Is the danger of war overstated? Look at something like D-Day, for example. Out of a 150k troops "only" 4000 died, and another 6000 got wounded. Basically 95% of soldiers involved came away unscathed. Now, of course those casualties aren't evenly distrusted and there were situations were a particular company might have taken 50% (or more) casualties, but on the whole it doesn't seem that bad.Same thing if you look at WW1. Culturally, it's notoriously known as a meat grinder but the UK for example "only" had an 8% death rate.Again, I understand that on a micro-level you might get hit by an artillery shell that wipes out 80% of your platoon, but on a macro scale war doesn't seem that dangerous.
>>62136725evenly distributed*
The important part is that it always FEELS like it's going to be you next. And if you do something stupid, it probably WILL, just by virtue of making yourself the easiest to hurt. People being good at mitigating hazards doesn't negate the hazard being there.
>>62136725The majority of people are serving in armies in non-combat roles, so your perception based on pure numbers is way off.When we look at poor fucking infantry doing actual assaults or defending positions, the chances of shit going bad get higher. If we talk about crews of armored vehicles, they usually are high priority targets on the battlefield, so their outlook is even more grim
>>62136725>Is the danger of war overstated?>Out of a 150k troops "only" 4000 died, and another 6000 got wounded. Basically 95% of soldiers involved came away unscathed.no, thats just the western front, lad. it pains europe and america to admit that russia did all the job in WW2, so the west had to utilize gigantic propaganda measures to somehow make people believe that the west actually contributed in the war in ways other than sending supplies to a country thats actually doing all the fighting. here in france, especially, the power of american propaganda was felt everywhere 24/7 for 60 years, you couldnt open your fridge without an american add begging frenchmen to thank them for WW2. here, take a look how historically american propaganda did its job.
>>62136772You could at least thank us for liberating YOUR country ya dingus.Also the USSR negated a lot of their positive perception by being subhuman evil cretins who conquered the nations they were supposed to be liberating.
>>62136772Saying "America actually didn't do shit in WW2" is as retarded as saying "America did everything in WW2"It's not because the US narrative of the war is bullshit that you have to adopt the other extremeAnd even if the Soviets MAY have won without Western help, the Western front was definitely useful for one thing : It prevented us from becoming a commie shitholet. Frog
>>62136793>You could at least thank us for liberating YOUR country ya dingus.thank for what? american influence ruined this once beautifil country. if the western front didnt exist and the USSR would stop in Portugal in 1945, it would be much better than 60 years of american occupation. the retarded USSR would collapse inside its own communist asshole even faster and none of that modern degenerate horshit plaguing this continent would ever happen. France is an unlivable fucking shithole now, unless you ran away to a small forest village.
>>62136801>It prevented us from becoming a commie shitholebecoming a commie shithole would be a blessing compared to what we have now in france. just look at the czechs or poland.
>>62136772Dying at catastrophic rates is not doing all the work. Thank you for distracting the Germans, though.
>>62136811Ok you're clearly a retard
>>62136815russia had losses because they actually fought the germans.
>>62136816living in modern france makes people retarded, i can agree with that.
>WW1 is notoriously known as a meat grinder but the UK for example "only" had an 8% death rate.Its still multiple times higher than what the death rate for military aged men was in peacetime Britain. Even worse nowadays since with advances to medicine etc. you're even less likely to die back home.
>>62136824British involvement in both of the World Wars is kind of a meme.>British losses in WW2>In WWII there were 384,000 soldiers killed in combat, but a higher civilian death toll (70,000, as opposed to 2,000 in WWI)but i guess thats what happens when your biggest contribution to the war is sinking a ship and firebombing an undefended german city in 1944.
>>62136834You're a lolcow, fartfaggot
>>62136841
>>62136807yeah I didn't read past the first sentence, I like France and am learning your language and marrying a French grille. not looking to argue and might even agree with you about some things.But you know what would rape French culture worse? Forced Russification by your USSR conquerors. You guts wanted to stay 100% independent? Shouldn't have chimped out on each other until you lost nearly everything.
>>62136849>Forced Russification by your USSR conquerors.here's a list of countries russification worked on:-----
>>62136834>in peacetime Britain>peacetimeWhy can't /pol/ zoomers read?
>>62136857apparently you can read.
>>62136834Expand your hypothesis. Why do you believe British WW2 casualties indicate their involvement in WW2 was a meme?
>>62136834>Russian commanders didnt give a shit about Russians>so they had extreme death tolls>British commanders, in WW2, gave some semblance of a shit about their troops>death toll isn't that bad for an all out warSeems like its a Russian issue caused by the general outlook of Russians on Russians. We can see similar retardation in Ukraine where Russian casualties have already exceeded that of a GLOBAL CONFLICT for the UK by 75%.
>>62136856Yeah bro, countries taking literally decades to recover from the rule of the USSR and some still being colossal cluster fucks, is far preferable to decades of prosperity only recently marred by an influx of immigrants- never mind that those immigration policies are heavily influenced by leftist originally supported by the USSR. Avoiding complete cultural decimation and sending your people to the gulags just wasn’t worth it because there’s a McDonald’s within eyeshot of the Arc De Triomphe is a completely sane thing to claim bud.
>>62136864nta but reading about the british and french in WW2 is just sad.>be french and british in 1940>outnumber, out-tech and outgun the germans>had a full year to prepare for blitzkrieg - everybody already knew how it works from the Polish campaign, its documented in detail, recorded, and analyzed>the Allies have the biggest fortifications in human history>the germans invade>they completely bypass all allied defenses in 3 days and encircled the french and british armies>total collapse of allied armies, humiliating british escape from dunkirk beachescherry on top:>At the Nuremberg trials, German military commander Alfred Jodl said that "if we did not collapse already in the year 1939 that was due only to the fact that during the Polish campaign, the approximately 110 French and British divisions in the West were held completely inactive against the 23 German divisions."[18] General Siegfried Westphal stated that if the French had attacked in force in September 1939 the German army "could only have held out for one or two weeks."[19]
>>62136889almost no british died in WW2 because the british didnt really do anything.
>>62136807>France is an unlivable fucking shithole now, unless you ran away to a small forest village.yeah, but not because of usa, but because of (you) giving citizenships en masse for retarded colonial purposes and still stirring shit in africa for the same reason.DAMN FRENCH, THEY RUINED THE FRANCE. You see, I hate the french. I hate them because they have this superiority complex with nothing to back it up. Because they killed their king (few centuries after britain), they are now experts on social injustice and democracy. Because they wanted to be morally superior to the rest of europe, they educated and imported tons of niggers. Macron wants this european army, but the moment such things springs into life, french will start autistically screeching until they are put into charge. They hate the US because they wish they were them. I genuinly prefer the bongs, as they are also retarded, but sincerely and openly. Too bad they an heroed themselves :(.t. EUropean
>>62136897>outnumberBritish and French populations were spent and none had the stomach to bleed themselves even more. The only way you can say they outnumbered them is if we included the colonies which doesn't change anything because they had barely any standing forces in 1940.>out-techNone of which would help with an actual push into Germany.>outgun the germansThe French did but that more or less brought down by how retarded they were.>everybody already knew how it works from the Polish campaign, its documented in detail, recorded, and analyzedApparently not given how the Battle of France went. Hindsight is 20/20.
>>62136964the Fall of France was probably the biggest military disaster in human history and probably the biggest example of military incompetence, coping by saying "we were super duper tired after WW1 : (" is worse than just saying nothing.
>>62136955nobody hates the french more than the french.t. french.
>>62136807Have you tried not flocking to Paris like lemmings to a cliff edge?
>>62136897>the approximately 110 French and British divisions in the West were held completely inactive against the 23 German divisions."[18] General Siegfried Westphal stated that if the French had attacked in force in September 1939 the German army "could only have held out for one or two weeks."[19]this is assuming the germans couldnt have quickly rediverted troops away from the polish front back to the west. germany had a really dense rail network back then. they could have quickly assembled a large force in the west to stop or counter attack a french advance. also the french would have had to cross the rhine and advance over hilly south belgium, not exactly easy terrain and after the river crossing they could have been easily trapped when the german air force cuts the bridges. the german air force was still a huge force in 1940 and would have had air superiority over germany. the french were right to not just rush in there.in 1914 the russians made the mistake to assume that german forces were stuck in france and they could easily overwhelm the small force that was stationed in the east. germans redirected reserves to the east and used their railway to outflank the russians, which led to the russian defeat at tannenberg and at the masurian lakes. the french knew this, it had been extensively studied.
>>62136975lol the americans fell into the same trap 4 years later, at the same place even.
>>62136975>coping by saying "we were super duper tired after WW1"But nobody is saying that except you? The Entente being hesitant about getting their populations culled has nothing do with your retarded claims of the Poland campaign being analyzed to hell and back by 1940.
>>62137001please read about the Phoney War.>the french and british armies actually went inside german territory in 1939>met almost zero resistance, took a few german villages>i guess nothing is going on, lets turn backand so they went back home. the first 2 years of WW2 are such an insane rollercoaster of franco-british stupidity and incompetence, its so stupid, it wouldnt even fit into a Monty Python sketch.
>>62136964>British and French populations were spent and none had the stomach to bleed themselves even more.>>62137015>British and French populations were spent and none had the stomach to bleed themselves even more.
>>62137036Are you ESL maybe?
>>62136856>here's a list of countries russification worked on:How can anyone who is not a zigger be this ignorant? How?Look at a political map of Russia, dumb fuck.Are you looking? Good.You see those dozens of little tiny oblasts clustered around the Western fifth of Russia? The ones about the size of Chechnya or North Ossetia? The Russia state equivalent of Rhode Island or Connecticut?Each one of those represents a people that was conquered, raped, subjugated and possibly enslaved. Every single one of those were once independent, spoke their own language, worshipped freely and got to grow their own food. Until they were broken, looted, forced to speak Russian and impoverished. Exiled to Siberia if they resisted. Until the only way out of poverty was to join the army and help conquer new lands.How in the fuck to do you think Russia became the biggest country on Earth, you fool? Russian roulette?"Where has Russification worked?" You're looking at it now in realtime.https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_endangered_languages_in_RussiaYou are a stupid worthless fuck and it shows. Educate yourself (assuming you are not a diaspora fag, in which case I hope you kill yourself along with your family). cheers m8 thanks for tuning in
>>62137041everybody in europe who isnt british is ESL, i noticed some butthurt losers use "ESL" on /kas an insult, care to elaborate further on this?
>>62137034>Eleven French divisions advanced along a 32 km (20 miles) line near Saarbrücken against weak German opposition. The attack did not result in the diversion of any German troops. The all-out assault was to have been carried out by roughly 40 divisions, including one armoured, three mechanised divisions, 78 artillery regiments and 40 tank battalions. The French Army had advanced to a depth of 8 km (5.0 miles) and captured about 20 villages evacuated by the German army, without any resistance. The half-hearted offensive was halted after France seized the Warndt Forest, 7.8 km2 (3.0 sq mi) of heavily mined German territory.
>>62136807>it's a /pol/fag>"waaah, it's over, my Russian-backed (literally, look up the 9.4 million-euro loan from a now-defunct bank) based trad waifu lost">"millions must die"France is great IDK wtf you're talking aboutParis is a shithole but the rest is bretty gud
>>62137034>please read about the Phoney War.i know about this. they didnt even test the siegfried line. please look at a map of the saarland. moving in there would have put the french at high risk of getting trapped. its not an ideal place to invade germany.
>>62136725Thing with an assault like this is that if you get it wrong, you're all pretty much fucked. If the beach and nearby inland can't be controlled then you get thrown back into the ocean and everyone involved will die or maybe be captured because there's just nowhere else to go but forward. By splitting up the attack across multiple beaches it does minimise the risk that everyone gets 100% fucked but if even one of those landings goes wrong its still some massive losses to contend with and potentially the whole op being compromised because there's less ways in, an enemy pocket might form and all manner of stuff just ends up really sketchy and its not like today with modern communications. Once this starts its got an inertia all of its own and you've sort of got to be confident that all those moving parts are actually working and following the larger plan.Amphibious landings also just don't get done very often, a few countries practice them 'for real' in terms of how difficult they are
>>62137050i think the french dont get enough ridicule for WW2.
>>62137045It just means you're a subhuman that can't even understand something as universal as english.
>>62136725Fun fact; more soldiers died during the various trainings than during the actual Normandy landing.The allied were that dedicated to not fuck it up.
>>62137077everybody who isnt british is subhuman?thats a hot take bro. do you have a loicense for that racism?
>>62137065overlord was just a very successful operation. compare it with the assault on stalingrad. 600k soldiers move in, only 90k are still alive in 43 and get taken prisoner. of these 90k prisoners only 6k survive prisonship in the soviet union.so survival rate for a german soldier in stalingrad =1%
>>62137096thats because the eastern front is where the actual war was fought, on d day the beaches were defended by like 3 germans, 2 czechs and a hungry goat.
>>62137091hey lay off the bongs, friendThey're doing the best they can with what they've got
>62137118careful not to fall for it...
>>62137118>>62137141>google it>12,000 germans stretched over 53km
>>62136820with their patented "my nuts to your fist" and "face to foot" styles
>>62137166yes winning a war usually takes losses, thats why western allies didnt have any losses - they didnt do anything.
>>62137166Please excuse the vatnigger, we trained him wrong as a joke
>>62137189dont be butthurt at the russians, its not their fault the western allies didnt do anything in WW2....
>>62136955>still stirring shit in africa for the same reasonWe haven't been doing that for decades. The glorious days of Francafrique, with its French sponsored proxy wars and coup d'états, ended in the early 2000sSince then it's been (useless) humanitarian aid and war against terrorism>DAMN FRENCH, THEY RUINED THE FRANCE>they educated and imported tons of niggersWe have our flaws, but the mass importation of africans is happening because of a minority of plutocrats and the useful idiots that are the leftistsEvery single Western European country has the same problem, hating the French specifically for it has always been weird to me>They are now experts on social injustice and democracy>They hate the US because they wish they were themFrench on the Internet aren't necessarily representative of the average French populationMost French just want to be left alone and don't give a fuck about the US or lecturing others. Yes, we are proud, sometimes with reason, sometimes less so, but again so is everyone on this planet
>>62136983>nobody hates the french more than the frenchDon't take your case for a generalitySelf-hate is cringe as fuck
>>62136793>they were supposed to be liberating.>You could at least thank us for liberating YOUR country ya dingus.the fucking irony of this post.Petain was legally handed the government of France and his government remained popular for a few years. The "french resistance" was mainly stalinists who only took action after germany invaded the USSR. De gaulle was technically just a renegade.
>>62136772Dying!=WinningSomehow Russia still hasn’t figured this out
>>62136725If you only look at infantry (the guys actually doing the fighting) casualty rates are something like 60%
>>62137182>>62137192Holy butthurt kekInb4 the allied didn't do anything
>>62136725You think those 150,000 are landing at the same time? Those casualties are undoubtedly going to be concentrated towards the earlier waves. How many men are in one landing craft, a dozen, two? "Only" 4,000 men at 24 to a craft is 166 full landing crafts worth of men dying.
>>62137182>you didn't die by the tens of millions so you didn't do anythingbeen a while since I saw this cope thank you
>>62136772>russia did all the job in WW2oh yeah, the ol' reliable>drow the enemy in our troops blood!i hope for more ru*sian victories like that
>>62136772>russiarussia stronk fags conveniently forget the USSR wasn't just russia
>>62136891france is the last communist country in the western europeits also the bestpeople fights in the streets for the things the commies gave ussure, i would hate if france was a post ussr shithole, but communism is the best things that happened for us frenchmen
>>62136772France was plagued by commies and their propaganda at the time, that only really ended when The Gulag Archipelago came outt. frog
>>62136748>If we talk about crews of armored vehicles, they usually are high priority targets on the battlefield, so their outlook is even more grimAnd yet, in the case of AFV crews, their KIA statistics are surprisingly low, especially for the US. Russia I’m sure skews the stats with their death traps but the point remains.
>>62136725Depends on what part of war you consider dangerous. If you take it as a whole, only a fraction of the personnel are doing any fighting, thus we may conclude war is not that dangerous. If you consider only the people expected to be in and around combat, we get a different picture. In other words: It's relative.
>>62136983>nobody hates the french more than the french.Clearly you've never met me before.
>>62136725There is more to the army than just "front line infantry" you dullard.
>>62136823>posts ParisLol
>>62137238>dying=winningrussia quite literally won WW2 by doing that. adolf would gladly sacrifice 100 mln germans to go and die but there was no one left in germany to grab a gun besides children and women. i suppose 8 mln dead germans was the max adolf could squeeze out of their population.
>>62136897>outnumber, out-tech and outgun the germansBut they didn't have the doctrine.>had a full year to prepare for blitzkrieg - everybody already knew how it works from the Polish campaign, its documented in detail, recorded, and analyzedThey really didn't know, hence the battle of France.>total collapse of allied armies, humiliating british escape from dunkirk beachesBritain had 10 divisions in France, they had no realistic possibility of changing the situation once French forces collapsed.>Everything elseHindsight is 20/20None of your post answers why the quantity of bong casualties makes it a meme player in WW2. Its not a metric which necessarily aline's with strategic effect.
>>62138255>yes they fucked it all up in every single possible wayit looks like both of you agree.
Many men thoroughly enjoy war.
>>62137091If i can't understand you, you aren't white, sorry bud.
>>62136823Is this not simply the price of success? If you're a first rate country won't immigrants flock there for a better life? It seems the only way to retain stable population and some semblance of ethnic purity is to be a second rate, out-of-the-way country
>>62137062>saarlandIndia?
>>62137091im Dutch so im ESL, no idea why people use it as an insult. Dutch power lol.
>>62138619Als je geschreven engels slecht genoeg is dat je kan worden herkend als een ESL, kan je het vaak überhaupt niet goed genoeg lezen om een fatsoenlijke discussie te volgen in het engels.Het is dus een teken dat je waarschijnlijk geen idee hebt wat er gezegd wordt en dat je contributie aan het gesprek daardoor eigenlijk nil is.Als je niet gepakt wordt is er niks aan de hand.
>>621370966th Army only numbered around 360,000 at the start of Case Blue. Of these, 200,000 (plus around 100,000 Romanians, Hungarians, Italians, and Hiwis) or so were trapped in the pocket following Operation Uranus, with the rest either having already become casualties and been evacuated or in some cases managed to escape before the encirclement was complete. Of these 200,000, 30,000 or so wounded were successfully evacuated by air, 90,000 were taken prisoner at the end of the battle, the rest perished.
More like Operation Urmomsanus.
>>62138665That's basically it. It's a form of gatekeeping.
>>62138665this reads like somebody is trying to sneeze and just cant.
>>62137050iirc the Frogs didn't really prepare any logistical support for the invasion and just said fugg it we ball :DDDDThey outpaced their supply lines and were worried they were being baited into a Hurtgen Forest type grindfest, so they pulled out.
>>62138323>t.
>>62136748>If we talk about crews of armored vehicles, they usually are high priority targets on the battlefield, so their outlook is even more grimEven off the field it's bad because I guess they expected the sea to be perfectly calm while deploying these
>>62140387I always thought this dude sounded based, and he'd have made a good neighbor.
>>62136725More men died in training for Omaha than in the first 24 hours of landing.To be fair a troop transport was sunk in exercise by a UBoat.
>>62140387Based Pre-boomer.I bet this guy's kids are not fags.
>>62140670>>62140687It's from a satirical magazine called Viz.
>>62136725150k men werent in combat, of the men in combat the casualties were high.
>>62136856My man to this very day there is a hard line of economic disparity that runs right through the center of Europe. Anything to the east of Germany is almost always worse off than the places west of Germany. Lower economic development, lower quality of life, more corruption, more violence. Why do you think that is? Russification doesn't have to be successful to ruin your country, even if it fails it can still cause damage that will take generations to heal. Just ask the Ukrainians or >>62136857any other former Soviet state.
>>62140904It's literally how many men landed in Normandy. 23.000 men landed on Utah beach and only 197 died. Even if only a fraction of them were in combat it again just proves how not dangerous war is because the fighting is over that quickly.
>>62136772>you couldnt open your fridge without an american add begging frenchmen to thank them for WW2what the fuck are you talking about you fucking retard? this has never happened>>62136807france WAS the degenerate shithole that came up with most of the shit that plagues the modern world, from feminazis to fag rights and mass 3rd world migration it was all invented in your fucking dump of a "country", and then you wonder why everybody hates you
>>62142342>france WAS the degenerate shithole that came up with most of the shit that plagues the modern worldThe psychos who came up with this bullshit were from here, yeah, but it first became popular in the US, and then it is american cultural power who made it worldwide phenomenons
