455
>roguelike deckbuilder
>early access
gaben please what do ignored tags mean if you still show me every game with them
>>
>>11066418
The dev constantly shills, ignore him. Endless fucking posting about his goblinshit.
>>
>>11066511
Honestly, first time I hear about this abomination, and, I hope last time.
>>
Does Kinky Dungeon have an endgame?
After floors 4 and 8 i got boss fights, but got none after 12 and 16 doesn't seem to have one either.
>>
>>11066452
>My biggest problem with the game is that it looks like the dev or the dev's friends shills it all over 4chan including on /v/, ritualposting it with no tact or remorse. It's hard to get into something that you associate with deranged schizos.
That's just most weg's at this point.
>>
>>11066705
That's true. Degrees of Lewdity's dev used to come to /dgg/ to shill his game.
>>
>>11066452
>My biggest problem with the game is that it looks like the dev or the dev's friends shills it all over 4chan including on /v/, ritualposting it with no tact or remorse. It's hard to get into something that you associate with deranged schizos
oh hey, I found one >>11066729
>>
>>11066729
Purityfag also shilled it hardcore on /v/
>>
I remember seeing a weird futa game taking place in a school where a futa went on a fuck kill rampage and there was some other girl who could absorb their lackeys dead bodies to regenerate. The art looked kinda fake realistic instead of the typical anime you see. Anyone remember the name? I believe it was done in rpgmaker as well.
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>>11066484
not that anon but while you're here, is there any reason that this ability has you target another party member despite not involving them in any fashion (nor does the skill it replaces)? It doesn't really change anything and would only really cause issues in a solo run, so I'm not really sure it counts as a bug.
Loved how big the dreamer dungeon was, got a mana amulet drop early on running it and ended up with 328 mana, which was interesting.
>>
>>11066801
You talking about that one where everyone kinda moves jankily and animated the whole time, right?
>>
>>11066867
And another "possibly a bug maybe not a bug", laying eggs can spawn enemies in the narrow chasm modifier past the stated limit of 2(or 3) enemies, which is maybe intentional, I don't know.
>>
>>11066801
That sounds like Donna..donna something. I can't think of the title.
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>>11066240
Anyone got any other good feminization games like perverted education and secretary? I really like html games games of the such
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>>11066801
A little bit, i just remember a scene where the futa gives birth to a clone or something to help you fight, fever dream game

>>11066867
No clue
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>>11066909
That's not DohnaDohna at all anon.
>>
>DoL uodate
>a month of work from various people
>one scene added and the rest is just graphics
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>>11067127
At this point, being smacked with a loli porn conviction would be the upside of Vrel's pathetic existence.
Good excuse to cut free, at least.
>>
any games with elaborate hair mechanics or characters that look like this >>11067141 ?
I am mainly looking for stuff with armpit hair and pubic hair
>>
>>11067127
I really wonder what's the point of changing the upload schedule like this. It's just going to make the game look worse.
>>
I hadn't noticed before, but in the game, in the information tab, Vrelnir is credited as the creator, while Purity is credited as the developer. I don't like the implications.
>>
>>11067177
>elaborate hair mechanics
we can only dream
might draw armpit fluff at some point. I tend to draw fluff instead of hair because I'm a coward.
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>>11067177
I swear I've played a couple of games with hair growth mechanics for pubic/armpit/ass hair
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>>11066400
You can do that in Free Cities pregmod, make the PC a futa and trapify all your male slaves, give your female slave penises
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>>11067177
Village of Corruption is about transforming a bunch of innocent villagers into succubi, most of whom also have pubes and hairy armpits.
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>>11067287
Fluff is fine too, I'm just tired of seeing smooth skin where it shouldn't be
>>11067303
you mean The Corruption of the Village [v0.4.2] [Inatari Tales] ?
>Ntr can't be avoided
oh well maybe in 3 years when it will be abandoned it might be worth checking it out
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>>11067386
No, I was thinking of Village of Nightmare.
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>>11067397
uh thanks..
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>>11066240
I'm working on a /d/ game, how important is game play verses content for people here? Right now I have a 2D point and click game with no combat, or art, would you rather have a more linear, less combat focused game with animated walk cycles and customizable characters and NPCs, or less details such as no player or NPC walking sprites and just click on NPC sprites to speak with them, but more animations for sex combat. I want to have things like cursed loot & BDSM gear that changes the player or NPCs, like armor that turns into a bitchsuit and makes them crawl, but all that would take time from other aspects of the game. Perhaps it's not clear what I mean without seeing it, I'm not the best at explaining things, but in a few days I will show which ever style I go for at first and then get some feedback from you all here.
>>
>>11067476
I wanna have everything fully animated in 3D VR with full voice acting for every NPC and a complementary fleshlight with each purchase
shit dog, it's your game, you gotta know what you wanna make vs. what you can get away with
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>>11067480
I get you, that's true. I just thought I'd see what anons thought but ultimately every ones opinions are going to be different and maybe not even what they'd actually want, even if they think they would.
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>>11067121
>>11066909
He's not thinking of dohna dohna, he's thinking of rondo duo
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>>11067476
People care more about volume of content than quality of gameplay in general.
Personally, I find sex combat often turns out awful, I don't want to be playing a text adventure though. I think those games where you simply walk around and monsters try to grab you and put you into a fuck scene are ideal.
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>>11067476
gameplay > content
luv me lots of stats and systems
i also like sex combat systems, usually feels too much like a visual novel without some semblance of one.
also please for the love of god let your performance in sex combat actually effect the story
>>
>>11067476
make something you would play first. only then you can think about what others would like
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>>11067476
i've also been working on a game, a sort of deckbuilding-combat in a traditional 2d rpg style thing. played a game with a similar concept recently and realized some of my core design principles were things that pissed me off. i'd strongly recommend finding a game of the type you want to make that you enjoy and getting a deep understanding of why you like it, don't just come up with mechanics that sound like they'd work when you're horny as that's a recipe for some torturously bad gameplay.
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>>11067504
>>11067510
>>11067525
>>11067542
Thanks for the advice guys, especially that last one, I I should probably start over and make a design document and do more research, to help insure the game play loop works and is fun. I'm pretty bad about deciding on features when I'm horny or whatever that when I get to actually implementing are shit, or too complex.
>>
>>11067499
Nah its not that, this was made in rpgmaker and had lots of guro
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>>11066867
That's a bug.
>>11066888
That's not really intentional, but it doesn't cause major problems and programming it differently would be a pain. So it can stay.
>>
>>11067476
I hate that this is even a question, in any context, ever.
If you are making a GAME, the first and foremost priority should always be GAMEPLAY, no exceptions.

When it comes to lewd games there's already too many crappy renpy wegs with worse gameplay than in an ancient sim dating flash made as a joke. Too many japanese rpgmaker games that are just CG galleries with minimum effort stock rpgmaker grind tacked on, because games sell better than CG sets.
Bad gameplay is an epidemic. Don't make it bigger.
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>>11066400
RJ393283 - Dragon Princess is Hungry - about 4 scenes
RJ203431 - Introducing An Apprentice Incubus - 2 scenes

Neither game has its main focus on futa on male, but what's there is good and if you like regular femdom too then they're great.
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>>11066400
RJ265685
I personally can't stand rpgm grind games but maybe you can if you liked pandoras forest
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>>11067975
I wouldn't say it's super grindy, but I'm not sure I ever made it to the end because I couldn't be bothered to do it all
decent game for futa on male.
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>>11067655
I understand, but the problem is, if I go with my gameplay focused idea, there is so much content that needs to be created for something that I have a good feeling 90% of players, even ones that want a gameplay focused game like you, will mostly ignore and then likely complain that there is no sexual content. I want to make an adult isometric CRPG roguelike, but all the mechanics and art assets required will take so much time from adding any sexual content I just don't know if I can justify it. That said, even the gameplay light version will be more than a renpy VN or RPGMaker grind.
>>
>>11068068
Whatever you decide please put a lot of focus on UX. I cannot play another ToA or Trapquest
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>>11068103
Is ToA, Tales of Androgyny or something else? I haven't played either but I'll see what is wrong with them.
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>>11068068
Gameplay doesn't necessarily have to be a higly complicated affair that's work-intensive to produce, it just has to be fun and polished. Maybe not even polished, many beloved game classics are janky as hell. You gotta find what works for your game and production possibilities.

Also even basic RPGMaker combat can be made good, the UX is already very robust. It's down to encounter design, itemization, etc. And getting those right takes RPG design skill, a scarce resource that the whole whole lacks.
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>>11068117
Yeah that's ToA. Trapquest is mostly horrendous due to an old design philosophy for both the game and the UI, it's reminiscent of roguelikes and belongs back in the 90s.

The problems with ToA is the combat being both awful and incomprehensible to the player, due to a bad UI combined with obscure nonsensical unintuitive mechanics. Worth playing both so you have a good idea of what to avoid.
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>>11068146
Just looking at screenshots Trapquest"s issues look pretty obvious, but yeah I'll try both out to make a better UI/UX.
>>11068140
>Maybe not even polished, many beloved game classics are janky as hell. You gotta find what works for your game and production possibilities.
Yeah, that's true most porn games are a bit janky, but I still like them, and so do others. So, I'll aim higher with my project. Even if I don't quite make it, I hope people will still enjoy it.
>>
when I played trap quest about 5 years ago I turned of about 80% of content because it's not for me (not into inflation, latex, bimbos, diapers and so on) and just played it like a normal dungeon crawler with traps basically and it was alright. I know my opinion is very skewed

I'd argue the main problems are having 5 or 6 artstyles while not a single one is completed. too ''much'' content per level and having little overarching content (each level could be seen as a different game). lots of things you won't know unless you play the game multiple times and remember the smallest detail (what the different candies do) is also not really fun imo.
the old engine is not that big of a deal I'd say. it doesn't help but it's a lot better than having all the renpy and rpgm garbage we have now that don't fully utilize the capabilities of the program

I want to play it again but the game only having an update twice a year doesn't help it. I might just try it and treat it as abandoned
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>>11068209
I would hold off on it. I played it for years since I enjoy the way it handles tf but they recently "upgraded" the UI in the most frustrating way. Every action takes about 3 more clicks than necessary, which is torture on that engine, and far less is displayed in favor of an uglier overall appearance. There is also clearly not a definite direction towards the finish line in terms of how they want to conclude the game--it has been a placeholder ending for years that is now locked behind one more door than it used to be.
>>
>>11068228
>I would hold off on it.
reading your full post I will, thanks. I feel like the annual updates alone was a sign of how bad the game was doing but I didn't know they changed something they shouldn't have changed. I hate how many weg devs do that

I don't understand why there are no more dungeon crawlers allah trap quest. steal everything, use a different engine and simplify it and it will sell like hot cakes. I'm too retarded to do it but I don't see why it would fail
>>
I just noticed the dialog in DoL for trying to enter the strip club was changed. The protagonist tries to use their school ID but gets told they need a legal ID. As opposed to the old line that didn't mention a school ID and all but spelled out the protag being underaged.
I believe this is what the hip youth nowadays call "gaslighting"? I'll definitively have some strong words for Vrelnir about these changes and that Degrees of Pedity nonsense excuse.
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>>11068228
>recently "upgraded" the UI
I don't think "recently" applies. It's been years since the switch to graphical. What's annoying is that clicking on an icon brings up 4 interactions, but they're not necessarily the ones you want, so you have to click the tiny corner of the pop-up window to bring the full list up. And of course, not everything has that setup implemented. Good luck guessing if you're clicking in the wrong place or trying to do something unplanned, unless you spoil yourself by reading the wiki or searching the git.

>>11068266
>allah
It's "a-la" unless you're invoking a god. There are plenty of roguelikes, but unless you have a specific idea of how to integrate porn you're better off with just making a regular game.

If you do want to try TQ with the latest stuff enabled, F95 thread has a DL for "clothing" version and debug unlocker. Though "clothing" doesn't have body size changes enabled and swaps to Danaume to show growth/shrinkage.

>>11068336
Shut your troll mouth. We had shitposts for days over this back when. Don't make the mods pay attention to us again.
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>>11068379
Looking back, I got bit too upset. Something about that line just set me off.
Anyway, different subject. I've seen Course of Temptation brought up here before and I've been enjoying quite a bit of it lately. It gets some fairly decent-ish updates. It doesn't really have much /d/ content and it probably never will, but I hope it will at least have at least a little bit more of it in the future.
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>>11068336
Minitru notice, recdep malquote Vrelnir. Fullwise adult protag always. Discord rectify Goodwise.
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>>11068379
>We had shitposts for days over this back when
We were ribbing Vrel's recent update just last thread to nobody's dissent you joyless toad.
>>
What was that one game where you were the wolf / dog boy and you went through a room-based layout and the one boss was the wolf with the big dick or whatever?
Only asking because I played it years ago and am wondering if it's dead.
>>
>>11068418
>ribbing
Which is fine. Multiple 600-shitpost threads over DoL changing words are not, whatever side of the pedo watershed you happen to be on.

>>11068394
And I apologize for overreacting. DoL was inspired by IRL pedo stuff in UK (multiple victims, years of abuse, multiple perpetrators acting in concert). Protag being underage creates an obvious position with a lack of power, and explains why PC is easily overpowered and can't get help from authorities. DoL started moving away from that almost instantly, though, with explicit age references first edited out and then cut altogether. "Gaslighting" would be to say that content was never there, which it was.

Underage content had been getting cut from lots of stuff due to Patreon and UK crackdowns. DoL might have gotten proactive about it, or the fans brought onboard might have overwhelmed Vrel and taken over. No matter how much someone might feel "betrayed" by changes, /d/ is not the place for that kind of stuff. People who care for that self-organize elsewhere, same as what happened with FC lolimod. That's part of why DoL discussion died down.

It does leave present-day DoL with clear incongruities, both in specific parts and in general. "Why don't you just leave" is actually a problem a lot of the fetish game setups share: you either have to bend the world until it facilitates your fetish, remove player agency, or make MC so dumb as to stick around in objectively bad situations. In DoL's case, it feels like the supernatural is going to be doing most of the heavy lifting going forward.
>>
>>11068438
>Which is fine
nobody cares about your opinion
>>
>>11068438
>FC lolimod
Is that part of pregmod now or is it a separate mod entirely?
>>
I need a new game with freedom to do whatever you want, bonus points if it has character customization, non-con and futas
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>>11068438
>UK crackdowns
They should focus on stopping real child abuse instead of protecting imaginary children.
Fucking hypocritical pieces of shit.
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>>11068537
>1,400
>up to 1,000
Even if those numbers might be inflated for shock value, fucking hell that's dreadful.
>>
>>11068476
Yes, it got integrated. Lets you set min age of all slaves, min age of fertility/potency, etc. Has incubators to rapidly age children, max speed 1 week = 1 year, and spit them out as slaves. Nursery isn't complete yet. You can alter MC with slave-grade drugs now, but not major surgery (hip/shoulder width) or genetics (adding quirks lke giantism). On the visual side there's been a bunch of work to generate slave images via AI.
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>>11068537
It's an anarcho-tyrannic state now, anon.
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>>11068510
Degrees of Lewdity
Debasing Grounds
Modded Skyrim
>>
>>11068541
Even if they were inflated 10x, which they are not, that would already signify that it's a highly organized system. Not just something like a gang of rapefugees grooming the occasional kid online.

And those are just the rings that got caught. The real problem is almost certainly bigger.
>>
>>11068543
Gotcha good to know. I've been following the git and there's even a bit of a side-side-side project of working a LLM into the mix. Nursery is pretty much broken, sadly. The gradual expansion of what you can do to yourself is pretty cool though.
>>
>>11068546
That's pretty fucking insane to contemplate. With the UK basically being a panopticon I have no idea how that's even possible besides corruption.
>>
>>11068558
>>11068541
Rotherham knowingly went on for ten years with collusion from local government and police, it's documented fact. Some police were helping to supply the gang with kids and drugs, tipping them off. Anon is wrong though, Vrelnir stated multiple times DoL was based on his own experiences. but yeah, not /d/. The guy who said not to start shitposting started it, how ironic.
I'm not gonna talk more about it, but if you want more details, 'Easy Meat; Multicultural islam and child sex slavery' is a book on it, and there's also a large wiki article. It's fucking awful, depressing reading.

>>11068544
Shamrock is top tier and I want him in games.
>>11068510
AI gen is your best bet, honestly, if you can find a non-neutered GPT. I used to run a local /v/ broken AI dungeon way back when for obscure fetishes. They're lobotomising it hard but it was amazing at the time. Otherwise, Eragames. Eratohok, EraTW. You can be a futa, rape a futa into mindbreak, commit bestiality, rape pretty much everyone you meet, piss in someone's pussy, tentacle rape someone to death, marry your sister in Tohok. TW is mostly about stealing panties, time stop raping everyone and meeting your soulmate waifu and going on dates with her.
>>
>>11068570
I'll keep it in mind when for when I finish the two books I have in my current queue. Part of me thinks I won't find a copy locally due to the local leftist bent, but it's worth a look anyway. Thank you.
>>
>>11068547
The nursery has been dead for crazy long, you gotta remember how it's code built on code built on abandoned code, like a hive city. Farmyard is super fucking broken.
The new PC body system looks interesting but honestly i'd just love to do more with slaves that is more affectionate for my favourites. But I also enjoy playing it more for the running a lewd arcology aspect and the geopolitics so I might be nuts.
>>11068573
Internet archive has an online copy, archive.org. Like I said, it's not easy reading. Those girls were tortured, mutilated, blackmailed. Several were doused in gasoline in fake executions, one was beaten unconscious with a clawhammer for getting pregnant. All witnesses and whistleblowers were threatened, including by the police, who threatened to hand over one whistleblower's daughter to a gang. DOL is fucking tame in comparison.
Life is fucking tiring and this is why I hide in porn games.
Honestly the fact someone hasn't made DoL: Rotherham edition yet is a blessing.
>>
>>11067552
the best piece of advice you're going to get is to make what you want to make, keep it focused, and ignore anyone asking for a fetish you didn't plan on including unless it's a really good idea and easy to implement
>>
>>11067293
DoL has pubic hair growth, but it's not elaborate at all.
>>
Anybody still play Girl Life? It used to be discussed here years ago
>>
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This Slay the Spire clone is kicking my ass.
The game pressures you to make use of the demon cards (which lets the demon rape you later) to beat fights.
>>
>>11068823
better link it
https://www.dlsite.com/maniax/work/=/product_id/RJ01186021.html
>Partial AI Use
seems the card graphics are AI but the CGs shown look real
>3D Works Younger Sister Transforming Girl Sex Change / Transsexual Pregnancy / Impregnation Violation Discipline Interspecies Sex
>>
>>11067476
Often times, restraints become a massive penalty to the player and forces them to reload a save. What might help with this is if they didn't just blatantly cripple the wearer without offering anything back. Instead, they should be a source of unique and interesting powers that come with trade offs. There are a few pictures detailing "cursed loot" that you can take inspiration from.

Sex doesn't need to be part of combat. If your game must have it, then it should be more of a "side show" or a reward mechanism for success. Letting the players see it by losing on purpose kind of makes any time you spend making the game fun a waste of time. So look for ways to make the sexy content a reward instead of linking it to failure is the gist of it, in combat and gear.
>>
>>11068228
>There is also clearly not a definite direction towards the finish line in terms of how they want to conclude the game--it has been a placeholder ending for years that is now locked behind one more door than it used to be.
Huh? You can beat the game and get an ending epilogue, that's been the case for like 8 years at this point.

>>11068379
>I don't think "recently" applies. It's been years since the switch to graphical.
They did another rework. Now your inventory is split into three separate tabs for worn/held/bagged items and you can swap between the clothing and body viewers on the fly.

My main issue with TQ is that it's just kind of awkward to play as a porn game. It's too restrictive to be a sandbox like say DoL but it's also not anywhere close to a proper narrative experience. The total randomness means a lot of stuff just ends up being silly rather than hot, and the mechanical implementation of the fetish content can be really awkward. Basically there's too much game for it to be a simple stress-free scene viewer but also not enough game for it to actually be fun and engaging to play.
>>
>>11068545
I've played all those, lately mostly Debasing Grounds. I'm looking for other games like it.
>>
>>11068438
Proof was posted multiple times about DoL which discord fags like to come and try to astroturf it saying "it was never that" but then conveniently ignore Vrel posting and liking posts on ATF.
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Dumb question but any good hentai games right now that I can play with my wife? I wanna a discreet hentai game to play with her hat hastgentle femdom It can even have feminization but no cuck shit. it gotta be a good game that I also get "surprised it turned out to be a hentai out of nowhere" but that keep us playing because it has a good story or is interesting enough. I kinda wanna get her into it but have no idea how so had that stupid idea
>>
>>11068958
I'm gonna be honest with you anon, you might want to reconsider this one when you're done jerking off. I just can't see a scenario in which trying to subtly trick your wife into playing a hentai game ends the way you want it to. You might just have to muster up some courage to discuss the topic with her directly instead of ending up like that anon with the Smash Bros pick-up line spreadsheet.
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>>11068991
I've talked about it with her she is open about it but I just don't wanna bring it up again, kinda. I wanna have an excuse to bring it up or maybe make her bring it up? I've tried a couple of hentai/lewd games but wasn't interesting and were focused only on the porn part
>>
>>11068996
Might be good to try some phone games. That does, unfortunately, limit what you can play by quite a margin. Avoiding games that aren't explicitly lewd from the start is difficult as well...
I'm partial towards something like Max the Elf for this. Anything too complicated isn't going to work well. I've got my own game but I wouldn't be sure if that's suitable.
>>
>>11069000
Thanks anon hey if you can please tell your game I'll give it a shot!
>>
how the hell do people like this get married
>>
>>11069006
I might shill it sometime, but I'm struggling to put these various games in the context of "would look good if someone else were watching you play"
It might be good to look for femdom games, like the previously mentioned "Dragon Princess is Hungry", but there are very few games that look high quality enough to really pass as something you'd casually download. Dohna Dohna is the closest you'll get on that, and it seems to have quite a bit of non-H content, but I haven't played it myself.
>>
>>11069007
what you mean anon
>>11069018
thanks its more like she is the one that is gonna play while I help her
>>
>>11069023
Isn't the problem then the wife's tastes?
If you look at DLsite, it has a section for women. You'll then notice all the products are ASMR or, if you're lucky, VNs. Unless you know she's actually into it I think most ladies would get frustrated at any /d/ game, the audience for /d/ games is almost entirely men. You wouldn't want it to fall flat when the wife gets frustrated by a game and you're the one trying to do all the playing.
Even when I've had a girl recommend me action games, they tend to be more the emotional sort. You do the platforming and fight the enemies but then you're hugging the spirits of dead bears or whatever. Or it's an action game but you also rescue kitties from fires. When I think of emotional sorts of games, far too many of them are cuckshit because that's what drives an emotional response out of people, so that makes this even harder. One time I played a VN aimed at women, I was surprised that I ended up with an ending where the girl (main character) is manipulated and betrayed by the guy.

what on earth would a /d/ game for women even look like, I wonder...
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>>11068958
I certainly can't think of any series that introduced femdom and crossdresser sex several games in
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>>11068991
>You might just have to muster up some courage to discuss the topic with her directly
I'm seconding this.
>>11068996
>I just don't wanna bring it up again
Why? If it's too embarrassing, you can tell her “Hey, there's something I want to talk about, but it's embarrassing.” She'll probably appreciate your honesty.
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>>11069042
A lot of sites like Pornhub have a category for videos that are frequently viewed by women. A lot of lesbian content.
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>>11069042
I think with the big female fanbase DOL is getting we'll probably be getting /d/ games aimed at women eventually.
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>>11069164
>big female fanbase DOL is getting
eh?
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>>11069338
Why do you think that it's been moving away from the rape simulator aspect and into more of a dating game? Check out the #DegreesofLewdity hashtag on Twitter sometime. Tons of art, some with thousands of likes, all clearly drawn by women. I even saw a cosplay once.
>>
>>11068140
>>11068103
"""UX""" is not a real thing
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>>11069340
anon those are trannies
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>>11069342
Wouldn't be surprised if a lot on discord are, those types flock there. But you can just tell the artists posting on twitter are actual women. Though I guess it's probably easier to tell the difference between the two if you've been in fan communities with actual women in it.
>>
>>11069343
>you can just tell
troonblind
>>
>>11068958
Snipperclips
>>
>>11069356
No wonder men hate them so much, it's because they simply can't tell the difference...
>>
>>11069361
just you
>>
>>11069343
This is always the most hilarious cope. "Uhhh our fandom has actual girls, just take our word for it"
>>
>>11066617
There's a point where you go to new game+ I think but I don't remember what version I played when I did that. I think there are three bosses now but it's hard to tell what's going on with that game since the dev moved all their update news to discord. I'm not a fan of the boss fights in that game at all though they're really tiresome.
>>
>>11069042
>If you look at DLsite, it has a section for women. You'll then notice all the products are ASMR or, if you're lucky, VNs. Unless you know she's actually into it I think most ladies would get frustrated at any /d/ game, the audience for /d/ games is almost entirely men.
You vastly underestimate how many women are total degenerates. DLsite may have a "women's" section that's mostly audio/VNs but that doesn't mean they aren't still consuming the "male-targeted" h-games, just like how the existence of shoujo manga doesn't stop shounen from still being incredibly popular among women.
>>
>>11069936
"Shounen" is just a general category. DBZ is going to have much more of a male audience than Boku no Hero Academia. Women absolutely are degenerates but just in a different way. Most h-games are too specialized to hit a wide audience so most h-games are going to appeal to just one demographic.
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This game
https://inksgirls.itch.io/orbs
but with belly inflation in 9 sizes ending in an abdomen bigger than a woman pregnant overdue with triplets. She couldn't possible play with her whole body ballooned up.

Alternatively, a dating sim:
You, a customizable male you'll never see except in one mirror.
Love interests: farm girl, shy girl, party girl, sports tomboy, fashionista, books nerd
They can randomly have one of three levels of interest: low, mid, and high.
Each grill has three arcs to her story, and if her interest is high, you only need to finish the chapter.
Otherwise, you have to go through her entire backstory.
Backgrounds: garden (garden hose), beach (water hose, air pump, air compressor), gas station (tire pump), etc.
You can unlock the playable female you can customize and never see except in one mirror.
>>
Imagine a reality where Vrel hadn't fallen into an 'official discord' trap. We might've got some of the fucking maybe pile done instead of the 'have some more ten thousand clothes because cosplay'
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>>11070156
I'm still living in my hopeful deluded headcanon that Vrel is moonlighting as Madodev to escape troon house arrest.
>>
>>11070160
>eldritch latex vacbed
Sign me the fuck up.
>>
>>11070163
Play Latex Dungeon.
>>
LonaRPG finished yet? Chink is a hard cunt to follow ever since he left /tg/.
>>11070160
>the party denounces the Vrelnite coalition who have been working for counterrevolutionary forces, engaging in wrecking, undermining the Discord and contradicting the official history with revisionist propaganda
All his messages do feel pre-reviewed like a gun's to his head, yeah. Perhaps they'll stop him posting next for the 'good of the game'.
Never let any cunt in.
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>>11070172
>LonaRPG finished yet?
Nope.

In terms of the world map and overall content, there wasn't a big difference between my previous 0.5.3.2.2 (2021) playthrough and recent 0.9.0.5 (2024) one. The game is well over 80% done, and, as with any software, the last 20% takes 80% of the effort. The updates from 0.5 on have mostly been small tweaks, polish, expanding this and that a little bit, adding side content. Game's completely playable from start to finish, there aren't any broken/wip mechanics or systems. Only an increasingly small chunk of Sybaris is still blocked off and the questlines in the northeast region end short.

Also, you can use the fag95 thread to follow the development. Or the dev's youtube channel for random dev videos, @eccma417
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>>11069999
I'm pretty sure there already is a belly inflation watermelon game clone.
>>
Stick to your general, fags.
>>
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Received answer from Steam that they aren't allowing Ero Dungeons on there. No clarifications on what specific content caused them to ban it, just a short dry message, no retries allowed, no possibility to remove content.
>>
>>11070492
To avoid that kind of stuff some producers publish a pg-13 version + lewd patch in their website.
>>
>>11070495
Yeah, I know, I got greedy. I wanted to use the Steam Workshop for easy mod support, didn't want to deal with censoring everything, and assumed a game listed as adult content would get more visibility (since people would explicitly look for it).
Mistakes were made.
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>>11070497
>ng, and assumed a game listed as adult content would get more visibility
I don't think it matters.
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1227890/Summer_Memories/
>>
>>11070492
Meanwhile DAZ-screenshots-"games" are all over the steam.
>>
>>11070492
honestly wonder if they just see the (relatively) blocky bodies and go "that's kids" without any real thought put into it.
>>
>>11066408
What is the name of this kind of artstyle? Or program? How can we destroy it once and for all?
>>
>>11070581
>>11070577
>>11070492
Adult games on steam always is a russian roulette. I can believe they throw a dice every time to refuse something or not.
>>
>>11070492
Damn, that's fucked.
Gaben gets too much worship when there's so little effort put into site quality control. They'll let any assetflip trash on there but if they decide they don't like you specifiically there's just nothing you can do.
I hear a lot of benefits like being given a special highlighted discount are down to just chatting up the steam employees or knowing someone from there, though, anyone could ask and if the employee likes your game they might oblige. Still fucked up.
>>
>>11070191
if you know of one please poast it. All ive found on itch is a boobs one.
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>>11070636
They also specifically hate anything school uniform related, and perfectly safe games get denied without even having lewd content. Things like Evernicle 1 being on steam but not 2, it mostly comes down to if a normal person gets to review the game for steam or someone with dyed hair and pronouns gets it.
>>
>>11070497

We spoke about this... you even made an entire argument for why you were going to make a sfw version for steam since otherwise germany wouldnt be able to see it. So what happened with the sfw version that you said that you had been making alongside with the game?
>>
>>11070492
Could it be an issue with potential copyrights from Darkest Dungeon?
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>>11070492
Damn that sucks, it might be because there's spider children in your game?
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>>11070840
There's already lots of other darkest dungeon style games on steam.
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>>11070577
Perhaps steam doesn't count them as porn because daz3d is too hideous to be considered arousing to anyone.
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>>11070492
Steam rejects and/or approves porn games at random. It depends entirely on the mood of whoever is approving games when yours comes up, and their personal opinions on what they see

Sucks that you got unlucky.
>>
>>11070577
>>11070581
>>11070596
>>11070636
>>11070700
>>11071210

Look, I know by the very nature of this board, the average aversion to loli shit is much lower than most places... but holy shit, you guys need to realize how much trouble Valve would get into for allowing literal child porn on their store due to lack of caution. *That* is why you can get assetflip trash onto Steam so easily; because Valve isn't going to have to deal with literal criminal charges if they allow shitty games on the store. Yes, that means false positives are common, but I really don't know what you guys are expecting.
>>
>>11071599
It's perfectly legal in some of the biggest steam-using countries and Steam can and will ban certain countries from seeing certain content.
Hell, in countries like the UK where it's technically banned, it's one of those new millenium laws that makes up a long list of
>dumb shit that they added to the law books but never enforced, that nobody cares about other than businesses who don't want their competitors to abuse the legal system to get government grants to sue each other
Plenty of steam using countries don't allow any sort of sexual content, period. Iran can give you the death penalty for simply possessing porn.

Steam could allow it, it's just they would have to actually put any effort at fucking all into managing their store, so it's easier to just kick everything out that's even a slight liability.
Especially with Visa and Paypal. Just about every retail business on the internet depends on them and if Visa or Paypal decide they don't like you, you're fucked.
There are no "literal criminal charges", these have never happened with loli.
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>>11071607
Child porn is illegal in the U.S, which is where Valve is based. It's that simple. Like holy fuck, I don't understand what is so complicated about it my guy. Valve has no interest in getting tangled up with child porn.
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>>11071617
Your chances of finding child porn in Ero Dungeons is zero, your chances of finding child porn in TF2 is above zero. I don't get your argument.
>>
>>11071617
The definition of child porn is subjective.
Even if you read the discord TOS it says:
Do not solicit, share, or make any attempt to distribute content that depicts, promotes, or attempts to normalize child sexual abuse. Also, do not post content or engage in conduct that in any way sexualizes children. This includes real as well as manipulated media, animation (such as lolicon), and any type of digital creation (note that this includes AI-generated media).

Note this:
>This includes real as well as manipulated media
Real is pretty easy to understand but "manipulated" means, based on real material.

I understand that this is a complex topic (which has yet to reach a consensus) but I feel like it is important to highlight that we live in a world with mentally retarded people who lack the ability to dissociate virtual/abstract concepts from reality. Examples: Trannies that think sex is an abstract concept when biology says otherwise. Or furfags who anthropomorphize animals with the claim that they are entitled to human rights. Same goes with lolicons, but like what I cited above there's a spectrum, no absolutes. One big boundary is the 2D filter differentiation with 3d but that's not sufficient. Anyways rent over.
>>
>>11071627
That's because you're being willfully obtuse. Valve does not (generally) reject "random" porn games like people here are pretending. It's a specific sort of game that is either skirting the edge in a "grey zone" of sorts, or just has the unfortunate luck to have visual similarities. It's not about what games *could* be legally defended as not being child porn, it's about Valve not having the slightest desire to touch that rattlesnake nest with a 100 ft pole. It *is not worth it* to them. Porn has never been a focus for Steam, it's essentially an afterthought they allowed because, "Well, why not?". They are not going to stick their neck out for anything that *could potentially* get them into trouble, and you're an idiot for thinking they either would or should.

And where is there child porn in TF2 that's actually part of the game that Valve (the developer of the game) has put out, and not something *users* are injecting into the game? It's the equivalent of walking into a movie store and holding up a phone playing child porn and then blaming the store and the store *actually* carrying child porn for sale.

>>11071632
>The definition of child porn is subjective.
Even more reason for Valve to be extra cautious, that's kind of the whole point here. It has NOTHING to do with what could legally be defended or not, it's about Valve having no reason to risk it.
>>
>Even more reason for Valve to be extra cautious
Yeah I agree, better be safe than sorry.
>>
>>11071634
>Valve does not (generally) reject "random" porn games
It absolutely fucking does. What are you playing at?

Kagura Games for example has managed to get lolicon onto Steam. Their every released used to get carefully screened and they famously had to gnomify some titles with lolis, but at some point something changed, I assume Valve just started trusting them more as a publisher, and things got more lax.
>>
>>11071638
Whatever man. If you still can't get it through your head that Valve just doesn't want to risk being associated with child porn at this point, you're a lost cause. Go eat some more lead paint or something.
>>
>>11071641
I'm a different anon, just calling out your mistake there.

Valve's vetting for porn games is wildly random. They have absolutely inane refusal criteria like school uniforms, while at the same time letting actual loli porn through if they trust the publisher.
>>
>>11071646
Alright, trying not to be an ass here then, I'll try to explain what I'm saying succinctly one more time.

The reason loli can get through if they "trust the publisher" is *because* they trust the publisher. They have a strong enough working relationship, or the publisher has a good enough general reputation, that Valve can safely say, "We can trust that whatever you have in this game *will not ever* get us into legal hotwater". But if a similar thing pops up from random no name indie dev's first project? Do you really think Valve is gonna go, "Oh, well, we trust you to have dotted your i's and crossed your t's anon.". No, they're gonna say, "Your $20 niche porn game that'll make us some spare change isn't worth it.".

It's not some grand, "muh SJW, feminist, communist, woke, tranny, etc., etc., etc." conspiracy. It's basic corporates self-preservation.
>>
Clearly what's going on here is we have a valve-spy among(st) us!
>>
>>11071634
The problem is you're arguing that it's a legal issue. It's not a legal issue, it's a complex business relationship issue with some level of social standards and publicity in there.
Paypal is often in the middle of all this shit and yet people pretend that it's not the fault of the business but the fault but the law.
No, it isn't, the businesses are willingly choose to ban this shit either because it hurts their profits or because of some fat banker on Epstein's island trying to take a moral stance on something that mocks the thing he loves so much. Profit is the most obvious answer but we have heard before about bankers trying to do vigilante justice against sex.
>>
>>11071664
No, it's primarily a legal issue. Porn being on Steam or not period was more of what you're talking about. There were not legal issues stopping them from doing that much sooner, but the culture towards that sort of stuff was much different even a decade or so ago. The fact that they allow loli *at all* showcases they, ultimately, don't have much of an issue allowing it on the platform. It's about covering their own asses.
>>
>>11071599
Sometimes perfectly safe visual novels with nothing pornographic about it gets denied just because a character is wearing a school uniform, or something mundane and perfectly safe like dungeon travelers 2 gets banned, but stuff like Furry Hitler 2 Electric Boogaloo get on the store perfectly fine. Even put on the front page under new and trending. The only way to deal with it is to give steam pushback because it has gotten things a second chance before.
>>
>>11071665
What examples have there been of legal action actually taking place?
Why would someone sue steam for hosting these games?
We cannot truly know who is threatening steam but when you consider every platform that has had issues with "loli content", it's almost always linked to PAYMENT PROCESSORS, and not some customer saying "we're gonna do a class action lawsuit against steam!"

Pixiv/fanbox? Payment processor issues. Itch.io? Payment processor issues. Patreon? Payment processor issues.
Paypal is not the law. They do not decide what is legal and what is not, as much as they want to make you believe it.
>>
>>11071671
No offense anon, but what are VNs primarily known for? And who, in real life, actually wears school uniforms? I'm not saying it was "justified", but can you really not see how it could be the result of someone being overly cautious and rejecting something that should've been accepted rather than someone just hitting the "random" key on the accept/reject screen?

>The only way to deal with it is to give steam pushback because it has gotten things a second chance before.
I *do* agree with this. If a game legitimately should be okay to be on Steam, you 100% should protest the decision. Just because I think the decisions are "understandable" doesn't mean they're *correct* as well.
>>
>>11071655
Then explain Dungeon Travelers being banned from steam despite the fact you could buy that game off a Walmart shelf? Or the fact Evernicle 1 is on steam but Evernicle 2 got banned from it? Or Chaos:Head which actually got unbanned because people bitched about it hard enough?
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>>11071655
>It's basic corporates self-preservation.
They're not doing very good job of it and their standards vary wildly. Valve has been bumbling with this ever since they started allowing porn and they still haven't quite got it.
Maybe in the future, but right now it really is a gamble whether you get your game in steam. I used Kagura Games as an example because it's a relatively big name with many titles to its name and many eyes on its games, but smaller literalwhos have also smuggled lolis into steam, while other titles get denied on inexplicable grounds. Sometimes any VN with school setting gets nuked, sometimes you get the cringiest OELVNs with school setting in. Sometimes a completely innocent game gets blocked because the japanese dev said something culturally inappropriate in broken english--Miscommunication, basically.
>>
>>11071676
By your the Persona games should be banned because they wear uniforms, visual novels are none for all sorts of things, just because you're a /d/egenerate doesn't automatically mean any visual novel is porn.
>>
>>11071680
Reading comprehension mate.
>>
>>11071677
>because people bitched about it hard enough?
because as I think we've all agreed, Steam is arbitrary and decides your fate as a developer based on whether or not an employee has decided they like you enough, or that you're worth enough profit to them. I can agree with the other anon about that, Steam favors already successful developers (and gives lower rates to them, too)
>>
>>11071679
>They're not doing a very good job of it and their standards vary wildly.
Oh, for sure. Everyone seems to think I'm just some Valve shill here, as if I'm saying, "They're doing everything literally perfect" or something. I'm not, in the specific area of porn they are doing a pretty shitty job. If they're gonna allow porn, they need to do it properly. But this idea that Valve (you know, the company that originally *didn't* allow porn, and explicitly *started* allowing it) is somehow... against porn? It's ludicrous.
>>
>11071687
I think it's calling a videogame "literal child porn" that made you seem like somewhat of a fool, anon.
Besides, Valve themselves are fools. They've allowed all sorts of nonsense, from copyright infringing material to malware to non-games that profit from Steam itself. That's why it all seems to depend on who's reviewing the game and how much attention they're giving it, if any.
>>
>>11071699
If a fictionalized depiction of child porn isn't literal child porn, then is hentai not literal porn? You're just being a pedantic fuck.
>>
>>11071702
Child means there's children involved and carries gravitas.
Porn is a term that is legally for anything that is almost exclusively for sexual gratification. If we were being pedantic, we could say Ero Dungeons isn't even porn, but we use the term anyway because it's a very loose term.

These are all their own terms with their own nuances, you shouldn't compare them.
>>
>>11071709
Ah, I see. Porn involving children, even though it isn't real life porn, isn't child porn. But Ero Dungeons, being a game explicitly meant to be a porn game, isn't porn. Gotcha.

I don't think I'm the fool here, anon.
>>
>>11071713
>even though
*since
>>
>>11071713
Nuance.
"Your game is CP" - your game will get you put in jail for years or decades in most countries and you will likely be beaten or even murdered in jail.
"Your game is loli" - your game is highly controversial but its legality varies greatly depending on where you are.
CP is referred to in the context of law and court and crime. Loli is referred to in the context of fiction and anime and smut.
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In other news, the developer for Exile of Aphordisia https://bluefairymediagames.itch.io
a game that most people using tfgamesite will have seen, is making a new game "The Restoration of Aphordisia" which seems to play quite differently.

What do you tf faggots think, is it gonna be trash? The artstyle already looks a bit inconsistent and every character seems to be a static pose but they might improve on it. I wasn't quite happy with how the content was played out in their old game so I wonder if it'll be better this time around.
>>
>>11071713
It's not real. Just like how distributing a recording of someone being sexually abused will result in a prison sentence or the footage being taken down, while writing erotic fanfiction of someone being sexually abused will result in nothing.
>>
>>11071599
>literal child porn
you dumb motherfucker
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>>11071723
The art of EoA is already inconsistent as fuck.
That game could randomly be hot or extreme bonerkill. I'll keep an eye open but I'm sure not hyped.
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>>11071662
Well I'm not a spy!
>>
Games like Corruption of Champions or TiTS that aren't afraid of diving into non-consensuak transformation fetish?
Letting the player bail out is one thing, but I hate when the game, in-universe, doesn't feature forced TFs and everything has to be some boring "safe and consensual" shit
I want to willing force my PC into unwilling content
>>
>>11070191
Link, please.
>>
>>11071723
Played through every bit of available content in it currently, it's alright. Some of the premises for the quests are nice, the stuff is pretty varied. I'm cautiously optimistic for it, though I imagine (from what I've seen so far) that it'll be somewhat like the last game in that there's not a ton of outright porn but moreso erotic scenarios and whatnot. Sexual stuff isn't specifically the forefront, but the world is fairly sexual.

>>11072004
feels bad that so many games (and it's probably partially Patreons' fault) have too much consent these days.
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>>11072004
MonCurse
>>
>>11060763
It has modding suport and its open-source, plus you already can filter out generic furry NPCs (the ones that are random encounters)
Someone even released a de-fur mod for the non-generic characters in the dev's discord but it got deleted for using AI portraits
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>>11072728
>deleted for using AI portraits
hoes mad
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>>11068840
A staple way of mostly solving this problem is that winning in some way unlocks the animations.
I kind of like how Rignetta's Adventure does it. Enemies drop items that allow them to be summoned in a jail/zoo basement.
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What do you listen to in the background when you are playing a game with no sound?
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>>11072004
The Isle of TS Monster Girls
You play as a dude that keeps getting TF'd into various monster girls, good shit but sadly no actual porn, it's all softcore stuff.
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>>11072905
usually vocaloid
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>>11071723
> starting 2nd game before first game even halfway done
classic
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>>11073047
Is the first game not done? It's a not!OregonTrail, played through it twice, seemed done to me.
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>>11072905
Old RPG music or Touhou music
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>>11072905
nothing, that'd be weird
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So any games with symbiote related stuff or Slime girls?
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>>11071675
I get the impression that they also squeeze the services that they're threatening to cut off not to blame them too. Notice that every time Patreon or whatever crack down on lewd stuff they always act all vague about it like "sorry I don't want to but the environment in which we operate legally and financially just doesn't allow for it anymore" etc etc.

You know that the payment processor snuck a little "and don't you even think about defaming is to your customers, or we'll get you acquainted with our very well-paid lawyers" in there.

As more and more transactions are made digitally, we're eventually going to have to deal with the serious issue that these companies can basically extralegally decide who can and cannot engage in commerce. I eagerly await the day they step on the toes of someone who actually wants to fight back.
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>>11071675
>paypal is not the law
Shit, now I kinda want a megacity /d/ game
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There any (preferably RPG or sidescroller) games that focus predominantly on machine enemies/bad ends instead of humans or monsters? Most databases of games I've seen don't really differentiate that from "a vibrator was used in two stills" or "one enemy is a robot"
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>>11073329
Future Fragment has what you're looking for if memory serves me right.
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>>11072911
This one also got a fan translation a few months ago on Fag95
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>>11073358
It had a level of that, but the dev released the game unfinished and fucked the writing up bad :(
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>>11073378
>fucked the writing up bad
The bane of every dev.
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>>11073236
Parasite Infection; some of the alien 'parasites' have no negative impact on host
Phasmohentaia; you can optionally let a slime live in your body (as in under the skin)
CoC; ghost can possess you, there's also probably symbiote content somewhere

Loads of games with slime girl scenes. Although if you want it to be the focus then that's rarer. Off the top of my head there's; RJ195886
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any good trap/male games? not really ugly bastard, but handsome guys. i know about dol already, free cities too, etc. i thought this would be more in the sphere of yaoi but fujoshi aren't too keen on draw girl call boy...i mean from them it exists but solely in the context of doujinshi
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>>11069342
no the game is genuinely getting a large ACTUAL female fanbase, which is totally insane to me. those korean, chinese, and japanese women aren't troons.
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>>11073446
Now that I think of it the game does offer lots of customization to appeal to the opposite sex. Can't really think of a game that can attract Fujos and lesbians. Plus the sprite style is cute and lots of wardrobe choices to play dress up..
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>>11073446
What a cope, as if asian countries didn't had their fair share of troons lately, soecially considering how the actual female japanese tend to be way less averse to what kind of content DoL used to have before it started getting sanitized
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>>11073459
I said it already but it's the romance routes. They see it as an otome game and rape and abuse isn't a stranger to those games.
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>>11071988
THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT SPIES SAY
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>>11067476
If you made the game you're describing, I would play it as a text-only roguelike. I'm more about the wordage and the mechanics than the visuals. If you avoid combat, then you have less to worry about, but at that point, it is ostensibly not a game but some sort of interactive program. It's best to release something first, you can always release more things later.



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