Are there any objective arguments against positivist hedonism?Objective meaning no religious or moralist arguments, and no trying to tell me what is actually favorable to me or not.
>>16804303>Can you give me objevtive arguments against my ethical theory instead of ethical ones?Really?Pleasure is type of reward system, its purpose is to train intelligent systems (in case of pleasure, biological ones) to instill productive and useful behavior.You can find reward systems in AIs as well, but not in form of pleasure.It's very important for such part to develop in a sane and correct way, otherwise self-destructive and dangerous behavior may arise.
>>16804334>Pleasure is type of reward system, its purpose is to train intelligent systems (in case of pleasure, biological ones) to instill productive and useful behavior.So if you feel pleasure, that's your biology telling you you're doing something right?>sane and correct>self-destructive and dangerousCompletely relative concepts, irrelevant.
Easy:Pleasure is not a replacement for purpose and meaning. Purpose is found exclusive under the direct and indirect influence of religion because the only way to give life a purpose is to uphold morals, which, in turn, depends on religionLife without a purpose is a life that's catapulting itself into an abyss of unhealthy coping mechanism
>>16804343>So if you feel pleasure, that's your biology telling you you're doing something right?Yes? Don't you feel pleasure after achieving what you want?>Completely relative conceptsCorrect behavior makes the difference between life and death. Your objection is inconsistent.
>>16804362Baseless statements:>pleasure can't be a purpose>purpose = religion>only morals = purposeRelative concepts:>unhealthy>coping mechanism>>16804366>Your objection is inconsistent.Life isn't necessarily inherently valuable. Death isn't inherently negative. Self-destruction can be rational.
>>16804375It's not relative, you knowAnd no, purpose without morals is called being a wage slave. Do you want that?
>>16804386>It's not relativeCan you prove it instead of just saying it isn't>Do you want that?Can I escape having to work through having morals or purpose or whatever?
>>16804375>Life isn't necessarily inherently valuable. Death isn't inherently negative. Self-destruction can be rational.Life isn't necessarily worthless, death isn't necessarily positive, self-destruction can be irrational.We could go on shitting out empty relative statements all day without achieving nothing except "i am le right and you are le wrong".
>>16804391Is depression and suicide not enough "proof" to you?
>>16804392You could've just not posted your relative arguments when I asked for objective ones.
>>16804398Again, why are you asking for objective arguments to disclose your ethical mental mansturbation?
>>16804303The best argument is that nothing is ever enough.
>>16804397>depressionI would be more depressed if I was a Christian with a family, and couldn't kill myself without consequences whenever I wanted.>suicideEveryone dies someday, suicide isn't inherently bad, especially if you don't expect anything but further suffering.>>16804400I wanted to know if there's an objective reason to not be a positivist hedonist that I haven't thought about. Seems like there isn't.
>>16804408>suicide isn't inherently bad,If something as serious as your own death is not bad to you, then nothing is lmao
>>16804408>Seems like there isn't.>give me objective arguments>someone provides evolutionary reasons, which is also the source of reward systems>"no you are wrong because it's not valid for me!"What a waste of time this board is.
>>16804414Maybe nothing is, then. Everyone dies someday, it doesn't make much of a difference when you do it.>>16804420The "evolutionary reason" was just "self-destruction and danger bad" which isn't an objective argument.
>>16804424>which isn't an objective argumentAccording to what behavior is not objective? My ass?
>>16804433Why is self-destruction bad?
>>16804438Why is self-destruction inherently bad or good? Still from an objective perspective self-destruction means extinction.I hardly see why any reward ststem would develops if the being in question fucking dies.
>>16804448So are you saying that evolution decides objectively what's right or wrong? Why?
>>16804453>>16804453>So are you saying that evolution decides objectively what's right or wrong?Why do you search a "right and wrong" in the objective world if your argument is just nihilism?I could use the same nihilism, turn the table and say "well, pleasure doesn't matter as well, because nothig fucking matters".
>>16804303Nothing wrong with pursuing pleasure, but make sure you aren't denying someone else their own pleasure otherwise they're probably gonna get mad at you and an ugly cycle of very unpleasurable revenge pursuit will begin. Other than that watch your weight don't eat too much or your body will start to have health issues which feel like shit and can kill you early. Fuck all you want but try to avoid STD's because they also suck and reduce overall pleasure felt in life. Basically do pursue it but be wise about what you do so that you can max pleasure gains while minimizing negative consequences.
>>16804463Pleasure is objectively pleasurable though.I'm just wondering if it's possible to prove that there's something better than maximizing here-and-now pleasure.
>>16804469That's good advice if you value life and living itself more than pleasuremaxxing and checking out when it catches up to you.
>>16804473>nothing matters bro>except pleasureInconsistent.
>>16804499What's inconsistent about that? I didn't say I was a nihilist, I said I'm a hedonist. I can't deny that pleasure feels good.
The question may be:>give me an objective reason why hesonism is wrongBut what OP really meant is:>how do i justify myself for sucking cocks day and night?
>>168045080 objective arguments.
>>16804505>What's inconsistent about that? I didn't say I was a nihilist, I said I'm a hedonist. And given the answers above:>i don't care about anything but pleasureWhy do you think pleasure is objective and can be good? Because you feel it in a subjective way?
>>16804521I'll be back in an hour
>>16804303People strawman hedonim as just blindly seeking momentary pleasure when that's an extreme case; everyone is hedonistic because we follow what is pleasurable for us or rather we try and avoid useless suffering, key word useless since humans are perfecy capable of going through pain if they think it will benefit them. Even the most ascetic still seeks the pleasure of enlightenment.
Reminder, everyone who claims that hedonism is le bad wants you to suffer for their own delusions and goes against human nature.
>>16804574Thank you reddit, i'm taking note.
>>16804362retard alert bzzzzzzzzt
