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Why are they redoing the HSK again?

>>219099299
To make it easier?

>looking for advice on Chinese, or Korean
>it’s all for self-conscious american born chinese or koreans who already know some of either
>join Chinese or Korean language exchange chat *for beginners*
>everyone is a self-conscious asian-american who can already speak a substantial amount of the language at full speed anyways
Asians are so weird.

>>219099494
sorry

>>219099299
Add levels 7-9 to fit with CEFR c1 c2 etc
HSK 5 and 6 too easy, need to make them a bit harder for it to actually be B2/C1
Add new words
Idk why they're removing the handwriting, probably it was too expensive to mark. But most people just do a computer test anyway, you don't need to handwrite anything for that
Basically it's to increase the difficulty and "skill ceiling" of the HSK per se so that high HSK levels actually represent really good Chinese
HSK6 is currently way too easy for what it claims to be

>>219099626
Do you intend on taking 3.0?

>>219099626
>Idk why they're removing the handwriting
Who needs to write on paper in the big 26? The Chinese are so technologically advanced that they are ditching hand written notes. Glory to the CCP. Glory to President Xi.

>>219099661
No, my HSK6 2.0 qualification is valid for two years. The new system coming in doesn't invalidate old scores.
After it expires I might do 7-8-9 but you really need to prepare well for that paper
>>219099675
Handwriting helps you improve character memory thoughbeit

>>219099494
These two are on my list of languages I'd like to learn, but the prospect is incredibly intimidating. Especially Chinese, as I'm already physically unable to hear Japanese pitch accent, tones will be the absolute death of me. Well, I guess most Chinese VNs aren't voiced anyway...
Wish there were resources for those as extensive as the ones weebs made for Japanese.

>>219098970
>Spanish flag
>American
>English French Toast
>Pizza image (Italy)
>ドイツ国 (Germany)
>Russian flag label
>Made in China
Did I miss any?

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I am slowly making progress! But those terms sometimes sound so fucking complex and if I dig down the phonetics rabbit hole each rule/sound/etc. would take 10 days to cover.

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>>219100644
It's shopped, although the original is pretty wild anyway.
https://www.kudopan.co.jp/pcategory/english-toast/

>>219100910
My goal is to cover the high-yield stuff ASAP and have at least one go at all the major rules so I can rely on my ear and repetition to progress from then on.

Give me your best resources for learning Russian

пoжaлyйcтa

>>219101033
https://sistemakalinka.com/

Advice to newcomers: filter the jordanian

>>219101112
Shiet, it's like I am the kid who cried wolf and when the wolf really came no one believed in him. I guess I'll just learn German in silence.

>>219101146
When are you traveling to Germany?

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day 2195: patient earnestly believes that asking chatgpt questions about sounds amounts to learning a language. Observation will continue, but signs indicate this is the start of another typical "cycle". I have little hope for the patient's recovery, and can only hope that he learns to live with his condition.

>>219100925
'french toast' is called eggy bread here and is a savoury dish. Used to have it for breakfast when I was young with tomato sauce.

>>219101272
If I get to C1, however long that takes.

I don’t want to learn German and I already know French, English and some Spanish. Anything similar to German that’s even worth it? Or am I stuck with Arabic, Russian etc?

>>219100910
This shit is not necessary right now
Focus on acquiring vocab and basic sentence structure

>>219102181
Chinese

>>219101687
I remember you saying before that you will never go to Germany, now you're motivated to learn German. It sounds like something changed chez toi.

>hear about immersing yourself in your TL
>set my device/app to my TL
>never lasts more than a day
this has happened multiple times, how do I break the cycle

My friend reached B2 in another language while I'm still stuck at B1

>>219099299
handwriting is a meme skill now, you don't need it for everyday Chinese usage anymore

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>>219102181
Learn Swedish with me.

I hope Steve Kaufmann dies

Can I reach to B2 level at two languages in a year with 4 hours of study? Am I too greedy?

>>219103132
I like your sense of humor so thanks for sharing I’ll look into it

>>219103204
why?

doing the duolingo

I want to start learning Chinese
Im a complete beginner so any recommendations or suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated.

To start, arent there multiple Chinese languages? Which one should I learn? I just want to learn whatever the majority of Chinese people speak and are projected to continue speaking until the end of my natural life.

>>219100491
Defrancis Chinese (the main textbook, which is much less famous than the reader) is extremely good, albeit old fashioned. I went over beginning chinese and read the reader, covering the main book like how Alexander Arguelles does assimil (repetitive shadowing, including audio alone, reading the english with mandarin audio, then the pinyin with mandarin audio, then the characters alone with audio, then reading aloud to myself. A year and a half later, having done almost no outside input and having not used it at all, I can still remember the bulk of what I studied and can even output it. I would say my problem with Japanese is there’s no text that comes close to Defrancis or assimil for european languages in building that core foundation.

>>219103204
I hope he outlives you

I get that music in your TL is nice to listen to and all but how do you actually benefit from it without studying the lyrics like its a book? Music often has lyrics that would otherwise be awkward and grammatically incorrect. Even in english most songs I listen to, I can only understand like 70% of the lyrics without looking them up

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>xe doesn't make vocab tables for every category of thing
Ngmi

>>219102622
Just don't bother, even if you set your OS to your TL it won't help you any since you already have everything memorized and don't need to read anything

>>219105171
Mandarin.

>>219106718
After some research I believe this is correct
Is there any consensus on a good textbook for an EFL? My friend (self taught Japanese and German) told me that this is a good route to take.

>>219102797
>请你签字
>signs it in disgusting chicken-scratch

>>219105634
music has a mnemonic benefit that helps the words stick. its only useful if youre actually memorizing the lyrics

I think I'm gonna leave German for now and dabble in French. Or Danish or Swedish maybe. Or Spanish or Italian. I won't learn German without going to Germany, I guess.

>>219107387
>I think I'm gonna leave German for now and dabble in French
This was me, but I ended up getting to C1, and never touched German again.
God bless French baddies <3

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>>219107610
>baddies

>>219107610
redpill me on French baddies

In theory, with French every other Romance language should be easy to learn to me. Spanish and Italian are easy to pronounce for Polish speakers, Portuguese shouldn't be a much trouble too. And I would already have a grasp on Romance grammar and about 80% of the vocabulary. I don't know if German would help me with other Germanic languages. Scandinavian languages sound different, even with their numerous cognates, and English doesn't help me with German. There are fewer job offers in Poland with Norwegian or Swedish or Dutch, but they are usually better paid. And if I emigrated, I would be surrounded by the language and I would have to learn it, no matter what language it is, but then it's a different type of learning. Now it's kind of dry, mostly stuff for beginner learners but there is no that pop culture drive. Even the Swedes have nice music and I was a little envious of the Serbanon
And I'm still learning English, it's a bit difficult for me to learn German at the same time because it's time-consuming. That's why I want to dabble in a, maybe not simpler, but less time-consuming language
>>219107610
How long did it take you? Did you use any specific methods? Have you been to France? If so, how did you navigate in the French-speaking environment?

>>219108399
i'd need german for work but it's so ugly i keep dabbling in other languages

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it's over

And if they ask you, say you feel it
But don't call it love,
Юceкcшya...
(Юceкшya)
>>219108399
Portuguese is not easy, speakers sound like they have a mouth smacking full of gum and it's literally incomprehensible compared to Spanish

>>219108497
My life would be much better if I had learned German in elementary school or high school. Lewandowski was playing in Germany at the time, there was less political tension, I was a Warhammer fan, and social media were usable. Right now, I don't feel like talking to Germans online, and studying from materials alone without anything else is boring as hell.
Btw. If German had retained pitch accent, it would be much prettier

>>219109058
Idk man. Rustling sounds, nasal sounds, steady word stress. I think the pronunciation of Portuguese has an undeservedly bad reputation.

>>219109181
what tensions do you feel between poland and germany nowadays?

My advanced novel reading (full comprehension, including looking up difficult words) speed is 1/3 the speed of the audiobook narration.

I am falling behind.

Are audiobooks a scam? Is listening and reading at the same time bad for you?

I think Lamont McLeod lied to us all. You can't listen to speech and read it at the same time.

>>219109524
It's more about everyday regular humans online interactions. Germans regularly whitewash themselves, shit on my country, and bring politics into any conversation. It's unpleasant to read, and I don't want to get involved in shitstorms. They feel very uppity recently. At the same time, they get angry at any words of criticism in retaliation. Surely there are decent Germans in real life, I think, but online, no matter where I interact with Germans, I feel like I'm on the /pol/ or some lefty reddit. I know there's this meme that Poles are constantly seething over Germany, but from my perspective, it's the opposite. The worst thing is that they know nothing about Poland, they literally make things up out of thin air, so they don't even offend me, they just tire me. It's a difficult language, and such occasional interactions do not affect my motivation positively
But that's how it is when you use X, 4chan and discord. So maybe it's my fault, but Poles really are more chill on these platforms, maybe except 4chan. Maybe I'll start using Facebook and join some cooking groups for boomers

This is why I chose TL. Germans are too uppity these days.

>>219099449
Yes.

>>219099626
I'm talking about the new one that's starting this year. Not the 2021 change. They are reverting some of the difficulty and focusing more on colloquial language.

Chat-GPT has hugboxxed me again. I inserted another excerpt of online chat in TL, that I wrote without any consultation of a dictionary or otherwise, and asked it to identify whether any users were non-native speakers. It was confident that I was a native speaker, and when I contradicted it, it said it found no mistake or any red flag in the text.

I am A1.

I'm starting to think that the CEFR is meaningless and not helpful at all.

>>219100491
Start on korean, it's super simple, hangul is like 8000 times easier than chinese writing systems, it's an alphabet basically and not a memory game like chinese

>>219111198
the actual language itself (not the writing system) is by far the hardest of the three

my wife chino... I WANT TO FUCK CHINO
please chino is so cute my wife chino is so cute chino chan sex chino sex with chino i'd like some more kafuu chino sex with chino kafuu chino my wife cute is so chino wife

>>219110606
you have yet to explain how you justify "being A1" but also being effectively conversationally fluent

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what's something good I can drill Spanish grammar with? Spanishdict is too easy because it's multiple choice, and FSI Spanish is too hard. I don't know wtf is going on in FSI because it's so vague what they expect you to answer

spanishdict is pretty good for it in theory, but it usually gives you two choices to pick for with the answer and one of them is obviously not correct

I want something with a moderate amount of difficulty. I don't care what it is. It could be a textbook, or online service.

>>219112334
I am not fluent. I am not an advanced speaker. CEFR makes a lot of assumptions based on the apparent performance of a learner. It's not a real measurement of your actual knowledge and aptitude. How can I be C1-C2 while being A1? Make it make sense. I am just barely scraping by. I can't listen to speech at normal speed. My reading speed is around a third of the speed of audiobook narration. I am A1. An absolute beginner.

>>219112611
A1 doesn't even have a "reading speed" because they don't know 90% of the words they see at all

>>219112716
Oh, so now CEFR means total vocabulary? The CEFR crowd can't even maintain a consistent definition.

Is it true that if I learn a southern european language and talk with boomers there they'll offer me their daughter's hand in marriage (I'm not overweight)

If you have to ask, then no.

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>Persian youtubers stopped uploading 1 month ago after the riots and internet lockdown

>>219113315
Did the riots ever amount to anything? It seems like the whole country is the embodiment of NEH

>>219112394
linguno is good for drilling verb tenses and conjugations, it doesn't have other things though

>>219109995
No, 3.0 will make HSK 6 harder

>>219113398
the riots may have caused them to transition to a China/Russia style closed internet, unless something changes

>>219113315
I'm surprised they even had access to YouTube in the first place

I think my TL chat room is finally getting annoyed with my incel jihad.

fuckkkk audio input is so hard bros why can't people irl have subtitles

>>219109878
interesting you mention that, last week i was at a language exchange event and a german woman hijacked the conversation at the table and wanted us to talk about orange man and whatever he said last

>>219117619
US politics lives rent free in the heads of all europeans

>>219109878
The only time I ever had a good conversation with a German was with a second generation Tunisian immigrant

Le bump

>>219119780
Answer me here >>219108399
"How long did it take you? Did you use any specific methods? Have you been to France? If so, how did you navigate in the French-speaking environment?"

>>219120035
>How long did it take you
2 years
>Did you use any specific methods?
I listened to all of Coffee Break French and read loads of graded readers. Other than that, I only consume media in French (i.e. news, movies, etc).
>Have you been to France?
Yes, and French speaking parts of Canada - but I have only spent 1.5 months total worth of time in French speaking places.
>how did you navigate in the French-speaking environment?
You just speak French. If people swap, either swap or don't The more niche of a place you go to, the less likely they are to speak English.

French is a really simple language to learn if you know English.

>>219100910
>takes forever to pick a language to study
>finally picks one and starts studying the most trivial shit first
bravo Jordie, you're a masterful troll

Bump

Bangkok has to be the best place to practice speaking jap. In Japan they're welcoming but also busy and usually don't really want to spend time with some foreigner.
When they're abroad they're thrilled to meet someone to have stories to tell without even risking using their shitty english.
Actually the only japs who'd keep writing to me I met in Vietnam or Thailand.
Also you can fuck some 40kg brown chicks for a low price and they won't call you back because "I swallowed your cum that must mean something".

>>219122382
>but also busy and usually don't really want to spend time with some foreigner
Thats why you go to small snack bars. Them old fellas just yap. Good output training grind spots.

Fucking japs. Can't use their websites for fucking anything. Try to buy something, you need a jap credit card or phone number. Try to post, you need a jap IP. Can't even register for Misskey. I get it though. Allowing us onto their platforms would ruin them. It must be so nice to have access to an internet where there isn't constant political ragebait.

>>219123476
>It must be so nice to have access to an internet where there isn't constant political ragebait
True. Its the biggest reason why I learn languages. Can tune out of westoid faggotry.

>>219123476
Is ragebaiting about gaijin reclining their aeroplane seat on twitter a political act?

>>219123476
China and Korea do this too but the Japs invented it first
credit to them

The best is the Jap version since it's just enough to filter retards but not enough to (usually) cause you any problems
Compare this to something like the Chinese version where just signing up to 1(yi) app requires you to get your ass pumped and dumped

>>219111198
The writing system doesn't scare me as much because I can already read Japanese, although having to learn _two_ sets of Hanzi (traditional and simplified) is a bit tiresome indeed.
>>219111683
Somehow it seems like it combined the worst of Asian and European grammar

>>219105906
I see Lithuanian wtf, are you studying it (assuming the image is yours)?

>>219128551
honestly once you're a high enough level learning (to read) traditional is effortless

>>219123476
too bad the west doesn't do this. then spam from mostly India wouldn't be a problem

>>219120698
my problem with french is i keep making mistakes when speaking
some of their grammar is fucking wacky

>>219123639
Which languages is best for this? Don't all the big ones like China, Russia, and Japan have geo-blocks or other measures to prevent Westoids from getting onto their sites?

>listen to an e-celeb promulgate on his linguistic bs for an hour
>huh, this is interesting, I'd like to read his book on the language that he studied foremost, this specifically interests me
>$500
>huh
>check out his site
>he doesn't even sell his own books
>he shills for Assimil (for free)
>okay, this looks interesting, he explained how to do it, I'll give it a shot
>series for Korean only has French/Korean
>just learn French in order to do learn Korean
What a dead end. Idk what I was expecting. Why become the John DeFrancis of Korean and not even sell your own textbook. He must not have the rights to it or some silly shit

Learning specifically with materials for language certification exams is the obvious way forward in a pragmatic sense, but sometimes that's not what it's about, if it's just to supplement a leisurely interest of someone who's going to be working in the country soon anyway, that would be mindsucking and boring

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>>219132324
>doxxed my first name and the town I used to live in like a retard

what's some good high A2-low B1 literature in russian? Slice of life mangas (translated to russian ofc) are too easy and while I can read harry potter, its a bit too hard to make a habit of.

I live in Serbia and am slowly learning Serbian. But I'm just not getting it very well after 2 years. I'm looking for a way to gamify it. Duolingo of course doesn't have it. Almost zero videogames have real Serbian localization. I have no talent for Slavic language, please help

>>219115413
I feel this, what language? I'm on French and I absolutely cannot keep up without subs. That said I think spoken French is probably a lot easier to learn if you don't even care to be literate because it condenses a bunch of different grammatical formulations into the exact same pronunciations. Meanwhile if you're a studycel and you get exposed to all the grammar first, trying to map backwards onto that from a bunch of words that all sound the exact fucking same is impossible. Permanent brain damage, always start with input

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>>219132462
Required watch

>>219133530
There's plenty of great Serbian films to watch and this isn't one of them

>>219134535
>Doesn't list a single one

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Anyone here learning a language because of your heritage? What language? If not, what do you think about someone who does this?

>>219135907
Do you mean more like a Scandinavian learning Old Norse, or like 3rd generation immigrants learning the language their grandparents speak?

>>219135907
>If not, what do you think about someone who does this?
I find it admirable. Self teaching the language of my heritage is impossible (very limited and weak resources to learn with), so those without their forefathers tongue should definitely learn it if they can.

Any advice for regaining motivation? Every day I do my Anki and that's all I can muster. When I started learning Swedish in April last year I would be able to work all day reading my textbook and taking notes. Now I've reached the point where I can read the language decently well, but I'm struggling to keep studying.

I feel like I'm slipping. I wanted to apply to some grad school programs in Sweden this fall but my progress is stagnating so hard from my lack of drive.

why did I start creating a conlang out of blue

>>219136790
Just input, if you don't feel like studying you can put some swedeslop on the tv and call it good

>>219135907
based, of course I study latin because brazil is an heir of rome

at what level can I stop using anki

>>219137380
I've never used Anki, so you can stop when it feels like you don't need it anymore

>Sister wants to start learning Japanese
>Keeps asking me to teach her what I know
Perhaps this would be a good time to get back into learning it. Took some courses of it in university three or so years ago, and I still have the books.

>>219137380
immediately

>>219136790
Hur är det med läsförståelsen nu då, Anon?

WHAT'S WITH THE FUCKING CAPTCHA WHERE THE PATTERNS ON ALL 4 IMAGES ARE THE SAME
LITERALLY UNSOLVABLE AND I USE LITERALLY CORRECTLY HERE

>>219136790
Create habits or systems rather than relying on motivation
>>219137380
You'll know

>>219135907
>You have living relatives who can speak it
Good and admirable
>You have no living relatives who can speak it
You've been fully assimilated, trying to "reconnect with your heritage" is just larping at this point like some American plastic paddy learning Irish

>>219136790
Do 2 30 minute reading sessions, once in the morning once in the evening
Time yourself

>>219137380
if you are content with your current vocab size and don't feel the need to drastically expand it anymore
you shouldn't need to use anki to maintain your current level

>>219136790
Sounds like you just outgrew your textbook. Start reading and watching more challenging content.

Graded readers:
https://annas-archive.li/search?index=&page=1&sort=&lang=sv&display=&q=l%C3%A4ttl%C3%A4st

Media with accurate captions:
https://www.svtplay.se/
https://urplay.se/
https://svtplay-dl.se - useful tool to download videos and subs from above, play them through Language Reactor

There's even some fan translations of SNES and GB games that are pretty accessible.

>>219139321
Is it okay to LARP as an ethnicity that you don't have any genetic connection to?

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>>219140007
>useful tool to download videos and subs from above
this can also be achieved through yt-dlp, which is easier if you're already running that anyway
never heard of svtplay-dl, but good stuff; looks like it works the same

>>219140049
>larp as a [biological thing] you're not
I mean... I guess. There are spiders that have evolved to resemble ants, just so they can get close to ants and steal eggs.

considering a quick dabble in Cantonese
I've known other Mandarin speakers who picked it up from just living in HK for a few months
don't think it'll be too hard

>>219132369
Very cool, St David of Charlie Kirksville :3

>>219100491
>m already physically unable to hear Japanese pitch accent
you have invented a excuse for your own laziness. ngmi. pathetic.

>>219100910
overdosing on information. none of that is helpful

>>219142954
No no, this is the Jordie way. Hes built different. Unlike you, he will find this extremely helpful and totally won't quit his language within a month.

>>219106871
a book for learning chinese?
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/51569401-hanyu-jiaocheng-grade-1-vol-1a
that is what you use to learn chinese as a foreigner in chinese universities.
you can find a torrent or pdf online. you can use it for self study fine.
>for an EFL
do you mean you are esl? those books are fine for esl's who aren't great at english, there is very little that would be too difficult to understand in the english sections.

>>219100491
>tones will be the absolute death of me
Tones are piss mate.
If you don't hear pitch accent, honestly its entirely because you haven't listened to enough Japanese. I don't even learn it, but I have spent too many years worth of hours of my life as a NEET watching weebslop in nihongo and I can hear pitch accent.

>>219136327
Both

>>219139321
Why do you think the latter? I feel like Europeans always accuse Americans of having no connection to their roots, being rootless cosmopolitans, but then say Americans are not allowed to reconnect with their ancestry. Why is this a thing? What the difference between an American of English descent visiting culture landmarks in England vs an English person doing this for example? Don’t they both have ancestors at the Battle of Bosworth, for example?

>>219143632
in the Americas, there are some ethnic groups that maintain strong connections with their ancestry, such as Hotschdeustch speaking Germans, Welsh in Argentina, Somalians in the US (serious) etc...
there are also groups that sever connections with their ancestors and form new identities, such as white Americans, Hispanics, "Asian Americans", Brazilians etc... They have their own traditions (thanksgiving), own history (war of independence and civil war), own cult figures (Lincoln, Washington, look at the fucking mountain)
to be a part of the second group and pretend to be a part of the first group comes off as incredibly disingenuous larp. Once you're assimilated into being a white American, you can't say "oh I'm actually English/Scottish/Irish/German/Norwegian" because quite simply you are not. Your ancestors made the decision to integrate into American culture, and you can't escape that. The battle of the Boyne or Bosworth has no significance to you because you have forsaken it for Gettsyburg.

>>219144257
I agree with the point that they’re only of one group, right. They’re Americans, not English or anything else. I think many Americans are tactless with this stuff, and they larp as more Irish than the Irish, etc. But I think the characterization of a complete forsaking of what came before is wrong. Just in the case of White American identity, you necessarily have to look back on your ancestry to determine whether you belong. And yes, that is usually done by looking at your skin but white skin means your ancestors came from Europe (99.9% of the time). Then, White American culture is heavily derived from Britain. Language, law, customs in White America all have roots in Britain. The English Civil Wars and the Glorious Revolution strongly influenced the political thought of the founding fathers and many Americans then had grandfathers or great grandfathers that fought in those conflicts. One of the founding fathers’ chief complaints was that they were being denied their due rights as Englishmen. So, there isn’t a clear cut off or forsaking of anything other than a government. There’s a new and different thing, sure, but not a forsaking. And, thinking about later immigrants, it was rarely a forsaking. I think of the stories of Irish immigrants in the 1840s with the choice of starve or get on a boat. They didn’t want to leave, but it was among their best options. I think the significance is evident in how their descendants here still cling to being “Irish.” Are they Irish? No, but their ancestors were and their ancestors’ struggles have significance to them. You’re not the same as your ancestors living in the same town as you from 800 years ago. You’d have very little to nothing in common (except maybe hating British weather). You wouldn’t even be able to understand their language, but they’re still your ancestors and what they did is significant to you.

Opinions on Duolingo? Not even as a supplementary tool to learn language but just as a way for refreshing and having some input and interaction language you are learning? Is it even worth using or is it complete AI slop?

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>>219145486
Everyone needs a toy hammer in their tool kit for fun

>>219145486
I'd say it's helpful in the very beginning like starting out with it, but becomes useless as soon as you know the basic structure of the language and some vocab

>>219145486
There's another serb in this thread who could teach you a thing or two

What should my maximum reviews per day in Anki with FSRS be?

>>219145486
It's slop for normies to think they're learning a language but are not.

>>219135907
I tried to learn Polish once, but somehow not for long.
My mother was Polish but my father didn't want her to teach me. Now all my Polish relatives are dead.

>>219147553
My German teacher at school was Polish and was a scary man, used to shout at everyone, was probably just angry about being Polish desu

>>219117732
It is actually insane. I have the tagesschau app on my phone which is like german's BBC sort of. They had TWO featured stories about the superbowl. One about how bad bunny owned blumpf, which I guess is halfway understandable, but then another one about the game itself lol. I can't imagine too many germans care much about how sam darnold lead the seahawks to the handegg championship.

They also seethe all the time about us, and what is remarkable is that it is often both sides of the political aisle

>>219147700
American football is more popular in Germany than anywhere in Europe I believe

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>>219101477
My father asked TTS with ChatGPT to evaluate his English pronunciation and it confidently gave him an answer. I think most people have AI/LLM psychosis at this point. Picrel; one of OpenAI's models, ChatGPT 4o, was apparently pretty good at "companionship," OpenAI recently phased it out and started redirecting answers to models with mediocre anti-delusion safeguards and now the lonely women on the r/MyBoyfriendIsAI subreddit are freaking out about it.

>>219145486
It's dogshit. Duolingo is incredibly frustrating to use if you actually know what you're doing. It's like using a tea spoon to dig a hole because you've never seen what a shovel or an excavator can do. Might only seem doable if you don't know how big the hole actually needs to be, but believe me, the hole of fluency is massive and takes years even with proper tools.

>just as a way for refreshing and having some input and interaction [with the] language you are learning

Why not read a page of a book or watch a funny video in your TL? It's not only more engaging, but in terms of sentence/hour, it's just more efficient.

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simply ask ChatGPT to give some A1 or A2 level sentences, while using Yomitan pop-up dictionary for individual words you don't know, or Mate Translate to machine translate the whole sentence if there is some idiom or confusing grammar you don't understand

>>219151482
it's good for widely spoken languages but completely fails at even the most basic Uyghur
like it can't even identify cases

>>219150374
I completely refuse to use AI whenever possible
have only ever used it to look up a few Chinese proverbs when I couldn't remember the exact wording
and even then it's not super reliable

>>219151964
based
Chinese proverbs sounds like something that you could find through a more conventional method, e.g. a book listing them. I found this in a few minutes of searching, I'm sure there's a more up-to-date version of this somewhere.
https://archive.org/details/collectionofchin00scar

>>219150374
ai is pretty good for corrections i have found but rating it is pretty bad.

>>219152177
there are dictionaries (including online) for them but the problem is I sometimes forget the exact wording, and searching a dictionary when you only know two characters in a four character phrase and not the exact position is aids
it's easier just to ask deepseek "what's the chengyu that means this and has these characters"
the kind of proverb I mean is a special kind called a chengyu 成语 which is made of four characters, not an English style proverb like the book you linked, those would be called suyu 俗语 or yanyu 谚语. But it is a nice book, thank you

>>219152324
This reminds me of a video about a pseudo-chengyu (or what I think counts as a chengyu?) in Japanese. In short, if you ask what 今朝毎朝 (which is to be read as "kesa maiassa") means to an AI, or why it's funny, it will miss out on the joke and try to search for actual meaning.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4KQ8wBt1Qg
As a side note, I'm surprised something like fuzzy search is not available in online dicts, it sounds like a straightforward enough feature to implement.

>>219153033
the one I use (hanyucidian.org) only has a basic version of fuzzy search and wildcards. Pleco has a better system but less chengyus. Most actual chengyu dictionaries are sorted by the first character, which is good... unless you've forgotten the first character and only remember the other three

>>219152241
I find its just a semantic prick with English, so I wouldn't trust it for anything else.

>>219153138
>required monthly subscription
what the actual fuck
the LKŽ (a Lithuanian dictionary) has over 100K more entries than this "Hanyu Da Cidian" thing, and you can access all of it for free on Ekalba, alongside many additional resources (synonym, antonym, neologism, riddle dictionaries, just to name a few)
Tēzaurs is the Latvian equivalent, also completely free, has a very receptive search that'll find even the most butchered word (I can tell you from eхperience), it has a built-in decliner/conjugator and word frequencies, eхamples are automatically generated from a vast corpus of data, plus you can now even submit words you think are missing. Oh, and it's larger than the chink thing by around 40K words.

did Jews make this???

>>219153966
oh lol I dont pay for this, my uni has a subscription and I can use it forever after I graduate
unfortunately everything on the chinkternet is either paid or complete utter trash poo poo
free alternatives are pleco (good functionality but even more limited corpus), mdbg.net which has a good corpus but terrible interface and zdic.net which just sucks all-around
other Chinese self-made dictionary websites and apps are usually chock full of adverts and deliberately hard to use
the best part of hanyudacidian is that all the entries are from actual published dictionaries, no user-made definitions, and you can check definitions in multiple different dictionaries.

>did jews make this
worse, Germans

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>>219142479
Okay I'll just own it then
Come visit this shithole and practice my TL with me

>>219153966
>eхamples are automatically generated from a vast corpus of data, plus you can now even submit words you think are missing
This sounds inauspicious

>>219154118
>mdbg.net
Looks like the best out of these, the advanced search with "Find entries that contain this Chinese" and "part of word" checked would probably make finding chengyus easier than on other dictionaries (...if it had the option to search just for chengyus and nothing else)
>>219154321
The automatically generated part is just "search the corpus, find target word, display". It has its drawbacks (e.g. if a word has a common definition and a far rarer one, you likely won't see the latter at all), but there's upsides too (e.g. since the corpus is biased in regards to recency, the eхamples more accurately reflect the current usage of the word).
You can also check the corpus separately, can be of use if you know what you are doing.
https://nosketch.korpuss.lv/#open
In regards to the submitting thing, this is not a Wiktionary "post it and it's there" situation, if you submit a word, someone will look into it before it becomes a part of the dictionary, and they can of course reject or alter the submitted word. Ekalba employs something similar for their neologism database and that has worked great so far.

>>219100910
Literally no one has ever successfully learned Germanic vowels (that includes English btw) by memorizing shit like a nerd. Go listen to more input of German being spoken instead of obsessing over trivia like this. Think back to your HS or college professor, did he have a pitch American accent? Definitely not. He's probably spent 1000s of hours poring over shit like this though. The average anon here probably sounds more intelligible than your cunt's English professors because they get more input.

More input less AI.

The people here would find learning a dozen unrelated languages from scratch easier than NOT falling for Jordie's bait

bump

Duolingo is not that bad

if you had to learn Turkish, Arabic, or Persian, which would you choose?

>>219156923
Persian
>best literature
>most interesting history
>very few other foreign speakers
>easiest

>>219156923
persian

French or German?

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>just have to say a mass every day and hear people's confessions and tell them to do penance
>NEETmaxxed
>probably allowed, even encouraged to study Latin, Greek, Hebrew, Aramaic etc in free time as well as religious texts, in addition any other language you could make translations of religious documents into for practice
>don't have to worry about h-indexes like in an academic career
>upgrade from incel to nominal volcel in the community
>never have to worry about money or starting a family ever again so you can focus the maximum amount of time on self-directed scholarship
I'm side-eyeing this path

>>219156923
Persian for sure.
I wish I could find a decent Anki deck for Persian.
I love Anki gooning because it works for me really well

>>219159302
i found praying the rosary or one of the chaplets works well for language learning

>>219159302
Greek is interesting, but after spanish and Latin I don't know if I want to use up another one of my precious language slots I have left on ancient greek.

Anyone have any recommendations for intermediate level reading content in traditional Chinese? I finished Advanced Chinese from John de Francis, but modern and high level textbooks/readers aren't cheap and hard to pirate.

Tried reading some Chinese VNs like 高考愛戀 and 餓殍, I found the former easy to read but the latter hard. Also read some translated hentai in Chinese, which taught me a lot of "prose" that deFrancis never taught...

>>219156923
Persian ez

>>219159300
people of both languages will just switch to english if they notice your accent. I'd choose german though

>>219159300
same dilemma

>>219160123
French don't speak English

>>219160343
nigga posting from the 19th century

>>219156923
Turkish so your hair transplant doctor will do backflips and a better job

>>219159300
German if you care about philosophy. Otherwise French.

I want to learn Japanese and Chinese and Latin and Ancient Greek so much to do and so little time

any god resources for spanish that aren't in the wiki?

This is my learning regime

Assimil Spanish with Ease - working through the lessons as the core of my regime
Madrigal Key to Spanish - I power through lessons for it one day a week to supplement Assimil
Anki - frequency vocab and Assimil sentence mining output practice
Linguno - targeting conjugations where I'm weak
Glossika Spanish - mass sentences for output practice
and I use a New Reference Grammar of Modern Spanish for my grammar reference

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Bros. I'm trying to grind listening comprehension and I have lots of hours to study each day and would like to learn this in the shortest timespan possible. Here's my routine
>Find audio with transcript
>listen first without reading
>If I hear something I don't understand, either because there's a word I don't recognize or the speaker just spoke too fast/not clearly enough, I read that part and listen to the part again
>After listening, read the entire transcript
>Listen to it one more time
Is this good? Maybe my brain is broken, but I find the amount of brain power that I need to put into simply listening in my TL insane. If I even lose focus for a split second I become completely lost and have to redo it. I'm feeling extremely conflicted because I know this is what I should be focusing on, but it's also very frustrating because it makes me feel stupid and progress feels extremely slow.

>>219140049
yes, i larp as a frenchman but with schizo past life/reincarnation features

>>219151252
Redpill me on what is wrong with duolingo. I hate it but purely emotionally and I never learned anything from it but I blamed myself. It's still the normalgroid gold standard for language learning, and if I tell somebody I'm learning a language they will come back with "oh so like duolingo" nearly 100% of the time. How do I respond to that, with or without sounding mad?

>>219161272
I think I gave myself permanent brain damage by listening to too advanced stuff too early. it's incredibly easy to just sort the audio as "background noise". idk how weebs who learn japanese ever start to sort this out after 50k hours ignoring the audio in their subbed anime

> be me
> learning Korean
> come across "치다"
> it means play, take, crash, hit, pitch, form, pickpocket
> all different words in English
> my brain is exploding
> then there's "빠지다"
> it means fall into, lose weight, get absorbed, miss a meeting
> all different words in English too

>>219162486
American discovers other languages also have words with multiple meanings

>>219162573
how did you know Im American

>>219162130
it's thoughtless input. you could do duolingo for a year, every single day for 4 hours, and come out of it not knowing how to speak basic sentences in your TL. You might be able to passively read up to B1 sentences though

>>219163576
>>219162130
wait, no

not being able to passively read up to b1. that's giving duolingo too much credit

you'll be able to translate up to B1 sentences. There's a huge difference between passively reading and translating. when you passively read, you've internalised a language to the extent that you automatically know what the sentences you're reading mean. Duolingo won't help you with internalising your TL. Translating what you read is 10x slower, maybe even more than that. Yeah, with a year of Duolingo you'll be able to translate B1 sentences.

>>219162130
Just don't tell people you're learning a language. They don't actually care unless they can see the results, and they'll most likely just demoralize you with their inability to grasp why anyone would spend time on an activity without an immediate social or monetary payoff.

>what is wrong with duolingo

It's painfully slow. You're getting comprehensible sentences, but at a very slow rate and you have to do a bunch of unnecessary extra bullshit to get to the next one. My favorite feature was the one mini story per unit, but it was extremely short and of course, animated and interrupted by busy-work. You could open a simple graded reader and get through 10 pages worth of sentences with much less effort, because everything is already unlocked. People think the mini games are what motivate you to go through the sentences, but it's actually the other way around, you want novelty, you're curious about your TL, you want to learn more and the mini games are just an artificial obstacle. Once you realize that, it's very hard to stay on the app.

>>219164605
I tell my friends I'm learning German, they just think I'm a Germaboo and want to move to Germany.

Portuguese mogs spanish so hard its not even funny

>>219164605
every other person is 'learning' a language these days because of duolingo so there's no harm in saying

>>219162130
you can just say you watch youtube/tv in your tl. that's also normie approved even if mose of them don't do it

>>219162130
>if I tell somebody I'm learning a language they will come back with "oh so like duolingo" nearly 100% of the time
yike

>>219162486
>be me
>learning English
>come across "set"
>it means put, arrange, prepare, cause, establish, instruct, adjust, harden, a group
>all different words in Lithuanian
>then there's "take"
>it means hold, occupy, rent, ascertain, write down, subtract, photograph, fuck, accept, tolerate, consume
>all different words in Lithuanian
>>219162130
Just learn a language that's not on duolilngo, preferably something obscure like Kamchatkan:DD (technically a language group, but still)

>learning language
>books+workbook are very expensive

should i use a pdf file and do the exercises in a random notebook? it does feel nice to have the book and do the exercises there, it's like oldschool shit, not looking at a pc all day. i could also print the books in some printing place, using my printer is wasting all the ink lmao

>>219168662
If you tell normies you read books in your TL, they act like you're an ascended being.

>>219169310
Even if it's something like Harry Potter?

>>219162130
Aside from what other anons said, duolingo used to be not that bad. You could use the desktop version and work your way through a course pretty quickly. They always had good notes for each lesson to explain the grammar concepts. You had a lesson tree to go down, etc. You could easily become A2 in a pretty enjoyable way and then go input with a little supplemental study. Now, it’s literally just candy crush and is meant to keep you on the app as long as possible. It’s totally useless unless you pay for it. If you don’t pay, you’re limited to like two lessons a day because of (((energy))) unless you watch a bunch of ads. You’ll be watching a bunch of ads anyway because they pop up after every single lesson. You are forced into each “lesson section” with like 5-7 lessons. You can skip a section by taking a test, but the next section will literally be the dame exact shit but with one or two new words. You could spend weeks working at it, and you will still have never been introduced to the concept of past tense in your TL. Total waste of time even if you pay for it.

>>219169838
Yeah it's useless without vocab tools like anki and some textbooks or other grammar resources plus input. I use it in large part because I like the streak idea and I'm streak partners with some good friends.

>>219162130
>Redpill me on what is wrong with duolingo
Its inefficient, and doesn't respect your time.
Outside of that, the company is pretty shitty.
It can be a pretty chill way to learn a language, and if it works for you, use it. It isn't very good as a primary resource though. You should do other things in addition to it.
If you don't, don't act surprised if you end up being these retards with a 6 year long streak who can't speak the language for shit.

>>219140253
Had this bloody thing come to my dream last night
The Emperor from 40k was disguised at this sort of spider

>>219171480
So we instinctively learn everything for pussy so if someone is learning Finnish they're INSTINCTIVELY learning it because they want Finnish pussy

>>219172242
Yes. I will learn French for African queens.

>>219169721
isn't there a sizeable portion of the population unable to read at a 6th grade reading level? they havent even read harry potter.

Still looking for a way to learn Serbian properly as a native English speaker :(

>>219172745
Grim if true

>>219172755
Have you tried textbookmaxxing?
https://languagelearning.site/serbian/colloquial-serbian/

>>219173094
I can try it. I have no talent for Slavic language. I'm about to hire a tutor. I'm in kafana evey day talking but get lost easily in conversation. The grammar and padež i can't wrap my head around

Just imagine yourself learning Russian, yes russian, that fucking disgusting, nasty, putrid language. fucking inserting it into your brain. Having that goblin speak inscripted inside your memory.
Now imagine people doing that deliberately to themselves.What have the world come to?

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bump

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbJqP9uUXiM

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I'm on Deutsch A2 and duolingo thinks "im" is a new word for me

>>219177230
Dein "handy?" How disgusting.

>>219098970
I've accepted I'm only ever going to learn English

>>219175073
I am doing this

>>219177824
It means cellphone

>>219178122
Stop

>>219177824
for some reason it's pronounced "Hendy" even though it's a normal "a" not "Händy"

The easiest way to piss off chinks/japs on xitter is to pick really obscure unknown characters for your handle and make a random combination.

Why tf the German language cannot produce good music.
I am so jealous of people learning Swedish like Serbanon or weebs, and even passport bros learning Spanish and Portuguese.
I'm paralysed by indecision: should I keep studying German and maybe it will finally click, or should I switch to some Romance or Asian language
>>219102588
>>219101687
>>219136790
The motivation to learn a language comes from cultural works and contact with people (this is also when culture is created; even inside jokes between friends are part of it). Most of us here learned English because of games, TV series, shitposting on the internet, searching for guides on how to do something, etc. Without 4chan, tv series like Parks and Recreations or Black Adder I would have never learn any English

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>>219179434
>Why tf the German language cannot produce good music.
https://youtu.be/Mg3CdijJe24?si=9mKKxBB27EYIaook

>>219179434
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXv31OmnKqQ

>>219179610
One of the few exceptions o okay music
>>219179678
I heard so much of Rammstein and Linking Park as a teenager that I can't take it anymore.

>>219179434
you aren't going to make it with that attitude.
if you don't have the grit and dedication you'll falter once you hit the plateau.

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How do you guys study a new language? Grinding sentence decks worked for Japanese (output still sucks but comprehension is pretty good) but I've been trying to do the same with Russian and feel like I hit a brick wall. I don't remember being this overwhelmed by all the unknown words and grammar when I learned Japanese. Should I just drop anki for now and pick up a textbook? I genuinely like Russian but I've tried going through an anki deck like 3 times now and keep burning out after a couple hundred cards. Feels like the app is slowly sucking my soul.

>>219181621
zero-foundation anki I think is not the best
try get a fundamental understanding of grammar (i.e. learn to recognise different parts of speech, extra info) and maybe the 100 most common verbs + other important words then come back to the deck if you must

also, does anyone know how I should go about auto-generating romanisation for anki cards?

>>219178122
Why? You know that civilized, intellectual Slavic languages exist, right? You don't have to learn Russian to scratch that itch for Slavic culture. You can learn a language spoken by humans in a nice country. It's baffling that some people are so ignorant.

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Realistically what do you do in this situation?

>>219182207
Don't drive cars. That simple.

>>219182207
This is a win. You would get to learn an awesome and very useful language all over again! Yippee

>>219182054
Western Slavic countries are just smaller Germanies and southern Slavic countries are just worse versions of Greece

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>>219103204
Amazing that crusty old jew isn't dead already

>>219182054
And they're pathetic little natoids who all worship American "culture", so why would I want to learn their language.

>>219182791
Czechs and Balts are far more ethnocentrist and right-wing than Russians thoughbeit

>>219182054
Just imagine yourself learning Polish, yes polish, that fucking disgusting, nasty, putrid language. fucking inserting it into your brain. Having that goblin speak inscripted inside your memory.
Now imagine people doing that deliberately to themselves.What have the world come to?

>>219169310
imagine this in brazil

VBI SVNT LNGVAE LATINAE DISCIPVLI

>>219168301
spanish is for kids, and yankees have trouble with it

Spanish is hard thoughbeit

spanish is very easy, really

>>219183102
For you

>>219182054
But I don't care about the other languages and Russian covers the largest net, why would I bother with Polish, Bulgarian, or any other Slavic language?

>>219183160
don't listen to him while you'll be able to read dostoevsky in the original

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>>219183137
because my language mogs spanish

Also you niggas know any good Russian music I already got Кino and Molchat Doma
>>219183195
This is how I wanted to practice actually haha, I was going to try comparing the Russian and English when I'm more fluent

>>219182207
Forgetting my NL would be kino and i would mog all the rest of you in my TL within days

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>>219183234
chad, I will enhance my english reading robert burton

>>219182591
And Russia is a worse version of all'at.

>>219182791
If you hate your own country so much, just get your "shared values" visa and leave already.

>>219183160
I'm just saying you should consider quality over quantity. It's not like you'll run out of people to talk to and books to read in any of those langs.
>>219183195
>learning a language to read widely-translated most popular books in the original
Terrible meme...
>>219183234
>Russian music I already got Кino and Molchat Doma
>he's a poseur too
Oh my lord.

Molchat Doma is Belarusian BTW. Just putting that out there.

Go away poleleaf

>>219183565
a translation never reaches the original, it is obvious, canadian man

>>219183582
What language are they singing in?
>>219183565
>quality over quantity
There isn't a single cultural export out of any non-russian Slavic language I even know of save for Poland and their CD Projekt red games (that I also have no interest in) and STALKER (which is in Russian anyway). Why are you so butthurt over my TL?
>poseur
How? These are incredibly mainstream artists, knowing them doesn't count for anything and I'm not trying to seem "in the know".

>>219183703
Translated famous books were made by world-class professional translators and linguists. You will never, Never reach the level of proficiency and knowledge that they have - and on top of that, when making a translation they work carefully re-checking and validating translations, may have multiple translators working together, etc. Your B2 ass first reading where you think you pretty much understand everything but it's "better in the original" somehow despite you absolutely completely losing whatever ephemeral hint of subtlety the professionals managed to not quite capture in their translation is just you jerking yourself off.

>>219183703
>but... le nuances... le lost in translation!
Kek. If you want to read books for these "non-translated super-deep nuances", then read your own literature. The translations don't make much of a difference especially compared to the time and effort spent learning the language to a level where you can comfortably read advanced novels like those of Dostoevsky. Don't bother unless you're specifically some professor of Russian literature.
>>219183734
>What language are they singing in?
>BUT MUH LANGUAGE
You said that is was Russian music, but it's markedly not Russian.
>STALKER (which is in Russian anyway)
You wanna know something real spooky? All those things you're consuming in Russian... are also in English!
>>219183734
>How? These are incredibly mainstream artists, knowing them doesn't count for anything and I'm not trying to seem "in the know".
Let me guess, you call it "Russian doomer music" and you think they invented it. Meanwhile you only know the two most popular. It's obvious you're trying to seem "in the know" about it. Most Canadian people don't know these bands, no. There's an entire meme starter pack for people like you.

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>>219183769
now, that you said all that, I still proclaim the indubitable truth: the translation shall never reach the original

>>219183787
Let people learn whatever they want you annoying autist

>>219183923
He can learn it if he "wants", but he can't say I didn't warn him.

>>219183787
>You said that is was Russian music
Because they sing in Russian, what else is there to understand? This nitpick only exists with me omitting "language", which seems unnecessary in a language thread where I already specified I would like to learn Russian.
>All those things you're consuming in Russian... are also in English!
No? The majority of NPC chatter STALKER is in Russian, with some named NPCs being the exception. While the game is still playable, it'd better my enjoyment understanding the dialogue. This same logic applies to watching films in Russian as opposed to dubbed/subbed in English. The only case where I'd choose the English translations even with good Russian fluency would be reading famous books as >>219183769 pointed out, but it's still nice to be able to read the originals.
>Let me guess, you call it "Russian doomer music" and you think they invented it.
Shit guess. I asked around before and was reccomended them.
>Most Canadian people don't know these bands, no
*Mainstream in the sense that most people familiar with Russian music would know about them. Why are you so pedantic and what's your problem with the Russian language?

>>219183787
>The translations don't make much of a difference
Disagree. It is good to understand the culture of the original language, which is why translations from neighboring countries that are well known to your country or linguistically close (especially in terms of grammar) are usually better. That is why footnotes used to appear frequently in the past, and nowadays they can be seen in fan subtitles for anime and manga, because Japan has different culture, very foreign language with alien logic of the language. I bet English translations of the Russian literature are much worse than Polish ones or even German ones because it's very different language from the region far away from UK and USA in which neither said country had a broad interest in this region. But is it worth to learn a language for that? Idk, who am I to judge?
>>219181588
I know, Draculanon. But it is precisely these little things that keep that dedication alive, like pizza party in a company

>>219184073
>Because they sing in Russian, what else is there to understand? This nitpick only exists with me omitting "language"
You're calling it a nitpick when what you were doing was misleading. It's the same old thing where people don't know that they're not Russian because they've been misled or made assumptions.
>it'd better my enjoyment understanding the dialogue.
Actually, not really. It's one of those things that are designed assuming that the audience doesn't understand, so it's all filler nonsense. They want you to have the sense that a foreign language that you don't know is being spoken. At most you'll experience "easter eggs" that you probably already watched a youtubeslop video list on.
>Shit guess. I asked around before and was reccomended them.
Then whoever recommended these bands wasn't taking your request seriously. They're well-known in Russia, that's precisely why it's poseur shit. It's the same idea in that Western poseurs think that listening to well-known band Green Day makes them punk. But what's worse is that you're a foreigner looking therein and flaunting your surface-level knowledge of "le russian doomer music" and posting doomjaks on /int/. It's just so fucking cringe, man. That belongs in 2016.
>>219184197
>blah blah blah
That's what footnotes/glossaries are for. If there's some cultural nuance that might be lost in translation, the translator can choose to include a footnote. If you ask me you're better off learning a language to read untranslated, unpopular trash shit because then you're getting more worth out of it in total versus reading a popular novel in the original instead of the translated.

>>219184235
>footnotes/glossaries
Yes. But they are increasingly being abandoned.
>you're better off
This is very subjective; there is no objective way to calculate what is better for someone.

I’m gonna learn Russian now

I don't have any problem with the Russian language except its cringe deletion of vocative case (and then the following neo-vocative troonery), disgusting hard/soft signs and stupid, arbitrary syllabic stress rules. What I have a problem with is these delusional "shared values" special snowflakes who are completely uncritical of Russian language & culture because they think that homosexuals are getting stoned to death there and that's based o algo. There is probably *some* worth you can get out of Russian culture (that you can find elsewhere in greater numbers) but that's not what these people are looking for. Also both sides do it, do not get me started.
>>219184303
It is objective that there's more content in an untranslated book that you can experience only through knowing that language, than in an original text of a book that's otherwise translated that you can experience only through knowing that language.

>>219184312
Good. Waste your time and ruin your life just to spite me, then.

>>219184388
Why would learning Russian ruin anyone's life?

>>219184408
Let's just say, never learn a language of people you don't want to speak with and a country you don't want to be in.

>>219184388
It wouldn’t be a waste of time because language learning is a fulfilling hobby, and I’ve always found Russia interesting. There’s nothing wrong with learning Russian, unless you’re a redditer with retarded politics.

>>219184485
That's the point. You are very, very likely to be a redditor with retarded politics. I've never met a single Russian learner who wasn't.

>>219181621
>I don't remember being this overwhelmed by all the unknown words and grammar when I learned Japanese
You probably were overwhelmed. Once you start to understand a language you tend to forget how difficult it was to learn it.

>>219184375
But that doesn't mean that in his personal situation, it's something he wants, something that will help him grow, give him joy, or bring him closer to his goals, because we set those goals individually. The objective fact is the amount of content, yes, but not its value.

>>219184499
Redditers HATE Russia, just like you. You can’t fathom anyone ever learning Russian despite there obviously being decent, non political reasons to do so. You’re completely politicsbrained beyond any point of return. That or you’re some 3rd generation Ukrainian diaspora living in Canada.

>>219184566
The only worth he can get out of it is character development if you know what I mean.
>>219184570
>despite there obviously being decent, non political reasons to do so.
That's what I'm saying, that (You) aren't aware of this. All Russian learners are just trying to mix language learning with politics. Show me a single one who isn't or go back to r*ddit.

>>219184235
>"Easter eggs"
Greatly downplaying the usefulness of understanding the language the game was originally written and voiced in.
>They want you to have the sense that a foreign language that you don't know is being spoken
Have you even played the games? The fact that Russian speaking players (the other half of the playerbase) wouldn't experience this sense of the language being foreign.
>youtubeslop
>doomjaks
Projection of your own lameness onto me to discourage learning, normie behavior.
>You're calling it a nitpick when what you were doing was misleading
Not being verbose isn't misleading, attempting to misconstrue this as misleading is.
>They're well-known in Russia, that's precisely why it's poseur shit
Posing as what even? I've made my intent to learn the culture and my lack of knowledge in it clear, I have nobody to impress.
>Then whoever recommended these bands wasn't taking your request seriously.
If someone with English as their TL asked me for music reccomendations and I told them to listen to Michael Jackson, am I not taking them seriously?
>>219184375
>completely uncritical of Russian language & culture because they think that homosexuals are getting stoned to death there and that's based o algo
My reasons for learning Russian are hardly related to that. I like music/games/movies/books which are in the Russian language, I've had good interactions with Russians in my own life, and the Cyrillic alphabet looks cool. All your accusations are completely disconnected from my intent. The "le trad orthodox russian worshipping foreigner" stereotype couldn't be further from me, I'm not even Christian.

>>219184639
*wouldn't experience this sense of the language being foreign also defeats this idea.

>>219184599
Okay, I’ve started learning Russian now and I have no political reasons to do so. I think the music and literature is worth understanding in the original language and I find its history fascinating. I even had a Russian friend back in high school that taught me some of the language and I can read cyrillic so this isn’t even my first time with it. Was I mixing politics with language learning over a decade ago?
Your post only vindicates what I said too, assuming immediately that all Russian learners must have political reasons for it with no evidence. You’re the one mixing politics with language learning.

>>219184639
>Greatly downplaying the usefulness of understanding the language the game was originally written and voiced in.
Like books, the translations are sufficient and you're not getting any worth out of learning Russian just to play STALKER.
>Projection of your own lameness onto me to discourage learning, normie behavior.
I thought you were only just listening to popular, well-known, lame bands? Why the reversal all of a sudden? Are you a lame normie or not? Make up your mind.
>playing dumb
No point in responding to this shit.
>If someone with English as their TL asked me for music reccomendations and I told them to listen to Michael Jackson, am I not taking them seriously?
Unironically, yes. EVERYONE knows Michael Jackson already.
>The "le trad orthodox russian worshipping foreigner" stereotype couldn't be further from me, I'm not even Christian.
Oh boy. What an edgy, blackpilled doomer you are.
>>219184679
>understanding music in the original language
More worthless than understanding books in the original.
>You’re the one mixing politics with language learning.
Let's not pretend that there wasn't a trad LARP mob "over a decade ago" (which means 6 years ago in 4chanspeak). Hopefully you'll realize there are better Slavic languages to learn and it's not all about politics either.

>>219184703
What language are you learning and for reason?

Russians aren't white. Russians aren't even Slavic. They are a mongrel concoction of Mongols, Turkic, Caucasus and Uralic peoples who just happen to speak a Slavic language. The remaining Slavic genes in Russia of the progenitors who introduced the language are few and far between. They are truly the missing link.

>>219184721
I learned TL because it came to me in a dream (and the gradual analysis that followed) that I was meant to be one of them and the attachment to my genetic ancestry was only a corporeal error.

>>219184599
It's a skill, it's a lot of people to speak with (although very crappy often), it's interesting history and learning a language is a cool hobby. But let's just agree to disagree

>>219184778
Too bad you're still A1

>>219184783
You know what Slavic country has more history than Russia? You're sitting in it.

>>219184790
I am C1 according to CEFR standards. Once again, CEFR is meaningless.

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>>219184797
>>219184778

>>219184806
Look it up. Russians and their language only emerged as a distinct people & language at least 300 years after Polish did.

>>219184703
>Like books, the translations are sufficient
But earlier you said I should learn other Slavic languages? Why bother learning anything when I can definitely access English translations for those according to your own logic?
>I thought you were only just listening to popular, well-known, lame bands?
They aren't lame, but to each their own I guess.
>No point in responding to this shit.
He just folds
>Unironically, yes
Everyone knowing Michael Jackson is a help if anything, translated lyrics will be easily available in their original language and his appeal will make it an easy reccomend. It'd be pointless to suggest something something less palatable for the sake of not seeming like a "poseur".
>Oh boy. What an edgy, blackpilled doomer you are.
More projection from you, I'm asking for help learning my TL and you're trying (and failing) to shut me down with endless negativity. Your only contributions to this thread are a condescending attitude and bad faith arguments.
>>219184758
>race out of nowhere

>>219101661
why brits have tomatoes for breakfast i’ll never understand. at least beans are nutritious.

>>219184861
>Why bother learning anything when I can definitely access English translations for those according to your own logic?
My point was only that learning Russian to read Dostoevsky was bad reasoning. It would be the same if you learned another language to read the most popular literature. Stick to niche stuff that isn't translated.
>They aren't lame, but to each their own I guess.
You were trying to make the case that they were lame and you were self-aware of this lameness in the first place.
>Everyone knowing Michael Jackson is a help if anything,
Not the point. The person asking that question already knows about him and doesn't need to be recommended it. At the very worst, he would find him if he did a quick google of "popular American music".
>whining
lol
>race out of nowhere
Of course you can't even deny it. The science is there.

>>219184871
You don't? In Canada if you order a Canadian breakfast there will be slices of tomato on that platter.

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>>219184896
>My point was only that learning Russian to read Dostoevsky was bad reasoning
Not my only reason as I've mentioned several times.
>You were trying to make the case that they were lame
Never made that argument, you called them lame yourself. I only called you a lame.
>The person asking that question already knows about him and doesn't need to be recommended it
Being aware of an artist existing =/= having actually listened to their music. I've known of the Beatles for my whole life, but I have yet to listen to an album from them.
>popular American music
The first results are picrel, MJ clears all of this lmfao
>lol
He folds again
>Of course you can't even deny it. The science is there.
There's nothing for me to deny, I'm only pointing out that you're a race obsessed. Why would I have any stake in whether or not Russians are white if I'm not even a slav? Why are you mentioning it out of nowhere?
>>219184952
I'd kill a nigga for some English brekky

>>219185078
>Not my only reason as I've mentioned several times.
It was in response to >>219183195
>Never made that argument, you called them lame yourself. I only called you a lame.
Here you are insisting that they are lame actually: >>219183734
>I've known of the Beatles for my whole life, but I have yet to listen to an album from them.
Either you're 12 years old or you're lying. Everyone has heard Beatle songs. Anyway we are talking about second language learners who are actively seeking popular songs to learn from, not native speakers.
>The first results are picrel, MJ clears all of this lmfao
>AI is shit
Okay?
>He folds again
>posts non-sequitur and gishgallop nonsense designed to be unrespondable so that he can "win"
>"I won btw"

>Why would I have any stake in whether or not Russians are white if I'm not even a slav?
You wanted to learn a quality language, didn't you? I'm just posting the facts.

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>>219185131
>quality language
Is your TL in this image?

>>219185279
>quality = quantity
lol.

>>219185131
>Here you are insisting that they are lame actually
Mainstream doesn't guarantee something is lame, your assumption of this reveals you're just a contrarian.
>Either you're 12 years old or you're lying. Everyone has heard Beatle songs
I'm being genuine, probably just a zoomer thing. I can name some song titles off the top of my head, but I couldn't get more than 3 or 4.
>we are talking about second language learners who are actively seeking popular songs to learn from, not native speakers
Doesn't refute my point of MJ being a good reccomendation, part of my justification was his accessibility for non-native speakers.
>calls AI shit
>relies on AI for language learning
Hypocrite.
>"I won btw"
True!
>You wanted to learn a quality language, didn't you? I'm just posting the facts.
How would whiteness relate to how good a language is to learn for me? That's something you value, I'm indifferent to it.

>>219185360
>Mainstream doesn't guarantee something is lame, your assumption of this reveals you're just a contrarian.
You were trying to brush it off as "totally lame" to ensure you didn't come off as a poseur (someone who has "cool" taste). That was exactly the point of you calling it "mainstream". It's in the same breath that you call news you don't like "mainstream media".
>Doesn't refute my point of MJ being a good reccomendation
It's not. Also, you should brush up on your English before you even think of learning a second language.
>Hypocrite.
You were showing an example of AI giving bad advice and - that was your point, no? That AI is bad/unhelpful. But it was unrelated to the discussion at hand. Not that I use AI to learn.
>True!
You're just parodying yourself at this point.
>That's something you value, I'm indifferent to it.
Then that's your prerogative. Fine by me if you want to learn non-white languages. The thing is that most people have a misconception that Russians are white. There is a lot of misinformation out there about them. You should be wholly well-informed before you make the mistake of learning Russian.

>>219185404
>you should brush up on your English
>is incapable of inferring I meant Russian language music from context himself
Funny.
>Not that I use AI to learn.
Might have confused you with another leaf.
>It's in the same breath that you call news you don't like "mainstream media".
Mainstream media doesn't just mean "news you don't like", learn the definition.
>trying to brush it off as "totally lame" to ensure you didn't come off as a poseur
I've already addressed this by saying I got reccomended Kino/Molchat by others and that I'm aware they are mainstream. You're going in circles now.
>There is a lot of misinformation out there about them. You should be wholly well-informed before you make the mistake of learning Russian.
If you hold Russians in such low regard, why even engage with my post about learning their language? As well, your points about it being "bad to learn" have all been disproven numerous times. Derailing the conversation from language to being about "poseurs' and semantics is pointless, I'm going to learn Russian.

>>219185615
>Funny.
That's not the point, retard. You can't even spell recommendation.
>Mainstream media doesn't just mean "news you don't like", learn the definition.
That's how you use it, THOUGH, if how you say "mainstream music" is any indication.
>If you hold Russians in such low regard, why even engage with my post
You're not a Russian. I was under the impression that you could be reasoned with (lol).
>I'm going to learn Russian.
At least I can rest easy knowing that you are not, in fact, going to learn Russian.

>>219185668
>That's not the point
And my point was that you can't make basic inferences. Besides, was typing an extra C such a gotcha you had to mention it twice?
>if how you say "mainstream music" is any indication
I use the term mainstream music to say it's well known, what else could it possibly mean?
>You're not a Russian
But I'm posting about them and their language (which you hate), so I ask again why involve yourself.
>I can rest easy knowing that you are not, in fact, going to learn Russian.
I will learn Russian.