>>17193817
His entire apologetics is based on the Masoretic text, a blatant corruption of the Old Testament, which we can find preserved fully in the LXX.

So any of his criticisms are wrong from the start. If he truly wanted to engage with Christianity, he'd work with the LXX.

File: jew.png (469 KB, 850x621)

469 KB PNG

>>17193817
>jew quotes/translates text wrong to draw incorrect conclusions deliberately
many such cases

>>17193977
>>17193950


Every Christian scholar compares modern hebrew editions of Isaiah with the Dead Sea Scrolls and it's attested that the integrity of the text is pristine.

You may criticize the jews as much as you want, but one thing is sure, they preserved their texts.

And the original LXX was a translation of the five books Torah only.
We don't know who or when the prophets were "translated", with all the additions that one can find in the LXX.
Remember that both Origen and Jerome preferred the hebrew text, although Jerome did use versions of the septuagint, he marked additions to the Hebrew texts with an "obelus" †

If Qumran Isaiah is pre-Christian and is perfectly consistent to current Hebrew Bible, it is not wise to say Jews removed passages that "gives credit" to Christianity.

>>17193950
You don't have the Septuagint, retard. You have some unknown Greek translation of the Old Testament from Codex Sinaiticus from 325 CE.

The real Septuagint was only the 5 books of Moses, yet the one you claim has all the books of the Old Testament, so it can't be the real one. The real one from 300 BCE has been lost to time. Show me a full manuscript of it and I will convert to Christianity right now. You don't have shit.

>>17194016
>>17194039
I'm gonna use a classic Jew move here: We don't care what you think, we Christians stick with the LXX, if you want to engage with us, engage with the LXX.

End of story.

>>17194046
You don't have the LXX. Get fucked Christcuck.

>>17194039
>The real Septuagint was only the 5 books of Moses
Source?
>yet the one you claim has all the books of the Old Testament, so it can't be the real one.
Fucking kek. So because it has more content it can't possibly have the Torah within it?

Fucking Jews, man.

>>17194046
>we

I was a Christian and I've been to many denominations.
So you have Catholics that says their bible is best (and yet never read it at all. I was there. I know) and then you have Protestants that prefer Masoretic.
My last adventure was in the Orthodox church that, although most Orthodox out there will say "trust nothing beyond the LXX", I've found out that many of them reconsidered their position after the Qumran findings. They still consider all the additions as inspired, but they know these additions were probably inventions of whoever translated.

And of course, we have the classic "Almah" controversy. The word "Betulah" is used throughout the ENTIRE hebrew text to describe virgin, only the "septuagint" has almah as virgin. And to "prove" this, the Orthodox came up with this very creative story that an Angel revealed this to a man named Simeon who was one of the sages translating for Ptolemy that, if he wrote "virgin" instead of "young woman", he would be rewarded by seeing the Messiah. 300 years later, he was still alive and appears in Luke 2:25-35. Creative indeed!

his entire job is to work for the state of Israel in counter missionary activites

sage

>>17194088
ESL

>>17193817
Read his books. He does appeal to scholars, and often uses the New Testament to show how it's not true.

>>17194080
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Septuagint

>Septuagint, the earliest extant Greek translation of the Old Testament from the original Hebrew. The Septuagint was presumably made for the Jewish community in Egypt when Greek was the common language throughout the region. Analysis of the language has established that the Torah, or Pentateuch (the first five books of the Old Testament), was translated near the middle of the 3rd century BCE and that the rest of the Old Testament was translated in the 2nd century BCE.

(Nobody knows who translated the second part, and there are no manuscripts before 325 CE)

>In the 3rd century CE Origen attempted to clear up copyists’ errors that had crept into the text of the Septuagint, which by then varied widely from copy to copy

Looks like one of you ancient Christcucks tampered with the already shoddy translation to get it to conform to your Jesus religion. No way it can be trusted.

>>17194046
I agree with this.
/thread

Yahweh just suddenly switched to using a Greek translation for no reason.

>>17194107
>Analysis of the language has established that the Torah, or Pentateuch (the first five books of the Old Testament), was translated near the middle of the 3rd century BCE and that the rest of the Old Testament was translated in the 2nd century BCE.
Great, so? If anything this supports the LXX
>(Nobody knows who translated the second part, and there are no manuscripts before 325 CE)
Who cares? Why is that important?
>>In the 3rd century CE Origen attempted to clear up copyists’ errors that had crept into the text of the Septuagint, which by then varied widely from copy to copy
Good for him.
>Looks like one of you ancient Christcucks tampered with the already shoddy translation
How do you know that the errors were written by Christians?
> already shoddy translation
Citation needed. The Britannica article says language analysys supports the LXX
> translation to get it to conform to your Jesus religion.
Before Jesus was even born?
And in any case, how do you know this when you've admitted that we don't have the manuscripts? How do you know that the LXX isn't a perfect translation of the Old Testament?

>>17194080
>Source?
Josephus, Antiquities, Book12

[45]
>Being also desirous to confer a favour both on these Jews and on all those throughout the habitable world, I [PTOLEMY] have decided to have your *LAW* translated and, when it has been rendered from the Hebrew into a Greek text, to have it deposited in my library.
[46]
>You will, therefore, do well to select from each tribe six good men of advanced age who by reason of their age are well versed in the *LAWS* and will be able to make an accurate translation *OF IT*. For I believe that from this achievement the greatest glory will accrue to us.
[...][55]
>We therefore promptly offered sacrifices on behalf of you and your sister and children and friends, and the people offered up prayers that your plans may be realised and that your kingdom may be preserved in peace and that the **translation of the LAW** may be of benefit to you and reach the end which you desire

The word LAW is TORAH, that's the meaning of the word Torah (instruction and law). Nowhere says anything else was translated. If it was supposed to translate the Prophets, it would say so.

You can read the entire book 12 of Antiquities if you want.

>>17193817
>jesus didnt fulfill any of the prophecies, and his supposed second coming, right before Paul's generation passed away, never happened
there, christianity objectively destroyed, no need for long ass research

>>17194168
Great, so what? How dooes this invalidate the LXX? We have the Torah and the Prophets.
>If it was supposed to translate the Prophets, it would say so.
According to whom? We're not beholden to Josephus.

>>17194185
>>jesus didnt fulfill any of the prophecies
He did fulfilled some, the remaining will be fulfilled in His second coming.
>and his supposed second coming, right before Paul's generation passed away, never happened
He never said this, He referred to the future final generation, not to His own.

There, Judaism destroyed.

>>17194149
evil jews changed the original text before christianity for reasons that one cannot understand, and YHVH could not prevent it from happening
therefore translation done mostly after christ is the most reliable

kek
they really believe that.

>>17194163
>>17194187
>proofs?
>*shows the proof*
>s-so what? n-not important okay

>>17194163
Show me the original Septuagint manuscript so we can make sure Christians didn't tamper with it. Oh that's right, you don't have it.

Here, let me whip out the Dead Sea Scrolls from 300 BCE and show you that it confirms the Masoretic Text. Isaiah 7:14 "young woman", not "virgin". Looks like you lose, Christcuck.

You thought you were smart, but you actually didn't know jack shit and had to be spoon-fed. How embarrassing.

>>17194195
You showed me proof that the LXX is supposed to contain the Torah, yeah, no shit. It does.

How is this a gotcha?

>>17194197
>Show me the original Septuagint manuscript so we can make sure Christians didn't tamper with it.
Show me the original Old Testament manuscript so we can make sure Jews didn't tamper with it in the Masoretic Text.

See? Two can play that game. We're not granting you any authoritative position over us. You are the deviation, we are not.
>Isaiah 7:14 "young woman", not "virgin".
Mary was a young woman, retard.
Plus the term has the implication of virginity.

>>17194202
It's called the LXX because 70 rabbis translated the Torah into Greek. Those same rabbis didn't translate the rest. Nobody knows who did, it isn't documented. You trust some unknown anonymous translation, and you don't even have the original, but an edit by Origen.

>>17194191
>He did fulfilled some
the torah is clear that the mesiah would have fixed the world day one, meanwhile yahweh jr fucked around quite a lot
>He never said this
sure, Paul preached wholeheartly that Jesus would come soon for him and his followers, and 2000 years later we have folks saying that was not what he meant

>>17194222
>Those same rabbis didn't translate the rest. Nobody knows who did, it isn't documented.
Why is that important? You only have a point if you can prove to me that the LXX is fucked up and has differences, which you can't.

But we CAN in fact see differences and deviations in the Masoretic Text, so there's absolutely nothing preventing me from affirming the LXX as the correct one and the MT as the deviation full of errors.

Get fucked, Jew.

>>17194214
Unbelievably retarded. Christians on this board really are low IQ third worlders. The Hebrew word is "almah" for young woman and "betulah" for virgin. A young woman is not always a virgin, such as a young wife. This is why Hebrew has the two distinct words. You're too stupid to continue with, sorry.

>>17194233
>the torah is clear that the mesiah would have fixed the world day one
Lol no it isn't. Rabbis have been debating the specificities of Messianic prophesies for millennia.
>sure, Paul preached wholeheartly that Jesus would come soon for him and his followers
Which is what Jesus said, since He didn't know when the end would come, so He told them to stay alert since it COULD have been in their time, but it wasn't. All Christian generations are to remain ready and alert for the end, since nobody but the Father knows the day and the hour.

>>17194243
>The Hebrew word is "almah" for young woman and "betulah" for virgin.
Like I said, Mary was a young woman.
>A young woman is not always a virgin
She was both. You only have a point if you can prove to me that Mary was an old woman.

>>17194234
Keep worshiping Yeshua the magical Jew in the sky I guess. I'm sure he will return to save you any day now and not leave you hanging like he did all the Christians before you over 2,000 years. Hahaha, you lose in the end, get fucked Christcuck.

>>17194222
We already proved the point. He will keep coping.

No use to keep discussing with this guy. Let him believe his fairy tales about the LXX.

This only proves how fragile Christianity really is.

>>17194233
>the torah is clear that the mesiah would have fixed the world day one, meanwhile yahweh jr fucked around quite a lot
Yup. Jesus walked on water, worked some miracles and said BRB. We have only four sources, supposed eyewitnesses that passed down this fact. He was anonymous.
Five thousand people saw him resurrected and taking flight to the skies, but only three people wrote it down. The Romans witnessed this feat and wrote nothing "eh, a guy resurrected and flied to heaven? No biggie, just another thursday. Not worth recording." Rabbis witnessed and were like "oh, that man took flight to the sky? certainly I will not try to disprove it or write a polemic against it!"
Jesus was so historical that Christians had to forge Josephus' mentioning him.

My point is, the Messiah should be the most popular being in the world when he comes. Nation will see him and say "yup, it seems jews were right all along, weren't they?"
But jesus was a nobody, and anonymous person, to the point that his historicity can be reasonably put to question.
It's normal to doubt Christ, and that's why his church (the most corrupt institution ever seen by mankind) began saying you will be in eternal bbq if you doubt him.

>>17194254
>Keep worshiping Yeshua the magical Jew in the sky I guess.
If you're a Jew, what is it to you? Why does it bother you? Go back to you little synagogue and stay with your corrupted text.
>I'm sure he will return to save you any day now and not leave you hanging like he did all the Christians before you over 2,000 years.
Why don't you ask HaShem why didn't he protect you during the Holocaust?

>>17194250
The Gospel of Matthew says the prophecy is that a "virgin" will give birth. But that's not the prophecy. The prophecy is that a "young woman" will give birth to a child as a sign to King Ahaz in his time, 700 years before Jesus, so he will know when the enemy nations surrounding him will fall. Has nothing to do with the messiah or Jesus, New Testament is a total fraud. But you never actually read any of it, so you wouldn't know.

>>17194267
ah yes, ad judentum!
that's the stage where the christian is visibly confused and needs make a strawman out of you.

>>17194248
>lol no it isnt
the true messiah would have never gone full hippie and become friends with the scum of society
>All Christian generations are to remain ready and alert for the end, since nobody but the Father knows the day and the hour.
he wasn't a messiah, a demon that deceived jews from their path, telling them to be meek and submissive in a world that hated them. giving his followers false information about his false second coming? no sweetest nectar for a demon than the tragic hope of a never to be fulfilled promise

>>17194267
I'm not a Jew. I'm an atheist, I'm just here to shit on you and put you in your place. It's clear you don't know anything and I fucking hate Christians.

>>17194269
>The Gospel of Matthew says the prophecy is that a "virgin" will give birth.
Again, almah has the implication of virginity.
>>17194275
You started it, Jew. If you don't want insults thrown at you maybe you shouldn't throw them first.

>>17194191
>Mashiach is said to be a person who will be from the line of David, will usher in a period of universal knowledge, acceptance and worship of the G-d of Israel, where all nations will be at peace and war no longer happens, and the resurrection of the dead happens. This was meant to happen. The Third Temple would also be built. He was meant to do this in a single lifetime.

Jesus did none of these things, and many of the teachings of Christianity directly violate Jewish theology.

The Hebrew Bible literally tells us that G-d is not a man, and is an entity without equals or partners. The worship of a man (as Christians do) is idolatry. Practising Jews can't enter Christian Churches because they are places of idolatry..

The Bible tells us that the Mosaic law is binding for all time. Paul tells Christians they don't have to follow it.

Jews are not allowed to consume blood, but Christians believe in the literal consumtion of Jesus' blood in the eucharist. Human sacrifice is a big no in the Hebrew scriptures, but Christians make it central point of their faith.

On a final note, The Christian religion was almost entirely rejected by the Jews at the time, and only spread via conversion of pagan gentiles, as polytheistic concepts of a triune deity, virgin births and deity's being raised from the dead were familiar concepts for them to understand.

>>17194283
>Again, almah has the implication of virginity.

No, it doesn't. That's why the word "betulah" exists.

>>17194262
>Yup
he was supposed to save Israel, not to do le funny magic tricks

>Xtians mistranslate 'young woman' into 'virgin', and then make it into a major point of theology.

>>17194280
>the true messiah would have never gone full hippie and become friends with the scum of society
See? This is the kind of mentality for which God has chosen to humiliate you for 2,000 years and has let Christianity and Islam rule over you.
>giving his followers false information about his false second coming?
It's not false information. He WILL return as a conquering Lion, the Temple WILL be restored, the Kingdom WILL come and the New Jerusalem will be its capital. I don't get why so many Jews are hostile towards Christianity when we both believe the same prophesies.

>>17194267
>Why don't you ask HaShem why didn't he protect you during the Holocaust?

The Holocaust fulfills Isaiah 52-53. Israel, Jacob, is the suffering servant, not Jesus, just as Yahweh said.

>>17193817
he sounds based, christians are whiny bitches

>>17194290
Are young women usually virgins? Answer yes or no.

>>17194315
No, there are many young married women who are not virgins.

>>17194310
>Yet it was our sickness that he was bearing, Our suffering that he endured. We accounted him plagued, Smitten and afflicted by God; But he was wounded because of our sins, Crushed because of our iniquities. He bore the chastisement that made us whole, And by his bruises we were healed.
How exactly has the suffering of Israel healed the world?

>>17194305
>This is the kind of mentality for which God has chosen to humiliate you for 2,000 years and has let Christianity and Islam rule over you.
God has given his chosen the world after 2000 years of testing and enduring, check who owns who before talking
>It's not false information
its not

>>17194321
I said, usually, Jew-

>>17194333
>Jewish supremacist.
Lol

Also most Jews don't even believe anymore, in fact they hate Judaism.

>>17194333
>its not
meant to say that it is, but i fucked up. thanks god for humbling me

>>17194325
By destroying the false Pagan religion of Christianity, they heal the world.

>>17194343
>moving the goalposts
seethe

>>17194348
How exactly has Israel getting butt fucked for millennia "destroyed" Christianity?

>>17194360
Israel is kicking ass right now?

>Zechariah 8:23
>23 Thus says the Lord of hosts: In those days ten men from nations of every language shall take hold of a Jew, grasping his garment and saying, ‘Let us go with you, for we have heard that God is with you.’ ”

Uh oh, Christcuck. That's a prophecy about you pleading with Jews to show you mercy after following the false messiah Jesus.

>>17194367
Of retarded Muslims, sure. With the backing and funding of Christians. You realize that we own you, right? If we were to cut all funding and weapons and leave you to fend for yourselves, Muslims would destroy you in a couple of months.

>>17194382
>If we were to cut all funding and weapons

You wont. LOL. Jews own you.

>>17194107
Oh so analysis shows that the texts were translated in two parts but the entire document was translated in it’s entirety multiple centuries before Anno Domini? Fucking jew just playing semantics around the precise meaning of the word “original” while using the wrong context for what is actually at issue. What actually matters is whether it is pre-Christian and thus made before any motive to lie or edit. Since it it, it looks like the whole LXX is legit.

This thread makes me wonder much about the psychological health of christians here in 4chan.

I honestly believe that most people don't believe in Christianity anymore. There is a small number of stupid people that still hold to it, but most people gave up of it. Especially when ideas such as hell are put to question, when you remove the psychological terror of belief, it falls like a house of cards.

They have no arguments to defend their positions. They often resort to insults and mockery.

I honestly believe that it has something to do with existential anxiety. They are afraid of the world (with a reason), but rather than facing it with courage, they resort to this fairy-tale, probably because when they were young, the idea of a beautiful long-haired blonde man loves them, will fix the world and if they don't believe, they go to hell.
It's not sincere belief, that's why its so defensive. It's a cope, and they are so afraid of losing this defensive mechanism that they bind themselves to it against all reason.

>>17194374
It's a prophesy about gentiles going to the Jews, retard Jew. And by that time all Jews would've become Christians, as is prophesied in Revelation

>>17194405
This is the dumbest cope I've ever heard.

>>17194290
As a layman, the word “almah” in this context reminds me most of the word “maiden” in English.

File: 1646419893184.jpg (83 KB, 696x654)

83 KB JPG

>>17194403
>t.

>>17194382
Israel already defeated retarded muslims without any help in a few days, and america is Israel's golem, usa being christian is irrelevant here
>If we were to cut all funding and weapons and leave you to fend for yourselves
do that, and millions of faithful american christians will find their asses freezing off in the pavement because rich jewish american families owns more than half of america

>>17194403
Yeah all the smart people left Christianity and it's just emotional retards needing mental therapy now.

>>17194414
why so defensive?

>>17194417
>do that, and millions of faithful american christians will find their asses freezing off in the pavement because rich jewish american families owns more than half of america

The only thing I like about judaism is the master morality of it. VAE VICTIS!

My favorite Tovia moment was when he made a point of the time passing between Jesus' death and the gospels being written, was sufficient time for legends to develop
So we should reduce our confidence in the gospels being historical

(the punchline being that far more time passed between events, and them being recorded in text he believes to be historical)

>>17194403
They don't have any arguments. They have to resort to quoting a Greek translation of the Old Testament and say the Hebrew has been corrupted in order to make anything work. It's Flat Earther tier conspiracy thinking. Even with that Greek translation, Jesus still doesn't fulfill the prophecies and they've been waiting 2,000 years for him to finish the job, even though he said he was going to return in the first century and didn't. They will come up with every cope to explain why. It's pathetic. I guess it's just low IQ.

>>17194414
Yeah, I actually believe there is NOT room for rational disagreement on this topic

>>17194444
Checked.

>>17194443
The lecture that gave most insight was realizing that we has writing to the church in Corinth, saying that one must not doubt that Jesus rose from the dead.
But the gospels said that his rising from the dead and taking flight to the skies was witnessed by five thousand. If this story had so many eyewitnesses, why would someone doubt it?

>>17194443
Yes, it's fake too. He took down both Christianity and Judaism in one swing.

>>17194016
>Remember that both Origen and Jerome preferred the hebrew text, although Jerome did use versions of the septuagint, he marked additions to the Hebrew texts with an "obelus" †
Origen had a position that's very rare nowadays, which is that he prized the Hebrew text very highly but also accepted the extra material in the Greek texts. However, he only did this because he thought the extra material was from the original Hebrew and had been lost from the versions the jews used. See his letter to Julius Africanus defending the longer version of Daniel. This position is untenable in modern scholarship and even Catholics and Orthodox accept the extra material was added later, although they still consider them inspired, which would be antithetical to Origen's view that rested on them being part of the original texts.

File: religiosity.jpg (52 KB, 710x605)

52 KB JPG

>>17194414
>They have no arguments to defend their positions. They often resort to insults and mockery.

>>17194514
Now compare the IQs of Christian countries with non-Christian countries.

>>17194531
>christian countries
you mean latin america? the average is 80-90.

Europe is no longer Christian since a long time.

>>17194191
>He never said this, He referred to the future final generation, not to His own.

Matthew 16:27-28

For the Son of Man is going to come in his Father’s glory with his angels, and then he will reward each person according to what they have done.

“Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom.”

>>17194550
He also told the high priest and the roman guards that nailed him to the cross that they'd see him return in the clouds too. Never happened.

>>17194305
>don't get why so many Jews are hostile towards Christianity when we both believe the same prophesies.
Because Christianity tells them to abandon the law that says that they will be cursed if they do. God personally face to face told Israel to never ever abandon his law. Every single time they have been destroyed has been when they abandoned the law amd ignores the prophets that told them to go back to the law.

>>17194191
>the remaining will be fulfilled in His second coming.
Right. So until that happens, you should not believe Jesus to be the Messiah.

>>17194543
>Europe is no longer Christian since a long time.
Look at the flags of the countries of Europe and tell me how many still have a cross in their flag. And the narrative that the west isn't Christian is false. Something like 70% of westerners self-identify as Christian to this day.

And anyways, you should have understood the point I was making, which is that religion has an ethnic component and ethnicity determines IQ. You can't compare an unga bunga south African shaman to St. Aquinas or Origen of Alexandria and claim they're intellectual equals and you can't compare African superstition with the 2000 year old philosophical tradition of Christianity which is based off of the greek school of logic.

>>17194016
>And the original LXX was a translation of the five books Torah only.
LXX is the original Torah. There is no Torah before LXX. Bible scholars propose that LXX authors compiled and translated various jewish texts from 9th to 4th century BC into a single book, but there is no evidence these texts ever existed. None whatsoever. It's entirely 3rd century BC Alexandrian project. Jews were primitive people with backwards desert culture. They had no literary background. Prior to hellenic period they used their written language for practical reasons only. The hebrew language itself is very primitive and rigid. Bible hebrew has only 8000 unique words, non-biblical hebrew much less than that. It was a dead language that no jew even spoke at the time. Septuagint being even remotely of jewish origin is about as believable as bantoids in 1000AD being capable of producing a work on the level of Odyssey. It's just not feasible. There's no historical or archeological evidence to back it up.

>>17194658
As dumb as "Jesus was white".

>>17193817

The most interesting part about arguing with Jews is the fact that they never bring up any of Christ's moral teachings, only fight semantics over why he isn't the Messiah because he didn't tie his shoes a certain way. Hell, Jews never bring up their own practicing morality. It always feels like something they're trying to keep hidden for some reason. I suppose for the layman, the best course of action is to simply see what goodness Jews and Christians bring to the world, and make up your own mind, as opposed to arguing over thousand-year-old texts where the authors are arguing over even older texts.

You will know them by their fruits.

>>17194717
Nice argument. Care to explain why there is no evidence of jewish observance of torah before 2nd century BC? Why is there not a single pre-hellenic jewish or non-jewish text that mentions Moses, Noah or any stories from Torah? Why does torah observance conveniently line up with Maccabean revolt and rise of jewish nationalism? Who was Torah written for if NO ONE observed it for hundreds of years that it was supposedly around, or over a thousand if you think it was passed down orally from Moses?

>>17194658
you got BTFO in another thread

>>17194867
Post a link then.

>>17194827
If Buddha showed up with some loving moral teachings will you bow down and worship him too? Do you chase after any man that says nice things in your ear or are you faithful to your husband?

>>17194867
>guy with racial hangups wastes hours of everyone elses time every day
I dont doubt it
Repost when you find it

>>17195169
It was more than merely nice. The "husband" in your analogy was evidently incarnate in the person of Jesus, literally called the Bridegroom in the gospel.
Investigating why the original jews followed jesus will produce an answer to that question for you.

Honestly it's kind of like Monkeybone with Chris Kattan only way better.

File: full.png (238 KB, 1220x608)

238 KB PNG

>>17194531
>>17194636
The blue countries over there in the East must have a lot of Christians.

>>17195209
>evidently incarnate in the person of Jesus
One person cannot be the son of David, the son of man, the begotten son of God and God incarnate at the same time.

File: religious countries.jpg (218 KB, 494x1055)

218 KB JPG

>>17195306
Damn, Africa must be full of atheists!

>>17195704
>>17195704
n-nooo but there is a cross in the flag of sweden, denmark, norway and finland
they are christerinos!

>>17194827
>only fight semantics over why he isn't the Messiah
Literally nothing about Yeshua bar Yosef matters if he isn't the messiah, anon. That's how revelatory religion works. Morality and truth are entirely subjective in comparison to Yahweh. You can't argue that Yeshua deserved to be the messiah, he either was or he wasn't the messiah and if he wasn't then he doesn't matter. This is Abrahamism 101.

>>17195969
>Morality didn't exist until 30 AD

>>17195970
No, of course not. It was laid down by Yahweh in a series of revelations to the Jewish patriarchs and prophets. If Rabbi Yeshua bar Yosef was the Jewish messiah, then those revelations got updated in 30AD; if he wasn't, then they weren't, and nothing he said matters. That's how revelation works. If you're going to argue that he wasn't the Jewish messiah but was none the less a Jewish prophet or patriarch (which is a common position within Judaism mind you) then that's a different matter, however.

>>17193950
>a blatant corruption of the Old Testament
Let me guess, the DSS manuscripts are forgeries made by le ebil joos too? The DSS predates the masoretic text by centuries and is from before the time Jesus was even alive, and it’s like 98-99% in agreement with the masoretic text. Also funny that you should call the masoretic text a “corruption”, considering that the original “septuagint”, named for the 70 rabbis who translated the text from Hebrew to Greek, was just the Torah, the five books of Moses, what we know as the books of Genesis, Exodus, Numbers, Deuteronomy, and Leviticus. That’s it. The translation of the other books of the Tanakh, namely the N and K, were translated later and were not translated with anywhere near the same accuracy as the the Torah was, it’s possible it wasn’t even done by actual scholars of the time. Some early copies of the Septuagint even admit this fact.

>>17193817
The Church recognizes the Septuagint (LXX) as the authoritative version of the Old Testament for the early Church. Many of the Old Testament quotations in the New Testament are derived from the LXX, which reflects an early Christian understanding of Scripture. The use of the Septuagint highlights the continuity between the Old and New Testaments, reinforcing the belief that the New Testament is the fulfillment of the Old Testament prophecies.

>>17193817
didn't this guy get defeated by a certain Dr. Brown on the nature of the text

He is completely unable to deal with academic scholarship on the hebrew bible
He just dismisses it as ridiculous and asserts that the MT must be the correct text because it's in Hebrew despite how we've found passages in the Dead Sea Scrolls which match the LXX
He cannot accept that there was no canonical text even at the time of Jesus
>>17194827
I'm not sure if it was Tovia or another Jew but I've seen Jews criticise the Sermon on the Mount for example
In the Orthodox view God has given mankind an evil inclination from birth but from the Jewish view this is actually a positive thing
The Christian view is that you're tempted to sin because you're inherently sinful and that temptation itself is a sin but in Judaism this inclination towards evil is seen as being a gift from God which enables people to be righteous
The man who is tempted and resists his temptation is seen as more righteous than the man who is never tempted at all

>>17196010
>who translated the text from Hebrew to Greek
It was always greek. "Hebrew" was a dead language. Jews had been using aramaic for centuries and then switched to koine greek in hellenistic period. Nobody spoke or wrote in hebrew. There are no pre-hellenistic biblical texts in biblical hebrew/paleo-hebrew. No references or citations to them either. This is pure heeb fiction because they don't want to admit that septuagint is the original bible and not a translation. Judaism or mosaic law did not exist before Septuagint. There is no evidence for it whatsoever. None. Nada. Zero. Zilch. On the other hand, we have plenty of evidence showing that it did not exist and that jews did not follow mosaic law before the composition of septuagint.

>>17196331
Meds

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketef_Hinnom_scrolls

>>17196351
Read your link dumbass.

>>17193817
Literal Pedo-Jew who is on the run from the cops in Indonesia(?), literally the most Muslim place on Earth, while also running a "Children's Charity". He also looks EXACTLY like the famous etching of Sabbatai T'Zevi. It's uncanny and true testament to the power of their incest practices.

Beating up Christians with the Bible is low hanging fruit and he's just as evasive and dishonest when confronted with the same short comings in the OT.

File: 1708317045033113.png (149 KB, 772x533)

149 KB PNG

>>17193817
>Jew fights with Christjews over who the Jewish mashiach is
Why should I as a gentile care about this?

>>17194222

It's called "LXX" (70), but there were actually 72, which is a very significant number in Jew-Doo and all things esoteric Astrology/Astrotheological.

72 "watchers", "demons", "names of god", etc.....


Get your facts straight, Dummy ;)

>>17193817
>>17194315
>Are young women usually virgins?
Erm. No not in the bronze age they were not usually virgins you fucking tard. It's ireelvant anyway. Matthew says nothing about "implication" or that there is any" inference " of the woman being a virgin when he misquotes the old testament.

>>17196800
I wanted to simplify it and not have to write the extra paragraph you just wrote.

>>17194222
>>17196800
The whole 70 rabbi thing is a jewish fairy tale.

>>17193817
>>17193950
The Masoretic is the word of God. You just need to stop taking Jews at their* word when they tell you what it means.

"Almah" means virgin. Like how "jungfrau" means virgin in Germans. Words have pragmatic meanings not always the same as their semantic meanings. If you were purely semantic, you'd say "no, umm, actually, 'jungfrau' just means 'jung' 'frau' - young woman"
The Hebrew Scriptures clearly speak of a virgin birth. What kind of "miracle" is it that a young woman conceives? See how this interpretation also just makes the passage nonsensical?

>>17193817
he achieved none of those things

>>17195686
Evidently they can

>>17194262
>We have only four sources, supposed eyewitnesses that passed down this fact
Well, supposedly there were many more texts that discussed these events, they just got destroyed because their contents didn't fit with what the Vatican was teaching that week.

>bad christians destroyed christian evidence that prove christianity real and good christians >>17198920 (you) correct