Would we be living in a utopia right now?
>>16535004This is what the USSR thought it was going to be
Who owns all the expensive infrastructure. From factories to harbors ships trains etc? "The workers" is not an answer.
>>16535004This is completely retarded and ignores why Marxism-Leninism was so successful in establishing revolutionary socialist governments worldwide, a vanguard party with rigid discipline and organization is the only way that socialism can be achieved without it being immediately splintered by agitators and foreign interests. This horse shit would fall within months.
>>16535018Probably, that's a good point. Trotksy and his ilk saw that that be ruined.
>>16535004>Having a smog spewing factory in your backyard is a utopiaDo commiefags really
>>16535044People used to have houses with chimneys. It's normal if you're in a neighborhood where people use their chimneys. But I get it, capitalism has left you without a good neighborhood so you wouldn't know any better.
>>16535004>Having a community and a society who believes in a singular goal of building a class-free, currency-free utopian futureImagine what it could have been bros...
>>16535019Yes, the workers. The workers appoint a table of elected representatives that manage the shit. They make yearly assemblies to elect new representatives and voice their concerns.This is how cooperatives work in the modern world you nigger, go take a fucking walk around town and see it for yourself.
>>16535034It was literally Stalin who ruined it
>>16535373Anon, I……… It was ruined from the start
>>16535004I love the idea of a socialist federation with Scandinavian elements like communal housing and cute scandi architecture. If only this were real.
>>16535050>People used to have houses with chimneys. It's normal if you're in a neighborhood where people use their chimneysYes, but then we modernized and invented central heating systems. >But I get it, capitalism has left you without a good neighborhood so you wouldn't know any better.Cope; Commies were just poor.
>Communist Regime>LonghousesAnon I...
>>16535438Lenin would be remembered as a hero of the human race if he just got rid of Stalin before croaking.
>>16535116What happens when workers elect the same representatives over and over due to a combination of lack of enthusiasm for new candidates and old representatives being more enthusiastic to keep their roles?
>>16535050>But I get it, capitalism has left you with central heating so you wouldn't know any betterftfy
>>16535004Thing is. There are responsible people who think about tomorrow and like to work. There are people who don't.The first kind of people like to gather more than they need, to secure themselves for the future. The second kind of people are more altuistic and try to get by any way they can, without caring too much about tomorrow.Only way communism works is if either everyone are forced in to it or the first kind of people greatly outnumber the second and don't cause their system to attract more of the 2nd kind from outside.
>>16535004"The Golden Rule: He who has the gold, makes the rules." -They Live
>>16535004If you had communal wealth but had to be self-reliant, you would end up with some people hoarding more of the communal wealth so that they can be less self-reliant, and rely on others to be more self-reliant, i.e. do more of the work.There's no way for you to put everything on the individual for the impetus to work and then have a communal reward without the Tragedy of the Commons biting you in the ass continually. I'm not going to work harder so that somebody else can have more, and neither is anybody else. My ancestors saw fit to enslave other human beings, domesticate beasts of burden, and develop machine processes just so that they could avoid working harder, what the actual fuck makes you think people are going to work harder for communal wealth?
>>16535050he is not talking about the chimneys you retarded commiehes referring to the smokestacks pictured herewhich are evidence of heavy industry, the kind that always leads of serious and detrimental health effects
>>16535373>killing jews>ruining thingsThe Soviet Union was doomed from the beginning...Stalin probably gave it 30 more years of live
>>16535004Zaire ahh nigga
>>16535044>Histrionic onions drinking vegan freaked out by industryMany such cases!
>>16536667>Yes, but then we modernized and invented central heating systems.My neighborhood has both. Cope.>Cope; Commies were just poor.You've never had a job.
>Would my special snowflake form of discord communism have worked /r/mtf?Spoiler alert: no
>>16535004The problem is humans need a long time to warm up to each other and achieve that level of cooperation and "solidarity", otherwise they will continually undermine each other and become strict individualists in response.Communism itself is inspired by the village commune, literal peasants who never left the same plot of lands and were often related to half the village. Communism passes itself off as something rational yet depends so much on emotions, custom and habit.The irony is medieval feudalism and trad values are the ideal. Bonds of trust and a genuine desire to work for a "common good" need not be familial, and it is probably not possible in the atomized modern world, however it helps. Muslims and other groups achieve it in their own deeply nepotistic clans. A modern twist on it could work, the French foreign legion for example are fiercely loyal to each other despite coming from vastly different origins and even after they leave the army, they can literally phone the FFL and ask for help with something and someone will come. This militaristic aspect leads into fascism.tl;dr no, we would not be living in a utopia, it would fail and it would be the same old shit
>>16535004>equitable access to essential resources is ensured through participatory labor exhanges>work or starveI dunno man, sounds awfully capitalist to me.
>>16535004It would fail for the same reason that all communist countries fail; there is absolutely no work incentive beyond "I don't want to get shot or thrown out of my home today." There is absolutely no reason to work hard or achieve shit in a communist country because it doesn't get you rewarded materially in any way, just gets you a slap on the back and the same watered down gruel that everyone else is eating (after waiting in a bread line for hours).Human beings are not generally motivated by moral or ethical considerations long term. You might be able to convince people to suspend their material desires for short periods but ultimately a working society needs something to motivate it's workers beyond the most basic of necessities for survival.
>>16535004AI slop got pretty damn good
>>16535004Scandinavia is utopianWealthy countries with strong unions. Finland is happiest country in the world.
>>16539650>achieve happiness by first massacring piles of communistsSee? This is what I've been saying
>>16538505Theoretically you can build small enough communities, preferably based on family connections, for people to care about the well-being of each other rather than themselves. But the question is how much will you achieve as a whole with such strong decentralization?
>>16539650Or so they report in their surveys. Then they proceed to kill themselves en masse.Surveys about happines tell you more about how submissive to the status quo a population is than how happy it actually is.
>>16539730Suicides, low birth rates, drug abuse is all linked to the same reason which is that we don’t live natural lives anymore. The more advanced tech gets and the more comfortable we are, the less happy we will be. We were meant to live in tribal families in small agrarian villages hunting squirrels and picking berries with our semi-wild dogs.
High trust socialist country sounds good but it needs to be rich and democratic to work well
>>16535004This but also be Christian as well. A Christian Socialist utopia.
>>16539765>we don’t live natural lives anymoreThat's only part of it.The real rot killing us is the lack of a higher purpose. Whether or not you believe in a higher power, an ideological cause, whatever, humans NEED to believe in something greater than ourselves. It's why the assholes that run the world have created a system that uses popular dissent as a weapon in favor of change the system wants. It's why people in the West are so insane in attaching themselves to causes and "issues" they believe need solving. The West has traded God for social activism/progressive ideology for this very reason.We have nothing to believe in any more and no way to die a meaningful death and it's killing our soul.
