i think the visigoth code proves it
whats in their code?
>>16882140The most savage and incompetent group of people that invaded the Roman Empire were the good guys?
>>16882159aryanism
>>16882415that was the Huns thoughbeit
>>16882140Yes
>>16882415They ended slavery
>>16882432Why would you just lie on the internet?
>>16882140Late Church Fathers got patronage from the Visigoths while all around them was burning. They did what Vandals, Ostrogoths, Anglosaxons and Lombards did not.
>>16882435I might have exaggerate but it is documented that slaves under roman empire literally joined their forces. The process of slavery transforming into serfdom began with them and we all know serfs enjoy a lot of rights and privileges that a slave didn’t possess.
>>16882459>Late Church Fathers got patronage from the Visigoths while all around them was burningThe Visigothic Kingdom was the most unstable Kingdom of the period, if anything they were the ones burning. >OstrogothsThe Senate under Theodoric created more than a century of Visigothic patronage did. >>16882469>I might have exaggerate but it is documented that slaves under roman empire literally joined their forces.Slave revolts joined multiple peoples that isn't ending slavery>The process of slavery transforming into serfdom began with them and we all know serfs enjoy a lot of rights and privileges that a slave didn’t possess.Slaves did not become serfs. It was people who were already tenants and other small landholders which became serfs. Slaves almost always remained slaves.
>>16882534Visigothic Kingdom survived into 8th century while Ostrogoths did not. Visigoths actually did kick Byzantines from their lands.St. Isidore's Sentences and Etymologies were the most citated and copied works from Middle-Ages. Not Boethius, neither St. Augustine. St. Ildephonsus was the only Germanic who made its way into a Father of the Church.While Ostrogoths brutally murdered Boethius for suspecting he was with Byzantines; Visigoths pardoned St. Leander aftef he sided with Byzantines.Visigothic architecture was copied by Muslims (as they did later on with Byzantine and Persian) and became standard arts in Western Mediterranean while Ostrogoths never developed an art of themselves.
>>16882615>Visigothic Kingdom survived into 8th century while Ostrogoths did not.Lasting longer doesn't somehow make you better especially when said Kingdom was the worst Kingdom of the period. >St. Isidore's Sentences and Etymologies were the most citated and copied works from Middle-Ages. Not Boethius, neither St. Augustine.Boethius and St Augustine were however among those as well. You could include even earlier Roman authors like Valerius Maximus and Cicero who actually were the most copied. >St. Ildephonsus was the only Germanic who made its way into a Father of the Church.Lie. He is not a Father of the Church. He was a Saint. >While Ostrogoths brutally murdered Boethius for suspecting he was with Byzantines; Visigoths pardoned St. Leander aftef he sided with ByzantinesOne act of clemancy does not change the naked brutality of Visigothic political culture. In fact it's completely absurd to try and paint the Visigoths as forgiving at all when their entire history is a revolving door of civil war and political violence. >Visigothic architecture was copied by Muslims (as they did later on with Byzantine and Persian) and became standard arts in Western Mediterranean while Ostrogoths never developed an art of themselves.Now you've changed from literary acomplishments to architecture, obviously there isn't going to be some special Ostrogothic architecture considering the Kingdom only lasted in peace a few years after Theodoric
>>16882633>Lasting longer doesn't somehow make you better especially when said Kingdom was the worst Kingdom of the period.That's a great cope that you have. Lasting longer means you are better, that's factual, when peopme think about Goths and Germanic tribes, they think about Alaric, Reccared and Roderick, not about some losers lead by Attila first and cucked by Byzantines later.>Boethius and St Augustine were however among those as well. You could include even earlier Roman authors like Valerius Maximus and Cicero who actually were the most copied.None of them were as famous as St. Isidore, not counting several of them returned to academic ambit during Renaissance. Etymologiae had a copies in every monastery, church-school or university across Medieval Europe, and Sentenciae as a keyrole theology work followed it.>Lie. He is not a Father of the Church. He was a Saint.He was a saint, a father of the Church and a doctor of the Church.>One act of clemancy does not change the naked brutality of Visigothic political culture. In fact it's completely absurd to try and paint the Visigoths as forgiving at all when their entire history is a revolving door of civil war and political violence.They were ahead of their time, only elective monarchy in a time of despotism. A system unthinkable for Dark Ages when kings got their power from violence and God.>Now you've changed from literary acomplishments to architecture, obviously there isn't going to be some special Ostrogothic architecture considering the Kingdom only lasted in peace a few years after TheodoricArchitecture is an achivement in itself, Ostrogoths never had an architecture of themselves, they just tried to imitate Byzantine architecture. Visigothic Kingdom had a different architecture (and arts) so unique that became the standard of Western Mediterranean to the point Muslims copied it and Castilians, Aragonese, Basques and even Aquitanians and Occitans kept it until Gregorian Reformation.
>>16882415>most savage and incompetent group of people that invaded the Roman EmpireThose would be the Alans.
>>16882140they were
>>16882653>That's a great cope that you have. Lasting longer means you are better, that's factualNo it doesn't. That's nonsensical. A 100 year old man is not better than Napoleon because he lasted longer and a state is not better than another for lasting longer.>Reccared and Roderick,Nobody thinks of either of these>not about some losers lead by Attila first and cucked by Byzantines later.Theodoric was the most famous leader of the immediate post Roman Europe becoming a legendary figure in myth for the Middle Ages. >None of them were as famous as St. IsidoreWrong. Why are you so hellbent on saying Isidore is somehow more famous when both Boethius and Augustine were fundemental to Medieval intellectual culture. Isidore is not a be all and and all to all literature for 1000 years.>He was a saint, a father of the Church and a doctor of the Church.Where are you getting this father and doctor of the Church from? I can't find a single source stating that>They were ahead of their time, only elective monarchy in a time of despotismAnglo-Saxons, Alemanni, Saxons. Even the Franks were technically elective. So, that's just objectively wrong there. >A system unthinkable for Dark Ages when kings got their power from violence and God.More Visigothic Kings came into power through violence than any other region of post Roman Europe.
>>16882707>>16882633Ask me how I know you’re a nafri.
>>16882707>No it doesn'tYes it does. Napoleon is known as a general, his empire is somehow unknown and nobody gives a shit about it.>Nobody thinks of either of theseYes, they are, only Germanic kings ever portrayed in Mosaics were Visigoths amd Franks.>Theodoric was the most famous leader of the immediate post Roman Europe becoming a legendary figure in myth for the Middle Ages.Not outside of Italy. A whole 8 centuries war started for Roderick the Visigoth and poems about him were written in Latin, French and Arab. The most known German monarch still was Clovis and Charlemagne.>Wrong. Why are you so hellbent on saying Isidore is somehow more famous when both Boethius and Augustine were fundemental to Medieval intellectual culture. Isidore is not a be all and and all to all literature for 1000 years.Because they were, just the fact Isidore works were the most citated shows that both St. Augustine and Boethius were not as famous as St. Isidore until modernity.>Where are you getting this father and doctor of the Church from? I can't find a single source stating thathttps://www.gaudiumpress.ca/meet-saint-ildephonsus-bishop-and-doctor-of-the-church/https://catholicexchange.com/st-ildephonsus/>anglo-Saxons, Alemanni, Saxons. Even the Franks were technically elective. So, that's just objectively wrong thereThey were not kings but tribes. Franks were not elective, they got long lasting royal families as the descendents of Clovis and Charolingians who replaced them.>>16882729They have a large inferiority complex that their whole history (supposing that oxymoron of nafris having even an history and a culture of themselves is real) is being being the crab louse of Iberians and Arabs. They have no writers, thinkers, artists, architects or a distinct cultural trope. They went as radical as kidnapping Iberians to bleach their afrosemite from Sahel somalian like roots. Their mosques architecture is Visigothic, their houses arabic, their elites andalusians.
>>16882698Alans persisted into the middle ages, Visigoths took Hispania and took L after L only being saved by the Ostrogoths.
The Visigoths ran a nigger tier state in the Iberian peninsula it was so bad that the locals actually willingly welcome the moorish invaders.Thankfully they definitely left history after that
>>16882783Visigoths stopped Byzantines when tried to take their kingdom and kick them out, they also btfo Vandals, Suevi and sacked Rome. Ostrogoths only large victory was against Franks, they never won a war, they were also vassals of Attila unlike the Visigoths who were free from Romans and Huns.
>>16882791Jews betrayed the Visigoths. And now Jews are taking over Muslim world. Kinda ironic, the goatfuckers and backstabbers fighting each others.After Byzantines, Visigothic Kingdom was more advanced than anything at the time.
>>16882769>Napoleon is known as a general, his empire is somehow unknown and nobody gives a shit about it.Are you trolling?>Yes, they are, only Germanic kings ever portrayed in Mosaics were Visigoths amd Franks.So Visigothic Kings are put in a style only popular in a region they once ruled? This is like saying Charlemagne is irrelevant because he isn't depicted in Anglo-Saxon miniature. >Not outside of Italy.He was largely known in Germany, actually.>Because they wereTHEY JUST WERE, OK? Isn't evidence.>that both St. Augustine and Boethius were not as famous as St. Isidore until modernity.Both of which stopped being popular by the Early Modern Period, but somehow became more popular when they fell out of use.>They were not kings but tribesEither you are stupid, or you are trolling, all of these people did in fact have Kings and they did elect them through councils. Anglo-Saxon elective monarchy only became defunct in practice by the time of Edmund in Wessex. It was widely practiced across England. The Alemanni elected their own King and later Duke until they were dismantled by the Franks.>Franks were not electiveWhich is why I said technically. It was nomative, after the death of a King the leading men would come to 'elect' the next one, which was more of acclaiming the chosen heir(s)
>>16882796>Ostrogoths only large victory was against Franks, they never won a warOstrogoths and OdoacerOstrogoths and the VandalsOstrogoths and the FranksOstrogoths and the VisigothsNever won a war btw.>>16882802>Jews betrayed the Visigoths.Any proof of your claim
>>16882816>Are you trolling?Try to open a book before trying to talk about history>So Visigothic Kings are put in a style only popular in a region they once ruled? This is like saying Charlemagne is irrelevant because he isn't depicted in Anglo-Saxon miniatureThe difference is that comparing mosaics with miniatures is like comparing a bigmag burger with haute cousine. Only wealthy kingdoms as the Visigoths got the money for that.>He was largely known in Germany, actually.Germany is Alaska compared to the Mediterranean sea.>Both of which stopped being popular by the Early Modern Period, but somehow became more popular when they fell out of use.Only among protestant nation, that in any case have no theology aside of Luther and Calvin. But since we are discussing about Catholic authors, stay with Catholic ambit instead of jumping to irrelevant places.>Either you are stupid, or you are trolling, all of these people did in fact have Kings and they did elect them through councils. Anglo-Saxon elective monarchy only became defunct in practice by the time of Edmund in Wessex. It was widely practiced across England. The Alemanni elected their own King and later Duke until they were dismantled by the Franks.All of these were tribes, you like it or not they barely controlled territories with civilized infrastructures, civilized lifestile, etc. Not different from mongol and hunnic warlords, they were just comparable with Visigoths from III and IV centuries.>Which is why I said technically. It was nomative, after the death of a King the leading men would come to 'elect' the next one, which was more of acclaiming the chosen heir(s)You are full of shit, Charolingians got their legitimation from the pope, not from the vote of nobility as the Visigothic kings. And Clovis from a mythological ancestor Merovech who got his power "from the gods".
>>16882824>Ostrogoths and OdoacerThey got support from Byzantines>Ostrogoths and the VandalsNever were at war plus Vandals sacked Rome>Ostrogoths and the FranksCold war more than a war>Ostrogoths and the VisigothsNever were at war
>>16882844>Try to open a book before trying to talk about history(you)>The difference is that comparing mosaics with miniatures is like comparing a bigmag burger with haute cousine.That doesn't have anything to do with popularity.>Germany is Alaska compared to the Mediterranean sea.One of the most well populated and wealthy regions of the Middle Ages is somehow like Alaska?>But since we are discussing about Catholic authorsWe are discussing the popularity of authors, not Catholic authors in particular. Don't make up arbitrary goalposts that have nothing to do with the argument. >All of these were tribes, you like it or not they barely controlled territories with civilized infrastructures, civilized lifestile, etc. Not different from mongol and hunnic warlordsMore trolling. How is having cities, roads, law courts, administrations and organised militaries not settled or civilized? >You are full of shit, Charolingians got their legitimation from the popeThis was Peppin's reasoning for deposing Childeric. Not that of later Carolingians and wasn't at all of the Merovingians.
>>16882872>(you)Your mother >That doesn't have anything to do with popularity.Holy cope, that's as saying that a king being portrayed by Titian or Velazquez is the same than a kang portrayed in an icon>One of the most well populated and wealthy regions of the Middle Ages is somehow like Alaska?It was a shithole until 1300s/1400s, no wonder why their kings focused on Italy and the Med for centuries>We are discussing the popularity of authorsAlready proved that St. Isidore was the great man of Middle-Ages Catholicism. No needing of Renaissance to get credit.>How is having cities, roads, law courts, administrations and organised militaries not settled or civilized?The famous cities of late antiquity early medieval Germany and England, wow>This was Peppin's reasoning for deposing Childeric. Not that of later Carolingians and wasn't at all of the Merovingians.Avoiding the theme of the point like a champion
>>16882952>Holy cope, that's as saying that a king being portrayed by Titian or Velazquez is the same than a kang portrayed in an iconSo, being locally in popular in one region means they are popular everywhere?>It was a shithole until 1300s/1400sDespite the fact it was the wealthiest region outside of Northern Italy it was apparently a shithole. >Already proved that St. Isidore was the great man of Middle-Ages CatholicismNo you didn't. You just claimed that he was without providing and proof.>The famous cities of late antiquity early medieval Germany and EnglandMoving the goalposts again? They had cities, why do they have to be famous? >Avoiding the theme of the point like a championYou claimed the Carolingians got their legitimacy from the Pope. I said that it only applied for Pippin's claim to Kingship and not later Kings and earlier Kings.
>>16882140if you think Rome is the bad guy then the visigoths aren't the good guys because they wanted to be part of the roman system, they even spoke latin. The problem is they basically broke the roman system on "accident".
>>16882415>The most savage and incompetent group of people that invaded the Roman Empireyou mean the romans themselves?
