Historically speaking, who should control Alsace–Lorraine?
>>17282054The Burgundian state (I will not clarify further)
>>17282054Germany because France failed to 1v1 the Germans three times.Thems the rules.
>>17282054>who should control this 90% German speaking region that was part of the HRE for most of human history and who's people consistently vote to be part of the Germany for every referendum ever given.The answer is of course that the Kingdom of Lotharingia should control it.
>>17282054they should just rule themselves
>>17282054Me
>>17282150There are too many sovereign countries in Europe already
>>17282184*not enough, and agreed
>>17282184Especially in the Balkans. All of those Southern Slavs should unite into a Pan-Slavic state.
>>17282054It should merge with Belgium to form a proper buffer state between France and Germany. Maybe include Switzerland too.
>>17282205They tried. Serbs chimped out and caused a huge war sending their diaspora all over western europe
>>17282088They failed once in 1v1 (1870)They succeeded once in 3v1 (WW1)Then they failed in 2v1 (1940)
>>17282054God who cares anymore, Europe needs to unite under one leadership and not quarrel over minor provinces the size of a US county
they were all ethnically Germans (were bc now It's full of niggers)
>>17282054Prussian retardation unironically burnt their goodwill towards Germany. During a minor crisis where garrison troops were getting into fights with the locals, Wilhelm II decided to publicly side with "his boys" (i.e the troops) and that pretty much soured the whole province on their 'fellow' German Emperor.The NKVD also received a few Alsatian defectors from the German Army during WWII, indicating a disaffection with being German in the 1940s
The Alsatians considered themselves French and wanted to remain French. So any argument about "muh self determination" in favor of Germany doesn't work. It doesn't matter that they were ethnically Germanic or German speaking, they didn't want German rule.
>>17282054Burgundy
>>17282054It belongs to Rome
>>17282089>consistently vote to be part of the Germany for every referendum ever givenNo, after the Franco-Prussian war they voted almost entirely for anti-German protest parties for over a decade. After Germany moved in colonists from the rest of Germany and 2 or so generations of brainwashing had passed they were gradually warming up to the German rule, but then the Germans destroyed their goodwill towards the Alsatians again with the Zabern affair and destroying their native textile industry in favor of favoring the textile industry in the rest of Germany.Germans knew Alsatians didn't like them and still had loyalties to France, Alsatians weren't trusted on the Western Front in WW1 so Germany shipped them to the East. They greeted the French as liberators and barely enlisted in WW2 for Germany so the Germans and were subjected to hardcore repression by the Nazis.It was just a bunch of Prussian militarist and Pan-Germanic crazies that saw people in France who spoke a Germanic language and thinking they were these lost Germans that thought they needed to be choked and punched in the face hard enough until they realized they were German and loved it. They never wanted to be part of Germany and Germans ruined whatever Pro-German sentiment there was with their behavior. Although they spoke a Germanic language, Germans also tried to culturally genocide them by outlawing their unique dialect and trying to replace it entirely with standard German in schools and public life.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZtgWpfaI9AThe sad thing is this just made France double down on destroying local languages and identity like French Flemish and Occitan because they perhaps reasonably never wanted this kind of thing to happen again. This idea that Alsatians are just Germans is just cope from Paradox game players and Neo Nazis who think anyone speaking a Germanic language needs to be forcefully assimilated into Das Reich irrespective of what the people there actually want.
>Alsace threadhttps://youtu.be/HQr0ZcDrYOM?si=U30tL15piAVyX3e5
I'm sure they'd rather have autonomy/self rule than be part of either one of those autistic imperialistic retarded blobs known as Fr*nce and G*rmany.
The HRE
>>17282054Alsatians and Lothringians
>>17282054Should be divided by linguistic borders.
bump
me
>>17282054He who can defend it. Sometimes German, Right now it belongs to France. Soon it will belong to some Islamic Arab state.
>>17282597Pure deranged nonsense.
If Alsatians loved France so much, why did they vote for autonomist/separatist parties?
>>17282054Gvermvan emvpvre with capital in Prussianstadt, built in place of the degeneate hellhole of B*rlin
>>17282054France>>17282160Good contender, but my claim is stronger.
>>17282088France could have killed Germany in its cradle in early 19th century.In fact it was the French who abolished the HRE which paved the way for a German state.
Belgium objectively.
>>17283636Italian general. And you missed the most important battle
>>17282478They lost the 1v1 in WWI.Literally the race to the sea was by Brits and Germans otherwise it would have been another 1870.>>17283636not even close. The HRE was ended by the Austrians. Germany completely destroyed France in 1870 and there is no reason to believe this streak would end in successive 1v1s.The French have NEVER been good at fighting.>Skarmbildgo back, Ahmed.The French raped MENAlattos because MENAlattos cant fight, they are wide hipped, bug eyed, sand people with feminine features.The French defeated them because they are partially related to the Germans.The Germans are the uncontested world heavyweights of warfare.The French suck, your people suck, no one comes close to Germany in warfare.
>>17283785>Literally the race to the sea was by Brits and Germans otherwise it would have been another 1870.You don’t even realize how few British forces there were in France during the race to the sea, you mong.
>>17283793Lmao KO
>>17282054>Historically speaking, who should control Alsace–Lorraine?Germany. And it isn't even close.The area was Demographically German, ruled by germans, and a part of the HRE(Feudal Germany) for a thousand years.It came to be French only after a brutal war of conquest and an even more brutal forced assimilation campaign (that is much more recent than you'd think)It was morally and legally rejoined to the German Reich following the Germano-Prussian war, but the French and 'gloid being the jealous beasts they are could not accept their defeat.>>17282562This applies to Tibet and Crimea too, but that's the chud position
>>17282054>Alsace–LorraineWhat if the Prussians had merely taken Alsace and allowed France to keep the entirety of Lorraine?
>>17283793>>17284124Actually, the race to the sea was mediated by a few hundred British and Germans while the French couldnt even keep up LOL.Try again.
>>17283793race to the sea was 2 weeks(!) before 31s of October btw, not sure if you were aware the pic you posted isnt even relevant to the discussion.
>>17282088>>>17282054 (OP)>Germany because France failed to 1v1 the Germans three times.>Thems the rules.Germanyits German
Historically speaking? France and if you don’t like it come take it
>>17282054It's Alsace-Moselle actually, and France, see >>17282597
>>17284344What’s the next cope going to be?
>>17282054Germany or Luxembourg or Belgium.
>>17283785The British contribution was barely noticeable until mid-1916That being said, while virtually alone on the Western Front, France still had help from Russia on the other side
>>17282088Anon really believes in the german invasion to France in WW2? pathetic.
>>17282597AI image + have you ever heard of forced assimilation? France did it a lot.
>>17284844I might be wrong, but didnt A-H contribute with divisions on the western front?
>>17284869yes, and krauts really love their artillery pieces as well
>>17284756Belgium held the whole front on their ownBelgium was the deciding factor for the entente winning WW1 (unironically)
>>17282054The French, I don't even understand why Germany took it, they had no claim in the first place and it provided no benefit to hold it
>>17282054The true border really is quite simple.If you can't define borders in geographical terms, they're meme shit.
>>17285647To elaborate, the core geographical definition of France is:>drainage basins with origins in the Massif Central.the Massif Central has been the central core of French identity through the centuries/millennia. It connects the Latin Mediterranean ports, to the remnant Celtic/Gallic Atlantic lands, and Germanic/Nordic raiders from the English Channel. It's a 3 layered history, nicely matching 3 drainage basins.The French have 0 business in the Rhine. The definitive German clay.
Or a missed chance to help Luxembourg not be such a meme fucking state. Should've just gifted it to avoid seethe and balance out the 3 parts of Benelux.. Lice
>>17282088France litteraly won ww1, drooling mongoloid>>17283785>They lost the 1v1 in WWI.>Literally the race to the sea was by Brits and Germans otherwise it would have been another 1870.Absolute mongoloid, brits role in ww1 was completely overshadowed by France, it's not even up to debate.For the same number of mobilized men than France they ended up covering only as twice kilometers of frontline as the Belgians. British army was seen, rightfully so, as a liability by the French High Command. Plus, Germany was not alone neither. This board is really full of retards lmao
>>17284861>AI imagenope it's a famous postcard from after WW1 retard
>>17282054The Kingdom of Lotharingia, obviously. >tl;dr Clovis was a faggy retard and Salic Succession law is one of the biggest crimes ever inflicted on humanity.
