I'm don't really know much about the cybersecurity and hacking scene, so this seems like an enigma to me.A lot of black hat or threat actor websites operate on the clearnetSites like breachforums and raidforums were on the clearnet, and both of them got seized by the government.Why dont they only operate from TOR? It's a good thing that this makes them easier to catch, but why would they operate in the open like that? I don't understand why they would do that. Do they think they wont get caught, do they not care? SOme of them do have onion addresses in addition to clearnet addresses, but i wonder why they have a clearnet at all.Does it just take the FBI a long time to catch them?
>>101572535because the point of operating a website is to have people visit it
>>101572535>Does it just take the FBI a long time to catch them?if you live in russia or china what is the fbi going to do?
>>101572598TOR is free though. Why would they want this on the clearweb?
>>101572816... to have people visit it.a system is only as secure as the weakest link. running a pure onionsite is just discouraging 99.99% of people from ever visiting, while providing no protection against attacks against the rest of the stack.
>>101572535because people are retardedinstead of going there and maybe learning a thing or two they just keep visiting reddit and 4chan
>>101573229Do you have the address to any of them?
>>101572868Maybe im out of touch, but doesnt it protect the owner of the site by running an onion site?If its a clear net site the owner information is public.
>>101573587the owner of the site could have bought a vps with crypto while using tor and only access it with tor, then only the users who are too retarded to use tor are at risk
>>101574005do they actually do that?
the point of those sites is to sell credits to access drops and make money for the ownermaking it harder to access means less money in their pocket
>>101574519If they didn't then the feds would simply ask the vps who owns it
>>101572535>Does it just take the FBI a long time to catch them?wasn't one of these shut down this year?
>>101574585Then why do CP websites only operate on the dark web though? Both are illegal. Do they just get shut down quicker?I mean forums like playpen (which were seized by the fbi).
some domain/web hosts are less invasive to their customers than others, and there are ways to spoof information if you need to give itand how has nobody made r34 of RF-tan?
>>101572535>Host website>allow on clear web>retards join and post obvious BS compared to the people using full hidden track mode>people take note>don't get shut down quiet yet because the retards posting their personal info get caught quick>FBI simply lets it exist to monitor for low hanging fruit moronsEven if you aren't working FOR a glowie your website existing might be useful for the feds to watch and get some of the retards from it.
I don't even understand how a place like this is illegal. Did they actually host illegal data? Because if it's just a platform for hackers to chat and share data somewhere else, I fail to see how it's the owner's responsibility. Who would be at fault if they were meeting in a public park and trading flash drives for cash? The government? A bit like the silk road guy who didn't really do anything himself.
>>101579024well in a republic it's the bureaucrats who decide what is illegal or not. They could decided that wearing pants is illegal tomorrow and all the cops who obey because they are drones.
>>101579066The supreme court just overruled chevron deference, so maybe it'll get a little better? I dunno, I'm a zoomie so the only reality I know is post-2001 hellworld.
>>101579226>so maybe it'll get a little better? I dunnozoomies are hilarious. and no. nothing will get better.
>>101572535Why wouldn't they? They aren't doing anything illegal
>>101577605I too ponder that question.
>>101579024>Who would be at fault if they were meeting in a public park and trading flash drives for cash?whoever organized and publicized the meetup, same as with the website.its illegal because theyre selling stolen data, to be used for cybercrime/fraud/stalking/harassment
>>101579024>I don't even understand how a place like this is illegal. Did they actually host illegal data? Because if it's just a platform for hackers to chat and share data somewhere else, I fail to see how it's the owner's responsibility. Who would be at fault if they were meeting in a public park and trading flash drives for cash? The government? A bit like the silk road guy who didn't really do anything himself.If you provide a space specifically for committing illegal acts, the government will treat you as aiding those acts.
Helping people commit crimes, is also a crime.
>>101579024>The DOJ also charged the alleged administrator of RaidForums — 21-year-old Diogo Santos Coelho, of Portugal — with six criminal counts, including conspiracy, access device fraud and aggravated identity theft.source: https://krebsonsecurity.com/2022/04/raidforums-get-raided-alleged-admin-arrested/
>>101575315yeah and at least 20 more opened.
>>101580836>>101580864That just seems like a stretch. If I put up a sign that says 'haxxors meet up at McDonald's!' and people actually show up and trade stuff, how am I responsible? More seriously, if I set up a gun show, how am I responsible for Bubba selling illegal NFA items out of the trunk in the parking lot? That last one actually happens!Now if he's hosting stuff or handling money, which it sounds like he might be ( >>101580942 ) that's a different story.If you were going to run a site like that I think the best way would to do it 4chan style, i.e. keep the illegal stuff offsite and give the government logs. Just be upfront about it.
>>101581418>That just seems like a stretch. If I put up a sign that says 'haxxors meet up at McDonald's!' and people actually show up and trade stuff, how am I responsible? More seriously, if I set up a gun show, how am I responsible for Bubba selling illegal NFA items out of the trunk in the parking lot? That last one actually happens!No, its like if you made rented a space to make a thieves club and advertised it on the fliers as:>a friendly space where you can discuss and plan robberies, burglary, and other theft.
>>101574519can use localbitcoin or bisq for non KYC crypto and then they just pay for the vps privately
>>101581676I honestly don't see how your theives club would be illegal. Arresting the thieves for conspiracy when caught is different, but just giving them a hang out appears to me to be free association.
>>101581418Mcdonalds is a public area. It's not the same as setting up an actual meeting. What they do is a lot more involved than just handing out fliers that say "hackers meet up at mcdonalds".With the gun example, firearms are legal (with restrictions). If they lie to you, you probably aren't responsible for someone not selling them properly (as long as you took reasonable measures).If you set up a club specifically for doing illegal stuff, thats another thing. If you set up a Child porn club and let people hang around when they show up with child porn, you would be arrested and prosecuted.
>>101581735This is kinda my point though, I don't know what these guys are doing on their forum but making posts about the stuff you're selling is the responsibility of the poster. Being the admin of a hacking forum isn't a crime by itself, and not all hacking related activities are illegal.
>>101581786>This is kinda my point though, I don't know what these guys are doing on their forum but making posts about the stuff you're selling is the responsibility of the poster. Being the admin of a hacking forum isn't a crime by itself, and not all hacking related activities are illegal.What if the admin admits that he's fine with his users trading in illegal content?
>>101581840It'd be different then. If he's actively participating in the crime it's a nono, that is conspiracy. Again, I don't know what those guys were doing, but if you're not a retard then there isn't anything wrong with being on the clearnet.
>>101581786bf/rf facilitated the sale of illegal content via the forum currency. you had to either earn it (by posting illegal content) or buy it directly from the website. even if they werent participating financially, its the website owners responsibility to moderate their forum and prevent crimes from being committed. 4chan does this, as does every active website.
>>101582282not to mention the forum HOSTED all the illegal content. the users didnt trade it peer2peer, they uploaded it to the forum and it got paywalled there.
>>101581733> Being an accessory to a crime means intentionally, knowingly, and voluntarily participating in a crime. You do not need to be present during the crime to be considered an accessory.
>>101582295>>101582282Yeah that's pretty fucking illegal, what a moron.Anyways, 4chan does allow illegal p2p content sharing, that's what /t/ is.
>>101582319fraud and extortion is pursued more aggressively than pirated hentai
>>101582309Hosting a forum is not a crime. As long as you are not actively participating in the activity, it is not a conspiracy. They properly nailed the RF guy with conspiracy based on what that anon said they did, but the fact remains that as along as the service the admin is providing isn't inherently criminal and he isn't an active participant it wouldn't be conspiracy, at least based on my naive understanding of the law.>>101582343It's still illegal though, and 4chan is a big enough place for something like that to get them in trouble. It's up to users to distribute what they what they want thhough, 4chan has no responsibility in the matter.
>>101572535two reasons:1. discoverability. the target audience is retarded script kiddies and scammers and many of them would have trouble installing Tor2. (the main one) hosting a DW website costs WAY more than a clearweb one. these sites get constantly DDoS'd and spammed by everyone (TLAs, rivals, skids, CF). on the clearweb you have CF which has IP reputation to stop bots + massive bandwidth to deflect DDoS, and is to a large extent free. on the DW you can't use IP reputation and DDoS protection costs a lot more.
>>101572535Because people who commit cyber crime and talk about it on forums are begging to go to jail
>>101572535is it an exaggeration to say that raidforum is a place for script kiddies to do hacks that mostly fail and no one takes them seriously
>>101572535The FBI employs 35,000 people, barely any of which are allocated to its cybercrime division, which deals mostly with child pornography rather than 20something year old faggot VS 20something year old incel wars on the internet.>The Kiwifarms were mean to you>The Sharty doxxed you>Furry trannies hacked you>WHAT THE FUCK RIGHT ON IT THE CYBERPOICE ARE HERE TO HELP!!!!!!!!!!
>>101582561>>The Kiwifarms were mean to you>>The Sharty doxxed you>>Furry trannies hacked youthats not what raidforums/breachforums were for lol. they were for buying and selling stolen datasets for committing fraud, identity theft, etc.
>>101583117when someone wants to impersonate you over the phone to your bank, they look you up on search.0t.rocks/search.illicit.pw/snusbase/intellx and find every leak that has personal information about you. know where those websites get their data? from dataset trading forums like raidforums/breachforums for pennies.
>>101583157lol this has been going on for decades and everyone, from zoomerkiddies who supposedly """grew up online""" to normies, still plug their ears and autistically screech when this is brought up. ~5 years ago, it was "ethically questionable" to use it, but now it's so normalized respectable journalists and even actual private investigators who do cheating spouse investigations use leaked data.
>>101582561Wait, did the soiteens REALLY write ransomware? That's nuts.I was about to say I didn't think the sharty would go that far, but it's honestly par for the course.
>>101574519I'd say the good ones do but I have yet to see a single one of these forums/markets not get shut down because the retard in chief used his clearname gmail address to sign up to the hoster or some other toddler tier opsec fail.
>>101584840My theory is that anyone who would be smart enough to have enough OPSEC to not get caught, is also smart enough to find easier and more legal ways of earning a lot of money.My gut feeling is that a lot of these hackers aren't earning very much. It's not quite the same thing, but Torswats was selling his swatting services for 20 dollars a call.
>>101584887>My gut feeling is that a lot of these hackers aren't earning very much.Depends on what field we're talking about. Ransomware is basically entirely corporatized to the point where these ransomware "gangs" are organized and structured enough that they could unironically be listed on the stock exchange and people wouldn't bet an eye at first glance.But yeah people smart enough to do that are probably the ones behind those hitman sites, I mean what the fuck are the scam """victims"""" going to do? Report to the police that a fake internet hitman scammed them? Then again there was that one darknet market that didn't exit scam or get shutdown by feds but just disappeared into the aether.
>>101585050bat an eye Jesus fucking Christ am I retarded
>>101582561>The FBI employs 35,000 people, barely any of which are allocated to its cybercrime division, which deals mostly with child pornography rather than 20something year old faggot VS 20something year old incel wars on the internet.Apparently its around 1000 people in the cybercrime division as of 2022: https://www.fbi.gov/news/testimony/oversight-of-the-fbi-cyber-division-032922The personal fbi agent thing is definitely a meme.I kinda assume most of them are actually dealing with serious hackers or international threats. I have to wonder how much time they spend on fighting child porn. There's a lot of it that gets shared on social media. Not just hidden groups, its people openly advertiing it (and spamming it to harass people). Twitter and facebook had issues with it. You have "troll" groups like UTTP who advertise it on Youtube. Its also an issue for smaller sites, You have nutjobs who spam it on the sharty. My guess is that they focus on the producers of it, rather than retarded skiddies who share it on messaging apps.
>>101579264>>101579226I'm a fed & a lawyer and I can say that everyone in my agency is freaking out over Loper Bright (the case that overruled Chevron). That
>>101579226>>101579264I'm a fed lawyer, and I can say that everyone in my agency is freaking out over Loper Bright (the case the overturned Chevron). Not saying that necessarily means that things will get better, but it's certainly got my fellow bureaucrats rattled, at least until we can figure out what to do going forward.
>>101584887>My theory is that anyone who would be smart enough to have enough OPSEC to not get caught, is also smart enough to find easier and more legal ways of earning a lot of money.in the US, yes, for sure. in russia, given there are no legal repercussions for hacking/stealing from westerners you can make way more in cybercrime than a software dev job
>>101579226its probably bad that they overruled that.
>>101582343it's odd that /t/ is still around though
>I'm don't really know much about the cybersecurity and hacking sceneIt shows
>>101582561>>The Kiwifarms were mean to you>>The Sharty doxxed you>>Furry trannies hacked you>>WHAT THE FUCK RIGHT ON IT THE CYBERPOICE ARE HERE TO HELP!!!!!!!!!!>>101583117Its not their main feature but kiwifarms users have hacked people (like yanderdev) once or twice. oi think that's how the source code for yandere simulator got leaked. The guy who did it "Not Based or Redpilled" is still active on the forums.the sharty hacks people pretty often. Well its mostly skiddy stuff, but still things that would count as hacking.They ususally use leaks as mentioned here:>>101583157>>101583912to try to find your passwords.Though recently the soiteens are exploiting VNC connections that dont have passwords.As shown here when they hacked into a nuclear reactor and messed with its settings: https://archive.li/RQbns
>>101587226do people still use torrents?>>101582343I looked at it and I actually found a few legal things. Some guy set up a old screensaver collection
>>101574519This how 99% of scams are done, including hosting the places for folks to "log in" after phishing them and shit like that. There are VPS hosts in nations that don't give a fuck.People from 3rd world dumps and Chinks also get VPSs and even bare metal servers from US datacenters, they will run all kinds of illegal shit until they "get caught" which in some cases can take months due to gross under-staffing and corpo consolidation of the industry. Most webhosts are shitbags that will collect pennies from anyone.
>>101587226nothing is hosted in the case of a torrent, it just lets peers talk to each othed
