I need a serious overhaul of how to "see" things. People just say "Copy that shit down, retard." I am trying but there's just something I'm missing, something I can't see for myself. How do I see the lines for the hips and rib cage, it's hard for me. I've tried reading M. Hampton's "figure drawing and design" as well as Andrew Loomis' book. But, I'm at a loss. Please help anons, I'm not here to troll, I truly want to learn. I don't want to be aimless and waste my time. I've been practicing without any result, even by asking myself questions and writing my mistakes down I still don't get it.
your work is much better than the average stuff posted here, you probably won't get any satisfying answers from this thread, desuthe best thing for you is to probably draw from life. If all you're doing are photographs, mater copies, Loomis, Hampton, you can get VERY very good like that, but you'll forever be a shape copier / memorizer. this is where I'm at. If you actually want to know the real undulations and structure of things, you will need to paint from life, draw from life, draw from a skeleton, draw from statues, etc. It's the end stage for any good aritst
>>7429040I have a drawing class in real life, a figure drawing class specifically. I think I should go there more often, though I'm not sure where to get a figure of the skeleton. I really want one, but right now I'm poor neet and I need to save money for food and shit. Literally quit my job to study art, retarded, I know.
it would help if you were more specific about what fundamentals in particular you're asking about and what in particular picrel shows. one problem I think a lot of /beg/s have is that they set themselves up for failure, basically. these look like 1-2 minute sketches: obviously there are going to be mistakes of various kinds. if you watch enough demos by artists who can clearly render out very technical works, they'll tell you plainly that with similar sketches they make failures. I remember Vilppu saying with figure sketches he tends to draw them too long (perhaps he was talking about legs in particular, but I don't remember). quicker sketches have their utility, but I think most /beg/s don't do enough long(er) drawings. I've seen some people say they've never worked on an individual drawing for more than an hour, some not even three. not saying you have to do it a majority of the time, but part of the problem might be that you aren't allowing yourself to fully realize your knowledge because you're trying to be perfect with little drawings and naturally you find various mistakes. there's more potential advice to be given, but again when you're vague and just saying "I just can't see" it's not, with all due respect, very helpful.
>>7429038Maybe a course from Stan will fix your woes.
>>7429045This is some good advice, anon. Well, I do have some drawings from yesterday that I did after doing some studies. They aren't one hour or anything. My focus is that I want to improve on my spatial awareness and my proportions. I think I've studied form enough to understand construction, I just need that proportion side.
>>7429038>asking myself questions and writing my mistakes down Keep those questions and mistakes in mind and re-read the books and re-watch the videos. When you are trying to look for the answers and correct ways to draw them, they'll stick out much more now that you have a specific questions and experience actually trying to do it. Watching Hampton demoing on YouTube with the photo ref there made more sense to me compared to some of his long anatomy lectures. Student critiques also help a lot. If you're lucky some anons can redline your stuff too.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XpejM-T9YG0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApyH98uufXgRedrawing stuff from memory is really good for testing what you were just trying to learn too, but it's very difficult and much more mentally draining but that's where you truly learn.
>>7429047I feel haunted by this shill, bro. I'm tempted but, I've seen a lot of stuff on here saying it's not worth it.
>>7429052His courses are fine. His free anatomy playlist is enough for most Anons unless they wanna get pretty deep into it. Not hard to pirate his stuff either. He's good at figure drawing and anatomy and is decent at teaching it. The 3D models and photo/video refs are great too. Anons here just have an irrational hatred for him. His lame ass jokes are pretty annoying though.
>>7429052worst-case scenario after a couple weeks you look at the content, go through some of the lessons, and you don't like it. you'll never know unless you try, not simply taking other people's word for it, and you can still get your money back.
>>7429054>you'll never know unless you try, not simply taking other people's word for it, and you can still get your money back.Very true.>>7429053>Not hard to pirate his stuff eitherGot any links? >>7429053>Anons here just have an irrational hatred for him. His lame ass jokes are pretty annoying though.Yeah, I've noticed that. I've watched a few of his things about rhythm and thought they were insightful. I also used some of his videos to get better at form, too. That's why I've been tempted to get his course, I just don't want to pay, lol.
>>7429049>Well, I do have some drawings from yesterday that I did after doing some studies. They aren't one hour or anything.how many drawings more than two hours in your life do you think you've done? also how long have you been drawing? not just months or years, but what has your consistency been like? how many days a week on average and on days when you draw how many hours does that span on average? I ask because another potential problem is simply that you don't draw that frequently and when you do it's relatively short. you have to remember that a lot of these great, technical artists have not only been drawing from early childhood, but they often have gone through great teachers or masters who have given them direct instruction - sometimes over multiple years. doing self-study is not easy, and even with consistent effort it might reasonably take you 5+ years before you're at an intermediate stage (though it depends on what we mean by that).>spatial awarenessdon't mean to be overly persistent, but I'm not entirely confident I know what you mean here. what exactly will gaining "spatial awareness" allow you to do? how does it differ from proportions, say? are you just talking about capturing 3-dimensionality in a drawing, or?>proportionsagain, with just drawing lines the first time and doing quick drawings, even advanced artists make mistakes. but you can work on looking ever more finely at relative relationships on your subject and measuring. learn how to use your pencil/utensil as a measuring stick.
>>7429057>Got any links?Before you go wasting time hoarding courses, just go through his free playlists first.https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLtG4P3lq8RHGuMuprDarMz_Y9Fbw_d2wshttps://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLtG4P3lq8RHFBeVaruf2JjyQmZJH4__ZvFor the paid stuff you can use the /ic/ torrent (it's huge so use qBittorrent and select just the stuf you want. it takes a while for the metadata to download). Or search on rutracker, online-courses.club, or the Telegram groups.>The /ic/ Torrentmagnet:?xt=urn:btih:0aebc0f02e6c179b62e04c69af3e5adee3abee12&dn=IC-STUDY
>>7429038Are you learning fundamentals ?Let me be honest okay so you are trying to copy ribcage for example if you have no idea how perspective and 3d shapes work you won't be able to do so. You can copy how much you want but if you don't know underlying rules behind it will not be worth anything. Also you need to know how it works anatomically. Also you can trace to learn the shape then copy it but problem is if you have no idea why it is drown like this then it's not going to work once you will have no reference. It's like copying tutorials for programming over and over and then when you work on your own you have no idea what to write.
>>7429063>how many drawings more than two hours in your life do you think you've done? also how long have you been drawing? not just months or years, but what has your consistency been like? how many days a week on average and on days when you draw how many hours does that span on average? I ask because another potential problem is simply that you don't draw that frequently and when you do it's relatively short.I've just started to commit to drawing. So in recent memory, I've just been drawing a lot of forms and other things like anatomy studies. The anatomy studies take a few hours. Right now, I have a schedule of working on drawing 8 hours a day. I've been doing this for about a week now. But, I do feel a little aimless. I said "Anatomy is my goal" but, as I've worked on anatomy, like arms and legs, I've seen how I lack proportion. >"spatial awareness" allow you to do? how does it differ from proportionsHow a drawing sits on a page. Planning my drawing before I do it.
>>7429068Thanks, appreciate it.>>7429069>Are you learning fundamentals ?>Let me be honest okay so you are trying to copy ribcage for example if you have no idea how perspective and 3d shapes work you won't be able to do so. You can copy how much you want but if you don't know underlying rules behind it will not be worth anything. Also you need to know how it works anatomically.Yes, I've been learning the fundies. Like how to draw a box, spheres, cones, cylinders and organic forms. The idea for this was to super simplify the rib cage and pelvis to have accurate proportions.
>>7429069I suppose my goal is to create decent proportions through gesture then add form on top of it. Going off of Hampton here.
>>7429038drawing things upside down really helps. it stops you from seeing how things should look like.
>>7429076>>7429076But do you understand anatomically how spine and ribcage work in torso ? because if you don't you will be having hard time to draw it. Im not asking for specific on how to draw but how it works. I would probably start with lame stick figure to get the pose and proportions right and then draw the rest. I dont have tablet right now so just drawn bit over it. Again look at what the guy you are trying to learn from did and what you did he have it correct.
>>7429082I see, thank you. I don't understand how the spine works with the ribs and hips. That's something I'm doing to highlight in my studies tonight.
>>7429070>The anatomy studies take a few hoursbut how long have you done an *individual* drawing? have you taken more than an hour or two on an individual figure, say, that you could show? when I talk about a long(er) drawing I don't simply mean drawing a lot in a day, I mean working on a singular subject for multiple hours, starting how ever loosely you want, but trying to push your knowledge as far as you can.>How a drawing sits on a page. Planning my drawing before I do it.besides doing particular drawings where your sole purpose is to fit a drawing squarely where you would like it to on a page, you can help yourself by sketching lightly at first and then reworking as needed/desired.beyond that I would say just draw consistently. you said you have a schedule of drawing 8 hours a day. that might be productive hypothetically, but it could quickly become the case that you come to hate those 8 hours or hate the idea of reaching 8 hours a day and push it off and hate the fact that you miss that. ultimately you can do as you like, but I would suggest setting your goals lower but allowing yourself any additional time to draw if you have it. there's also the fact that, like studying from books or videos, as we get further into our study sessions - even with breaks - we experience diminishing returns. so however many hours a day you plan to committ yourself to, be aware of how productive and clear-headed you tend to feel at the end of your sessions and consider whether you should adjust your approach.
>>7429086>but how long have you done an *individual* drawing?By what you're saying, not long enough.Alright, thanks for the advice guys. I think I got somewhat of an idea from all of this. I'm going to get off so I can focus, bye.
>>7429082>>7429083Steve Huston's book had a good section on this. The spine can bend a lot more at the place between the rib-cage and pelvis. Notice how it's mostly straight along the rib-cage and hips but where it bends (or stretches) the most is in-between those two large masses.
>>7429083The point is to realize where they are located and when you have good idea of location you just do fill in. That's basically torso... it's kind of annoying at start but after some practice you will have 0 problems to do it.
>>7429099Yup this looks good.
>>7429099He also has a great YouTube channel.https://www.youtube.com/@STEVEHUSTONdrawsfromlife/videos
>>7429086Dear Anon, thank you. I really thought about your post last night. You were absolutely right. I really haven't just tried to draw in styles that I see while I study. I really needed that kick in the pants. Drawing illustrations along lessons is really what I need to do. I just avoided it because well, to be honest, I didn't want to face the fact I would make shit pictures. I made an illustration last night, but, despite it being shit, I had so much fun. But I also realized that I just need to jump into the water. That I learn by doing in making illustrations rather than just study-celing. If I can't make a drawing to post, why bother? I need to draw pictures more, that's just the reality.Even if this is shit, thanks anon.
>>7430523I even drew a better one today, I want to make better pictures. But this one is a little better than the previous one.
Is there any proof people improve with Hidech? I've followed a couple of nips on twitter that challenged themselves to go through his playlist and they all gave up.
>>7430523Nta, but good for you anon. That picture may not be perfect, no, but you say you enjoyed drawing it? Well it fucking shows, it shines with heart and soul. This is 100% the best way to learn. Learn to love your art, even when you think it's shit. Finish that goddamn drawing, ask yourself what could be done better, then finish another goddamn drawing. Ganbare anon, you are GMI
>>7429038>>7429038Trace a photo it then copy your traced drawing using construction.
>>7429038If you haven't already, look into landmarks. Landmarks are very useful to know when simplifying into volumes and showing their orientation, knowing these makes your life a lot easier instead of guessing. Vid by Proko going over key landmarks.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qwt_wggUFHgHere he actually shows how the boxes relate to the landmark points, or use whatever simplified forms you prefer(Hide-chan?).https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqxPHew5bGQ
>>7434449I have been looking into that. thanks!
